Of Course Love Supreme is a production of I Heart Radio. This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora. What Up It's pay Bill? Check out this interview with Houston's very on DJ Pamirs talks about how he got his name when it's like League Texas to make it in New York City, and how he found musical enlightenment. It's a QULS classic from March twenty two, two thousand seventeen. Prima supremo role called sub prima, subpremo role called subprema so subpremo role called subprima sum roll. What's love not quest rockcare, block trot, no stopcare, no court and fists yere Suprimau suba roll call. Morte is here? Yeah, check my sound. Yeah, y'all niggas is folate? Yeah, straight up in town. Suprema road Subprima Suprema road call. I'm sugar Steve, Yeah, I cannot lie. Yeah, I watched Primo. Yeah, make Devil's Pie suck. Sub Prima road call. Some Prima Prima road call on Stiller is here? Yeah, you know my Steve re use my roll calls whenever I please. Suprema roll came Supremama roll call. It's my ear, Yeah, sitting yeah by the FU Premier. Yeah you know my Steve Yeah, yes, my name is Preme. Yeah I am Suprema. Yeah, I'm on the road call Yeah not a Cacama road road road called Premo roll. Wow. I wasn't expect that. Just hear me. It's just me. Now we should have this Supreme. I was thinking that right as we started. Yeah, it sound like Supreme. Take two. Na, no, no, ladies and gentlemen. She looks mad because she didn't get the Steve he did. Steve, come on, Yeah, very really happens that we'll hit the same one that I mean. I had two of my lines get stolen, so I see now, you know because I figured one of them Ransom's going to be part of that. Initially was going to use the violins. Then I was like, no, let me go to the well, ladies and tell if you have not guessed. Uh. This is going to be an instant UH fan out classic episode of Quest Love Supreme. UH. Without further ado, we have one of the greatest, most celebrated, most awesome ist UH flag torch bearing members of of hip hop culture with us today. DJ Premier Lazy Jump um okay, So I want to apologize in advance for the massive amounts of of fanning out that we're gonna do. I'm gonna try and keep the inside speaking and exactly the rabbit hole. Keep the rabbit holes now, I'm gonna try to rabbit holes stay out of that place. And I have on a shirt that you've You're one of the first ones to tell you were a fan of the n y g S. Yeah, so I remember a long time ago. You're like, when are they coming out? Yes, so they're about to come out. Yeah, shot the page and uh sha bino. So I'll make sure I get you an advanced copy of this it's coming out to Yeah. Yeah, I'm mixing now. I produced the whole thing. It's straight New York sounding, gutter raw lyrics. You know, from the perspective of the true adult streets, you know, nothing looking related to Uh yeah. My first time meeting you was at a New York Mr G show. At uh we were anter factory factory two thousand two. We did an LB show and it was I was asked my first time meeting you and Guru rest in peace. We uh we did the first joint we did like our first little showcase. It was it was a little brother not and uh Frank Frank, Frank and Nate. Well there they were doing, uh, they were doing take them clothes off, but it was people in the crowd saying take them coats off. And I was just like they had I remember that. I remember that was the original and did in factory before they moved. They moved Williamsburg and I met bringing back upstate. I was like, yo was the first. I was like, man, what's up? His first thing to me? Yo? Yo? So I only did two records of my life. You know what I'm saying. I did two records, did two records of my life, and the group was there and I was crazy night God was long ago. Okay, So what I always wanted to know. I mean, you're so New York and Gang Star was such the consummate New York group. Yet you guys didn't start from New York City. Man, he started from Boston and I started from Texas. For me, it was my mom, it is an our teacher, and she just had so many records in the house. You know the rules where don't touch the top of the record, only all the edges or you get a we we call it a whooping, not a spanking, a whooping. I touched the top because I just want to see what it touching the top. She goes, you got your fingerprints on your dumb motherfucker, like and then but I mean I got plenty of weapons because you know, I looked at records as a toy, because the labels was what attracted me. The way they looked when they spun. I was really attracted to the labels. You know, it's like, wow, Motown, the way it looked in Tamela versus like yeah, yeah, like the blue versus the yellow and the yellow in the brown. Harry Winner once at the Universal explained to me that because Motown used eighteen different factories across the United States UH to print it, like, they didn't do their own pressing, it was never consistent. So the ink would be consistent. So you would have some Motown print that had a very dark que to it, and then you had a lighter motail. But sometimes even the Tamela would be a very dark label versus a light one, like it would just go. It would depend on you know what pressing plant used. Yeah, but the labels always fascinated me just the way it look when it's fun. And then on top of that, you know, you had semi not semi auto. You know, they went to semi automatics but almost like a gun. But they even fully automatic turntables, which at that time my mother called it a record player and not a turn to it. So seeing her stack that the spindle with the then the that looked like a bottle rocket whatever, and stack that and then put five forty fis on there and look the arm holding and then then the arm goes up, touches, it goes back to record droughts in it. I'm like, how does it know to land there? Like? You know? So I took her apart, which got me because I want to see the mechanics or what's making it do that and know where to land. And then on top of it, when you put, uh, you know, an album, it knew to start at the album where it's like, how does it no go here? On the forty five? It goes all the way inside lands right on the dam. I was in the juke boxes too. I would just stand a jukebox to almost any restaurant back then had a juke box, and I would just stare and watch the shuffle the records and then you know like that. So I'm like, that's why he's like happy Days. I do not feel happy days? Would you? Would you rotate records without even listening to it, just see what it looked like? Were you biased against labels that you didn't like copy wise even if it had good music? How did you judge it on the label? The judges on the label like I do not like. I never like Capital, so thus it took me a long time, like especially old purple or orange like Nakin Cold Black with a rainbow around. Yeah, that's why I never touched my dad's Capital record. So we're wrong to get in the Beatles and beach board like so yeah, who was like the one? I used to like one? Scary labels used to scare me. I never like Buddha, yeah, with the little band at the bottom, like Curt Curt. But here's the thing that you like Kurt Time. Yeah, scared as ship. Literally I would never to listen to if there's hell below, we're all gonna go with all that psychedelic echo effect to it in the dark as a three year old watching that Kurt Time label. But I'd be obsessed with it, like make him put it on. Then I run upstairs and hide them the cover. I only I hit under the covers when Jaws came out because I thought the shock could come in. And I'm like, and if you think about the shock, can't swim without water. But I just remember going to see Jaws with my family and just that toom doom, doom, doom, doom, doom, doom doom. I was so scared of staying by myself, you know, my my my parents let us stay by myself at a young age because it's just like that in the South, you know, you know, you leave your door unlocked and people just walk in, you know, like I'm from that, Like, hey, your dad, it's not you know, unchained five. I learned that when I came to New York and my and my mom's from Baltimore. So even when we used to stay at my grandmother's house, same thing that they had all these like all these locks, and you're just like, damn, you know, what's the you know, But then you see the corner store right outside the house where everybody's fighting and screaming and breaking glass, and I'm like, oh, you know, and then you get to the teenage, it's like, I love all this violence stuff. And that's when the changes started. The change started to come. Your father, your father, he was a professor at pre Review and he was my dean. Imagine that. So you went for free? No? Well, I mean yeah, he paid for it. What was amazing computer science? But none of those languages exists, you know. I took four tran and basic. Yeah, now nothing. You can't get your receipt back. So wait, if if the if the turntable was such a sacred holy ground in your household? What happened the very first time you ever heard the Adventures of Grandmaster Flash on the Wheels is still? Did you hear it as a youngster in in Texas? No, I was. I was going back and well, yeah, but I was going back and forth because my grandfather lived in Brooklyn. That's how the first Brooklyn connection happened because he said he lived in Brooklyn. So, uh, being staying with him, he and I used to always go to I was really in the in the pinball games heavy as a kid, So He's always take me to play Land and Tom Square and then we always go to a Yankee game. So I was so used to going to baseball games with him, and so I got into baseball. I played, I played when I was young, and uh that he's the one that got me into that. And then he used to tour with his band and uh he played trumbone trumpet, guitar and upright bass. So he's always shown me all the pictures like he this when I was in Germany, this is when I was here, just when I was there. And I remember his wife, Rooney God blessed, She's always going, oh, Bill, there you go. Uh. He loves a brag about all the places he's been. But for me, it was like, wow, all this music took you all these places, you know, So I wanted to do that same thing. Yeah, but so so it wasn't like you scratchedable and no, not then. But by the time Scratching came out, I just was wanted to figure out, how are they able to bring it back like that? And then my my homie, uh, who was still a friend of mine, RP. Cohler. His name is Randy Pettis. He went to my college. So I didn't really understand the scratching aspect as far as how they're making a record come back until nineteen eighty five, when when eighty four, I'm sorry eighty four, when I was in college graduate high school in eighty four, my my, my freshman year in college, I went. I went to summer school just so I just wanted to be in college so bad, because you know that just to get away hang out with all the people. And we we don't we only live five minutes from the college. But down on the dorms and with the boys were drinking, We're doing all the stuff that that that you want to do away from your parents. And and uh, I just remember, man, he was scratching and and he had these felt pads on that and I'm I was like, yo, how are you doing that? And and and when he was like, I'll show, He's like, come to my dorm. And I went to this dorm. He showed me how to cut on this old big Gemini. It was a big gym, not mixer. It was silver with wood on the side. That's all I remember. The big silver Damn. He had to run to get the cross face, you know. And he was and the way the way, the way the dorms were set up shout to Holly Hall. That was that was the dorm of all the wildness. The way he had to set up he at two on the right because he couldn't. He couldn't, he could do nothing right because but he cut lefting right. But only when he was doing the gigs at at his at his dorm, he would set him up on the right. So, being I got so used to learning it that way, I just stuck with that way. I could. You know, I got better now where you have to cross over and everything, but I now I don't want him that way, but if it's set up that way, I'm still nice to do it with him on the right or And then the second thing that led me just keeping on the right was when Malcolm Claring in the world famous Supreme Team came out with the album do You Like Scratching? You see the turntables together, Yeah, the turntables together on the cover, and the mixer is the g L I'm mixing in the front. So I was like, I want to do that, but I'm just gonna move him back over like the way r P talk me. First time I saw you cut that was that was what you had write. I've been told that was called Philly style, but I don't know if I can claim that now. So it's because like cash money, was he cutting like that? I don't know, Like just every Philly dj um Jeff's the first guy I ever see cut normal with left and right turntables, But most Philly DJs that I've known always had the turntables to the left and the mixture to the right. Because that's that's how I learned. Even it even further. Uh uh, I got validated. I once saw whoever tone Lukes DJ was? Whoa? How do you know? How do you know remember? How do you know that? I don't know how I remember that, but I think he shouted him out in a song or something, but was still you pulled that out way too fast? Is there anything you know? No, it's flitty, That's why. That's why he's he's part of the breaks God like I was doing it Philly uh style with on the side. I never saw that either with the turntable. So then I was like, Okay, that's how you're supposed to do it. But so is that when you became like when you talking about wax Master Sea, Yeah, I just wanted to have a name, and uh, you know, first I was DJ Chris. You know and then uh wax Master secause I was like, damn, everybody jam Master, graham Master, No one's wax Master. And right when I claimed that name, wax Master Tor came out on B Boy Records, and I and the fact it was on B Boy Records with with you know, with Criminal Minded and all that I was in, uh you know, KG the all from the from the Cold Crush, and I was like, damn, man, this just dude was gonna blow and now I can't use that one, you know, but he was a DJ. But but just wax Master Tory and it was like damn, but I kept it. And then when when I joined Gang Star, Stu Fine, who was the owner of Wild Pitcher was a husband wife own label. Stu find was like, I really don't like your name. And I was like, man, what's wrong? He said, just doesn't catch it? Just catch Why don't you see if you can come up with a new name. And I was like, well, let me, let me get back to you. And I had going back to Texas to go to school, so I just made a list, and you know, I remember DJ Scratching cut. I had uh DJ uh turn turn around. I know, I'm sorry to turn around. I had mixed and scratch um. Premiere was one of my you know, I made a little list, and my mom always keeps these yellow tablets you know, around the house, which I took, yeah to this very day. I keep him as well because I got something one of my back day broke with me. Uh, it's just a thing. So I wrote road like seven or eight. I wanted to do at least ten, but I wrote about Oven. I remember had uh Rad Revolve Revolution shout the DJ Revolution was one of the nastiest cutters ever. Uh And you know. But and so my show my mom and she was looking at it. She goes, I think you should go over Premier because you always always want to be first and stuff and this and that. And I used to repair everybody stuff in my neighborhood. Actually, Travis Scott's father was like my old g yeah, you know, yeah, he's you know, he's probably like I'm fifty, he's probably like fifty seven ft eight. But but Jack Webster, which with J Actually Travis Scott used to be Jack Webster before he changed the Travis Scotts. Jack Jack Webster and Travis Webster and their brothers and south to Sonora Webster, and and recipe to that dad who do who's actually just played cards every Thursday with my father. He just past going on three years now. And uh and shout to miss Webster, who's first first person in my neighborhood I heard cursed more than Richard Prye lady on the every every Christmas can we still go over the house and go see her. And she's just a barrel of fun and she's just so funny. So you know, I remember when they were telling me about the Travis Scott wanted to get on and everything, and they would give me his music and stuff, so like he's popping now, yeah yeah, And and Jack and Jack and Travis played bass and drums, and they were the first one with the pool table, the first one with the VCR in our neighborhoods, so we and they lived like three houses from me. So I used to go over there to the game room, play pool and learn how to play drums and bass. And that's where my instrumentation came from. I took piano lessons, but by second grade, I don't like, I don't want to do that. I want to play Cowboys and Indians and all that stuff, you know. So I started doing that type of stuff. And then I was in Little league baseball. So so during that time, I just you know the kind of I left the the the everything else to the side, and next thing you know, um, everything starts to trickle into the you know, the turntable stage of every thing. And and uh, you know music was always just heavy in the house. So you started out DJ and and doing White Masters, West Masters, wax Master Sea not to come. Yeah, you know, I straight, I straight like Trump. Uh. So I called when I said, when my mom said Premier sounds like the one. I called, uh Stewart and said, what do you think of DJ Premier? He goes, that's it. I love it. And I talk about Stumn because I've heard like a lot of stories about wild people. I mean, you know, Diamond don't want to make pictures about all that. Like what was he like as a businessman and what was that first gangster deal like for me? Even when when we met my first manager, Patrick Maxi, who you know started to pay their records. Uh and and the Empire management was our management. Uh. With with Patrick, I remember we went to a party and he goes, Joe Man loving the new Gangs our record. First thing we gotta do is get you off that small label. And I looked at him like you're about to ruin our stuff because stew was so cool. Like we we we got along well. And like I said, with a husband and wife label, Ghurules, the one that hurt. They used to go through the shoebox of demos that got sent to him, and he heard my demo and heard Lord Finesse demo Wild Pitch. What was your demo? So I was in a group call and we we were called M Season Control, you know, M I C M