No Hair, No Problem (Alopecia recap)

Published Aug 18, 2022, 7:00 AM

Do you have hair privilege? Cara and Tracy discuss theirs with the Red Table Talk community on this episode of Let’s Red Table That. They’re recapping the red hot Red Table Talk episode about alopecia with guests Kula Voncille and Jerrica Jackson. Kula lost her hair at age 15, but it all grew back years later thanks to her doctor discovering the underlying cause. Jerrica found a love of custom wigs because of her alopecia, and now she makes them for others.

Hosts Information:

Cara Pressley
@thecareercheerleader Cara’s Instagram
@TheCareerCheerleader Cara’s Facebook
@the1cheering4U Cara’s Twitter
@FeelinSuccessful Cara’s TikTok
Cara’s Website

Tracy T. Rowe
@tracytrowe Tracy’s Instagram
@troweandco Tracy’s Facebook
@tracytrowe Tracy’s Twitter
@tracytrowe Tracy’s TikTok
Tracy’s Website

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LET’S RED TABLE THAT is produced by Red Table Talk Podcasts. EXECUTIVE PRODUCERS Jada Pinkett Smith, Fallon Jethroe and Ellen Rakieten. PRODUCER Kyla Carneiro. ASSOCIATE PRODUCER Yolanda Chow. EDITORS AND AUDIO MIXERS Calvin Bailiff and Devin Donaghy. PHOTOGRAPHY Lee Salter Creative Firm. MUSIC from Epidemic Sound. LET’S RED TABLE THAT is in partnership with iHeartRadio.

Hey, y'all, Hey, what's up? And welcome to Let's Red Table that I'm Tracy t Rowe and I am Cala Pressley. What's going on in your world? Tracy? How are you feeling today? You know what I'm feeling every day? Amazing and i know you're feeling successful and I'm glad about it. I am so glad about it. Let me tell you this episode was This episode was definitely hot. The awareness for alopecia, the acceptance for alopecia, and the empowerment for alopecia. This episode was pivotal, I think to so many people turning the corner on understanding checking themselves in their own hair privilege. Hello, there's so many things we take for granted, and you think you don't have to worry about waking up, getting in the shower and having your hair falling out in the shower. People have to experience that. Jada experienced that and the trauma that's associated with that. It's sad that they're so little acceptance for people that are going through issues period, but especially with their hair. People are so dangle mean. They are mean and again not realizing even what it truly is. Some things are just not controllable. It may cause a lot of women people men to say, am I the problem? When it maybe their body attacking them? And these instances is what I'm really realizing. So it's so many things that are untapped, so many different variables that can contribute to alopecia, and they covered a good number of them on the episode. Let's talk about what alopecia is. Listen, Alopecia is an umbrella term for hair loss. Right there in that one sentence opens up the narrative to change it from just a woman thing or some type of shame thing, or it's just an umbrella, overarching term for hair loss. It can affect your scalp or your entire body. It can be temporary or it can be permanent. And there are three main types of alopecia with different causes and treatments, and we're going to dive into some of those deeper in today's episode. There was a super proud moment for me in the episode, and there was a super heartbreaking sad moment for me in the episode. This super heartbreak of course, real story. We gotta talk you story. Yeah, that was hard in general, and her mother we got to talk about that. We will be remiss if we didn't. And her birthday is right around this time, and so we just like to say happy heavenly birthday to Rio. Your light is still shining brightly, and the beacon that you started for understanding awareness and acceptance for alopecia patients lives on. Yes, and your story will change lives definitely will. One thing also that I know we tapped into it this episode. There was no cure for alopecia. There's no real cure for But I'm excited about today's guests because we do have a story of where her hair came back, so I'm interested to hear and have her share exactly what that was like and what that experience was like. And we had the super proud moment in the it wasn't in the episode that was an add on with the fantastic and beautiful first ever Sports illustrated baldy. Yes, yeah, that was beautiful. It's good to just see the evolution of these humans on the same planet that I live on. These two guests today were the epitome of taking what you have and literally making the most of it in the face of what could be a life altering, damaging adversity. Now you talk about proud, I'm proud of them, and that's love the people men and women who have had experiences or having experiences with alibisia. Our community is our backbone, and we've loved to hear from you. We've asked our community what does your hair mean to you? And here are some of your answers. One of our viewers said, there was a time when my soul called beauty was all too pendent on my hair. I know that's that struggle. Now at my age, after growth and experience, my hair speaks to my individuality and lifestyle. I would hate to think that someone is less confident or feels like an outcast because of having a condition. That's not the fault of theirs. I think we need to reevaluate our standards of beauty and redefine it in a more personal and organic way. That is from Diane Feeling Cook, and I appreciate her perspective