So every so often this show, we have our fellow listeners reach out to us and ask us to interview people are well known in a certain field, whether that's for hunting cryptids, whether that's for delving into unsolved crimes, or in the case of today's classic episode, whether it's a matter of what's up there in the sky. So we we're joined with Dr Steven Greer to talk about his work looking into global reports of UFOs and as we're taking um as we're taking some time off for the holidays, we figured this would be a good time to share this conversation. You know, our interest in Stephen Greer's work goes back to the early two thousand's, right around two thousand one, when we learned about this thing called the Disclosure Project, and you know we've been interested in his work since then. So let's jump back in and listen to this conversation together. From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or learn the stuff they don't want you to know. Hello, and welcome back to the show. My name is Matt, my name is Nol. They call me Ben. You of course are you and that makes this stuff they don't want you to know. We have a doozy of an episode for you today, Ladies and gentlemen, skeptics and true believers, friends and neighbors. You've heard longtime listeners about something called disclosure, and typically in the realm of uthology, which is a fun word to say, and it's tricky to spell. It's just that, why know, after the f you've heard of this concept if you're at all interested in allegations of extraterrestrial contact, rumors of government involvement with extra terrestrial or extra dimensional entities. Right, it's the idea that one or more world governments or corporations have not only discovered evidence of some otherworldly or other dimensional being, but they have also perhaps had contact with these creatures or use technology that they have found, and for one reason or another, and the reasons can vary, wanted to keep it as secret. Yeah, we've been fascinated by the disclosure movement and the UFO issue in general for years and years and years. You may take your mind back to May of two thousand one, when at the National Press Club in Washington, d C. A group of twenty government witnesses These are military ex military usually who got together and they described a decade's long conspiracy to cover up visitation of extra terrestrials to Earth. And they discussed how the US government was spending forty two eighty billion dollars a year through black budget projects to fund this thing. But why, Matt, why would they do that? Why would they try to cover up the aliens? Because you know, it's just sort of good to have secrets for funzies. Sure, but you know, according to these people, they were saying that the government was sitting on alien technology that they had reverse engineered from a the Roswell crash in onward, and that they also could provide unlimited energy to all the Earth's inhabitants like right now if they wanted to, and they could have since the fifties, but they were just keeping it to themselves. And we know how the military and the government love to sit on technology and keep it away from US mortals as long as possible. That is a document into fact. Uh. Unfortunately, it is true that there is there is technology hidden from the public, or at least technological capacities that have not been publicly explored or commercialized. The old joke that you might hear a lot of your military official friends saying when there are a couple of cups in to their Saturday night, is you know the old the old trope that the the military is about five years ahead minimum technologically to what we see in the commercial sphere. Two thousand and one, Why are we talking about it? Well, that date maybe ninth two thousand one, when that press conference occurred that could be seen and probably is seen by most people as the very beginning of the global disclosure movement. And it was headed by a gentleman named Stephen Greer, Doctor Stephen Greer, Yes, Dr Stephen M. Greer, the most prominent and most well known proponent of this disclosure concept, the founder of the project. As Matt mentioned, we've received so many emails, tweets, messages scrawled in blood and darkened bathroom mirrors, etcetera. You know, however, you choose to contact us about this concept of disclosure, and it touches on many things. It touches on the exploration of space, it touches on the classification of secrets, and it touches on the alleged future of energy. So we went to the primary source and in today's episode, we interview Dr Stephen Greer. Uh. He also has a follow up and in this interview, we stick to the rules of engagement force stuff they don't want you to know. And what that means in this case is that we never have on this show. We never will on this show tell you what to believe. What we attempt instead is to present to you the most current and the most prescient evolution of the disclosure concept. Dr Stephen Greer is the leader in this field, and he is on the bleeding edge of this pursuit. So prepare yourselves, keep an open mind. There's gonna be so much stuff you're gonna be on your computer for several hours after this. And we were lucky enough to get an early look at Dr Greer's film that's coming out this month called Unacknowledged, where he gets some pretty intense interview subjects in the form of former retired high level government officials who have a lot of very interesting things to say about the UFO phenomenon and our current government and our country's involvement with it. UM. And you know this is there's a lot to unpack here UM. And I, like Ben was saying, what we always try to do is present the facts present, you know, what people are saying in the community surrounding various conspiracy theories and such. And here we do nothing less than that we let Dr gear speak for himself and for his movement and his beliefs, and we try not to interject. But there are some things in this interview that we don't necessarily agree with wholeheartedly. But we did not want to deprive this very interesting man the opportunity to present his views uninhibited. And with that, what say you, gentlemen? Shall we so? Dr Greer? In another life, so to speak, you were a physician, You were the director of a medical facility. What made you decided to give up the life of a doctor and pursue this UFO issue full time? Yeah? Well, I'm actually still a physician and licensed and all of that. However, you know, I left my practice as the chairman of emergency Medicine in North Carolina because I realized that nobody was really addressing the central problem around the secrecy of UFOs and particularly the technologies that go with them. And in about when I briefed the sitting director of the CIA for Bill Clinton, it became quite clear to me that there was another larger problem, and that is that the programs related to UFOs were being run illegally and unconstitutionally because the CIA director and the President, we're being denied access to them. This was something that was so shocking to me that I still was working as a medical doctor and I was sort of shoveling back and forth from North Carolina up to Washington, d C. And at first I thought perhaps that was an anomaly of the CIA director that particular one, or this particular president. And then I started doing briefings in the later after that with members of the Senate Intelligence Committee, Senate Foreign Relations Committee, the head of intelligence for the Joint Chiefs of Staff, padmal Wilson, and also the head of the Defense Intelligence Agency, the position that the General Flynn had before it was fired, and it was General Patrick Hughes. And all of these people were also in a situation where they knew there were programs involving billions of dollars going on related to UFOs, but when they made a specific inquiry about them, were denied access. And that's when I realized we are in a very dangerous situation legally, uh and also from a security point of view. And that the reason these lives and cover ups are happening is because there's a if you want to talk at the deep national security state does not want the public to know that we already have technologies that would get