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On this Monday, after the news broke, we turned down to Seth Harris, former labor policy advisor to President Biden and senior fellow at the Burns Center. Seth, it's great to have you with us here at the table. Thank you for joining. You probably know Joe Biden better than anyone else. We're going to talk to you on the program today. And so I don't want to get too personal here, but I do. And what motivated him was the pressure too great for him to wait to speak to the American people, to do this in his own time, at his own pace from the Oval Office.

On this Monday, after the news broke, we turned down to Seth Harris, former labor policy advisor to President Biden and senior fellow at the Burns Center. Seth, it's great to have you with us here at the table. Thank you for joining. You probably know Joe Biden better than anyone else. We're going to talk to you on the program today. And so I don't want to get too personal here, but I do. And what motivated him was the pressure too great for him to wait to speak to the American people, to do this in his own time, at his own pace from the Oval Office.

All we still have is a piece of letterhead.

All we still have is a piece of letterhead.

Well.

Well.

The defining character trait of Joe Biden, at least in his public life, has been resilience. He has suffered unfathomable personal losses. He has suffered professional setbacks that would have caused a lot of other people to go and lie in the fetal position on their beds. But he has always persevered. He has always continued, and he's always gone to work for the people he grew up with in Claymont, Delaware and in Scranton, Pennsylvania, the middle class, working class families that he cares about so much, that he identifies with, and his family was that kind of a family. But there's an even more important trait about Joe Biden, and that is patriotism. He sees Donald Trump, I think correctly, and the Republican Party as an existential threat to democracy in the United States. And when he sat down with his top aides Steve Vershetty and Mike Donald, and they showed him the data that showed that it was going to be very difficult for him to stop Donald Trump. He chose country over party, country for self, which, as you all know from doing this television show here in Washington, DC, when you talk to a lot of politicians, that's not what politicians usually do. He chose to do the right thing for the country and for the working people of this country at great cost to himself. And I don't think it was that the pressure. I don't think it was the donor saying we're not going to give you any money. It was that he cares about winning for working people, he cares about winning for democracy. It was for me personally, a very deeply sad day. But I've never been prouder of the man, and it's been my privileged to work with him in two administrations. He's a remarkable human being and it's been my honor to be associated with him.

The defining character trait of Joe Biden, at least in his public life, has been resilience. He has suffered unfathomable personal losses. He has suffered professional setbacks that would have caused a lot of other people to go and lie in the fetal position on their beds. But he has always persevered. He has always continued, and he's always gone to work for the people he grew up with in Claymont, Delaware and in Scranton, Pennsylvania, the middle class, working class families that he cares about so much, that he identifies with, and his family was that kind of a family. But there's an even more important trait about Joe Biden, and that is patriotism. He sees Donald Trump, I think correctly, and the Republican Party as an existential threat to democracy in the United States. And when he sat down with his top aides Steve Vershetty and Mike Donald, and they showed him the data that showed that it was going to be very difficult for him to stop Donald Trump. He chose country over party, country for self, which, as you all know from doing this television show here in Washington, DC, when you talk to a lot of politicians, that's not what politicians usually do. He chose to do the right thing for the country and for the working people of this country at great cost to himself. And I don't think it was that the pressure. I don't think it was the donor saying we're not going to give you any money. It was that he cares about winning for working people, he cares about winning for democracy. It was for me personally, a very deeply sad day. But I've never been prouder of the man, and it's been my privileged to work with him in two administrations. He's a remarkable human being and it's been my honor to be associated with him.

Well, it's a great reminder to us, Aul Seth of just what Joe Biden has been as a public servant. We're talking half a century through surviving the loss of his wife, his daughter, eventually his son bow continuing to serve through it all.

Well, it's a great reminder to us, Aul Seth of just what Joe Biden has been as a public servant. We're talking half a century through surviving the loss of his wife, his daughter, eventually his son bow continuing to serve through it all.

But of course, yesterday not.

But of course, yesterday not.

Just a decision to no longer continue that service, at least in the presidential capacity, but a second decision that quickly followed his announcement to endorse Kamala Harris as someone he thinks should take the helm.

Just a decision to no longer continue that service, at least in the presidential capacity, but a second decision that quickly followed his announcement to endorse Kamala Harris as someone he thinks should take the helm.

And be the Democratic nominee.

And be the Democratic nominee.

How do you view that part of this decision making process for Joe Biden, Because we'd had a lot of conversation in the week since the debate about how he needed convincing that Kamala could beat Trump if he could not, So should we rule that the polling suggested that Kamala could do it, or just that Joe Biden thought it would be the right thing to do to back up his vice president.

How do you view that part of this decision making process for Joe Biden, Because we'd had a lot of conversation in the week since the debate about how he needed convincing that Kamala could beat Trump if he could not, So should we rule that the polling suggested that Kamala could do it, or just that Joe Biden thought it would be the right thing to do to back up his vice president.

I think it's both. He saw polling that showed that not only that she can win, but that it's likely that she is going to be able to win. But also he is deeply loyal to her. He picked her when he didn't have to pick her, and he positioned himself as a transitional figure in the Democratic Party, ushering in a new generation of Democrats who are going to carry the progressive values that he's lived his entire life forward. He hasn't agen that he wants to see finished. He talks about finishing the job. He knows that she is the best situated person to do that.

I think it's both. He saw polling that showed that not only that she can win, but that it's likely that she is going to be able to win. But also he is deeply loyal to her. He picked her when he didn't have to pick her, and he positioned himself as a transitional figure in the Democratic Party, ushering in a new generation of Democrats who are going to carry the progressive values that he's lived his entire life forward. He hasn't agen that he wants to see finished. He talks about finishing the job. He knows that she is the best situated person to do that.

It's been noted that Joe Biden is a hugger, that he likes to surround himself with people, his friends, his coworkers, his staff in this case, but he's had COVID and has been dealing with a very difficult environment as he comes to this decision. Has this been a depressing experience, a dark time from him?

It's been noted that Joe Biden is a hugger, that he likes to surround himself with people, his friends, his coworkers, his staff in this case, but he's had COVID and has been dealing with a very difficult environment as he comes to this decision. Has this been a depressing experience, a dark time from him?

How would you describe it.

How would you describe it.

You know, I haven't spoken to him during this period, and I haven't spoken to the people immediately around him. Understandably, they're focused inward, not focused outward. But you know, having experienced COVID myself and sitting in a house alone without your family, although he does have a doctor Biden there with him, although she's in a separate bedroom to keep her safe. It is difficult, particularly when you're trying to do business and you're not feeling especially well. But he's an amazingly tough man. I mean, he's made it to the age of eighty one, at the very peak of his profession, and he has accomplished remarkable things for this country. He lifted us out of a pandemic. He drove the economy to the best economy we've seen since the nineteen sixties. He assembled a coalition to fight tyrants and to defend democracy all around the world. He's fighting democracy at home. He's been remarkably accomplished, even though he has experienced this illness now and he's experienced some physical setbacks. Otherwise, it's really an admirable record, and that's what he wanted to continue. And he was convinced that he could.