because we definitely need to reevaluate standards. And I realized in my personal life journey, once someone shares what they've been through, people are a lot more empathetic. So it's really more about the storytellers. We gotta tell us story that's the truth. Our other community member, LaToya Ford said, people don't really know what going through alopecia is like I have had alopecia since sixteen. It started with the spot and by twenty one I was completely bald. My alopecia affects my whole body, not just my scalp. Took me till forty to embrace it. Why Toya, thank you so much for sharing that. Absolutely, thank you for those comments from our audience because they were dope. We're going to take a quick break, but when we get back, we'll be joined by two incredible guests from our Red Table Talk community. We're bringing to fellow RTT community members to let's red table back. That's right cool. A van sil is joining us today to share about her own journey with alopecia, which started when she was just fifteen years old when she found a small ball spot on her head. It grew bigger and bigger, which probably was just terrorizing. He don't know what to do with that, right, But she masked those spots with carefully planned shaved designs because she just cool like that, and also wigs for many years until cool at alopecia actually went away. So I love that part of her story and just how you know she transition. She loved it first and so I can't wait to hear more about how you were able to get your hair back and just hear about your whole experience altogether. Thank you for coming on Let's Red Table with that to share cool. Yes, thank you for the invite. I am super excited to people cool. We can't wait to hear about your journey and Jericho Jackson, Miss Jackson, if you're nasty, it's joining Let's Red Table that from Virginia Beach to share about her own alopecia journey. It started for her fifteen years ago when she discovered her first alopecia ariata spot. Since then, she's been on a path that started with avoidance of her hair loss, but has moved into acceptance and a newfound passion of wig styling and even creation. We are excited for you to be here with us today. We can't wait to hear about your journey and your weird creation. Come on here, Jericho, right hey, jack thank you, thank you, thank you for having me. I appreciate the opportunity to come share my experience and this journey. So we're gonna jump into it. This is our wait What segment. Okay, let's say it again part of the show. This is Wait What where we reveal which moments made us pause, rewind, and listen all over again. So one of the first moments, let's just jump into it, was Rio's mom saying that she was torn over reading her daughter's final letter because once she sees it, there will be nothing left to say. You know, I haven't seen the first one, and I'm really torn on that because no answer is going to be good enough. But also that's literally all she wrote. It was a very heavy part of the episode. Would you all wanna wait to Arena find a letter from a loved one? How did you feel? Watching that? Kind of leaves your speechless? I mean, I can definitely understand where she's coming from, being a parent and just knowing that his final, their final thoughts, their final everything. So I can't imagine how she feels, but I definitely understand probably just gives her something to hold on to. You know, I shared the story several times. I've lost my brother. I find myself still going back through the box of like his final things that I have know exactly what's in there. But the other day I realized he had signed his name on a piece of paper, so it was just like another, Oh, look that's him signing some right. I don't know, it just does something different, Yeah, it does something different. Wait, what number two in our list is when Dr Mina said, I have patients who significant others and their family members haven't seen their scalps and years because they have to hide it even at home. I'm not defering and not being able to show things what happens when you're in that space. That's definitely me. Okay, I don't know why I don't, but I just don't. My kids, I don't think they would matter. But I just think it's a comfort thing for me. I think it's either or, and this is a journey, so it's about comfortability. And I do feel like I'm on my journey to just go on all bald. I'm not there yet and it's just being comfortable, but I feel that I can. But that's just not what I'm going to do. One of the things that I love, first of all is a woman. We get a choice, but that's a black woman. You get to rock your hair anyway you choose, and I love that you can make a weird looks like you got a anchio hair, you got come down your back, you got curly, you got a straight. You can wear it however you want or none at all. And so that's the beauty of you being comfortable in your own skin. And so I appreciate and affirmed the fact that you don't want to share your scalp right now with your family members, and you get that choice. But it's coming though, It's coming. Oh I see it coming to you could tell yes, it's coming. Okay, so you're planning to do it or your level of comfort is increasing, because that's probably the only hairstyle that I haven't rocked that you call the hairstyle. Maybe it's a cup style, but that's the only thing thing that I have not done long, short, different