QLS Classic: Joi

Published Apr 11, 2022, 5:29 PM

Singer, songwriter and producer Joi talks about how her debut album changed the direction of Madonna's Bedtime Stories, working with Fishbone, her spot in the Dungeon Family tree and so much more.

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Of Course. I Love Supreme is a production of I Heart Radio. This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora. What Up q l S fam It's like am and this QLs classic takes us back to a time when the whole crew went to Los Angeles did a few interviews. Oh, with this one right here is special. I'm talking about Joy. Yes, I'm taking you back to February eighteen where we sat down with Joy, singer, songwriter, producer. She talks about her debut album, how it changed the direction of Madonna's bedtime stories, working with fishbone Um and her aspired in the Dungeon Family treat and so much more. Check this out. Supremo role called Supremo, Supremo roll call, sub Prima sub Primo road call, sou Prima just block, got me feeling pressure. Yeah, I'm going insane. No Joy, Frankie Beverly reference here Sunshine ring Soma road called Suprema sub Prima road Pante's in the building. Yeah, y'all know what I'm about. Yeah, I made a record with Joy. Yeah in my house. Sub Prima road call, so Prema Suma road name, sugar Boy, I'm your boy boy. I bring you joy boy, I bring you, oh Joy. Yeah, sub Prima Road still is here. Yeah, I'm trying to find a rhyme. Yeah, but I'm I said to like, yeah, yeah, because I ran out of time. Roll call Premuremo, roll call Eat, and I'm a little nervous. Yeah, motherfucking joy, my first bro girl crush ruma Roadmama Road. Sometimes they call me kitty yeah. Sometimes they call me pussy yeah. Sometimes they call me sugar. Yeah. But today I'm gonna be doing I'm already run for Surema road call Frema su Prima Road, Supremarema road. H boy, Thank god that's over. Freestyler I am. I'm a little rusty on that. I'm awful. Yeah, you can tell it's been a minute. BLA. Everybody looking bad? Yeah exactly. Yeah, Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to another episode of Quest Love Supreme. Uh of course Love in the house. We got Team Supreme. Hello, people having on Fonte good Man, I'm not saying having New Year. I was like, now that's totally long. I don't know, you know it's gonna air, but no, I'm good Man happy to in l A. Yeah, we have something I think maybe I don't know we might be black history might be March. Who knows? And yeah, we we have to mention that we are broadcasting line from the illustrious uh Westlake Audio Recording Studios house. That the house that Michael Jackson thrill of money built this house. We're actually if you if you've seen the Michael Jackson Uh Bad documentary, are we are literally in the spot where like him and Stevie and him, they said, that's where he wrote the pianos. We're yeah, the piano, the girl's mind pianos behind us. I believe that Bruce Woden built this this uh kind of it looks like a pyramid esque looking Uh what did you call what? We're just your engineers. It's the stage. Okay, well, I mean you gotta become a more colorful close. It's a nice stage. It's sort of like a booth, but sort of. It's very usual anyway, watch the Bad incredible stage, one of the best stages of it go. But it's kind of cool to be here because even Well Bad was recorded here. The things in the uh the Atlantis. Moore said, how jagged little pill? Wow? What's done here? I'm I'm sure millions of we have a special guest with us today. Um, I will say that I could holly name three people in history that uh kind of face the the burden of being way before their time. For you know, Sigio is just one of those people. Betty Davis is definitely one of those people. And I feel as though our guest today, uh, it's definitely so ahead of her time because everything that she's ever done, other people have graciously walk through. Well I mean, you know, I mean, unfortunately in life, some people have to pay the red carpet or a part to see for the people to walk through effort effortlessly and sometimes never get the credit for it. Exactly. Somebody got inspired those bedtime stories exactly, So the greatest Machette carry up all time. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome to the show. Joy Gilly, good to be here with you. I'm really glad you're here. You know, we've we've been for a long time, crossing paths and torn with each other. But this this is the conversation I've been dying to have with you forever, because you know, I have so many questions about the path and the trail that you blazed and and the after effects of it. Yeah, let's talk about it. Let's talk about there's you know, you're not suck up, right, So we're for our listeners that don't know where are you? Where were you born? Where are you from? I was born in Nashville, Tennessee. Hey, Nashville. That is we're it because I thought you were born And I'm the king of assuming that our guests are born in certain places. Narrative, you're not What do you think I was born? I thought you were born in Atlanta? Did you That's not a hard That's not bad though, a lot of people think because that's been so much time now, But I guess the only Tennessee Kenny and every Tennessee. You know, I was always you know, Tennessee slim. All right, So you wrapped your set. I wrapped my step. But you know eight time down also born and raised National tense, you're born in there? Um so what was what was your childhood music environment? Like? Um? Well, I had a pretty intensive love affair with music early on. Um My mama had album, She had a friend that worked at a as a DJ or something. My mom had a bunch of hustles when I was growing up too. Ah, that made me feel like we were rich even though we weren't. Hindsightly, looking back, we were absolutely not rich. But my mom worked hard and I felt I had, you know, things at my at my access. And so my mom I had a DJ friend and had a bunch of albums and stuff, and I would go through those albums and listen to him. And when I was really really little, my parents were still together. Daddy listened to a lot of Johnny Gets Out, Watson and um and my daddy played profile when I was a little, so we had a little you know, young your father was on the steels, right, he was quarterback grandfather too, and my granddaddy was a very well respected UH college football coach. He was he's in there in the Hall of Fame. Actually, when you were young, did you know that your dad was did you know who he was? Like? Did you know y'all kind of had it good? U WHOA, We had a good as you know that as relative as a motherfucker, I recognize. I knew that he was talented. I knew that people UH respected him a lot. I knew that he had done some great things. So he grew up in a football environment. I grew up in a football a heavy football environment. Weekends were like holidays and um, but my family is very woman heavy also. But the men and my family, a lot of them, uh, play football, worked in football. Um. So it was just you know, the women embraced it as well. But I I didn't have to be all up in it if I didn't want to be. But it was deeply entrenched in the culture of me growing up, particularly HBCU football because my grandfather was coach at Tennessee State. Okay, um, and my dad was you know, a star player at a Tennessee State as well. So the Gilliam Yeah, the weight of the Gilliam name in Tennessee State was like a you know, it's a lot of weight. That meant something. Yeah, men something after them. I mean I went there for a hot second, for a high second. I went to Tennessee State a whole semester. You get your book and all of that is such a blurr, Like I barely even remember, but I don't want to neglect. Request asked me about the music though, I want to get that part. It was a lot of P funk and a lot of La Belle and it was a M radio which back then kind of mixed blue Eyes sole and uh and you know uh Route Soul as well. Um, And so that was constantly you know, playing it was, it was. It was a constant diet of that. And my parents were young, um, and so my mom would take me to concerts with her. I saw The Mothership Land when I was six, And because Solo Bill performed at Wore Memorial Auditorium. Just because of your your musical openness and all the risks that you've taken and stuff, I was like, well, certainly in your your formative years, you had to have adapted to this earlier. I mean there's some people that like either you know, for beat makers, you know, they'll start collecting records and then discover like their uncle's records or something like that. But you know, I always felt as though you might have gotten this education super early. Are you do you? Where do you fall on the sibling line? Are you okay? Then that's something weird because normally the youngest of the brood gets the trickle down, and I'm the oldest on some like I was mostly an only child, weird, no cousins to lots of big cousins, But I just I was always a little bit. You're just adventurous. Yeah, and a little bit different from my other the things that interest me, which is different than everybody else. Was kind of thinking about I don't know, future and getting married and things like that, and I was just thinking, how to you know, just go deeper into the funking expand my mind. I knew it. Okay, that's what it like us five days from us you January, but she was born, Yeah she was okay, but yeah, we'll just we'll go with Yeah. I just was a little bit different from my cousins, but still not a not a not a not a secluded or introverted or weird old kid per se, but absolutely yeah, but that developed a little more. I think later I was a little more risk taking. Like I remember smoking some cigarettes and shipped at the house when I was little, like six years old, Like my cousin Mayde left some cigarettes there, like maybe I smoked them, and I don't know how I ended up being able to even light it and do it, but I remembered them like finding me and being like, let me sell your broth. Cloud coming around my mouth when I'm like six and I was in trouble and even like you know, just all of my interactions were a little different growing up. I had two boyfriends in kindergarten, I mean, you know what I mean, and they were fine with it, you know what I mean. So there's that I just I don't know, I was just but I got in trouble for because we were you know kind of uh, I was just ahead of the car. There was certain things that are like natural explorations for little people that all little people do, but I think my understanding of them as a little person was much keener. And I think because it was much keener I had, I recognized that it wasn't as keen for everybody else, and I think that kind of made me realize you might be a little different. So, you know, in any interaction, no matter what it was, you know, it's just a little bit here with it, and everybody else might have been kind of like right there. So then I would try to kind of backpeale and kind of be back there everybody else. But that, you know, how would you have bands in high school or that sort of thing. I didn't do that, but I did sing in high school, so I was, you know, doing some talent shows and want some talent shows and it was a dancer um for like thirteen years. I took when your family know you could sing. When I was little