Now, there's a backstory that I want to tell you that I often don't tell around how was it that Oprah found me? I got a call and the call was, " Hey, Paul, we've got this show." I said, " I've never seen it," They said, " Well, we're looking for a host. Can you come?" We looked at each other and my wife and I said, " Let's just go to London." She liquidated her retirement fund. She used that to invest in the business.

Now, there's a backstory that I want to tell you that I often don't tell around how was it that Oprah found me? I got a call and the call was, " Hey, Paul, we've got this show." I said, " I've never seen it," They said, " Well, we're looking for a host. Can you come?" We looked at each other and my wife and I said, " Let's just go to London." She liquidated her retirement fund. She used that to invest in the business.

She really likes you.

She really likes you.

I was like, " She actually does like me. Look at this."

I was like, " She actually does like me. Look at this."

This is Show on the Road, brought to you by Auto Trader. We are driving famous faces on a personalized road trip, visiting the places that help shape them and hearing how the locations turn them into who they are today. We've matched each celebrity with a car chosen specifically for them. Join me, Alex Legouix, as we get this Show on the Road. My guest today for he and his family, we're flying to the UK to move here just for three months, and they're still here now. It turns out it was the right move. Paul Brunson has very much cemented himself as world's most influential matchmaker. He's been co- hosting Celebs Go Dating and Married at First Sight and has most definitely made himself a very good name in the UK. Now, he is going to show me around London today. Taking me to some of the haunts which have transformed a very strange city into what is now his home. We've matched him with this 6. 2 liter V8 Twisted Defender. It's been Paul's dream car since he was little, apparently. In fact, he even has a Lego figure of it, so I'm very excited to see what he makes of the real thing. Here we go.

This is Show on the Road, brought to you by Auto Trader. We are driving famous faces on a personalized road trip, visiting the places that help shape them and hearing how the locations turn them into who they are today. We've matched each celebrity with a car chosen specifically for them. Join me, Alex Legouix, as we get this Show on the Road. My guest today for he and his family, we're flying to the UK to move here just for three months, and they're still here now. It turns out it was the right move. Paul Brunson has very much cemented himself as world's most influential matchmaker. He's been co- hosting Celebs Go Dating and Married at First Sight and has most definitely made himself a very good name in the UK. Now, he is going to show me around London today. Taking me to some of the haunts which have transformed a very strange city into what is now his home. We've matched him with this 6. 2 liter V8 Twisted Defender. It's been Paul's dream car since he was little, apparently. In fact, he even has a Lego figure of it, so I'm very excited to see what he makes of the real thing. Here we go.

It definitely sounds good. Look at it. Can I say, I've never been in one of these?

It definitely sounds good. Look at it. Can I say, I've never been in one of these?

No.

No.

No, no. I've never been in one. Oh my God. Let me take this in for a second, and you've got the soft top?

No, no. I've never been in one. Oh my God. Let me take this in for a second, and you've got the soft top?

Isn't it hot?

Isn't it hot?

Oh my God, this is incredible.

Oh my God, this is incredible.

How do you manage to work with doorale?

How do you manage to work with doorale?

Oh, you saw that? I had to look at that like, please, I hope I can open this door. All right, let me see. Wow, this is so... Have you driven one of these before?

Oh, you saw that? I had to look at that like, please, I hope I can open this door. All right, let me see. Wow, this is so... Have you driven one of these before?

No.

No.

Yeah, I love this.

Yeah, I love this.

Yeah.

Yeah.

This is like industrial. Ah, man, this is so incredible. Can I have this?

This is like industrial. Ah, man, this is so incredible. Can I have this?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Do I get this at the end?

Do I get this at the end?

Yeah, but we get to share it.

Yeah, but we get to share it.

Okay. We can share it. Do you want it on weekends or weekdays?

Okay. We can share it. Do you want it on weekends or weekdays?

Weekends please.

Weekends please.

Okay. All right, you got it.

Okay. All right, you got it.

What's your connection to the Defender?

What's your connection to the Defender?

This is going to sound the dumbest story ever. I have this Lego set.

This is going to sound the dumbest story ever. I have this Lego set.

Right.

Right.

It's a Defender Lego set.

It's a Defender Lego set.

As an adult.

As an adult.

As an adult.

As an adult.

Okay. All right.

Okay. All right.

No, it's something that I do with my boys. We built this Defender Lego set. I was like, this is my car. I think growing up in New York, we would always see the Lamborghini's and the Ferrari's go down the street and always think that that's the type of car that we should have. When you've made it, that's what you should have. But it wasn't until I built this Lego set where I said to myself, " This is it."

No, it's something that I do with my boys. We built this Defender Lego set. I was like, this is my car. I think growing up in New York, we would always see the Lamborghini's and the Ferrari's go down the street and always think that that's the type of car that we should have. When you've made it, that's what you should have. But it wasn't until I built this Lego set where I said to myself, " This is it."

Is it like a prized possession sitting on the mantle piece?

Is it like a prized possession sitting on the mantle piece?

It is. It's prized.

It is. It's prized.

Is it?

Is it?

It's forest green, it sits on the mantle piece. No one can touch it. It took us three days to build this thing. That's what set it off. Then I started really researching these vehicles and I love them.

It's forest green, it sits on the mantle piece. No one can touch it. It took us three days to build this thing. That's what set it off. Then I started really researching these vehicles and I love them.

It is proper cool, isn't it?

It is proper cool, isn't it?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Okay.

Okay.

We're off.

We're off.

You weren't expecting to stay in the UK, were you?

You weren't expecting to stay in the UK, were you?

No, not at all. Not at all. Now, I thought I would be here in the UK for three months, to be honest with you. Yeah, there was three months. This is in 2018, I got a call and the call was, " Hey Paul, we've got this show here called Celebs Go Dating." I said, " I've never seen it." They said, " Well, we're looking for a host, can you come?" I thought, " Ah, I don't know if I can come." My wife and I had plotted three months that we were going to go to Jamaica, so we were going to leave the states, go to Jamaica. It happened that the three months perfectly overlapped. We looked at each other, my wife and I said, " Let's just go to London." We ended up coming here. We spent time filming, but then also we traveled all throughout the UK, loved it. Went back and thought that would be it. Two weeks later we get a call. It's like, " Paul, the show's green lit again for another series." Just like that. Before it had even aired, it was green lit again for another series. The shoot date was within about two months, so we decided, okay, we'll come back again. We came back again. Said, we'll stay for another three months, it'll be great. We'll do all the things that we didn't do. We will eat fish and chips because we didn't eat fish and chips. We will have more gin because that's what everybody drinks. We stayed for another three months, left, went back to the states for about two months this time. Got another call, " Paul, it's green lit again." Then we came back for a third time. Then when we came back for a third time, I then got picked up from Married at First Sight after that. Then it's been this, Celebs Go Dating, Married at First Sight, Celebs Go Dating, Married at First Sight. We just decided we would stay. That was five years ago.

