From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A production of I Heart Radio. Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt, my name is Nol. They called me Ben. We're joined as always with our super producer Alexis code named Doc Holiday Jackson. Most importantly, you are you. You are here, and that makes this the stuff they don't want you to know. It's Thursday if you're listening to this, the day it comes out, which means it is time for our weekly listener mail segment. We scour the Internet. We infiltrate social media, which makes it easy because we're talking about our social media where you talk to us. We listen to mysterious calls from around to the world, and we pick just a few. It's always a difficult choice, pick just a few to share with our fellow conspiracy realists. Today, we're gonna learn some very strange allegations about Joseph Mangles mentioned in a previous episode, and talk a little bit about the Ponts and Devil's Road. We're also going to talk about the scary future of facial recognition coming to a town near you. If it's not already there, Uh, if you guys are okay with it? I see we open with Mangel. What do you think sounds good to me? That terrifying slash? Yeah. Always lead of a human being. Yeah, always lead with the Nazis. That's what Spielberg taught us in Indiana. Jones right, It always goes back to them. So our first letter today comes from Sean. Here's what you had to say, Sean. Sean says hello again. After listening to the Doctor Mangli episode, I was reminded of a disturbing yet true story that is worth sharing with you all. While in college at the School of Minds not Mimes, I misread it initially too. At the School of Mines in Colorado, a friend of mine who was studying mechanical engineering and focusing on medical devices, was given a project to design a portable device that could perform a certain type of blood transfusion in emergency situations. Because a doctor in the US had developed a highly oxygenated teflon based compounds that could be transfused into a trauma patient who was losing or had lost too much blood, and this could keep their organs in stasis until injuries were repaired and or blood was available. Although he had achieved success with smaller mammals, he could not get approval for the human research in the United States because of the highly dangerous practices involved, and decided to move down to Brazil to finish his research. Have you guys heard of anything like this? I remember seeing a film of purportedly doing such activities with a dog and other smaller mammals um but again, I could never verify if if it was real with that type of transfusion. I just trying to pause to check to see how how far into the into the wild we're going here? Okay, so it doesn't seem completely alien. This was brand new to me, and I had a moment where I thought, hold on, telon the stuff that we already did an episode on with pots and pants and how they're insidious and and dangerous. That Cody, at least to be fair of what I saw, I had nothing to do with teflon. Okay, Okay, you're talking about maybe head transfusions. Yeah, exactly. It was some of some using plasma blood parts of blood. Yeah, not that stuff. Well, here's where Sean's story continues. Ten years later, Sean says, uh, this person was back in the US developing the devices to test in the field. His research was a success mostly, and the military wanted in on it. Q School of Minds, my friend, this part made me laugh. No one on the engineering team knew this doctor's real name. They just referred to him as doctor Dracula. As his research evolved draining people of a large portion of their blood and injecting them with his compound before bringing them back. I always wonder how many casualties there were in this process. This bad part about this story is that the process was originally developed in the States and will probably benefit the US before anyone else. But the US wasn't willing to take the biggest risk and happily benefited off the medical exploitation of other people. Of course, as in the words of Voltaire, it is forbidden kill. Therefore all murderers are punished unless they kill in large numbers. And to the sounds of trumpets, quickly back to Mangela. Have you guys heard of Arizona Wilder? This lady claims to have unknowingly been a Satanic priestess who was controlled by Dr Mangla until his death. It's a crazy story with many hits, transgressive hypnotherapy, world leaders, satanic rituals, etcetera. Love your show, Holy smokes, that's wild. I have to say. It makes me think of that part of ed Wood Um with Johnny Dapper that was based on him, you know, obviously, the crazy filmmaker Edward. He had a character named dr Acula, and it was meant to be like, you know, like Italian cheek reference to Dracula, But I love that just went all the way and it's called him Dr Dracula. Um. God, I just can't understand the motivations behind these uh, these types of folks. I mean, the thing is that teh flon as we know it today is yeah, it's real name is poly tetra flora ethylene, right, and this stuff does have some safety issues. So initially it sounds really odd to think that would be purposely injected in somebody's blood, you know, or into their circulatory system. But as I looked into this, I found a couple of articles on blood substitutes for transfusion won by a Dr M. J. Williams, but then papers by several other people that we're exploring the same thing. Like, you can find these papers for perfluorinated blood substitutes artificial oxygen carriers basically, and it's this, It is that stuff that the teflon like substance. Yeah. Yeah, it's maybe not exactly the same kind of formulation that you would see on a pan, the ones that are not supposed to use metal spoons on please, but it's but it is yet it is the same kind of stuff, which is amazing. Uh. The abstract for one of these says, faced with an increased demand for blood products in a stable donor pool, different companies have developed products for oxygen carrying from hemoglobin to fluoral carbon based compounds, the latter being based on teflon like products. There are several difficulties and showing efficacy of these compounds, and the reasons are discussed. In addition, various strategies for the production of oxygen carrying blood substitutes or O c b s are noted, as well as other