Hello, my name is Gillian Bowen, the Australian manager of Public Affairs at Chartered Accountants, ANZ or CA ANZ. This is Small Firm, Big Impact.

Hello, my name is Gillian Bowen, the Australian manager of Public Affairs at Chartered Accountants, ANZ or CA ANZ. This is Small Firm, Big Impact.

It's actually looking like a pretty big year for 2023. There's a number of standards in play, either new standards or post implementation reviews of some of the big standards. There's no shortage of technical reasons and different stakeholders pushing us towards greater complexity. But what we have to do is look at the bigger picture and often push back. We deal with about four or 500 member queries and and sort of pieces of feedback in a year. And a lot of that is very useful to identify these types of issues and the pressures that that members are facing.

It's actually looking like a pretty big year for 2023. There's a number of standards in play, either new standards or post implementation reviews of some of the big standards. There's no shortage of technical reasons and different stakeholders pushing us towards greater complexity. But what we have to do is look at the bigger picture and often push back. We deal with about four or 500 member queries and and sort of pieces of feedback in a year. And a lot of that is very useful to identify these types of issues and the pressures that that members are facing.

It's the podcast giving you and your clients the up to date information you need to do your jobs. Each fortnight I share resources, tools and expert advice provided by CA ANZ and a range of people across our profession. So make sure you're following the pod in your favourite pod app and if you've got an idea for the show Email podcast@charteredaccountantsanz.com . Today we have in Amir Ghandar Chartered Accountants, ANZ Reporting and Assurance Leader in the hot seat. The topic: changes to accounting standards in Australia and New Zealand, as well as what's different in the auditing and reporting space in 2023. Amir, Welcome to Small Firm, Big Impact.

It's the podcast giving you and your clients the up to date information you need to do your jobs. Each fortnight I share resources, tools and expert advice provided by CA ANZ and a range of people across our profession. So make sure you're following the pod in your favourite pod app and if you've got an idea for the show Email podcast@charteredaccountantsanz.com . Today we have in Amir Ghandar Chartered Accountants, ANZ Reporting and Assurance Leader in the hot seat. The topic: changes to accounting standards in Australia and New Zealand, as well as what's different in the auditing and reporting space in 2023. Amir, Welcome to Small Firm, Big Impact.

It's great to be with you, Gill.

It's great to be with you, Gill.

Look, let's get straight into it. What's happening with international accounting standards and how do they apply locally to small and medium sized practices?

Look, let's get straight into it. What's happening with international accounting standards and how do they apply locally to small and medium sized practices?

It's actually looking like a pretty big year for 2023. There's a number of standards in play, either new standards or post implementation reviews of some of the big standards. I guess to sum up there's increasing complexity overall coming in to international accounting standards, a number of moving parts at once. This year, one thing that complexity means we have to be very careful how these standards translate locally for SMEs, for small and medium entities, and of course the impact on the practices that work with with those types of entities. The biggest piece in play now in that space is the framework reform in Australia, the removal of special purpose reporting and replacement by a tiered model and in New Zealand refining the tiered model that's already in place. And also when we're looking at the standards internationally in some of those big post implementation reviews, we'll be looking at, for example, the leases standard, making sure we have a really robust input from our members and getting getting a view across, a real view and getting that heard and working with peers in other countries to try to effect change. We've had some success along those lines that during the pandemic, for example, getting some relief on some key areas that were causing problems. I guess you know, in all our advocacy work on the accounting standards, a major focus for us to to represent our small and medium practice members is to aim for simplicity and pragmatism. There's no shortage of technical reasons and different stakeholders pushing us towards greater complexity. But what we have to do is look at the bigger picture and often push back, hopefully to land somewhere sensible and workable.

