For decades, iconic supermodel Paulina Porizkova had a picture-perfect life: world-class beauty, the largest modeling contract in history, a rockstar husband, and two beautiful sons. For the first time, Paulina is opening up about her separation from The Cars lead singer Ric Ocasek, his untimely death, and the betrayal, heartbreak, abandonment, and grief she faced behind the scenes. Now, at age 57, Paulina is bravely exploring the dating pool.
Hey, fam I'm Jada Pinkett Smith and this is the Red Table Pop podcast all your favorite episodes from the Facebook Watch show in audio produced by Westbrook Audio and I Heart Radio. Please don't forget to rate and review on Apple Podcasts. She's an iconic supermodel. Paulina poor Riskova was the highest paid supermodel in the world. Her glamorous marriage to Hall of Fame rocker Rick Okasseck made them the ultimate a couple. She says she spent a lifetime being seen, but has never been heard until now. For the first time, Paulina is revealing what happened behind the scenes of our picture perfect life. I was waiting for him to leave his wife and then a few months in, Oh yeah, there's children involved. All the lie started as soon as we met. I opened an envelope that says, this is the will in the testament. I will not provide for my wife because she abandoned me. He wanted to hurt me one last time. My parents abandoned me when out three. Abandonment still is I think my greatest fear. So let's talk love life. O love life. Men willing to sleep with women our age have slept with all my girlfriends already you sleep with him yet, Yeah, don't don't bother a raw revealing an emotional RTT you won't want to miss missing but was probably some of the worst things that has ever happened to me. I know that the day he passed that you found him. She's an iconic supermodel who says she spent a lifetime being seen, but has never been heard until now. Legendary supermodel Paulina Poritzkova was just eighteen when she made history as the first Czechoslovakian woman to grace the cover of the sports illustrated Swims suit issue. Vogue Australia declared her the face of the nineties and she landed the most lucrative modeling contract at that time. When she was nineteen, she was in the music video for the band The Cars iconic ballad Driven, where she met lead singer Rick Ocassock. The glamorates couple had two sons in Paulina and Rick were in the process of ending their thirty year marriage when Rick unexpectedly died. A shocked and heartbroken Paulina found his body days later. In the midst of her grief, Paulina discovered Rick had cut her out of his will, leaving her feeling betrayed and in deep financial despair. Now, in her new memoir No Filter, Paulina is opening up about it all. She's ready to talk no filter. Welcome, Paulina, welcome, thank you. That is a going to color. The color is specific. I wanted to Yeah, nice to me, look like already red table. Yeah you look beautiful. Well, thank you. So so let's talk about your book cover no filter and there's no filter the picture, right, Yeah, no filter. I make a point of not using filters ever, because that's kind of my thing by you know, trying to represent a woman my age fifty seven without filters. I am so delighted when I see a woman my age that looks like I do. I'm like, oh, look, you have the same wrinkles where you have the same little weird goobbly bits here, and I find it BEAUTIFU full on them. So I'm kind of hoping to do for other women what some of those women do for me. I was really excited to talk to you, specifically for that reason. I just turned sixty nine a couple of days. What a beautiful sixty nine. So much, but that's the thing it really has made me rethink, like how much of this am I gonna do? Like how much botox am I going to get? And when will I be comfortable enough to let that all go? How did you get comfortable? I am not comfortable with and I'm still like struggling with it on a daily basis. And I think that that's kind of where a lot of women fall. It's like I have fourhead wrinkles, and I have wrinkles here and and all the stuff that comes with being lucky enough to live. So it's kind of a precarious balance because we're in the public eye all the time and people will take hot shots at you constantly. The amount of like hey Grandma, that I get it's plenty. It hurts my ego a little bit. But at the same time, it isn't a part of the beauty of becoming older that we acquire more confidence because we know who we are and we are a little easier with telling people to just piss off. All right, So let's see, if you know, if I if I pushed back my next botox supportment exciously. The moments where I feel the least secure about myself is when I am modeling. One day of modeling will set me back, like confidence wise, Like a few can totally get that. I've been a model for forty two years, since I was fifteen, and so I'm just kind of used to stepping in front of the camera. And then I see the pictures and I go, WHOA, wait, this is not how I remember it looking the last time I did it. And so it's just the comparisons between like what I remember myself as and then you know, being faced with the reality of what I look like now, and it's beautiful. I think we need to switch the thing of like, oh, there's something wrong with me. So there's something wrong with the world. You said it perfectly, So, Paulina, you had a traumatic and offensive incident with a photographer early in your career. You talk about that a little bit. Okay, So I'm fifteen years old, like