applications for these compounds. So that's just like, that's just the abstract of one paper. But how surprising. I think most people would be surprised to learn this substance that we have been taught to avoid is being purposely put into people's bodies. I mean, there's the last time I heard stories or studies about teflon in human body systems, it was very much framed as terrible news. You know there with microplastics, Yeah, it's definitely something. I mean, we've we've learned this numerous times over in the course of the show, that you keep those things away from you, and when they leak into your water supply at the tiniest amounts, it can be a terrible situation for any biological life, specifically mammals and animals, amphibians, other other animals. That's a yikes. The thought of injecting it into your blood stream in any way, in any amount, I just don't understand it, Like, is there some purported benefits Like I don't the ability to to transfer oxygen through the body, and especially you know, the ongoing problem with plasma or with blood in terms of donation. Not to sound like a vampire, but it is a huge problem. There are a lot of people in the US and abroad who need blood, uh, and not not in a Dracula way, though the name does fit. Sean I do hope you tell your friend the name fits and the universal donor is negative, right, yes, the universal donor is oh negative, this is and and there are also you know, we could also do an episode in the future on very rare blood types. There are some blood types that are so incredibly rare. There are only a few known cases throughout history, and people still aren't sure genetically how those came to be. Uh. For anybody who hasn't familiar with teflon or the concerns about it, this has been going on for a long long time. There was a class action lawsuit and community settlement with the DuPont company, and after that lawsuit, three epidemiologists conducted studies on the population surrounding a chemical plan that was exposed to p f O A S like you said earlier, math that's the common acronym H and they found that there was an association between this exposure and six health outcomes, none of what you are superpowers, none of which are pretty or fun. There are things like testicular cancer, kidney cancer, ultrative colitis, thyroid disease, and hyper cholesterolemia, high cholesterol, as well as pregnancy induced hypertension. Luckily, you don't have to throw out your pots and pans right now. Overall, cookware that has substances like this is considered a minor exposure pathway, so you should be more worried about it if you're living near um a plant that create that manufactures this or works with it, or I guess if you need a lot of blood quickly. Right, we still have to learn more about this, but I think everybody would be interested to know. As strange as the strangers Sean story where he might sound, it is indeed based in a measure of fact, and because there are multiple people looking into blood substitutes. Uh, it's it's a little bit difficult maybe for us to figure out who our doctor Dracula is. But I'm totally down to reach out to the School of Minds and say, tell me about your creepist doctors. Also, the Brazil story is interesting, but I hope we're not painting the stereotype of Brazil is like the home to mad science. Yeah, maybe just the home to escape a bit of the regulation one of the homes. How about that one of the places where you can escape some of the regulation of the United States that exists in the medical community and several other industries. Do you guys remember when we interviewed Rob Billott. There was that movie Dark Waters that came out and Mark Ruffalo in it, and it was the he was the lawyer that actually I don't know if it was that DuPont oh No suit. Maybe it was that suit, but it was about it leaching into the water and killing livestock and that was sort of the big indicator. And then it turned out it was killing more than livestock at the very least, giving people much long term serious effects from you know, consuming that stuff. Yeah, I just I still think about that. Um. Sorry, and I'm still horrified by this notion. It's something that is important to be horrified by. People should not be okay with that is is it is like the microplastic problem in that, you know, the the distance between the chronological distance between exposure and then the development of symptoms maybe very long, right, It may we may be talking about years or decades intervening. And that makes it easier for immoral powers to try to distance themselves from it, you know what I mean, to try to push it out of the news cycle. And it does take people, Uh, it does take people like Rob A lot too to become honestly tenacious about it, you know, and that he got very close to seriously ruining his life when he went up against this gigantic corporation. Folks, that guy is a hero in my book. Yeah, and so I'm still modest. Like, I was really shocked at how a matter of factly he was able to talk about all this stuff and didn't really you know, slip into hyperbole or anything. It was just kind of like but also not just like, oh, there's another day at the office. I mean, he obviously saw the gravity of his work in the situation, but I actually enjoyed that conversation. He was really interesting, dude. Another fascinating thing about that. You can tell the guy had to speak on in court and was used to the possibility that folks might try to turn his words against him, So I do respect it. At the the end, we chatted a little off air. Very nice person as well. But this leads into a couple of different things. You know, Sean mentioned the problems of the US profiting off human experimentation. Uh, that is true in like, people are well aware now of the Tuskegee experiments, where disadvantaged population of people of Color and the Sky Alabama were told that they were being treated but for syphilis or bad blood, but they were not at all. Yeah, I was gonna say something else. I was trying to figure out how to end that sentence. But no, they just weren't given any sort of treatment. Uh. And then the US used that science. That project continued for a long time, but a lot of people aren't aware of the U S did something very similar in Guatemala. The US has and will take that data. And I would argue it's different from It's