us completely off of fossil fuels. So I realized that this was really all about macro economic power and money. And that is when I left my medical career. I realized that this was such a huge issue. It wasn't just any longer, you know, gosh of their et s out there, and isn't this interesting, and let's go look at a UFO. It became something where I realized that the course of the future of our civilization was being hijacked by a group of global elitists who were at their core fascist. Just about track slightly a little bit more on your background, it occurs to me that a medical doctor, a physician, that is a world of codified procedures, and you know things that you go to medical school and learn very specific methods for doing things that are established as part of Western medicine. I know that you also practice transcendental meditation, and I'm wondering if you moved away more from this more codified medical background toward kind of thinking outside the box. For lack of a better term, what exactly guided you on that path other than what you just described, was there something? Was there something that clicked for you that made you feel like you wanted to kind of venture out beyond into the unknown? Well? Sure, I mean, thank goodness, I was a student of meditation and things of that before I went to medical school. Um uh, you know, because that's all hard sciencests and not just howified procedures. I mean, you've got to know quantitative analysis and physics and molecular biology and all the stuff in organic chemistry. It was really great that I had done the APICO that gave me a foundation for thinking outside the box number one, but also experientially understanding how interstellar civilizations are using advanced electronic systems that interface with thought and consciousness. And this gets into some very controversial concepts which are really outside the box to the average listener. I guess it. I can assure you they're not using an iPhone that's traveling as a speed of light to go of you know, a million light years across, you know, from one galaxy to another, but they take a million years if its speed a light to do so, so you're you're talking about technologies that are interfacing with fields, um you could say them other dimensions of energy, but that are quantifiable. It's not like some you know, psychic sitting around with a turbine on. But my understanding of meditation and consciousness and what's called nonlocality and physics and nonlocality of consciousness meaning that the mind is not limited to space and time, that that knowledge helped bridge the mystery of how these ekey civilizations appear and disappear and communicate. So that actually served me very well. You know, that's a fantastic connection that you've made, Dr Greer, which I think is going to be astonishing to our audience. The idea of this interrelationship between cognition, consciousness and more highly evolved forms of technology. You know, it reminds me of that Arthur C. Clarke quote about after a certain threshold of technology, everything like might seem like magic to some people, which you know, sometimes I think people become comfortable with the stuff that they feel is established, even though, as you have pointed out numerous times, it's really strange that smartphones exist and that some areas of technology are so much more sophisticated and advanced than others, and and it does make people question the concept of secrecy and in full disclosure, we've studied the Disclosure Project fairly extensively in the past of this show, and it's something that our audience is very much interested in. And since you're the founder of the Disclosure Project, we were wondering if you could tell our audience a little bit about what the Disclosure Project is and how it came to be, especially regarding the technology we've mentioned earlier. Yes, and you know, this is one of the central themes of the documentary that's just come out. By the way, we're now number one on iTunes for documentaries as of right now. Um and Unacknowledged is also a book that has more information and as it's available at Amazon and everywhere else. Those the book and the movie Unacknowledged are really about my journey discovering what the unacknowledged Special Access projects, which is the proper name for these very classified projects, are And the reason the Disclosure Project happened was an accident of history in the sense that my real intention was to simply focus on a an enter planetary diplomatic team that would make peaceful contact with these civilizations using what's been called in which I coined a FEAT and five initiative close encounters of the fifth time where we go out and make this sort of contact. But early on in when we were doing some experiments with this in Florida, we had four extraterrestrial crafts show up. It got filmed with very quality high cameras. Back then it was on the front page of the Pentacle of paper and there were two Air Force kernels in pilots in the training group of about fifty people. This got kicked up and picked up by the head of Army Intelligence and people at various other three letter agencies, and they approached me within thirty days, and some of them were very hostile to what we were doing and threatening. Others, however, were very supportive and said that yes, it's high time that this subject be a declassified in the public know the truth, uh, and we want to help you. So that's kind of how the contact expeditions I was leading led to the early stages of what INE became known as if you go to the Clinton Presidential Library, project Starlight, and that was a code name for a briefing process that we put together. Um, we put together the best available evidence of the best cases and images and everything from around the world, and government documents to provide to the presidents and members of Congress, into the UN Secretary General Buttris Gali at the time and other people, and to try to create a consensus to end the secrecy. But by seven it was quite clear to me that no one in Congress and no one in the White House was going to take that tast on. And in fact, one of Bill Clinton's friends used to stay with him at the White House came to my home and said, uh, you know, Dr Greer, they very much agree with what you're recommending in the brief you put together that this subject pp classified, but we're concerned that if the president does this, he will end up like Jack Kennedy and I start laughing. I think this is completely nonsense. And then he said, no, we're not joking. And I said, well, what the hell do you want me to do. I'm a doctor in an emergency department. Doing this just a sort of an interest. And they said, well, we think you should do it. And I turned to him and I said, yeah, what you're saying is I'm expendable and the President isn't. And he looked me straight in the eye and he said, yes, you're expendable, and the president is. So I I always joke that I'm the throwaway person. I can throw away my career, I can throw away my life. I can give blood and treasure that would matter because these kiddiots, politicians and money horrors that run Wall Street in Washington, they're not going to stick their next out. So you know, what I realized is that there's no courage left in our leadership and that we the people have to manifest that courage. And that's how the disclosure projects about put together. Is when I realized that no one in the official world of Washington or Paris or London, and I went all over the world, meeting with officials in governments all over the world, nobody wanted to take this issue on. So I decided, well, we the people want to do it, and so began the disclosure process. Well, speaking of idiot politicians, um, James call me was fired yesterday. I'm just going to use that as a as a segway. I'm not really going to go into detail there, um, but I'm wondering we're wondering when someone like vacates or gets booted from a high level intelligence position like that, do you think they're leaving with state secrets that they have actual information about some of the things that you're describing that they try to keep under wraps. Well, some do and some don't. And this is something