freshly fifteen years old. I'm in Paris. Getting hired for any kind of a job was such a big deal because I thought that every job would be my last, and you wanted to be the nice little girl and the line everybody. And so I'm sitting there and there's a you know, makeup mirror in front of me, and there's a makeup artist doing my makeup. There's a hairdresser on the side, and then the photographer walks in from behind and then I feel something on my shoulder and it's like how warm and heavy? And he's laughing at me, and the makeup artist is laughing at me, and the hairdresser is laughing. Everybody's laughing, and I'm like, what what is that? Don It looks like a brown flower or but it feels like Penny who's stuff was mashed potato. It was like, I could not for the world figure this out. And it wasn't until he retracted it and zipped up his flight that I realized it was Spenish. So were the were the makeup artists and the other people that were in the room where they all men not women. This was his little joke that he did two young girls. And it's kind of culture in that. I mean that modeling World, Paulina, Was that the first time you ever saw well, yes, it was certainly the first time I saw it. That's so disrespectful. And you were on these sets alone, right of course. I remember Carl Lagerfeld telling me with you, he was like, I love that you don't leave her alone on the set, and he said, never, Jada, never leave her alone on the set. And he didn't go into detail. A lot of sexual harassment going on, and if I saw that being done now to my granddaughters or my nieces, I'd be horrified. And I want to go and kill somebody. So let's talk love life. Oh love life. Oh great? But you met Rick when you were nineteen and you said it was love at first sight. It was kind of love even before first sight. Because I had just gotten my MTVS, like Night four, and I had accidentally seen this video and I thought, oh God, that guy's really hot, and his name came up and it said Rick Okasseck. And about three months later, I was called to do an audition for a MTV video for a band called The Cars that I had never heard of because I was from Europe, so I didn't know the American bands and the band we're going to take me out to dinner before we did the video. So I showed up at the Four Seasons and the door opens and the guy from the video walked out and it was literally like one of those like teenage wet dre So I was like, right, yeah, I can't breathe. It's like magnets drawn across the room to each other, and it's like, yeah, that was history. So he was he was married at the time. Didn't tell you that, No, not not right away, obviously. He told me that after a couple of weeks had gone by, when we had, you know, already made out and I was like passionately love with this guy. And then he sort of came up with I like, oh, yeah, by the way, I'm there, and I was like what this bombshell came While Paulina and Rick were making out. At some point between the kisses, I asked him to tell me something secret about himself. I meant a little confidential snippets, something only I would get to know. And that's when he told me he was married. It was a glass of cold water thrown in my face. But quickly, with my nineteen year old reasoning, I figured it always took two to be unhappy in the relationship, so clearly his was not a good marriage. But that was that we resumed kissing. I just thought, okay, so they'll divorce him. You know, I'll leave my boyfriend, he'll leave his wife, and that's good and then so I left my boyfriend, and then I was waiting for him to leave his wife. And then a few months in, oh yeah, there's children involved. That one was a little harder to take. I was in too deep at that point. I was maddeling in love with him. And when he said that he needed time because there were two small children involved, on went, he's such a good dad. Yeah, And it never really dawned on me that he had all the lies that had started as soon as we met. It took back three years to leave his wife. During that time, Pauline and Rick kept their romance secret. Eventually they married. I became his obsession for the first time in my life. I felt totally desired. He would not share me. He flew into jealous rages often enough to make me understand how much I mattered to him. I stopped doing bookings where I had male counterparts. I stopped working weekends, but we're not convenient with his schedule. We made very few select friends together, only ones who understood that we were a package. There wasn't much room for anyone else, but adoring someone takes up a lot of room. Both of our careers suffered because we became each other's priorities. I trusted him wholeheartedly for pretty much most of my life. Wow, I was very very much in love with him. But I started to match or and no longer was his word the word of God. And you have your own children, you run a family. He had a bunch of children that you know, we're all incorporated as family. I did all of that work, and I wanted him to step up a little bit more to be acknowledged, I guess for what I did. And the more demanding I became, the further way he pulled Pollack. Yeah, And I felt that as an abandonment, and so abandonment has been like it still is. I think my greatest fear in what way my parents abandoned me. When I was three, they moved to Sweden in a Soviet invasion. Then my mom came back to get me when I was nine, and then I was taken away from my grandmother, who was really the woman that raised me. So there was another