different from taking data from like conquered World War two enemies, Right. That's that is a case of trying to find something not terrible or you know what, arguably to say that maybe people didn't die in vain, or maybe this can be used to prevent death for other people in the future. But what Shaun's talking about here is is a little bit different because it feels it feels very close to the state sponsored when the military gets involved and says like, hey, her Jetta wild time in Brazil, But in a partnership with our good friends at the Pond, we're glad to help with your research. You know what I mean? Well, I think about how beneficial that would be to a military force if there ever was fighting on the ground where there's an infantry or ground troops that are being injured on the field, and you know, blood supplies are running loan, but you do have the synthetic thing you can use. Yeah, yeah, it's true, and it's hard to say no to it. The the very last thing I'll note and then we'll we'll move on to our second act. Is the last line chan that you put in there. About Arizona Wilder, also known as Jennifer Green. You can see several interviews she's conducted where she says she's revealing numerous secrets. She says she was born into the Illuminati, that she has taken part in various Satanic rituals. I looked into this and I was unable at this point. I will keep digging, but I was unable to find stuff that I could verify. It was really difficult to follow up with specifics of what she was saying. Like in the case of child abuse ritualization, like the Detro affair, there are specifics and you can learn about these people. But in in this specific case, at this point, shot I wasn't able to find anything. So I'd like to put out a clarion call to our fellow conspiracy realist one A three three std W y t K conspiracy and I Heart radio dot com. If you've got any leads on this, whether it's teflon blood transfusion or the story of Arizona Wilder. Uh, let us know, and let us know if you think it's mugged as well. We just like to we'd like to get your opinion, sort of read the temperature of the podcast room. It's atter of fact if you want to do that. Right now, we're gonna pause for a word from our sponsor and we'll be back with more news from you. And we're back with with stories from you, the public, the conspiracy realists of the world. Today, I brought one from Ronan, the Wandering Ronan. He sent us an email talking about facial recognition software being quietly deployed in his his home in Colorado. He says, Hey, they're conspiracy stof guys. I am a Colorado resident. I recently was separated from my driver's license that's no fun and had to get a replacement. When I got my temporary I D there was information about an app that would allow you to have a quote Digital i D on your phone. This is me guessing this is something along the lines of an Apple pay situation, where you have something in your phone that you can either show or maybe even a bar code on that you can scan. But he believes it. Goes on to say, I'm not sure what's your replication. These digital ideas are used for I don't believe they can commonly be used to purchase cannabis or alcohol, for example. Some bars may decide to accept them eventually, but it's up to the establishment at any rate. I thought, since my only idea at the moment as a flimsy printed sheet of paper, that I checked this option out. Um. I think we've maybe all been there, or we either had a temporary idea, or we've you know, lost a wallet perhaps, and then you get this literally like this like print out thing that feels very sketchy. So I understand where he's coming from. Um, so he thought he'd check it out, so we have a backup until I get my new license in the mail. After setting up my account, there's an option to select my Colorado Digital I D. When I selected, it says for security, we must verify your i D. When you confirm, it goes right into a facial recognition function. Uh. There's an oval and instructions to get your face inside the oval. I was not expecting this. Then the app was prompting me to get my face closer to the camera, and it really spooked me a bit. Uh. It's clearly facial recognition software. Granted that this is one way for an app to verify an i D, but it feels like there's all kinds of things that this could get used for. Because my face being upliaded into a state database of some kind, I backed out of it. It did not confirm my idea. I have no idea if I being paranoid, But it seems like a good subject for you guys to look into. Should people be concerned about the facial recognition software being used to verify I das for digital ideas in Colorado? Thanks for your time. Even if this is not worthy for the airways, Ronan more than worthy for the airways. Uh. And we found an article um somewhat confirming your worst fears. It was an article in the Denver post Um from let's see it was from UH September twenty seven of last year, and the headline is how Colorado law enforcement quietly expanded its use of facial recognition. State agencies have access to d m VS facial recognition software and some paid for use of Alexis Nexus service. So, uh, it doesn't name the software, but there is. We've been seeing this thing pop up and we've got a few other emails about it, about this digital I D verification for for example, getting unemployment or verifying your I D for getting like COVID relief. It's called something like i D dot ME. I believe it's what it's called, and it's the name of a company that is using facial recognition to verify your I D. But it appears that what Colorado Department of Motor Vehicles is doing is that they have this facial recognition software and they're able to run screenshots even or like you know, security camera photos, still photos through this database they have that's presumably being fed by these biometric scans that you know, residents are giving to the d m v UM. There is a case in Aurora, Colorado, which is only one according to this article, only one of hundreds of times Colorado police UM in the past few years have accessed facial recognition software in partnership with the d m V. By using this program that more than eighty Colorado agencies have paid to be a part of UM, and it's becoming more and more common, let's see. Uh. Lakewood Police Commander John Pickard said that facial