Season Control. It was me my MC top Ski Sugar Pop no no sugar for day all for day all from South Dallas shop, the Old Cliff and all of that. So you know, so they all went to we all went to school together and and then there was styleI T. Styly T was our flavor. Flavor you know what I'm saying. So you know what I mean, Like he was just I mean, and not only that he's not acting like that, this is really how he is, you know. And when I just went on the Problem tour two years ago, when I went to Dallas, I saw all of them and we all still talk to each other, to call each other texts and they come to my shoulder. We still call each other like it's a regular thing. They're not mad that I took off and continued because they couldn't really afford to come to New York. Uh me and top with win New York shopping the demos. I gotta credit Carlos Gaza because he's the one that got me a job at a at a sound Waves record store, which was the store in the hood in Houston to go to. If you and even from the streets and you want to get anything, you gotta come to sound Waves. All the all the players and the pimpatures coming there with the furs and and this isn't the hot Texas with dators on and everything. Hey, everybody got some of that Alatamo Yeah and and and plus we sold zeider Co music. A lot of people don't know what. Yeah, that's huge down in Texas, and so I I you know, and you have to know your music. So it so what it was. Uh, this is how I got the job. I actually used to the price tags were easy to peel off, and they had like three ninety nine and twelve, and so we were putting the one ninety nine ones on and Callos saw me doing it, but he didn't confront me because I was the top and top of a very cocky do yo. Yeah for all that men. You know, ain'tybody gonna be to front on us. You know, that's how he that's our top end. This is probably like eighty for five. Yeah. So, uh so when we get to the counter and I got a stack of twelve and just call Us is the one that puts the prices on it because he's the twelve inch buyer from the warehouse. He's the one that says, hey, give me ten tone looks give me ten evenly girl. You know it's true stuff like that. So, uh when he saw what I what I was buying, He's like, dude, these prices are wrong. And you know me, I'm acting tough. Yo. Man, it's a dog night. No, that's what I'm painting there. But there are three ninety nine. I'm the one that priced those. I'm like, well, whatever on it. When I'm paying for the year. If you're gonna fit change the prices, you're gonna put on nex time my body record. You know, I was like you and I was like you and change, you know. So so from there I came back in the storm, you know, maybe a couple of weeks later, and he was just like, yo, man, yeah, I saw what you bought. You know, you have you picked a lot of hot records that I just got in, you know how you know all that stuff. And I'm like, well, I'm moving to New York and from here and you know, I'm gonna I'm gonna we're gonnaett a record deal. He's like, yo, you want a job here? I was like yeah, And then I met met with the owners and everybody. They gave me a job. And from there, me and Carlos the tightest friend. That's how I ended up beating the odd squad with Devin the dude, and and uh, you know, all of us got got cold as I mean, I met scar Face, I met Willie d So we go way back and way back for the deal. And then from there, uh, the Billboard that just started having a rap category in Billboard magazine, a rap chart. So Carlos became the Billboard reporter for Houston for the South. And then they needed they said, do you want to be the twelve inch buyers? So now I took over as the twelve inch buyers. So I'll call south by South I mean I mean Southwest Wholesale and say hey, I need uh you know a hundred uh wild thing tone logan. They're like, are you sure you need a hundred I'm like, Yo, it's moving because people coming to the store going yo, we need wild thing wild things for the weekend, and you know, and then we can move them. They got to a point where they trusted anything. I would say, the order people and then that's when the basin and the in the cars was like a new thing. Holding out Hit it is what totally got us into the sound system era for us in Texas. Holding out Hit it my mother, my man uh uh always mixed this ship way louder than and and what it was. There's a guy named Oltis Curtis. He was part of my rival DJ team, the DJ crew that that that we arrivals all the time. It was Chris Garrett, Tony tap Scott, Darryl tap Scott, r I P. And we we all friends, played football everything, but we also enemy and not not not but rivals with the turntables because we was like, yo, but you ain't got this record but you got that record. But oh, this was the first one to have the big Wolfers in his truck. And I remember he came pulled up. He goes, Yo, I'm about to put on this song by the BC Boys. We had already heard, like, uh, we heard BC group, but didn't have No eight or eights And this is when the old Purple Death jam. So yeah, exactly. So then I remember, this is exactly what he said. He said, Yo, when this record be beat drops, you better duck. And we're like why he said, watch, and you know it starts off with just holding out. It's no you know, he goes, get ready to dug and sit and soon he said tom and I'm a chill with and it it just said boom boom boom, boom boom. We were like, goddamn, that's some bags. And after that everything just started coming out and it seemed like it seemed like I and that just everything was just boom boom boom. And then that's how I got really into Molly, because Molly didn't follow the every kick pattern. His would just be just like and we were like, yo, look what he's placing his ship. So that blew me away. And this is even before you had even started. You want to know something hilarious. So your your moment of realization with like this, this might call me to the culture was holding Now hit It? You want to know something hilarious. So the initial printing of holding Now Hit It, when def Jam did it put the acapella on the A side, right, So when Lady b Ever played it in Philadelphia, we never knew there was drums on the ship. She was just like, not until, not until we all license to ill. And I'm still mad even to this day. When I played Holding Now Hit It, like I played the acapella in Philly, it was because to us it was like, yo, they are so dope, they don't even needed no words, no music. I mean, we never heard of acapella before. So this was number one in Philly for like all of nineteens, we never knew there was music. We never knew there was drum, so we never knew. We never knew that. So like and only later I found out the initial pressings of it, like I think Mural took in Japan, I brought a twelve inch where Holding Out Hit at the acapella they called Acapulca was on the A side and the other version was on the B side. But yeah, never, I never knew it was just acapella. Yeah, and that's what that's really what what said off as far sound from me and then that's from from there. That's why I was like, man, But when it came to Marley, that's why I was like, I want to I want to lie, how to make beats? It was just everything is When I heard the Bridge, you know, I remember run DMC and Dana Dane came. I was college to perform and during the break, you know, when they're setting up the equipment and everything, I just remember I thought it was called the Breaks because it was gonna it sound like it was going to break to break, to break, the break to break, and I didn't know what the bridge. And then I remember like that's around Tom mccarlos, and I was like, yo, there's a song called the Break, the Break go. No, it's saying the Bridge, he know. I got it right over here and it said Bridge Records, and it just looks so plain, but it looked New York. Like the label. I was like, again, labels, the way they look they you know, they just make you pug out based on the label. Now you'll see a label with some weird ship and go always I know something on. It was general hip hop culture in Houston derivative of New York culture, like Okay, we see run DMC doing that, so what's up? Home Boy liked really everybody was because it was southern. Was Southern. When did Houston established their own thing? Like, Okay, we don't have to be in New York or in l A. We could be ourselves. Like I gotta say the Ghetto Boys, you know, because I go back to knowing the Ghetto Boys when it was Johnny when you know, when it was waiting for Face before Ready Rad, Jukebox and Johnny C and everybody that you know, this is uh you know when when Phase came, he was a DJ action you know, so uh even Butchwick Bill wasn't in the group officially yet. So then Ready Rad came in, laid on like when Death four and all of them came out, um and and uh raheem. So during the first record that that came out was called car Freak. That was the first Ghetto Boys reckon and we were like, wow, they got the dope feel out suits on and they got the fat cables like where they get it this in Houston where you're finding cables at you know what I'm saying that they had the big dupie ropes and it was like wow, you know they got them already. And uh, everybody knew J. Prince because we had a we had a club called the ron Stone Wrangler, which was the Tunnel back in the eighties. And and J. Prince was one of the owners of that club. So uh. And then RP the one that taught me how to scratch, was working there on that nights. So yeah, so he would always get me in and he this is when he's playing. He's not really playing, you know, Yeah, you play card Freak from the Ghetto Boys and play Captain Jack, who was the local DJ and radio personality. And he had a record call don't do it like that Baby. Yeah, so so come back then people go, yo, don't do it like that baby. That was like a saying. So he made that as like an anthem before the fat Man scoops. This was don't do it like that baby was the anthem. So that guy played and then uh and uh, and you know, Steve Farnier and all them was a major part of Houston. But in the club, if it wasn't ghetto boys, it was steps of Sonic. Uh, nobody beats, two bars, make the music with your mouth, the bridge like it was those types of records in Texas likestnah, Nah, it was fresh, I mean because it was the same for us, like in North Carolina, like it was you know when we were young, like New York. I mean that was it. So whatever was whatever hip hop was out, Yeah, it was, it was. It wasn't it hadn't become regionalized yet. So like at the time, so you're still are you DJ and at this point or you at the time when you know, in eight once, I was already doing parties. But I just knew how to blend. I didn't know how to cut. I know, I do nothing. I was just very and I used to sit down and just just spend. I wouldn't standing up. I would just sit there. The crowds rocking, and I would just sit there and go and everybody's still rocking. And I always had just a hot stuff and then and then, uh, how many crates are you bringing to a party at that time? Probably like ten fourteen because because everybody why because everybody help it was a place called a Memorial Center. And then we also plus spunt of the place called the Newman Center, which is part of the church I went to. I used to go to Catholic Church. I was an alter boy all that stuff, and uh so the Newman Center was the place to have the jams. So it's the spot and when we spun it, we had the Newman Center. Um and at the Memorial Center, everybody wants to get in because then you know, you gotta pay to get the getting the door. They were really strict like that. No how you gotta pay. You know, they're probably a dollar then, and that was like a big dog. I ain't got a dollar, yo. People always help me carry the creates in and there not there when it's time to go home. Every time, no, no one didn't help you. Yeah, you know, be out of ten people, be to two people to help you. So that back then, we had our own equipment recipes to Theodore Archer. We call him Meatball. He he and I had a DJ crew. My mom made just a little cards and you know uh what we call we would call magic sounds. My mom named it. I didn't like it magic sounds. I was like my can. We had Magic one oh two, which was our hip hop and an R and B station. But David, back then they played like I said, the mix show played nothing but predominant New York because that's all you really asked. But but then we had Egyptian Lover for the West Coast, you had Egyptian Lover, you had Axed Stay. I seouldn't even even now really like yet he had a record called Colewin Madness. A lot of people don't know that he has a record on a blue label. Jimmy Jay Tyror Lewis one. Yeah, yes, it is so right before just be good to me, Jimmy Jammy Terror Lewis would making a little uh instrumentals and that blue label yeah times you know, yeah, yeah, yeah was that before? So that was before Egyptian Lover. Two show was just on because we now I have West Coast friends who I met in college. Just got Stevie, Steve. He should be like, man, you're on all that New York stough y'all always put it on plus two. We put it on plus eight and I was like, so he said, yeah, can we cut faster? And he's always had that attitude. He's like, let me show you what we could do. And he put on the al Na fish from machine It's time and I don't think. I'm like, wow, he's doing it fast. He's like, yeah, stick to your plus two. That's all our I will always remember what I'm saying that stick to your little plus two. Because he would always every time you get on, he can get off. He would just slapping down the plus. You know what I'm saying. He shout to Stevie, Steve wherever you are, shout to John twine. Uh, he's a guy. You're John twine Man. He was like pretty boy from the West Coast. But they taught us how to do the dance called the Guests because I used to dance back then. I was in I was in a B boy crew everything. That's what you know. I had footwork and everything. You know. We used to battle the legend um. He used to playing for the Rams. Uh um. Oh my god. Harvey Williams used playing with the Rams and he played with the Raiders. Um. We used to battle him and his brother Darryl Williams and they used to wear the tuxedo jackets with the white cap c os and and the white gloves and then they would move walk. They're the first one to have a saw moonwalk where it looked like they were literally floating on air. I was like, Yeo, these dudes are nasty. We gotta kill him in the next battle. Yeah, all right, I'm mind blown right here. All right, you're listening to the quest of Uh. We're here with Teams Supreme and our very special guests DJ two plus The The The The, The Larry Love of Houston. Yeah. Um yeah. So I'm like, I'm really shocked because the only inkling that I had that Houston even had a culture was when Chuck d shouted out ghetto Boys and on Fear of the Black Planet. Like it really wasn't even occurring to me that way before hip hop was. And the the guy that's like the quote unquote Melli mel of Houston, his name is Ka Reno. Oh yeah, Ka Reno. If you asked Phase Bundy, any of them, like who's your guy you look over to from housing, They're not gonna even go um I was, They're gonna say Krino. He just released an album called The Big Seven. H just posted on the Instagram a couple of days ago. He just released seven albums all in the same day just came out. He's just a militant, a militant angry just I don't just fuck you all type rapper and he can spit. He's actually on the n y g S album on the song about it's called Introduction to Manhood, which is pretty much about how many how many youth black kids go to jail to be learned to be a man because they don't really know until they hit a consequence where they got to go to jail and really face real men. So so it's all about that. So it's Karino, you know, n YGS and a little favorite m O P. It's a real hill song. To beat is crazy and it's it's very serious beat, but it sounds like you, you know, running high the hoodie music. But Kirino bodied it. I mean and just man, he Kirino man big up to him. He's the he's the you know, he's from south Park, so that south Side. He he's the south Park General. So you know that it's really north Side and south Side and Houston, yeah so and Most and then you got the most city, which is Missouri City. So you know, so, m at this rate, are you thinking like, okay, this is a career for me and or is it just now? How did you because you're not in the original, No, I'm in the third I'm the third generation. The first generation is Guru, Sugar and Shug brother swab D. He he was that was the first gang star. They named Gangstar when they were going to morehouse. You know, Sugar was hustling out there and uh, you know, the Gurgle was going to college and uh, they were called the gangsters because you know, Sugar wanted to keep it. Yeah, yeah, we're keeping your heart. You know, she was heavy in the streets at the time. So from there they said, you know what, it's called a gang star to kind of not soften it, but just having more accessible of a name and having catchy. So they originated the name Shug, swab D and and Guru. Then from there Shug got inconcerated, did a few years of time, and then another MC stepped in because it was only one MC, but now it's two MC. There's Damodski and Guru. Guru wrote all the rounds for Damo Damo, uh with with rapid Guru and then that the DJ. His name was Mike D but his DJ name was DJ want to be Down, but he spelled but he spelled at DJ one one two, the number two B, the letter B and then downs. There was DJ one to be Down. But if you and if you listen to the first, yeah, DJ want to be down on the DJ on the wheels, you know, So, yeah, didn't want to be down. Mike D's brothers name is Gang Star T, so that that's another addition of the name. But even though they had already started Gang Star already with Sugar and Suave D and Guru, but Gang Star T was a known guy in Boston. And again Mike D is his brother in the group. So that's how that the those affiliations happened. And then when he got to the point of Gurgle staying in New York when he's living in Brooklyn, he and he got with me that he was like, man, if they're not gonna come up in and help, you know, for get us to the point where they're only showing up when their shows and money, I'm not gonna have them be in the group. We're just gonna be me and you. So I was like, well, that's on you. And that's when that that beef started where they were like, well, we're gonna be Gangstar Posse and uh, you know that's when a little Shad who's from East New