abandonment of somebody, of my safety, of my home life, of everything I knew. And then I marry a man that seemed to love me so completely and holy, if somewhat obsessively. M M. And when he started backing off for me, I was like wait, wait, wait, like where are you going? Can we can we do therapy, can we do vacations? Like can you read the self help? But can you please? And he'd be like, doesn't work for me. You do your thing. I'm back here. When you figure it out and you want to just be happy, then come back to me that thing. So things kept disintegrating more and more and we decided to get a divorce and we told the children and I put it out on Instagram that we were separating, and I go, okay, this is what I'm going to post. Is this okay with you? I mean, we're still living in the same house. I was so concerned about him his well being that he was okay. I didn't realize until much later that it only went one way. Actually, he was inducted into the Hall of Fame. I was like, I'm gonna go I'm going to be your wife. I'm going to be like fully supportive because I know how much this means to you. And he was the only guy who didn't thank his wife on the podium. And so when we got back home, I was like, yeah, okay, so now we're going public, and I'm going to start dating right anyone, Okay, to your thing. So I did my thing. We lived in a really large town house and our children were still at home, and there was no real animosity, And so I went about still being housemother and still providing food, and still making sure he had his favorite yogurt, even though we slept in separate bedrooms for many years by that time already so like to me, all of this was, you know, strictly, strictly above the table. When I found a man and I fell in love, I told my husband. My husband went, oh, well, good for you. You You know, I'm glad he was not a musician. That's all I got to say. After we had separated, I had fallen in love with someone else, and I was in a relationship with this man when my husband died. I've never spoken about this publicly, though I've never hidden it either. My friends and family were all aware. My husband knew him. We talked openly about my boyfriend. We discussed getting apartments close to each other after we sold our home so we could help each other when needed. I thought we had found the perfect way to navigate the end of our marriage. And you guys were actually divorced. We were separated, and we were going to do like the final divorce papers after we sold the house, so that we knew exactly what the assets were. And he did get a really really evil lawyer, divorce lawyer during this period and didn't tell me about it, and I thought we were going to get mediators. All of a sudden, shark lawyers came in and you know, oh, no, you don't get this, and you don't get this, and you don't get this. And I go to my husband and go, what what's going on here? Oh, don't worry about it. He'd say, don't worry about it. It's just a beginning negotiation. And I told her to treat you fairly. And I was like, you know, she has one of the worst repute patients in like the United States, right, And that never went anywhere because when he died, tell us about that day. So he had surgery because he had UM. They found stage zero lung cancer. So it was kind of good news. You know, he had gone in for a catskin just to be sure because he had been a heavy smoker, rock star, you know, UM, And so they found it super early and it was like Hey, this is great. It's like we're finding it before it makes any trouble whatsoever. And I said, honey, don't worry. I'm there. I'm taking care of you. We're going to get through this together. Don't worry for a second. I'll be there. And he was like, I'm so happy, Thank you so much. We went through the surgery, me and the boys, I mean we were all there, and you know, I'm making him dinner, taking care of him, all of that stuff that you do for somebody that you love. And he was recovering really well, like two weeks. He was walking around um, he was starting to feel much better. He was sleeping better. And this night I went out for a friend's birthday, I mean sure that my boys were at home. And as I was going back home, I remember I bought like these like warm cookies from like one of those like stands on on the the New York streets. And I came home and he was sitting up in his chair in the living room where he always said, and I was like, hey, honey, I brought you some warm cookies and he said, you know what, I'm feeling kind of tired. I think can you save them for me for tomorrow, and I said sure, and he went to sleep. The next morning, it's like, you know, nine ten, he still wasn't up, but he tended to sleep late rock star hours, and so by eleven, I was like, he's sleeping in a little bit too long. So I'm gonna make him a cup of coffee and I'm gonna bring it up to him, like maybe he's not feeling so great. And I brought him a cup of coffee and and he just looked like he was sleeping. So I set the coffee down next to him, and that's when I saw his face. I saw his eyes and they didn't like eyes anymore. And it all kind of started going through my head. I was like, oh, I can't move. Oh I think I'm gonna pass. Oh no, I'm my legs are giving out, okay, and I'm just gonna fall onto the floor here. But this is interesting. And that coupled with this like panic, like oh my god, oh my god, Oh my god, Oh my god. And then uh and then I think my only thought was I have to get to my children. I have to get to my boys. It was kind