recognition is an incredible tool that helps us identify a lot of serious suspects out there. Obviously, this is something that is problematic from a civil rights perspect active. Uh, it's very similar to let's say the way when you do one of those twenty three and me kits, you know, or ancestry dot com. Your DNA ends up a database that can then be pulled from, you know, for solving crimes, which on its surface is not a bad thing, and we know that that helped contribute to identifying the Golden State killer. But it is kind of a tricky situation where in the wrong hands, this could be used, you know, to identify protesters or people that are um conscientiously objecting to police brutality, or even to you know, if police really had a beef with somebody. UM. We did a story not long ago about someone who was being essentially or allegedly being stalked by police. I can't remember exactly that the gentleman's name, but he ended up dead. Um, previously killed, but also burned in a fire. Um, And that's exactly who it was. And uh, I just feel like this kind of our in the hands of an agency that we know isn't always above board, and that oftentimes we'll do whatever is necessary to get a conviction or even just to find a scapegoade. Um. I hate, I hate to be cynical, but I don't like this. I've predicted it, man, I mean, why would you walk away from that technology? I saw it? Ronan, You're You're absolutely right to be concerned. Unfortunately, the scruiser being tightened on you and your fellow residents of Colorado. I am so lucky that there is a thunderstorm coming through my part of town right now. That thunder that you heard in the background, that's that's on my end. I think we should leave it in because this is literally a metaphorically a storm on the horizon. My friend. If you look at how this is being applied again, it's going back to the Gattica argument right now. The state doesn't really force you to have this right because Ronan. As as we saw you are. You are going through the normal older i D replacement process, and you have the option to get a digital i D by downloading that app. But what happens for a resident of Colorado who wants unemployment benefits? You might have to submit to the facial recognition. That might be part of the process, taking people who are in a desperate, non ideal situation and then forcing them to, you know, go with I D dot me. This is probably advertised as you know, just the next step, just keeping current with trends. But to your point, Noel, yeah, obviously this this is going to be misused. It's not like, oh, maybe something will happen at some point. No, certainly something screwy will happen with this at some point. That's not saying that Colorado is full of monsters or villains. They're just it's just a very powerful technology and there are a lot of people who will have access to it. I agree, I think with you guys, but I do want to put the other perspective here, because I'm imagining the circumstances of inevitable misuse of this are going to be far lower than the circumstances where somebody really nefarious doing something terrible gets caught because of it. I would I would be tempted to agree, Matt, if facial recognition did not have such absolute horrid biases, especially for people of color, people particularly falsely arrested for this stuff in particular, Like I mean, people with darker pigments in their skin are often misidentified. You know, it's almost it's almost a cliche. You know, it's like the facial recognition software acts the same way as like real cops. You know, it's like there's that guy with the hoodie and then the dark skin totally. But know the In in the same article that we're looking at it from the Denver Post, they're discussing how, you know, a lot of crimes that occur online where it where there's an image from like a camera or something like that. It's not going to be perfect. But if that's the only lead you have on you know, some like serious child sexual abuse stuff, um, I don't know. I can imagine this being like really great to have. I I'm with you, Matt. And there is a list of crimes that this would be considered fair game to use for and as things like sexual abuse of children, passport fraud and on homicide, among amongst some others. But uh, you know, you do start to get into more vague uses or situations where maybe it's not warranted or it's you know, that's insurance. Also. Yeah, the reason it's so important to me to bring up that bias against people of color with facial recognition technology is because it is real and it is common, and this only further expounds. It brings the same systemic discrimination into the future with the human species. It just makes another avenue for it. And there are people like there are people right now who are innocent and are being held in jail essentially at this point, for the crime of being poor and not being able to get decent legal representation. This is this is horrific. And I looked into this my interest uh grown and and the rest of us here. I looked into the company that is ultimately responsible for I D dot me. Uh, and no, you're absolutely right, it is I D dot me of course there. Uh, this is a company called Pair of Vision, and Pair of Vision statements are what you would expect, but they're not specific enough to really allay the concerns. I would have Pair of Vision when they're speaking with CNN, say, we don't really a comment on partners systems, but how the rollout of our technologies are guided by AI principles, which quote require that our products are ethically developed and conscientiously sold. So flashback to NSO group in Vegas is right, Vegas is a note was that you know, well, the state in which we are based, the state of Israel, has to approve our client list, so it's really not on us and clear View AI. Clear View AI is another one where they said, you know this is just this is just neat and you have to have access to this system. But again it's like the example I used earlier. Look, we just build the missiles, you know what I mean, We're not in charge of where we blow We're we're surprised that so many people are into the fact that they blow up. We thought of them as law and art. How how willfully like, how how willfully ignorant can you pretend to be? At what point do you reach a threshold? I don't I mean, And also I the