little, I would be like maybe four or five. My grandmother used to belong to a ladies social group called the Beautiful Lili that is so black and something just lovely ladies. They bring up you know, it's popla. They bring a dish. They played Pikino and Vega and uh and I remember singing you Light on My Life for them something. That song is number one wait speaking on which you Okay, if you ever get the chance. Jimmy Caster Bunch has Yeah, if you're to see if you can see Fonte's eyebrows like just a gun, Jimmy Caster That Jimmy Caster Bunch has a one of the most jaw dropping versions of you light Up My Life. It's hilarious, like in a bad way, like it's it's adds that it's in a very good and terrible Randy Watson with the saxophone too, because saxophone you gotta pep You Light in My Life by the Jimmy Castor Bunch, produced by uh Billie Davis Jr. That's what I was thinking. I sang you light up my life in third grade too, to win this girl's heart, Like I stood up in front of everybody and sang that and stole her away from the Southern. Really it worked, it really worked. Wait was a second or third grade something? Oh my god, forgive me? Okay, Steve, you know that's the piano from I don't believe it. No, that's that's the line. I don't believe it's from now and so that's the never mind, that's the piano there is that damn quick quest love you ner Yeah. Maybe I didn't warn you about this before warning, but I figured it would have to be if it was y'all two together, because I'm familiar with your nerd and I'm familiar with Quest nerds, and I figured this, Yeah, I think it was going to be used the hard You know, I sang you lighted my life in third grade? Okay, no, there, nerd, And I'm so so you didn't have any bands or anything, so not bands. No. I worked with after winning the talent show and because I was in tenth grade and so everything was change, oh of course. And then I also he's an apolo classic everything with my come the pianist that accompanied me was Gary Jenkins, who was Lugi from from Silk and he went to Tennessee seton h He's an amazing piano player, like ridiculous and and he used to do all the funerals and winds and saying at people's churches and you know, all of that stuff around Nashville because he's from Natural too and uh. And so he was my companiment and he and I do edit. Uh. We started off with Nobody Loves Me Like you Do, and then we segued into everything was change and I want to talent show. But after that I started working with some producers in Nashville got in the studio. So that was my first When I first went to the studio, I guess I was about six team. You know, I know that Nashville is in music city, but also primarily know it as a kind of a country country music. Yeah, but I know that down there is there any sort of at least when I say urban, I mean like to the to the sort of cosmic funk level that you're on that you brought to the Atlantic community. Well, was there any of that sort of culture in Tennessee at Not really? Um, But I also feel like Nashville was a place that was sort of ripe for getting whatever you wanted to get. There would think lots and lots of lots and lots of cultural diversity that came artistic cultural diversity came through Nashville back then. So my mom, because I was, you know, a dancer and I enjoyed theater and I sang and stuff, my mom always had me very plugged into all the stuff that was happening in the city. So it's really more so a blend of all of what I was, you know, being exposed to at the time. Lots of theater, lots of dance, and lots of you know, music by my choosing, by my own hand, and whatever was on AM radio at the time. But in terms of a scene, like you're talking about, no, that that that wasn't happening. What was it that got you into dance? How did you I just was always dancing and ship when I was little, and my mom put me in That's what mam was doing. And she also felt like I was a little clumsy when I was little, and when I was very small, she thought I was clumsy, and so she wanted me to be graceful, and so she put me about That's what she said. She didn't do the combo, the ballet, jazz tap. I did that. That came later, but the root of it, it started with ballet, the jazz and all that came when she really saw that I had taken to the dance. And so probably in about maybe third grade, I started taking like modern and jazz and tap and all of that. But from like little girl, like three years old too, like sixteen, I was like Bella with some jazz and tap and stuff, you know, mixed in. So when did you leave Tennessee? I left Nashville. I guess technically I left when I went to Memphis State eighty nine, but still kind of coming back and forth because I also went to Tennessee State, like I said, for a semester. I guess I've officially left Nashville probably in let's say ninety three, officially, but that was the year Depends came out. I think it dropped in ninety four, but I think that's how that worked. That was working on it in ninety three. So I moved to Atlanta like top of ninety three, and like by that summer I was working on So why, Well, I want to know why. What drew you to Atlanta. Why you now? In ninety two, Dallas Austin came to Nashville and he was working on at that time, Holland Placed Monsters. Yeah and so, and TLC was just like bubbling, like just going kaboom. ABC was doing their things and stuff. And so I ended up meeting him at a studio there and we hit it off instantly. I told him I was a songwriter. I didn't say a singer because I thought songwriter. It was just more I'm serious about my ship, right and uh. And I played him some of my little songs on my little demo taping ship, one of which was Narcissic Cuty Poe at the time, and some other stuff that was on there, and we just hit it off, and I knew that he was from Atlanta, and we stayed in touch, and he was like, I'm really gonna be hitting you up so we can do some stuff and I was kind of whatever. And and then I just knew that it was time for me to do something different and leave Nashville because I was just down there, kind of pulled a post, kind of hustling, feeling real out of place, having like all these you know, grandiose ideas and dreams for myself, but knew that they weren't going to be realized. And in Nashville, so I left, and then my girlfriend went to Atlanta, and h I kind of went down there with nothing and just never came Where was your first place in Atlanta? I'm just curious. I lived in a place called Peastree Hills. Well, that was the first place by myself. That's act I got a record deal. But me and the girlfriend that I moved down there with and Martin Luther, I don't know if I lived there of course. Um that's O the brother Trey rab And who's my boyfriend at the time, and then two others, seven of us, and we lived in this apartment on Beauver Highway. Highway. You know what a highway strip clubs they but it's not it's the street that's called the truck Street from the truck stop though right to Hell. Yeah yeah, Flame is definitely still open go club, of course not it's it's a regular club, just regular at this point Atlanta, Honey to step off the plane. But we all live together, yeah, Temple Hallmark so seven, Yeah, that was at the top of and so then Um. I remember breaking up with the guy that I was loving so at that time and feeling so heartbroken, and I was just like, this is the worst thing ever happened. I must be about to get a record deal, because if this is the worst, the best thing that could happen would be there. I would get a record deal. And probably like about a month, probably a month later, I got a call from Dallas and he has me come to the studio and he was like, come right with me. Whenever they played a few songs, ah, one of which would be fine Me and one of which would be Sunshine right. And I just wrote to him and and of course I'm still there as a writer, not as a as an artist per se a singer. You know, I'm still just kind of wanting to do that. But then after we heard how the tune sounded, he was just like, don't you want to do this? And I was just kind of like, yeah, I guess I do. You know, we listen to Sunshine the Rain probably, and I'm not exaggerating, we probably listened to that probably fifty times right there, just over and over and over and over and over after it was done. And that's what kind of both let us know, like, yeah, we need to move forward on this. This is something kind of else. So was there is there any direct planning because I mean there's really I'm just kind of up in the air on who planted the flag first. But I mean, you definitely weren't under the current status quo of what music from Atlanta was supposed to be. I mean, you weren't in a tlc umbrella, nor were you under Brownstone or so. Yeah, and I felt like, and I could tell when someone's like trying hard to be contrary, like you know, just you know where everything is is well thought out and well plotted too. But it didn't feel like that to me when I heard it. I knew it was different, but I couldn't I couldn't quite call it. So, I mean, what was just the planning? Like, there wasn't any planning none. We just did it, and we did it in about two months? Yeah, yeah, month maybe two. So at the time Dallas called you the work, you hadn't signed the deal to U m I yet. I signed the deal with m I through him, Okay, that came. That came with him, Yeah, because I was signed to him as an artist actually under LIMP which was that Rowdy was through, I mean he had Rowdy. Rowdy was on aarrestill though, and then Limp was on m I. It was me and Shades a Link maybe one other somebody, maybe one other person, but one of the act. But yeah, we were the one only ones that were at m I. But there was no plan, Like, there was no The only prerequisite that I had was I wanted live instruments. That was the only thing I came And I was like, every you know, you're well known for you know your beat, you know these R and B beats and stuff, but that's not what I do. That doesn't really resonate with me. It's cool, but for what I want to do, I need the ship to be live, and if it's not live, it needs to be freaked in some sort of way that it sounding. He was like, hell, yeah, well, I was gonna ask just the question I always had, how do y'all sell that record? Like what was it like taking it to E m I? Because even now, I mean twenty plus years after released, it sounds like like it still is in the league of his own, So like, how do you sell that? In impossibly? You know, you could go at the meetings that I had at the labels. Everybody was like, Wow, she is fucking great. How do we sell it? Gary was garrs. Gary Harris was um. I don't even remember. I don't even want what department Gary worked then. Back then Gary wasn't. Dave Gossip was my and I guy because they Mr. Mr Dave right, that's oh no, no, no, no, no, no no, that's something that's somebody different. No, Dave Gossip was mine, Dave. And at that time Dave had maybe maybe he'd done from maybe like Vanilla Ice or somebody at the time, and like a few other people like he and I had some big projects Black Sheep, he did. He signed Gossip signed the Roots to Mercury. I never knew when. I didn't know that. Yeah, and the contract had they misspelled all of our names on the contract, so made it no avoid that seventy two hour period that they were making a new contract for