From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A production of I Heart Gradios How Stuff Works. Welcome back to the show. My name is Matt, my name they call me Ben. We are joined as always with our super producer Paul Mission controlled decade. Most importantly, you are you. You are here that makes this stuff they don't want you to know. An episode that almost never saw the light of day. It's true, this episode you're gonna here today went through the longest q A period I think we've ever had with any episode. That's true, Matt. Yeah, just as a little behind the curtain. Generally, what we do after we finish an episode, one or more of us will listen back to the episode, give some notes. Generally there's nothing, but sometimes there is. And in this case, um, it's taken a couple of weeks for us to come up with, um some major decisions about this, even whether or not to release it right. Yes, yes, as you said, so let's get the badger out of the bag here. We recently spoke to uh incredibly controversial figure prominent in the world of conspiracy theory or fringe thought named David Ike. To his supporters or his fans or advocates, he is seen as a voice that speaks truth to power in some cases right uh. To his opponents, and there are many he is considered either outright uh too far afield, you know. Some people have used phrases like crack pot or something. Other people have called him a virulent anti semit. This is a very very big figure in this world. But this is also very much a controversial figures, so much so that we spend a lot of t LC going into the interview with concerns and I'm actually not on this interview um, which I guess was a good thing for the process, because I was able to kind of take a step back and listen to it and come up with some some notes and some concerns that I had that we all ultimately shared. And we did a thing that I don't think we've ever done about an episode where we all sat down in a room and kind of prode and conned it out as to whether we should put this out or not, and we ultimately decided that because this gentleman looms so large in this space that we occupy that we're like talking about, and our whole you know, concept behind the show is to present things open mindedly. Um, we decided that it was probably a better idea and more of a service to our listeners to put this episode out and let this man defend himself and speak what he sees as his own truth. And as as we'll hear, he's pretty articulate. Spoiler alert, we do not get to everything. No, there's no way. David Ike has been speaking and writing gosh since the nineties and early nineties and at least on on the particular topics that we're interested in. And just to that one point, uh, that that you both are making here, he is such a large figure in the space in which we occupy that there's a certain amount of um fascination I think, at least for me personally with with David Ike, no matter what you or I think about him and his a lot of his views. Uh, we hope that you find him as intriguing no matter how you feel about him, as we do. And we wanted to try something something a little bit different for us in the course of this interview longtime listeners. As you know, we often say that you are the most important part of the show. You specifically you listening, No, not him you. Uh. This this is where the rubber hits the road in that regard. We're going to ask you if you would like to participate in a project with us after you hear this interview. We'd like to start something on our Facebook page. Here's where it gets crazy, where you can post the questions that you would like to ask David Ike. And if this is something that may be of interest to all of us listening, we can attempt to arrange another interview wherein we ask those questions of him. Yeah, that's a great idea, Ben, So we we hope you'll listen and think about those questions that you want to ask, think about the concepts that you're interested in that you'd like to hear him talk about, and and we'll do everything we can to to make that happen. Or reactions to what you hear in this interview, that's great. And here's a pro tip to see just how long we held onto this interview and going back and forth on whether or not we should air it. You'll hear you'll hear him drop some specific dates. One of the major reasons that we got to speak with David Ike is because he had a new documentary coming out called Renegade, and it was released on June four, and it is now well into June. That's that's how long it took. You know, if you look at it from a technical perspective, we've never been that far ahead. Yeah, that's true. That's true. And to that end, when you hear David or us mentioning his movie is documentary Renegade in the past tense, just know it should be the present tense. Right. So we want to give a big thank you to everyone listening as always. Uh and nol I especially want to thank you as well as you, Paul. You've probably had to sit through hearing different versions of this interview the most out of all of us. Uh and nol I think you're right. Having having a distance to come in and evaluate it from that perspective is invaluable. So thank you. You're welcome then, and I appreciated the opportunity. And one thing I do want to point out that hit me was this gentleman has a lot of work out there that you can read yourself if you so choose. He speaks about a lot of his ideas through the lens of empirical research and scientific data. I did not find that to be the case myself personally. UM, maybe there's something I'm missing, but I would leave it to you to sort out what one man's opinion is versus what science and fact would support. Well said Noel, and uh, here we go, everyone, David Ike, so for a brief bit of backgrounds here on stuff they don't want you to know. Since two thousand and eight, we have been exploring some of the some of the questions that never make it to the mainstream right across the wide field. And David, you are a prominent figure and have been in the world that the mainstream would call conspiratorial thought or research. But you have you have a journey that is far more complex than a simple point A two point B. You were known to some originally as as an athlete, right a professional athlete, and to some still as that. You were known to others as a uh an investigator who is not afraid of controversy, and to some critics you have been you've been an adversarial figure, at least in their eyes. What we would like to do today is to is to start at the beginning, because I think a lot of our listeners are probably they're aware of your work, but they're not aware of your origin. So could you tell us a little bit about about your early life leading up to your athletic career. Well, yeah, I was born in a city in the English Midlands called Leicester, in a working class uh family, and we didn't have any money and uh, you know, you got by and what you had. And I went through the school system as it was in the Auntie and fairties I was born in. But my ambition as a kid was always to be a professional footballer and a series of coincidences, bits of luck has been the story of my life all the way to present day really led me to be a professional footballer. And then I had to finish at the age of twenty one with rumortoried Arth Riders. I became a journalist and worked in newspapers and radio and television. I became a national spokesman for the British Screen Party as well as being a sports presenter and news presenter with the BBC, and then in nineteen my life change, if that really started to change in nine if we're talking about you know, paranormal happenings and what have you. When throughout nine nine, whenever I was in a room alone, I was still a television