Why has shoplifting, a seemingly minor crime, escalated in recent years? People are growing more desperate, more brazen - and the safety of store workers and bottom lines of businesses are at stake.

Dave Ross talks with Roger Goodman, who represents Kirkland and Redmond in the Washington state legislature, and Judge David Larson, a civil court judge in Federal Way. 

Rep. Goodman chairs the House Public Safety Committee, and Judge Larson deals with shoplifting theft convictions in his court on a regular basis. Having seen how the system works firsthand, they have some ideas, and opinions, about what will really work to stop repeat offenders.