us. Geffen came in the last minute, like and so we weren't to Geffen instead, and Dave Gossip never talked to me. Well, Dave, it was good to me while I was there, but Dave was so I just remember what I remember about Dave most thing is that the fact the Pendulum Vibe did not get his proper shot, and it's fair shake for how much he put into it, really broke his motherfucking heart. It broke his heart to the point where he didn't stepped aload music. Yeah. From after that, he was just like, I can't even like, fuck all this ship you know, now, guys has just been chilling living, you know, a cool civilian life as I call it, civilian life. You step away from this ship. And I love him to this day because he wrote really hard for him. We were just kind of all we didn't realize that there would be a machine to contend with. I know, I didn't. I just thought that I'm doing some ship. I recognized it ain't nobody doing what I'm doing. What could be so hard about selling it? Like, isn't it? What's what's the hard sale? If you put something in front of someone, if it's great, and if they've not seen it before, won't they instantly be enamored with it and curious about it? And won't it Like ain't that how to funk it? Go? And then I remember saying, you know, we'll put me on the road, just just put me on the road. I want to perform. Put me on the road. If you put me on the road, the people will come. They wouldn't do that. They wouldn't give you to support. They won't give me to a support. They were like, no, we're going to really try to push the radio. And here we are, they're trying to push Sunshine in the fucking round against Brownstone and come on. And I remember very clearly them saying to me too, if this was just a little bit more like what's the four? One? One? That's not about to ask you? Who were the contemporaries at the time marriage, So, so what's the four? Mom? Was like super huge, and everybody included let me, let me ask who because they always do this usually like we'll coming on a Monday and they'll be like, all right, sitting on the couch, guys, um, I'm gonna play you some remixes, just my ideas and see if you guys like it, and then they'll be like twelve. There's so many distortion and static remixes, like swell of them that never made it to the light of day. So like, who were they trying to match you with? Like let Eric remix? Well, because Dallas was there. They weren't really doing a lot of that. They were just kind of because he had the magic touch at that time, so they weren't really doing that. They were He was really trying to push it from the standpoint of y'all gotta trust me on this, like we gotta like I'm telling you this is you know, and they just weren't. They couldn't understand how to do it. And you know, it wasn't really about like because it was several, you know, rock bands that I was on the label with, all of them had to support, all of them was out on the road. They was just getting started. I didn't understand why I couldn't handle to a support and why I could go in world, Why it wasn't important for me to build my fan base like that, And it just wasn't looked at for it wasn't looked at like that. By then, the death of the Black Band had really kind of already occurred, except for just these few concrete roses like y'all and Man Condition and Tony Tony Tony, like the Black Band had been reduced. It had been it was done. So the idea of that even at that time, and they were like, if you go out and you do shows with dad, and I was like, a dad, ain't performing on fucking dad. I mean a band, you know, my band did I have? But at that time too, I was rolling with a larger band um and Dallas was on keys and Colin was on but that was later. That was after he joined, But that was later, like when Pendulum vibed or was like Dallas and Colin woolf and it was that's crazy like their day job, feed in the machine. But I got what I want. This is what I want to do, you know. And that's kind of been Also that's been a lovely bright spot over the course of my career is that people do like to come and work with me when they want to make a departure from kind of what they're used to doing. Or they'll bring me in and be like I want you on what I do and I'm like, fine, you know I can do that too. But a lot of people will come and be like, I want to do some different ship, I don't want to work with you, um, And I like that. I like to be I like to be that haven for people. I'm cool with that. But anyways, that was and then were in the band. It was about probably about eight of us at the time, and that just won't gona work a three background things. They won't gonna pay all that ship yeah, at the time, because it just it had to be the fullness of the sound. At that time, I hadn't tapped into mom. I hadn't tapped into being able to feel comfortable enough with something more stripped down. I figured that out by the second album UM. Once I started working on me with Cleansing Syndrome, with Fishbone UM, and even there was a lot of them in the band, I had more. I was able to zero in more on rhythm section and what that meant. So I was able to zero in on that drum, that bass, that guitar, and and and and get from that what I needed. And so for a number of years I saw a I toured with was just drums, bass, guitar, and it was just super fucking rocking, you know. And then that became more of a home place for me to the point where I really didn't want to to to funk with nothing outside of that, you know, particular set up. What was ahead? Oh what was the transition? So after Penelum Vibe dropped and then you started working on me. But cleansing, they're just stopping in between. We gotta asked about Freedom. We didn't talk about the impact that Pendulum Vibe had on a certain to get the match, but I'm want to get Freedom first and didn't get the match. Okay, So could you talk about the the Freedom project. Freedom um came about um from apparently the people from from Panther the film at the time. Uh, I guess maybe Polydor. It was hell browed it back with the Probably Polly Ground heard Freedom on the Whole Music when they were calling up to the studio to talk to Dallas. And when they heard it on the on the Whole music, this is what I was told and she could be. They heard it. It sounds really great. It's a story. They heard it on the Whole Music and decided that they want that's what they wanted to use for the soundtrack. And then they had this idea that they would, um, you know, bring in every black female artist that was working in R and B at the time. It was like the female you will know, it was like the female um and jeez, everybody was there. But when I got that call, um, that's what they wanted to do and that all those women were going to be on there. I just remember being like like, this is incredible, you know, and then it was like breathing some more life into pendulum vibe. It was like a a good consolation for how heartbreaking it was Unford to have not done what I thought it was gonna do and for it to not have been accepted the way I really thought that it would be accepted and stuff. And so it shed another light for me on kind of what it means to have like critical acclaim because I didn't really understand that concept at the time either. But doing that let me know. Because then people, the ladies, that was a really powerful experience because all those ladies you know that I met that day, I still have, you know, a tremendous amount of respect four you know, and they still have a tremendous amount of respect for me. And some of them have gone on, you know, to ascend to you know, crazy commercial successful heights. But it's never been another moment like that since what a group of black female singers, I don't female one. They have a title for it, like like Black Men United, was that you won't know what was the female version of you know what, it was various artists for Africa, that's a various artists. And then so I remember you're telling me, so the Sweet Honey and the Rock thing you got like, I didn't. I didn't even know. I thought it was your song. I didn't know it was Oh another heartbreak. So yeah, that was that. Blessed my little heart. Just just baby, just out there trying to say something. She ain't knowing nothing about, no logistics going on, and she didn't get um. So my so pendulum vibe opened up with I'm Gonna stand. I saw Sweet Honey. My mom took me to see Sweet Honey in the Rock and Fish Chapel when I was in seventh grade, and it changed my life. And I decided from that point professionally, when I would do music, whatever, whatever project I came out with, first Sweet Honey in the Rock, something by Sweet Honey in the Rock would be the first thing that I would have on my records. I would cover it in some way. So once I got once I you know, got the deal and started making out, I was like, I'm gonna put I'm gonna stand on this record, and I had it cleared. M I cleared it for pen but again hearing PolyGram, hearing the ship on the whole music, they're thinking they had no They're just thinking it's mine, so they weren't even using it initially. There ended up being so many women on the song that they didn't have enough room to do features for all the artists, and so that's how they decided we we're just going to add that beginning part to the song and how to fund am I supposed to know if the people in PolyGram, like got their paperwork shipped together and got clearance from Sweet hunting in the work. What turns out they never got clearance. Nobody fucking got clearance. And Bernie Johnson reading suit. But what does it have to do with you personally? Though? I was just because I was a writer, I'm naming the suit. So basically they took the interlood that was before Freedom and so so for the for the optic, for the v DEO and for the other because who ended up being on the beginning of that Vanessa Williams involved maybe to change you know, it was like all these profile you know at the time, like super duper um, but I ended up getting su and man, it hurt my fucking feelings and it was just so Unfair's just like, how does that happen? How do I have to take the fucking hit for this ship? Like I hadn'tna do it? That I didn't, I didn't, you know, did you ever really get a chance to talk to her and like Bernie to Miss Bernie? I did not. And she's a fantastic, awesome daughter to Tosi, who's badass musician, and uh huh, that's that's Dr Regan And I don't know. Tosi and I have a lot of mutual mutual sister friends. Um, but even she I've never met in person, but I remember kind of trying to do Doctor Reggan back in the day and she was like, na, oh that's as family. Maybe he could bring you all together for two and eighteen. Can you not throw me under the bus or my own show? Please? She isn't the one that's the cousins. There's a cousin of mine in the group. I don't even know. I haven't met her either. Don't put that gun away for you, um, but I just I always speaking to it with you know, she got to know by now that that child didn't hand him to do with that ship. I know she know, and I just you know, I kind of charged it to the game. I was like, I know, I'll be able to meet Dr Reagan one day and it'll be all good. Wow, I'm right, So this is gonna be a lot of those stories. So let's just go for it. Get the cleanex. Oh yeah, I was just gonna how did Madonna