You know, I haven't spoken to him during this period, and I haven't spoken to the people immediately around him. Understandably, they're focused inward, not focused outward. But you know, having experienced COVID myself and sitting in a house alone without your family, although he does have a doctor Biden there with him, although she's in a separate bedroom to keep her safe. It is difficult, particularly when you're trying to do business and you're not feeling especially well. But he's an amazingly tough man. I mean, he's made it to the age of eighty one, at the very peak of his profession, and he has accomplished remarkable things for this country. He lifted us out of a pandemic. He drove the economy to the best economy we've seen since the nineteen sixties. He assembled a coalition to fight tyrants and to defend democracy all around the world. He's fighting democracy at home. He's been remarkably accomplished, even though he has experienced this illness now and he's experienced some physical setbacks. Otherwise, it's really an admirable record, and that's what he wanted to continue. And he was convinced that he could.

Well, you talk about an admirable record on the economy, and yet polling does suggest that he has not gotten credit for that. Voters do not feel good about the Biden economy. Can Harris message that differently than Biden, make that a narrative that works for her, do something that the President could not.

Well, you talk about an admirable record on the economy, and yet polling does suggest that he has not gotten credit for that. Voters do not feel good about the Biden economy. Can Harris message that differently than Biden, make that a narrative that works for her, do something that the President could not.

I think that there's going to be a lot of time and a lot of money spent making the case comparing the Biden economy now the Harris economy to the Trump economy. President Trump is the first president since Herbert Hoover to leave office with fewer jobs than when he entered office. President Biden has set records for the number of jobs that have been created under his watch. Unemployment set a fifty year record at a low level below four percent, real wages rising for working families, the bottom quarter of working families, the bottom quarter of incomes seeing a dramatic increase in their real wages as well. The big issue has been prices, even though inflation has come down dramatically and is barely hovering above what the Federal Reserve tells us is their policy target. Again not handed down from Sinai on tablets, but even though inflation has come down, prices are still too by. That's what the American people are reacting to. So I think that the Vice President will be able to talk about all of the accomplishments and the dramatic threat to our country that's posed by the Trump administration. The sales pitch will be very simply that the Vice President and President Biden care about working people and whether or not their lives come out well. The other side can't make the same case.

I think that there's going to be a lot of time and a lot of money spent making the case comparing the Biden economy now the Harris economy to the Trump economy. President Trump is the first president since Herbert Hoover to leave office with fewer jobs than when he entered office. President Biden has set records for the number of jobs that have been created under his watch. Unemployment set a fifty year record at a low level below four percent, real wages rising for working families, the bottom quarter of working families, the bottom quarter of incomes seeing a dramatic increase in their real wages as well. The big issue has been prices, even though inflation has come down dramatically and is barely hovering above what the Federal Reserve tells us is their policy target. Again not handed down from Sinai on tablets, but even though inflation has come down, prices are still too by. That's what the American people are reacting to. So I think that the Vice President will be able to talk about all of the accomplishments and the dramatic threat to our country that's posed by the Trump administration. The sales pitch will be very simply that the Vice President and President Biden care about working people and whether or not their lives come out well. The other side can't make the same case.

Let's talk about the issue we associate you most closely with, and that's organized labor. Joe Biden professed to be the most union friendly president in American history.

Let's talk about the issue we associate you most closely with, and that's organized labor. Joe Biden professed to be the most union friendly president in American history.

We know that he's struggled with.

We know that he's struggled with.

The rank and file to some extent, but won the endorsement of Sean Fain in the UAW.

The rank and file to some extent, but won the endorsement of Sean Fain in the UAW.

It's been a.

It's been a.

Little bit of a different relationship with the teamsters. We just saw Sean O'Brien speaking in Milwaukee. As a matter of fact, Kamala Harris walked a picket line I think in twenty nineteen, what is her relationship with organized labor? Is this going to be the same campaign when it comes to unions.

Little bit of a different relationship with the teamsters. We just saw Sean O'Brien speaking in Milwaukee. As a matter of fact, Kamala Harris walked a picket line I think in twenty nineteen, what is her relationship with organized labor? Is this going to be the same campaign when it comes to unions.

Let me say President Biden is the most pro union President would argue in history, and the labor movement understands that, and that's why the AFL CIO and a couple of dozen unions endorsed him earlier than they have ever endorsed any presidential candidate before. Vice President Harris doesn't have fifty years of history with organized labor in the way that President Biden does. She's newer to national politics, but during her time as Vice president she's been very deeply involved with organized labor. She chaired the White House Task Force on Worker Organizing and Worker Empowerment. That's where she and I work together most closely. She has spoken at conventions. She most recently spoke at the convention of Unite here, which is the hospitality union. She spoke at the convention of the Service Employees International Union, which has already endorsed her. She has very effective and close working relationships with a number of national union leaders. They know her, they trust her, and my prediction is that every union that has endorsed President Biden will go forward through their democratic processes and ultimately endorse Vice President Harris. And the reason is they want this pro union, pro worker, bottom up, middle out economics strategy to continue and Vice President Harris is the most likely candidate to be able to do that.

Let me say President Biden is the most pro union President would argue in history, and the labor movement understands that, and that's why the AFL CIO and a couple of dozen unions endorsed him earlier than they have ever endorsed any presidential candidate before. Vice President Harris doesn't have fifty years of history with organized labor in the way that President Biden does. She's newer to national politics, but during her time as Vice president she's been very deeply involved with organized labor. She chaired the White House Task Force on Worker Organizing and Worker Empowerment. That's where she and I work together most closely. She has spoken at conventions. She most recently spoke at the convention of Unite here, which is the hospitality union. She spoke at the convention of the Service Employees International Union, which has already endorsed her. She has very effective and close working relationships with a number of national union leaders. They know her, they trust her, and my prediction is that every union that has endorsed President Biden will go forward through their democratic processes and ultimately endorse Vice President Harris. And the reason is they want this pro union, pro worker, bottom up, middle out economics strategy to continue and Vice President Harris is the most likely candidate to be able to do that.

And yet when you listen to the Republicans, especially the vice presidential nominee on that side, JD. Vance and his acceptance speech, he specifically called out the working men in places like Pennsylvania and Michigan, Wisconsin, those ross belt states that he's trying to appeal to. In what way does the Harris and whomever campaign, assuming that she's the top of the ticket, need to counter that narrative that is also coming from the Republicans. They're competing for the same batch of voters here.

And yet when you listen to the Republicans, especially the vice presidential nominee on that side, JD. Vance and his acceptance speech, he specifically called out the working men in places like Pennsylvania and Michigan, Wisconsin, those ross belt states that he's trying to appeal to. In what way does the Harris and whomever campaign, assuming that she's the top of the ticket, need to counter that narrative that is also coming from the Republicans. They're competing for the same batch of voters here.

Yeah, all they have to do is tell the truth about JD. Vance's record and Donald Trump's record. Donald Trump is the most anti union president in the modern history of the United States.

Yeah, all they have to do is tell the truth about JD. Vance's record and Donald Trump's record. Donald Trump is the most anti union president in the modern history of the United States.

JD.

JD.

Vance has opposed every piece of legislation that would empower working people so that they can improve the quality of their lives that has been presented to him. They do not want working class populism. They don't want to put power in the hands of working people so that they can have a say in their workplaces and have a say in their communities. They want to make corporations bow down to government. That's their version of populism because they view themselves as speaking for the American people, a couple of guys out of the Ivy League trying to represent the working class. That's not the truth. Unless you are involved in putting forward an agenda that empowers workers by allowing them to build power through democratic organizations like unions, you're not for working class power in America.