York. He was friends with Jay the Damager, and then that that that they kind of angry that that group kept running with the name, so they started that. But then you know, I got shut down quick. We were doing dis records and stuff like that, and I didn't I didn't know them, but I knew whoever it is, if it's to that degree where we gotta gotta get it on. I was always like, not was I am still from line if it's something that's going to protect our team, and and I'm like that to this day, how did you and Guru even meet? Because you signed this and the Wild Pitch he still find finds your demo. Gurgle really found the demos that still checked U. So how did you and him actually meet? Um? So STU say, you know, I should put you all together, but I stud I wanted to stew to sign the m CS in control. But now you have changed our name to I C P, which was in a circle Posse. But there's a reggae group called that that. Yeah. I was like, why does that sound. Yeah, So we were so with that. We were just like we're just We're just I c P. You know, we'll say in the circle polse and I ran, I ran, what equipment were you using? Then I was Carlos having sp twelve that he had bought twelve the blue so you couldn't save the sound. Well, I bought the drive you know that you had the big big flat square uh, you know the one it's like a tenanch disk, you know when you said so so, but then when you saved it and you lower the back up and it's all like, uh, you know, it's not playing back the same. But I learned how to run, K do everything, and I would just make it and go directly to my casset decks because I'm like, damn, it's not saving anything the way I want. So if you know I can't reload it up to play it again, then then yeah. And then when I got to New York with you know, going, you shout to Gordon Franklin. They were they went to pray View as well, so that's how we all met. So when I told him I was coming back and I want to get some demos done to hopefully get a game start at the time still was like, well, I just don't like the way you got wrapped. He didn't like the way Top rap and uh because the demo me and Top did is what got that got us to still wanting to sign us. So that's why I'm like, I'm not gonna leave him. And you like got the demo that we cut. Yeah, we had one call. We're fantastic. We had one call to up another level and we had to let my DJ get hyped, which was him rapping about me and I was looping. Uh, people make the world go around from Michael Jackson boom poom poo poom, boom boom. I just kept just boogle boo boom because I my man Skeet, who was our neighboring Britain in East New York, taught me how to work a four track. I was like, wow, so I could just cut this for like five minutes. Now I got that, and then I would just cut the no no no, I'm from the I mean from the Mill Jackson version yellow covered with the I cut that over it. Then that that was that was the beat. Let my dj get hyped turned into DJ Premiers and Deep concentration because he said, let me get off the mic and let my DJ get hype ki ki ki ki ki give the man behind the wheels, And so all the cuts that I did on that became deep concentration once I joined Gang Star. But I and I and I found my demo tape that I gave stew and Stu gave it back to me. It's in great condition. I'm about to transfer it because you know, and digitize it because that's you know, safety stuff. Man. Yeah, no real, I'm not joking. Even the writing on it and and you know, just looking at like, wow, this is And I found the Lord Ferns demo. Lord Fess wrote his own He put Lord Ferness the Technician on it, with his own hand writing, with the nice you know, graffiti style handwriting everything, you know. And that's how I met Lord Fernest when he became our labelmatee um, you know that was the first person I ever produced us outside of Gangstar. But yeah when they when when uh, with my partner, as far as how we separated top but with with Stull even said look I'll put you all in the studio. Maybe you need a professional studio. Maybe I like him put in the professional studio. Next thing, you know, we do a couple more demos. He's like, I still don't like your guys. So I said, I'm not that. I can't join gangster unless no lessing with my dude. Time passed. We cut the more demos, don't do no work. We went to every label. Still nothing. The Top said, Yo, man, the next couple of months, if we don't get a deal, I'm going into the military. You know, was like, nah, not you. That's not even He's he's so street. It's like, that's not even leaving you man. We gotta knock gonna do it. Because we all were living with Gordon family now, you know, hanging out the basement living there, Me the Gordon brother Gary Uh and me and Top and I dance h your rock shot shot to h L And next thing, you know, dudes at the door and he's like, Yo in the uniform, going hey, I'm looking for Theodore Campbell. And I'm like what he said, Uh, he's leaving today. You know he I thought he was bluffing, and he said, yeah, he's joining the military. I'm like, yo, Top yelling down, yelling down in the Uh. I was just explain is that another interview. I was just and he comes up to standard with his bags already packed, and I'm like, you're really leaving and he was like yeah, and he said it's rap ain't working. I was like, now as I leaving me, like I'm stuck in New York without you because I really thought we were gonna make And he's like, yo, and he said and I thought he even listed for like a year. I was gonna wait, just be like, when you come home, we'll do it again. He said, no, un listened for four years. That's a lifetime. My partner just left me. He went to the Navy. And he's like, so that's when I joined Google. He actually got discharged. But he's doing well. He's got he's got a beautiful family. Were homies. We still see each other everything. I like, I see everybody, check up. But we all always calling each other, texting each other. Everything's good and good with everybody. So in the vay in the third basis almost like an arranged marriage. Yeah, yeah, that worked. That was man or did it both? And I told group at the beginning, I said, listen, I still want to produce other acts, you know, so please you know if you got a problem with that, let me know. He's like, no, I'm cool with that. Just I want you to DJ from me or whatever, and you know, make the records for me too. And I was like cool. I said, well then I'll be in the group with you. But I almost to produce outside of that, so no more missed a nice guy I read. I think there was anothering you said the album was done and like ten twelve days that I wasn't really nasty yet as far as being being competent to say I I am a be maker producer. That really was me. Gurgle this now is that's me twelve hundred you know, this is me Guru and Slomo's son and fell and we went in Brooklyn at such a sound studios and uh, I used see King of Chill there all the time, Like wow, I think of Chill, you know, like you know, like I was such a big fan and and and I didn't really know how to work and that's not fifty yet and it's not fifty Sampler and me and him got cool and he's like, yo, if you want to come to my mom's house, I'll teach you how to how to work as I used to go to Crown Ice to take the train. Bought me a nine fifth of my own and he taught me at his mom's house with no drum machine attached, so I didn't have anything to trigger it. He just taught me how to loop and everything. And I used always go to King and Chill's house and learn all of that. So once I got that master, then he said, man, and you could buy you like a little basic device that can midi up. You know. I learned this whole midi thing and he said, and you can trigger it all your sounds. And once I did that, I started going, oh okay, I get it. But I didn't know how to do chopping until I met show Biz because because now the lord labelmate, he's like, I don't want you meet one of my homies from from my projects. He's dope. His name is Showbiz. You know, show Biz is in the street. But he was nasty with the beach And that's how Mt Diamond and that's how I met the whole dr TC and I'm a fat Joe way back before. Yeah. Then they were active, oh yeah, just waiting for their waiting for the time and uh and Patrick really liked you know, show Biz is doing everything on his own out that I write a trunk of a car. Patrick liked like show biz music, so that's why he's like, yo, let's sign them to pay Day. And that's how we all, yeah, well we're not when we didn't a mom, it's a nice guy. Um. We were all on the drum machine together, like we'd be side by side and I'm like, I'll hit this, you hit that, and so almost like, well I'll hit this, really because if you hear the productive all of them, because I'm saying everything was so wait a minute, so on cause and effect. That's someone doing the yo yo dog and you've been trying to replicate that. I was like, program because because I didn't understand, because because I never liked the quantize, so I like it loosen. And once he told me, I was like, how can you make it? Do it with it's almost like you're doing it. He said you could turn the quanties off. I thought everything just one sixteen. So when he showed me that, I'm just like, you know, I gotta hear this for one second. This is causing effect by gangster. You ain't leaving right punk a lot to school you're not really, But I say, yo, you fool yourself when you try to deny the five written lost lost and we're doing Yeah, that's like like he might go to you know, like that's how it was, like, were you really? But you know what, I'm not. I'm really not mad at that at all because what you know what Marlon Jackson said when that Off the Wall Um documentary that sometimes mistakes and and the human element makes the song breathe better than yeah. And you know, like I really didn't know the importance of quantizing until like some DJ started complaining that they can't blend. You know, that was like, all right, I'll do it, click track, but you know, like I would have Okay, now there's there's a lot of these records making sense to me now that I realized that you guys were just doing it triggering live with your hands. So after that we all do no one m's nice guy. How do you make the transition from wild Pitch to Chrysalis for um got to give it up? Spike Lee and and brand from Marsellus Um Oh yeah yeah, because we had done jazz music. Spike saw Spike saw the video towards the manifest gurg look like Malcolm X in the video that prompt him the Body album. He bought the album and was and her jazz music. And it was during the time he was doing more better blues. So when he was doing more the Better blues, he reached out to us and plus it Brooklyn. You know, he was saying, Brooklyn is Brooklyn now, so he you know, he's very pro Brooklyn. And he said, uh, I remember he called us and said, Yo, man, I love that song. Y'all did shouting out all the jazz grades, but y'all left got a lot of people. And I was like, well, we actually did that for our grandfathers because they win jazz bands and and we did that to dedicate to them, because before my grandfather passed, he said, we want you to do a record about about jazz grades if you really uh you know, uh respect you know, the music of the past. So we did it as a tribute to them. We weren't really like really focusing on it. And it's the only record on there about jazz, you know what I'm saying. Everything else is there's other subject matter, you know, battle battle rhymes, and Google's always like to do battle round stuff. Anyway, the next thing, you know, they said, well, we want you to do a a better version of what you did, but we want brand for myurselves to help you do it. And he said, we got a poem by this guy named Eric Eeli and it didn't rhyme. But I remember Gurugle looked at the at the run and said, and it don't rhyme. And spikeaels they would do it and do whatever you want, but mention those names that you didn't mention. Gugle just said, you know, Charlie Ming is such number fingers, you know, just a little feeling because he had all the names and it was pretty much a done thing. He right grew rights fast, done and we cut the cut the vocal. My original version was the one that's in the video game. That was the demo I presented to say we should do it over this we brand from them. They were like, you no, we need instrumentation and we want to make it a broad, big thing for the soundtrack. So we did that and that's why that version on the soundtrack is very well, it's like big production. When it came to the video Spike was like, yo, I want to use your version for the video, which he was like, cool, so we did. We did that, and then all of a sudden, shout to Duff Marlowe. Uh saw the video and uh, I just reached out to him on Twitter. I just shout him out and all the sudden, now me and him talking again. You know, he's doing well. I haven't seen him in years, and he's the one that said to get a sign and we got signed to Christmas. So then when y'all did the uh step in the arena, which I don't know if that's the first CD I ever bought the long Box and she was like eight hours. No. Actually, first, I have a reputation for stealing. Yeah, for stealing in my early days before I found I used to still cause we skipped that part. We just we were we were all about stealing the stereos, you know, so so and then but then my own friends who you just still got me. I never I remember when I walked out and saw the hole of my door, you know, because what it was used them pulls and and all that stuff. We used to do, all that stuff, man, And I was like, damn, they got me from my system because I used to put all the systems in my neighborhood and people's cars. So I was nice with it and I was just like, man, they got me even know I you know, got another one, but yeah, yeah I almost yeah man, you know yeah all of thieves that I used to that that used to rock with and you know, I won't say their names, but so it stepping in arena. What was um because that was I remember buying that one. Well I didn't buy my grandmother bought it for me and umber no, No, it was like from I think we gotta I think I gotta like at a walmartyrside. But but yeah, that was that was my first CD. And so with that record, from what I could tell, it sounds like the production you were starting to get a better because now I wanted the sound to be like the Jungle Brothers because they worked at Calliope. This is what brought me to Calliope for this album. You went to Calliope. Loud Leaked Loud, Yeah, okay e l E T. I remember reading it, yeah, and it's so crazy because because whenever I wanted to do something off and lay it down, he had this thing called the Russian Dragon. So if you're rushing it will it will tell you if it's Russian and if it's dragging, it will go dragging. But it's called the Russian Dragon. Had a dragon on the car on the front of the thing. It was all these lights that that it's a it's a lightness in the middle that's green and if it's rushing, they'll go red and if it's dragging, will go yellow. And just you just turn it to you if you if you put it on a track and running through that track when you turn the dollar would move it for you. You know, it's called the Russian Dragon. What are you here for, Steve. That was going into ninety two because we were working on daily operation. Um. But as far as this is where, well, prior to daily operation, yes, Stephan, the arena was all our lead except for just to get a reperts was still done. It's such a sound and firehouse, which is your Vazon who was partners with Shlomo and they started to two studios. So now it's such a sound and firehouse. And that's when King and Chill started to just be He ran fire house pretty much and I was still such a sound, but we did just to get it up there and we did say your prayers there and we did uh with his boom, Yeah, yeah, there it is. That's it. That's it, that's the Russian drag. That's it. Yeah, we need that so so and I never I was like, what the hell does that? But he was like, this is how you can move or your track either forward the back of to get it and if you wanted to be a little more off so that. So from there I finally got an a lessons drum machine that could trigger my and my sampler. And the first beat idea was, you know, for clope, I did step in the arena because I always wanted to loop that that the horny horns looped it up and Google wrote that right away. We we cut it and then uh, just from there, everything just started flowing, man, and I started just getting better with understanding, because, like I said, now I learned how to filter better with Pete and I already knew peteing them now and large Professor. They taught me how to filter and and do all of those things. And show Biz chot me how to chop and he's like, yo, if you put it on the same output, it cuts the sample off and you can do it. I'm like, wow, so then I'm taking all these tools from show biz Lars Professor and Pete and then applying my way with the Molly mentality and and the scratching mentality. And I said, I want always and only scratched like I did, because I wanted DJ's to be like you hear what he cut, because I forgured a lot of mcs are not gonna really care about the cutting part. Now we care. You know, you know it's not going he cut this line. So I knew DJ would be like, yo, he's killing it on the cut. So that's I did it for DJs. Now you would Well, it's funny, you said, because as MCS. For me as a kid listening, it was always dope to me how you would take parts of different songs. But like, you know, it's almost like a collage, you know what I mean. It was like you would take all these things and put them together. And I remember hearing. I mean, you know, like with mathematics, we you took the cut in to do your math part. I never would have thought unbelievable with the dogcounts, like, what the funk? Why do you do that? Who would? It just comes to me like that as a DJ. It's all d J oriented. Everything for me is DJ oriented first, you know, even from what I do as a producer, everything is starts from the DJ. And like, if I had to pick out of everything I like making, I like I just like DJ even. Okay, not that I think you will confirm this question, but for the sake of quantizing stuff, do you think, all right, do you think have you ever just especially if it's a sharp cut, just what I call pulling a doctor ice u t FO like cut it via your your NPC or your through your drum machine. Oh no, so for you, Oh yeah, he'll tell I'm hard aboutself when it comes to laying my scratching. No, you wouldn't