colors, curly. That's still part of the journey as well, not saying that I'm gonna do it forever, but you're just's gonna be a time where I'm gonna go take pictures. It's gonna be my big thing that you know what I did it. This is completely me. I may change my week three times a day four times and she will, Okay, I've been like, when your hair down, your back off right, you look good. Don't know, it looks so good you forget. I find that refreshing because I'm the total opposite. Yeah, I don't feel comfortable with wigs. I've only had natural hair, and since I was like sixteen, I've never had straight hair. So when I do like plays or something and they want me to put a wig on, I'm just like, it's foreign to me. Another way, what moment for me was about men. I was diagnosed with alopecia and two thousand and twelve, and just like Jada, I lost all my hair in the shower. It felt like hair was in my hands, and I looked into the mirror and I'm gonna be honest with you. Tears started to roll down my cheeks and I started to question my worth, my value, my identity. Oftentimes people think of alopecia and they just think it's women, But what do you think about the episode and from their perspective for them being able to share their own journeys to my alopecia journey caused me to go to barbera school, Wow, and a lot of my clientele were older men who we're going through alopecia. So when I had to go to Barbara class, we learned about the different types of alopecia. And it's weird because alopecia is feminized, but when someone says of receiving Helline, we automatically think men, and we never equate that word alopecia to men. And it's weird because they're the most prevalent in the alopecia community. Is that they are they really are. That makes sense though, when it's get the horseshoe, when they get the thinning, and it starts early. Some start alopecia at eighteen. That just deal. They don't get the pleasures of trying a new hairstyle and trying locks or corn rolls, whatever. They just have to cut it off and just rock their baldy for life. It's expected of men not to be vain like that. Wow, we have so much that we can unpack with this episode, and especially since both of you have had your own personal journey with this. So what did you think of this episode and how did it connect with you. I think that it came to my aha moment or the moment that I said, it's not out of a jericha. People lose hair for all types of reasons. They lose it for cancer, burn victims. It just felt like there's some people who are not going to get it. But there has to be someone who is going through it. And you usually need to see someone because if everybody is wearing wigs and sometimes you just don't know. I'm the person that can take this and have the confidence for people who may not have and I will change it two or three times a day, change the color of the length of style, and for people to look and say, did she just change her hair? Yes, I did as she did, and it's okay. I want to say though, for both of you, you guys took what was in front of you and turned it into some beautiful Jericho. You decided, Hey, my journey is gonna be wigs cooler. You decided to say, I'm going to Barbara school cooler. I've known you with for short hair the ENTI our time, and in my mind, she just wants to rock your hair like she's just I was forced to be cool that part, and that's what I was gonna say. What made you tap into for both of you and find that piece of confidence when I think society said you don't have it or you should be this way. It was forced to be cool or trend setter before I really was ready to be a trendsettor. So the alopecia happened when I was fifteen. That natural hair journey wasn't popping in nineteen six. Hot top fade on a girl. That hot top fade on the girl with designs in the back was not common ever, so I, oh, that's the girl with the fade, or that's the girl with the designs. Oh, she cool, she confident, hence the name cooler. I've always been told I'm just cool, don't cool. Look, let me just make sure I heard one thing right. You have become cool love because you are cool? Yeah, because she was cool up than you, Yeah, cool, older than me. My real name is Andrea. Okay, come on here, cool Yeah, So everybody like, yo, you're so cool, you're so confident, you're so cool cool. It came about how at fifteen. Let's tap into that. Fifteen is such an age, right, Yeah, I don't want to know very quickly. If you can share, how in fifteen did you find the confidence? How did you get to be in that space where you were self affirming and so self aware. Okay, so at fifteen and had the little salt and pepper asymmetrical cut Jered Carroll jan The spot went from dime to like half dollar size. And it's weird because you don't see the hair thing out or go away. It's just disintegrates. You wake up one morning and there is a smooth bald spot. It's not fuzzy, it's no stubble. It's like acid. Just ate that spot and it's smooth. It is the baby's. But so that's one and my mom thought I had an anxiety thing going on picking that spot, not it. So the doctor found out I was a nemic. Basically, my body is saying yeah, yeah, I don't really need to go up there. We need to go to the eye in your body. So we're not gonna take it there. So here's my barber from my brother saying, oh, I could hook you up. At fifteen, dark skinned little girl in Chester, Virginia. I had to cut all her