Vance has opposed every piece of legislation that would empower working people so that they can improve the quality of their lives that has been presented to him. They do not want working class populism. They don't want to put power in the hands of working people so that they can have a say in their workplaces and have a say in their communities. They want to make corporations bow down to government. That's their version of populism because they view themselves as speaking for the American people, a couple of guys out of the Ivy League trying to represent the working class. That's not the truth. Unless you are involved in putting forward an agenda that empowers workers by allowing them to build power through democratic organizations like unions, you're not for working class power in America.

The narrative right now is that Donald Trump is more concerned about running against Kamala Harris than he was against Joe Biden. The narrative a minute ago, five minutes ago, maybe is Joe Biden's the only person who can beat Donald Trump. Does this actually change the calculus for Donald Trump? Can she beat him more easily than Joe Biden?

The narrative right now is that Donald Trump is more concerned about running against Kamala Harris than he was against Joe Biden. The narrative a minute ago, five minutes ago, maybe is Joe Biden's the only person who can beat Donald Trump. Does this actually change the calculus for Donald Trump? Can she beat him more easily than Joe Biden?

In your view?

In your view?

Well, I think it does change the calculus. They have ordered and their entire campaign around running against President Biden and age was their best.

Well, I think it does change the calculus. They have ordered and their entire campaign around running against President Biden and age was their best.

Arguments on the age issue.

Arguments on the age issue.

Absolutely, and she is an extraordinarily effective campaigner. Let me say, as somebody who has been put in what we call the witness chair, when I was briefing her, when she would ask some really tough, formidable questions, when you were when you were briefing her on whatever topic it was. I'm happening to be labor for me, So he's going to encounter that if he has the courage to debate her. I think he's going to back out of the debates because at bottom, he's really quite cowardly, and he also doesn't let me. Also, just add one other piece to this this calculus, Donald Trump has a sort of difficult relationship with women, and the idea that he is going to go toe to toe with a former prosecutor who is a woman and a person of color, I think that he's pretty worried about that.

Absolutely, and she is an extraordinarily effective campaigner. Let me say, as somebody who has been put in what we call the witness chair, when I was briefing her, when she would ask some really tough, formidable questions, when you were when you were briefing her on whatever topic it was. I'm happening to be labor for me, So he's going to encounter that if he has the courage to debate her. I think he's going to back out of the debates because at bottom, he's really quite cowardly, and he also doesn't let me. Also, just add one other piece to this this calculus, Donald Trump has a sort of difficult relationship with women, and the idea that he is going to go toe to toe with a former prosecutor who is a woman and a person of color, I think that he's pretty worried about that.

All right, Seth, it's great to have you join us on this day of Dave Seth Harris, former labor policy advisor to President Biden and senior fellow at the Bird Center. Great to have you reflecting on the legacy of the president as well.

All right, Seth, it's great to have you join us on this day of Dave Seth Harris, former labor policy advisor to President Biden and senior fellow at the Bird Center. Great to have you reflecting on the legacy of the president as well.

You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast kens just Live weekdays at noon Eastern.

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The World was Rocked yesterday with the announcement of Joe Biden that he is not seeking re election, instead endorsing his vice president Kamala Harris to be the Democratic nominee. We are watching history being made in real time, especially when we consider that in the endorsement of Kamala Harris, which many other high profile Democrats, including some of the governors we thought may toss their own hats into the ring for the nomination, that she is a woman and a woman of color who is now potentially going to be the top of the ticket for one of the major parties in this election cycle.

The World was Rocked yesterday with the announcement of Joe Biden that he is not seeking re election, instead endorsing his vice president Kamala Harris to be the Democratic nominee. We are watching history being made in real time, especially when we consider that in the endorsement of Kamala Harris, which many other high profile Democrats, including some of the governors we thought may toss their own hats into the ring for the nomination, that she is a woman and a woman of color who is now potentially going to be the top of the ticket for one of the major parties in this election cycle.

Yeah, you've got an historic candidacy, at least on the verge of being made official here Kley, and as we were discussing with Seth a short time ago, potentially changed the calculus for Donald Trump, who did run.

Yeah, you've got an historic candidacy, at least on the verge of being made official here Kley, and as we were discussing with Seth a short time ago, potentially changed the calculus for Donald Trump, who did run.

Against a woman in Hillary Clinton.

Against a woman in Hillary Clinton.

But this is a very different case and a very different election against the backdrop of very different politics in America.

But this is a very different case and a very different election against the backdrop of very different politics in America.

Well, and I actually raised the parallel to twenty sixteen yesterday in our special coverage with former Congressmoman Jane Harmon and asked her if America wasn't necessarily ready for a female president, then are we ready for one now.

Well, and I actually raised the parallel to twenty sixteen yesterday in our special coverage with former Congressmoman Jane Harmon and asked her if America wasn't necessarily ready for a female president, then are we ready for one now.

Absolutely America was ready for a female president the last time. Hillary narrowly lost sadly, and I think some campaign choices that she made were responsible to that. She didn't go to the Midwest, she stayed on the coast. I don't think Kamala Harris will make those mistakes.

Absolutely America was ready for a female president the last time. Hillary narrowly lost sadly, and I think some campaign choices that she made were responsible to that. She didn't go to the Midwest, she stayed on the coast. I don't think Kamala Harris will make those mistakes.

This is something we're going to be talking about a lot over the course of the hour coming up with our panel. By the way, Rick Davis and Jeanie Shanzano are with us as we try to pick through the pieces here. The endorsements though hard to argue with to your point, Kayley, and we're hearing from a number of state delegations to the Chicago convention. We can add Florida to the list, but none of this is official yet, and there are still a lot of questions about what process the party will follow in making this nomination real.

This is something we're going to be talking about a lot over the course of the hour coming up with our panel. By the way, Rick Davis and Jeanie Shanzano are with us as we try to pick through the pieces here. The endorsements though hard to argue with to your point, Kayley, and we're hearing from a number of state delegations to the Chicago convention. We can add Florida to the list, but none of this is official yet, and there are still a lot of questions about what process the party will follow in making this nomination real.

Yeah, of course, we.

Yeah, of course, we.

Have four weeks to go until the actual convention, which begins August nineteenth in Chicago, and ninety nine percent of the pledge delegates were pledged to Joe Biden. Now, some of the delegations, including the likes of New Hampshire, Tennessee, North and South Carolina have chosen otherwise with Biden's distriction.

Have four weeks to go until the actual convention, which begins August nineteenth in Chicago, and ninety nine percent of the pledge delegates were pledged to Joe Biden. Now, some of the delegations, including the likes of New Hampshire, Tennessee, North and South Carolina have chosen otherwise with Biden's distriction.

Now, of course, there's going to be a big debate about the legal ramifications here. Some Republicans think that this could be blocked in court, and the idea that this was somehow a setup or an abandonment of fourteen million voters. It's interesting as the talking points come together on both sides.

Now, of course, there's going to be a big debate about the legal ramifications here. Some Republicans think that this could be blocked in court, and the idea that this was somehow a setup or an abandonment of fourteen million voters. It's interesting as the talking points come together on both sides.

Of the aisle, certainly, but certainly the endorsements and the money are coming together on.

Of the aisle, certainly, but certainly the endorsements and the money are coming together on.

The Democratic side of the isle.