find out about the Pendulum Vibe? Uh? Probably because um, she was working with my guess this guy. I'm sorry that it could be that guy is always her ear to the street. It could be. And I'll say this too, I think any people of that particular ILK at that time knew who I was because the first person that reached out to me, that was working with me was Lenny Grab. It makes sense, um, which is how Han Dallas ended up. But um, but Lenny reached out like, you know, who is this? What is the sunshine in the rain? Who is this girl? I want to meet her? I want to meet her, you know, And he called record label, found me, invited me out with he and his friends. I just remember being like, whoa fuck? What kind of your virgin virgin big old umbrella back then? Kind of yeah, it wasn't too hard, not too much of a stretch, but you know, it's his little old meat and you know, um, and that was fun and it was great to be like acknowledged and great to be you know, uh, you know acknowledged, you know, seen for for my craft. And I think through him, I think he kind of let a lot of people know, yeah, about what was what was happening at that time. And then um, Madonna would end up reaching out for Dallas to produce Bare Time Stories. Uh um oh that uh damn, damn no, I'm just saying now it makes sense because even with I'm Not Sorry Human Nature, I was like, yo, that's I feel like joy. She definitely heard the album and definitely loved it, and they definitely had to go back into a little restruction, but she ended up helping you out. Though she was had. It wasn't like any now that motherucker that made a phone called Stephen Mazill and I've got the Calvin Clan campaign. I'm not she was cold. I never had any issues. She was actually fair, very cool, like you know the times that she actually mentioned one day like doing a show together because the thing is interesting because it's like, yes, that's great. You're modeling, not singing, right, We're also a Maverick association. I just remember that myself though, okay, cool, we're not trying to throw salt on the game. I just know that was real. That was Madonna. I see a game. I peeked it just they often retweet our shows album they appreciate it. Joy out there. But no, she didn't reach out on any tip like that. I don't know that anybody ever reached out, you know what, not that we could afford to do anything with you at the time, but definitely Gary was saying that, uh, you were someone that we should work with. I mean just at the time, I'll say, before we realized what had to happen. And also you two found your own family tree with the Dudgeon family, Like when you're alone, I realized that you need a group of people. You basically need five to seven people that do what you do and be in a community. So well, I mean, I guess that's what you were basically going with Fishbone with the next Yeah, I did more so with them I think than than Yeah, like I did. I definitely did that with them. Um, and I would collaborate with DF You know, and I would go on the road with them, not as joy though not as an NT. I would go you know, as music director, or go as singing backs, or go as you know, doing things of that nature. When Goody first went out a little bit later on, I would do that music direction and stuff for them because Low and I just had kind of a we knew it each other like, and I could, you know, get the ship together, um and make sure everything was was good for them. But not as a joy entity. No, always in a more of a supporting um kind of bro you know, which is fine, you know which is whatever? Because I would still do my own ship, you know, whenever I would do my own ship. So I gotta ask in the most diplomatic way possible because we have a lot of mutual people in common. Yes we do, but you but you and I also have a lot of experiences in common. And I don't say that even with whatever my weird journey is in music, I always still felt like the bride's maid and never the bride. And there is no feeling like the feeling of you're thinking, Okay, there's gonna be the moment, It's gonna be there. Always in January like this is gonna be okay, this is year we're gonna get together, and then yeah, you honestly you're like all right, cool, cool next year, just keep working. But how I would like to know? And again I'm not I've never want to use the show as a got to journalism or that sort of thing. But you are literally one of the people of my contemporaries that I could possibly think has had the same sort of toward us in the hair Journey. So what is that feeling with Once the years start to develop and suddenly people are open to alternative ways of cing R and B and I'll say your name with Erica and everything, and you're not getting your turn, Like how do you? I've said tears over many of Rolling Stone cover, I've had panic attacks, shot throw many a coffee mug at you know, I get it, so damn that mix. Um, here's the thing. One thing I've been pretty blessed with is the ability, like I like, when we're in the beginning of this interview, when I told you from very little m I've known my ship ain't like everybody else's ship, So the journey is not like everybody else's. So if and I mean and I really really realized that early on. So and and another thing that I don't do it, which is probably why I've been able to keep a lout of my zin and my sanity and check, is that I don't do a lot of I'm not a I'm not a comparer. I don't compare myself two other people. I don't compare what I have going on in my life or what they have going on in their life. I just don't do it. And this is from the jump of your life. This is from my life. This is not me as an artist. This is me as a human being. Because when we started this conversation, you said something to me that was very ill for somebody that was your age. You said that when oh Boy broke up with you, it was one of the saddest parts of your life. But you knew that you were about to get a record deal. It's already clear on what balance, what checks. A lot of people would take some books, some spiritual learning, some things you know, to really realize that not moment, no no, no book has taught me my nothing has taught me better than my experience and my living and my making it through. But what keeps you saying in balanced, because what keeps me saying and balance is that I'm still here and I know I got shipped to do. That's what keeps me saying. I believe you know what it is quest here, it is in a nutshell genuinely. I believe my best work is in front of me, genuinely. So if I didn't believe that, then I could be mad and I could be like what fox on so on song so got damn had my goddamn shoes on at one time? And on so goddamn head this is on? So sound like me on that and that bitch? No she got damn sample that nothing, No he got damn it. No. My contemporary, my my peers get mad like that about certain ships, and I have to calm them. They're like, why y'all, I mean, but why are y'all so helping on comparing me to the next motherfucker? Why are you so helping on that. It's not because they're projecting, they're pro and it's not what it is. I'm with it. If I did not believe, then my best work and my my my finest, finest self was not in front of me. If I didn't believe that then I wouldn't be doing it h And it's literally that simple. It don't mean the ship don't hurt or don't you know, It doesn't mean that I'm not affected by those things. It just means that I'm rooted in something that anchors me outside of all the external noise. How fast did it take you to realize that? For me? Like, I'll be honest with you last year, I'm really truly not lying to you. I'm not lying to you, and I'm not I'm not even saying to the point where it's like, oh, I had to watch all my contemporaries fall or break breakup or that sort of thing. But you know, even though like I still don't know where this place is where, it's like, Okay, I get the write books and teach class and do a radio show, and but I definitely feel like I knew that my biggest fear starting was whether or not I'd still be here in nine That was like some super future ship. And I'm not even talking about like two thousand five or two thousand fifteen or even two thousand twenty five. But you know, I know four years as a rap career, Like I mean, that's it's rap. It's like high school, like literally you got four years to get your money, and then after that it's kind of like, you know, I think I came to the conclusion that if Tarik and I really got what we wished for, you know along the way, you know whatever, like the Bentley or whatever, the right, we would have been assholes and dead would have been dead. Yeah, we would have been assholes. Like inside of the way too free way to what I would do because I'm a creature of desire, I do what the funk I want to do, so and because I'm that way, I would have just telling what the he said that I couldn't have I couldn't have had it like that million units. But he was saying like he was saying like the question is like, you know, can you survive your success? That's the thing, Like you can because whatever it is you're into, if it's girls, if it's dope, if it's whatever, you're gonna get all of that dope, all the dope, all the holes, all the cars, whatever it is into. So with success, the question that comes can you survive it? And if you get it too early? You know, that's why a lot of people don't think I I agree, I would have. I definitely I didn't. The road had to be temperate. I just I really look at it because now where I am in my life now, you know, should some people looking at me like a damn shaman at this point, you know what I'm saying. And my friends who uh, you know, do have to be under the lights, you know all the time. Um, you know, can find you know, some comfort and being able to come and and and and sit with me or talk to me and to to to get grounded, you know, and where they are and and to have to to to to to gain some clarity about where they are. So kind of what ended up happening as a result of all these experiences and me having to process and digest all these different things that have happened to me career things I've seen, whatever, it's really turned me into an a one fucking therapist without the doctorate, you know, but a one like a fucking one like really, I was about to say, your door is open. Please do not want to share that info? Please do? And um And that's the kind of book where I could, but you can't touch everybody's difference. I need something, I need something for the everyday man, because that's it's human ship. You're talking. Yeah, it's just and that's and those are things that I'm you know, those are journeys I have to to to to get suited up for with being able to put things into books and do things like that. Because my mom, I'm so like, just come see me. Yeah, because see me and sit on my couch. You know what I'm saying, Like a book, fuck, a seminar, funk all of that. Okay, I was thinking about everybody else, but I'll come over your house everybody else. I'm just like we're sitting in here to your house. I'm about the tears was about for a month. Yeah, because we've about to finish album for this week. You got the month off. You're about to go and will take it camp quite a you know. I'm you know constiguian. I bring my medicine with me too. You can bring all medicine. You