Leah Remini: Setting the Record Straight

Published Aug 18, 2020, 10:00 AM

After years of not speaking, Jada Pinkett Smith and Leah Remini meet at the Table to discuss their very public dispute over Leah’s accusations that Jada and Will Smith are Scientologists

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Hey, fam, I'm Jada Pinkett Smith and this is the Red Table Pop podcast, all your favorite episodes from the Facebook watch show in audio, produced by Westbrook Audio and I Heart Radio. Please don't forget to rate and review on Apple Podcasts. So yeah, I'm really looking forward to to today's show. Um, we haven't talked in a long time. She reached out to me, which was really huge of her because I really don't I don't know if I'm that big. Sometimes when wounds are still fresh, Um, it can. It definitely can create tension. I'm really gonna have to have my listening ears on and really just listen and really understand her side versus being defensive. For years, it's been rumored that I was a scientology is because I took some courses at the church and was interested in study Tech, one of the organization's teaching methods. I also opened a school that used the study Tech, which added to the speculation. Leah Remedy was a scientologist her whole life. Our problem started when she included a story about a party we both attended in her memoir. Her experience that night was different than mine, and when asked about it on Andy Cohen's Bravo show. I explained what I remembered from that evening. I know she kind of made it seem kind of weird, but it really wasn't. Leah had issues with my response, and from there our private disagreement became a public battle. We haven't talked in years, but she's coming to the Red table so we can finally hear each other out. Oh yeah, yellow and red, yellow and boy, pretty think about the Lemony show today. We got a minute, so we might as well talk. Here's my position. People are suffering bad, you know. And when I look at Leah, like whatever she experienced with the Church of Scientology hurt her bad and hurt people, hurt people. And she took a shot at us out of pain. She was hurt and she started taking shots at us. And I commend you, babe, for taking on these these kinds of topics. But you know, I gotta give lea promps because she opened the door. Yeah, you know, she made the first move towards a reconciliation. So it's Leah here. Okay, what sid I like your operation? Thank you for coming. Oh my god, my pleasure. You look gorgeous, you do, and you always do you got that skin? Well, you know, I know, I know, I really want to say I really I want to start out by thanking you for even in like for this. It says a lot to me, and so it I come with that. I come with this open heart, and I know that you invited me with an open heart, so definitely, and this is actually the first time that I'll actually be talking about my involvement, you know, with the church or what have you. And I want to say thank you to you first because you actually opened the door for this. You did Okay, yeah, I did with your communication with Dwayne. Just did you know, get you guys up to speed. Dwayne Martin, who um we're making reference to it now, happens to be a mutual friend of Lee and I both. I remember the first time I met you was twenty years ago, and then we reconnected at Church of Scientology. I went off and did my thing. You eventually went off and did your thing, and then you wrote a book, and it upset me because I didn't understand why we had to be in your book, because you know, when we really didn't have anything to do with this, and there were headlines about Scientology and I didn't go seek at Tom's and how you know, Will and I had participated and I was hurt, but I never said anything but Jada, I wasn't even considering that you would be hurt. Like I literally, looking back on it, I didn't even consider Jada and Will. I was going in hard on my rightness. And then I looked at it and I said, you know, what responsibility do I have? Can I take here for upsetting somebody that I actually really care about? And I'm sorry that I didn't consider you because I didn't. I was I was so caught up and they I don't want to cry. I was just caught up in that pain, right and also the pain of others and the effects that it had. And you know, I come from a world, Jada, of of fighting, you know. And I don't know that that was particularly your experience with scientology, but my world fully indoctrinated as a child. There's a lot of anger and there's a lot of fighting, and that is what I was raised with. Just a lot of the world is bad. Everyone who's not a scientologist is bad. Now, what I do know for a fact is you really didn't know Leah, because what we're taught is to act a certain way around other celebrities. And when the thing happened on on on Bravo, like I was floored. I was really really like, wow, Jada is not only is she in scientology, but now they sent Jada out right. I guess that's that's the secret. That's Yeah, we just really like each other. I'm sure you've been asked us before because Leah Remedy in her book talked about like a game of hide and Seek at your house with Tom Cruise. It was Tom's house, it was Tom's house, and you wanted to play hide and Seek with everybody, but she didn't want to play or it didn't happen, right, did you have you played to? This is when our kids were really small, and Tom loved games. That was the whole point of Tom was just fun like that. So I know she kind of made it seem kind of weird, but it really wasn't. It was just a bunch of us goofing off with their kids and playing silly games. There's always a backstory. There's always a backstory. Yeah, well, I hope this has been a fun girl's trip to the clubhouse. He doesn't tell you what he's going to talk about he just throws stuff at you, you know. And so when that came up, I was like, that's not how I remember that night going, you know. And I my producer told me that you felt like I wasn't supportive of you. And I just want you to