The Democratic side of the isle.

As we have been discussing more than fifty million dollars raised by Kamala Harrison just the seven hours after her announcement that she does intend to win and earn the Democratic nomination, and there could be more money thrown at her. Emily's List, which of course is a group that focuses on getting women into elected office. It's the largest pack that's focused on that effort. Yesterday pledged to spend at least twenty million dollars to support Harris's bid for the presidency. So let's turn now to Jessica Mackler. She is president of Emily's List, to have more on her reaction to the event. So obviously making a big financial commitment to Vice President Kamala Harris. Have you seen an influx in donations? Can you just describe what the last twenty four hours have been like for you, Jessica.

As we have been discussing more than fifty million dollars raised by Kamala Harrison just the seven hours after her announcement that she does intend to win and earn the Democratic nomination, and there could be more money thrown at her. Emily's List, which of course is a group that focuses on getting women into elected office. It's the largest pack that's focused on that effort. Yesterday pledged to spend at least twenty million dollars to support Harris's bid for the presidency. So let's turn now to Jessica Mackler. She is president of Emily's List, to have more on her reaction to the event. So obviously making a big financial commitment to Vice President Kamala Harris. Have you seen an influx in donations? Can you just describe what the last twenty four hours have been like for you, Jessica.

Well, this is an incredible time and a real momentous moment for this country. And I think what we've seen in the last twenty four hours, not even twenty four hours, is a true outpouring of support all over the country, every region, leaders, at all levels of the ballot organizations.

Well, this is an incredible time and a real momentous moment for this country. And I think what we've seen in the last twenty four hours, not even twenty four hours, is a true outpouring of support all over the country, every region, leaders, at all levels of the ballot organizations.

For us, this was an easy call.

For us, this was an easy call.

It wasn't just a day one endorsement, it was an hour one endorsement. We've been with Vice President Harris throughout her career and we are thrilled to stand with her.

It wasn't just a day one endorsement, it was an hour one endorsement. We've been with Vice President Harris throughout her career and we are thrilled to stand with her.

She takes the helm at the top of the ticket.

She takes the helm at the top of the ticket.

There is no one who is more stronger on the issue of reproductive freedom and abortion rights.

There is no one who is more stronger on the issue of reproductive freedom and abortion rights.

That is what is going to decide this election.

That is what is going to decide this election.

So what we are seeing is truly that enthusiasm and excitement for Vice President Harris's candidacy, and we're thrilled to stand with her.

So what we are seeing is truly that enthusiasm and excitement for Vice President Harris's candidacy, and we're thrilled to stand with her.

Jessica, How important will it be to get Nancy Pelosi behind this effort?

Jessica, How important will it be to get Nancy Pelosi behind this effort?

How soon does that need to happen?

How soon does that need to happen?

Well, look, I think, like I said, what we have seen is an outpouring of support for the Vice president from all over the kinds of well, you know, I'm not going to speak, no one's going to speak for Nancy Pelosi, But like I said, you could see that there is an outpouring of support across this country for Vice President Harris. There is no one who is more ready to win this campaign against Donald Trump, and there is no one who is more prepared to lead this country than Vice President Harris.

Well, look, I think, like I said, what we have seen is an outpouring of support for the Vice president from all over the kinds of well, you know, I'm not going to speak, no one's going to speak for Nancy Pelosi, But like I said, you could see that there is an outpouring of support across this country for Vice President Harris. There is no one who is more ready to win this campaign against Donald Trump, and there is no one who is more prepared to lead this country than Vice President Harris.

Well, Jessica, I'd like to ask you the same question I asked Jane Harmon last evening, which is that we have seen, specifically Donald Trump run against a female candidate before Hillary Clinton did that in twenty sixteen. What does Kamala Harris need to do to make sure that this election ultimately doesn't end up like twenty sixteen with a victory for Donald Trump.

Well, Jessica, I'd like to ask you the same question I asked Jane Harmon last evening, which is that we have seen, specifically Donald Trump run against a female candidate before Hillary Clinton did that in twenty sixteen. What does Kamala Harris need to do to make sure that this election ultimately doesn't end up like twenty sixteen with a victory for Donald Trump.

Well, look, I think one of the things we have to understand, and we've been doing at Emily's List research on the Vice president for this past year and have been with her for many years.

Well, look, I think one of the things we have to understand, and we've been doing at Emily's List research on the Vice president for this past year and have been with her for many years.

So I'm going to take this on looking forward.

So I'm going to take this on looking forward.

And what I know based on that research, based on the work that we've done for the Vice President is that she is well equipped to litigate this case against Donald Trump. And the research that we have done shows that when we talk about the Vice president's record on issues like reproductive freedom, she is so compelling to voters, the voters that we need to turn out and win in November, young voters, women, voters of color. When we talk to them about her record and the work that she has done over the course of her career in standing up on reproductive freedom and other issues, they come to this ticket, and we expect that.

And what I know based on that research, based on the work that we've done for the Vice President is that she is well equipped to litigate this case against Donald Trump. And the research that we have done shows that when we talk about the Vice president's record on issues like reproductive freedom, she is so compelling to voters, the voters that we need to turn out and win in November, young voters, women, voters of color. When we talk to them about her record and the work that she has done over the course of her career in standing up on reproductive freedom and other issues, they come to this ticket, and we expect that.

That's what's going to happen in November.

That's what's going to happen in November.

I will also say that we know we've seen since the Dobbs decision that when we put a clear choice in front of voters around the stakes on abortion rights, when we talk to them about what is in front of them in these elections, Democrats win.

I will also say that we know we've seen since the Dobbs decision that when we put a clear choice in front of voters around the stakes on abortion rights, when we talk to them about what is in front of them in these elections, Democrats win.

And we're going to do that again with.

And we're going to do that again with.

Our best messenger on abortion rights and Vice President Harris.

Our best messenger on abortion rights and Vice President Harris.

Jessica, I wonder what you make of some of the rhetoric that we're already hearing surrounding a potential Kamala Harris candidacy.

Jessica, I wonder what you make of some of the rhetoric that we're already hearing surrounding a potential Kamala Harris candidacy.

Here a Harris campaign.

Here a Harris campaign.

You know that it's been sport here in Washington to mispronounce her name on a regular basis, which Donald Trump continues to do. Chris las Savita, the co manager of the campaign, issued a statement saying that Trump survived in assassin's bullet. The last thing we're worrying about is laughin' Kamala. That's apparently going to be the nickname that Donald Trump uses going forward. Here there's another one that I heard that isn't worth repeating. I just wonder to what extent she should acknowledge this.

You know that it's been sport here in Washington to mispronounce her name on a regular basis, which Donald Trump continues to do. Chris las Savita, the co manager of the campaign, issued a statement saying that Trump survived in assassin's bullet. The last thing we're worrying about is laughin' Kamala. That's apparently going to be the nickname that Donald Trump uses going forward. Here there's another one that I heard that isn't worth repeating. I just wonder to what extent she should acknowledge this.