that I make very clear in both the movie Unacknowledged and the book, is that whether you're in the loop, let's call it, of these very classified, unacknowledged special access projects on this issue has a very much less to do with your rank and position, then with your let's call it psychological makeup, and whether or not you're willing to go along with a fascist secret agenda. So if you're if you are not, then you're not gonna be told anything like like the CI director Wolsey or like General Patrick choose ahead of the Defense Intelligence Agency, And now here you have head of the CIA, head of the d i A both being lied to. Now have there been ci A directors who know or FBI directors who know absolutely, But those are people who have at their core value system, let's talk about your value system, a fascist view of the world where the elite should have this power and the rest of us are basically slaves on their authoritarian plantations. So whether or not Jim Clooney was read into these projects or not, I honestly do not know. He's probably aware of the issue and they were briefed ti UM. I know the presidents that have been around since nine i e. President Clinton onwards do know because I have provided briefly materials for them and their senior staff. However, them knowing about the issue from a source like myself who has no official standing, and being able to have access control are two very different things. And this is that this is where the public is very confused on how you want to talk about how things really work. That's how things really don't work. So in Washington, let's talk about dysfunction on the massive scale. For example, when I brief Admiral Tom Wilson, who was J two, the head of intelligence for the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and about this time of year in n many years ago, I had Edgar Mitchell with me. I had all these other people who were military whistleblowers who had information, and I had sent to him this admiral a briefing paper prior two the meeting. In that document, and this is in the movie, by the way. And in the book was a National Reconnaissance Office document from Nellis Air Force Space a security warning, and in it was the distribution list of all the top secret and acknowledged special projects that were current as of that time in early and I got this document. It's authentic, it's not then be classified, and it's in the book, and it's in the movie, and go see it. Now. This admiral recognized one of those compartments, and so he contacted them and said, I am Admiral Tom Wilson. I'm the head of intelligence with the Joints Chiefs of Staff, and I want to be read into or braced on this project. And he was told, sir, you don't have a need to know. Now everyone listening needs to have that think in this is the head of intelligence with the Joint Chiefs of Staff of the Pentagon. And he said, he's a goddamn it. How can I not have a need to know? I'm the head of intelligence for the Joint Staff. And they said, sir, we will not discuss this with you further and hung up and block. So by this time Edgar Mitchlin and I got to this stand up briefing that I was doing at the Pentagon. This Admiral was both furious and terrified because he realized that there really was a sort of subterranean literally and metaphorically of covert programs that that we're running off out of his control, and we're willing to deny him access, notwithstanding his responsibilities and high position. So now have there been people in his exact same position at the Pentagon who did know absolutely Because those were people who came up through the system and were tested to see if they would go along with illegal programs, criminal enterprises, and a fascist long term agenda. And that is the distinguishing mark between people who are in the system and out of the system. Now it's more complicated. There are people who have tried to defect from that system, such as CIA Director Bill Tolby, who in the mid nineties or so, wanted to provide for us a zero point energy free energy device, which is at the heart of the energy system of the UFO or any other thing that's going to be running through space and it would run your house forever with no energy bill and no pollution. He was going to give us some seed funding of around fifty million dollars in this device so we could get it out. He was a very old man and he thought the secrecy had gone on to such a point that it was damaging with the future of humanity. But the but the week that he was going to meet with a member of My Order directors, they found imploating down the Potomac River and he had been killed. Now his son thinks he committed suicide. He did not, And the press just that it was a boating accident in a canoe. And that's not truely either. But the fact of the matter, if that was a shot fired across the vowel of people who were on the inside, like Bill Coleby, but who wanted to defect, and so it had a chilling effect all through the establishment of covert programs. And you know, this has been my life for twenty five years, and a lot of it's not pretty. But this is you know, this is not conspiracy theory stuff. This is stuff I have personal knowledge and was very instantly involved with. So this is why that I think the film un Acknowledged is so important because it explains the architecture of the secrecy and what the reasons are for the secrecy. Because you know, the majority of the public believe you apos are real and the government's heightened some, but they don't know how they're m from whom and what these unacknowledge special access projects are and hapably operate. And more importantly, and this is that the hundred trillion dollar question why it's so secret, and that that question of why is the biggest one of all. Yes, yes, sir, we absolutely agree with that question of you know, the the impetus, the motivation, it's it's become increasingly apparent to even the casual uh, the casual researcher, that the deep state does exist and the you know, in multiple instances. Of course, most people are probably most familiar with stories about the CIA operating illegally um abroad in in the interests sometimes of corporations, in the interests sometimes of ideologies. But it brings us to another related question that we'd love to hear your take on. Do you believe that the current inform nation age you know now that now that the cost of communication is lower than it ever has been. Uh, do you believe that that has had an effect on the practice of state secrecy? And if so, what and to what degree? Well, let's talk about conventional state secrecy, the sort of thing that Edward Snowden tried to expose, but which frankly was prosaic and everyone in the world knew it existed already, because what he exposed with PRISM was really just a later version of what the New York Times and others exposed in the early two thousands about the Carnivore and Echelon and other metadata and intelligency dropping programs of the National Security Agency. And of course Edward Snowden was too young to know this and to an experienced and um unfortunately, he did not focus on the illegal projects. He focused on ones that were rather even though they're extraordinarily evil and big Brother risk was expinal everyone all the time UM or rather prosaic. The ones that are that are being running these unacknowledged special access projects are several generations beyond anything that say Snowden exposed, and deal with technologies. I go back now about nineteen fifty four to nineteen fifty six when massive breakthroughs occurred in electromagnetic theory and technologies that interface with space, time and also consciousness. So a lot of people have heard about the c I a program on say remote you and using consciousness to see remote places. That material that's out in the public domain by people like former NSA offered to the Dames and others is like the kindergarten version. The really advanced stuff was electronic interfaces with consciousness that we're developed in the fifties. Now most people have heard the mk ultra experiments where they were used in l S and B and other things on mind control. What never got exposed in senator churches hearing about this about MK