hair off and rock a wig until I had about four inch growth. And then that's what my barber hooked me up and made the designs out of the spots and I was rocking the most precise hot top fade ever. And because my barber took his time and made it so clean, I had to own it. I cried like a teenager would, trying to figure out the confidence. So I just ate the natural. And then when hip hop started to come out, big Daddy came, Kid didn't play. I had something to be line to. That made me feel a little bit more confident. And then I started my hip hop journey because I looked like those rappers, so alan not I think about it in hindsight, was a dope saving grace for me and helped me build confidence as a teenager. It made me go that route a barber school, and it also helped me fit in physically with my hip hop journey. So I don't know where I would actually be without alopecia. To be honest, it's part of your story. It is literally part of my story. Yeah, and it's a cooler story. I like it that was a quarter Jericho shoot out because I ain't like I need to talk of it a little bit. It's the ways for me exactly. I know your alopecia areata started when you were about fifteen, what was it like navigating high school? It was definitely like Okay, so I played basketball, rain track, I did long chop, triple shot put, discus, and it was you know, being underneath the post and you go for rebounding, somebody catches your hand until that being pulled old off. So you gotta shift the wig and it takes all your focus off the game, off the plane. All of a sudden, you're just insecure. You're focused on oh, snap, is the bobby pinning right? And so now you're not even focused on your plage. Then shot putting you have to like go in the circle and throw it. Sometimes that wig wanted to go to Okay, wait a minute, don't jump triple jump down in that dirt cooler. You were doing all of these super physical activities with a wig on. I thought, you're just running the full hundreds. No, because I couldn't. I can't run, I'm flat footed. But that's when I told my mom, I said, I can't do the wig. I'm scared. I'd rather deal with the ridiculee or not even ridiculee, the roasting of me being natural and having a face. I'm quick on my feet with a roast what are you getting roasted? Oh my god, come on, Tracy, and I don't know. Kids are cruel. Yeah, kids are kids in school? No more. You can't pay me go back sixteen seventeen. Now I'm trying to be cool, cool like sophomore doing you're in high school. It was more so of it just embracing what I can't control. That's what it was. It was embracing what I can't control. It was embarrassing. It was times when I would cry and it was no support. Groups won't even a word for it. You just literally felt like I was the only person that had alopecia until I became an adult, and then when I went to barber school I found out this was a real skin condition. In middle school, high school, I thought I was the only person that had this and I just had to own it. But playing sports, I couldn't do it. And Jericho, kudos to you for being ready on Johnny on the spot. So, honey, I couldn't do it. I did track as well, so I did shot. I did disc it. So as you were saying that, I just remember all the moments of that shift. It's like that air, you feel, that wind, you just hold up. Not now too much breeze, because you're building that centrifical force up. Yes, that dis the discs go that way and the we're gonna go that okay, listen. Gives me so much joy is to hear that you can recount this and you can laugh about and find something retrospectively that is humorous, because I'm sure at the time it was stressful and there were like high anxiety moments for you. Let's jump into the next part. Jada said in this episode that her reason for dedicating an episode of Red Table Talk to the alopecia community is that so many people who have it are suffering in silence and with the definition breakdown of alopecia just being hair loss and then cooler what you've shared with how these barbers are really saving lives out here with the camouflage of things, the people definitely are suffering more than we realized, and it is something that people deal with just in silence, while even the outside community doesn't have a lot of understanding about it. I'm hoping platforms like this bring that awareness to light. What has your experience been or have you experienced this feeling of isolation on your alopecia journey. I think cooler you tapped into it a little bit, feel free to tap in again. But Jericho as well, have you experienced that isolation? My suffering in silence is just how to fix it. I'm a fixed person, fix the situation. So what am I gonna do when you're younger? Maybe a little broke? He's just like, all right, you wear a ponytail, all right, half up, half down. I'm a fixed person. I think because of how I process things. It was okay, I can't do that, now what? And so that's basically it. I didn't stay and it too long. Of course you cry. Of course you want to wear braids again. I had people talk about, oh, you have horse hair. You know, I had the clap bag. It was fine. I'm the one for it, like I was the one who was ready for it. I will cry at home, and it is in silence because like it happens, and you may not actually know what's going on. You gotta go to school, you gotta go to work, you gotta go see people. You have to live with this. So it's really