problem is that I absolutely agree this can prevent crimes, but it really depends on as cliches it sounds, it depends on who watches the Watchman. Now, I will say that I don't want to misconstrue what Ronan is talking about with what we're talking about here in this Denver Post article. There it's it's unclear if they're exactly the same. Like to me, it's more of a larger conversation and how facial recognition technology is being used. I don't know for a fact that what you upload to the d m V to get that digital i D get shared in a database, but why why would it not? You know what I mean, there's probably some I imagine there's got to be some kind of you know, uh, disclaimer or some end user agreement that says if you participate in this with the get the convenience of having that digital i D, then you are going to be I mean, why would you know? It has to verify you in some way so it already knows what you look like. UM. I just feel like it's giving them more accurate data, uh that then can feed these apps that we're talking about, which would be something a little more on the lines of clear view AI. Because in the Denver Post article I was talking about how you know they're using these apps to snap photos of people and then it searches a database and connects them um or you can even use a blurry screenshot for example, or you know a piece of surveillance footage, are still from surveillance footage. It's a It's interesting because to the point about sharing what likely happens. I haven't had time to do as much research on this yet, but what likely happens is so the unemployment thing should spook you a little because it's forcing people essentially to get this idea. The only way that you the only way you can avoid getting in the digital ID system and still receive the unemployment benefits that you paid for. By the way, don't forget that part. It is your money. Uh. The only way you can avoid it is if you are under eighteen and have IF again on technological barriers, because I D dot ME is not applied to minors, which should also give you a sense of just how dangerous this can be due to long tail consequences. So what I what I imagine happens, and this is just by speculation. I imagine that for ease of use and for streamlining purposes, when you do your digital I D, which you know odds are it's not gonna be nefarious. We're just we're outlining some of the worst case and best case scenarios. When you get that I d uh, then you you have your face in the system. In that way, it probably is shared with you know, other state level organizations, right, just so you don't have to keep doing the same thing over and over again. But the big question is um, Again, in the case of like unemployment agencies, out of the twenty seven states that have entered contracts with I D dot me, are they sharing stuff together? Does the d M the or the unemployment office in Vermont know what's going on at the DMV office in Colorado. I would imagine there would be some barriers to that, right, because otherwise it would essentially become a federal level system. Yeah, and a lot of the stuff was really revealed, UM to be a real problem, you know, during the pandemic, when you know a lot of these pandemic relief funds were made available through this online portal. And there's actually an article on the what is this Colorado Public Radio website UM about a gentleman who, through what is being referred to as a glitch and the I D dot me platform was unable to get his unemployment that he was due after he and his his wife um burned through all their savings during the pandemic, so it was literally a matter of survival to to you know, they they choose not to have internet access. It shouldn't be a crime, and you know, you shouldn't be uh not able to get what you are do be because you choose to live a different type of life. Um. But more and more it is becoming prohibitive to not have the Internet. But I don't think it should be. And these decisions are often being made without people's consent um and in some you know, effort to streamline you know, bureaucracy, but oftentimes there are people that get left behind or just outright screwed over. I will say one good thing about this that that I think, well, it's in the vein of this world, but it's really important. So as as we're talking about mobile devices and how much they can see, there is a way to use this for good because I feel bad about kind of like ranching and raving about how how terrible this stuff could become. Um if you are like us, uh people who often travel for work. Now the pandemics closed down and you stay at a lot of hotels, Please please please check out an app called traffic Cam t R A F F I c K cam. Uh. This. All you have to do is use the app and take a photo of the hotel room that you're staying in. And this kind of recognition allows investigators to fight against human trafficking because they'll see photos from these things where you know, god forbid video footage, and it'll seem like an innocuous hotel room. But if they can match it up, you know, to someone who's like, oh, I was in Pickkeepsie or I don't know, some small town making or whatever, then you can you can actively help rescue these victims. I know that's reach, but I'm just trying to find something nice to say about it. Well, I mean, if if if I get mugged one day, or well, you know, what, do you guys get mugged one day and there's happens to be footage that's good enough somewhere and we can like positively identify whoever that person was. I mean, that's good enough for me. And I know I hear what you guys are saying in your arguments, and I also like, I know, I know those things to be true. I think it's just tough for me because I I'm almost giving in at this point. I'm trying so hard not to. But I was looking at Lumen and some of the other services that these are these agencies already used where there they are sharing a ton of information. At least when you're within a state, that whole state basically has all of that information. Um and in Georgia we have these real ideas. They are just meant to say exactly who we are, but be able to track us down if law enforcement ever needs to. It's also a terrible name. Yeah, real idea. What what about those other ideas? It's not really like tidy trapper keepers? Now, I don't know, but the the Yeah, I see what you're