of lucky that they were both at home and I couldn't walk. I crawled downstairs on my elbows, like three flights up stairs on my elbows because I couldn't use my legs. Just the damnedest thing. It's like how your body just shuts shuts off. And then my boys, I think witnessing, my witnessing the pan of which was probably some of the worst things that has ever happened to me. Yeah, I can only imagine. Yeah, Okay, I'm good. I know, yeah, I know, I know. I'm just thinking. You know, it's so deep, it is. But as I'm listening to us, you know, I think about my life and I remember talking to this older actress. Her name was Ruby d and she said one of the things that she wished when Ozzie Davis died, which was her husband, and they were married for decades, decades, and there's so many ups and downs. But she said to me, you know, I wish I had laughed with him more. She's like, the one thing I want to tell you, Jada, she was like, marriages go through their seasons, you know, they go through their chain ages, she said, but um, when a loved one dies, you don't even think about all that has transpired, all of the foolishness that goes on within a marriage, you know, and when I'm listening to you, that comes to mind. Yeah, yeah, thank you empathetic souls. Yeah, it comes to mind. You know. Do you feel like you had a moment, that moment where it didn't matter? Of course, of course I for about two days all I remember. I mean, first, you're just kind of in this fog um of you know, I have to call his children. It's up to me, like, it's like, I have to do this. I have to do this now. Choosing out the clothing for the coffin, which was really rough. Mm hm. I never realized how sad shoes were shoes, you know, just opening the closet and seeing his shoes. Yeah. So while doing that, you know, I opened a novelope that says this is the will in the Testament, and and his writing that says I will not provide for my wife because she abandoned me. Whoa. Paulina writes that Rick had decided to disinherit her. He used the legal system to try to prevent her from inheriting money after he passed by using the word abandonment. My husband wasn't just making a hyperball statement he was making illegal claim. Abandonment of a spouse legally speaking, is when a person's partner disappears and cannot be contacted for the duration of at least a year. I was in no state to process it, honestly, I just went I was like, well, that's ah I yea. So maybe he was angry and like he had jotted this down and somebody took it down as a memo and like pasted it on, and it's like somebody made a mistake. But people kept bringing it back up to me, and then the press got ahold of it because it was put in a way that it could be publicly released. He could have made it secret, they didn't. So then all of a sudden, I'm in a position of what did you do to him? Yeah? Like what did you do? Like what kind of beastly wife were you? Yeah? So then you're put put in defense. Yeah, yeah, made out to be the bad bad which yeah, I mean, this was a man that I was just bringing a coffee to. How did we go from being like best friends and family to him publicly shaming me? Why do you think that he did that? I saw some text on the phone my girlfriend when she came for the funeral, went p look at his phone, go into his phone and look, you need to do this, and I was like, no, no, no, they like and it's like, if you don't do it, I'll do it. So I looked through his phone and I found some interesting communications between him and his divorce lawyer. Let's just put it that way. Yeah, but it was his choice to hire her, and when she kept pushing, he went and did as she suggested. So I know he didn't expect to right now. He didn't expect his lawyers, didn't expect him to die. So I think ultimately, in myself, I have decided to solve it by going. I don't know that this makes me very sane. But when love ends, when it really ends, when you no longer love somebody, you just walk away and you never look back. So him being vindictive towards me, I went. You know, he he still loved me and his obsessive, crazy love was still in there and he wanted to hurt me one last time. And weirdly enough, I can forgive that because you have understanding around it. Yeah, were you right in your book about being broke after Rick di? Okay? So I was very specifically broke. I just want to upset that right so that people don't, you know, accuse me of lying. I was a woman with um assets. I had two mortgaged houses, and I had a pension plan that I can access in ten years and zero cash, had no way to pay for anything. So I was in a really really peculiar position of being a woman with assets and no money, right right, right right, And because that's that's very different full down COVID. Yeah. So, and property values in New York had just fallen off a cliff and I had to sell my house immediately because I couldn't pay. I could write, you had no liquid, zero liquids, zero liquids, and zero So yeah, I was asking my friends to buy our groceries for a little while. Yeah. Wow, so you didn't have any money for groceries. No, no, no, no, no cash, no cash. Yeah, I had to be scary. Yeah. There were so many things that sucked at that point. Yeah. The worst part of the betrayal was not that it took away the income Brack and I had been using to live. The worst part was that he publicly declared that I had abandoned him. For the next two years, I had to sue my own business manager, who was now the trustee of Rick's estate, and by extension, my own children and