presenter and a national spokesman for the British Green Party, I felt I wasn't alone. It was like there was a presence there, and I've was not into any of the stuff before, but it got more and more tangible throughout n until in early I was sitting on a bed in an empty hotel room working for the BBC, and this presence was so tangible that I actually said into the room, would you please contact me if there's something there, because you're driving me up the wall. And coincidentally, another series of amazing events. Really it led me to a psychic after reading her book, and I didn't tell her anything that was going on. I just, you know, just told her that I wanted to see her and told her nothing else. And then she went into psychic mode this is March and said you're going to go out on the world stage and revealed great secrets and that she said the presence that was talking to her was saying that I would face enormous opposition, but they, whatever they is, would all be always will be there to protect me and that I would be guided to knowledge from then on, and sometimes increasingly now knowledge will be put into my mind and I just know things, and all I can say. We used to have an advert in on British television and the punch line was it does exactly what it says on the tin. Well, what I was told in this psychic experience has since done exactly what it says on the tin, because that's exactly what's happened in my life. From that moment. My life became a synchronistic journey of walking into information, whether it's contacts people at new things, whether it's personal experiences, whether it's books, whether it's documents, whatever. And it's gone on now for nearly thirty years, and that's basically how the information has been put together. Hey David, So a lot of our listeners out there, they they find themselves in um of in a a place somewhere along the spectrum of you know, extreme skeptic to a true believer. Right, So there's there's this Gosh, I just want to say, there's a spectrum that a lot of our listeners find themselves on. So some people listening to that story will will hear you talking about going to a psychic who has a message for you that then becomes a self fulfilling prophecy. Some some will hear that as a true prophecy of what is to come. I'm interested to know if you if do you feel like it influenced you in a way that led you down this path or do you think it was a path that was already preordained in some way for you? Well, Um, the idea that I could create a self fulfilling prophecy that would lead me all over the world and meeting people I didn't even kay arranged to meet just coincidental. Apparently meetings over a period of thirty years is stretching self fulfilling prophecies to the limit where they would probably snap. You know, the control system of the human family, human society is control of human perception because from everything, everything comes from perception. What we do, how we perceive things, everything is perception. Behavior comes from perception. And what we've what we're looking at is a a lifelong download from cradle to grave. If people only get their information from the mainstream, the mainstream everything, as I call it, that is a download of a perception, and it's a very narrow band of sception, which limits the sense of the possible and dismisses the almost entirety of possibility because it's so focused on what I call the postage stamp consensus, which is this version of normal that's taught in the schools that pounds out from the mainstream media. Seven that peer pressure is constantly imposing upon us. And what I've done is something very simple. It's you know, it's not kind of rocket science. I have let information be my guide, not preconceived idea, not oh that's not possible because I can't perceive it's possible. But just let the information be my guide. And that's where it's. It's taken me into this vast tapestry of information that I put together, and that the reason that so many people are now looking at my work is what was in my books in the ny farve Um is happening, you know. I mean, that's one hell of a self fulfilling prophecy. That is so people. All I say to people is, um, let's look at it this way. According to mainstream science, the electromagnetic spectrum is no point. Do not five percent of what exists in the universe visible light, which is the only band of frequency that we can actually see. Everything else we can't see is a smear of the north point, not five according to the projected size of the universe by mainstream science. By comparison with that, planet Earth is the equivalent of a billionth of a pinhead. Do you know? I feel it in my water, fellas. I really do that there possibly is more to know than appears on CNN and MSNBC and Fox News. I feel I feel that. I know it's strange, but I do It's uh. I think that's something that everyone listening can agree with. The sad truth of reality or perception, whatever you want to call it, is that things take more than five minutes to explain, which I know. I know. Local television anchors hate to confront that in more than a day to understand lived I lived. I lived it on the BBC. You know, you're trying to tell a story in some kind of with some kind of substance, and it's like, oh, that's a bit long in it. Oh yeah, it's up to three minutes now, craikey. So this is the This is the lack of substance, the superficiality that holds people in this perceptual prison because you're quite right, you need time to explain things, um, and if you don't have it, then all you can deal with is the superficial. Okay, So let's go back too and after your press conference and then you do go onto the BBC, not for the first time, because you've been a podcaster, you have people are aware of you, they know what you look like. But you go on, specifically on the Wogan Show with Terry Wogan, and you you come out and you tell your truth, that that your revelations right, and uh, you know this has been documented so many times, it's been spoken about so many times. It's such a turning point for for you. You've discussed that in the past. A lot of our listeners know about that. But let's talk specifically about what that message was early on the first um, the first communication essentially that you wanted to to have with the world. Well, let's um, first of all, um, look at the run up to how the Wogan Show interview came about and where I was coming from at that time. After I met the psychic, my life started to change again, synchronicity, coincidence, whatever you want to call it. And I left the BBC, not because I chose to leave the BBC self fulfilling prophecy, but because they didn't want to renew my contract, which was strange because all I had had was commendations up to that. But it was a perfect time for me to leave in the in the sequence of what was to come, and through nine I started writing a book called Truth Vibration. It's just about what was happening to me and I didn't really know at the time, but my life was changing. It was getting very strange. And then in early I had this overwhelming feeling to go to Peru, and I got on a plane to Peru. I didn't know why I was going to Peru. I just overwhelmingly intuition. I've got to be in Peru. This was the kind of thing what was happening then, And I got to Peru and over a period of three weeks, I was really only meant to be there for two I thought, But over a period of three weeks again an extraordinary series of coincidences led me all over to the place, and then eventually I ended up at a place called c Stani, which is an old ancient inca site not far from Puno on the lake of on the banks of Lake Titty Carcar, the highest navigable lake in the world. And I was walking around this place and