No, not at all. Not at all. Now, I thought I would be here in the UK for three months, to be honest with you. Yeah, there was three months. This is in 2018, I got a call and the call was, " Hey Paul, we've got this show here called Celebs Go Dating." I said, " I've never seen it." They said, " Well, we're looking for a host, can you come?" I thought, " Ah, I don't know if I can come." My wife and I had plotted three months that we were going to go to Jamaica, so we were going to leave the states, go to Jamaica. It happened that the three months perfectly overlapped. We looked at each other, my wife and I said, " Let's just go to London." We ended up coming here. We spent time filming, but then also we traveled all throughout the UK, loved it. Went back and thought that would be it. Two weeks later we get a call. It's like, " Paul, the show's green lit again for another series." Just like that. Before it had even aired, it was green lit again for another series. The shoot date was within about two months, so we decided, okay, we'll come back again. We came back again. Said, we'll stay for another three months, it'll be great. We'll do all the things that we didn't do. We will eat fish and chips because we didn't eat fish and chips. We will have more gin because that's what everybody drinks. We stayed for another three months, left, went back to the states for about two months this time. Got another call, " Paul, it's green lit again." Then we came back for a third time. Then when we came back for a third time, I then got picked up from Married at First Sight after that. Then it's been this, Celebs Go Dating, Married at First Sight, Celebs Go Dating, Married at First Sight. We just decided we would stay. That was five years ago.

In that time you've come over and there's been a global pandemic in the middle of it all.

In that time you've come over and there's been a global pandemic in the middle of it all.

Oh my God. Yeah. What is interesting, the pandemic was terrible, but the blessing in the pandemic is our family. We got an opportunity to stay. We were staying in basically like this hotel, so we had to stay almost in the same room, which would drive people crazy. But for us, it was a moment that I'll never forget because our family actually gelled. We became closer as a result of this. The pandemic. Side note, one of my favorite coffee shops.

Oh my God. Yeah. What is interesting, the pandemic was terrible, but the blessing in the pandemic is our family. We got an opportunity to stay. We were staying in basically like this hotel, so we had to stay almost in the same room, which would drive people crazy. But for us, it was a moment that I'll never forget because our family actually gelled. We became closer as a result of this. The pandemic. Side note, one of my favorite coffee shops.

Oh, this one? The Columbian Coffee Company.

Oh, this one? The Columbian Coffee Company.

Yeah, this one right here. The Columbia Coffee Company.

Yeah, this one right here. The Columbia Coffee Company.

That looks cool.

That looks cool.

Yeah, they do fair trade coffee. I didn't even know we were coming down here.

Yeah, they do fair trade coffee. I didn't even know we were coming down here.

This is a colorful part of town.

This is a colorful part of town.

This is what I love about London over New York, where I'm from. Is in London, I feel like everyone lives together. You'll have a council estate on one corner, and then right across the street is a 5 million pound home and they're both shopping at the same grocers on the corner. In the US we're very segregated. In New York, it's like all the Italians live here, all the Jamaicans live in this area, and we're separated. We're also separated socioeconomically too. But here everyone is like... There are other cities like London, but there is no London in the world. That's something that, yeah, we have to be thankful that we could be here.

This is what I love about London over New York, where I'm from. Is in London, I feel like everyone lives together. You'll have a council estate on one corner, and then right across the street is a 5 million pound home and they're both shopping at the same grocers on the corner. In the US we're very segregated. In New York, it's like all the Italians live here, all the Jamaicans live in this area, and we're separated. We're also separated socioeconomically too. But here everyone is like... There are other cities like London, but there is no London in the world. That's something that, yeah, we have to be thankful that we could be here.

What was little Paul like? Endearing.

What was little Paul like? Endearing.

I grew up in New York and grew up in Jamaica, Queens. It was very communal. It was basically all Jamaicans to the point where when I grew up, I thought America was Jamaica. Sports were very important. That's when I got to American football. I've played American football ever since I was little. Rugby, I think, is much more brutal than American football.

I grew up in New York and grew up in Jamaica, Queens. It was very communal. It was basically all Jamaicans to the point where when I grew up, I thought America was Jamaica. Sports were very important. That's when I got to American football. I've played American football ever since I was little. Rugby, I think, is much more brutal than American football.

Do you think?

Do you think?

Oh my god. You guys are doing it with no pads.

Oh my god. You guys are doing it with no pads.

Yeah, that's true.

Yeah, that's true.

I played American football, played soccer, and I was blessed. My parents were together. They stayed together. They were great parents. I had my grandparents. I had aunts and uncles. I had friends and family. Very loving environment. I felt like I could do anything.

I played American football, played soccer, and I was blessed. My parents were together. They stayed together. They were great parents. I had my grandparents. I had aunts and uncles. I had friends and family. Very loving environment. I felt like I could do anything.

When did matchmaking come into your world?

When did matchmaking come into your world?

Oh, man. Yeah, matchmaking was big Paul. My first career was in finance. I was an investment banker of all things. I was managing the investments for a very wealthy Turkish family. I was doing that in, this is like 2007. I always just say that I'm Jamaican, so I have 10 jobs always. I'm doing that. But one of my jobs is I had a nonprofit organization that provided tutoring services for low income household kids. Basically kids that were impoverished. We provided these services for free to these kids. One of these summer camps, I had 100 kids in the summer camp. One question I would ask is, when they were registering, is how many parents live in your household? Not one of 100 of these kids had two parents living in their household. All of them just lived with basically their mother or their grandmother or their aunt. Very few had male figures in their household. It got to the point where I was saying, okay, here we are, we're tutoring them on math or science. But what fundamentally is happening in the household, there's something missing in the household. The counselors would joke me and they would say, " Paul, why don't you just become Hitch and just hook up all the moms? Why don't you do that?" Because the movie Hitch had just come out. Come on. It was a great movie. I said, " That's the worst idea. It's crazy." A year later, I'm Hitch. Pretty much. I ended up quitting my job and I doubled down and I went back to school for social psychology and I did an apprenticeship.

Oh, man. Yeah, matchmaking was big Paul. My first career was in finance. I was an investment banker of all things. I was managing the investments for a very wealthy Turkish family. I was doing that in, this is like 2007. I always just say that I'm Jamaican, so I have 10 jobs always. I'm doing that. But one of my jobs is I had a nonprofit organization that provided tutoring services for low income household kids. Basically kids that were impoverished. We provided these services for free to these kids. One of these summer camps, I had 100 kids in the summer camp. One question I would ask is, when they were registering, is how many parents live in your household? Not one of 100 of these kids had two parents living in their household. All of them just lived with basically their mother or their grandmother or their aunt. Very few had male figures in their household. It got to the point where I was saying, okay, here we are, we're tutoring them on math or science. But what fundamentally is happening in the household, there's something missing in the household. The counselors would joke me and they would say, " Paul, why don't you just become Hitch and just hook up all the moms? Why don't you do that?" Because the movie Hitch had just come out. Come on. It was a great movie. I said, " That's the worst idea. It's crazy." A year later, I'm Hitch. Pretty much. I ended up quitting my job and I doubled down and I went back to school for social psychology and I did an apprenticeship.

You just gave up your finance career.

You just gave up your finance career.

Yeah. But I gave it up because I found something I was more passionate about. I'm definitely a dreamer. I just moved here to London. I like moving off of feeling. Myers- Briggs, I'm a feeler. I like just moving off of how I feel and I felt alive. There's this one quote of, don't do what you think you're supposed to do in terms of careers, do what makes you come alive. It just made me come alive. I spent a year studying and then properly started matchmaking a year later, unconventionally. Oprah definitely changed my life. She definitely changed my life.