Well, look, as you've just outlined, there are going to be some really gross, gross, racist and sexist attacks against the vice president. We've already seen that. We know that Republicans are going to do that, and so that is something that at Emily's List we have fought back against for a long time. The disinformation, the misinformation that we know women of color candidates in particular are targets of. I have to tell you that Republicans are doing this because they are terrified about Kamala Harris. They are terrified to face such an accomplished and prepared candidate who is going to be able to effectively litigate a case on an issue that we know is going to win this election abortion rights, but not just that. They are terrified of a candidate who is ready to lead on day one. For the past three years, she has been on a national stage. She has cultivated relationships with world leaders. She has de livered economic relief for people across this country. She's an incredible record throughout her career of fighting for people. So they're scared and they are going to resort to the tactics that they always resort to in these times, and they are going to resort to these racists and sexist attacks. We are going to push back against those, and we're going to do the work of amplifying her voice.

Well, look, as you've just outlined, there are going to be some really gross, gross, racist and sexist attacks against the vice president. We've already seen that. We know that Republicans are going to do that, and so that is something that at Emily's List we have fought back against for a long time. The disinformation, the misinformation that we know women of color candidates in particular are targets of. I have to tell you that Republicans are doing this because they are terrified about Kamala Harris. They are terrified to face such an accomplished and prepared candidate who is going to be able to effectively litigate a case on an issue that we know is going to win this election abortion rights, but not just that. They are terrified of a candidate who is ready to lead on day one. For the past three years, she has been on a national stage. She has cultivated relationships with world leaders. She has de livered economic relief for people across this country. She's an incredible record throughout her career of fighting for people. So they're scared and they are going to resort to the tactics that they always resort to in these times, and they are going to resort to these racists and sexist attacks. We are going to push back against those, and we're going to do the work of amplifying her voice.

And we know that when we do that, voters will be compelled to vote for her and we will win.

And we know that when we do that, voters will be compelled to vote for her and we will win.

Well.

Well.

Jessica, of course, at Emily's List, while you are going to be throwing your support behind Kamala Harris's presidential ambitions, your wider mission is to get democratic women elected into office at all levels of the US government. Knowing what we have learned in the last twenty four hours, the notion that concern about Democrats being able to retain control of the Senate or get control of the House, the down ballot implications had a factor in Joe Biden's decision. What Kamala Harris at the top of the ticket actually helps some of those vulnerable Democrats that we're watching, like Senator Tammy Baldwin or Senator Jackie Rosen.

Jessica, of course, at Emily's List, while you are going to be throwing your support behind Kamala Harris's presidential ambitions, your wider mission is to get democratic women elected into office at all levels of the US government. Knowing what we have learned in the last twenty four hours, the notion that concern about Democrats being able to retain control of the Senate or get control of the House, the down ballot implications had a factor in Joe Biden's decision. What Kamala Harris at the top of the ticket actually helps some of those vulnerable Democrats that we're watching, like Senator Tammy Baldwin or Senator Jackie Rosen.

How do you view that.

How do you view that.

Well, First of all, I'll say that the electric energy that we're feeling in the Democratic Party right now is incredibly helpful. It is the jolt that we need to get back to a conversation that we know is is what is going to decide this election. That we need to have a conversation with voters that is consistent and clear about the choice that they are facing in this election, and that is true at every.

Well, First of all, I'll say that the electric energy that we're feeling in the Democratic Party right now is incredibly helpful. It is the jolt that we need to get back to a conversation that we know is is what is going to decide this election. That we need to have a conversation with voters that is consistent and clear about the choice that they are facing in this election, and that is true at every.

Level of the ballot.

Level of the ballot.

We talk to voters about the stakes on abortion rights and reproductive freedom, the choice that they have between a ticket that is going to defend and restore those rights and Donald Trump and jd Vance, who would enact a national abortion ban, who've signed on for these awful state abortion bans that are in place right now, and for the most dangerous elements of Project twenty twenty five. Voters are clear that they will stand with us and that choice when we put it in front of voters. Whether we're talking about a state legislative race, a US Senate race, or the race for the presidency, we know Democrats will be successful if that's the conversation we're having, and that's exactly what we're going to do between now and November.

We talk to voters about the stakes on abortion rights and reproductive freedom, the choice that they have between a ticket that is going to defend and restore those rights and Donald Trump and jd Vance, who would enact a national abortion ban, who've signed on for these awful state abortion bans that are in place right now, and for the most dangerous elements of Project twenty twenty five. Voters are clear that they will stand with us and that choice when we put it in front of voters. Whether we're talking about a state legislative race, a US Senate race, or the race for the presidency, we know Democrats will be successful if that's the conversation we're having, and that's exactly what we're going to do between now and November.

And it appears that Marian Williamson is going to take a swing at the nomination if given the opportunity. Jessica says she will compete for the spot after previously leaving the race and getting back into the race should she be given that chance.

And it appears that Marian Williamson is going to take a swing at the nomination if given the opportunity. Jessica says she will compete for the spot after previously leaving the race and getting back into the race should she be given that chance.

Well, look, I think this is a democracy, but what we've seen from in the last twenty four hours is just an incredible show of support for Vice President Harris. We have seen that from, as I've said, every region of the country elected officials at all levels of the ballot. We've seen it from organizations that are a whole wide range of issues and they all know what I know, which is that there is no one more prepared to win this election against Donald Trump. There was no one who is more prepared to lead this country on day one than Kamala Harris. So I fully expect that Kamala Harris is going to be our democratic nominee, and she is going to win in November and will be in the White House at this time next year.

Well, look, I think this is a democracy, but what we've seen from in the last twenty four hours is just an incredible show of support for Vice President Harris. We have seen that from, as I've said, every region of the country elected officials at all levels of the ballot. We've seen it from organizations that are a whole wide range of issues and they all know what I know, which is that there is no one more prepared to win this election against Donald Trump. There was no one who is more prepared to lead this country on day one than Kamala Harris. So I fully expect that Kamala Harris is going to be our democratic nominee, and she is going to win in November and will be in the White House at this time next year.

Well, Jessica, of course, if she is the top of the ticket, needs to be on that ticket with her. I've heard suggestions in the last twenty four hours that if it is to be Kamala Harris, a woman of color who is leading the Democratic ticket, that it's going to need to be a white man on it with her to balance things out.

Well, Jessica, of course, if she is the top of the ticket, needs to be on that ticket with her. I've heard suggestions in the last twenty four hours that if it is to be Kamala Harris, a woman of color who is leading the Democratic ticket, that it's going to need to be a white man on it with her to balance things out.

What do you think of that notion?

What do you think of that notion?

Should she be considering a woman like Governor Gretchen Whitmer to be her vice president if she wins the nomination.

Should she be considering a woman like Governor Gretchen Whitmer to be her vice president if she wins the nomination.

Well, I'm not going to put my own parameters out there for the vice president. I trust her to make the decision that's right for her to choose a partner.

Well, I'm not going to put my own parameters out there for the vice president. I trust her to make the decision that's right for her to choose a partner.

Who is going to serve.

Who is going to serve.

Admirably with her and is going to be the right partner for her in this ticket. But I will say that regardless of who she chooses, we know that that ticket is going to provide a really clear contrast with Donald Trump and JD. Vance, who embraced the most extreme elements of the Republican Party and the MAGA movement.

Admirably with her and is going to be the right partner for her in this ticket. But I will say that regardless of who she chooses, we know that that ticket is going to provide a really clear contrast with Donald Trump and JD. Vance, who embraced the most extreme elements of the Republican Party and the MAGA movement.

And this is going to be a clear choice between a ticket that is going.

And this is going to be a clear choice between a ticket that is going.