saying that I would I would say that I have not proposed anything that is an argument. I feel like we've outlined very much good and bad things that will inevitably happen. This this this technology is not going away. No one is going to step it back. There might be maybe some parts of the world that are privileged enough to uh to eventually stem the tide, because privacy is going to be the new precious resource. It already kind of is if that if we're in that situation, then it's like that line from Thanos, I'm inevitable, you know what I mean, that's what facial recognition is saying. I guess I just wanted to had more faith that humanity could like handle this kind of power correctly, because you're absolutely right, man, the perfect world if we uh you know, really trusted those in power to deploy the stuff with uh you know, compassion and to use it for for the right reasons. I think it is kind of magic. Really. Um. I just I have to have been made a little bitter and uh and distrusting of law enforcement over the years, but who knows. Maybe, Um I'm just looking for a world that's free of strife and crime, that the deepest, darkest underbelly you can ever imagine world. I thought you were going to say a world that's free of faces, and I was like, okay, I'll hear them out. I don't know where are we going. I mean, there are also mass and makeup people use, especially during protests, to disrupt facial recognition technology, and those are old school analog solutions. They work, but um, yeah, I mean, to be honest with you, I see more potential for honest mistakes rather than you know, active like active concerted discrimination or assassination attempts. In the US, i'd be worried about things like I D got me in places like places with oppressive regimes, you know what I mean, because that in that situation, the odds of this being used for terrible means are are exponentially higher. But then if you think about it and play says, with the oppressive enough regimes or very few civil liberties in the first place, they don't really even need this to screw with people. You know, they'll just snatch them out of their homes, whether they are confirmed or not to have done anything, even if it's the smoke and mirrors kind of situation. I mean. So, I think there's a lot of positive and negative to this, and I think it's something we're gonna be keeping a close eye on for sure for quite a while. Um. But in the meantime, let's take a break and then we'll be back with one more listener mail. All right, and we are back, and we are going to jump to a place called Chad's Ford, Pennsylvania, very very close to Delaware. We are jumping to a specific part. They're called Concert Road c O S S A r T Road. It's also known as Devil's Road, and we learned about this through a message from Cody. Here's what Cody said. Hey, guys, I wanted to send you this conspiracy. This right in my neck of the woods. It's an interesting area where many high schoolers and young adults drive around at night with their lights off and then get chased out by a bunch of white Ford Broncos. Highly specific there right. Uh, it's very strange and I would love for you guys to check it out. I should also mention that right outside of Devil's Road there's a bridge called Smith's Bridge, where the legend says that if you park on it and shut your lights off in the middle of the night, you can hear a baby crying. Very odd stuff. Well, let's jump right in. I didn't find anything about Smith's Bridge in particular here, but I did learn quite a bit about Concert Road in Chad's Ford, Pennsylvania. You can find it on your map again. Just spell it the way I did CEO S S A R T and you can look at it. It's fairly small. It goes through a wooded area, and if you look at it from above, it doesn't seem that frightening whatsoever until you start learning about the lore that's behind this thing. And we'll begin learning about this by going over to w j BR dot com. That is a radio station. They've got an article called the Haunted Legend of the Duponce Devil's Road and the Cult House. Wait, you might think Duponce. What do you mean DuPonts as in that company we were just talking about. Yes, the DuPont family and the DuPont Company. Yes, that very same thing. That's at least where the legends lie. So according to this article, as well as several other places online, this area and road in the forest surrounding it, it's where the village was shot, or much of the village was shot. Do you guys remember that movie m Night Shamalan. Yeah, I enjoyed it. Uh. Yeah, so it's right around. That's a good way to set the tone. Yeah, yeah, just imagine that that's what it looks like. Uh. There's a specific part of it that you can see m es of online if you go on street view on Google Maps. It's a bit harder to detect this phenomena. But the trees have this weird thing where they bend strangely along this road. It should be noted that this is a single car road, a single lane road, so it does feel strange. It feels weirdly claustrophobic. At least it looks weirdly claustrophobic. And then those trees just make it eerie. Um. There was allegedly a mansion that was located somewhere on the property within the woods there with on one of the lots, and this mansion has been known as the Cult House. This is again according to legend, and at one point, this large home was owned by the DuPonts, who were just one of the wealthiest families that existed at the time. This is quite a while ago, I guess it doesn't give me any specific times, but the DuPonts have been operating in the US for decades and decades and decades. The legend goes that the DuPont family perhaps experienced and suffered from quite a bit of inbreeding. I guess I don't know the right way to say that their gene pool. Allegedly, according to this thing, it was small and there were a lot of unwanted children that were born according to the story, and those children were buried near trees. And yeah, there's certain trees that form the weird shape of a skull, like a child's skull. Kind of disturbing. Where did I first I think I first read this years ago in the series of books that's like Weird insert state here. Oh yeah, there's a your website side attraction type books are Yeah, I think it's like weird. Um, well, I don't know where do us whirred us dot com has an entire thing on here the alleged stuff