Yeah. But I gave it up because I found something I was more passionate about. I'm definitely a dreamer. I just moved here to London. I like moving off of feeling. Myers- Briggs, I'm a feeler. I like just moving off of how I feel and I felt alive. There's this one quote of, don't do what you think you're supposed to do in terms of careers, do what makes you come alive. It just made me come alive. I spent a year studying and then properly started matchmaking a year later, unconventionally. Oprah definitely changed my life. She definitely changed my life.

That sentence in itself is a pretty cool one to have in your story.

That sentence in itself is a pretty cool one to have in your story.

To be able to say Oprah changed my life?

To be able to say Oprah changed my life?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah. I've a lot of cool Oprah stories. But I think the most significant one is, when I started my matchmaking, this matchmaking business, which by the way, it wasn't mine. My wife liquidated her retirement fund. She was working for a law firm. She liquidated her retirement fund. She used that to invest in the business.

Yeah. I've a lot of cool Oprah stories. But I think the most significant one is, when I started my matchmaking, this matchmaking business, which by the way, it wasn't mine. My wife liquidated her retirement fund. She was working for a law firm. She liquidated her retirement fund. She used that to invest in the business.

She really likes you.

She really likes you.

I was like, she actually does me, look at this. She liquidates that. She gives the money over. I invest the money into this business and basically a year goes by and I've really nothing to show for it. I said, okay, what I'm going to do is I'm going to start creating YouTube videos. Now I know you're probably thinking what? You have a little bit of money left, you're going to do YouTube videos? I said, " No, I'm going to do YouTube videos because if I can express myself and tell the world what it is I'm doing, I can then convert those people into clients for a matchmaking business." I started this YouTube series called The Modern Day Matchmaker. You could go to YouTube right now and you will see there's nobody who's watched this thing.

I was like, she actually does me, look at this. She liquidates that. She gives the money over. I invest the money into this business and basically a year goes by and I've really nothing to show for it. I said, okay, what I'm going to do is I'm going to start creating YouTube videos. Now I know you're probably thinking what? You have a little bit of money left, you're going to do YouTube videos? I said, " No, I'm going to do YouTube videos because if I can express myself and tell the world what it is I'm doing, I can then convert those people into clients for a matchmaking business." I started this YouTube series called The Modern Day Matchmaker. You could go to YouTube right now and you will see there's nobody who's watched this thing.

Still?

Still?

Still, nobody. I should just sit and watch it now. But nobody's watched this thing. Every week we would put out this video and it would get 11 views. I knew my mom was watching nine times. It was like nobody really was watching this. It was one or two people watching. It turned out Oprah was one of the people watching. She then eventually gives me a job to co- host a television show with her. I had zero TV experience. I never ever thought I would be on television. She just picks me up and I co- host a show with her. Now, there's a backstory that I want to tell you that I often don't tell around how was it that Oprah found me. Remember I said I spent a year working on the business, didn't have anything to show for it. That year, you know what I was doing? I was doing free services. I was taking on clients for free, working my ass off. Working very hard for them. Sometimes I would get results, sometimes I wouldn't. But I was always transparent with them and I would say, " I'm going to work hard for you. I may not get what you want, but I will work hard for you." I did that with maybe say 30 to 40 clients over the year. It turns out, and I didn't find this out until much later. It turns out that one of the people I had offered those free services to was a writer for O Magazine. She then later was on Oprah's jet, on her private plane. Oprah was talking openly about, she had an idea for a new television show that she wanted to do around love. She asks everyone on the plane, she says, " Does anyone have any fresh voices, any new voices in relationships or in love?" This woman says, " Yeah, have you heard of Paul Brunson?" Oprah's like, " No, I haven't heard of Paul Brunson." They said, " Let's go find him." They go online to YouTube, they pull up the video, she starts watching the Modern Day Matchmaker. The reason why I think that's such an important story is because one, it goes to show that when you are providing a service or you're providing a product, you have to provide it at the highest level and not seek the immediate reward or the immediate return. I had 11 views. Oprah was one of them. I didn't need to have a million views on this video to get a project that would then change my life.

Still, nobody. I should just sit and watch it now. But nobody's watched this thing. Every week we would put out this video and it would get 11 views. I knew my mom was watching nine times. It was like nobody really was watching this. It was one or two people watching. It turned out Oprah was one of the people watching. She then eventually gives me a job to co- host a television show with her. I had zero TV experience. I never ever thought I would be on television. She just picks me up and I co- host a show with her. Now, there's a backstory that I want to tell you that I often don't tell around how was it that Oprah found me. Remember I said I spent a year working on the business, didn't have anything to show for it. That year, you know what I was doing? I was doing free services. I was taking on clients for free, working my ass off. Working very hard for them. Sometimes I would get results, sometimes I wouldn't. But I was always transparent with them and I would say, " I'm going to work hard for you. I may not get what you want, but I will work hard for you." I did that with maybe say 30 to 40 clients over the year. It turns out, and I didn't find this out until much later. It turns out that one of the people I had offered those free services to was a writer for O Magazine. She then later was on Oprah's jet, on her private plane. Oprah was talking openly about, she had an idea for a new television show that she wanted to do around love. She asks everyone on the plane, she says, " Does anyone have any fresh voices, any new voices in relationships or in love?" This woman says, " Yeah, have you heard of Paul Brunson?" Oprah's like, " No, I haven't heard of Paul Brunson." They said, " Let's go find him." They go online to YouTube, they pull up the video, she starts watching the Modern Day Matchmaker. The reason why I think that's such an important story is because one, it goes to show that when you are providing a service or you're providing a product, you have to provide it at the highest level and not seek the immediate reward or the immediate return. I had 11 views. Oprah was one of them. I didn't need to have a million views on this video to get a project that would then change my life.

Yeah, that's amazing, isn't it? What year was that?

Yeah, that's amazing, isn't it? What year was that?

2008 is when we launched the matchmaking business. 2008 to 2009, I had started it. My show was on air by 2010 with Oprah. It's one of those where I think that you always have to check back as to why are you doing the thing? Because if you're doing the thing for likes and for views, then okay, then you should take it down because that's what you're doing it for. But if you're doing it to inform. If you're doing it to help transform people's thoughts, then continue to do that, no matter if you're helping one or 1000 or one million people.

2008 is when we launched the matchmaking business. 2008 to 2009, I had started it. My show was on air by 2010 with Oprah. It's one of those where I think that you always have to check back as to why are you doing the thing? Because if you're doing the thing for likes and for views, then okay, then you should take it down because that's what you're doing it for. But if you're doing it to inform. If you're doing it to help transform people's thoughts, then continue to do that, no matter if you're helping one or 1000 or one million people.

Yeah, I agree. Tell me more about Oprah. She watched your YouTube video and then what?

Yeah, I agree. Tell me more about Oprah. She watched your YouTube video and then what?

She watched several of the YouTube videos, and then she had-

She watched several of the YouTube videos, and then she had-

You were like, whoa, 12. We've reached a peak. Oh my God, darling, come in here. Look.