listening. We did. We were doing cuts for the breaks, and he was doing what he was doing. We wasn't doing ship. He was watching, but he was doing he was cutting. Uh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, he was cutting. I did it with the actual record, Yeah he wasn't. It wasn't I could have done in serato, Yeah why not? And I kept going I kept going no again again, and in every take we'd be like, you feel like I was dope. I was doing like Nope, it was just a little again when you were going like okay, let me just go to pro tools and ro no no no, I know, yeah okay, And I was saying he but I'm just saying that I didn't know people even did that. He's still mixes like he's running through okay, so that they would see what you're saying. I'm looking at you like how I've seen I mean someone someone taught me how to cut, like I would load whatever I want to cut and scratch on stuff or or yeah, and then thousands up to But there's a way to make it. I mean there's there's I mean you won't get because sometimes you'll hear product like okay for instance, like if you would do like yeah, like that because I want people to go, Yo, look how he's cutting like that's like I said, it was a DJ thing where I want DJ to go. I've seen cats cut via I've never seen that out all these years. Yeah. Now he's still like even when we were doing stuff, like he still works even though it's all digital, he still works like he's on tape, so like it would be nothing. I'd be like, yo, so Prin, like you know we can go in and just like no, no, let me punch punch out of your son. Yeah, if you gonna step up, step up, step and I'll say take it from step and then go step and I'll go up. Yeah yeah, And it's that Persipe'll be like I'll do but I have I'm always literally on the fader. Yeah alright, So slight admission time. This is my confession. This confession time. UM game playing from step in the arena. So back in the early Square roots stays back when we were busting on South Street. Um, we that would this would be one of like we didn't write our own material. We were just like do you know all right? Do you try next do? But for some reason we used to do a routine to static. I even knew that one said, Yo, you gotta chat at this group. The rude like he he brought and brought y'all to me. He was so into y'all from the gating and him and re met what I'm saying, but you know, and but he was like, Yo, the Philly that they have band, you know, because we only knew steps a sign against the hippop band, you know, so you know he's like, Yo, they dope, that dope and you know y'all. Just man, y'all, y'all have transformed hip hop into its own planet. Man, I want to know now right now you're in like you're your second year with Guru. How are you guys, because this is an arranged marriage, how are you guys jelling as a unit as a unit? Like, you know, is it like he feels that it's more his band and you're visiting or you know, like, are you guys friends? Offset are you hanging afterwards? Like what's in the first in the in the first two years of Gang Star, what's the relationship both because we lived together, because we lived together from the from normal Mr. Nice guy all the way too hard to earn. We lived together, well, we lived in Brooklyn. The first we lived in Brooklyn, Brooklyn. Then we moved to one A three Street in the Bronx. And that's how I met Panche and Melan kind of yeah, that's how I met Melancola, Nutcrackers, Smiley yellow Child. That's how that whole connection from the Bronx happened on one of the third street because we lived on one of the three and Andrews. You know, that's what I used to see, uh Ski, I see Dame Dash walking his dogs. Uh that's when the jay Z was around a lot, you know, running with Dash. So you know this is where where that that transition seeing chub each ub all the time. You know. So we all live in the same area era, but the area and but uh we fought from day one and and but it would be over nonsense, but it never affected the greatness of the songs. Like we we'd be fighting, and then he's fighting with my dancer, you know, and then that they're they're fighting in the hallway. But we're in a grimy building, crackheads all on the same floor, and they're like, come on, let's go, let's go, and they they're tearing the room up or tearing the hallway up. And then next thing you know, we're like, yo, I love you man. And next thing you know, we're in the lab making another bank. So because I'm skipping ahead, I'm skipping out a little bit. Now your mind off hard earned? Was that told me about? You even know what? Yeah, even though it's basketball's lingo. We had just got into a major fight. This during the this right around daily operation time, We've got to a major, major, major fight. Uh, it's very bloody, very messy, and we had already gotten hired to do the song for White Men Can't Can't Jump soundtrack, so you know, the check is already and the last thing I want to do is is not the So I remember. I remember Greul walked into the session, bandages on his head and everything like that. And he walks in and goes straight to the booth and looks right at me. You know, because the way D and D did, the way it is with the voca booth, it's just a slight look to the level. He's the booth right there. He looked at me and just said, you do get there wrong. You never have the skills like mine. And he's just looking right at me, and I'm looking at him. Good. We still have a little tension, and I remember when it when the vocal was done, he goes good with that. I'm like, yo, it's dope. He goes and fuck you, walks out. A couple of days later, it was back to but how did you even know that we had talked about that. I'm missing probably I missed him so much and then only that. I mean, you know, he had a big alcohol problem. He used to flip a lot where it's not even just me you can be I mean, so many people in the industry and fans have still come up to me and go, yeah, he was drunk and he was cursing. Yeah. And there's so many stories that are similar to mind, so it's not like just us. This is fans and other artists that have witnessed the same thing. But one thing is that and you know, so dope is even when he would be pissed or in one of his moods, he would go, well, that's just one thing. I will say, I'm one of the nicest. And he would always say that, or he go, one thing is for sure, nobody can out rhyn me. I don't care how ugly it was or is. He would always make that his last hip hop fights like food or a girl or whatever. Just so many things, man, and and but we don't. He just had issues because you guys kind of came into your prime when this was really a young man's game. I mean, the least perceived, you know, I mean, you're you're, you're said his age lists anyway. But I'm just saying that, you know, most people get ushered in when they're like nine, they're young boys, you know that sort of thing. I mean, well, I was at an age at that time. What's the difference. He's uh, he's older than you. Yeah, he's older you. Um. Yeah. So even though the age line happened for several years, you know, which I already knew what his age was, but significant, man, I never knew he trying to hide his age or whatever. He just had such a cool Guru's I mean, for those that you know are too young to even remember that time period, I mean, Guru's voice. It was probably, i'll say, definitely the top five most unique voice absolute as I mean absolutely, just as far as delivery, Like you know, I put him up there with Snoop's voice, Tips voice, the real voice, uh even at Rocks voice has a very unique you know, so crazy. I didn't know his real age either until we went back to Boston promo for one of our albums, and uh, l G and the Bulldogs was shooting. I got to have a video in the back of the store, so like your l G was in and and uh, why dont you come in? Because we knew the awesome to everybody knew gangster by that time. But we went around the corner to be in the video which we're in it, and uh a kid walks up and goes, hey, Mr Healinging, remember me? And I'm sitting there like, why is this kid calling the mister heal him? So I'm like, why are you calling the missal him? He said he was my teacher? Great did That's when I was like, just tell me what theyd you so I know, even if I gonna lie for you, I just want to know so I know you know. And then we all got our story straight. When did when did y'all start? Because okay, so no one missed, not miss like a daily operation. I remember that follow up that seemed to come kind of quick after. Uh after that, you come out with an album. Every year you're do an album, your tour, come home and get the next budget. And so with that, hud, well wait a minute, but this is one thing though, you guys didn't because by this point you're with Patrick Moxy and I know his m O is tour right, because you guys were the only people I ever saw going to the same places because because our radio played, ship was down and we weren't on TV. Management was like, yo, we gotta go on the road. And so we got a lot of our gigs based on the acts that wouldn't go blah black cancels to do that. But you guys were always on the route. Yeah. Well, but Patrick's is British, even though he speaks American English that he doesn't have an accent, but he's British. And all of our staff nearly east to be who all the you know, top executives now shout all of them. Uh they they were all uh part of his to his team. So that's why that's why I knew so much slang. Like even to this day, I still go fucking hell And I'm so used to hearing that in the office so much that that's normal for me to respond with a certain things like are you serious? Man? Fucking hell? Like it just it just rolls off the tongue that naturally. Speaking of tour, you must give the QLs listeners the Gang Star Father m c DJ quick tour story. The towels. I've never heard it. This is the most gang all of the towels. Oh my god. E p m D three years Yeah, E p m DS is a tour with him. Just when Jess get the rep was very hot and uh because jess Get came about ninety. If you look at the twelve and just seven the arena, the album came e P M D S is going tour when we were so ecstatic, like wow, I drove my own vand and my mp V. It's me Dap Gordon Guru and we had a nine million meter and a whole bunch of beer. You know, we werenaken freaks. Yeah, the Premier van, yeah, the one we all used. So you weren't renting a we can afford it. We couldn't afford to get a bus yet. You know, I was a big, big paper and we wouldn't get into a support at that time. We didn't get to support until the second until Daily Operation. Then we were canto a support all the time. Do they still do to still to a support for artist? Probably not. Well now it's three sixty deals where they just pay for everything. And yeah, so it is D D. Quick. He was brand new. He's like the first blood Rabbi ever seen that. I only knew crips. So it was D D. Quick, Uh, father them See Mary J. Blige was with us for a little while as a backup singer, you know, with with Father Sear all label mats. Uh Chubb rock, that's that's some Polke was just the DJ before Yeah and and Gangstar. So we're on the tour and uh father them. She used to always be late to the gigs where he would have to because d D. Quick supposed going right for you pm D because the markets we win. He was bigger, you know, so the lineup goes into order of how pop POPA and you are so obviously even p D with the biggest but you know so fatherm C was always robed late where Quick way that to go on so that it doesn't keep a lagging in the in the show. And then uh father them, he's closer to the heirline got to a point where everybody was getting frustrated with it. Was like, yeah, we gotta say something to him, and uh you know words was said. We was like, you know, if you don't, if you keep starting keep coming late, we're gonna have a problem, you know, flat out. So it got to a point where once he uh started, he started coming on time and everything was cool but Quick but Quick was like, all right, let me, uh let me show it this this kind how big my strength is. Because every show after Quick would get off stage. He used to do a meet and Greek and you know, meet and greets were really a new thing for us at that time, right after the show. And then plus Quick was so new, you know for us because everybody kW E, pm D, everybody knew chop Rock at the time. And uh and like I said, we were popping with our our records. But man, uh the line for Quick was that crazy to just get you know, the glossy promo pictures sign and you take it back this is backstage. But after the whole thing, Father them he got out of hand where they were like, yo, you know this, this gotta stop. And again he started coming on time. But just to get back at him, Quick had his security guy, the security team by a whole bag, like garbage back full of towels like the little ones that you twirl at football games and stuff like that. So all of a sudden, Father the Sea goes on stage and there's like a big ruckis in the crowd and everybody's like wondering what's going on. And you look at you know, because we've already performed, so we're hanging out and we're watching and we looked and DJ Quick is wiping his Jerry curl with the towels and then passing them to the girls. So there, you know, that's distracting everybody watching. I was waiting for like he's wiping his Jerry curl and so girls like, oh, I got this great and didn't wipe his face. You know, he'd wipe his face, you know. And and the security team was all from St. Louis. He went to a show in St. Louis. He went to a show in St. Louis and loved the way that the security team was handling the crowd. They hired everybody that worked at that club, so they shut the club down for that period of time while that whole security team went on toy He got got him a RV of their own, and they wrote in that RV with the security team, and they were because he was having a lot of problems with gangbangers and it was heavy. Yeah, people were like fun, quick, fun, quicker and stuff like that. And we were riding with him because you know, he's part of our tour and we were both were families, so we you know, and then everything turning out cool with father them. See it was we were always cool with him anyway. It was just stop coming late, you know, just because you want to you know different. But everything ended up being a cool tour. Everybody got along with father them. See he's a great dude and big up to him too, you know. Can I ask you because I mean, you're one of the few luminaries that is pretty much been privy to and active in every era of postmodern hip hop touring. You were there for the nine early nineties right when like MTV raps was ramping up in America and a whole new thing. You were there for like the alternative tours. You again, you hit Europe and all those other spots you still towards you this day when you think of, ah, those were the days, like that's real touring. What where does your mind instantly go to from those days? Because you I feel like you've toured more than the average cat and hip hop and in various you know, when your own or whatever, Like when do you have is it fine memories when you're in the van driving or is it like when we got tour busses that was the time, or is it like what are the glory days for you? Like he tour really really for us was when we did London because we were told and you know, London is the New York of Europe. Were not even cities I've just met, like Era Oho Daily Operation really so early. Yeah, that's when we brought j ruined DAP and I even seen j Ru dismantle a guy that pulled a gun in the audience and he was able to dismant on him and take the gun and the guy and got it from him, and then we took it on our bus and we're like, I got an old video footage, I got video foot tage document. Oh yeah, we got hundreds of tapes, uh, to be continued, so we're safe in a safe place. That's the good thing. Was the from Daily Operation on like and then on y'all Hit Hard to Earn? When was the was the harder and kind of like the pay dirt moment for y'all, Like record were the headliner and we it was it was it was Gangstar mp nas and uh and uhum Gangs are mlpnas and Jay was the damage because Ju was popping and Mop was really popping and starting to pop with out with the first album. They didn't even have the second album out, but they were they we we took them on tour because we became really close friends. And then uh, um Nas was only on the tour for like three shows, and then it's uh his manager, who was ll Cool Jay's manager, was like, you know, no, it's too big for y'all. We're taking him off the tour. We're like, what do you mean. He's like, hey, he's too big for y'all. We were pissed. Yeah, no, this is when Nematic had just come out. Yeah, I got footage, lyrics, I have footage, but but it was like just like, Yo, how are you gonna do that? And it's not it's not no management, but uh, but it was just like, you know, we we just felt like that was a slap in our face because we asked not to be on it, and we were like, yo, this is gonna be a good, good look before he does getting ready to do his own thing. But we were you know, we weren't even salty in him. It was just a manager. So he did three shows. I got all the footage of the shows he toured up because that's from New York state of mind of just pubbled in the street and it was heavy and having him open up too a big deal. Uh okay, before I as are the Dwick questions, because I feel like Dwick was the the real turning point of you guys blossom into it, you know, for the group. However, you guys are also on uh Nice and spoons and the damping change right down the line, down the line. Did you produce down the line? Did you cut on down the line? Yes? Okay? Who produced it? Greg Nice? Greg Nice makes it makes dope beats. Here's the funny thing though, because I always felt that Greg Nice did not know who you guys were as you were doing it exactly. Yeah, so that's actually how do Greg Nice? Yeah, so we got an old history. But what this is what happened or did he just not correct? This is what it was. That's what they used to work a power play and everybody knows, you know, paid him forward was done there. You know. Uh I saw I witnessed large Professor do uh wanted that alive cool gi rap album. I was there to watch all those sessions. Well, you know, I was just like, wow, look at g rapping. He's always goes hold on, I got spit and he's spitting then literally, yeah, a spit on the ground and then he would and he punched me in and he would boom, just