It's actually looking like a pretty big year for 2023. There's a number of standards in play, either new standards or post implementation reviews of some of the big standards. I guess to sum up there's increasing complexity overall coming in to international accounting standards, a number of moving parts at once. This year, one thing that complexity means we have to be very careful how these standards translate locally for SMEs, for small and medium entities, and of course the impact on the practices that work with with those types of entities. The biggest piece in play now in that space is the framework reform in Australia, the removal of special purpose reporting and replacement by a tiered model and in New Zealand refining the tiered model that's already in place. And also when we're looking at the standards internationally in some of those big post implementation reviews, we'll be looking at, for example, the leases standard, making sure we have a really robust input from our members and getting getting a view across, a real view and getting that heard and working with peers in other countries to try to effect change. We've had some success along those lines that during the pandemic, for example, getting some relief on some key areas that were causing problems. I guess you know, in all our advocacy work on the accounting standards, a major focus for us to to represent our small and medium practice members is to aim for simplicity and pragmatism. There's no shortage of technical reasons and different stakeholders pushing us towards greater complexity. But what we have to do is look at the bigger picture and often push back, hopefully to land somewhere sensible and workable.

Mm hmm. And so then the changes that you've mentioned there, why have they come about?

Mm hmm. And so then the changes that you've mentioned there, why have they come about?

Well, look in both Australia and New Zealand, the government has for a long time committed to adopting international standards issued by the International Accounting Standards Board with only essential kind of changes made for the local environment and the local standards boards, the Australian Accounting Standards Board and the New Zealand Accounting Standards Board take these international standards which apply to larger listed entities and issuers. And and of course we then have a sizeable population of entities outside that space where either tweaks or significant requirements might apply ideally in a more bespoke and fit for purpose way. For example, private companies, not for profits, associations, you know self-managed super funds. It's not always ideal, however, and the laws and regulations impacting this can be fragmented across the states federally, and sometimes quite obtuse outcomes occur.

Well, look in both Australia and New Zealand, the government has for a long time committed to adopting international standards issued by the International Accounting Standards Board with only essential kind of changes made for the local environment and the local standards boards, the Australian Accounting Standards Board and the New Zealand Accounting Standards Board take these international standards which apply to larger listed entities and issuers. And and of course we then have a sizeable population of entities outside that space where either tweaks or significant requirements might apply ideally in a more bespoke and fit for purpose way. For example, private companies, not for profits, associations, you know self-managed super funds. It's not always ideal, however, and the laws and regulations impacting this can be fragmented across the states federally, and sometimes quite obtuse outcomes occur.

That's always tricky, isn't it, about different, different jurisdictions rolling out different things?

That's always tricky, isn't it, about different, different jurisdictions rolling out different things?

Absolutely. And we invest quite a lot of time working with the standard setters to push for a practical and reasonable approach that's in line with the international standards. In New Zealand. For many years, a tiered system has applied. So the standards for smaller entities get progressively simpler and more suitable for smaller entities, right down to a cash based management accounting type approach for the smallest entities. In Australia, we've had special purpose reporting where entities decided on their own accounting policies, where there notionally aren't uses that would need to rely on general purpose financial statements. But one of those major changes of the past few years and continuing in 23 is where the Australian Accounting Standards Board is phasing out this approach to be replaced by a tiered model, as we have in New Zealand and a lot of other parts of the world.

Absolutely. And we invest quite a lot of time working with the standard setters to push for a practical and reasonable approach that's in line with the international standards. In New Zealand. For many years, a tiered system has applied. So the standards for smaller entities get progressively simpler and more suitable for smaller entities, right down to a cash based management accounting type approach for the smallest entities. In Australia, we've had special purpose reporting where entities decided on their own accounting policies, where there notionally aren't uses that would need to rely on general purpose financial statements. But one of those major changes of the past few years and continuing in 23 is where the Australian Accounting Standards Board is phasing out this approach to be replaced by a tiered model, as we have in New Zealand and a lot of other parts of the world.

And our our members and the people who work in this space across those changes, they know that this is coming into force. And if not, then what is it that CA ANZ is doing to ensure that they do know?

And our our members and the people who work in this space across those changes, they know that this is coming into force. And if not, then what is it that CA ANZ is doing to ensure that they do know?

Yeah, So we have a, we have a lot of regular forums and, and, and ways of, of both informing members, but I think also really importantly getting the views of members in. For example, we have monthly forums with, with accounting experts from the small end of town to the big end of town and some of those actually met fortnightly during the pandemic. We've in the last few years done an annual IFRS survey. Of about 500 to 700 members really looking to see how those international standards and the local equivalants are impacting where the problem areas are..