stepchildren who were the beneficiaries of the estate. During those two years, I learned more about money than I had in my entire life up to that point. When I signed a contract with st Ladder, it was the largest modeling contract ever signed. At that point, all that money went into the family purse. I had no real idea what happened to it, whether it was saved, spent, or invested. Our business manager always spoke to my husband about our finances, and I would just get the condensed version from Rick later. Don't worry. It was so nice not to have to worry. The will got settled at court Under New York law, I don't get a half as you didn't divorce, you get a third. At least I got my third and and I'm out. That's it. I don't want to have to ever think about that again. If I need money, I'm gonna have to make money. And that's the way it is. It's like to me money because of how I grew up. I grew up without money, and when I was nine years old, my mom went to Italy because she was having a nervous breakdown, and somehow Dad was supposed to look after us and he didn't get them my moos, so they just left us a lot. So I was nine and my little brother was three, and we weren't two weeks by ourselves, and I ran out of food. But after a week and I had to you know, go and steal in a in the supermarket to you know, get food for the second week. And uh, to this day, I really don't like white bread and spread cheese because that's what I kept stealing. So I know how to survive. And then there was another abandonment that was my boyfriend leaving me. He just walked away without ever looking back on the day that I was moving out of my house when I probably needed it most. I don't understand saying you love somebody and can off and being like you're just too much for me. I love you, like I really love you. But he said he didn't have the fortitude to stay with me, he couldn't have a healthy relationship with me because I was too up. I mean, he had a point. I was grieving my husband's and I had no money and was going through menopause and how to sell my house. So yeah, well maybe I was not in the best place of my life. There's a good year where I'm like, I don't recall much, but like walking through the woods behind my house, playing like Herman and the Hermits the End of the World and just howling. Yeah, yeah, yeah, sometimes that's just that's what it takes, that's what Sometimes that's all we got and the Hermits. I have a pretty hard time trusting people. Yeah, I could see that. I think when someone says I love you, I think we think you're gonna love me whether I'm up or down or happier sad exactly. And then when they're like, oh, no, I only love you like this, No, I only love you when when it's when you're not complaining exactly. I think we like in the first stages, it's so like intense and hot and passionate and fiery, right, and so you want the same things at that moment. Then you start peeling, peeling the las of people really really are we can't we can't really see what we want when we're in the passion of it all. Once that kind of dies down and like life takes its course, it's like, no, no, no, I need someone who can show up with me. It's really about getting to those next stages up togetherness. And you always say, Jada, and I love that is you don't really know who somebody is until you've been in the battle. Until you you've been on the battlefield. It is one thing to know somebody yourself. It's one thing to know somebody when everything is going well, But who's the person that shows up with stuff isn't going that great exactly at the end of the day. I think that's a big lesson for all of us. But when it's a partnership, there's a partnership, you're like, let's just work together to figure this out, because that's part of the humanness of it, right, because yeah, sure, crazy love infatuation. Oh, it's just the two of us on the mountaintop making love forever. And then it's like children and responsibilities and this and this and this and this, and then that's when it comes to a partnership. Right where your partnership I feel is I'm there for you when you need me, and you'll be there for for me when I need you. Yeah, And I haven't found that one. Yeah, But now on fifty seven and I'm in the dating pool. What is that? Like, it's a small pool, dirty little puddles, dirty little girls, ladies. It sucks. It turns out that on the dating apps, men our age my age that are willing to sleep with women our age have slept with all my girlfriends already. So like there's like these five guys we keep passing around, and so they're like, so, did you sleep with him yet? Yeah, don't don't bother? Ok, thanks, right right right, So that's the first problem. The second problem is all my friends are like, okay, so you need to date real people. That's your problem is that, you know, you think you need to date celebrities. No, you need to get real. You need to real people, real men. They're going to respect you. You know, they're gonna act the way that you know, real people should, not the narcissists that you always deal with. Well, the challenges of dating real men when you are a celebrity. Yeah, it's just it's it's fascinating because basically you walk in there and you're either a trophy and they're like really sweaty and nervous and they're like, yeah, So, like I told my buddy that I was going out with a supermo I'm already like, gah, oh you told all your friends, did you sexy? This is totally gonna work. Or there's a lot of well let me tell you about all those