it was beautiful, but I had this really intense feeling I had to go there. But my experience when I was there was was lovely. It's a lovely place, but it didn't match the intensity of my feeling I had to go there. So I got into the little taxi van with a Peruvian guide and the driver you could a little bit disappointed, thinking, well, yeah, it was nice, but why did I have this feeling to go there? And just a literally minutes down the road, I'm looking out the window daydreaming, and I was looking at this hill. And as I to the hill, all I could hear going through my head repeating was come to me, Come to me, Come to me, Come to me. So I'm thinking, well, what the heck? And I asked the guy to stopped the taxi bust thing, and I said, I'm just going to up that hill. I won't be long, but I was about an hour because of what happened. I got up the top and I walked among these stones on this hill and I'm looking out across see you starting which a beautiful site and distant mountains and the lake and everything. And then suddenly my and I've experienced this once before, my feet started to burn and it was like my feet were being pulled into the ground. And then I felt an energy going in the top of my head and through my body. And of course I'm all new to this, fellas, I don't know what's happening. I can rationalize it now with the thirty years of knowledge, but at the time, I'm thinking, what's happening to my life? And as I as I was standing there and this energy was going through me, I heard uh, not not a voice, but a very clear thought form that said, it will be over when you feel the rain. And I'm standing under a clear, cloudless, perutlean sky. I've got a big red nose to prove it at the time. And and then my arms went out at forty five degrees without me making any conscious decision to do it. And this energy then started to build and build until my body was shaking. And you know when you're driving a car and you you lose two miles or so, and you think, you know what happened to the last two miles. Subconcerts been driving the bath Thank goodness. Um it was bit like that. And one of these times, when I came back to two if you like consciousness, UM, I noticed that on the across the distant mountains some way away, there was a light gray mist. And as I watched it very quickly, it was almost like you know, putting a video on fast forward, and if you portrayed what followed in a movie, they'd say that's far fetched, that would never happen. Well it did, and I watched this h what was obviously a rainstorm over these distant mountains get darker and darker, and it started to come towards me. And in the end, by which time my body is just shaking with his energy, I had almost literally a wall of steroid rain coming towards me, and eventually it hit me. I was soaked in an instant. It was so powerful and the energy stopped. My legs were like Bambi. My arms were now agony because though I hadn't felt them before because they've been in the air. All is done. And what happened then is um I described it like this, It's like some you've lived in a bubble all your life and someone comes along and burst the bubble without telling you, and suddenly concepts, information, perceptions are pouring into your conscious mind and you can't handle it. It's like pressing too many keys on a computer. The computer says, I'm going to freeze now, thank you very much. I can't handle this. And this is what a kind of the state I was in for about three months, and the Wogan Show was right in the middle of that. So um when after about three months the computer unfroze, if you like, and I was I was the David Ike that people recognized before. People were saying to me, I thought you'd supposed to have gone mad, You're the same David. I used to know what I was outwardly, but I wasn't in fact, because now I was seeing, as they say about newspapers, you know, you don't believe the words, the real truth is in the white bits between them, you know. And that's what it was like. Instead of seeing lots in terms of world events and happenings, I was seeing patterns. I was seeing uh, not pixels. I was seeing pictures. I was seeing how they connected. Because it's when you connect dots, when you connect the apparently random events, that's when you see the door. So in the middle of all that, when I'm trying to get a grasp of what the heck is happening to me? And I mean there's three months of of who am I, what's my name? All the rest of it. That's that was when the Wogan Show appeared. But that was a phenomenal gift to me. Phenomenal gift because the prison that most people live in is the fear of what other people think, and what stops people giving their genuine opinions and their genuine views and saying what they really think is the fear of what other people think and the mass, ridicule, historic levels of it that followed that Wogan Show, where I couldn't walk down any street in Britain without being laughed at. I lived my life to the sound of distant and less than distant laugh m was was the nightmare you would think, But it was the gift that set me free. And some of the things I've talked about and written about since. Um anyone that that was concerned about other people what other people thought of them would never have talked about that, never have written about that. But to me, I don't give a damn what people think about me. It's of no interest to me. It's it's it's they choose to see the world as they see it, choose to see me as they see it. But but I choose to see me as I see me and not be influenced by by by what people think and what people say about me. So that was the great gift that set me free. Let's pause here for one moment. We will be back after a word from our sponsor, and we're back. What's fascinating about this in particular is that it leads us to it leads us to a series of let's say two or three questions that are are forefront uh from from this uh, this experience that you're describing. First, you know, the name of this show is stuff they don't want you to know. And one of the main questions that we get often is, uh. We we'll have people right in and say, well, who are they uh for for us? Uh that the nature of they or them changes depending upon what we're exploring, and typically what we're exploring is people, forces, groups, whatever you want to call them, who are controlling uh some sort of narrative. Right the same way that UM petroleum companies prevented studies on pollution or certain types of pollution from coming out, or the same way that tobacco companies prevented research on the dangers of tobacco consumption for coming out. So one thing that really really interested us when when you were describing both your books earlier and your personal experience, was this idea of a hive mind. You've you've mentioned this before in earlier work of people, you know, people existing in perhaps an invisible psychological prison. And if we look at the Internet as a hive mind, the most direct question we run into with that thought is who then controls the hive Well, just very quickly, before I go there, you bring up the hive mind. We are on the cusp and people like ray Kers while the Google executive or openly talking about this because they're trying to put a positive spin on it, we're on the cusp of the technological hive mind where AI is connected to the human brain through technological connections UM and people like curse while even give a time period of it of around twenty So if we have our our brain mind connected to the cloud as occurs wild calls it via AI, then what what a fantastic description or what other description could you give that than a hive mind that they are seeking to turn humanity into basically a series of computer terminals on an aim