Yeah, So we have a, we have a lot of regular forums and, and, and ways of, of both informing members, but I think also really importantly getting the views of members in. For example, we have monthly forums with, with accounting experts from the small end of town to the big end of town and some of those actually met fortnightly during the pandemic. We've in the last few years done an annual IFRS survey. Of about 500 to 700 members really looking to see how those international standards and the local equivalants are impacting where the problem areas are..

Is that a good number of members getting involved in that.

Is that a good number of members getting involved in that.

Or that a decent or I'd certainly like more. You always, always would like more, but that's a pretty reasonable cross that gives us a cross-section of different types of members, different locations and backgrounds. So if I use the example of that framework reform in Australia, a really important pace impacting on a lot of members, particularly in those small and medium practices. We conducted a major survey early on in that project a few years ago to understand views, and it's challenging because there are a range of views and there are strong views on on all sides of the debate really, but ultimately landed on whatever change does come through needs to be practical, workable and suitable for the entities that applies to it in the for profit space where that change has already happened and applied for the first time in the last couple of years. We saw in this year's IFRS survey that members of for the most part saying that the burden has been reduced through what's been done, but there is scope for further simplification and in the not for profit space where, where the future proposed changes are right now being consulted on. And so we we would really encourage any input from members. The proposed model from the Accounting Standards Board does take into account very much the feedback we've provided from members and simplified a lot of the key areas and the feedback from members so far on that has been quite positive.

Or that a decent or I'd certainly like more. You always, always would like more, but that's a pretty reasonable cross that gives us a cross-section of different types of members, different locations and backgrounds. So if I use the example of that framework reform in Australia, a really important pace impacting on a lot of members, particularly in those small and medium practices. We conducted a major survey early on in that project a few years ago to understand views, and it's challenging because there are a range of views and there are strong views on on all sides of the debate really, but ultimately landed on whatever change does come through needs to be practical, workable and suitable for the entities that applies to it in the for profit space where that change has already happened and applied for the first time in the last couple of years. We saw in this year's IFRS survey that members of for the most part saying that the burden has been reduced through what's been done, but there is scope for further simplification and in the not for profit space where, where the future proposed changes are right now being consulted on. And so we we would really encourage any input from members. The proposed model from the Accounting Standards Board does take into account very much the feedback we've provided from members and simplified a lot of the key areas and the feedback from members so far on that has been quite positive.

Look, you've mentioned the word burden there and I'm sure those listening along would have their own view on this. So feel free to let us know. But what is the regulatory burden like out there at the moment?

Look, you've mentioned the word burden there and I'm sure those listening along would have their own view on this. So feel free to let us know. But what is the regulatory burden like out there at the moment?

So I guess the real challenge is making sure that, in terms of accounting standards, that the right, the right approach and the right standards and frameworks are applying to the right entities. And that's a that's a major challenge because we have a.

So I guess the real challenge is making sure that, in terms of accounting standards, that the right, the right approach and the right standards and frameworks are applying to the right entities. And that's a that's a major challenge because we have a.

People would be like, well, are they are they applying?

People would be like, well, are they are they applying?

We have a complex system with with many state and federal agencies and different laws involved in determing who must report under what standard. So. Notwithstanding the the Accounting Standards Board has been very receptive to feedback about simplifying the models that are there. We've we've really had to get involved and invested quite heavily in helping the standard setter as well as different agencies and departments around the states and federally to make sure they're aware of the standards that are coming through and how that fits into their to their regulatory framework. And that's been largely quite successful that that approach of getting ahead of that which we really have been doing throughout the the process. But but I think it's fair to say there are exceptions and this can even change over time for particular entities. So we we remain vigilant. We again call for input from members. We deal with about four or 500 member queries and and sort of pieces of feedback in a year. And a lot of that is very useful to identify these types of issues and the pressures that that members are facing now that's in the for profit space it in the not for profit space coming up, it could be even more complex. So we we're working hard to get ahead of any actual exposure drafts or standards coming through to make sure that it's it's not just a sort of unilateral piece, that it really does involve all those different states and agencies and and that we're recognizing where the pressures and impacts are going to come into play.