go go, go, go go. You know that. Yeah, I was gonna say, what magical? What sessions have you witnessed that you were there for? Like alive shout the the um you know, Polo would be there and uh Drew um uh man, oh my god he lives in Texas now, um Drew, Uh what's his DJ name? He's part of the early x X men. Um. Um, oh my god, you know what his Drew's name? Uh damn. Now he's killing me. Uh Drew whose name is? He'll come back to me. Um. But just being there to see that go down, you know, one of that allows one of the dopest could you wrap albums ever? And every song, every song? You know? So so you were there to witness the whole process. Yeah? Were you next door to them or was now? You know, we all hung out so large, Like come with me to the sessions. Verry B walk in with the big cable and just like there he is there, he is there, he is. Was it easy for you guys to get initiated in the the And I mean well no, Actually, you know what Chuck d did make you a part of the extra Strength process, like Chuck these thank you on all public albums like to be the extra strength problem. I used to love come with the fold up paper and exactly. So, I mean, how how long was it before you guys. Were you guys just instantly like welcome wherever you came in, Like oh yeah, yeah, I remember when we couldn't get into clubs. And also when Manifest came out, those same security guys like and they would call again, they called Google gangstar gang come on in, you know, yeah, and you know, but they knew we were both gangster, but they would call him gangster. But we now we're getting into every hot club that's hard to get in. It was automatic. We were like wow, and we'd be like thirty forty deep and everybody got in. So yeah, because unless it was Patrick's club. It was Patrick's Club at the pay at the Powerhouse, which was the big club of that during the early nineties, we were a hundred deep. We got in. Yeah. I always think of that because solutically of Chaos true story. It's I imagine, because he's so descriptive with it, true story, and it's somewhere because you guys are at least what you represent musically. And I know it's street, I know it's true to the boom, but there is a mellow, kind of calming, non aggressiveness about Gang Star. But you guys rolled like we were wild. Five car Lucy like, yeah, we were wild. We were really wild. I mean our house it was literally like a frat house. Easy Mobile will tell you, JESSU will tell your Rizzle will tell you they were there. Yeah, like our house was a wild house. Rage but before I remembering, Rage wanted me to our demos and she was like, loop up this, Michael Jackson. I'm like, no, you need to do and she's like, you know what, ain't nobody helped me out here. I'm going to I'm gonna find Dr Dre And she goes, I'm gonna move to what And she and we did a Stepping the Arena tour and we did l A at the Palladium Sat Palladium of Sunset and she was doing security with the yellow jackets, that security on the back, you know, and she was like, yo, I met up with Dr Dre. He's starting a new label called Death Row and he signed me and I was like for real. She goes, yes, we're about to watch. So she was in New Yorker first, Yeah, she was going with Nicky D. She used to sleep on the couch at Chung King. She ain't have a place to stay. She's going and uh and uh it did. It was her, Nikki D and Nikki's sister. He's called a terrible t And I met rage because Nikki D, you know, was the first female on Death Jam. We went to the release party for her and we knew we all live, we all knew each other. But they need to ride home. And I had the MPV and we just got the stepan the arena, uh test press cassette to make sure it sounded good. We never see c d's weren't ready yet and uh, you know, to test those out before we were, before we're going to put them into production. And I had precisely the right rhymes, which was my jam where I used the Brethren drums, and I had that fifty hurts uh eight, which is if you ever right. I'm giving them a ride home. Right when they get in the car, I said, your mind about to listen to something. Mind, My new album is about to come out. They're like, yeah, go ahead and play it. When that when that Bay said, rage goes turned around like she goes that eight oh eight, And I said, what you know about eight oh eight? She play that again, you know, almost like it was making a horny. She'll tell you the same story. She'll tell you like yo, she's like oh, And I was like, yo, b how you know about that? She got work at Young King, he said, you know, so I'm always there, you know, seeing him do the process, trying to like she just wanted to get She wanted to be engineer and an artist. But everything she wanted me to she should come to my house and everything she wanted me to do was like Luke Luther andros Loup And I was like, no, you need hardcore beats ahead of her time. As soon as I heard this should be played volume ramped, let me kick off, I was like, that's hard. You don't even though it said it on the cover, said later Inn with the death Row inmates, it was a real little block in the bottom left corner, and I was like, that's her, and and then she was on everything. And then so by the time y'all did you did the record for her album? That was but it started at that time. Can I ask you something since you brought it up, asked me something, be super honest with you, don't be politically correct. When the Chronic came out September, what was your initial reaction, Bloom, Yes, I knew that I was. I wanted him to hear it from you. Yo. Every song tied in, you know, because it was because I remember because telling me you said, like after the Chronic came out, that's what made you step up the sonics. Yeah, because even though he samples, I mean, we'll replay stuff. It just it us again. I'm I'm from an era. I'm from boom box and drive and I drive all the sometimes just getting the contra drive and just listen to ship. So that's still my mentality. And that's how my great uh like shout the Tory Wolf. We just finished her album on my on my I have two labels year round, which is my street Ship and then I have T T T which just to the top. With my manager Ian, we put our alternative stuff R and B whatever, just as long as not the gutter gutter, we put it on T T T. So The Tory Wolf am I just finished. And even though she's a singer, songwriter and all of that stuff in the style of music I did for her is so different. I still mat when I went to mastering the shout to Tony Darcy, who's been mastering my stuff since the early Game Star days. So when I got there, he said, you still doing he go he did the first thing. Tony said, still doing it the cassette way? I say, yeah. When I sequenced, I say cassette s I'd be of a cassette and you know what would start when you flip it over. The flipover part is the most difficult for me because it's getting it going. You want to put some bangers, but you still need to put some bangers on the other side. Yeah you got and you gotta kick off side be with a bang, and I and I just I just sit there and just play the ending of the song in my head, like when I look at the list, like then with that, run into that and then I'm really meticulous about the spacing. You know, somebody run into it on uan two three and boom does he really? Yeah, he's sequencely, He's sequences everything on the one like when you listen to his record, really yeah, that's because I learned that from him too. I like stuffing. I hear stuff like that, one of those first person that see I only said that because I saw you say something about that before in the interview, something about the chronic didn't hit you right away. I'm saying, like, because you mentioned straight off the jungle to me and and all right, figure out the way that you did take it personal. So you take Skar snaps and you took just that one song really because you're your weapon up choice by now is still the sixty No no, no no, I mean yeah. Because Eddie Sancho when Lyle was doing the Russian Dragon, he was like, it was taking too long to do it that way, man, he said, you know what, and he's I'm watching how you're doing your beats because he Eddie Sandra was the engineer there at D and D. He's like, you should use the NPC because the tracks are laid out, you know, one through a million. And he said the thing with that is it's like he said, it's like a tape deck without being a tape deck. And you know a tape machine. I mean so he said, that's all. You just don't have the tape machine, but just the way you could layer and mute and do this and I was like wow. So then when he taught me how to work it, I was like, he's like, you know, I'm about to get rid of mine. You want to buy it? I bought it and that's when I got hooked on the MP. What's the first thing you did on the MP? Uh? Well, all of actually was the LASiS. Uh So the MP, I would probably say it's on Daily Operation. Um around that time, it would probably be. It would honestly around that time. That was around Dwick. Okay, So because Drick was a B side, it wasn't on it. It wasn't meant to be on the album. On reason why we did Dwick was to give the nicest move payback to down the line they were because they were like because we all did that together, bugging out, and we was like, well, do one on our on our record, but the album already been turned in. So he did. And I remember Don Barron was there from the masses of Ceremony because he was friends with Nice and Smooth and dub Ce, who's been coming to New York since since you know d D. Laddin was battling in eighty nine. I've been a friend with dub c recipes to his brother. Um, we just shot a video from year my Year Round label. Me and MC eight just did a project called which Way as West the executive produced. I produced three songs, and he has a producer named Brenk Sinatra from Austria who so he's uh he produced the rest of it. But the mixes were everywhere, so they I thought, they let me mix it, give it to me and if there's any hooks or nothing that's tight, I'll scratch on it. So I scratched on every song, mixed everything, had to get all the vocals in order. That's why it took me so long. Just today, I'm not used to mixing somebody else's stuff like mixing my stuff. Got it tight, We turned it in. We're about to release that. We just shot the video four days before Christmas. So Tunes was with a US and that's why we dedicated to him. So we're about to release the video and about a week or so and uh I Tunes is all in the video. And then at the end we get give a special about to him, showing him just throwing it up slow motion. You know, it's just saying r I P to him and you know, it was just even going to his funeral was l CNLLL there and Chuck d there and almost every West Coast artist you could think of was there. It was I never got a chance that he was more than the home and he was a friend, you know. So that the first song is not even the singles. We did the single which is called Compton Zoo and then and then I knew eight from back then to already. That's how we've been so cool and uh so all of that's gonna be coming out, you know, Promptu, Tory Wolfe, uh m C eight and y geez Um and my band the Batta Band. So when we're doing the EP and we're about to go on the road too. So so what is your your creative process as far as you uh practicing? M Are you a get up at eight o'clock and treat this like my real gig thing? Do you listen to records on Sunday for five hours uninterrupted? Do you like what's your because to be as good as you are with cutting, scratching, looping and you you know, even though I know the evolution of your production style um from your earlier work where you're just straight looping four bars to the point where you're chopping stuff and right, so what is your what's your preparation like, like do you have do you just do? Like Okay, I'm gonna just do three hours a day of That's how it was, well not now, but like then, like uh maybe all the way up till maybe that's what always get up. Just start practicing cuts and going to Goo Google. You're not gonna Google check this out and that sound we're gonna use that for for this beating and stuff like that. You practice cuts because you know more. Even when you were DJing on the radio, I was shocked that you play the street versions of some ship and not. I was like, why don't you just play the radio version because the first time we ever came to your show, you played the the uncensored version of Brooklyn Zoo. Now, in my opinion, I like his his his vocal performance on the radio version. It's better to me. And I was like, and whoever was in the studio, I was like, yo, why why is he played the streets on when the clean version is way better, Like it's a better vocal performance, and it's like, yeah, he always does he you know, he like that tells me you study the song too. List of all the curses and just right the curse word on a piece of paper, and the two words it comes before. So if it is it says uh um enough to make a nigger go crazy, I'll put make uh and I'll put in and then put a line I don't know why, and I won't even put a line under. I'll put just who scratch a thick to scribble line under that that inn word. So it'll make me just be like and you know, so I'm gonna look at the paper, but you will. Yeah. Right, it became normal and flext you to call me because I was on from eight to ten flexible, from ten to midnight, FLEXI calling. What is that? What is that? What is that? That's how I broke shook Ones Part two because I'm on through. Yes, they came to see me first, the first first because I worked with them because the last professor on peer pressure and did the remix and we shot a video and everything. So and so the sug Ones Part one was had been out and you know they were already allowed. I saw them at D n D in the A room and they were like, yo, man, we gotta get your new record shoog Ones for when you go on radio this weekend. And I was like, already got it. He said, no, this is part two. He goes, this is some other ship and this is and having like wait till you hear this one. And I was just like okay. And then they brought it to me during commercial break and as soon I just heard word up somewhere to all of them, I was like, I was like, oh man, out of it's just like I never heard no beat like this. That one became more popular right now. It was on like a tape I had, like the single or whatever and was whatever. But two was the one that was it. Man, talk about um because I mean by this time, so talk about j RU and Group Home because as you have told me before, like they were kind of you know, they were kind of you know the red headed steps like Google just kind of passed them off, like yeah, I work with them. Well you know what happened was I bring it down to you what we uh we we knew j RU uh and DAP once I even joined Gangstar because uh, a guy named gust Mo was around Guru all the time. I mean, Gusto got mad cool, yeah, and so um he started bringing them around so as it and then it just started to growing more people, more people, more people. I always kinda keep my distance at first, just because I was so new, you know, I didn't want to, you know, people start jumping on. You don't know what the ViBe's gonna be. So as time passed, you know, me and dapping off, this guy finally cool and we're all cool with each other. First we were, we had a little tension because it was just like, you know, we're with the we're with the MC, you're we're with the guy. You're just absolutely your crew versus Google's pretty pretty much. And I didn't really have a crew, you know what I'm saying. My friends from college and that was pretty much it. And you know, my grandfather had already passed, and you know, I didn't really have no friends. I knew. I knew Vic Black, who was still down with me because when I lived in East New York and I knew Fat Gary, I knew so uh uh he's uh it towards him. So everybody from that side of East we always call the Jay ruin them the other side, because there's there's another side of East New York across across uh, you know, Liberty and all of that. So on that side in Livonia and and all that by the train tracks on that side is predominantly Spanish, but it's very wild, very shoot them up. So we always said, you know, we're on this side of the because I live right and right next to Linden Houses, which is very wild projects. So I'm right there, I'm I'm I'm near Pink Houses. I'm near and then there you know, the drama drama, so j rus borderline of of of Brownsville, uh, and that and the other side. So he hit where he lived in Grace Towers, separates that part of East New York, but where he lives a while too. So um, we started being cool with both sides of my friends, you know, with just Fat Gary, a lot older guys, you know. But Black Black had a label called Black Magic Records before I even got a deal. I wanted him to sign me, and he was like, it's not what you think. Just because I have a stack of records in my car and all that. It's independent. I don't undertand what independent labels was. At the time Black had his first artist, they would call spider Man and Freeze and they had a record call spider Man. Yes, it was called I'm Too Much. Yeah, they were grouped Spider Man and Freeze. Yeah, like they were before they got to doing poison. This is early early, so I can't even get a sound effect transmit. Yes, it was called I'm too Much. I have a stack him at the house. Brown round, brown, brown round, run around, round around. It's called I'm Too Much by Spider Man and Freeze. So they all from the same projects. Uh yeah, so the from Workmen so so so that I used to hang out with them and everything. Again is before I was in Gangstar, so you know, the hanging with them, that's how I got cool with so many real live dudes in East New York. So I was really around real soldiers that put it in you know. Uh um, Black Is the top was a former Tomahawk, you know, one of the biggest gangs during the Warriors era. Tomahawk is a real, you know, certified gang in Brooklyn. So he was a Tomahawks. So he goes back back and uh so when it came to that, that that stage of it, I've seen them grow to where it finally got to you know them doing poison and calling me bad sex. You up all that stuff dry the biggest dr freeze and man, Okay, I have a question about j Rue the Damage. I consider that al right, the first summarizes from the East. I consider that entire record your greatest troll and your greatest victory. Now, I mean, what I have to know is I want to know your attitude. I think I brought this up to you maybe