You were like, whoa, 12. We've reached a peak. Oh my God, darling, come in here. Look.

No, actually I would call up my friends. Did you watch? No. Did you watch? No. Oh my gosh, that means someone who doesn't know us watched the video.

No, actually I would call up my friends. Did you watch? No. Did you watch? No. Oh my gosh, that means someone who doesn't know us watched the video.

We got viral.

We got viral.

Oh, man. But what happened was kind of wild because Facebook had just really become a thing. I got an inbox message on Facebook, I'll never forget it, from a woman named Jennifer Duck. The message was, hey Paul, my name is Jennifer Duck. I work for the Oprah Winfrey Network. I was like, delete.

Oh, man. But what happened was kind of wild because Facebook had just really become a thing. I got an inbox message on Facebook, I'll never forget it, from a woman named Jennifer Duck. The message was, hey Paul, my name is Jennifer Duck. I work for the Oprah Winfrey Network. I was like, delete.

Yes, spam. What are you trying to sell me?

Yes, spam. What are you trying to sell me?

I deleted it. She said to me-

I deleted it. She said to me-

Did you actually?

Did you actually?

No, for real. I deleted it. Because that was also when people were attaching weird stuff and spamming. I deleted it. I got another message maybe a day or two later.

No, for real. I deleted it. Because that was also when people were attaching weird stuff and spamming. I deleted it. I got another message maybe a day or two later.

Oh my God, persistent.

Oh my God, persistent.

I read the whole thing. Because I thought, okay, let me read this. I thought, I don't know, it seems like a joke. Maybe it's one of my friends playing a joke on me. I'm not going to let them get the best of me. She sends me another message maybe a week later, and it's like, Paul, this is Jennifer Duck. I work for Oprah Winfrey. We would like to bring you out to LA. We want to talk to you about a project. I was like, all right. If you could really do this, if this is really you, buy me the ticket. But I messaged back, we exchanged a few more emails, and they flew me out to LA. When they flew me out to LA, I went to the Oprah Winfrey office. Oprah Winfrey network office. I'll never forget because they told me ahead of time Oprah would not be in the meeting. But I knew we were in her office. I still got there early and tried to walk around the office. I went to this meeting and it was with Sherry Salada, who was the co- CEO of the network. On the spot, they offered me a television show.

I read the whole thing. Because I thought, okay, let me read this. I thought, I don't know, it seems like a joke. Maybe it's one of my friends playing a joke on me. I'm not going to let them get the best of me. She sends me another message maybe a week later, and it's like, Paul, this is Jennifer Duck. I work for Oprah Winfrey. We would like to bring you out to LA. We want to talk to you about a project. I was like, all right. If you could really do this, if this is really you, buy me the ticket. But I messaged back, we exchanged a few more emails, and they flew me out to LA. When they flew me out to LA, I went to the Oprah Winfrey office. Oprah Winfrey network office. I'll never forget because they told me ahead of time Oprah would not be in the meeting. But I knew we were in her office. I still got there early and tried to walk around the office. I went to this meeting and it was with Sherry Salada, who was the co- CEO of the network. On the spot, they offered me a television show.

Oh my God.

Oh my God.

With Oprah, on the spot. I went back home to DC and I was was telling my friends and family, " Sit down. You're not going to believe this. Oprah Winfrey just offered me a show to co- host with her." Everyone's like, " Yeah, you're lying." It was like, " You're not telling the truth." I was like, " No, I'm serious. This is really a thing." Long story short, we started filming at the end of the year.

With Oprah, on the spot. I went back home to DC and I was was telling my friends and family, " Sit down. You're not going to believe this. Oprah Winfrey just offered me a show to co- host with her." Everyone's like, " Yeah, you're lying." It was like, " You're not telling the truth." I was like, " No, I'm serious. This is really a thing." Long story short, we started filming at the end of the year.

Yeah, you must've learned so much from her.

Yeah, you must've learned so much from her.

Oh, man. Everything. Yeah. She was incredible. Also, my wife loved her, but she has the best Oprah story, I think, on the planet.

Oh, man. Everything. Yeah. She was incredible. Also, my wife loved her, but she has the best Oprah story, I think, on the planet.

Better than yours?

Better than yours?

At the end of filming this show, we had this big ball and my wife came in from Washington DC and she was going to be meeting Oprah for the first time. She was all super excited. My wife had this beautiful black sequence dress on for the ball. I said, " All right, Jill, come on. We'll go into Oprah's dressing room early. You'll meet her." Oprah has the same black-

At the end of filming this show, we had this big ball and my wife came in from Washington DC and she was going to be meeting Oprah for the first time. She was all super excited. My wife had this beautiful black sequence dress on for the ball. I said, " All right, Jill, come on. We'll go into Oprah's dressing room early. You'll meet her." Oprah has the same black-

No, she doesn't.

No, she doesn't.

The same black dress on.

The same black dress on.

No.

No.

Black sequins, the same dress. They're admiring each other's dress. Oprah says, " All right, well we better get ready to go." Oprah, like an auntie, " Come on, give me a hug." Oprah and Jill hug and they try to move, they are stuck. Their sequins has intertwined. Oprah's assistants are trying to unhinge her. Bodyguards coming out, trying to unhinge. They can't unhinge the dresses. My wife, who's super nervous to meet Oprah, is now stuck to Oprah, and her arm is literally on Oprah's back. She was like, " I was trying to think of something to say. I didn't know what to say." She rubs Oprah's back and says, " Oprah, you have the softest back of anyone I've ever met in my life." I was like, "a Soft back?" She's like, " but she does. Her back is so soft."

Black sequins, the same dress. They're admiring each other's dress. Oprah says, " All right, well we better get ready to go." Oprah, like an auntie, " Come on, give me a hug." Oprah and Jill hug and they try to move, they are stuck. Their sequins has intertwined. Oprah's assistants are trying to unhinge her. Bodyguards coming out, trying to unhinge. They can't unhinge the dresses. My wife, who's super nervous to meet Oprah, is now stuck to Oprah, and her arm is literally on Oprah's back. She was like, " I was trying to think of something to say. I didn't know what to say." She rubs Oprah's back and says, " Oprah, you have the softest back of anyone I've ever met in my life." I was like, "a Soft back?" She's like, " but she does. Her back is so soft."

Oh my God. How did they de sequin?

Oh my God. How did they de sequin?

They had people. Oprah has people come in one by one, unhook. It probably took 10 minutes to do the whole thing.

They had people. Oprah has people come in one by one, unhook. It probably took 10 minutes to do the whole thing.

Oh, my God. That's wild. What a great story.

Oh, my God. That's wild. What a great story.

Oh, man.

Oh, man.

Geez.

Geez.

I know this journey we're on right now.

I know this journey we're on right now.

Right. Because-

Right. Because-

I know this journey.

I know this journey.

Anywhere.

Anywhere.

I would take this journey home every day, because this is where I used to live. You're talking about COVID. This is where I lived.

I would take this journey home every day, because this is where I used to live. You're talking about COVID. This is where I lived.

It's called-

It's called-

Three Quays.

Three Quays.

Cheval Three Quays.

Cheval Three Quays.