ultra from the CIA were the electronics systems. So at the course, so when you start talking about the national security state of what they can penetrate, there's the Internet, and there's the fact that everyone is has been Rich said in the mid the head of Wackey's conforts, he said, there are no private conversations anywhere on Earth now. Whether or not he knew what I'm about to tell you, I don't know. But one of my military advisers was at the White Those Naval Facility which is now closed up in Maryland in the nineteen seventy four, and he was read into and saw an electronics system that could target any point in space or time. And extract from what's called the white noise of space time anything that was ever said or done in that blind of space or time, non locally, not with a wirecat. Now, that was in the seventies. There are people I met with who had worked on technologies beyond that of a similar nature in nineteen fifty six. So I think that the problem is is that you're not going to see these stories on the New York Times and Washington Post because, as one of our witnesses in the book Acknowledge and the film Unacknowledged states, their bags of cash being carried to senor people in the in the mainstream media, who are usually the people who report on national security issues, who are really on the payroll of the c i A. Or of the Pentagon or what have you. So, you know, the fourth of State. The media has been so corrupted that it's very hard to get this story out. So but however, the good news is that the Internet and things like iTunes and uh YouTube and what have you have enabled us to get the information out to millions of people, and hundreds of millions of people, more so than perhaps that now watch ann So I think that it's sort of one of these things where on the one hand, there are all these corrupt uses of these technologies, but on the other hand, if we're clever, perhaps we can begin to level the plane field a little bit. So with these people who are in mass media, do you think there is a some kind of coordinated effort to get different outlets and let's eat, let's say, even scientific establishment groups to purposefully discredit and debunk the entire UFO issue and any anything else related to it. Well, I don't think I can prove it. I have CIA documents and witness testimony from Air Force intelligence and other figures, and some of these appear in the book and in the in the movie that's flat out state that it's not it's there. It's that's not a conspiracy theory. There's no question at all that that's the case. And I've known of this since the early so uh people are very naive if they think that we still have a truly free press. It's it's a compromised and corrupted big media. Uh. Now, recently there have been more and more stories on quote unquote aliens, and of course have been a plethora of movies out of Hollywood on the subject. Although most of them are zinophobic, and the purpose of that is a decentsitization program to let mainstream people know that there's something coming. But with the punchline, they're coming to eat us for launch. I think that as Douglas MacArthur said in nineteen fifty five, the year I was born, I'm sure you guys weren't alive then, uh, he said, you know, basically World War three will be interplanetary. So you know, since the fifties there has been a plan to manage the subject in such a way that when it does come out, it will be hijacked by the buffoonery of the UFO subculture in Hollywood, and also by the xenophobes that the people who are you all afraid of all things alien because they want to basically unite the world around the military punta, sort of a fascist military state that engages in a conflict with one or more extraterrestrial civilizations. That's been the agenda since the fifties and sixties, and there's no question at all that that's the case. I mean, Werner von Brown and his deathbed confirmed it. This Air Force offic of Special Investigations of Officer Dotie, who did counterintelligence and disinformation programs on UFOs for the Air Force for a decade has confirmed the existence of this false flag UH, and I have dozens of people who are in the national security programs who have confirmed it to me, and that this is this is one of my big concerns with the U the UFO subculture. And you know what some people call full disclosure, right, so, well, full disclosure is great. Let's not make it boke at a U X disclosure because there's so much disinformation on this because we have to begin to ask to ask the question who benefit from conflict that's interplanetary? Was the same characters who have benefited from the military and industrial intelligence financial complex since World War Two, who are really just modern day fascists. So we have to wonder whose hands are we playing into when we UH sort of began to be parenting that narrative allah of the movie Independence Day. And I think that there is a very clear counter intelligence program out there that has co opted most of this subject on the Internet and movies, and we have to be very skeptical. Absolutely agree with UH with with the statement regarding the the elephant in the room for a lot of a lot of these concepts and that would be as as you pointed out eloquently, uh disinformation. So towards the end of unacknowledged, you ask one of the one of the witnesses, somebody that you've interviewed before, I believe Richard Dody, and you're asking him about something called or that you referred to as deceptive indication rewarnings projects and right, we just wanted to see if you could describe for our audience what a what false i NW is, like, why, what is it and why does it matter? Well at the Pentagon and in the intelligence community, the I see a deceptive indication and warning or false signed w H indication warning is what pop folks were called false flag for example, the Gulf of Tampton incident, where or we exaggerated or perhaps staged the attack on our vessels ships in the Gulf of Taunting so that the Congress and the public would be so outraged that President Johnson was stampeded into vastly expanding the Vietnam War to the great enrichment of the war profiteers and the war mongers. Um That's been done over and over and over again through our history and also throughout the history of the human race, where demagogues and others stage craft. It's called stagecraft stage something that then pulls people in emotionally that then focuses them on the path of war and conflict and division. I think this is clearly what's going on. And and this I began to speak about in the early nineteen nineties, much to the chagrin of most of the other people in in the UFO subculture, because it's become sort of a big cottage industry involving millions of dollars frankly for people who are you know, spouting all manners stuff. And it's very interesting that only does Officer Doughty, but others that are in our networking team who are military officials, have confirmed that they have staged, for example, alien abductions and fake alien events to scare people so that people would think that it's e t but it isn't. That is completely a d percent of counter intelligence operation. Now people say, God, how long have you known about this? I said, will since or four when I was first briefed on this by to some men who were inside some of these special operation teams that were staging these events. Now this begins to put this you have to pull is it's like the Wizard of Oz if you're ever seen the Wizard of Oz or there's this old prud mudge and behind the curt and pulling all the levers, scaring the hell out of Dorothy and everyone else. And you pull the curtain back and here's this old crud nudge and doing all this stuff that becomes lore and becomes accepted as fact, but isn't. And it's really but to what end? Well, you know what, everyone who has studied history and of war. In order for a populous to support of war, you've got to have an enemy. And the way you create an enemy is to demonize whoever it is, whether it's Jews in Germany or whoever it is. And you have to then create enough fear in the minds of the populace that they will pay blood and treasure to go to war. So this is this is right out of the playbook