twenty years ago backstage of the Beastie Boys show. But what is what is super notable and very much troll like about the j Ruth the Damage and record. It's because now it's it's it comes out in uh four technically, yeah, even though Come Clean came out. Uh So I consider this and his entry in the Hip Hop nine the new renaissance here again with the large professor, uh Premier Tip and Ali Pete. In other words, they're not doing the conventional means of hip hop production, whereas you know, again using break beat limits, beats and breaks and all that stuff right break loose. So here's the thing, though, every every drum, uh, every every drum track used on some rises from the East. At that point when I'm listening in I consider it extremely taboo. In other words, it's like if Ray says, hey, uh, let's take uh mental Stamla Billy Jean ain't the first thing I'd grabbed for when I'm thinking of drums. I mean, now, as mature, you know, anything's up for grabs. But literally do like you took? Uh? Was the Static like you like it too? For static is a renaissance cat thinking, Okay, let me go to all of them, be some brace and take funk Adelics you like it too? Or uh bitches was all night literally even the original, even Junkle Brothers on the Run, even even using coolest back forcome Clean. So after when I listened to the record, We're talking about that later, right, even when listening to the record. By the time we got to with with the exception of Knowledge, you can't stop the profit. That's because the showbiz show biz said, yo, when he didn't catch reck, I was so addicted that record. I was like, yo, yeah, I said that shouldn't do the shingling right right yeah? And I was like, yo, man, I would love to use those drums. You go, I have two copies. You said didn't didn't do your thing. I was like, yeah, but I've never taken a drum from somebody else that's not that's like, that's like this. And SHOW was like, nah, because I know you're not gonna do it the same way I did it. And he said, I can't wait to hear what you do to it. And remember remember I remember he called me and goes like it, he goes, this is crazy. Yeah, I'm not even when I say that sample, I was like, yeo, I hated you. I just I just found it, like yeah, like like four months ago, get the drum. But yeah. I was like I was coming over from a gig and I was like, that's the crusaderes and and then it came on. I was like, but my point was that the reason why I said this is either your greatest troll or your your your your magnum opus, only because I feel as though you said either all right, let me do his record, and all right, let me challenge myself and uset backdrops of drums, then no one else would even touch. Now, with the exception of old Billy Joel, which was still not in the lexicon of hip hop drump producing. Whatever, why did you purpose? I like, you could have used the same drum. You could have used skarl snaps I mean, which I mean it was relatively new with it. Why did you use the most taboo? I would never touch that in a million years stuff. None of your contemporaries will touch it. Played out might have been the term why did you do that? That's still my approach even now, where I'm like, you know what, I've never used to one not drums and I'll go, let me do a version of that, or I'll go, I never used the the what's the Yeah, the same thing. It's like, damn, you know it's been out and they had this run. No one's really touching it. Would you have done that to a gang star record? Yeah? Yeah, you know what it is. But understand, let me understand first of all, when when when j RU Numb became part of our of our crew. I remember when we brand from oursellers left a drum set at the Brownstone, So I used to play it a lot, you know, and that's where I started getting, you know, because I was decent enough from when Travis Scott's father taught me how to drum. So Dab used to love the drums because he'd be like, let me get on how you do it? DAP caught on quick. So we just have a little battles, just bugging out and we didn't do a little different rhythms and stuff like that. Next thing. You know, you know, we always it's always all of us together in this brownstone, just smoking, drinking and jillion girls in the house. Just party, party, party, party, party, party, party, party, party, every day. Even when we went on to and come home, twenty people there, and it wasn't like what are y'all doing? They get out of the house. It was like, it's up, everybody, we're back. And yeah, we would leave people in how did you lock your room? Yeah? Okay, I was up school that, Yeah I locked mineus and so and they'd be like, yeah locking his door. Yeah you know, but but used still in my record, who's that? I'd be like, I let my passport and see my room open cast going through already. Yeah. But that's how the foundation even started, because we used to just bug out downstairs because that's what the kitchen is, what googlese room is. And one day we're all just you know, I'd be playing the drums, everybody's kicking the verse, and all sudden, da girls it's a little dap on the mind. And we were like, yo, because he never wrapped in front of us. It was it was always just yeah, yeah, a song, yea look at a minute, and we don't get the nigga, you know that? And I just missed it. Want to box. So was it true that you that you went to court for him and yeah, and to judge was like, yo, you know he had two gun charges on the under eighteen and you know at that time there was very they're very strict on gun charges in New York still, and uh, you know what, we he really wanted the box. And we told the judge, Judge Bamburger, thank you, Judge Bamburger. She was a mean little white lady, but this tall but with an attitude, and she's like, you know, I want him box him because he's violent. He's always getting into violent stuff. He's always getting getting the rest of, getting the rest of because melank I loves just to get down. So she was like, how tall is he? He's short, Yeah, but he will stand up to the biggest the meaning you see him. He does not give a fuck. He still doesn't. I just spoke to another day. He just came home again. You know what I'm saying, that's that's my baby, man, shout shout, that's what called him a baby. He'll go call hey baby, you know, hey baby, you know and that that that's my breast, my bro So he uh, but yeah, if it's on, he's he's ready. It don't matter what. He'll pop it. He'll do whatever. But he's a great, little, soft hearted kind guy to you, very very cordial. But if it's a negative situation, he's ready for it. So just stay on his good side. That's you. He loves you. He'll be like Chris, look and he'll talk like a child. You can leave your drums, you know. Oh man, but he wanted to box so bad. He was nice. So I was like, Judge, why don't you let the box because if he can make a profession out of it, that's a positive thing. She goes, no, it's violent. She goes, have you heard the word remanded? Remember she said that she was gonna remand him. She goes, you're in music, make him make a record? Was like, but so he didn't want to rap. He he would be like, I don't want to do this. So he would always disappear. So that's why what you got? How long did it take to make? Uh? The group from the album? That was the most heaviest test in my way. Let's it was just a lot of just pushing pull to get it to be that right, because it's a great album for what it time to be, you know, and and uh and this is what it was when Jay Ru used to do his demos over at Black scribt Um, his Black Big Sugar and and and and the group. I wasn't even rapping then they were doing the demos over blacks Cript. That's how it led to Groogle saying, you know, we should start Gangster Foundation. And he said we should both sign three artists. He said, I'll sign three and you signed three and I said, well, who you're gonna sign? He said, I want Jay Row Group Home and Shugar. And I was like, all right, well I don't have anybody yet, but eventually I'll get somebody, so let's start with him. He said, who do you think should go first? I said, Jay Ruth, the one is ready. He's got the boys, he's got the cocky attude. You know, he's called himself. He was a real fat guy back back in the day before he started doing the martial arts and got really in shape, and he was like he used to go up to girls going, Yo, what's up baby, I'm Porky the pimp. You know what I'm saying. You want to date? He's still do Yeah, he's good. Yeah yeah, and ask you in front of the gall together. Oh yeah, he even been around him. You know, you want to date and he's I'm the fat Mac and you did group says that, Oh there goes my man, the fat Mac on the Yeah. You know. So like these are the things that really happened. And so I like ruins the most ready, let me do a demo with him. And I remember L cool J and Chris like he had just left my apartment that I was living there at the time to work with some LL stuff. But they never transpired. And uh, for what album U that had to be to four Shots? It had to be fourteen yea fourteen Shots to the Dome had pink cookies, right, Yeah, it was around that time. You could remember L was like, Yo, spoke a little bit good stuff. Maybe I'll get you. You know what I'm saying. We're working working on something hot. You know, you know, I got some joints. LL joints. I'd play it for you. I got some joints, you know. But but but but but oh yeah, but then there in the vault. But in the meantime, since j ruthe seemed like he was the most ready. Um, that's what we said, let's put him on our next album, on Daily Operation. And that's when we did on the and and that came out though, so we're like, yo, we got something. You know, these guys got a little a little something. So that's why I was like, well, since I specialized in the beach, Google, let me do the beach. We still play everything down the middle of all the deals, we still fifty fifty. Even if he doesn't touch anything on the album, I still make sure that Google gets his half. You know, people he's are spread sa rumors of not even knowing like he was getting more than him. It's like, no, everything was split down the middle still is. Initially, Jay Ru was going to be called the dirty rotting scoundrels and dirty round scoundrel and the R and B group came out. They came out for somebody. Okay, thank you that that mean and j Ru was mad about that, Like, yo, that's why he said uh on the originally god original don't sing no RnB jab at them. But when we're rude. Once we started doing, once it come clean popped off, I just wanted to attack it. Just just taking drums and stuff that I knew what would would you know, not really be used by but nobody's gonna take with Billy Jean and didn't take that and just bom uh and just trickling, you know, and roy A is that's clear to sample and the yeah, and you know, everything was just rolling. But it wasn't it like everything's gonna be just break beats or taking uh you like it two and I'm like that they just just man, I don't know again, it was it was so taboo that that at that point then I realized, like, oh, I feel like that was the first time I realized the value of flipping. Yeah, because then it's like because when I when I love mental stamina, and I was like, damn, like I never considered Billy Jean breakable right right the whole thing. I know there's isolated drums there, but he actually made it work. So now I gotta I gotta listen to all these records all over again and figure out how to recontextualize and make it breakable. My moment for that with the my unbreakable pre moment was when I heard uh tin Crack Commandments because I had that record, which I don't want, but yeah, well uh Leslie Nielsen niked gunn Yeah, I like that, and but no I had it, and so I used to just play that song no, no, yeah, no, yeah, the original because because those are just kid program kicks and stands, and so I would just play that song like in the morning, getting ready for school or whatever. And so then when Life After Death came out and everybody was like, yo, t Crack, that's the one. That's the one. So you know, we get schooled and we're in the parking lot and my man is playing it and the joint comes on for the rest, I'm like, I'm like, yo, that's remember. I'm not the only one. I'm like, I'm like no, because the way that it's slooping, that's the way I was scratching. Because the drums are already relaid, and we were doing a promo for Angie Martinez. It wasn't for us. We were just doing a promo for Angie. Listen, it's called Angie Martinez used to have us just when Andrew was like the new hot thing and she was, you know, brand new. Everybody loved Angie, so everybody was doing promos for that were dope, we'll taking the Onyx and they were just so incredible. So Ja Rue was very popping at the time, and uh, but we said we're gonna do one. But because she loved j Rous damages so because and and so when we were doing it, she had a show called The Hot Five at nine. That's why I'm only scratching to nine when it goes one, two, three, seven, eight nine at nine o'clock. And then after that was going one, two, three, four or five, back four or five. I don't go past five until right before the first one, two, three, four, five, seven, eight nine, eight nine, ain't nine, It wasn't no ten. So yeah, it's called the Hot Five. I have the song Jesus Christ. All right, you'll listen to Supreme. We're taking a quick break the patent bills and get into our final hour with special guests DJ Premier right after this. All right, this is our final hour, uh of of fanning out with DJ Premier, who just revealed to us that some of his throwaways is some of the greatest things on earth ever common on this show. Yeah, just now, I'm not I'm just gonna working to ship for two minutes. Um, God, I had a not to cut you. So when we did HOW five and nine and and it uh and how I got two big because Puff was on High nineties seven and that particular day, she played the promo and I mean she had played him many other times, you know, because you mix them up and then you know, you still here somebody else promo. A couple of weeks later, he heard that and my boy Danny was like, yo uh. He hit me on my beeper and was like, yo uh that telling the PUPPI is telling you to call him on HOW night and seven. I'm like, for real, He's like yeah. He's like he's like turning on and turned it on and he's talking about other stuff and you know, not a deep into their interview and then finally goes Prem called me and then I called and that's when he said, yo big once that once that beat. And I was like, all right, but you know now as Jal is he cool with it? He's like yeah, and j was said, Yo, that's hip. Hop it's all good. And then I gave it the big so I just muted the it's the Galien te Sinko Allen whoever you know? Was that two tracks of the sample because I tried to do it at once and can't. In other words, because you're using three tones to it. Did you do it on two tracks or straight one track one tracker? And but then I put it in my sampler and just just made sure I had had a trigger. So so I scratched my nuning that time. Yes, that's the one I because I wanted to because when you're doing a live I was liking it so much that I was like, it has to sound just like that. And then I went on pro tools. Yet you know what I'm saying, I was still still on so so I just made so what I do. I used to used to click. I still do this. I click in my head and just be like and and imagine it's the same tempo as the way I wanted to be. And then I just told that when you hit the record on the sampler, I can go and then yeah, I programmed that that way. It's so loose, it's like I'm doing it in my hand, which technically, I am, is it true that um for why we gonna? Is it true that it was his idea to put the Kelly sample. Yeah, he was on the way out and he's like, yo, put that unbelievable from Mark Kelly. I was like, yo, it might not be in tune. And I'm very I was murdering about decision. I'm very key conscious, you know, like I know you. I'm sure you're I was running the decision behind man like it works. But oh my god, I always thought that was a woman. Believe your just one of my favorite songs at the time I had. I was like, okay, so can you confirm can you confirm that that's Patrice Rushing unbelievable? I believe no, Okay, wait wait wait wait wait wait, because Tomas the Stabs and I just pitched it. I was told that I thought the stab was from Yeah, remind me. Yeah, I thought you'll excuse me. I'm just as student question. I really thought stabs was just like a slang term. But that is a real technical term when it comes to like, it's an autom out here. Isn't that much of a it's an audio atom out here? When when the horns goes, Yeah, that wasn't that wasn't Russia. No, you see, if when I hit it as a rattle, as a little rattle, and so I back then, before I could play bass notes on a keyboard, I used to just pitch everything on the nine fifty. So so if it needs to be boom boom boom, by just boom boom boom boom boom boom and just and just put them on the same output so that could cut them. So I was just gonna bump bump bum Yeah. Yeah, are you going to reveal what that staff about the studio? I'll load it up because I found her. I found I found it. If you just tell us what that's behind the scenes, but come by everything already when you load it up, it's automatically on the pads and everything. I'll even let you. I'll even let you. I'll film you even doing it yourself, all right, and then pieces just yeah we know. But yeah, man, And even that looked like Beach again, because in Peach came from Big Going calling me going. I was like, Big, I don't have time to do a beat, and he's like, yo, I just need this one for the beat side of my single juicy, and I was like, I don't have time. He goes, man, you could do impeach. I don't care anything. And I said, okay, let to come by. Came by and can I remember I had remember the legion? Yeah. He goes another word, I'm a big mother and I had it go on so it was gonna boom boom boom. I'm a big I'm up in my I'm a big and big. I don't like that. And I was like, Yo, it's dope because you big and I'm a big. I'm a big koom. I'm a big, big, big, big big And he's like no, and then and then that's where he came up with the YO user Kelly. And then that's how Kelly got cool because I Kelly loved the record because you know, we had to go through him to clear it. And then then then they started doing every day and now yeah, I read and then you know, big just on everything. Then after that, that's dope. Man. You have any nys ile