just that moment of okay, this is what it is. How do I fix it? And then you move on right, Well, it's the solutions for me. I can relate to that as well. I love the solutions too, and love that you took your braids down and you were like, you know what, here's my solution. I'm gonna wrap my head. And that's what I'm saying again, like women, we can tap into that African heritage and have head wraps and rocket with out there even being an issue. Just look natural and beautiful because that's who we are. Here's the thing that that the two points that I loved that each of you made for you. Cooler you're like I'm a rocket, and Jericho you're like, I got it and I'm gonna find a solution for it. It's like you took it and you had to cry about it, but then you said, Okay, now I'm white my tears and move on. And in the face of this alopecia, I'm still gonna be my best self. I really appreciate that, and I want to celebrate that for both of you. You app cooler. One of our guests on this Red Table Talk episode was Gina Knight, who developed alopecia after years of feeling connected to her Nigerian heritage only through her hair. Her story was so powerful. I was raised in private Forstica with a white family. Eleven months old and go to us my mother's soul. She could not do my hair. I always felt that my hair was problematic, and up until the age of eight, she used to shave off my hair, cut it really short. At the age of eight, I said, please, don't cut my hair again, please, And I started to learn how to do my own hair, and it just became such an important part of how I would connect with my Nigerian heritage. What does your hair mean to you? Considering you lost it for a long time and then got it back. I'm okay with different hairstyles because I'm gonna lose I'm gonna come back right in a different form, in different shape and a different rebranding. I guess you could say, come on, butterfly, Oh my gosh, that's so powerful. I can rack the locks or the low season with their part and I color it with an outline, and nobody could do that but me mean design, since got the best designs enrichment, A promise the waves. I was killing him with the waves last summer. Yeah, I'm saying, said I had him like kind of bunga dude. And my hair is my crown. I don't really need a metal one. I guess the alopecia has made me very aware of my hair and very proud of the foreseed, just being like it's mine and I'm gonna do whatever I want to and I'm a rocket any kind of ways. It was genuinely from a suffering kind of place and it's sprouted into something really beautiful. So my hair is everything. And I got the little gray in the back suit girl. A man had great hair but it fell out. It's my mama got the scumpe wig. This episode also got me thinking about the obstacles we come up against this Black women living in a predominantly white society as far as our hair is concerned, right, whether we keep it natural like cool little or rocket protective hairstyle like I do, people outside the black community often perceive us a certain way. I'm thankful for the protections we have now against hair discrimination thanks to the Crown Act and other laws that were passing twelve states now, so we got a little bit of ways to go. But years ago in my corporate job that that was not true. Jericho identify with you because I have had my hair in every wig style known a man and cooler, I'm with you. I have rocked a fade, I have had a low top, I have had color, I've done all kinds of stuff. So I'm like completely connected with both of you. But in my corporate environment job, when I broke out of the wig and had my natural hair, you will not believe. Oh it makes me mad just thinking about it now. I'm like, oh, because I couldn't say anything Corporate America, you got a total line. But I literally had a wig on one day and then the next day I was like, Ye're gonna go ahead and rock my own hair. I want you to know that. One of the officers in the company literally he said to me. I was like it when you get your other hair back, child, it would be the comments for me, not the other hair. When I say that for me, Like what? First of all, I was like the audacity number one, because at what point do you think it's appropriate for you, under any circumstances to speak to me about what I'm wearing on my head. And then because you're in a position of authority, you can say it and no one I can't say anything in response because at the time I wanted to say was something that would have got something bleeps right now? And so how have you navigated in jobs? When it comes to how you were your crown? I always have the first week, the first new job wigs, you know, black bob bob, something that's really nice and cute, but babe bad When I tell you I have worn electric blue hair like red hair like it definitely switches really quick. I try to keep it, but it's my personality. I used to match my clothes two weeks with my hairstyle. So if it was electric blue, that's just what it is. Like the nails some people ain't know who was coming to get cold? Who was that? But now go back to what you said though week one week was what it was natural color. It was straight and it was probably like a short bomb your bone straight and it was just like something very simple and natural. One one be yes, one bee and straight out of dream Girl wavy in there. You know what Wedden Wavey could have been too sassy week say she don't