We have a complex system with with many state and federal agencies and different laws involved in determing who must report under what standard. So. Notwithstanding the the Accounting Standards Board has been very receptive to feedback about simplifying the models that are there. We've we've really had to get involved and invested quite heavily in helping the standard setter as well as different agencies and departments around the states and federally to make sure they're aware of the standards that are coming through and how that fits into their to their regulatory framework. And that's been largely quite successful that that approach of getting ahead of that which we really have been doing throughout the the process. But but I think it's fair to say there are exceptions and this can even change over time for particular entities. So we we remain vigilant. We again call for input from members. We deal with about four or 500 member queries and and sort of pieces of feedback in a year. And a lot of that is very useful to identify these types of issues and the pressures that that members are facing now that's in the for profit space it in the not for profit space coming up, it could be even more complex. So we we're working hard to get ahead of any actual exposure drafts or standards coming through to make sure that it's it's not just a sort of unilateral piece, that it really does involve all those different states and agencies and and that we're recognizing where the pressures and impacts are going to come into play.

Because, I mean, there would be people listening along that would be saying, great, you're asking for feedback. It appears that you're hearing our feedback. But then are the people who you pass on that feedback to as , the government organizations, those setting the regulations, are they listening to the issues that we are raising?

Because, I mean, there would be people listening along that would be saying, great, you're asking for feedback. It appears that you're hearing our feedback. But then are the people who you pass on that feedback to as , the government organizations, those setting the regulations, are they listening to the issues that we are raising?

I absolutely. I think the standards boards in Australia and New Zealand are listening and and receptive to the feedback. We can see that they've genuinely listened to the feedback when it came to the framework reform project in the, in the for profit space and in the not for profit space, you know significant simpler case simplification from where they started and and early on in that that NFP area. I think I summed up some of the feedback we had as whatever comes needs to be simpler than special purpose. And I put this to the Standards Board staff I guess as a challenge and I. They've actually responded with a well-received set of proposals that do dramatically simplify complex areas like lease accounting, financial instruments, income and others in a way that will make life easier for not for profits and their accountants so they can get on with what's more important.

I absolutely. I think the standards boards in Australia and New Zealand are listening and and receptive to the feedback. We can see that they've genuinely listened to the feedback when it came to the framework reform project in the, in the for profit space and in the not for profit space, you know significant simpler case simplification from where they started and and early on in that that NFP area. I think I summed up some of the feedback we had as whatever comes needs to be simpler than special purpose. And I put this to the Standards Board staff I guess as a challenge and I. They've actually responded with a well-received set of proposals that do dramatically simplify complex areas like lease accounting, financial instruments, income and others in a way that will make life easier for not for profits and their accountants so they can get on with what's more important.

I like that idea, making life easier. That's what everyone wants, is that not as they start a new year.

I like that idea, making life easier. That's what everyone wants, is that not as they start a new year.

But as I said, the real lift ahead is going to be making sure that the state and federal agencies and regulators adopt the right frameworks for the right entities, have the right thresholds in place. And we're actively working on this alongside the the standards set up.

But as I said, the real lift ahead is going to be making sure that the state and federal agencies and regulators adopt the right frameworks for the right entities, have the right thresholds in place. And we're actively working on this alongside the the standards set up.

So how are we helping practices and entities who are working in this space with these changes and with all the complexities that come with it, especially as things evolve and change fairly rapidly, really?

So how are we helping practices and entities who are working in this space with these changes and with all the complexities that come with it, especially as things evolve and change fairly rapidly, really?

Yeah. Look, I think we've got quite a range of, of resources, so the first place I'd recommend to go is our reporting in an Assurance Essentials guides, which come out every six months as well as our update webinars, which we've come to doing every six months now, which talk through all the main changes in around an hour of the next one's on February 2nd. Or if you're hearing this after that, you know all members can still access that as a recording.

Yeah. Look, I think we've got quite a range of, of resources, so the first place I'd recommend to go is our reporting in an Assurance Essentials guides, which come out every six months as well as our update webinars, which we've come to doing every six months now, which talk through all the main changes in around an hour of the next one's on February 2nd. Or if you're hearing this after that, you know all members can still access that as a recording.

Yeah, and we'll put links to those in the show notes to make sure that if you're listening along now, just go through to the description of the episode and you'll be able to click straight onto those either to register or to find the recording as Amir's mentioned.

Yeah, and we'll put links to those in the show notes to make sure that if you're listening along now, just go through to the description of the episode and you'll be able to click straight onto those either to register or to find the recording as Amir's mentioned.