manic questions, No, is there anything about your ill man acquestions that we don't know? M What is that like? Did it you know I'm ready ready to die? Question? Because you're the original version of what you want to be? Hard corey? Why even though I like the live version, ever made it like that? Yeah? Guess what it's called. It's called I don't like this remix, That's what it's called. I just gave it to official. I just he just asked me for yesterday because he say he's coming next week to New York and he's like, anywhere I can get that. He's only got a radio rip and it sounds horrible, and yeah, and I'll give it to you. You know, I got the instrument. Why don't you like it? I just thought it could have been better? You know, it's big, you know, and I think everything I've done prior to that is better than in that case. What three beat of yours are you like? That's like a staple test? Like I don't like Memory Lane? What nas Nas like? Yo? I'm nas nas was making fun of the Ruben Wilson cover, look like like you know what it sounds like. But this is a thing, all right, It's it's it's a synesthesia thing for me because it's like when I hear it, it feels like winter. It feels like it's something about that loop that makes it feel like it's winter outside like. There's certain loops that make you see some ship the same way that I saw that fun House on for Better for I see him sitting on a park. It's winter like. It's it's like, I don't know if it's a yeah but yeah, but for one but memory Lane. I never liked it because I thought New York State. I wanted to just do New York State of Mind represents even represented. That's the remix. The one is on the album as a remix word Yeah. The original is some Baseline jazz apple. I use I got the original version. I'll get that too. How did you switch at the last? One? Represented? The first record we did period and uh and after I heard whatever, I was there at that session. Pete did all them scratches in one take. We were at bad that battery. Then a Q Tip Metal met up with us and Pause mixed the Heat Brothers and brought the cassette to NASCA. I was giving him no ride to me, that's a Pause tape. I was there. I wasn't there when he made it, was there when he brought it to give the NAS because I was giving nos a ride to meet up with Puff and I'm giving him a ride, and we met up with Tipp and he gave the cassette and if you had the cassette, it's going so you're just like, what in the fund is this? Because I didn't know what he brothers was at that time, and it's just like and he's going, you know, some of them are on. You know when you get four bars tight and then you'll be a little off. And now I was like, yo, man, this is good craz Yeah. So I was like, yo, man, I gotta change mind because New York stay to MI. I was happy. I was like, this is what what we posing made. I just like I said, I love when the streets have something that that that that that feeds there their pain and anger and stuff, you know. So that's why I like, it's just as good as possible. So even even when it's melodic. But so we're memory Lane. I was just like when I was laughing at the cover, he was just like, yeah, he's like this, this dude looks funny. And then then we heard that dude. Dude, he was like, Yo, that's it, that's it. I'm like, nah, that's too happy, he said, No, I dug that up. I'm like nah, I need some hard stuff. But that's the thing though, like I feel like you'd be trying to match, especially like in Later you got be as gott as them. But if you if you think about it, some of the most menacing sounding hip hop's when there's a contradiction there you go, so that beautiful loop over how he's delivering it. It works even when shook one because p and then they're not like I thought Onyx was the pinnacle of hardcore, and then they come with this like Robert de Niro deadpan ship and it shares the ship out of here. It works that way. The beautiful ship works with and I put the drums to it and he was like, that's it. But when I heard him spit the e right for listen, I was like, wow, this is kind of cool. But I still wasn't not crazy about them. Once I heard uh one love, I was like, I'm changing my represent and so I gave him I gave knowledge the new remix and he's like, no, go back. I just pushed and push him, push, like come on, please now, it's like let's roll with this one. This is the one, this is the one. He was like, no, he totally was like, no, okay, before we wrap up one more client? Who okay, your your whole process like he for a reasonable doubt, For reasonable doubt, he would just call me and go, yo, I got this song. And he would do the rhyme over the phone and be like, yo, and I want you to do this. Dear God, I wonder he ain't me. I can't you know, I can't die. I can't die all that stuff. Man. And I was like, all right, I'll meet you down there. He got there. I had. He's like, that's it goes and it does it, um, friend of foe. We I was just because I make my betes on the spot. And you know I'm known for that. And that's how I've always that's always making in front of every time, every time. I never be like, yo, here's ten beats, pick one. I sit there and make it right there. Isn't that too much pressure when cats are watching it though? It's the only way I know. I thought, that's how you did ship. You know something, first time I ever met you, you were making them act like they don't know. Oh man, I totally forgotten. Um. We were with we were the beat beat miners making a sound treatment remix the WHI right, we were and then I kept hearing this bell going off and I was behind were watching that ship. I totally forgot you were like making that's the yeah and oh the rewind to the nasmatic Shan Nicholson who did the rubble Kings about the all the Gangs. Um, he was a guest on my radio show and he said, he said, yo, he's I got a crazy story for you. Like you know, he said, we met before I tell you the story when we go on the end and he said, yo, he said, you came in to give nas the memory lane dead. Uh. To let him hear in the final mix at Chunk King, he said, I was an intern there and he said on the way out and uh. And then he introduced me to a z all that was there. They had just the Life of Business played it for me him and Na's father. I watched father going to booth and do the horn part in one take. Well, he did a couple of takes, but the one that he said, this is the one that's the one I ended up on the album. But I remember he said, uh, he said on the way out, I said, don't forget when the phone when the answer machine goes off, whatever you do, say I chill. He goes okay, guy, and you know, but for him to be an intern and and he said at that time, it was like what is it? Because I said, no, matter what you do, that's what you got to say at the end of the phone of the phone message, and he said he got hard earned and heard all right, Chi plus Nasse starts at all and he's like, wow, that's what he was doing, shout San Nicholson. Which is a dope documentary. Ever seen you never seen rubble Kings. Check out rubble Kings. It's an amazing documentary. Can as Christina Aguilar question, I'm just I just I just do it now. I just need to know because I feel like you haven't done with so many R and B albums and the full, the full thing, like how that happened? Because I know she called you at first, and what made you go, Yeah, well, I was I was a fan of her. You know, I wasn't in a genie in the bottle, you know. It was it was a cute pop record and it is what it is. But uh, when she did Beautiful, he was she did dirty with Red Man. I was like, man. She got red Man in her video and then even though she had she was wearing the skippy chaps and showing up button everything. You know, I was just like, you know, it's a Darren little chicken everything. So when it came to them reaching out to me, Uh, her ex husband Jordy, you gotta get a lot of credit. But because he put her on the Group Home album, and she was really into the Group Home album. So when I met her, she's like, I love the music in this Group Home album, the structure, everything, you know. I want something like this and that type of vibe but using more jazz type samples or whatever, and were back in the Day. Was the first song we did was never I love that song. I love that song. I love that. She came to DND first and then Uh and I played to the because I was like, I gotta have something ready, So I got there a little early, cooked it up, did it, and then when she got there, she was like, I liked this one. And then we went to Record Plant in l A and UH cut it there when Madonna was in running room. Uh, Macy Grave was in another room, then Biscuit was in another room, and Evanescence is another room. And remember cameras all outside because they had heard she was getting married and they were wating to get papa. So you know, I'm with her all the time. And then I would even see pictures saying, uh with with such a bodyguard, and I'm like, I'm not the bodyguard. I go out to the car to go grab some o the car and they were like that could see his bodyguards because you know, you know, I guess it's the way my statue or whatever. And I'm saying like that, little do they know making the be But back in the day was the first one we did it. She did Chara de I guardy big up to her. She she wrote that right on the spot and she was sit there with a little dog, um with a little Chihuahua and uh and and she would do it on the laptop boom. They would going to room and just vibe together because Christina has to be involved with the structure and everything. She's real meticulous and she cut a vocal real quick. The shoutouts in that song are real like yeah, she said, do your thing, do your thing. I'm skipping moment of truth. I know, we I know, but I got it, like in my mind, I'm like, I got five questions, but there's one for the owners. No high hats. Yeah, you started this madness revolution. No high hats, right, what made you even think to go there? Because? Um, because no? Because Ah. In a review, a guy said Premier used the same high hat all the time, and I was offended by, and I was I was offended by. So I was like, you know what, I'm not the same thing. When I started stop using jazz samples, I was like, because everybody keeps thinking saying with jazz rapping, it's like, we're not rapping about jazz where which is why Grew always said I'll do the Jazz Bass Project to protect gangster this category because we're rapping about regular stuff. So I said, I'm gonna start using weird sounds to show that I'm ammiversatile beatmaker. So I did that on purpose because I couldn't take criticism at that time when somebody was saying it's weird, because then everyone followed suit and just the same higher every single record, And I was like, so that's why I started going all right now, you know, And that was before the end OFNET. But it's just like just I purposely did some spite. But even with skills though, I remember with skills I had I first heard that Tony touch it, played it and the wrapper of us never I was like, yo, like the fact those drums that was kindnu, it's not the regular point where you take it god like. And again I do that for people like yourself to get it, like I know, quest level get it. I remember when before we had already met and there, but um, we got more cool when I started hanging with the Angelo because de' angelo was that just gotten signed to Chrystalists. So because the rest of the development was our first label mates outside of hip hop, and then uh and then D'Angelo came and I remember when Lindsay who was saying are there whose mother owned Sylvia's And he was like, YO, tell me what you think of this guy from Virginia. And so when I heard it, I was like, Yo, this is dude, dope. So we had to go on a lot of promo together. They had already signed him. They're just saying that I did. They are legitium like yeah, and me and D'Angelo got this super duper cool. And then he started used to always say he's getting with you and he's always be and we get with Jay Diller to you know, God bless him. So I was are the session when you were leaving, when I was about to do Devil's Pie, I was just you was on your way out from doing how does it Feel? You would just laid all the drum pards and and he was like, yo, I'm gonna be naked in the video. I'm like, I'm not even thinking. He's like, yeah, I got a trainer. He I trained every day. He's got me. He's getting me in shape. He said, well, I'm gonna be cut. And when that ship came out, I was like, damn, this motherfucker's ripped. And you know, you know, he's doing regular shirt and he was up in the sea room literally cutting all these stuff for Devil's like to see it made. And me and Diyla are there like He's the reason why Double Trouble exists on Things Fall the play because they were just like playing each other ship knocked each other out and I had nothing to that, and I was like, I need a song. Goddamnit my life. I use a lot of vocal samples. Um, do you have a like a book that was just like everything where you just have it all up here, like because you just seem to be able to find the most perfect vocal sample for every song based on either the rhyme or what the song is about or the title any of those. Um that it's stuff that just come to me going, oh so so said that. And then sometimes it won't work, and the drums from the sample might before you're forcing it. Sometimes you can hear the drums from the original sample come in and it won't fit. And sometimes and I call it the other thing I called called force fit and like, you know, let me see if I can force fit it, and if if I can force fit where it doesn't sound really messed up, like with Master Appeal, with with the Youngsters remix, you can hear all the yeah yeah and and it worked, And I just said, stand out ticket all. There's a blog dedicated to every acapella he ever cut in his career. Really and it's not even called in this business. I'm sorry. Okay, let's say a guru, so where were you? And uh, you find out he passed? And what was the what was the relationship between Guru and solar like and you know that dynamic? Like what was that all about, because it just looked weird, very very weird. I won't talk about him too much, but what I what I can say is um, just because he's not worthy of the energy, but um, but for one when he passed, I remember I had just seen him in the hospital, which I gotta thank. Uh Guru's nephew, and it's both of his nephews, Justin and uh Denzel. Denzel's is his young nephew. Denzel is the one that's like, Yo, I just went in song because there was a list of people that couldn't come in there because the whole healthcare proxy and stuff assigned the old boy. So when uh, when it came to I wasn't gonna go see him, I was just like, you know what, I just hope he pulls through. I hope he pulls through because I already spoken to his father, and his father was keeping me up. I wasn't even on Twitter yet. Buster and Q Tip were the ones that were on being my behalf tweeting. YO, just start to preem that's not true. He's not you know, he didn't have a hard he didn't. He never had a heart attack. He had a cardiac arrest from an asthma attack and the induced him into a coma to prevent him from dying. He just did not recover from that because you have to send signals to the brain to read get your nerves cracking. And there was nothing but silence in the room every day. And and people that would they said music, voices and things that he loves will trigger his brain to get him. He'll snap out of coma and go back to normal. He never woke up ever, so all that I'm up and uh to my fans, and that didn't happen. No, so, uh So when it came to going to the hospital, uh, Denzel went because their family members and they were they were Grew's father where they were to override the illegal people of the hospital because he got the power and you know, you know, he's the Supreme Court judge and he got that to happen where they could go in. You know. So when Denzel went, Denzel called me and was like, Yo, you need to go to the hospital. I'm like, dude, I'm not gonna get in. He goes, I don't care. This is a young kid. He's like, I don't care, but you need to be there. Out of anybody else you need to go, and the way he said it, and and I go, and I still was like, nah, I'm good man, I'm just gonna pray every day everything goes good, he goes find a way. That's what he said and the way he said it. I was like, all right, I'm going Monday, and I can call two of my guys and said they to, my guys have already seen him through certain circumstances when they took justin up there, so being that he got in there through the right but you know, he was allowed in and he got to see him, and he was telling me what he looked like and all that stuff. Now they can't with me just in case, you know. So I was like, let's see if we can get in there. We got there that they stopped me and like, yeah, it can help you. And then they're like, where are you going? Because I was already told with room to eight and I was like, uh eight and and and Guru's father said, if they turn you down asked for a healthcare I mean a proxy advocate, they can't deny you, and then they know you're on on your ship. I said, until I asked for a proxy advocate, the first day when I said, no, who you know with room going through the looking at listen, you can't go in or whatever. That's what the proxy hafic gets it. It was gonna be at half an hour to an hour. I was all right, I'll wait, wait and wait to wait to wait to wait. Getting to the point where I'm getting restless. Where I want to go in. It's not working. This dude, this black guy rollsing in a wheelchair and and starts he starts cursing at the information desk. God, I want to see my doctor right now. And he's causing a ruckus where now no one's really kind of paying attention. I um, I go around. Uh, I go around the back first, but because I'm like, may maybe it's another way to get into the side. Just dudes out there. He's taking a lunch break. Black guy taking a lunch break. He works in the morgue, and of all places, Googles allowed. This is just before he passed. Dude working in the morgue, sitting there and he's like, uh. I was like, yo, man, you know who I am? And he's like yeah, yeah, and and he's like, anyway you can get me in and give me in. You know what he says. He says, if he listened to my demow and you know what I'm said, I would listen to your I would listen to your album, just whatever you could do. He said, well, you gotta be back in a certain amounts. I'll be back. He said, you