of the uh of history, and it's been done over and over and over and over again. So these false flag operations and counter intelligence programs are to anyone who understands the system, you know, are very obvious. But to the average person they're not obvious. For example, you know, even comb All, who is former Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and the Secretary of State for George W. Bush and Dick Cheney, goes to the u N with files of stuff saying, oh, we have these weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. Bang. A few months later, weeks later, we're in Iraq in a trillion dollar war with hundreds of thousands of people killed, counting iraqis they're humans too, And it was all nonsense. So this is it's not as if this is ancient history or isn't a matter of historical fact. It is a matter of historical fact that's happened over and over and over. But the big one, the big one that's still pending, that I think is getting fast tracked in the last eighteen months or so, which is why we made the movie unacknowledged. In the book, there were sort of the cosmic call Revere here warning people of this is that it will be this a false flag involving an alien threat, precisely what Bernard von Brown warned about and which Douglas MacArthur called for when he stated that the World War three will be interplanetary. So those sorts of people who are as sociopaths and basically fascists really do want to see the world being able to unite it. You know, remember Ronald Reagan's speech to the United Nations when he said, what in our job of creating world unity and peace the easier if we had a common alien threat to unite against? Okay. So this is very much like the movie Independence Day. And I tell people that this is how easily the populist is manipulated. We were manipulated into Vietnam. We were manipulated into a rock, and they're going to try to manipulate it into something much worse. And that's what we have to be careful of. This is one of the reasons why I left my medical career was because I knew that this was afoot twenty years ago. And on the one hand, and they're trying to hurl us towards a catastrophic event like this. On the other hand, there was holding from the public the technologies that would give us a sustainable civilization with free energy and zero points so called zero point energy, where we would never have any pollution or poverty, and within a generation, poverty as we know it on the planet would disappear. Pollution would absolutely disappear. Even the technologies to take ionizing radiation nuclear waste exists that it could be neutralized to inert elements. I know this sort of fact, I know the people who've worked on it. So we could have a pristine planet with abundance for everybody on the planet. But we're going to have to fix this central problem. And that's really what the Disclosure Project has been about, and that's what this movie and book are all about. So right now we're kind of exploring how the secrecy has kept UM, let's take a look a little deeper into the secrets themselves. Earlier, you mentioned this idea of a technological breakthrough in the nineteen fifties. Um, but where did this technology actually come from? Well, there are two two UH streams that joined us. One after World War Two. One stream was being worked on in the twenties, thirties and forties by people like teen Towns and Brown and others in Germany that dealt with very high voltage systems that caused mass cancelation so called anti gravity levitation, as well as a free energy. Now, they didn't understand zero point energy at that point, but they knew that they could put you know, X amount of energy in and get a hundred times out of the system. And in Tesla knew this as well. He caused the infinite energy field. Now, those those were man made discovery. So as I always tell people, the laws of the universe are guess what universal? So human minds and unraveled these mysteries as well as an extraterrestrial mind from another star system. However, those developments which were being kept very secret but for the same reasons in the twenties, thirties and forties as today, because it would have upset the Rockefeller Plan and the centralized, the industrialists and everything else, that is, everybody, nobody would need the miss JP Morgan said that Nikola Tesla, we're not gonna let anything come out that we can't put a meter on it and get paid and make a profit on. So that that stream joined with a very big river of research. Uh in the post nine era, and particularly after ninety seven to nineteen five, when we use some very advanced electronics to shoot down but not shoot with a gun, but with electromagnetic weapons systems that are so called scaler or longitudinal. They moved faster than the speed of light, to down these craft that crashed at Roswell and at King in Arizona in multiple other places. Those crafts, some of which were fairly intact, were then studied and on board those craft were not only energy systems that were extremely advanced, crystalline energy systems that were zero point, but also the propulsion systems that allowed the craft to to UH not only float and levitate and move it from the speeds, but also enabled them to UH at higher frequencies to go quote unquote interdimensional. Now, those technologies we began to be studied in highly classified operations in the forties and fifties, and that what knowledge we had from the twenties, thirties and forties joined with this treasure trove of technologies which were acquired from extraterrestrial vehicles, and by ninety four we had mastered the fundamentals of gravity control. I have a senior official, the highest ranking scientists at the Naval Research Labs, Richard Fouche, who was on my team for many years. He has since passed away of prostate cancer, but he had been in the vault and seeing the documentation, and in October of nineteen fifty four we mastered gravity control. So what I tell people you look at the world out there, and whether it's your power lines or your cars, or your trains, or your jets or your airplanes or your ships or whatever it is, all of it is from the early twentieth century or in late eighteen hundreds Mercedes for the internal combustion engine. Uh. Even jets are from the thirties. Rockets are from the forties. So you know, SpaceX, it's all jumped, all of us jump jumped more jump jump. Everything that has developed since then, isn't These are in these hun acknowledged special access projects. And it's a shame because you know it has been Rich said, it seems like it will take an act of God to bring them out to benefit humanity. Been Rich being the head of the famous Locksheepump works the secret operations at Lockheed Martin. But I think this is why you know, this sort of that will takes an act of God. Well though, it's it's humans working together to do this. Um. People are very naive if they think these large corporations and government entities are going to do it for us. We have to do it. And one of our objectives and has been for a number of years that we've lacked the financial resources to do it is to start an independent, open source research lab where these technologies, particularly the free energy ones first and maybe later the anti gravity um could be developed independent of any large corporation, but would be live streamed on the internet and open source. But you need millions of dollars to open a high energy to six lab and we don't have that. We're hoping now if everyone listening to your podcast would go get the book and get the movie, maybe we get on the way to having it. But or somebody who wanted to contribute those funds, or some you know, you get twenty people to contribute the funds. So far, no one stepped up to the plates fund the basic science research that needs to happen. And um, I think people have to understand that, just like disclosures, in the hands of we the people bringing these technologies forward, or in the hands of we the people. But even though we by right that the textpayers have been trillions of dollars working on these projects, and the forties and fifties we have had no dividends paid to us. It's all being slept in the in this kept in this ocracy of of