To stand up and defend our rights and our freedoms, that is going to be for a better economic future for our country, and the choice between Donald Trump and jd Vance, who, as I said, embrace the most dangerous elements of Project twenty twenty five and are going to take this country down a really dark path. That's the choice voters you are going to have in front of them, regardless of who is on this ticket with us.

To stand up and defend our rights and our freedoms, that is going to be for a better economic future for our country, and the choice between Donald Trump and jd Vance, who, as I said, embrace the most dangerous elements of Project twenty twenty five and are going to take this country down a really dark path. That's the choice voters you are going to have in front of them, regardless of who is on this ticket with us.

That is going to be the choice in November.

That is going to be the choice in November.

Jessica, I want to get back to something that we were talking about a bit earlier, and that's just the change in stakes for Donald Trump to be debating a woman, and in this case, a woman of color and lessons learned from the twenty sixteen race in which Donald Trump shared a stage with Hillary Clinton. What do you expect to see if Donald Trump actually makes good on this debate appointment that he had with Joe Biden. I realized that he might want a different venue at this point. But if something takes place in a debate between these two candidates, how does this change the game for Donald Trump.

Jessica, I want to get back to something that we were talking about a bit earlier, and that's just the change in stakes for Donald Trump to be debating a woman, and in this case, a woman of color and lessons learned from the twenty sixteen race in which Donald Trump shared a stage with Hillary Clinton. What do you expect to see if Donald Trump actually makes good on this debate appointment that he had with Joe Biden. I realized that he might want a different venue at this point. But if something takes place in a debate between these two candidates, how does this change the game for Donald Trump.

Well, I am sure that Donald Trump and his team have seen what I've seen, and that is a life time at a record of achievement from Kamala Harris and just an incredible litigator.

Well, I am sure that Donald Trump and his team have seen what I've seen, and that is a life time at a record of achievement from Kamala Harris and just an incredible litigator.

Her background as a prosecutor.

Her background as a prosecutor.

We saw it in the US Senate on display and the Judiciary Committee. No one wants to be in her line of sight when it comes to having to defend a record that the American people are clear that they don't want, and.

We saw it in the US Senate on display and the Judiciary Committee. No one wants to be in her line of sight when it comes to having to defend a record that the American people are clear that they don't want, and.

So I expect that they have to be pretty scared of that moment.

So I expect that they have to be pretty scared of that moment.

She's an incredibly effective messenger on issues including reproductive freedom, but certainly not limited to that, and it is going to be a daunting task for them. She's going to litigate this case incredibly effectively against Donald Trump.

She's an incredibly effective messenger on issues including reproductive freedom, but certainly not limited to that, and it is going to be a daunting task for them. She's going to litigate this case incredibly effectively against Donald Trump.

Well, Jessica, you've mentioned reproductive freedom a few times during this conversation. It was a conversation that notably wasn't really being had in Milwaukee, where Joe and I were last week, and a lot of the discussions we were having with people gathered there and strategists was this notion that the Republican Party and especially Donald Trump and selecting Jade Vance as his vice presidential nominee, seems to have decided not to go for suburban women in this election cycle to focus on rural areas, working classmen in particular. Do you think Havin Harris at the top of the ticket may actually change that strategy and you have to counter what could be a more concerted effort with the Republicans and the Trump campaign to go after that same base of voters.

Well, Jessica, you've mentioned reproductive freedom a few times during this conversation. It was a conversation that notably wasn't really being had in Milwaukee, where Joe and I were last week, and a lot of the discussions we were having with people gathered there and strategists was this notion that the Republican Party and especially Donald Trump and selecting Jade Vance as his vice presidential nominee, seems to have decided not to go for suburban women in this election cycle to focus on rural areas, working classmen in particular. Do you think Havin Harris at the top of the ticket may actually change that strategy and you have to counter what could be a more concerted effort with the Republicans and the Trump campaign to go after that same base of voters.

Well, I will say, I mean watching the RNC last week, I know that Republicans like Donald Trump, Jadevance, they can read polls and they don't want to talk about this issue. But unfortunately for them, this is not a branding problem for them, it's an agenda problem.

Well, I will say, I mean watching the RNC last week, I know that Republicans like Donald Trump, Jadevance, they can read polls and they don't want to talk about this issue. But unfortunately for them, this is not a branding problem for them, it's an agenda problem.

And it doesn't matter where you are in this country.

And it doesn't matter where you are in this country.

We have seen since the DABS decision in Red States, Purple states, all over this country, people believe overwhelmingly that these are decisions that belong with individuals, that they should be able to make them themselves their private medical choices, and that these are decisions that the government, bureaucracy courts should not be involved in. They are very clear on thatvoters are very clear on that. And so the problem for Donald Trump and JD Vance and Republicans like them up and down the ticket is that you can run, but you cannot hide from this.

We have seen since the DABS decision in Red States, Purple states, all over this country, people believe overwhelmingly that these are decisions that belong with individuals, that they should be able to make them themselves their private medical choices, and that these are decisions that the government, bureaucracy courts should not be involved in. They are very clear on thatvoters are very clear on that. And so the problem for Donald Trump and JD Vance and Republicans like them up and down the ticket is that you can run, but you cannot hide from this.

We know their records.

We know their records.

We're going to put that in front of voters and wherever you are again around the country, they're on the wrong side of this issue.

We're going to put that in front of voters and wherever you are again around the country, they're on the wrong side of this issue.

Jessica, it's great to have you.

Jessica, it's great to have you.

Jessica Mackler, the president of Emily's List, America's largest pack devoted to electing Democratic women and in this case, devoting twenty million dollars to the Kamala Harris for President campaign.

Jessica Mackler, the president of Emily's List, America's largest pack devoted to electing Democratic women and in this case, devoting twenty million dollars to the Kamala Harris for President campaign.

It's great to have you here.

It's great to have you here.

I'm Joe Matthew and Washington alongside Kaylee Lines where we have two major endorsements dropping in our lapse here from the Senate. Kamala Harris already had a majority of Senate Senate Democrats, and she adds two more.

I'm Joe Matthew and Washington alongside Kaylee Lines where we have two major endorsements dropping in our lapse here from the Senate. Kamala Harris already had a majority of Senate Senate Democrats, and she adds two more.

Yeah, the list is getting longer, including the Senator from Maryland, Chris van Holland, out with an endorsement, and also, interestingly, Senator John Fetterman of Pennsylvania, who had been one of the most vocal advocates for Joe Biden the President, staying in the now, out with a post on x that he is proud to support and be all in for the next president, he says. Kamala Harris, attached to a picture that says, let's win this Harris for President.

Yeah, the list is getting longer, including the Senator from Maryland, Chris van Holland, out with an endorsement, and also, interestingly, Senator John Fetterman of Pennsylvania, who had been one of the most vocal advocates for Joe Biden the President, staying in the now, out with a post on x that he is proud to support and be all in for the next president, he says. Kamala Harris, attached to a picture that says, let's win this Harris for President.

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Hold Sir Franklins, founder and president of fil Inc. Who is here with us in our Washington, d C. Studio. Frank, great to see you. You were on with us months ago talking about how Joe Biden was not going to be able to win this election because he is too old. The age issue potentially taken away if Harris is at the top of the ticket. She's only fifty nine. Can she beat Donald Trump? As the data suggests right now that she can.