Yes. This particular place is super, super special to me and actually super special to my family. Because not only was it our first introduction to London and to the UK, but because we stayed here during COVID, we literally spent about a year-

Yes. This particular place is super, super special to me and actually super special to my family. Because not only was it our first introduction to London and to the UK, but because we stayed here during COVID, we literally spent about a year-

In one room.

In one room.

In one room. Yeah, it was serious. It was hardcore.

In one room. Yeah, it was serious. It was hardcore.

It's really good that it brought you guys closer. Probably you formed valuable memories that you may not have ever had the chance to do if you weren't pushed together in the same way.

It's really good that it brought you guys closer. Probably you formed valuable memories that you may not have ever had the chance to do if you weren't pushed together in the same way.

Oh, my gosh. We had a whole regimen of, okay, we're going to wake up, we're going to do Joe Wicks, we're going to get that done. Then what we're going to do is we're going to read for a little bit. Then what we're going to do is we're going to watch a movie together. Then remember, during the early days of COVID, you could all take a break at a certain time? You could go outside. We'll all go outside at a certain time.

Oh, my gosh. We had a whole regimen of, okay, we're going to wake up, we're going to do Joe Wicks, we're going to get that done. Then what we're going to do is we're going to read for a little bit. Then what we're going to do is we're going to watch a movie together. Then remember, during the early days of COVID, you could all take a break at a certain time? You could go outside. We'll all go outside at a certain time.

What does this represent to you now?

What does this represent to you now?

When the book is written on my life, this is a full chapter of my life right here. It's not a page, it's not a paragraph. This is a full chapter right here.

When the book is written on my life, this is a full chapter of my life right here. It's not a page, it's not a paragraph. This is a full chapter right here.

Have there been parts of British culture, I guess, that you've really loved and adopted?

Have there been parts of British culture, I guess, that you've really loved and adopted?

Yeah, I love South London. I love the diversity. The culture of South London. Where we live is the most diverse area with the population over one million people in the world. There's 200 languages spoken in the area that we are in South London. You get every bit of culture with those languages. Everything. Wow, good play. Good play.

Yeah, I love South London. I love the diversity. The culture of South London. Where we live is the most diverse area with the population over one million people in the world. There's 200 languages spoken in the area that we are in South London. You get every bit of culture with those languages. Everything. Wow, good play. Good play.

Oh, wow.

Oh, wow.

Yeah, you get the music, you get the art, you get the fashion, you get the food for sure. The food is incredible. I'm obsessed with it. I'm obsessed with it. I love it. For me, growing up in New York where the corner shops, there are so many people, they never even remembered your name. Whereas in this little village area that we're in, everyone knows our name. I have left my phone to be able to pay, and they're like, " Oh, whatever. Pay me whenever." Come back whenever. Those kinds of traditional old school, that does not exist where I'm from.

Yeah, you get the music, you get the art, you get the fashion, you get the food for sure. The food is incredible. I'm obsessed with it. I'm obsessed with it. I love it. For me, growing up in New York where the corner shops, there are so many people, they never even remembered your name. Whereas in this little village area that we're in, everyone knows our name. I have left my phone to be able to pay, and they're like, " Oh, whatever. Pay me whenever." Come back whenever. Those kinds of traditional old school, that does not exist where I'm from.

Yeah. Wow.

Yeah. Wow.

Yeah, this looks familiar.

Yeah, this looks familiar.

Looks familiar.

Looks familiar.

Because I would go from Cheval Three Quays to right over here. This would be the Celebs Go Dating agency.

Because I would go from Cheval Three Quays to right over here. This would be the Celebs Go Dating agency.

Which has been basically your home, right?

Which has been basically your home, right?

Yeah. You know what's wild is, we're getting ready to start filming. They're probably working on it right now. They should be working on it right now.

Yeah. You know what's wild is, we're getting ready to start filming. They're probably working on it right now. They should be working on it right now.

Are they?

Are they?

Yeah.

Yeah.

What would they be doing right now?

What would they be doing right now?

Well, right now they're rigging up the cameras. Because what a lot of people also don't realize is, we don't have a camera crew inside.

Well, right now they're rigging up the cameras. Because what a lot of people also don't realize is, we don't have a camera crew inside.

Oh.

Oh.

Yeah, there's no camera crew inside.

Yeah, there's no camera crew inside.

I see sort of big brother style.

I see sort of big brother style.

That's big brother style. We have, depends on the series, but we have say dozens and dozens and dozens of cameras rigged all through the agency.

That's big brother style. We have, depends on the series, but we have say dozens and dozens and dozens of cameras rigged all through the agency.

Oh, wow.

Oh, wow.

The moment that the celeb walks into the agency, to the moment that they walk out, they're just being caught on these cameras. It allows them to really forget that there is anyone watching and step into who they actually are. Kind of like what you're doing here.

The moment that the celeb walks into the agency, to the moment that they walk out, they're just being caught on these cameras. It allows them to really forget that there is anyone watching and step into who they actually are. Kind of like what you're doing here.

That's really interesting. I guess ultimately, while it's a celebrity reality show, you still want to... Actually, it's a congruent show, isn't it? You still want it to be real.

That's really interesting. I guess ultimately, while it's a celebrity reality show, you still want to... Actually, it's a congruent show, isn't it? You still want it to be real.

Yes.

Yes.

It's not a showman, let's all be fake in front of the cameras, right?

It's not a showman, let's all be fake in front of the cameras, right?

We're trying to strike that balance. We're trying to strike the, okay, the agency, this is real. What's happening in here is 100% real. What you see in terms of the entertainment, like with Rob Beckett on the voiceover, that's entertaining. You get some voyeurism with them on the dates. Sure the celebs have fun. But hopefully you get all of that. That's the idea.

We're trying to strike that balance. We're trying to strike the, okay, the agency, this is real. What's happening in here is 100% real. What you see in terms of the entertainment, like with Rob Beckett on the voiceover, that's entertaining. You get some voyeurism with them on the dates. Sure the celebs have fun. But hopefully you get all of that. That's the idea.

That's really interesting. That is a balance that definitely is apparent. When you very first started, was it what you expected? Did you enjoy it instantly?

That's really interesting. That is a balance that definitely is apparent. When you very first started, was it what you expected? Did you enjoy it instantly?

One thing I do is, whatever project I'm on, I don't watch that project. For Celebs Go Dating, I remember the producer said, " Hey Paul, we want you to watch a couple of episodes and see if this is something that you'd like to do." I thought, I'll just do it. Three months in London, I'll just do it. When I got here, I had no idea what to expect. I had no expectation. Therefore I wasn't disappointed because I had no expectation. It's the same with Married at First Sight. With Married at First Sight, UK, everyone says, " Paul, did you watch Australia or did you watch the US version?" " No, I don't." It's only the UK format. Celebs didn't disappoint because I really didn't have the expectation.

One thing I do is, whatever project I'm on, I don't watch that project. For Celebs Go Dating, I remember the producer said, " Hey Paul, we want you to watch a couple of episodes and see if this is something that you'd like to do." I thought, I'll just do it. Three months in London, I'll just do it. When I got here, I had no idea what to expect. I had no expectation. Therefore I wasn't disappointed because I had no expectation. It's the same with Married at First Sight. With Married at First Sight, UK, everyone says, " Paul, did you watch Australia or did you watch the US version?" " No, I don't." It's only the UK format. Celebs didn't disappoint because I really didn't have the expectation.