of elite programs and unacknowledged special access projects, super secret projects. But we can change that if we want to. I mean, it's not like we need to be sitting around on our hands waiting for the government to do this for us. I think people need to understand we the people or where the action is, and we have more power than we realize that we would unite around an effort and do it. So Dr Gerey, can you tell us a little bit more about the Orion project itself and how close you guys have come to finding some viable way to harness the zero pointer free energy. Well, the Orion Project is sort of a sub project of our Serious Disclosure dot com if you go to our website s I R I U s Disclosure dot com, and it's a research effort to identify technologies that meet our criteria. So far, we have not seen any technology that exists that meet our criteria that the person is willing to have taken forward. There. Now, let me qualify that their their technologies out there, but people want to keep it secret because they get best to keep it secret, or they've been threatened, or they've had the technology already tied up by it be involved out from under them. For example, I'll give you one great example. The Orion project was very close to acquiring all the stan Meyer equipment. Stan Meyer invented this car that rental water and it was legit. But what people don't understand, the crown jewel of his inheritance, of what he left to his heirs, was a toroidal system and donut shaped system that was an over unity free energy device that had a national security order on it that was slapped on it in the eighties, and he and his brother worked on this and it was legitimate. Now, our group only had a few hundred thousand dollars, so we couldn't acquire that collection. An engineering group in Michigan did. And I said that if those people keep this secret and don't go public with it, if they get it operational, they're all dead men walking. And sure enough, a couple of years later, they got it operational and their chief funder, a man who is in the British Isles, is very wealthy, called me up in a panic and said, they're running for their lives. I said, well, of course they are, because they've done everything strategically backwards. They're trying to be like golem and Lord with the rings might Precious might, precious Ring. Well, guess what you know, you think you're going to have an invention and make yourself rich, You're gonna be dead before you ever get rich. So I told this this. I won't repeat his name on the air, but I said, I will write a strategic memo to you of what they need to do yesterday, and if they do it, they can survive. And if they don't, their history, well it turns out they didn't want to do it because they were wanting to monetize it and get rich quick. And I's just confirmed about last year this time in March of that that entire team has been a saf date and terminated. So the problem we've run into isn't that the technologies are impossible to find. It's that the human factor, the greed factor, the ego factor, uh, and the lack of strategic sophistication. And let me let me explain what I mean. You're not dealing with a new iPhone or an app or software program like you can just crank out a new uniform Billionaire and Silicon Valley every week. You're dealing with the technology that makes a run at this foundation of our entire economics tetra dollar oil based, fossil fuel based centralized electric grid system. It's involves in the aggregate, hundreds of trillions of dollars in economic impact, and you're not going to be able to do that secretively. So people who try to keep the intellectual property secret, the patent secret, people who try to do this in the dark of night and thinks A're gonna be so clever, they're going to outbox the intelligence community or these corporate goons, they are delusional. So what I have said to people is phase one of this is to get one of these devices. Do we either have to have one handed off to us, or we have to have the funds to do a lab where we can create it ourselves and we would be able to or and we then disclose it to the public, open source, no intellectual property, no secrets, and a billion people know it and can build it on their own and it works. Every engineer in m IP can do it. The second phase, you might be able to monetize it. You might be able to take that basic operating system let's call it, and create something that will run your computer, create something that will run your house and your heat pump, and then you know that's phase two. But everyone is trying to skip phase one, which is ironically open source disclosure. And if you if you skip phase one, you're never going to get to phase two. And and this is because of the unique strategic risks that attend something that is as disruptive. You know, everyone thinks what's going on in Filicon Valley right now is disruptive. It's not disruptive as tinkering around the edges of Alexander Graham Belle's communication devices are mark TONI in eight in the first telegram at the at the speed of a radio waves. Big deal. This is what I'm talking about now is truly disruptive. Now we need it. We should have been disrupted with these technologies and the twenties, forties, fifties. Now we're really running out of time, both geophysically and geo politically. Um, we can't really just pass this on for another fifty years to the next generation. So I tell people, who are the scientists and technology people working on this. Uh. Back when we first founded the Orion project, I didn't have anyone on my team who could return to a research team who would put their life's work into doing one of these things and say hey, you know, here's compensation for your effort, and now let us take it open source. We I do have people on my team that can do that. Now, if there's something that's legitimate and can be tested independently, reproduced independently, and which they will allow us to massively disclose. That last thing is the big one, because if it's not massively disclosed, if it if it's perpept very under wraps in secrets, it's going to be the tree that fell in the woods that nobody heard. And I think over the last fifty to a hundred years, there have been literally thousands of these technologies that have come and gone and have been vacuumed up, hoovered up by corporations and the intelligence community to try to keep them secret. I mean mainstream scientific organizations like the American UH Federation of American Scientists have stated there's at least five thousand, one thirty five patents that have been confiscated through the patent Office, and those are of systems that have gone to patent. I know many inventors that never got to patent, but they were just quietly working on these technologies and they got a knock on the door or a national security order sent to them, like stan Liar did for his Toroy system, this doughnut shaped free energy magnetic system, and have just disappeared even before they went to the patent process. So there are thousands more. It's conservative to say there are probably tens of thousands of these that have come and gone. And the reason they have never reached the public is because the people who are the scientists and engineers and the and the people funding them don't understand a strategy to get them out to the public. They don't understand the unique strategic threat and that that what's called the threat matrix, that it's out there, and this is something that I've spent twenty seven years studying. All I can do is advise people. So far, no one has taken our advice. They all want to sort of be uh, the next Rockefeller of energy and and try to get rich quick off these things. And I tell people, well, you know what, let's do this like get hub or Unix or some of these operating systems that are open source. They can still eventually be monetized and they can still eventually create revenue for your your group, but don't keep it secret. It's got to be something that it belongs to every man, woman and child on planet Earth at the beginning. UM, and that's when I'm recommending. So far, no one's taken us up on that offer. And if you guys know anyone who is ready to, you know, they should give