internet. In terms of they, it depends on what level you want to go to. I mean, obviously, the questions that you're asking are the questions that I asked um way back in the ninety nineties when I'm trying to understand how things operate. These are the questions that I asked, who are they? And after thirty years of research that basically the world is controlled like this. And I would say this that people might look at people like me and say, you see conspiracies everywhere? Okay, Well, first of all, the definition of a conspiracy Dictionary definition is basically two or more people conspiring to bring about a desired end, usually illegal. On that basis, the world's drowning in conspiracies, So let's get over this idea. There are no conspiracies which were asked to believe. And by the way, the term conspiracy theorist and conspiracy theory came into widespread use because of the c I A provable fact. The CIA put out a a round robin UH request to major media in America in the nineties sixties, when people who were questioning the Kennedy assassination were starting to make ground in terms of people seeing that maybe the full story hasn't been told. Are you kidding um? And they urged the media organizations to use the terms conspiracy theorist and conspiracy theory to discredit those that were questioning the Kennedy assassination and other assassinations that happened in the sixties. Of course, Martin Luther, King, Malcolm X, and Bobby Kennedy. So that's where it came from, and all these years later, without a clue where it came from, the mainstream media just parrot conspiracy theory. And the question they never asked when they parrot it, Oh, it's an conspiracy theory is a simple question which any mature, intelligent person would ask. Okay, but is it true? And if you look at so called conspiracy theories and look at one so called conspiracy theories in my books going back to the es they've happened or are happening, you know, maybe that's another self fulfilling prophecy. Maybe I've made that happen. I don't know. But in terms of day, this is how the world is basically controlled. And we can go deeper into this if you like. One so explained. Imagine a spider's web um and each strand of the web is a secret society, a semi secret group or organizations and agencies that we see in the the world of the scene. At the center of the web is the spider, as I call it, and that's where this whole control agenda for humanity is coming from. The strands immediately around the spider are the most exclusive secret societies. Some of them don't even have names to make them harder to track down, and they will be peopled overwhelmingly by those that the public will never have heard of. You then come out from the spiders, still in the hidden, and you start to hit the secret society is that we've heard of but we don't know what they do. Be in the core of the Freemason's Opus Day, the Knights Templar, the inner core of the Jesuit Order, Knights of Malta, etcetera. And then you meet what I call the cusp organizations, which are groupings overwhelmingly owners thinked tanks where the hidden meets the scene, and these are the Builderberg Group, the Council on Foreign Relations, the Trilateral Commission, the Club of Rome, and so on. And then you go out from them and you're into the world of the scene. You're into governments, government agencies, cartels, corporations, banking systems, et cetera, media ownership, and in the world of the scene, the decisions being made, constantly impacting on the direction and nature of human society, appear to be random, but actually that society changing, transforming ones are coming from the spider. That's where it's orchestrated from. And that's why as I go around the world, as I've been many many times in the last thirty years, you see the same things happening at the same time, and you see the same types of legislation being introduced, often with the same excuses and sometimes even worded almost the same because it's being centrally orchestrated. If you think of a corporation, a global corporation, say McDonald's, they have a headquarters in the United States, but all around the world you have McDonald's in the various countries, and they all are the same brand, the same nature. I mean, you go into McDonald's in Russia or South Africa, it's the same McDonald's as in downtown Atlanta, because that network, that global network of McDonald's is being centrally orchestrated. So they all look the same, they are at the same they all basically respond to a central point. This is how this web works. So if you look at the oil industry and the biotech industry, and your Monsanto's and your bays, etcetera. And you look at these other cartels like the pharmaceutical cartel, in the end, if you go deep enough into their structure, you're meet the point where they attached to this web. The vast majority of people in these groupings will not be aware of what their their cartel or their corporation is really about. But at one point deep in the in the structure, it will attach to this web. And at that point, the pharmaceutical cartel, the oil cartel, the biotech cartel, et cetera, are all controlled by the same force, and that's how it's orchestrated. Okay, so David, this is all This is all fascinating stuff, and it's it's interesting how has been and I are listening to you, how we've covered a lot of the things that you would uh, that you've mentioned here as parts of the web, you know, the varying aspects of it. Over the course of your career, you've had a lot of criticisms thrown at you, and and one of the one of the primary ones that at least we've found in our research is is that mentioning of this um even the symbology of the black spider at the center of the web and um hearkening back to the protocols of the Elder of zion Um, that a lot of these beliefs, at least to some people's view who have criticized you, appear to be anti Semitic in nature in some way, at least the basis of the beliefs around which the you know, some of the stuff you're talking about. UM, I just want I wonder how now, in twenty nineteen, how do you respond to to those critics. Well, I don't respond to critics. We're talking garbage. Let me tell you about my philosophy on life. My philosophy on life and the nature of life is that we are consciousness. We are awareness. We are a state of awareness. That's the eye, that's the eternal lie. And all the labels we give ourselves, whether they're Jewish or Muslim, or Atheist, or Christian or Indo, or black or white, or whatever income bracket, whatever cultural background. These are not who we are. These are experiences that we're having. What we all are, whether we call ourselves Jewish or Muslim or whatever. What we all are is the awareness in the end, the same awareness, a different point of attention, in the same awareness, having different experiences. So I completely reject as a self identity all these labels, which are basically sub dividing all the time into smaller and smaller labels of self identity, which what can be then what played off against each other to divide and rule the population. So I will not take lectures on discrimination from those that fundamentally, whoever they are, identify their I with their label and perceive everything from the filter of that label, when I'm actually the one saying, actually, you know, we're all the same consciousness having different experiences, which is the ultimate in inclusivity, to use the word of the time, it's the ultimate in not discriminating between labels, because I reject them all as as as a self identity rather than an experience, so that when you when you're coming from that perspective of reality and life, and you are being accused of the very opposite