might bring your medicine. We'll share medicine. You're not supposed to share prescriptions. I just want to do some drugs, so joy. Yes, Okay, So the tenure for the tim Injuries, sweet Badass song, the Fishbone period, Okay, did I pronounced that right. The tenure is that what you say, Jim Cheery serious tree like no, not not Mary Poppins. You're thinking the mith it man, Jimmy. The flow was quote Mary Poppins, Jim Jim Jury didn't watch Mary Poppins. You never seen you never but I knew that. But you're really gonna love it. It's really good. You're like yann On watching Poppins in the next nig and you watch all of Friends. Yeah, you better watch Mary Popps. I had nothing to do. I was in Maui alone. You could have watched Marry Poppins. You watched Friends, and the randomness it would have been over sooner, the randomness of it. You're going to check it out one time late night. You totally are like, I watched I will watch Mary Poppins. Thank you anyway, pronounced this fish bad. Y'all just looked at me like you don't know what this is, don't know. I was just I thought you were saying Chimmy Cheery because Jimmy Cheerry Sauce is like the sauce shop it on Steak about steak, so like it. So we we actually not many people will not many people know I think one third of our third album, Oldelf Half Life we recorded at dark Yeah, And I was gonna say, um, how did how did you guys pull? Uh uh, I'm about to say Norwood Angelo away from that goddamn Thurman miss Sherman. Well, he practiced that ship like seven hours a day, he did, and that it was newly discovered for him at the time. It's still a party like once it came and never left. Now that's still a part of the Fishbone show. But he's, you know, masterful with that one. Now back seven. You want to answer questions like, so he loved it, he loved it so deep in heart? Um so, just being in that chaotic environment, what was that like? Wonderful? Oh? Okay, you embraced that. I embraced it. I'm not good at chaos my kind of freedom and can't see I am I don't do well with order and do it after three weeks attentive. I'm disciplined with so much that I'm not following the rules. I just recognized that the rules, you know, I'm what. I'm not going to yield so easily to someone else's control and I'm not gonna be brown bunctious or funked up about it, but I will if I want to. I'm gonna to make some else. I can't be here. It's like that, coming for a second in the morning, talk to me. But I'm also super respectful and super nurturing of other people's ways and how other people are. So I have a lot My mama is you know, she got a little amal thing a little bit with her. You know, my auntie got a little a thing where they really need real orderly, really about route. And I appreciate that deeply. It's just not me so I can do it for a time. I just can't exist in it and perfect. How many beatings you get before they were just like I do as at all? Oh yeah, a lot growing up and just after a point they was just like, y'all, this is just how she gonna be. Um. But that time period with them was really wonderful. Um. I had met Angelo. He was doing a Doctor Mad Vibe thing in Atlanta, and I went to it, and I was so excited because of course I'm a fan from uh you know, from from from their southern California. Yes, And I remember seeing them on soul training. I remember them performing phrase did every day sunshine trying to killer And so I met Angelo there and he was super funny and insane and awesome, wonderful, and he was like, man, we just lost our deal with who they was said Sony or see the other who Sony at the time, because the last aven they didn't. I think maybe give the monkey brain, which is great thing. Um. And he was like, so, Fisher one doesn't have a deal And I was like, what, I might have a deal. And I said you were the bridge to Dallas. Yes, So I said, um, y'all gonna have a record deal. Y'all gonna do that ship here in Atlanta And he was like, I was like, we're gonna, we want to do it. So I took Antelo to meet Dallas, and of course Dallas was like fucking fishbone. Dude likes being cool because he's a little quiet, kind of reserved cat bag being still kind of his but he was really kind of quiet a shot back again, but he was freaking out on the inside and uh. And they started dialogue about it, and he made that he pushed that ship through pretty quick because onless he found out he could really do it. He was just like, you know, so as really pushed that forward, and the guys ended up spending a tremendous amount of time in Atlanta over the next year. So here's Fishbone in Atlanta, like during like at the dungeon, and you know they meet U g K. Because I mean shouts them out on on Rodan dirty at the end, he shots out of fish Ball because he spent I mean, because you know they were we were very good friends, you know, um at the time blend and people like our family, UM, we're getting out with married and um. And they ended up just spending a lot of time with them too because they were just round. So here it's like you g K, it's Fishbone, it's cast as Goodies, it's you know me, It's it's like it was just this you know back then. Describe what working with Dallas is like, because i mean, again, you know what what was his first joint? Mr dj would Yeah, So, I mean he was a child, you know, he was in high school age. But to have that range of being a new jack proprietor and just going to the new soul like sort of swimm into that and then to go all over the place, right, how was he able to because he's turning out the hits for everybody at this point, how is he able to devote time to you, to them, to TLC, to Madonna, like just keep all of this. It was a lot. I can't remember it being a lot for him then. It was a lot for you, though, I mean in terms of like hello, are you picking up? You know, it wasn't that way for me, only because like that's not like the same age, same exact age, and how things were structured with us back then. It was a little more family dynamic ish, so it was a little more like, that's my partner. If his mom was cooking on Sunday, I'm going over to the house, like which he would have everybody come over with his mom's house on Sunday. But like they would do these regular occurrences. If he's a student, he's working on I'm going by the studio and he gonna hit me I'm at studio. I didn't necessarily, I didn't have problems with accessibility with him. No one did. He wasn't an inaccessible person at the time. If you were working with him, Um, he could get ghosts like you know, the best of whoever. But but I didn't have that problem and I didn't see him. And thinking back, that ship happen, you just call out all that ship. I was like, damn, he was young as fun back then and he was doing all that ship like I hadn't even thought about it like that, and so I should. I guess he handled, you know, as best he could and did a pretty decent like a job of it because he was working on I mean but cleansing syndrome. We were working on that at the same time. They were doing Chim Chimp was at the same time. And then um, whatever else he was doing because at that point to you know, everybody's calling you for these individual tracks and you know you got the work or remixes, and you're doing all kinds of ship for everybody. Um. I didn't have any accessibility problems with him. He was great to work with. He was um adventurous, He was rooted and soul and funk. He was, you know, a James Brown student, you know, an old soul student, a p funk student. So we had a lot in common. He was just doing this R and B. You know, he had gone heavy into this new urban R and B sound, but his roots were in the ship that I sucked with so it it was always, you know, a pleasure, very easy, you know to work with him. Was that? I mean? But was that? Or yes, well it was supposed to be a but cleansing is like my black album never commercially released. What happened, so in my folds about two weeks before am but was supposed to come out, I Am I folded and the label prior to that, they were with it. They were like, we're gonna put it out, We're gonna put it out, and then the label folded. So then it was like they had the video out Forghetto Superstar and the video Forghetto Superstar had just dropped. Oh no, it hadn't come out yet. Because here's what ended up happening. Once a m I followed Dallas hurried up and got another situation together with this other cat. I can't even remember. Maybe V not V two. I don't want to get that wrong. Um was it? Uh no, I know you're talking because he put out was that the Lisette Young, Sad and Blue, that free world, Free World? In the free world? Though? Was that I had that single in college that nourish It look at You when I'm so tired on there does it have. I don't think that's on there, but it's it's the one with the pink cover. Yeah, yeah, maybe it because I'm so tired. Was a lot of people that have that, because I wasn't on like the big, the more widely distributed some people have the one when I'm so tired that it was like the college sampler umstte free World. So he ended up cooking up a deal real quick, put that together and got some money behind ship, and then we shot the video for Ghetto Superstar, and then Ghetto Superstar was really that girlf It was doing well. It had been like kind of pulled into that whole MTV regular play list when they would do a little R and B ship back then or whatever. And then Free World folded Jesus and then I was just like, there's a route on my life. There's a curse of me. There has to be. This is some bullshit. No, no, no, You were like, because that's not the way. Said again I said, you were like, this is my journey though, because you know, even on our journey, we gotta take me sometimes. One thing. Yeah, did you have your daughter? And That's what I was leading up to. I had just had keep sire that keeps I was born. So the first iteration of amber cleansing syndrome began before Keeping was born, and the second iteration because I went back and added you turned me on time need one. You just said that she's always going to be yeah, grown Marblin, She's gonna be two forever. I know. I remember working at Clark Atlanta Radio and you're walking in with a baby. That is I feel. I mean, I was going in the nineties. It was weird, you're only a couple of years, but yeah, keeps twenty one. She'd be twenty two in June, but um, so yeah. Then I went back in and I added, you turned me on Thetbell cover Tom Smile went back in and did something with Colin wolf Um, and then I added Ghetto Superstar, Gettle Superstar came letter up something I added to me, but cleansing for them to be just on, we don't have that one one, so we're making it. Added that one, and there's one I'm missing. I'm sorry I forget, but yeah, so it was too. It was before Keeping, before and after Keeping. Uh, thank you danielon does By. Yeah, I'm sorry. So the two you know it was before Keeping After Keeping Mean, but Cleansington Drome took a while to come out. I started working on it in and then it actually came out in uh well, didn't actually come out. Was finished with it in ninety seven. As it was about to be released, everything all the plugs got pulled. So I just after that, that's really what made me kind of go deeper into being more of the wind beneath other people's wings because it was a little too I just I didn't know