know that you had basically created a situation for Will and I now, and I didn't know that. I know. I didn't know that. I know, but I'm clear on that now. So I'm just giving you this where I was in that in that framework of why you might have felt as if I didn't have your back, you know what I'm saying, because at that point, I'm like, I gotta protect Will and I when the thing happened on on on Bravo, And I should also tell you this, And I don't know if you really do know this, but scientology has policies called fair game, and that's too discredit and attack anyone who's speaking out against some of the abuses of scientology. But I was like, oh my god, like she's even more in than I had thought, you know, so, and I was wrong. So when I saw somebody had tweeted me and said, why is Jada throwing shadey you. I was like, wait what So when I saw it, I was hurt because like, oh, she's oh so she's in she's fair gaming me. Fair game is a policy in scientology that calls for the utter destruction of a critic of scientology. So the thing to do there's there's you get trained on how to do this. You first deal with it with a laugh, you know, like it's boring, it's not worth watching or not worth reading. And the second thing is a discredit the facts. That's why I said, and Jada is a scientologist, because there's no reason for Jada to be doing that other than fair gaming. Yeah, and you know, I want to apologize to you because you know, I'd never just so you know, I wasn't fair gaming you on Andy Cood but it was yeah, but literally it was just like, Okay, that's not how I remember that happening. I want to acknowledge that I hurt your feelings, and that's the last thing I want to do. I don't get any joy out of hurting people. I really don't. And when I saw that you made that statement, I was like, yeah, I felt the need to respond to something that I thought was untrue. And it wasn't attack and and listen, this is why it's so important just to have communication because this was just a big gass misunderstanding because you saw me at the Scientology Center, will and I always being accused of being scientologists in this and being that, and what's rap I'm like, And the crazy thing is is that that is literally if we've walked into my library right now. Like, I love religion because I grew up in the Ethical Society. So my grandmother was like, You're gonna learn all the religious and then you got to decide which one you want to practice that So for me, all religions have been my home, which is why I didn't have a problem going to the Church of Scientology and saying I'm not a scientologist. I want to just be here and see what you have to offer, because that was my life. That's what I'm used to, you know what I mean. So, but I totally see with in your shoes, your reality, how you could see me the way that you did, right. Yeah, I always took the position that I'm here at the Scientology Center to learn what I want to learn, and I have no interest in being a scientologist. And one of the things that I really prided myself in was to be able to be amongst that group of scientologists and still hold my own in regards to no, no, no, no, you can't tell me that I'm this because I've read past this page. No no, no no, I'll tell you if I decided to do that. And you were allowed to do that because oh yeah, who you are and who your husband is, and regardless of what was being presented to you from me as a friend, you were seeing a side of me that wasn't a authentic because my job was to always be a perfect person in front of you or any celebrity, to solely get you into scientology, fully indoctrinated, fully on board, and deserting any other beliefs or or systems of learning. If you know, you cannot dabble in scientologist. I just never got any of that, Like, of course you wouldn't. Yeah, I never, of course you wouldn't. First of all, your Jada, that's number one on its own. Number two. You're married to Will, So there's a certain protocol and there's certain things you would not see. You would not be privy too. So when I saw you, when we became friendly, I was like, here's one person. Here's this ballsy, badass chick who is a lover but also well, you know, put you in your place. Then the wedding, oh yeah, we had it was the wedding Tom and Kate's wedding, right, so the wedding together, and I'm like tired. I have a newborn baby, so I'm not really excited about sitting down to a twenty course meal. But I can't say any of that. If I say anything that's critical, I would have gotten my ass handed to me had I been critical of anything that was happening at that wedding. And I have people listening to everything that I'm saying. After the wedding, Yeah, I get sent to Florida, Okay for interrogation for three months because I was saying things at the wedding like where is Shelley Scavenge, the leader's wife. I when I got home to l A, I had a stack of reports written on me, internal reports from scientologists saying that I was this at the wedding. I was that. I was like, oh my god, this is what's happening. What why am I getting all these? And I know I remember that because I do remember when I got home and oh that was happening. I was like, you know what good for Leah? No, really like the fact that where is your friend? Where is she? You know? And I had a lot of respect for the fact that you would not give up on that question. Well it's still not answered today, despite me hiring a lawyer, and that lawyer through the Public Information Act trying to get information, we are still stop being stone wall today about where is Shelley Scavenge, the leader's wife? I guess And three months, this is when I'm on a hiatus for King of Queens and I spend my time literally being derogated for three months. What are your evil intentions towards David Mims Scavenge? What are your even towards scientology? Like battering me for three months and until I said I didn't see the things that I said I saw. I'm sorry, the wife is not missing. Was I able to leave? And then I went back to