Hold Sir Franklins, founder and president of fil Inc. Who is here with us in our Washington, d C. Studio. Frank, great to see you. You were on with us months ago talking about how Joe Biden was not going to be able to win this election because he is too old. The age issue potentially taken away if Harris is at the top of the ticket. She's only fifty nine. Can she beat Donald Trump? As the data suggests right now that she can.

Yes, she can. I've already done a not ed for the Financial Times, for the Times of London. This campaign for me, anyway, has begun twenty four eighteen hours ago. The age issue is now a Trump issue. It's not that it's been taken away. Now. Trump has to defend some of the things that he spoke of because he would be the oldest person ever elected if he were to serve four years. She changes the entire equation. She brings young women to the table who had no interest in voting for Joe Biden and were not attracted to Donald Trump. She brings African Americans who are completely disinterested in this campaign. And these matter in states across the country. I wrote just seventy two hours ago that unless things dramatically changed, it was going to be Trump. That you can now pretty well declare him, because not only was he winning the swing state, but he had the passion, the energy, the intensity of vote. Every Trump supporter is going to be a Trump voter for sure. And that not to say with Biden. Now that it's Harris, everything changes and I can't call it, and I can't wait for that debate. And by the way, I will pay money. I will seriously donate ten thousand dollars right now if ABC News host that debate and you let me sit in the studio, I will pay ten thousand dollars to ABC News is or Bloomberg.

Yes, she can. I've already done a not ed for the Financial Times, for the Times of London. This campaign for me, anyway, has begun twenty four eighteen hours ago. The age issue is now a Trump issue. It's not that it's been taken away. Now. Trump has to defend some of the things that he spoke of because he would be the oldest person ever elected if he were to serve four years. She changes the entire equation. She brings young women to the table who had no interest in voting for Joe Biden and were not attracted to Donald Trump. She brings African Americans who are completely disinterested in this campaign. And these matter in states across the country. I wrote just seventy two hours ago that unless things dramatically changed, it was going to be Trump. That you can now pretty well declare him, because not only was he winning the swing state, but he had the passion, the energy, the intensity of vote. Every Trump supporter is going to be a Trump voter for sure. And that not to say with Biden. Now that it's Harris, everything changes and I can't call it, and I can't wait for that debate. And by the way, I will pay money. I will seriously donate ten thousand dollars right now if ABC News host that debate and you let me sit in the studio, I will pay ten thousand dollars to ABC News is or Bloomberg.

I was gonna say, I'd like to host that debate, Frank, what about me and Joe?

I was gonna say, I'd like to host that debate, Frank, what about me and Joe?

Yes, I'd love you guys to do it, because at least I could get into the building, because that would be the most just contentious debate ever. These two candidates don't like each other, don't respect each other, and have no hesitation to express it. We're gonna have the most negative campaign in the history of American politics, and I want a front row seat.

Yes, I'd love you guys to do it, because at least I could get into the building, because that would be the most just contentious debate ever. These two candidates don't like each other, don't respect each other, and have no hesitation to express it. We're gonna have the most negative campaign in the history of American politics, and I want a front row seat.

So this turns the race completely here in your view, Kamala Harris has been beset with low favorability ratings. She has been laden with a difficult portfolio, and until recently, the abortion issue has played in her favor. Based on some of our polling as opposed to the border, Americans think they know Kamala Harris, do they actually What will they learn about her in the week'sa.

So this turns the race completely here in your view, Kamala Harris has been beset with low favorability ratings. She has been laden with a difficult portfolio, and until recently, the abortion issue has played in her favor. Based on some of our polling as opposed to the border, Americans think they know Kamala Harris, do they actually What will they learn about her in the week'sa.

She has the chance to redefine herself. Everything starts to start from scratch. You start from scratch, and how she presents herself. I brought this up yesterday, the laughter that she would use, and I was criticized for saying it. Why is it that women get yelled at for laughing? Well, the fact is, in so many interviews, back to back to back, you can see it on YouTube. This is what she does when she gets asked a tough question. That's number one. Number two is she wouldn't go to the border for month after month after month, as Republican House members, Republican senators were going down to making an issue, she stayed away because she knew that it was toxic for her. Number three, She never she never created a separate identity from Joe Biden at number four. Quite frankly, she went through staff pretty darn fast, and that tells you something about the care to of an individual. None of that matters now, it's all from this point forward. She has the chance to redo herself. And you can see by the fifty million dollars raised in one day in small donations how significant this this decision was. This race is on Monday, whatever date this is, the race begins again with one hundred days to go.

She has the chance to redefine herself. Everything starts to start from scratch. You start from scratch, and how she presents herself. I brought this up yesterday, the laughter that she would use, and I was criticized for saying it. Why is it that women get yelled at for laughing? Well, the fact is, in so many interviews, back to back to back, you can see it on YouTube. This is what she does when she gets asked a tough question. That's number one. Number two is she wouldn't go to the border for month after month after month, as Republican House members, Republican senators were going down to making an issue, she stayed away because she knew that it was toxic for her. Number three, She never she never created a separate identity from Joe Biden at number four. Quite frankly, she went through staff pretty darn fast, and that tells you something about the care to of an individual. None of that matters now, it's all from this point forward. She has the chance to redo herself. And you can see by the fifty million dollars raised in one day in small donations how significant this this decision was. This race is on Monday, whatever date this is, the race begins again with one hundred days to go.

Well, I wonder here how high the bar is for her Because we've talked so much during the cycle about double haters who didn't want Trump or Biden, or the Nicky Haley primary voters who were decidedly not voting for Donald Trump even after she had abandoned her presidential campaign. How easy is the conversion from a double hater or Nicki Haley voter to potentially a Kamala Harris voter.

Well, I wonder here how high the bar is for her Because we've talked so much during the cycle about double haters who didn't want Trump or Biden, or the Nicky Haley primary voters who were decidedly not voting for Donald Trump even after she had abandoned her presidential campaign. How easy is the conversion from a double hater or Nicki Haley voter to potentially a Kamala Harris voter.

It's not easy, but it can happen. And what's particularly important in this is that the numbers are so small. There was only four percent undecided before Harris became the Democrat, the likely Democratic nominee. Now it's probably up to six or seven percentage. People take a look at her. You don't have to swing that many voters to create the two hundred and seventy electoral votes. And the states that mattered before matter now. Pennsylvania, Michigan, Wisconsin. Those are the street states that are truly in play. And those states this is why I think that that Governor Shapiro from Pennsylvania would be, in my mind, the obvious choice for the Democrats, because that takes Pennsylvania off the map, and that gives potentially Joe Biden the election.

It's not easy, but it can happen. And what's particularly important in this is that the numbers are so small. There was only four percent undecided before Harris became the Democrat, the likely Democratic nominee. Now it's probably up to six or seven percentage. People take a look at her. You don't have to swing that many voters to create the two hundred and seventy electoral votes. And the states that mattered before matter now. Pennsylvania, Michigan, Wisconsin. Those are the street states that are truly in play. And those states this is why I think that that Governor Shapiro from Pennsylvania would be, in my mind, the obvious choice for the Democrats, because that takes Pennsylvania off the map, and that gives potentially Joe Biden the election.

I want to ask you.

I want to ask you.

Sorry, Kamala Harris. And by the way, how many times will people make that mistake?