about what has occurred, what has been seeing, what witnesses has stated. Although it is highly difficult to corroborate any of this stuff to get Unsolved Mysteries episode, you're not supposed to take it as hard research. It's folklore, you know, in my opinion, Like Weird Pennsylvania, you can order the book I have the Weird State books. Sculpture actually play a role in the village, like it actually was some sort of plot point where there's something hidden inside of it. If I'm not mistaken, one of them did, or perhaps it was just a set piece. I don't know. I don't know enough about the filming of that. All I've ascertained from my research here is that those woods were, in fact he used as a location. Best part of the village, by the way, we're not going to give away this whist if you haven't seen it, but the best part and the night Shamalan's cameo, he's just he's with a newspaper is always the best. I love them. I love them. Uh yeah, I think it's I think him Tarantino does. Who else does, like as a director does every movie with the like face pops in at some point. Is Stephen King a maximum overdrive? I just watched the trailer. Yeah, it's a great trailer when I need motivation, Like everyone makes mistakes, you know, and they power through it. Those trucks were terrifying when I was a kid. The short stories, right, he was all about sentient machines, you know, but like dumb ones like from Microwaves and Evil the Mangler, which is about like a haunted most laundry machine. That's good too, like the way it happens is really anyway. I like the short stories. I would love more of the cameos, but I don't know, man, I would love to hear more about directors who cameo in their own films, because I think it's Alfred Hitchcock. I think it's so films as well. Matt is there. I mean, there's like a cult like kind of mythos behind this area, and it looks it it feels very true detective to me, like there's some sort of elite you know, child murdering cult that like as rituals out in the woods. It just feels like those kind of woods. And when you throw du Pont in the mix, big money, you know, old money, start to the mind. Wanders Man, I would say, I would say, I can see what you're saying from my view. Outside of these websites that are specifically talking about how creepy it is and how there's a cult involved in all that stuff that's going on, the area looks very safe and happy and you're just kind of in the middle of the woods in this area of Pennsylvania and then maybe maybe security you know, uh, in the in those broncos. But also, yeah, there's so much stuff is stewing around about it, like the idea that like people aren't agreeing on what's going on. Some people are saying it cult without a ton of specifics, and then other people are saying, no, it's the ku Klux Klan, right, some are saying that yes. Again, there are rumors all over the place with all kinds of different concepts of what's going on here. This is one of the major things I will say about the road, because it is single lane, and because those trees are like in just weird formation at certain points, and there are other places in there where you're just there's so much tree cover. You're in the middle of the woods, right, But you've got a one lane highway going through kind of like going through some of the mountain areas of Georgia that I'm thinking of, or going through where it just feels like you're you're stuck and you're you're lost in the woods. Thank goodness you've got lights, especially if you're in the dark. And I'm imagining if you are on this one lane highway going through, winding through these trees, and you do encounter another vehicle that is, let's say, coming in the opposite direction, that's not just a quiet passing of another vehicle like you would on any other road. That becomes an occasion. It becomes a moment becomes a word yes, and the maneuvering figuring where you can actually get off where the shoulder exists. Yeah, I think this is me and I and I don't have any proof to bag this up other than what I know slightly of psychology. That tension that would be in anyone who is driving along that road if it's already got these legends surrounding it and you're just worried that even even the worry that another car is coming while thinking about these other legends, I think those two could combine to create a general level of fear and anxiety and maybe fight or flight that's going on just by being on the road, especially at night. Uh, I don't know that that's my that's my thinking there. So then everything that occurs becomes heightened, and I can just imagine something normal that you may see or here could be much scarier, especially if you're unfamiliar with the area of the floor of the flaida. I I totally see this, and I tend to agree. I would say, yeah, you guys are you guys are pretty on the money. But one thing that we also need to consider is the US is big. There are a lot of rural areas and there are a lot of creepy things that happen in those areas where population density is low, where there's not a huge like the US is a land filled with secrets. That is true. There is a great part of the country that is is invisible culturally. And I I love hearing about this. Cody, Cody, your letter has made my day. I would love to go there. I would love, love love to go there. Who's down for a road trip? Where we going? Let's go because I want to learn more about the true story and the legends surrounding that true story of the Bruce Alfred Johnston Senior Gang, known by a lot of different things, but this this was a gang that existed in the nineteen sevense that's when they were pulling most of their heists. Um nineteen sixties as well, but the nineteen seventies when they became notable a whole group of people that were operating all along this area, not necessarily in on that road or anything to do with that particular place, but all in this area. They were using crowbars all you know, blowtorches, ropes, like old school kind of stuff to pull off major heists where in the seventies they're stealing like thirty thousand dollars worth of stuff, or twenty five thousand dollars worth of stuff, or a bunch of tractors. And they were pretty notorious for the things they did. They're also notorious for as things went bad, killing off their own, including family members and and close loved