Did you just do the same thing with the celebrities? Because I guess it's hard not to have preconceived ideas about certain celebrities that are going to walk in through the door as well.

Did you just do the same thing with the celebrities? Because I guess it's hard not to have preconceived ideas about certain celebrities that are going to walk in through the door as well.

I didn't know anyone. Even to this day, I just found out who the cast is for this upcoming one. I know no one. I think that's good because the celeb walks in. I have no preconceived notion of who they are. They're human to me.

I didn't know anyone. Even to this day, I just found out who the cast is for this upcoming one. I know no one. I think that's good because the celeb walks in. I have no preconceived notion of who they are. They're human to me.

Yeah, that's really good. Have any surprised you? I guess that's would be a yes for loads, right?

Yeah, that's really good. Have any surprised you? I guess that's would be a yes for loads, right?

Oh, man, yeah. Surprised me positively. Surprised me negatively. I think the show surprises them quite a bit. Because I feel, let's keep it real. They come on, they all get checks. Some of them get big checks. Then they land on a television show for probably two months, which is good for their career. You could think, okay, just from the business standpoint, it's a good move for some of them. But what I don't think that they truly expect is to be tested and to change. I think the best testament to that is probably Pete Wicks. He's someone who has, I think he's been on the show, I think he's been on seven series by now. I think he's been on probably two. But I think when he first got to Celebs Go Dating, he probably thought, oh, this is just whatever. Very quickly he realized, no, this could potentially change my life. To the point where I know the last time he was on, he had even asked, he wanted to be on. Because he enjoyed the experience. Therapy. Any range of therapy, whether it be a deeper psychotherapy. Whether it be a general counseling, it is beneficial. It is very helpful to express your emotions and have someone to express those with. A lot of celebrity, a lot of people just period, they don't have anyone to express their emotions. You think there's real power in expressing yourself. I think that's what the celebrities love about the agency. I think that what we have to understand is, I think that's also what's cool about creatives is that you see that we all have pain. I think that's the beauty. Even when it comes to television, I think that's what makes TV characters or a cast work. Is that when you can see yourself in that person. No matter how famous that person is, that you could still see yourself. Beyonce, one of the biggest artists in the world. She does these little things that just make people resonate. She's like, " Look in my purse, I've got hot sauce in my purse." " Like, what? You're Beyonce and you bringing hot sauce in your purse to the restaurant?" " Yep, that's what I do." All of a sudden you could resonate. You could say, now, I have never personally brought hot sauce in my purse. But you could still resonate with that. I think that's what makes us connect to these people, is being able to see us in them.

Oh, man, yeah. Surprised me positively. Surprised me negatively. I think the show surprises them quite a bit. Because I feel, let's keep it real. They come on, they all get checks. Some of them get big checks. Then they land on a television show for probably two months, which is good for their career. You could think, okay, just from the business standpoint, it's a good move for some of them. But what I don't think that they truly expect is to be tested and to change. I think the best testament to that is probably Pete Wicks. He's someone who has, I think he's been on the show, I think he's been on seven series by now. I think he's been on probably two. But I think when he first got to Celebs Go Dating, he probably thought, oh, this is just whatever. Very quickly he realized, no, this could potentially change my life. To the point where I know the last time he was on, he had even asked, he wanted to be on. Because he enjoyed the experience. Therapy. Any range of therapy, whether it be a deeper psychotherapy. Whether it be a general counseling, it is beneficial. It is very helpful to express your emotions and have someone to express those with. A lot of celebrity, a lot of people just period, they don't have anyone to express their emotions. You think there's real power in expressing yourself. I think that's what the celebrities love about the agency. I think that what we have to understand is, I think that's also what's cool about creatives is that you see that we all have pain. I think that's the beauty. Even when it comes to television, I think that's what makes TV characters or a cast work. Is that when you can see yourself in that person. No matter how famous that person is, that you could still see yourself. Beyonce, one of the biggest artists in the world. She does these little things that just make people resonate. She's like, " Look in my purse, I've got hot sauce in my purse." " Like, what? You're Beyonce and you bringing hot sauce in your purse to the restaurant?" " Yep, that's what I do." All of a sudden you could resonate. You could say, now, I have never personally brought hot sauce in my purse. But you could still resonate with that. I think that's what makes us connect to these people, is being able to see us in them.

Do you think that's what has made celebs Go Dating work so well as well? The audience can. They get to see a different side. They get to see a vulnerable side. They get to see that they're actual human beings that even struggle with things like relationships. They don't have it all. They don't have love. They don't have those things that we just assume your life is amazing, whatever.

Do you think that's what has made celebs Go Dating work so well as well? The audience can. They get to see a different side. They get to see a vulnerable side. They get to see that they're actual human beings that even struggle with things like relationships. They don't have it all. They don't have love. They don't have those things that we just assume your life is amazing, whatever.

Right. Yeah. I think that's definitely, that's the biggest part of the success. I think that in addition to, I always keep saying, man, Rob Beckett is the most hilarious dude on the planet. I think a lot of it I give him his props for. I think he does a lot of it. I think the celebs, seeing how quirky they really are. That's a lot of it. I always say with Tom, Anna and myself, we walk a line between reality and the real world. Because reality TV is not the real world. We're able to keep a foot in the real world and a foot in reality and keep that line straddled. Yeah, they have so much skill to be able to do that.

Right. Yeah. I think that's definitely, that's the biggest part of the success. I think that in addition to, I always keep saying, man, Rob Beckett is the most hilarious dude on the planet. I think a lot of it I give him his props for. I think he does a lot of it. I think the celebs, seeing how quirky they really are. That's a lot of it. I always say with Tom, Anna and myself, we walk a line between reality and the real world. Because reality TV is not the real world. We're able to keep a foot in the real world and a foot in reality and keep that line straddled. Yeah, they have so much skill to be able to do that.

What have you learned about yourself through it?

What have you learned about yourself through it?

Through that project?

Through that project?

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's funny, even though I'm in reality, I don't know if I'm the biggest fan of reality TV. But what I am a big fan of and what keeps me showing up on these projects is, how we teach through the projects. Like through the cast. We're teaching vicariously through them. I'll never forget, after my first series of Celebs Go Dating, I was walking somewhere in London and this guy walks up to me and was like, " Paul, I don't have a father. I don't have any male role models in my house. I appreciate what you say on Celebs Go Dating." I realized, wow, I'm the only the nearest thing to a male authority figure in this guy's life around relationships. I have to take this role responsibly. I have to take this very seriously. That's how I view it. I don't view it as I'm showing up to a reality show. I view it as, okay, I'm showing up to counselor. I'm showing up to teach.

It's funny, even though I'm in reality, I don't know if I'm the biggest fan of reality TV. But what I am a big fan of and what keeps me showing up on these projects is, how we teach through the projects. Like through the cast. We're teaching vicariously through them. I'll never forget, after my first series of Celebs Go Dating, I was walking somewhere in London and this guy walks up to me and was like, " Paul, I don't have a father. I don't have any male role models in my house. I appreciate what you say on Celebs Go Dating." I realized, wow, I'm the only the nearest thing to a male authority figure in this guy's life around relationships. I have to take this role responsibly. I have to take this very seriously. That's how I view it. I don't view it as I'm showing up to a reality show. I view it as, okay, I'm showing up to counselor. I'm showing up to teach.