things, because like you might be a celebrity at all, but I've done some really awesome things to right, And then follows two hours of me being like, right, right, you sold those bullboards. That's fantastic. Are there any other options? This is not only two? Maybe I'm like, what about like men in different countries? You know, thank you, darling. I'm gonna have to start traveling. I don't know, I don't know, I wouldn't know. Tell us about your sons. You have two sons, right, my boys? Yeah, well I have two sons, but I also have four step sons. Okay, so it's like this boy that's all boys and they're really close to each other. They just actually just all took a vacation in Kankun together. My brother. It's like we are a tightened family. And I did that. I'm taking credit. That was not my husband. Well, we're gonna give you credit because thank you. Will your boys send a little rid tickets talk surprise Hello everyone. My name is Oliver Okassek, and hi, I'm Jonathan Okassk. One of the most important things that my mom taught me over the years is that it is actually possible to reinvent yourself. It's a long road between being some hot chick on the cover of the magazine and being an intellectual who's actually talking about some of the real problems behind aging, and just the fact that she has managed to do that is as founding to me. For my part, the most important piece of advice I feel like my mom ever gave me was you always want to do um everything to the maximum of what you're capable of, and she puts her heart and soul into everything she does. In terms of this book, I learned a lot about my mother was dealing with this great tragedy internally and how she was trying to heal from this terrible time. I mean to see a path forward, and it really gave me a path forward for myself as well. That's beautiful. I guess I couldn't have told told you any better. How fantastic lessons we got to see it for ourselves. We got okay, wait, that's totally bawling here and Jonathan got engaged. Jonathan got engaged in London a couple of months ago. To it's a long time girlfriend, saving together for almost eight years and as of today, she just passed the bar in New York. That as a big accomplishment. So Maria Shriver reached out to you and told you you should write a book. Yeah, that was kind of out of the blue. Say so, I'm going through this period of time grieving, kind of kind of having a little nervous breakdown, being really alone. It's COVID. I'm posting my emotions of how I feel on Instagram, and I'm getting to be known as the crying Lady of Instagram, which I had no idea. By the way, I was so desperate and so lonely. I felt like I was drowning and I was just throwing little bottles with little messages going help me read somebody please. And it turns out there were women who felt like me, that we're suffering, that we're in pain, that we're losing people in COVID that couldn't even say good eye to their loved ones. I mean, it was a crap place to be. It's kind of like they all they found me and I found them, and then Maria Shriver calls me up, like, I know Maria Shriver right like home. Maria Shriver is, of course, but it's not like I hang right And she said, I follow you on Instagram and I have an imprint and I am only going to publish it to four books a year, and I want them to make a difference in the world. And would you write a book for me? Wow? Well, Maria Shriver sent you some R T T love too. Oh Hi, red Table Talk Family. Hi, probably not. I just wanted to say how proud I am of you for writing this book, for sharing your truth, for being a candle in the dark to millions of women. I had seen you on Instagram a couple of years ago, and I said, this woman is at the beginning of what it's going to be a fascinating journey to finding herself again, reclaiming her life, claiming her power. I know some days are still really tough, and some days you feel like you've found your purpose through your pain. I hope you keep talking about aging, keep talking about grief. We're blessed to be the age that we are, and you are shining a light on that and lighting the way. I'm really really proud of you, Brava Maria. You know Maria's against O G Yes, I feel like look three Barbara Walters. I never had a chance to cry with her. So thank you, thank you, Pauline, and thank you so much for sharing your story. Thank you for this book. I'm an agreement with Maria. I think that's been an inspiration. Thank you so much. It's really given me plenty of food for thought, and I certainly certainly appreciate it. That's that's so kind of net to say thanks you and thank you. And it's so fascinating to have three women of three jed rations. You're like this, this show rocks to hear from each of you and you're intellectual curiosity and your empathy to share. Thank you, Yeah, thank you at this table. And Paulina's new book is called No Filter, The Good, the Bad, and the Beautiful, Go get it. Thank you, thank you. Should I take my height he off? No, we're not. Don't take your hot heels off. Do you read my chapter on height about me feeling like Shrek? Oh? Okay, I can take them off. I'm gonna got your treat from the theater. Oh you want to see my broking stocks. That would just like be a bad fashion choice guy. Look, I'm normal. To join the red table Talk family and become a part of the conversation, follow us at facebook dot com slash red table Talk. Say thus for listening to this episode of Red Table Talk podcast produced by Facebook, Watch Westbrook Audio, and I Heart Radio.