ones of family members in order to protect their secrets. There's a whole huge story there with this gang and what they did and the way it culminates, and the reason why it's connected back to that road is because a group of them that were um that were caught allegedly were led to a field directly off of that Concert Road where they were made to dig their own graves and they were shot and killed and put into those graves. And that was allegedly done by the gang members themselves. UM. So you can imagine if the places supposedly haunted, that could really that could be an actual thing that could be. I don't know, if you're gonna do some ghost hunting, let's try that one out first. Yeah, yeah, that's and what we're seeing here is what we're seeing here is what I would call folklore live right. We're seeing these this kind of free form jazz of things get mixed together. I like you, Matt was trying to figure out find an image of the so called cult house, you know, and it's tough there because there are I saw a report from a guy who lived in the area, and this was around six years ago, so this probably changed. But he said he had worked at the Sun and Coach shop down the road on fifty two I think, and that he worked on all these people's cars, so he knew there were real people. They owned a lot of money. And he said, yes, there is a mansion in the woods that's the quote unquote cult house. There's an old couple that lives there. Uh. They just want to be alone. They just want to be rich and alone. And I could see how, you know, it reminds me a little bit of um. A lot of these stories, you know, they're descended from earlier stories, so it reminds me of the old tales of like the creepy, creepy old woman who lives on the edge of town, or the creepy old man is at the edge of the woods. Is he a warlock? Is she a witch? Surely surely one should get up too. When the moon is included how come no one ever sees her in a wolf in the same field at the same time, you know what I mean? Like that, Yeah, that kind of stuff. It's kind of reasons why people probably for a for a beat, believe that the Blair Witch Project was a documentary, because, I mean, the woods really do conjure these types of images. They really do kind of conjure these types of feelings of isolation and uh and terror. I mean there they can be beautiful, but they can also be very you know, otherworldly, and when you start getting this kind of lore in there, it really makes the mind go places. Yeah, I agree. No. Uh, Then when you were speaking of that story, did you say the Gorober? What did you say? Where did that person work? Unat Okay, I'm so I'm looking at the cult house that I found. I don't know if that's what it is, but it is a mansion, is a large, large house. I don't have the address here, but it's by a la a small lake or a pond um and it does look pretty or e uh, and the road does go right by it. So I'm you know, I'm thinking that might be it. And if it is, I can see why that place might be considered a bit creepy because of its uh general appearance on Google Maps. I think Google Maps is it's funny we're talking about Google Maps after we also did an earlier piece on facial recognition, like the surveillance state is real very much so. Uh So I would say that in that case, is folks can't be that well off because they're not able to get the big g of the Internet g Daddy to erase there or like at least pixelate their location. Right, Yeah, no, I can see that. Maybe it is maybe some offshoot of the DuPont family because they owned so much land, so much if you go on just keep saying, if you go in any maps, it doesn't matter which which digital map service are using. If you go on one of those maps services, you can find all of the DuPont company and families, lots of land and buildings, and they are everywhere around this area. And by the way, just we could go down such a rabbit hole with with the family. You guys, let's do it. You remember Catcher, right, Yeah, well, I think we would. I would. I've been thinking about this as well. I would love to do a series odd the modern American aristocracy, which is very much a real thing and very much above the law. If you guys are down, then we won't do that. And if you're listening along the home, send us some suggestions of some lesser known US aristocrats that you think need a spotlight on them. Also, tell us if you've been to Coult House. Tell us if you're the are you the couple living in Colt House and you're just really into podcasts? Has this like? Has this in the surprise twist of your day? Do we just accidentally shamal on you? Can we come hang with you and and do stuff? Whatever it is that I love a good cult. It's like a barbecue, you know. If you go in for the intro meeting. The secret is to know when they'll leave, you know what I mean? Yes, If if you have an evite you'd like to send us to join your cult, you can direct that to us via the internet, can't you, guys? That's right. You can find us all over the place on Twitter and Facebook and YouTube. We are conspiracy stuff on Instagram we are a conspiracy stuff show. If you would like to leave us a special message with your mouth, you can give us a call. That's right. You can dial this up directly any time at one eight three three st d w y t K three minutes you'll hear a voice that tells you you're in the right place. And then those three minutes are yours. Tell us what's on your mind. Give yourself a cool nickname like cult Boys or the h or do Pontron. Okay, they're not all gonna land. And then and then tell us what's on your mind. Tell us what you think about what we've discussed with Sean, Ronan and Cody today. Hold on, you might be saying, I do have a very creepy, creepy story. I know what happened with teflon blood transfusion in Brazil. I know where the cult lives. But I need more than three minutes to tell you. Don't. Don't feel like you have to keep calling this back instead, just right out the story. We read. Every single email we get always makes my day to to learn something new, and I'm sure that we're all the same in that regard. All you have to do is type it up and send it to us at our good old fashioned email address where we are conspiracy at I heeart Radio dot com. M H stuff. They Don't Want You To Know is a production of I heart Radio. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.