me a call yesterday. If you're out there listening and you have a device such as this, you can write to us conspiracy at how stuff Works dot com, or you can contact Dr Greer at our website is Serious Disclosure dot com. S I R I U S Disclosure dot com. So there's a part in the film and acknowledge that really struck me when I was watching it, and I didn't feel like it was addressed as as deeply as as I at least I had questions about. UM. So let me see if you can find up in this a little bit. There's a part that touches on the possibility that these intelligent beings may not be traveling from distant worlds to visit Earth, but are instead visiting from other dimensions. UM, can you talk a little bit about the multidimensional concept and how it operates and how maybe that also figures into this idea of the technology that's far more advanced than anything we can wrap our heads around. All interstellar civilizations are transdimensional or interdimensional. To go from one star system to another, you have to go beyond the speed of light. When you go through what I call the crossing point of light, you are in other dimensions. Now, there are also intelligences that are interdimensional but are not extraterrestrial. They don't originate on a as we would describe physical planet or star system, but they reside in other dimensions. These two things are conflated all the time, and I think that this is I call it cosmological indigestion because people lack of proper differential diagnosis is what we'd say in medicine. Um, it's a little bit like if someone comes into my e er uh and they have chest pain, and the only diagnosis I have is heart attack, and there are a hundreds fifteen other things that could be dissecting thoratic aneurysm like blah blah blah. So what has happened in the people looking into this subject is that they have to understand there are extraterrestrial biological entities with extraterrestrial vehicles from other planets and star systems. If they've reached the ability to go beyond the speed of light, they are by definition also interdimensional. They're crossing to other dimensions. But people also have experiences with all kinds of weird things that are from other dimensions that are not quote unquote from a physical star system and planet. Does this make sense to you, I see what you're saying there. Yeah, absolutely of the concept, it's a it's a very important distinction. So what I what I think that people, and I don't want to confuse the audience too much, but basically what I say is all interstellar civilizations are interdimensional, but not all interdimensional beings are extraterrestrial. Got you? I think what when? What was getting at was there was a there was a part where they're discussing nuclear weapons and detonating and testing nuclear weapons on Earth, and one one interviewee uh mentions that perhaps we're causing more damage on a higher dimension if you're talking first, second, third, fourth, and higher. Well, in the way it's that came up to me was almost as though it were like another timeline where there was a more extreme version of something that we had done in this reality and the idea of like, well, yes, and it's both. It's it's that it's those sort of events and the electromagnetic pulse and then things that aren't normally measured by scientists in nuclear experiments, energies that go they do then cross interdimensional. And that's why Gordon Crichton was the name of that witness who I personally interviewed at his own prior to his death. He had been a British intelligence and Foreign Service official who who ironically I knew about this in his official capacities, and then began to publish an old UFO magazine called Flying Saucer Review, which Prince Philip and Prince Charles subscribed to until he stopped publishing. He told me this personally, so um interesting when Gordon said that it's the statement is pregnant with with implications, but basically what he was saying is that you know, if you look at sort of the ancient alien concept, that there's evidence that there have been extraterrestrial civilizations observing or involved with the planet for thousands, past millions of years, but the modern arab really got launched when we started detonating atomic and thermal nuclear weapons. Why, well, one may be what he's bringing up, that it may be doing disruptions in dimensions that we're not even aware of yet. Number Two, it indicates that we have reached the ability, as we would say in in in psychiatry and medicine, where we become a danger to ourselves and others, in other words, were collectively insane and crazy because we have weapons, we have technologies we've developed that have then been weaponized that could terminate all life on Earth, but also could be an existential threat to other civilizations out there. So I think that when we began to play around with these uh weapons of mass destructions in the forties and fifties and went from atomic weapons to then hydrogen bombs, which are a hundred thousand times more damaging, this began to be a very big concern to extraterrestrial civilizations that probably have been observing us four thousands of years and perhaps millions of years. And if it's a milestone that a civilization reaches, such as ours, where we have to make a decision, are we going to live together in peace with each other? Do what Michik who is called to become a level one civilization were a level zero because we're still fighting and destroying the biosphere, but become a level one civilization that has global peace and is not destroying the environment for us to have a technological society, or are we going to stay a level of zero civilization where we become not only a threat to all life on Earth, but now that we're going into space, are perceived as a potential threat to other star systems and planetary systems. Well, it seems like the existential threats are such a big part of quote unquote, you know, development and progress as we see it on Earth and in our society, and we're dealing with a whole lot of technologies and things that were maybe advancing faster than we should without fully considering the implications of what they mean, things like you know, nanotechnology and artificial intelligence and like you mentioned nuclear weapons. I mean, is there a sense on some level that we may be in danger of being looked at by these civilizations um as a such an existential threat that we may be in danger of potentially being a target for annihilation because of all of these things that we are doing without fully grasping the potential for great harm, not only to our planet. But others, well, I can't speak to you know, it depends on what we do in the future. But I can say if you look at the past seventy five years or so seventy years UM, since the forties, but we we we are viewed as a threat. But if they had that as their main operating uh philosophy, let's call it, there would have been no question we would have been stood down in UM. But the reason, you know, and there's an interesting little vinyon. I was at Wright Patterson Air Force Space doing a briefing with the a colonel and Air Force intelligence people there in the section that hold a lot of the materials from Roswell and elsewhere and UM. The meeting was set up by the head of intelligence for the Joint Staff, who ordered the head of the Air Force to make it happen, and they were not happy about it. UM. But the man asked me, the colonel asked me, well, what if these civilizations are a threat to us? I said, I think it's the other way around. We are viewed as a threat to ourselves and to them potentially, and that we need to figure out how to lift peacefully and go into space peacefully. Or it could be problematic. And the intelligence officer of the civilian was writing furiously as I was speaking answering the colonel's question, and one of the things I said is that if that was really their intent, and they were by nature that hostile, it would have been point set matching over uh in August of n when we dropped the first STOM equipment. I think that, you know, I said, the fact that we're still breathing the free air of Earth doing all the stupid things that we are doing as a