of what you are, then there has to be another reason for it. And if someone is revealing things as I am, across a vast spectrum of information, um that the system in totality, the core that I'm talking about, doesn't want people to hear here. Then if you can't discredit them by having an open debate and they won't debate with me, I've tried, UM, then you you don't debate with them on what they're saying, You accuse them of what they're saying on the basis of lying about what they're saying. And that's that's That's basically what it is. I mean, explain this to me. I've got a movie coming out on June the fourth, just what four days from now, called Renegade, story about my life but also about my work. I'm in that movie, the word Jewish and Zionism is not mentioned at all. And yet, when there was supposed to be a premiere of that movie at the Aero Theater in Santa Monica, Los Angeles, theater owned by an organization called American Cinematique, it was canceled two hours before that the film was supposed to be shown with all the upset and disruption and chaos that it caused for the audience, because I was supposed to be antisemitic. The people that canceled it, I've not seen the film. They don't know anything about me. But it was canceled. Why because they were told what I'm about. I'm sure they were told what was in the film, where nothing of the kind was in the film. You know, if you stood by my side over the last few years, you would realize, and probably I would think your jaw would drop if you realize how easy it is to destroy someone's freedom of speech just by lying about them. And what we're looking at here is not a a group of organizations, because it's very coordinated that are trying to stop discrimination against Jewish people. It's not about Jewish people. And I'll tell you one reason why. If you're a Jewish person and you criticize the government in Israel, you are going to get abuse from these same organizations on a scale that's much greater than even I get. Because it's easy to dismiss someone and accuse someone and demonize someone as anti Semitic what actually means actually means anti Arab, by the way, when when they're not Jewish, it's much more difficult to do that. When they're Jewish people saying the same thing, so they get more flat and more abuse from these organizations than even I do. It's not about protecting Jewish people from discrimination. It's about protecting the Israeli government from criticism and exposure. And when you've got a movie that doesn't even do that doesn't even talk about it being banned on the grounds of what they've been told about me, then you see how easy it is to silence someone by lying about But I don't care. I don't care. I know what I think, I know where I'm coming from, and that's all that matters to me. And if people want to lie about me, well be my guest, but it ain't going to stop me. Absolutely. So to to UH, two important points here. First, I I believe in hope that everyone listening to this episode can agree that the government of a country is not the people or the population of a country. UH. And furthermore, one of the criticisms UH speaking of freedom of speech that that we found cited in earlier interviews was an excerpt from your book and The Truth Shall Set You Free. I'd like to I'd like to read this and hear your response to it, uh, and and to verify that this is uh, this is your your words, your speech. It is quote I strongly believe that a small Jewish clique which has contempt for the massive Jewish people, worked with non Jews to create the First World War, the Russian Revolution, and the Second World War. This end quote, This passage continues, and this is This is one of the things that we see critics citing when when they raise charges of discrimination and anti semitism. It sounds is if it sounds as if you've clearly established in this interview and other interviews that your opinion is that all people fundamentally are the are are the same, right. But in this this passage, I think is one of the things that critics immediately go to when they're when they're saying that you are uh, discriminatory or anti Semitic. Could you could you respond to that quick? Let me ask you this Let me ask you this question, please. UM. If if I had said that a small claque of Chinese people were involved, or a small cliaku of Argentinean people are a small clique of Australians. Would that be a problem, No, it wouldn't. So why is it a problem because they're mentioning Jewish people. Just take the Russian Revolution. You see what what's been happening is these groups that ultimately answered to the Israeli government, not to Jewish people. They just claimed to speak for Jewish people, use Jewish people as a front when the Jewish, like every other group of people, Jewish people as a vast spectrum of opinion. And when you when you look at the Russian Revolution, um, the the documents have come out, they've been published in other books decades ago, people who have done a scholarly research into the Russian Revolution and found that there was a fantastic ratio of Jewish people involved in the Russian Revolution compared with everyone else, major major ratio. Now here's the other thing is one of the things that happened after the Russian Revolution is that very large numbers of Jewish people in Russia were subject to programs, were subject to discrimination, were subject to violence. So how do you square that? Well, you square that by understanding that Chinese people do horrible things to Chinese people as well as nice things, and American people do horrible things to American people as well as nice things. When do you take any group of people and you say this group is this, you are completely missing the point. You show me any group of people, any cultural group, any religious group, anywhere in the world, and I'll show you nice people, I'll show your ugly people, I'll show you okay people, and I'll show you psychopaths. Why should any group of people be different from from that when it's all the same. So when you call out in this case, what I would call psychopaths, you are, by definition, according to the propaganda, accusing that entire group of being a psychopath, which you're not doing. I mean, some of the the people Jewish people have suffered enormously from the actions of other Jewish people, so the same with every other cultural group. But it's it's um and I will not be intimidated from delivering my truth and the factual research that I've done just because someone's gonna hurl abuse and mendacity at me. I won't do it, and I won't defend myself either. I've got a thing to found myself for. If you see yourself as a label, and you see if your label to be superior to all the other labels, then don't accuse me of racism, because that's what you see around the world because so many people are trying to impose their label and what their label represents on everyone else. What coup people just chill out and just you know, if you want to be that and you live your life like that, go ahead, good luck to you. Just don't e pose it on everybody else, whoever you are, whatever background you are, David, I was having a discussion with my wife last night about a quote of yours that speaks to this. I think, really well, I'm just gonna really really fast if if you become mesmerized by all the labels I am are this, I am are that, then that's how we get caught in the illusion. The labels are getting played off against labels, and the labels are at war with each other, while the few with their hands controlling the strings of all the bloody labels are laughing their socks off. And she and I both identified uh strongly with that. Just when you when you think about especially culture on the