how much I had left in me to get kicked in my kicked in my chest like that, shotgun blasted in my chest like that, and then before another Ghetto Superstar to come out, like I was trying to get it out of my head because every time I hear the title, the other one comes in my head, and I'm trying to get it out. What I tell you, I don't like that's as to this day. I'm sorry, I'm hugging you right now. I remember thinking like it's this, how y'all gonna do it? It's just gonna be the black, Like it's just gonna it's gonna be like this, We're just gonne. And I remember, and it was always these situations, whether it was just enough what you're doing is legal for it to be okay, and you can't like it's only the moral like you just gonna do what you're gonna do. You only have that, but you don't have like a legal leg to stand on and ship, so you just gotta be like shrug. Wait. But we talked about keep, but we didn't talk about her debut, you before she was even born, and how that I felt like that was a whole history making moment on screen. Yes, that was okay because I was about to say I thought in China, but China was a little thing. But I was pregnant in a pikini with a bikini sheer moment. It was a moment were you did you have questions like was the pikini? Did you say, I'm going to do it, but I must be in my bikini? No, I came, I just came dressed that it was a summer day. No, it was you're gonna be. They wanted to be in a video and I was gonna shut it down. And I'm on this bikini with this ship dressing him and this and what video was? And I bet you nobody complained And that was and that was the day I met Erica really wow, because she was in the video first drop. That was her first little It's crazy first seeing you know, first seeing her on the screen, and that was my first time meeting her and my first time meet my Faith that day too, and Faith was pregnant with little um lou c J at the time. That's crazy because then the in between what was the video? It wasn't Eric's video where you were in the car. I just have a visual of I haven't been in any any no you know what, No, you're thinking of Lucy Lucy Brow. I wasn't think it couldn't be there because you're my man, right, I am not in domes. I'm in without you and you because you know my I came in at the very just to finish up awards season and the tour. That was it? What was that transition? I feel like you're just then fix it. Yeah, it's like a fix It's like some fixer ship. It really he is um fixed with no drama like deliver in low key, don't end up in flow with Seriously, we're first about that. Where's our jingle? I'm sorry? Yeah, I'm sorry, I'm sorry that was your first brilliant moment of comedy on the show. Damn, it only took almost two years. No, that was for phone call at the eleventh hour, you know, that was you have to say no. Dif few things I've had to say low to a no to a lot of things. Who did you say no, I can't do the project right now? Or I'm good? You know what? Like your weirdest offer, my weirdest offering spice girls, that would have been hilarious. That's weirdest offer. Child. I don't even know. I can't even so much. Damn ship in my brain. I don't know. I don't know. You could ask me this probably in two hours and I'd be like child, it was that one. But right I can't think of what my weirdest one would be. But I have to say the stuff that the universe was shoot at me, um the universe that it'll be tough, fucked up, kind of hard kind of lessons and stuff. But it's not. It ain't nothing that I can't, you know, stand back, and it ain't nothing that I can't be like what you know, I'm always proud of the work, So anything that I've done, I'm still proud of the work, you know, my involvment in But I can't really I can't think right now of what the what I've turned down. While I was like probably because once I turned something down, I'm through with that and I don't think about that. I don't, I don't store that. No. Well, um, but working with you know, getting a call from right it was cool because I was just like, you know, I'll be on the lips of my name, will be on the lips of some you know, some folks in the demographic that otherwise absolutely wouldn't know who I was. So and he's the homie and where you shot that? Like okay or is it like whatever? Like I mean, are you I don't mean in a jaded cinema And I mean it's just like it's a job. It was a job, like I looked at it like a job that I can do for now, Like that's what it looked like, Like this is a good temporary gied and I'm gonna do it. We're playing them back because I also forgot that we toured uh during the good in mind period. Yeah, and also so it's like I was pregnant where you have to sort of not you kind of have to. It's a weird laying in the cut and being a team member. Been doing it for so long now, like you have to remember after me, but cleansing syndrome, that really started me to being a little to scale back. I wasn't so in pursuit of the spotlight, and I just wanted to work, you know what I'm saying. So once I just got to that point, I was just like, I just want to work and I'm not so you know whatever. And I think for other people it's far more weird than it is for me, because people have these these notions of me and what they think I am and how they think I am and all this type of ship and so then when they meet me, they really not like that. Yeah, I think the notion of like what fame being a successful musician. Musician is like you can be a success and nobody knows, nobody knows, ye, And that's what I know. You know, I don't give a fuck about that. Other part of fame is not even controllable enough for me to want it, you know, Like it doesn't offer the freedom I'm too. I live and die by my freedom, and fame doesn't offer a tremendous amount of freedom. It has perks, but it doesn't. It's enslaving the opposite of freedom it is. And so I don't. I ain't never been titillated by that particular part. I've only felt the I know that when you do good art, the fame tends to come with it. So if I had to endure the fame to produce the good art, then I would do it. But that part of it so me kind of stepping back and being like, well, I just do work with other people. That was That wasn't a hard decision to make. That was like, hey, I want to work be I just say me, I'm tired of all that other part of ship anyway, and I'm just who the funk I am, And I'm just gonna be that and do that and raise my child. And if you were famous, I think me and you couldn't have been sitting outside the Dennis or whatever the chilling that moment. It would have been something totally different exactly. And see, I I I have to be able to sit outside of Dennis with my folks sometimes, you know what I'm saying, Like, I have to be able to do that in this life. You miss any who you missed Denny's. No, not at all. It doesn't happened. No, I was just saying in those moments because he's so it's opposite in that way, like what you're talking about, like that outside of my illustrious apartment about up, you got that fancy Denny's, the only, the only Denny's in Manhattan. So I'm very familiar. It was like a metaphor. But then I love ready only pread sometimes anyway, So yeah, maybe like twice a week I'm at that Denny's connecting and the other thing too. I have to say, is that famous my kind of fame or how I'm famous? You know? My my way? It's um, it's different because people I don't. I don't deal with a out of like foolishness and ridiculousness to other people. Like people fun with me because they fun with me, not because other people people to fun with me, you know. And so I don't have like a fickle anybody that was you know, they came along as a supporter of what I do from pendum, but they still here. You know. I ain't lost, No, ain't nobody like I don't funk with joy she wet or she don't do whatever. I didn't like that other album and she but no, everybody still supports me, stays down, goes over with me, and believes in my ability to continue to produce good works. Yeah. I remember. I mean when we did the record together for those albums, I was just still getting in my head. I was telling them my well, now, wife, you know what I was like, Joy is on the way to the house, like about to be in my house. She's like what what I'm like? Yo? You understand I met her when I was sucking fourteen and Nashal at my house, like, so just to see that come full circle, like to meet you when we were at Yeah, you were doing an in store. I think I like skip school to come see you promote Pendulum Vibe. It was her and Jay Rum We're coming. It was both. It was and uh and yeah the store and I was there and we saw we were there. We were there to see j Ru and we didn't even know that she was coming. It was just you know, j Ru was like I would go see Ju. So then she showed up tall with like the orange hair. It was like, who is that there? And so they gave us the sunshine in the rain take. It was just the single that was the It was like the yellow like orange. Yeah, it was the yellow tape. We was just like all right, what is this? Like all right, well I check it out and we took it home and it had the same It had the song on one side and the instrument on the other and we used to free stop some issuance yo yo, that was it. I was like, we used to yeah that instrumental, man, That's what the guys from DF said when I met that. We were sitting in the dungeon freestyle and when I came into the studio, they were like, that's the girl wore your ship. Yeah yeah, So yeah, that was to go from there to actually be able to sit in co write and produce a record with Jordan And that was a great experience. I thank you. She enjoy sat like in my crib, like were just in my crib and bang that. So, since we're talking about experiences and recording, I just because in my mind, you were part of the equipment, I like recording era right where you are part of the aliens. You came in Aliens. I was like, yeah, because I feel like at some point we would hear you in the background. Yeah, I am, but before I guess I'm saying before that, I guess that's what I was saying. Are you asked me specifically about Aquamena? Is that what I'm asking about? That just that time period in Atlanta and that feeling. Yeah, I was, Yeah, And its like from an outsider, it just looked like another world of heaven, I guess based on the players in that whole situation, and I was just curious from your perspective, again, that's that's perception. But what was it really like like during that time in Atlanta amongst from there was a renaissance happening. That's what I'm saying. You know, at that time we lived for the romantic perception of it. Yeah, that's what plicious like. Was it like magical? Three? I mean, at times it could be that was some magical moment. You have to tell the story. The reason why you said that, you have to tell the story and do the impression of Rico singing you may die please. She didn't remember telling me this would dude o god she was, she was very, very elevated. But it was the story of how Rico had an idea for you may God Rico can have amazing ideas about melodies, but Rico cannot see at all, like not at all, um, and so he was trying to yea, it was so per He was trying to, uh, you know, convey how he wanted the melody to go. And I feel like he was just guy because you know, you can't be that's how