civilization, destroying the biosphere, endless wars, weapons of mass star shows how amazingly restrained they are. Because you're dealing with civilizations that are hundreds of thousands and millions of years or more developed than we are, so being able to sort of deal with this problem, you know what, the human situation would be very simple. The fact that they haven't is wrecked evidence that they are not that way by nature. However, now this is the big However, if we were to reach the point that we would be going out into space more and more, is a threat to them or to other peaceful planets that have reached level one or level two or level three levels of enlightened civilizations that could change. So I think that this is why this is another reason why disclosure is so important, and calmer heads need to prevail, and we have to figure out how are we going to live on this planet together in peace? And how are we going to go out into space peacefully? And that it's interesting. There's really one possible long term future and that's one of what I call universal peace, not only peace on Earth, but peace and space. And anything short of that is annihilation. So I think that, you know, we have a choice to make. Do we want to choose annihilation or do we want to choose going forward with thousands of years as a peaceful and enlightened civilization. I think that is the big choice that every man, woman, a child on Earth in is facing. You know, Dr Greer, I love that you point that out, because this is anticipating one of the biggest questions we wanted to ask, which is a future oriented there? What is the uh? You know, what do you see if we were speculating over the next uh, let's say short term, the next five years, are there any milestones that the audience should be on the lookout for. I think number one, the audience needs to become activists. So if for example, I'm going to be on coast to coast on Friday, they might have five million people listening. If each of those people got the book in the film, or even once to our site and made a donation, we'd be able to open the Energy Lab this year. And a lot of people want to be entertained with shock and dribble on this subject. What I think people need to begin to understand is that that that the passivity is sitting around looking at boob tube, YouTube and other things and just consuming the latest sensational thing on Guya TV or elsewhere really needs to get transformed into genuine activism UM. And I think people need to begin to, you know, walk the walk on this. So I would say that that's what people need to start asking themselves. And that's the first thing. The second thing is things that you would be concerned about in the future are things that I've observed in the last eighteen months, And that is a ratcheting up books, articles and figures going out into the public domain, UM, sort of presenting this sort of fierce threat alien threat that Bernavon Brown in my teen seventy four warned about that would be a complete lie in a hoax UM. And I think that that is quickening, that the case of that is quickening. So I'm concerned that a disclosure will happen that serves the agenda of those who kept a secret. And I wrote a paper in the nineties called When Disclosure Serves Secrecy. It's on our website on serious disclosure dot com. I recommend people read it, and it's an analysis of how disclosure could be hijacked and turned into um, a sort of a fearfest of everything alien that would of course benefit the same war momitoring and war profiteering fascists that have been ruling the planet since World War Two. So I think that the public needs to be very aware that that's being fast tracked. I made this film because the heads up I've gotten that that is the fast tracked and we need to do something to avert that disaster. Well said Dr Greer, We want to I want to thank you so very much for taking the time to speak with us today and for everyone out there listening if you would like to learn more about the Disclosure Project in the future of government secrecy and all of the other things that have been treated as rumors in the mainstream media. Then do check out Unacknowledged nextpose of the World's Greatest Secret. It's available now on iTunes, Amazon Video, Google Play, and Voodoo. It will be on demand on May twe that's a wild ride. Huh. Yes, certainly is fascinating. I'm going to spend hours and hours just doing more research on a lot of topics, he trust me, folks, Well, I mean, you know, we created just a little insider baseball here. We created a document that was fairly long when we were looking at Dr Greer and all of the stuff that they cover in Unacknowledged, Like I said, a lot to unpack on many many levels. Yes, I just want to say right here, right after this, you may be you may be familiar with Serious Serious Disclosure, which was the previous documentary that Stephen Greer produced. I know I watched that. I think I think we watched that back in the day and back in the day anyway, that one focused a lot on what Dr Greer spoke about with contacting aliens with the close encounters of the fifth kind, and Unacknowledged was much more about the individual interviews of the Disclosure Project people, and that false flag attack that that he was speaking about at the end of the interview. There, yes, yes, yes, similar to uh, the concept in the original version of Watchman. That's right. So one of the things that we're very fortunate to explore with Dr Greer was the concept of um the nature rather the mechanism of secrecy and classification in the US government. And we want to be clear that not every government or every state works the same way, especially with regard to the concept of these special access projects. That's compartmentalization, right, And so you may recall hearing Dr Greer say that someone was read onto a file or something like that. We do want to verify for you and confirm that it is. It is absolutely true that the president you vote for, the congressional representative that you you know, go door to door campaigning for, can easily not no, can easily and eleagally not know something that is going on. At least in the case of the US government. It is very much a left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing situation. And additionally, Dr grim did bring up one of my favorite facts, which is so crazy and so often ignored and so true. This government, the US government does have the right when you apply for a patent. So let's say Matt invents what's something amazing, free energy? Matt invents a free energy alright, perfect, So Matt invents a free energy widget and he files a patent. If it is seen as something that could be contradicting the interests of national security, then not only can that patent be suppressed, not only will he lose ownership of it, that he will also get hit with a gag order which does not allow them to talk about this is a real thing that happens. This, of course, spread so much fuel to the fire of people who have conspiracies about technological suppression. One. It's one of those things to where like what constitutes a real and present threat to national security that could be up to some very high level individuals to determine, possibly for nefarious purposes, and like just swiping that for their own use. Oh yeah, definitely, And if you're interested in that stuff. We have several episodes in the past about specifically those topics. Uh, I think stan Meyer was brought up as h Yeah, stan Meyer was definitely the inventor of the water powered car allegedly. Yeah, but what Stephen Greer focused on is that terroidal device that was like the the main thing I guess um. Check out our episodes if you want to learn more about that stuff. And that's the end of this classic episode. If you have any thoughts or questions about this episode, you can get into contact with us in a number of different ways. One of the best is to give us a call. Our number is one eight three three std w y t K. If you don't want to do that, you can send us a good old fashioned email. We are conspiracy at i heart radio dot com. Stuff they don't want you to know is a production of I heart Radio. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.