Internet today and the oppositions that exist these binary systems in almost everything where you are for or against this, for against that. UM. It's it's fascinating to me. And what I really want to get to is something that Gosh for for a decade now, for a decade now roughly, UM that I've been thinking about, something that you've been speaking of, and it's the the binary system that exists within all the energy that exists in the universe. The concepts that you that you brought forth in that still I believe, I believe and I can't speak to you, but I believe these are still the same UM beliefs and at least beliefs of the energy systems that exist in the universe. The Godhead versus the the opposition power, the Um, the lucifer. I think you referred to it as A several times, but that that's what the Secret Society is referred to it as. Yes, that's their God. Well, I want to get back to UM. And I think my understanding on this is correct, at least from from what you've you've said in the past. But it has something to do with the planet Saturn. Can you talk about that? WHOA? I mean, that is such a massive subject and it needs so much background for something that appears on first hearing to be crazy to make logical sense. That's why I go into it in the books in detail and with all the background. But let's just say that Saturn where it is now? Um, I mean, how how did ancient societies see it? How do they see Saturn? How do they work out what satin is or even if it's a planet or whatever? They couldn't And yet, again and again and again you find that ancient societies worship Saturn. How did they do that if it was where it is now? And there's been some tremendous research. There's a a whole scientific movement now which is known as the Electric Universe, which looks at the electrical electromagnetic nature of reality but also encompasses, um, the ancient myths about Saturn. Because the myths about Saturn are absolutely phenomenal in their number and their nature and when they've been there's a particular guy who's done a tremendous amount of research on this. When you break down these myths about Saturn, it's very clear they're not talking about Saturn as where it is now. They're talking about Saturn as where it was when the myths were created. And it was a son of the Earth Um, and we had a twin sun system, the one we see now, but also Saturn, which was much dominant in the Earth sky. And what followed was a cataclysmic cataclysm in the heavens, which is come down in the words of myth as the war of the gods in the heavens. And this is when, if you followed the research, that Mars became what we now call a dead planet, and so many other planets went walk about in this whole period, and the Earth um nearly nearly came to an end. There's a book I read a long time ago by some researchers who basically looked at these ancient myths of the cataclysm that struck the Earth, which was the Saturn cataclysm and others involved, and they looked against that in the same book at the geological and biological history and evidence of the Earth, and they found that they correlated. They were just fantastic upheavals on the Earth, as there would be if what happened happened. And and this is that leads us to the myth of the end of Atlantis and New and the Muria and these great civilizations disappearing under the oceans and all these stories that come out through history, and when you go around the ancient or cultural native societies that have carried this ancient knowledge through the generations, you find that they all have the same basic story of this period when there was this war in the heavens and the earth nearly came to an end. And so that was the start of the story that I that I tell in the book that led to where Satin is now. And again, when they're describing Saturn in its previous position, they do not describe rings. They don't describe Saturn with rings at all, just as a son. And so where did the rings come from? And so I go into that in the books as well. And there have been some scientists, one in particular who was a mainstream, middle of the road, um you know, songsheet scientists who started to look at pictures coming back from the Voyager spacecraft that took pictures of Saturn at quite close range in the nine eighties, and then he started to see even from those pictures that the rings were changing and they weren't static, and there was something malleable about And then when the Galileo UH spacecraft came through to Saturn in four or something like that, and he looked at their pictures with the rings, and he saw phenomenal differences in them. He also, by the way, saw um what he called electro magnetic vehicles, vast electro magnetic fields that that were in the rings, and and he's put pictures in his book. He produced a book called The Ringmakers of Saturn some time ago. He's in his nineties now, and you see some what he calls exhaust coming out of this, these electromagnetic fields that are actually making the rings and changing the rings. And you know, I go into all this in some detail in the in the great detail in the books. And when you do, you realize that m. Saturn is very different to what we've been told, and the whole story of the Solar system is very different to what we've been told, but fits perfectly the ancient myths about what happened in ancient history to the US and uh on human society. Let's take a quick break here. We'll be back with David soon, but for now, let's hear a word from our sponsor. All Right, we're back man, David. Okay, you you are you are famous for your for your lectures and the lengths of those lectures and how much you pack in when you're speaking on subjects. And uh, man I I heard as soon as you started answering that question when you when you reacted with woe we hold okay, hold on, we gotta go into so much stuff here. Um, it's just it's so true because Uh, there's so much information that you have to build up upon. And really, honestly, David, that's what we do with this show. We try and build up on all these things so then we can harken back to you know, this episode that we covered this thing. Listen to that for background. Um, you know your your work over everything that is covered in Renegade, the movie coming out with Orchard. It's just there's so much there. And you know, in the past, people get stuck on some of the things that you've said, and you get criticized for those things as people get stuck on the what seemed what's at least, um, what people experience in their minds when they hear it as something like a reptilian uh, you know, race of extraterrestrials or something like that. That's what sticks with people. Um. But there's so much to be discussed here. Um, Can can we talk just really quickly right before we end here about the stakes that we find ourselves in, um, both with regards to humanity, you know, as a species, but also with our planet Earth. And why is Earth? Why is Earth? And the small little bipedal beings that walk around on it? Why are those two things so important? Well, how important they are is relative. Obviously they're very important to us. But like I say, it's the size of a billions of a pinhead compared with the size of the universe, and we should not forget. You know, people tend to see everything as it appears in the moment, and they solidify that into a view of how things are. Just to give you an example, until the nineteen twenties, mainstream science believe there was one galaxy in the universe. Less than a hundred years later, the latest highest estimate that I've seen from science is two trillion galaxies in the universe. So there's a great quote from Socrates in ancient Greece that's attributed to him. Anyway, wisdom is knowing how little we know. That's what