you say, and that was actually peaches that h But as we're you know, peace is not kind of coming up with how we you know, go float with it and went and weeks like, oh, so y'all should do a lot. You can be shure, I low to get high, you may learn to you you die or some ship like that, and he but just completely out of tune. But you know what he kind of means because you can and you know what the music is doing. And so you're like, actually, reek want is dun He kind of wants it like that. So then we end up, you know, pulling together, get a couple of my lyrics out, and then he just puts the thing on it and I put the you know, the backs and can you tell the babies this significance. I mean, I was in college when I used to see you girls performing and I'm just amazing. But tell people of the significance of Peaches to the movement the music well. Wild Peach Um is a funk rock band from Dallas, Texas comprised of Murna, Screechy, Peach Brown, and David wow Brown. Um. Peaches passed and two thousand seven. Uh yeah, it's been overted almost level m m uh Peaches uh in Atlanta, UM. And it was interesting because I met Peaches around the same time that I met Fishbone Um through the the rock lockdown scene, because it was a thrive. People don't know that Atlanta had a cool last black rock scene happening in the early nineties. UM. There were lots of different bands, Naked Truth and Wild Peach and wood Weinstein and follow for Now and uh Mobi's Trip and love Joy and it was a lot of bands. And because what I did live, even though I was classified as R and B, what I did live translated as something more like funk rock. So I ended up meeting Peaches and becoming really good friends with her. And she was just like this. She was she was this this incredible performer, incredible writer, incredible vocalist. UM. And it happened to be that we bought out really good ship in each other and UM and we worked really well together. So we started just lasing you know, people's backs. We ran in, particularly with the guys and the DF because I ended up introducing them to introducing Dave and and and and Peaches to Dia. Really yeah, yeah, I am the bridge, yeah for sure, you know. UM. And so that's how they ended up linking up. And from the initial you know, like it started off with Peaches singing backgrounds was UM with me and with UM A couple of the sisters that were kind of interchange out. Uh. Later on, UM Keecha Jackson come in and she would end up being a staple there as well later UM, but it was Peaches and not in the beginning and UM that blend and that was vocal just all that ship was killed. But Peaches was you know, on the ground level from the building of things, and I bought her with me and once she was you know, got in there, and then they were able to check out, you know, the band for the themselves and stuff. Then everybody just you know, they started loving them too. But they had already been doing their wild Peach thing on the scene in Atlanta and they had had like a major record deal or something that didn't you know, one of those things where they damn sure didn't know what to do with Peach. There didn't anything locally, they didn't, um, but they would do shows and they have these incredible ass songs that people still and I think, Wow, it is gonna do a full release of I think he's working on something pretty special. I think for her, um and for them because the the what they brought to the table um freed all of us up. Because they were also a little bit older than us. UM, so they had just more you know, the most seasoning on the thing too. UM. But Peaches was a fantastic writer, a fantastic vocalist, Uh, killer fucking vocal stylist, and unlike you know anything before or since. Yeah. Absolutely, she's my sister and I miss her every day. You mentioned something earlier and I know that, UM, a really big influence on your life. Uh as far as your your music was Betty Davis. Could you talk about her influence on you? And have you ever gotten to meet her and have a one on one and you never got to meet her? Now she's still there. Yeah, they're there. I mean there's still talks of her life or bio in the movie whatever. But but she's very um um, yeah, it's extremely reclusive. She's sort of like giving notes to the producers of the movie, like not in front of them and that sort of thing. I think she just wants to remain a mystery. But have you made attempts to try to or is that one of the heroes that you know? I don't ever want to meet my heroes, you know what. I don't give a shit about that about the meeting of heroes and things like that. So you would never like to have to sit down with her, and just I would, That's what I'm saying. I don't care. I don't have any like, oh my god, that's meet them at this point now, because I know people in life is crazy. It takes people down through that any goddamn thing could happen. Like for what I've created about you in my mind, that doesn't necessarily mean that that's how you're gonna be in That's fine. I ain't gonna hold it against you. It ain't got shipped to do with how bad ass that ship was that you created the influence it out of me. But yeah, I haven't talked to her. I would love to one day when the time is right, but I would never want to push that. I wouldn't want none of that. I would only want Miss bet to do that if that's something she wanted to do, because I know people have tried to get and I like, don't, don't, don't do that. Miss need know I'm out here that our for quick backdrop for our listeners that don't know. UM Betty Davis Uh ex wife of Miles Davis UM pretty much, I guess he could say. It was basically yeah, and and sort of what you've been describing as you building the Atlanta scene. I mean, she cont she was a connector. She was extremely important in the funk direction that slides up with there's a ride going on. Um. Actually there's a tattoo on her ask that literally says that this ass inventive fusion. So yeah, she was. She was very key to Miles's bitches brew development and on the corner and also with Herbie Um doing his funk stuff with the head Hunters and Chameleons. So how many wives and Miles have I'm just I'm trying to place her for She's not one that you probably would have seen. People really only talk It's mostly Cecily Tyson that people talk about that he was married to, and then maybe the one other who was Yeah yeah, but people don't really talk about because it was so quick. But she had a she had a singing career. Um kind of weird speaking of the Slide thing. Slide would be so notoriously late to these studio sessions that um yeah that basically the Family Stone be chilling like this during like the ride going on in Sepond one period that she just come around the studio and Slip be going for days and missing. And that's basically how the Family Stone became her because Greg Erico produced the first album, right, yeah, exactly with I mean, but it's Jerry and Cynthia and and Freddy Stone and the point of sister Yeah yeah pretty much. Yeah yeah, but but but I didn't know that because slo would be so lame and shoot out to the baby. We come out and she just end up getting tight with everybody and they just stopped playing for her. He'd be going for three four weeks maybe sitting and so there's just all right, let's work on our own ship. So that's how that initial album came to be. But yeah, like why why did you gravitate towards did you feel the need to like maybe take the baton that she had? And and I didn't feel that until I found out about her. And I found out about her later in my life. I was already grown once I found out about her. Um. I found out about her when I was working on Amba cleansing syndrome that makes sense, and Fishbone introduced me to her, uh No specifically Norwood fish and jb Um and they were just like because you know, we had been jamming together and doing it together on the World Age, doing all this stuff, and and it was just like have you are you for me? With Betty Daves? Have you heard her? I was like the actress, you know, right like kil cars Um. They're like no, Miles Davis's s ex wife. And I was just like no, And they were like hauld up. And then they had because at that time everybody still had like, you know, cassette were rare cassettes and ship that they would like keep little. They went back there and pulled out focus sts of her ship and the first ship they played for me was if our men look good God, And the first time I heard I mean, I was just like mother, Like seriously, it was like a right, like some missing link type ship. Because the only person I had really felt connected to like that when I was really little was like many represents Voice used to do me like that, it resonated they had a thing with me. And then I had a very in depth relationship with as a teenager musically, and so there were just these things that had you know, like there were certain but there was always something missing. There was nothing outside of like LaBelle and Funkadelic that spoke to like the gotural parts of me, but I didn't really And I loved Tina Turner as well in a hardcore way for sure, but I didn't have I didn't. There was still something missing in terms. I hadn't seen that other part of myself in anybody else. And when I heard that part of myself and anybody else, and so when they let me hear that, I was just like, Okay, so joyce for all the new Betty David's people, because now I'm in it. I'm you got me. I wasn't familiar. Give us a cheese. What what's the album that you think? Like? Can you start with first one subtitle Betty Day srank it up. It was really just three or four four. So I see nasty gown. I just want to go to it because it's just that's okay. But as start with the start with the first, start with that when and then go to last. She started dating, uh, addicted to love Robert Farmer. That makes sense, Yeah, like, yeah, she was dating Robert Palmer. Like minute, but you said addicted to love. Well, that's why I was thinking of Robert Palmer. But yes, she started dating him. Uh, and he got her deal on Island and they made a record and then never released it. A sucker like me like went to Bleaker Bob's put a few benjaminents on it, or the Acid Date I released like two years later. I was like, yeah, um, but that expanded me and opened me up in another count of way. And I just felt instantly like and I saw so much of my self in her and in her journey. Um, and I just you know, it changed me. It's one of those, you know, one of those moments in your life where do you have any aspirations and hopes to at least be a part of her biopic or the Telegramer story or I would love to. I would absolutely love to. I would absolutely I would like somebody to do the ship for I get to go out there. I have one one more question, because I know we gotta wrap soon, but it seems so obvious to me. Why have you not made a complete full album with organized Newis or would that have been too obvious? Well, not obviously, like you know, I mean, were you comfort with Dallas? You know, like you work well with Dallas And has there ever been a thing like you work well with whoever I'm working with you, whoever want to work has the conversation ever come up I'm working about them doing a whole album. They did quite a few, you know, they did, but not an entire album. But not an entire