How did Married at First Sight come about?

How did Married at First Sight come about?

That came about. I had done a few series of Celebs Go Dating, and they had reached out to me because they liked the authenticity that I brought to the project. They could see that I was very serious about the counseling side. I was offered the job to Marry at First Sight UK. Then believe it or not, COVID is what made Married at First Sight UK, hot.

That came about. I had done a few series of Celebs Go Dating, and they had reached out to me because they liked the authenticity that I brought to the project. They could see that I was very serious about the counseling side. I was offered the job to Marry at First Sight UK. Then believe it or not, COVID is what made Married at First Sight UK, hot.

Really?

Really?

Because Married at First Sight UK was, I think it was a very powerful show the way the old format. It was true docuseries. The couples never met. You followed them. Then the show aired and it always had respectable numbers on Channel four. COVID hits the channel. All channels are looking for content. What the channel does is, the channel then licenses Married at First Sight Australia. They license Australia. Everyone watches Married at First Sight Australia in the UK, it becomes a super hit. The production company here is like, " Hold on for a second. We're going to make our show just like this one." What we end up doing is we end up then including dinner parties and commitment ceremonies. Format changes that make it more like Australia. Then those tweaks make it a massive, massive hit.

Because Married at First Sight UK was, I think it was a very powerful show the way the old format. It was true docuseries. The couples never met. You followed them. Then the show aired and it always had respectable numbers on Channel four. COVID hits the channel. All channels are looking for content. What the channel does is, the channel then licenses Married at First Sight Australia. They license Australia. Everyone watches Married at First Sight Australia in the UK, it becomes a super hit. The production company here is like, " Hold on for a second. We're going to make our show just like this one." What we end up doing is we end up then including dinner parties and commitment ceremonies. Format changes that make it more like Australia. Then those tweaks make it a massive, massive hit.

Admiralty art.

Admiralty art.

Oh my God. It was right here, this exact spot, when my wife and I decided that we were going to raise our boys in the UK and move here. Right here. This was our first time coming into the UK. We had just arrived Heathrow. We're coming in this way to go to Cheval where you just took me.

Oh my God. It was right here, this exact spot, when my wife and I decided that we were going to raise our boys in the UK and move here. Right here. This was our first time coming into the UK. We had just arrived Heathrow. We're coming in this way to go to Cheval where you just took me.

No.

No.

Yes. On this side of the road, right here in this spot, there was a motorist. It was a Black motorist. He was pulled over. Police officer pulls him over. We're over here in this lane. When he gets pulled over, immediately my boys grab my phone and they hold it out and they start filming what's happening on this side of the road. The driver is like, " Why are you filming?" My boys say, and I tell him, I said, " This is what we do. You don't do this here?" In the US, there had been so many Black motorists that had been killed by police that what we would do is we would film to protect the motorists. My boys are filming. The white police officer walks over to the motorist, they exchange some words. We're wondering what is going to happen. Then the motorist smiles. He goes like this. Police officer high- fives him, and then they walk away. Now, that's not to say I know the UK's got issues. Every country has issues. Me driving in Washington DC, if a police officer were to pull me over, I remember I was pulled over in, I'll never forget this. We had taken a road trip to Nashville, Tennessee in the states. We had our two boys, but they were babies. They're in the backseat, my wife. A police officer pulls us over. I'll never forget. I was shaking. My hands were sweating. I told Jill, I said, " Keep the phone on just in case anything happens. If he tells me to get out the car, make sure that you turn." You should not in this day and age, nowhere in the world should you live in fear of being pulled over. You could understand when we saw that here-

Yes. On this side of the road, right here in this spot, there was a motorist. It was a Black motorist. He was pulled over. Police officer pulls him over. We're over here in this lane. When he gets pulled over, immediately my boys grab my phone and they hold it out and they start filming what's happening on this side of the road. The driver is like, " Why are you filming?" My boys say, and I tell him, I said, " This is what we do. You don't do this here?" In the US, there had been so many Black motorists that had been killed by police that what we would do is we would film to protect the motorists. My boys are filming. The white police officer walks over to the motorist, they exchange some words. We're wondering what is going to happen. Then the motorist smiles. He goes like this. Police officer high- fives him, and then they walk away. Now, that's not to say I know the UK's got issues. Every country has issues. Me driving in Washington DC, if a police officer were to pull me over, I remember I was pulled over in, I'll never forget this. We had taken a road trip to Nashville, Tennessee in the states. We had our two boys, but they were babies. They're in the backseat, my wife. A police officer pulls us over. I'll never forget. I was shaking. My hands were sweating. I told Jill, I said, " Keep the phone on just in case anything happens. If he tells me to get out the car, make sure that you turn." You should not in this day and age, nowhere in the world should you live in fear of being pulled over. You could understand when we saw that here-

Wow. The impact.

Wow. The impact.

Yeah. It looks like we're going to stay here.

Yeah. It looks like we're going to stay here.

Our final venue is Jamaica Party Company.

Our final venue is Jamaica Party Company.

Yes, man. Yes, man.

Yes, man. Yes, man.

Tell me about your Jamaican heritage.

Tell me about your Jamaican heritage.

My mother was born within the bush in Jamaica. My grandparents, obviously aunts, uncles, all Jamaican. I've been going to Jamaica since I was a little boy. It is home for me.

My mother was born within the bush in Jamaica. My grandparents, obviously aunts, uncles, all Jamaican. I've been going to Jamaica since I was a little boy. It is home for me.

Really?

Really?

Yes, it is home. I rep Jamaica strong. I love all Jamaican food. Jamaican Patty Co is one of my favorites because they make a high end patty. Matter of fact, the owner, Teresa, she was just appointed an ambassador from Jamaica.

Yes, it is home. I rep Jamaica strong. I love all Jamaican food. Jamaican Patty Co is one of my favorites because they make a high end patty. Matter of fact, the owner, Teresa, she was just appointed an ambassador from Jamaica.

Nice.

Nice.

Yeah, she's a cultural ambassador now.

Yeah, she's a cultural ambassador now.

Oh, that's nice.

Oh, that's nice.

Yeah. She's amazing. Her husband, because I go to Jamaican Patty Co all the time. Her husband taught me about the history of the patty, which I didn't know comes from Cornwall.

Yeah. She's amazing. Her husband, because I go to Jamaican Patty Co all the time. Her husband taught me about the history of the patty, which I didn't know comes from Cornwall.

Does it?

Does it?

Yeah. A lot of people don't know this.

Yeah. A lot of people don't know this.

No, I didn't know that.

No, I didn't know that.

Yet. The Jamaican patty comes from, what is it in Cornwall? Is it called the pasty or paste? Is it pasty, right?

Yet. The Jamaican patty comes from, what is it in Cornwall? Is it called the pasty or paste? Is it pasty, right?

Pasty.

Pasty.

Pastry.

Pastry.

It's pasty or pastry.