keeps your mind open to all possibility and stops it closing and coagulating and becoming concrete like around a very narrow perception of reality. Um. And where we are now is, from a human point of view, a very very critical period. As I've been pointing out for thirty years. You know, people have dismissed what I've said in the past and laughed at it because it wasn't tangible to them. But as I said many years ago, you can only manipulate under the radar for so long to transform human society. Before you have to transform human society, and it has to break the surface where people can see it. And we are big time there now. So if you look at just one level of what I've been saying all these years, but we were going to eventually face the imposition of an Orwellian um tyranny that would destroy freedom of speech and would not allow official narratives to be challenged, Well we are there now, big time. And let's just go back to this sequence again. Perception, which controls human behavior comes from information received. You control information received so they only see official narratives. You will impose um perception and thus control behavior. And what we're seeing now with the Silicon Valley giants, in my view, all of which ultimately are controlled by the same force. It's why they operate in unit. In unison, we're seeing the systematic deleation of freedom of speech increasingly, not even through human hand, but through AI, which is increasingly controlling everything. Now. I've been warning about this for such a long time, long before people like Elon Musk, who has warned what a danger it is and then opens a company to advance it, which is kind of strange, and keeps putting satellites up to beam WiFi Internet at every inch of the planet, which is absolutely fundamental to this technological control system that I've written about for so long. Because the idea is that you attach the human brain to AI, so AI becomes the human mind, it becomes human thinking, it becomes human emotional response. And to do that you have to have what people like kurs Wild called the cloud everywhere, Otherwise you can't attach people to it. And this is why we're seeing this explosion of satellites going up, pounding the Internet at every inch of the Earth. That's what they want. Eventually, they want more than twenty thousand satellites up there. We're now even seeing astronomers complaining in the last few days about the fact that they're destroying the night sky with these things. There's so many well they've seen nothing yet and and Elon Musk is right in the middle of it. And I would love to ask him how he squares AI could be the end of humanity with what he's doing, which is allowing that process to happen. It's very very strange. He's either bewildered or his kid in us somehow. But the thing is that we're now having in particularly you, but all of us in the end, particularly you in America, are now having this five G rolled out without any tests whatsoever, and without any independent studies funded by government or anyone else to see what the consequences are, not just physically but psychological of this um this five G millimeter frequency band, which is actually a weapon. It's been It's come out of the military, you know, the American military and law enforcement. They have trucks that they used to scatter crowds. They drive them up, you can see them on the internet, and then they unleash this frequency and the frequency is decoded by the skin of the protesters, because the human body is actually an antenna. The cutting edge of science has been aware of that for a very long time. And if people feel their skin is on fire, and what did they do? They scatter and they run. That technology uses the same band of frequency as five G, which because it doesn't travel as far as as as what we've had up to this point, and you can't use um big transmitters transmitting along distance, they're going to have to put They are putting across America as I speak, boxes, little boxes on lamp standards, etcetera, along this every street to beam this stuff out, like in front of children's bedrooms, etcetera. And the reason they're doing it without testing it's because if there was testing, as some independent scientists have come out and said this is a potential catastrophe for the human race, then it wouldn't be allowed to play out. So you don't test it if you know you're going to get the wrong result. And the whole foundation of five G is to empower something called the smart grid. And the smart grid is the reason that almost everything that comes out these days is called smart. Smart They're smart that smart meat, the smart car, smart TVs, ETCeteras. Because all these smart concepts and smart technologies are designed to connect and communicate with each other and the idea is to create we're talking about smart cities now they're starting to be built where the entire city is controlled by AI. This is the same because we're touching now on the present into the future. And what I appreciate what I what I appreciate you mentioning is something that may not have occurred to many of our listeners before hearing what you just said. So just to re emphasize what you're saying here, we are entering. We already exist within an orwelly in networked world, and this touches on. This touches on multiple things, you know. It touches on the extinction of an ownership society into a service economy. It enters into the extinction of privacy, right if privacy still exists? Connected might yeah, yeah, And what I think most of our fellow listeners would would want to know is given given your history of accurately in some cases accurately predicting events from from your earlier work, such as the child abuse cover ups that existing continue in the United Kingdom and abroad, as well as predictions regarding a surveillance state. I believe the UK has the highest density of CCTV monitoring in the world. Uh, what what observation, advice, prediction, even words of encouragement would you have for people who have listened to this episode and are thinking, for lack of a for lack of a better phrase, pardon my French, holy sh it, what do I do now? Right? Well, maybe I could just briefly explain how you can predict the future in relation to what we've been talking about. There are two worlds operating in the same world, and these two worlds have very different levels of information. This is why so much information is suppressed from the the the reality the world that the mass of the human population lives in. This cabal and its networks operate from a very different level of knowledge. It's knowledge that he's kept from the rest of the population, and it's passed on through the upper echelons of the secret society network through the generations, and they don't want us to know that. What people like me do is go in search of it. And so if you are in that other world, which is much more advanced in its knowledge and knowledge of technology and knowledge of how reality works, knowledge of how to manipulate human psychology, then you can project a future agenda a future sequence of happenings to transform human society, which are not known about in the mainstream of human society. But if you can, through research and sweat and hours, uncover that, then you can predict the future. Because what you're actually doing is not so much predicting the future per se, but predicting or revealing the sequence of events that this agenda has in mind for humanity. And if nothing intervenes to stop that sequence unfolded, which is the whole point of what I do to stimulate that intervention, then it will unfold. So now we can start to understand why old As Huxley could be so phenomenally accurate in Brave New