Sorry, Kamala Harris. And by the way, how many times will people make that mistake?

Send me upuscle.

Send me upuscle.

Memory is a hard thing.

Memory is a hard thing.

This is so true.

This is so true.

We'll keep dating our checks here with Frank Luntz. The question about process I want to ask you about because there's already this idea of a smoke filled back room, even though it's the vice president of the United States, and whether the Democrats should have have some sort of mini primary or some sort of nominating contest that makes it feel like she was vetted Donald Trump on truth social They stole the race from Biden after he wanted in the primaries a first. These people are the real threat to democracy. He's saying that Democrats have rigged the race again. How do they make this appear like this was not some sort of.

We'll keep dating our checks here with Frank Luntz. The question about process I want to ask you about because there's already this idea of a smoke filled back room, even though it's the vice president of the United States, and whether the Democrats should have have some sort of mini primary or some sort of nominating contest that makes it feel like she was vetted Donald Trump on truth social They stole the race from Biden after he wanted in the primaries a first. These people are the real threat to democracy. He's saying that Democrats have rigged the race again. How do they make this appear like this was not some sort of.

A deal, because it's a coronation. It is a deal, but it requires someone to say I want to run. It requires a Wes Moore who came out in favor of her right, It requires a Corey Book I've not heard from him yet. It requires some of these other potential candidates. Gavin Newsom came out for Harris. Someone needs to stand up and say we need this vote. The only one who's done so at this point is Joe Manchin, and it's unclear whether or not he will run, and Mansion is too conservative for the average Democratic.

A deal, because it's a coronation. It is a deal, but it requires someone to say I want to run. It requires a Wes Moore who came out in favor of her right, It requires a Corey Book I've not heard from him yet. It requires some of these other potential candidates. Gavin Newsom came out for Harris. Someone needs to stand up and say we need this vote. The only one who's done so at this point is Joe Manchin, and it's unclear whether or not he will run, and Mansion is too conservative for the average Democratic.

Now he tell the CBS today he's not running. Then it's just Mary.

Now he tell the CBS today he's not running. Then it's just Mary.

Anne Williams and I guess no one else at this point.

Anne Williams and I guess no one else at this point.

And she got what one percent of the vote in the primaries, so this would have been an argument twenty four hours ago. But if there's no candidate, then there's no election, and this issue goes.

And she got what one percent of the vote in the primaries, so this would have been an argument twenty four hours ago. But if there's no candidate, then there's no election, and this issue goes.

Away as we consider the other side of the aisle here, Donald Trump and now a Trump Dvance ticket because he had to make this selection of who was vice presidential nominee was going to be before all of this went down. What is to change for two white men as they compete against potentially a woman of color. How can they attack Kamala Harris without being vilified for it?

Away as we consider the other side of the aisle here, Donald Trump and now a Trump Dvance ticket because he had to make this selection of who was vice presidential nominee was going to be before all of this went down. What is to change for two white men as they compete against potentially a woman of color. How can they attack Kamala Harris without being vilified for it?

In some say they will be, but that doesn't mean it matters.

In some say they will be, but that doesn't mean it matters.

So they just treat her like they treated Hillary Clinton in twenty sixteen.

So they just treat her like they treated Hillary Clinton in twenty sixteen.

It worked for Trump. We forget that when Trump was elected, she was not, even though she got more popular votes. I think that people are aware of it. But in the end, if you're a working class voter, and more specifically, if you live paycheck to paycheck, you're going to ask yourself, which one of these people know my circumstance and which one of these people can fix my circumstance. Is twenty five percent of the electorate working paycheck to paycheck. The candidate that has the best agenda for those people and seems to empathize with him and understands them. JD. Vans comes from them, That's who he was, and his language is actually better than Donald Trump's in speaking to them. It's not necessarily inspiring to the corporate community and particularly the people who watch this show. This is a very educated and a wealthy audience that you have. This is not a JD. Van's audience. This is not a Donald Trump audience, but the people who do care. Does she come across as being flippant, Does she come across as truly understanding and empathizing, or is she trying to score political points? And this is the one thing that the Democrats have gotten wrong in times of economic distress. They hear the Democratic message, but they hate it if they think that they're being taken advantage of, if they think it's just a political ploy or partisan trick. And she in the past has communicated that a less than forthcoming persona I remind you she raised tens of millions of dollars as a candidate in twenty twenty. She didn't even make it to Iowa, so she's had the chance before she didn't succeed, But she's this is a new game, a new day, a new office, a new electorate, so I would not hold I would say to you that everything begins fresh right now.

It worked for Trump. We forget that when Trump was elected, she was not, even though she got more popular votes. I think that people are aware of it. But in the end, if you're a working class voter, and more specifically, if you live paycheck to paycheck, you're going to ask yourself, which one of these people know my circumstance and which one of these people can fix my circumstance. Is twenty five percent of the electorate working paycheck to paycheck. The candidate that has the best agenda for those people and seems to empathize with him and understands them. JD. Vans comes from them, That's who he was, and his language is actually better than Donald Trump's in speaking to them. It's not necessarily inspiring to the corporate community and particularly the people who watch this show. This is a very educated and a wealthy audience that you have. This is not a JD. Van's audience. This is not a Donald Trump audience, but the people who do care. Does she come across as being flippant, Does she come across as truly understanding and empathizing, or is she trying to score political points? And this is the one thing that the Democrats have gotten wrong in times of economic distress. They hear the Democratic message, but they hate it if they think that they're being taken advantage of, if they think it's just a political ploy or partisan trick. And she in the past has communicated that a less than forthcoming persona I remind you she raised tens of millions of dollars as a candidate in twenty twenty. She didn't even make it to Iowa, so she's had the chance before she didn't succeed, But she's this is a new game, a new day, a new office, a new electorate, so I would not hold I would say to you that everything begins fresh right now.

Well, as you were talking about who's going to appeal to the working class votor that lives paycheck to paycheck, which Jagievans obviously tried to do when accepting the nomination. He of course grew up in Ohio, but his family was from Kentucky. And we heard from the Kentucky Governor, Andy Basheer about that notion when he spoke on MSNBC Morning MSNBC's Morning Joe earlier today.

Well, as you were talking about who's going to appeal to the working class votor that lives paycheck to paycheck, which Jagievans obviously tried to do when accepting the nomination. He of course grew up in Ohio, but his family was from Kentucky. And we heard from the Kentucky Governor, Andy Basheer about that notion when he spoke on MSNBC Morning MSNBC's Morning Joe earlier today.

This is what he said.

This is what he said.

Let me just tell you that jd.

Let me just tell you that jd.

Vance ain't from here now in the nerve that he has to call the people of Kentucky, of eastern Kentucky lazy. Listen, these are the hard working coal miners that towered the industrial revolution, that created the strongest middle class the world has ever seen, powered us through two World wars. We should be thanking them, not calling them lazy.

Vance ain't from here now in the nerve that he has to call the people of Kentucky, of eastern Kentucky lazy. Listen, these are the hard working coal miners that towered the industrial revolution, that created the strongest middle class the world has ever seen, powered us through two World wars. We should be thanking them, not calling them lazy.

He of course, is a democratic governor in what is a deep red state. Some have suggested he too would be a good compliment to Kamala Harris as a vice president. But I know you said Shapiro earlier, would Basher be just as good of a choice.