listen. It's the speotypes for me, the probation. But let that probation bery it pass ninety days. Baby, it's red men. Okay, So here's the thing. No one had to say to you, Jericho, you have to assimilate. No, at any point did anyone ever say you need to make sure you're hair is aligned with the European accepted style or did you just know I took that on. You know, when you get a job and I have read and that it says that it's about the hair, says need to be well groomed. It even tells you that it has to be a natural color that someone could grow on their own. To me, I didn't like that yet, that wasn't fair. But to me, you took album by color. Sometimes you read between the lines because at that point they can only put certain things. So that told me, okay, Jericho, come in, get a temperature check, coming with your straight, natural color brown hair, and just sat down and see how this goes. Because I definitely feel that energy. Yes, listen, it's not just that though. These are literally things like you said, you took that on literally things women carry with them all day long, like from hair and my job because my boss gonna look at me like this. Things we just carry. There's so many unspoken things I worked in the restaurant business. Did you ever have any issues with that? Cool up? Sometimes certain tables would be like about their hair. So here's the thing, and the restaurant business they called back in the day old school tips, they would call black tables Canadians because you never know if you had a table of Canadians, right, could you spot the Canadian out? Okay, so the term was in the restaurant low key, damn you know, sat me with the table for the Canadians. But I knew how they work on Canadians. They didn't care about my hair. They were also intrigued of how you get in a way with this with your hair. So I would take all the black tables and get the compliments. I would get the good tips. I know how to take care of mine. So you're telling me that Canadians was really Cannigros pretty much. Stop. So if there was an employee with blue hair shaved in the back that happened to be of a caucus ancestry, you can't really come for me with my natural hair growing out of my natural scout, with my natural color when she over there has blue hair, So like, you can't really write me up because to me, that's an hr issue I got. She definitely tread softly on that. They got to tread softly when it comes to me, when it comes to anything about that, it's a fine line to where it's harassment or you just you're discriminating and things like that. Just the people need to learn to leave people alone. Facts, mind your business, Mind your business. You truly don't know what people are going through. Like how you mad at how my hair grows out of my follicles. Literally literally, that's the real things. I worked in DC, the entire Obama administration, and when I first got the job, it was the air of you're gonna go to d C with those locks. I had just started my locks and people just could not believe it. So I've always too cools point of I've always been somewhat of an outsider. But at the same time, it's just my hair. I'm just starting locks. But two thousand and eight, I want to say, is one of the cusps of let's let our hair down, let's allow this to happen. I mean, who knew that in twent two weeks still be arguing about our hair at work and actually having it suddenly be allowed. I mean you think about twelve states, that's we have ways to go. Just recently, like within the last couple of weeks, I had one of my mentees call me because she had an interview, and she's like, Tracy, I have an interview Friday, but I'm supposed to get my hair braided on Wednesday. Should I wait and reschedule my appointment getting braids until after I had my interview? Or do you think it'll be okay? I was like, the fact that we even had to have that conversation in it was heartbreaking, but I was also grateful that she was aware to your point, Jericho, that you had the ninety day probationary hairstyle, that you know that so many things can be held against you. I would love for us to see that crown On Act moved throughout the entire United States because we have so many other bigger fish to fry, right, And also shout out to the news anchors who I see more and more wearing it, you know what I mean, just regular braids and natural styles. I'm like, come on news, that, come on weather, whatever they're doing on that. I'm just so excited. Again, that's my representation matters. Dr Mina in this episode also explained that injections into the scalp help some people with alopecia to regrow their hair, but they are painful. The first line treatment are steroid injections. They directly target the information around the hair bowl, so they're suppressing the immune system. And often we do around eighty pokes or eighty injections just into the scalp, and you have to get the month. But I did running over right cooler. Yes you did try this treatment, So how was it for you as a kid. I was just like, man, I hate it going to get injections in my scalp. It was painful. Then when the hair grew back, it was a whole different straight hair. It was baby hair. I had to get too blood transfusions because I was chronically anemic, and then my hair go back and I never had alopecia again. So my alopecia was due to being severely anemic. Wow, you see why people need to mind their business