It's pasty or pastry.

Pasty.

Pasty.

Pasty.

Pasty.

The Pasty. What would happen, here's the story. In Cornwall, they were minors.

The Pasty. What would happen, here's the story. In Cornwall, they were minors.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Aluminum or bauxite, it was the number one natural resource in Jamaica. The UK would send these coal miners, or should I say these bauxite miners from Cornwall to Jamaica. While they're mining, they needed something to eat during the day so they'd have their pasty's. The Jamaicans got ahold of it, like we get ahold of everything and remixed it a little bit. That's what eventually became the patty.

Aluminum or bauxite, it was the number one natural resource in Jamaica. The UK would send these coal miners, or should I say these bauxite miners from Cornwall to Jamaica. While they're mining, they needed something to eat during the day so they'd have their pasty's. The Jamaicans got ahold of it, like we get ahold of everything and remixed it a little bit. That's what eventually became the patty.

Oh, wow.

Oh, wow.

Yes. You see the JPC?

Yes. You see the JPC?

Oh, yes.

Oh, yes.

Yeah. No, the patty's there are phenomenal.

Yeah. No, the patty's there are phenomenal.

You go to Jamaica a lot?

You go to Jamaica a lot?

A lot. A lot. I was just there actually now it's a while ago, but I was there in January.

A lot. A lot. I was just there actually now it's a while ago, but I was there in January.

Oh, wow.

Oh, wow.

At least once a year I go to Jamaica. Jamaica in my opinion, is on a per capita basis. It is the most influential country in the world. The reason why I say that is because there's only roughly two million people who live in Jamaica. There's probably another two million people who live outside of Jamaica. You have four million Jamaicans. That's not even London. But yet, anywhere you go in the world, when you start talking about Usain Bolt or Bob Marley, or you put on reggae music or whatever it may be, Jamaica resonates. It resonates with a smile. To the point where when sometimes when I travel, and I did this more so about five, six years ago, is I wouldn't say I was American. Because sometimes you jump in a taxi, you say you're American. It's like I say ugh. I say I'm Jamaican, and I tested the taxi. Sometimes I'll jump in. Now I'm like, I'm from the UK. Let's say I was in, where was I? I think the last I did this, I was in Barcelona. I jumped in and I said, "I'm from the UK." You know what the taxi driver did? He's like, he didn't even smile. He's like. Then I said, jumped into another one. " I'm from America, I'm from the US." Whatever. Jump in, " I'm from Jamaica." " Jamaica, man." There's a thing that comes with it.

At least once a year I go to Jamaica. Jamaica in my opinion, is on a per capita basis. It is the most influential country in the world. The reason why I say that is because there's only roughly two million people who live in Jamaica. There's probably another two million people who live outside of Jamaica. You have four million Jamaicans. That's not even London. But yet, anywhere you go in the world, when you start talking about Usain Bolt or Bob Marley, or you put on reggae music or whatever it may be, Jamaica resonates. It resonates with a smile. To the point where when sometimes when I travel, and I did this more so about five, six years ago, is I wouldn't say I was American. Because sometimes you jump in a taxi, you say you're American. It's like I say ugh. I say I'm Jamaican, and I tested the taxi. Sometimes I'll jump in. Now I'm like, I'm from the UK. Let's say I was in, where was I? I think the last I did this, I was in Barcelona. I jumped in and I said, "I'm from the UK." You know what the taxi driver did? He's like, he didn't even smile. He's like. Then I said, jumped into another one. " I'm from America, I'm from the US." Whatever. Jump in, " I'm from Jamaica." " Jamaica, man." There's a thing that comes with it.

That's so true. Yeah.

That's so true. Yeah.

Why is that? Is it because of Bob Marley and the likes of or?

Why is that? Is it because of Bob Marley and the likes of or?

It's all of it. It's the sun. It's knowing the pain that Jamaicans went through. It is the food. It's the vibrancy of the culture. Jamaica, just like the pasty, they've remixed the pasty. Everything in Jamaica is spicier.

It's all of it. It's the sun. It's knowing the pain that Jamaicans went through. It is the food. It's the vibrancy of the culture. Jamaica, just like the pasty, they've remixed the pasty. Everything in Jamaica is spicier.

They've remixed life.

They've remixed life.

They've remixed... You said it.

They've remixed... You said it.

Right. Okay, let's go and get a patty then.

Right. Okay, let's go and get a patty then.

Can we get one? Let's do it.

Can we get one? Let's do it.

Let's do it.

Let's do it.

You're going to love it.

You're going to love it.

Okay, this is exciting.

Okay, this is exciting.

You're going to love it. Let's eat in the car. That's a good place to eat. All right.

You're going to love it. Let's eat in the car. That's a good place to eat. All right.

Yes. I'm so excited.

Yes. I'm so excited.

There you go. Well, hold on. You're about to pull.

There you go. Well, hold on. You're about to pull.

Tear it. Only because I'm wearing a white top and I'm extraordinarily clumsy.

Tear it. Only because I'm wearing a white top and I'm extraordinarily clumsy.

Oh, but you can't tear though. That's not Jamaican style. You have to just eat it like this.

Oh, but you can't tear though. That's not Jamaican style. You have to just eat it like this.

Oh, okay.

Oh, okay.

Okay. But you can't spill any. All right, ready?

Okay. But you can't spill any. All right, ready?

Okay. Yeah. Oh, really good.

Okay. Yeah. Oh, really good.

That's really good.

That's really good.

I really enjoyed our chat.

I really enjoyed our chat.

Oh, I did too. I thought it was unintrusive and it was just like we just had a conversation, which was cool. While driving, which I've never done before.

Oh, I did too. I thought it was unintrusive and it was just like we just had a conversation, which was cool. While driving, which I've never done before.

Hang on. Whoa. You did not drive. I had to do that.

Hang on. Whoa. You did not drive. I had to do that.

But I helped you though.

But I helped you though.

Yeah, thank you.

Yeah, thank you.

No. But thank you though. This is really good.

No. But thank you though. This is really good.

Thank you too.

Thank you too.

Yeah, really good.

Yeah, really good.

Thanks so much to Paul Brunson for not only showing me around his adopted home city, but also treating me to a delicious Jamaican patty. You can see exclusive footage of the drive by heading to the Auto Trader socials. Look at the episode page for links. You'll also be able to see the Twisted Defender that Paul was so thrilled to be driven in. If you are looking for a new vehicle, you can find your perfect match at autotrader. co. uk. This is a new show and I'd love you to follow on your favorite podcast platform. Like what you hear? Rate and review, and make sure you tell your friends so you don't miss an episode. Show On the Road is a fresh air production for Auto Trader.

Thanks so much to Paul Brunson for not only showing me around his adopted home city, but also treating me to a delicious Jamaican patty. You can see exclusive footage of the drive by heading to the Auto Trader socials. Look at the episode page for links. You'll also be able to see the Twisted Defender that Paul was so thrilled to be driven in. If you are looking for a new vehicle, you can find your perfect match at autotrader. co. uk. This is a new show and I'd love you to follow on your favorite podcast platform. Like what you hear? Rate and review, and make sure you tell your friends so you don't miss an episode. Show On the Road is a fresh air production for Auto Trader.