And to stay up to date on a fortnightly basis and also access a whole other range of tools, webinars. And you can say what we're advocating on and the views that we're hearing and putting forward. I'd highly recommend subscribing to our free reporting and assurance news, which you can do on My CA , I know even when I was in practice that that newsletter was the place to go and we do try to curate and make it a really easy read and a way of staying up to date. Yeah. And we also do some, some specific pieces on challenging topics and work with the standards setters for example, we invested in some very comprehensive tools in the, in the pandemic to make sure members had what they needed to navigate this. And we now, you know more recently we've done some some work on some guidance on reporting and audit in uncertain times and in the current inflationary environment as well as a whole range of the other other different sort of rats and mice issues.

And to stay up to date on a fortnightly basis and also access a whole other range of tools, webinars. And you can say what we're advocating on and the views that we're hearing and putting forward. I'd highly recommend subscribing to our free reporting and assurance news, which you can do on My CA , I know even when I was in practice that that newsletter was the place to go and we do try to curate and make it a really easy read and a way of staying up to date. Yeah. And we also do some, some specific pieces on challenging topics and work with the standards setters for example, we invested in some very comprehensive tools in the, in the pandemic to make sure members had what they needed to navigate this. And we now, you know more recently we've done some some work on some guidance on reporting and audit in uncertain times and in the current inflationary environment as well as a whole range of the other other different sort of rats and mice issues.

Look, we are almost out of time because I don't want this to go on too long because you mean, I guess it is potentially a bit tiresome on the brain talking all this heavy stuff.

Look, we are almost out of time because I don't want this to go on too long because you mean, I guess it is potentially a bit tiresome on the brain talking all this heavy stuff.

How could you say that?

How could you say that?

Maybe I'll edit that out. Look, let's talk auditing before we run out of time. What has changed there? What's being rolled out now? It's 2023.

Maybe I'll edit that out. Look, let's talk auditing before we run out of time. What has changed there? What's being rolled out now? It's 2023.

So there's really two major pieces I'd point to the the new risk management ...quality management standard as well as the risk assessment standard. But let me focus on quality management because that's a really major change for practices from from December 202 a new standard applied for all audit and assurance firms. ISQM 1 with with local equivalents in Australia and New Zealand - it's a major update. And we really have invested heavily to provide resources for small and medium firms to be able to take on those new standards in a way that allows them to focus on audit quality. We have a comprehensive toolkit which was issued, you know, halfway through last year, and that provides illustrative examples as well as a comprehensive way of documenting a system of quality management.

So there's really two major pieces I'd point to the the new risk management ...quality management standard as well as the risk assessment standard. But let me focus on quality management because that's a really major change for practices from from December 202 a new standard applied for all audit and assurance firms. ISQM 1 with with local equivalents in Australia and New Zealand - it's a major update. And we really have invested heavily to provide resources for small and medium firms to be able to take on those new standards in a way that allows them to focus on audit quality. We have a comprehensive toolkit which was issued, you know, halfway through last year, and that provides illustrative examples as well as a comprehensive way of documenting a system of quality management.

Mm hmm. Mm hmm. And look, that's got me thinking. And how many people have been affected by this? How many how many practices or entities are we looking at that will be impacted by this change?

Mm hmm. Mm hmm. And look, that's got me thinking. And how many people have been affected by this? How many how many practices or entities are we looking at that will be impacted by this change?

I really talking thousands of practices. I mean, the lion's share of registered company auditors and in Australia and New Zealand, licensed and qualified owners are members of CA ANZ. That's that's north of 3200 on the latest figures. And then there's thousands of others doing other types of assurance engagements for for other areas, for other types of entities.

I really talking thousands of practices. I mean, the lion's share of registered company auditors and in Australia and New Zealand, licensed and qualified owners are members of CA ANZ. That's that's north of 3200 on the latest figures. And then there's thousands of others doing other types of assurance engagements for for other areas, for other types of entities.

So practices should have got this done already. If you've said it's coming at the end of last year, December 2022, would there be some who who haven't done it and now need to get on top of it?

So practices should have got this done already. If you've said it's coming at the end of last year, December 2022, would there be some who who haven't done it and now need to get on top of it?