because I think things are lumped into one assumption of what things are. And I think the Lord your body was talking to you and telling you what to fix is I had to write people around to help you fix that, and it was like advantageous and economic for me to go natural because the barber was cheaper than a hair salon. For my mom for sure, because having hair is expensive. Yes, thank god I wasn't born in the Arab bundles. My mom would be broke. So now, Jericho, we know that you started with the creams and shampoos and all the alopecia treatments before discovering your love for wearing and creating wigs. I'm so excited about this. If you could tell us, first of all, how all you found wigs that worked for you and we're comfortable because some of them are too smile and too tight, because I want to know in case I decided to wear a wig again. So at first you got this trial there, a lot of money and just trying to find them. I had hair at one point, so I was like, so it would be like the same haircit was layered and that's just what I always have. It didn't fit, and I always thought I had a big head always. When I went and I took Madame LaBelle got wigs, there's different sizes. Fifteen years later, I didn't know that, but then it makes sense. So I'm thinking that it was big. It's a one point five. I got a small head. So then I figured out, okay, it's a fit custom made wigs. Getting the wig head four mine, the twenty one point five fits perfect. That's the part of it. You get it, But then you need a tailor made custom wig this for you. And what she changed, but that lump behind the ear. If y'all ever had a wig old, they can't get that ear right to say. They're like, oh my goodness. When she put it on me, it felt like someone crowning. She went and made it tailored to my head, and it felt like it was just mine. If this is gonna be your thing every day, you need to get it custom made for you. Those other ones factory made. They're mostly masses mass productions, and that's why they have the adjustable bands don't fit right. You constantly adjusting it is the wind gonna blow. Because let me tell you, a storm came when I went down to the ocean front. Let me tell you it was a tumbleweed. Honey, I'm over here taking my wig on the beach. Yes, I had to take the sand down everything I've been there, hilarious. It's a transparency for me not. I wanted to prevent it the best way that I could, and if it did happen, I am always prepared in my mind. At any given moment, I am prepared jumping in the pool, honey, that thing was just a floating away. Plus y'all heart, I was just thinking about all of these things I was dealing with to add on a hair journe, babe, and not one that you're choosing. I did a lot of brains. Of course, I did sports the things. Again that my non alopecia privilege. I just realized it's always two sides of this coin, Like I just have a hair privilege that I just didn't even acknowledge in my mind. I'm just gonna get my hair braider. So I appreciate you' all sharing because this is gonna change list. And so in having the custom made wigs, what has it been like now finding the passion because of your alopecia condition? And then I'm really super excited to hear about the increased level of self confidence? Oh definitely. So I wanted to do it for a long time, but where do you start again? When I got my first wig done, it was important to me to understand, to really get the background on it, because how can I help people if I don't know? So I went and I invested in taking Shelley's class. So I took the class, and I even took a ventilation class, so I learned how to do it hair my hair, because it meant to me that there's people who may want to mimic their hair. They had a cow, a leg, a world somewhere. So when I come out, I want to make sure that I cater to all of the people who have alopecia. I have my eyebrows, some people don't, so you may have to ventilate that. Look at old pictures to be able to say, okay, what did you look like? What would this look like? Now okay, you had a worldly in the front. So I needed to learn how to make a worldly. I may not have their alopecia, but I feel like that I need the solution for it. I t person. So how can we take technology to be able to love the people who make it. I'm taking baby steps, but it is work that I know when it does come out, it's going to be a change for the people in this journey. So now we need more tools to be like, Okay, what can we use out there to make it easier for us because it's time consuming. It could take months to be able to create just one unit. People need help and there's options, right, That's so true. That's one of the reasons why I'm so grateful for this episode y'all to change their lines out here. Absolutely, even me, just in the episode, I'm like, note to self because I do not know that. And Jericho, you took something that you went from being in a position where you had to protect yourself to being passionate about it and then empowering other people to take their own passion and then be protected and feel confident in themselves. So that is a wonderful testament to know that it's okay. Some people just don't know. I feel that I'm powerful, I feel that I am confident, Like I was missing something until I had spoke to Shelley and she gave me that piece the missing. Now you can need to say yes and run with it and just let people know that it's okay. Yes, I wear wigs