album. No, I've not done an entire album with anybody since Pendulum that but I do feel that I've worked with different producers on different ships. I would have loved it. Heard their production, and I just feel as though because they did it so well with Cast, and they did it so well with good Mom and stuff, it was talk of doing it several times. It just didn't happen. It just didn't happen, but that was always talk. It was Si was talking about full Joy album, was talking about Petre Gangster Click album. It was talking about, you know, a full Heroin album, which was me, Peaches and Stephanie at the time, and talks of a well, you know, it's been lots of talks. It's just it just wasn't something that came to Where do things stand now, just as far as where things are with the family, like is just completely separated. This person is here, this person there, this person is up there, this person down there. I mean, you know, I'm in any situation. I mean I'm always the loan wolf. Even if I'm family affiliated, I'm still the loan wolf. You know wherever I am, so, uh, everybody's good. I don't see everybody. I'm out here, you know, everybody else is in Atlanta. Um, but everything is fine with you know, like people are still cool, people still work together, people still talk. People you put on each other. You played me some sleepy stuff like when Yeah, I don't know when sleep is gonna put his uh stuff out, but I think he is gonna do with fucking soon. Yeah. Oh man, you have to tell us about being a bank bang girl. Oh god, excuse me, what a bang bang girl. Uh So the cool thing that has happened, as like I said, the behind the scenes is cool. I'm fine with it. UM. Since I've been living in l A, one of my cool hustles has been, you know, doing vocals for some for a lot of pop music, UM and in particular working with Max Martin. UM. I received a call from UH nine, who's the homie that I grew up with in Nashville, who asked me to put together three ladies some label esque type vocals. Uh And I said okay, And I made a couple of phone calls to some ladies who I knew I could sing well with and they were available at the time, and we went to a session. We were only supposed to do one song from Max Martin and it was for something we're working on for Ariana Grande. UM. We got there and it turned out to be Bang Bang, and so we did that one and we ended up doing like four more songs Jesse, Jesse, j and Ariana Grande. Okay, so wait a minute, she's singing vocals. Well, so wait did vocal I did back back in vocals. So I've just been for the last few years. I've had some some pretty consistent work doing backs with Max Martin and with other producers. Are you are you cool with Sia Garrett, You'll have some similar parallel situation. I know Sada's husband, um, Eric, because I know Erica because she was married. I used to be married to a friend KP years ago. Uh huh. But I've never met miss Sidia and she's the ship. But I've never met her and she's the yeah, and I respect all of her ship and just she's just the ship. That's like she's a ship. Um and maybe I haven't met her once, but it was just very impassing. It wasn't anything too in depth. But yeah, the bank bang grew up me and tar Stinson then uh uh in Dombi, Oh yeah, yeah. So the three of us have been doing for the past few years and it's been it's been really cool. We haven't done anything in a bit, but we're so happy that y'all are like working and stealing it. But we did. We've done a lot and it led to other work. So it's like with us doing that for him and with that going so well, then it was like other people that were reaching I wish it girls and we just end up calling use as a bank and girls, because that was the first thing that we stung on together, and because Max was calling us statoo and bragging that he didn't want nobody but the Bank Bank Girls. You were talking though, that's like a whole supergroup Joy Hope the one. Well it is. But you know, girl, we're just gonna work checks. We I mean, check us out individually. That's the check She talking about Joy in Final Questions. The intro. Yeah, that's that's know. You have been a part of like two of the greatest intro albums intro to albums ever, Thank you, thank you. Right left me alone and he was working on that project. He just left me in the studio. Whatever, dude, can you write me something? I was like, pay And what I said was I love that ship. I was like, I'm gonna write you. So, I'm gonna write your intro song, write your intro, some theme music. That's what I said. Like I got me out. I was like, I'm gonna give you something. It'll be your virgin. It's like okay. So he left me and then I wrote the that's right, Ritter making money in l a Yeah, fun, that's right. Right. We almost had a Joy Fonte and everybody. You can kiss my entire black black Oh but yeah, that was one I love. That's one of my favorite things I've done. It was very fun making it, it was and he loved it. So I was glad that, you know, glad I was able to Was that given away? Was that after before your did I'm So Famous? After that was after Okay, that was after I thank you that, But I want to infest it to the world. Thank you, Thank you. I love I'm so famous. Thank you. Tensey Slam is the Bombers. Yeah, dance Yesterday's dance Yesterday. That's my favorite on that one. Thank you? Is there a new yes? When? When? When we're saying it was January? So it's already out now? All right? Yes, that's what I'm y. Yeah, I send to you what the album is called, sir, Rebecca Holy Love? Why you changed your Twitter name? I was like, it must be a new album? Is that like a Sasha Fierce type thing? Or is there a story behind that? Well? You know, I'm Tennessey Slam. You know what I'm saying. It's just another alias Savage, Immortal and Righteous Rebecca Holy Love. There, what can you tell us about Rebecca. Rebecca is the you know, um a woman fully realized stepping into her Christ's head space and fully realizing the you know, the not too much difference, uh what really almost the duality of things. That's what she She's a woman who realizes the duality of things. And she's forgiving and accepting, and she's peaceful, and she uh resists the confinements of constructs and she'll get I mean she could also you know, help you buried the body. But she can also uh she can also you know, be your ball and soothe you. She can do that too. Looking forward to thank you? Is it always done? Many ship? Okay? I was hoping. I was like, dam independent, is that absolutely fantastic. We in the family, got cooler team. We're just gonna keep We're gonna take it one step at the time and just keep pushing that joker. You're going forward. I am going to do it. I need a booking agement. That's what I'm looking for now. I need somebody to book these shows all right from your now two the Years of the God. Listen to podcast quest tho God's Favorite podcast. Yes that's it. But I'm excited, and uh I'm excited about the work I produced. Uh, hands on, I produced, I say, foh, and I work with Brooke to love. I mean, goddamn, y'all didn't respond like that. We didn't expects Christmas. No. We were literally just talking about this before you got here, about how like you know, artists shafted. Well yeah, also just how like artists that are you know, of the older generation, how they need to work with like the new Jacks that grew up listening to them. You know what I'm saying, Like they need that and you don't. You don't really see too much of that now, you know what I mean. I mean, I think it's like half and half. He's one of them, and then he's not. Well he's not that young, he's either. But they're the they're the o g s of the younger badasses that happen now. They were around to see it. They wanted Abody to be and their trailblazers and kick ass, fucking original you know, but I'm excited. Brooke did an amazing james and tastic working observation. On note, this is the first time in all these episodes that I've seen Bill get genuinely excited about music. Coming out like you awakened something in him that has been dead for so long. That's get excited. He wow, because he hates everything. I mean, I'm and I'm pleased with the album's you know, it's fucking bump. I can't wait for the show. It's bumping, it's bass heavy, it's mostly up Temple Ship jam med Temple Up Temple, and it's a couple of you know, slow ones. Book is a drum smith and and a and a hardcore techner. Yes he is. And for those of those listening that don't know who Brooke is, he produced the Miguel's a Door right, Yes he did, and I think, well he was part of the Grammy performance at least, but he did. He produce a couple of him. Yeah, but it was bad. But he's just a ridiculous tune smith. And and it really helped me get my drums together. I'm fine with my beasts, be fine, but I needed help getting them like chunky or like the sonics of them, getting them wide fool. He really helps. You're saying that you take long tedious Trump sells on stage. Just joking anyway, Anyway, Joey, we thank you. This is this is like our first real I feel like it. Well, no, this is I said. Remember we had a really great conversation at Dark when I let you listen to Start Katies. Yes, yes, I can talk about that record at all. We didn't even start that was that was record Raptor He No, he did. He did, Tennessee he was executive producer Tennessee Something. That's one of my favorite he said as well, Tennessee Soon is the bomb. He says, and this is out of his mouth. He says, I didn't produce that record. I just played based on a couple of songs. That's what he said. And he says, you produced that record, and I did. And I am like that with all of my projects. But I choose wisely on who I choose to work with because they bring out the best of me and not them. So I appreciate right for that. But yeah, tense Something was one of my favorites. Now that was half. Some of it was Dallas, some of it was Organized Noise, some of it was raphael Um and this other cat. I can't even remember that brother's name right now, Andre something. Fuck, I don't remember. But those were the people who worked on Start Katie so I was already out from under Dallas at that time, been with I'm glad to be here. I'm glad I was here. It was fun. Thank you. Well, you're awesome too, and we thank for look amazing. I can't see you, so I just want everybody know we'll get all the looks. Andre Betts, Andre Betts, thank you and I'm wait and Betts he did get on okay on the album. Yeah we got him, Andre Betts. Alright, well on behalf of the Team Supreme. Take a little uh boss Bill first and our guests Joy, thank you very much. Thank you for the conflux at Westlake Audio. This is an awesome experience. Shout out the bubbles. Shout out bubbles, bubbles. Room up there, bubble looking down over us. Thank you Coco because we are bringing up to year with a femail engineer ban with the gold. Alright yall or a Team Supreme. This is Quest Love and we'll see you on the next ground. Thank you very much. M M of cours. Love Supreme is a production of I Heart Radio. This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app Apple Podcast or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

Questlove Supreme

Questlove Supreme is a fun, irreverent and educational weekly podcast that digs deep into the storie 
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