Yes. So firms by now should have the system of quality management in place. And that means having conducted a risk assessment. And of course, our tool, an illustrative risk analysis, is available to help with this. It also means having the responses in place to mitigate those risks, which our toolkit also provides in terms of a set of policies. Now, if if firms haven't done that, they'd really want to get on with it. Technically, that that means they're not in compliance. But but having said that, don't , don't panic. Take a look at our quality management hub and I think you'll find everything there. And I'd hope with those resources it can actually be a helpful process to help, you know, give small, smaller and medium firms confidence in their risk management. At the end of the day, it's those running the practices and working the practices that are exposed. And the benefit of the approach in the new standards is it's a tailored approach, risk management, rather than all of the responses and controls being focused across the board, including things that are really more for for larger firms. So the opportunity is is here for those firms to simplify their systems and make them much more bespoke to what the risks that keep them up at night.

Yes. So firms by now should have the system of quality management in place. And that means having conducted a risk assessment. And of course, our tool, an illustrative risk analysis, is available to help with this. It also means having the responses in place to mitigate those risks, which our toolkit also provides in terms of a set of policies. Now, if if firms haven't done that, they'd really want to get on with it. Technically, that that means they're not in compliance. But but having said that, don't , don't panic. Take a look at our quality management hub and I think you'll find everything there. And I'd hope with those resources it can actually be a helpful process to help, you know, give small, smaller and medium firms confidence in their risk management. At the end of the day, it's those running the practices and working the practices that are exposed. And the benefit of the approach in the new standards is it's a tailored approach, risk management, rather than all of the responses and controls being focused across the board, including things that are really more for for larger firms. So the opportunity is is here for those firms to simplify their systems and make them much more bespoke to what the risks that keep them up at night.

Hmm. We will put links to to that as well, because we want you to be able to find the information at your fingertips if you haven't worked out where it might be on the CA ANZ website. Look, we're about to wrap up. So what does the rest of this year look like then under this new approach?

Hmm. We will put links to to that as well, because we want you to be able to find the information at your fingertips if you haven't worked out where it might be on the CA ANZ website. Look, we're about to wrap up. So what does the rest of this year look like then under this new approach?

Well, the next step is it's really going to be starting to operate your system of quality control and quality management, I should say, and and undertake an annual evaluation. So we've actually updated in December our tool kit to incorporate some monitoring and remediation tools with a similar sort of simple, tailored approach for SMPs to easily capture their quality findings and work out what the implications are for their system of of quality management.

Well, the next step is it's really going to be starting to operate your system of quality control and quality management, I should say, and and undertake an annual evaluation. So we've actually updated in December our tool kit to incorporate some monitoring and remediation tools with a similar sort of simple, tailored approach for SMPs to easily capture their quality findings and work out what the implications are for their system of of quality management.

We've covered a lot in a short amount of time. There will be a transcript so you can read along as well if you I'm thinking that we are moving too fast for you. That is all we have time for. If you want to find out more, as Amir has mentioned, we've developed a tool kit for small and medium sized practices. It is on our website. I will include a link in the show notes. Also, have you listened to the other episodes from season three, episode three has been very popular. It's on accountant's financing letters, there's also a useful episode on cyber security for SMPs, and one on the ATO changes to work from home deductions. Handy if any of your clients are starting a new job in the new year, follow the pod to find the episodes or click on the links I've put in the show notes for you. The podcast has an email, so feel free to get in touch: podcast@charteredaccountantsanz.com Let's start a conversation. Thank you Amir Ghandar for taking us through these complex topics on Small Firm, Big impact.

We've covered a lot in a short amount of time. There will be a transcript so you can read along as well if you I'm thinking that we are moving too fast for you. That is all we have time for. If you want to find out more, as Amir has mentioned, we've developed a tool kit for small and medium sized practices. It is on our website. I will include a link in the show notes. Also, have you listened to the other episodes from season three, episode three has been very popular. It's on accountant's financing letters, there's also a useful episode on cyber security for SMPs, and one on the ATO changes to work from home deductions. Handy if any of your clients are starting a new job in the new year, follow the pod to find the episodes or click on the links I've put in the show notes for you. The podcast has an email, so feel free to get in touch: podcast@charteredaccountantsanz.com Let's start a conversation. Thank you Amir Ghandar for taking us through these complex topics on Small Firm, Big impact.

Thanks for having me.

Thanks for having me.

Bye bye.

Bye bye.