work. But I was interrogated for years, for years and punished for years, and it took me six years to extract myself out of it. And then I wrote the book got it? And then you wrote the book. Okay, yeah, Leah it's such a trip. So now in listening to your experience and everything that you went through, I totally understand how we got into that clash, you know, And it's just it's just showing me over and over again at that how kindness is always the way because you don't know what people are going through period. And I really truly deeply apologize. I should have thought about the names in the book. I should have thought about what that meant for you guys, and I didn't. It's okay, I love you anyway, and I love you anyway. Yeah. So the other thing that I'm learning from this is just having the courage to show that vulnerability. It's not easy because when you do, especially as women, you know, we're we need to stit together. We don't see a whole lot of that, you know, publicly. You know, both of us are strong freaking warriors, you know, and it takes a little softness and gentleness to to just lay it down. And the moment, the moment Dwayne Martin said to me that you reached out to him, I was like, I'm gonna grab this moment. Thank you, But it was you. Do you know that you were really such a huge person in this because I don't think I would have done that, but you did, and that is that's huge. I'm you know, damn near fifty kind of feeling like I'm just for the first time really finding out who I really am as opposed to what has been taught to me. It's even just being a mom now because my daughter is now the most important thing. You know, Well you hope you also learned I'm selfish as all hell, and I realized that a lot. Okay, Like even when she's talking to me at the end of day, I'm like, is she still like she's just talking at me, like like it's a run on sentence like, and I'm like, isn't that amazing? Right? You just got me out of my self absorbed little world that I'm right, And there's such a gift in that way. Absolutely. I I have to tell you, my daughter has taught me so much. And I really had to learn through my kids how to access my more vulnerable side, you know, because they happen to be super affectionate kids and I didn't grow up that way, you know, And so my journey has been through my children to get to um just that gooey, vulnerable soft, you know, because how we both have grown up. I can see that you've had some tough things to deal with, and I know you have to, and so it creates that kind of hard exterior. I realized their therapy that I have to deal with the paint right right, I wasn't allowed to deal with pain. Right in scientology. I'm dealing now for the first time in my life and therapy that I do have pain from not having a father, but I've never dealt with the pain of him. I just pushed it aside. I go, well, that's just a bad father. Many people have bad fathers, but I never really saw that that might be dictating how I look at men, how I treat men. There's an argument because I've had to deal with my father issues in in in that way of just not bringing the stuff that I went through with my father into my relationship with Will or my sons. You know, So I totally hear you on that. Yeah, it's a lot of that. It's dealing with that childhood trauma that I never really dealt with, and being ripped from my home and my life and going into scientology and I have, of course, I fight. I had to because I didn't have somebody fighting. And that's what I'm starting to learn. You don't need to fight every fight, Leah, because I've not had third seasons of shows because I was climbing over a table in a boardroom going, I will punch you when you're I don't give it about the show. And I'm proud of that side of myself because I don't put up a boat this business. But I was, I said, I don't actually like that side of me. I like the intention behind it, but I don't like the way I'm coming at it like a fighter. Got it. I don't mind being it, but not in a damn business meeting. I told it. You know what, Leah, I so good. It is the little razor inside. Yes. When I turned forty, I had a just a complete out of midlife crisis, like everything in my life was just upside down, and I was like, I'm ready to take off the vest with the explosives because literally that's how I had been walking around all my life, like say something else, I'll blow us all the Exactly. I have the same mentality, and it's it's it's from all that pain, yes, and it's just that little girl in us that's raging, and I don't know how to get past the moment when it happens. And so with my therapist, she said, you're missing something. You just need to find out what you're missing, just in those moments. Just ask yourself or ask the person that's saying these things or antagonizing you. I'm sorry, what are we missing here? What do you think? I don't understand. That's lesson. It's a good lesson because I will definitely say you showed me that today, like I totally I missed it. I missed her too. It's a beautiful thing, you know. And I say, that's just never too late, you know, for friends, for families. You know, it's just never too late to heal Leah. Yes, man, thank you, thank you, thank you. I want to hug you back. This is great. Yeah, thank you. On our next red Table talk, why black women and white women have such a difficult time women of color Sometimes I feel like they don't want to be my friend. I'm not interested. Oh, get over the idea that you are white. There's one race, you know what. You need to shut up? Well, I saw you, sorry, I saw you cry in there crying. You're gonna that's what happens if you get old. It's so good to see and I am tired. I really didn't mean to join the red table Talk family and become a part of the conversation. Follow us at facebook dot com slash red table talk. Thanks for listening to this episode of Red Table Talk podcast produced by Facebook, Watch, Westbrook Audio, and I Heart Radio.

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