World, written or published in the nineties, written and published in the nineteen thirties, in terms of current events involving drugs and genetics and technology. We can now understand why George orwell real named Eric Blair could be so phenomenally accurate with his book in four and why someone that I have quoted at length in my last but one book called Phanto himself. He was a doctor called Dr Richard Day, a big time Rockefeller family insider, and in nineteen sixty nine, no one knows why he did this, but I'm glad you did. And he was addressing a group of pediatricians in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, in nine, and for some reason he asked people to turn off recording equipment and not to take notes because he was going to tell him how the world was going to change, because basically what he represented was going to change it. And he reeled off um a long list of things that were going to happen in the world, and when you read them sixty nine because one doctor called Dr Lawrence Dunegan did take notes, and later he started to talk about it because he was realizing that the world described by Day in ninety six nine was happening. Richard Day described in nineteen sixty nine the Internet and how it worked. He said in nineteen sixty nine, we are going to make boys and girls the same he said in nine. We are going to have mass movements of people from cultures to culture to break down cultures all over the world. And this was nine. So how is that possible? Because if you are part of, or can research into that projected agenda, operating in the secret society networks, you can predict the future. That's how it's done. That's why my books have been so accurate and predicting the future. They've just been saying, this is what's planned by this agenda, and the idea is to intervene in it. And what we need to do first of all, in fact, primarily is d program. You know, people talk about waking up, people must wake up. What does that mean? It means deprogramming from the perceptual programs that we've been downloading from cradle to grave. You come out of the womb, your parents are immediately influencing your perceptions from the perspective of the sequence you're about to go through. You at a ludicrously young age. Now you've only just arrived your into the education system, as it's bravely called, and for the rest of your formative years you are given the system states version of everything and reality of how things are, how things aren't, of history of everything. And also through that same period you are being prepared psychologically to obey authority for the rest of your life without question. They tell you from the earliest age when you can talk, when you can eat, when you can go to the toilet. In in the school system, these are all psychological preparations. And then you go out into the world, peer pressure around you, people who've been through the same programming sausage machine that you have and bought the the the program bought that version of normal. They then put pressure on you if you want to break out of it, they ridicule you or or condemn you or whatever. The mainstream media is pounding out that same version of reality that all the way through your life. Mainstream science is coming from the same perception of normal. So is mainstream medicine, so is mainstream everything, and and so if all you've basically heard is one set of facts, norms, whatever, you are very likely to believe them. This is why Muslim people overwhelming come from Muslim families, and and and Christian people come from Christian families, etcetera. Hindu families people come from Hindu families because as they were growing up, that's the belief system they heard about, so it they absorbed it. This is what the system does. And what people need to just do is just stop and say, why do I believe what I do? And am I really saying that although I live within a smear of no point, not nor five percent of the universe. All I need to know is the tiny band of possibility that I've been taught through the school system, but I read in religious books. I mean, it's ridiculous. You've got the entirety of possibility, uh in the great forever of infinite reality, and yet were confined to this narrow band of frequen which is the only frequence is we can see. And we believe that a few people called authority, within this tidy band of frequency are telling us all we need to know. It's nonsense. And if you're in authority and you want control, you you you tell people to believe what will allow you to have that control. Therefore you control by control of information. What we need to do to escape from that is to stop believing these these norms that we've been pressured to believe in, and start to open our minds to other possibility. And when you do, and I know this from people I've spoken to and people have read my books all over the world, When you have access to these two two other explanations for the world, they make more sense than what people have been told up to this point. And and and your mind starts to flow, and you start to stop seeing pixels and things in isolation and you start to see how everything connects. But you've got to let your mind open, otherwise you can't do it. And that is that that idea of a larger picture is perhaps a good positive analog to the web described earlier. Everyone listening to this show is well aware that the best way to learn about something is to read multiple views on it, and the and the biggest thing that any individual or group can learn about is the nature of this wild ride that we call reality. David, I thank you so much for your time with your time with us today. Now I speak for many people in our audience who are right now yelling at their phone or at their at their computer. However they hear this because I'm sure that there are dozens and dozens of things that we were not able to get to today. However, we do want people to know that they can learn more about your work through your multiple books, through your upcoming film that's great, Renegade, and also through your website, through your YouTube channel, all these things. Can you just tell our listeners where to learn more and where to watch Renegade? Well, David dot dot com is the kind of focal point. There's an enormous library of information and videos that I've done on David dot dot com. Renegade. The details of where to see Renegade are all on David dot dot com. It's it's out very shortly on June the fourth, and I've been very very encouraged UM that people in the premiers have taken friends along who know nothing about my work and they've been really gobsmacked by what they've seen because it's it's a story about my life, yes, but only up to a point. It's really the information that I'm putting out. And I'm very pleased with what the what the film company have done. I mean, I've had no input into it apart from you know, they Fly on the Wall filmed me. But I'm very pleased with with what they've done. And I've got another book coming out in UM in September called The Trigger. And if people think, um, I've been controversial up to this point, well strap in because that one trumps some are in many ways. Well, we certainly hope you'll come back to speak with us about that. David. Oh, I absolutely love to Yeah. Oh, thank you, and that is our show. Everyone. Thank you so much for listening. We'd like to hear from you of course, you are the most important part of our show. You can find us on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter, or you can email us directly. We are conspiracy at i heart radio dot com. Stuff they Don't Want You to Know is a production of I heart Radio's How Stuff Works. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.