and that's okay. People put such a stigma on having wigs. Why wouldn't that be okay? I blame. Back in the eighties, the Hairclub for men, he put a shame on, even put a lyric in the song about it. He he was the president, and I just think he started the shame and we don't like that. For cooler you being in the barbering realm, and then with Jericho creating wigs and having different styles. It's such a wide, like full spectrum of opportunities for hair now and because we have so much more exposure and access to information as opposed to how it was then. Like right now, if I got alopecia arianta, right now, I know that there's a very eclectic barber somewhere that would cut my hair low, and then I would take my eyeliner and color and my alopecia spotes and make it colorful, because it's okay to do that now. I feel like a pioneer, to be honest, Yes, feel like a pioneer. I was doing that in the eighties. Sun, get out of here and come on here a pioneer. We love it. If you both could sum it up in one sentence, what is one thing that you would want everyone to know about alopecia? Okay, So, as far as for me, alopecia is not a female thing, Okay, men go through this struggle as well, So I would like to challenge the women to be a little kinder to men in the community when it comes to them dealing with their alopecia, because the same way we went through our insecurities and our vanity with ours, they go through the same thing with their What about you, Jericho, I'm going to say that alopecia is a journey and it really doesn't have a final destination, and just to know there's always options. There's gonna be forks in the road. You try something, you don't like it, you can try something else. There's always going to be a solution that's gonna fit you and make you comfortable. It's always gonna be a solution that fits you. Right there. That's it. That's it. I love that. We want to thank you both, Jericho and Coola so much for being here with us. Your sharing and has just inspired and empowered so many people, men and women cooler to know that they can be on their journey and that they can have a solution and find what works for them and makes them comfortable too. So thank you both so much. Thank you for having me. Thank you. We really appreciate the invite and the opportunity to let everybody know our journeys. Thank you for what wonderful guests we have. I love our guests. We're going to take a short break right now, and when we return, we'll share our top five takeaways from this episode. I learned a lot during this episode and from our guests, and now it's time to start our thoughts, presenting Cara and Tracy's top five thoughts Tracy Dog, this is the partner show where we speed through the five thoughts slash takeaways from the episode. Okay, so I'm super excited Car because you go ahead and start with number five. Number five. It's one thing to choose to be ball, it's another to lose all your hair without warning. That is key. Coola shared her journey on that and it was the innovation for me since said I'm gonna get some signs and I'm gonna keep it moving and Jericho, but both after they cried. So I love that they had a moment, they grieved what they wanted to have their hair, and they run along big time, not before losing your hair can feel like losing a part of yourself. Okay, Now, how many times have you heard or seen someone get a big chop. They're intentional, they recorded, they said, in the chair and they are freaking the blankety blank out And it's an intentional haircut. But when you go in and you wake up and your hair is gone, no control at all, that is a loss that you're not prepared for. That's scary. Number three, there are three types of alopecia, and traction alopecia occurs, and one in three adult Black women due to tight hairstyles. So take care of your hair and protect those edges because we all know about that. Yeah, and y'all look mama's and dad is out there doing the little baby's hair. Stop pulling the baby's hair so tight they need just a little breathing room. Okay. Number two, even if a condition is not life threatening, we should still consider the mental toll it takes on a person and practice empathy. This is so true and number one last, but definitely not least. No matter how you wear your crown, you are royalty, period. I love it. That's such a fact. Just love on your hair and love on yourself. Where yah, that is the key. If you are looking for support relating to alopecia. Please visit in a A F dot org. We want to know how you're feeling about this new season of Red Table Talk, so we are open to talk about anything with you all as well. Send in your questions and even your comments to Let's Red Table That's at red table talk dot com. Thank you so much for listening. Make sure you subscribe on I Heard Radio app and please rate this podcast on Apple podcast. We want a Pile. We'll be back next week for another episode of Let's Red Table. That a big thank you to our executive producers Janda Pinkett Smith, Ellen Rackitton and Fallon Jethro. And thank you to our producer Kyla Knru and our associate producer Yolanda Chow. And finally, thank you to our sound engineers Calvin Bayliss and Devin Donnahy. We love you. Thank you, Let's Red Table, That, Let's Red Table, That tape table, Let's red tabble both that, Oh, Let's Red Tape both that, Let's Red Table. That

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