have to give me a minute. Man, he would be broke out. When we're waiting, we're like by trash, dumpster entrances and stuff, and and he's like, he takes forever to come and now my my gut, which I always tucky, you gotta go with your gut. I was like, man, this is to where I'm just gonna say forget it. But I'm not really a quitter type dude to give up. And I was just like, man, i gotta just do it my way. And he's taking too long. And I told I told Black was with me and my homie Eon, and I was like, yo, if dude doesn't come by fifteen minutes after and I'm watching my clock hard, I'm gonna do it my way. And if that don't work, I'm out. Because they had already going in to see him and they got by, you know, so that day's got to see him see him. This was here on second time because he came to hold Justin down this case of their problems. So when when I go back in, they're doing construction on the bathroom and the entrance. So being at the construction in the bathroom was being worked on, Um, you have to go. You have to pretty much be let in if you need to use the bathroom as the hospital. They got it pretty much onto that. I was like, I really got to go to the bathroom and anywhere I can go. She goes, listen, go around to the level, go all the way to the end of the hall. But I'm gonna be timing you to come back, and she said, so go to bathroom. Come back. Right when I'm going to the bathroom, there's the gift shop, you know, you're by flyer with all that stuff for people, and the elevators right there. As soon as I look at the elevator, I see it's going four three two, and I'm like, God, I gotta do this because they're so busy with that guy still yelling. Even after all that time I went outside to the dumps and everything, that guy still I want to see my doctor. You know, he's still doing that boom. Next thing, you know, a family of like five or six people, big family, football player size, all come to the elevator and I'm like, you know, duck, I duck behind the because the guys like for at least six five and you know, the wife is a big girl and she's got like three or four kids and they're all kind of big. So I kind of go in with them, and he goes with floor and I go to He goes, We're going to two. It's like God, because now they can block me. Soon we get on the floor. The nerves, you know, because it still they think I'm going to the bathroom. As soon as we get on the floor, we go. I follow them, and I'm just thinking to sixt eight to sixty eight. The nurse comes up and gets up, like, excuse me, you can I help all you all years? He goes, you're ever seeing such and such and such and such and you go room over, they said to sixty nine. She goes follow them, Yeah, yeah, so she sixty nine. She goes following me. So I'll let them walk in and I go and I back up and then slide into in the room and I have my moment of true c d and my Gang Star shirt and I went in there and you know, and pulled the cover down and I want to see what he looked like if he's been kept because you know, when you're in the hospital, either you pay them to clean your fingers, wash you up and all that, or you gotta do it. Then it wasn't I even asked, is he on that they need to be cleaned up? They're like, you know, the family man's gotta do it. So, you know, once I saw he was dirty, you know, nails all, you know, just just not clean all this stuff, I'm just like, and he's just laying there, his eyes open, but they're just you and he's on the Uh. Then later, yes, I was doing a you know that and you know, so that's going on, and he's just he's looking up like he's awake. You know. So no, he's already brained it and you know so um because maybe it was almost three weeks after I've seen him and uh, and so you know, I just it was just me and him. And it's crazy because me I talked to Dr Dre about this, like the easy thing. It's almost like that same type of thing, man, because I just talked to him, put the shirt on him, saying, yo, you know what this is all about. You know, I'll forever rep this, and and I wanted to put the CD under his uh, under his mattress, but then the nurse walks in and said, hey, you're not supposed to be in here. You gotta leave. And I said, man, listen, and I showed her the cover, like, look, this is us. This is the reason why I just wanted to come in and see him. And she go look at five minutes and she let me have my time, said what I had to dude, kissed him, walked out, never saw him again, and until static selector called me here like six in the morning, and he's like, please don't say it's true, cause we had already been getting Please don't say it's true. And it was false. Along So this one when I called his sister and she was like, I didn't. I could see it here in her voice, like don't don't, don't don't say anything. Get it. I can't confirm that, you know, because we were all in touch with each other now. And she's just like, I can't get to confirm me. Yeah, let me get back to you. I'm hearing the same thing, but I don't believe it, you know. And I was like, all right, I'm just wait for you. And then and then they got confirmed. Plus the great thing was his father, you know, was able to obtain the body get it back to Boston, and he was like, he gave a funeral. Key was there. Um. The whole gangster foundation was that all of us met up and came together and he had a private funeral fire. Maybe go to three people, maybe you know, he had it on the campus, maybe two other people, the clocks in the Elands. That's the both sides of the family. And h his father called me and said, I'm running everything, and you know, Judge Hill and you listening. He's a stern dude. I knew him when I ul stay at the house way when we were just on our first album before stepand the arena stand at the at the Elands House and all that stuff in Boston. So I've been around around and his father said, I need you and Sugar with sugar Bear back in the day. He said, I need you and Sugar Bear to speak, he said, he and and when he brought us on stage to speak, the first thing he said is I don't care what my son went through. Ever, all I know is him and this man and Sugar was the best part of his career. He said, that's why they're here, and I want them to speaking. And we spoke and I told Crum little jokes and had everybody laughing. You know, just crazy Guru used to do. You know, he's steal my clothes. And since he's so small, since he's so you know, he's real skinny. He's real skinny, so like you know, you know I've seen him and with no clothes. He's a bony kids but very well athletic build, six pack stomach. He got, he got, you got, he got the physique and everything. But he used to wear sweatpants, you know, the cotton ones, and then so you wouldn't see the sweatpants coming out the bottom, he would put rubber bands around the ankles so that they would stay stay hell, and he would put my pants on. So I'd come back to the house and be like, what's all my pants at? And he come in later on from working stuff because he was a casework as well, and he's got my shoes on, my pants on, my jacket, my shirt. And then he would always go all premiership all premiership word up man like like that became that became a that became a regular thing. That became a regular thing. But yeah, but as far as when they connected was close to when the horners happened, shout the black Jesus, who really is with a connection came from because they were they were doing work together and uh things, you know what. We always saw that the strangeness too, but we always ignored it. And you know it was just like I ain't some you know where we when Google did ill kid and uh uh Ball had projects. He always had a string of producers that would do to do beasts phone, so we just HEAs just another one of those guys. And then it just got to a point where as time built, I mean you really noticed that the the us being around each other was very very minimal. You know what I'm saying. The same people that you pretty much saw all the time was around around us. And he didn't travel with us. Nothing like that except one time to Colorado the Owners was doing like so that was Owners was over. We want tour with Tyler quality and uh and uh yeah Tyler quality common No, it was Commons Electric Cervius to Yeah, and uh, and Quality opened up. And that's when Quality was bringing Kanye and we're like, why do you keep bringing Kanye to the tour. He said, because he gave me my first hit record and he didn't charge me for so I'm now I'm bringing him because he's And then Kanye told me that day yo, I'm I'm about to start rapping. He said, I'm about to do an album and it's gonna be called College Dropout and he said for Meier, it's gonna go double platinum. I was looking at him like, man, that's a cocky thing to say, but I ain't doubting it. Hope, I'm gonna watch and man it happened. College Dropout just popped off. But yeah, we saw the strangeness and it was weird to all of us. And it ain't just us, it's everybody, you know. And then you know, even just people just spreading stupid stuff about like we were hating on on the situation. It's like, no, everybody's grown. Men. Whatever you just said, you choose to do with what you choose to do, just tell the truth as far as what's going on with with with how you represent yourself, but as far as not like the gay room was all that. That part I didn't believe now that problem. That part wasn't worried about it. That was all just nonsense because everybody but I understood why people are like, well, it's a weird relationship. But that part I never was, like, well, damn, maybe changed now he was still Google, just just in a different mental space where he wasn't him. You know, the way he was looking, the way he was dressing. I know Google, when you get Google had his own style. I started seeing the similarities and dress and everything. I was just like, this is not my dude. So even when people post certain pictures of him, I'm like, that's the that's afterwards. I don't acknowledge any of those pictures and none of that. By the time, by the time when when him and working together was Google getting clean? At that time I had heard it. He was the drink. He's gotten cleaner several times. And one of the first times he got clean, and you can vouch for this was when we were in Seattle and he spassed out hard body on stage. It was the second time he did a good but the first time he was flipping uh yeah, Rhode Island then, But the one that he filmed and we showed Gurgle on the tour bus. This is how you look when you wile out. And he remember, he kept we're all playing cards, and we just playing cards every day and then be you know, sucking out, laughing some people watching movies alone was playing video games. And Google's is still staring watching what he looks like on stage because he's never seen himself that wild and out on you know, and that and that. The next day he quit, he quit drinking, quit drinking. So if he and he real laughs, yeah, but he was still he still quit again again, then started back. He quit again. So when Cats is talking like, yeah, yeah, we got him clean, it's like, no, we got him cleaning. We watched him watch that tape, you know what I'm saying, and he would not stop rewinding. And this is not DVD. This is like when you Gotta go, you know, the same DVD era and he kept over and over watching. He was wilding that day at that show. It's crazy, you know, shout to uh Goldie. He got into a fight with Goldie. I had to break It's It's one of the craziest nights ever in Seattle and anybody that was there, even Common will tell you that was a crazy night and we got it all on tape. So that was the day and the next day is when he stopped drinking from that day. That's what I was like, man, not cats claiming they got him, got him well. Now we got him well first. And that was why the owners relationship still but were still we're rocking because Google, we always would have drama over some nonsense nonsense, never nothing like really really substantial nonsense. And even then it's like, this is not worth it, you know, because I'm always it's not worth the God because I don't want to fight and beat up my my boy. That's my dude, and he's not he's not my size, he's not he'll he'll throw it, he throw down, he will knuckle up me and he doesn't care what size you are. But I don't want to fight him. That's my partner. But all the fights we've had, it's always went to love, I love you, my nigga, let's go and and that's his line, I love you man, I love you yo. Let's go out and we'll go out and celebrate, getting get drunk and come back. But now he's the happy drunk. He's the best. Oh no, no, no, that's what's mad. And you're still not that they can't out wrap me. But yeah, but but but yeah, it's like, um, the thing that really touched me the most, his father said, I need y'all there you. I need the two of you. They have not anybody else to you too, and that that was a big deal. Even when his father died. Uh, his father wanted to make it to his ninety first birthday or his ninety birthday. I think it was ninety one, could be, it's one of the it's either ninety one. He was doing really bad just after grew it passed, and he said, uh, if I can make it to my birthday party. Even the doctors told him, no, don't do the party or really not well, he said no, if I can have this party, I'm ready to die, you know. And and so, uh, the day he passed, I had to go to Switzerland, do you know, to Switzerland to a do a festival. And when he passed, they were having to service the following day. And I asked his sister Trish, shout to her, she's she's a soldier man. Uh, Trish, I asked her, Hey, is that anyway I could go to the funeral home and go see your dad before I go to Europe, because I don't want to miss the funeral. But I really came back out of the gig because I had already canceled one when I had my knee surgery, and I've never canceled gig in my life. And they were letting you know, I don't want to be one known for you know, how to get my artist gonna show up. They started to do a video showing that you're here because we want to make sure. But I did a full video showing that my knee I just had surgery, and they said it was I could have had a blood clott and had a heart attack on on the plane because it was too close to my surgery. So when his father passed and they were having to service the next day, she said, I'll call on your bath and tell them it's okay for you to go see him. She said, you and Sugar, and uh. So I called Sugar and I said, listen my flights the same day to go to Europe. I'll catch a quick shuttle to Boston see him and then fly back to New York and then get on the plane of Europe. And that's exactly what I did, and met Shug Show picked me up at the airport. We got to the funeral home and they were like, hey, we we got them to a point where you can see him when song. The first thing I said was thank you so much for giving me your son. And you know, we just stood there for a while, just talked around him and you know, rubbed his hand, game a kiss, and I went back and got on the plane, transferred to the airline and went on the road. But I felt like I got that. That was a certain part of closure I needed. That's why, you know. And again I wanted to thank him even and even though he had sold it already left, I was like, I gotta touch him, well, primo, thank you for making our dreams come true. Yeah, but I mean just that it's just just the chance to fan out. I mean, there's definitely enough for it. Two Jesus Christ. We meant get to the half of your production work and the breaks it shout out to the break down. Uh, he says, I scored it all. I've seen them all. Thank you very much. Yes, I appreciate your work. Thank you. DJ Premier, lad thanks for having me. Everybody you enough respect to both of you, all all of the accomplished artists that I'm a fan of. You know, I'm a big fan of both of your quest you already know. And uh and we'll be able to work on records with this man like oh my God, and and uh yeah man shout the Dan Chaunas to Seethe Man and all the cast Man job Man, m Antoine Harris. Uh, it's so many. Tiana Taylor too, She's she's good. Yeah, alright, I love y'all. All right, this is a superstar group whom produced by the great DJ Premiere on Quest Love Supreme. In the ghetto, it's hard to survive somehow damn many from a shot, but our realiz switched life to choose. I want to make money, so I gotta paid tools. But there's no brutal sing. You only have one chance if you kid your fingers up from stands at night. I used to scream a shout living in a ghetto, trying to get the hell out watch my friends. That was superstar shout out the cameo. Uh dog. Now, now now that we're in reflection time, there's so many questions that I forgot to ask him. Man, mostly samples. I man, the freaking unbelievable sample. Yeah, I hate him for that. Man, I'm gonna have to go. I don't know what. You just gotta go go to the studio, find out what it is, and report back to us. That's all I think. Even then he was like, he'll give me the stab, but just won't tell me from which it came. He's so old school with it. Like you said, all the pads are laid out right there, so you just gotta go. You can't find out what the sample is. I just want to go to sleep at night. I don't want to redo this song. I don't know. You don't have to redo the song. Just go and hit one pad in the next pad, and then you're like, oh, by the third one, you should have to figured out. I still believe that it's you remind you remind me. If you think it's you remind me, I would say that you got to recreate it. Then if you can recreate it, off you remind me, then challenge Yeah, tap on. But but you know he said it ain't you remind me? So was it? Well? You know right? Yeah, this was on tape No loops, man, you know what I mean? But no, man, pretty dog, he's so like just working with women. He does you saw them old school Like he is very old school. He still very much operates like it's still ninety five in a good way, you know what I mean. Like it's just he's true. Man. I just realized something else. We forgot to talk about the Limp Biscuit record. Oh I forgot about the ball Yeah, Like why I just hope he got paid very well for that because that crazy are you Toto? It was too good for Limp Biscuits. It should have been a Mathew mat solo record. We could, Man, we forgot, well, not forgot, but we the Black Eyed Peas, Oh yeah, bp EM and I forgot to ask him about in this business of rat So we still haven't figure out who what that, what that sample is? Whatever was? I don't have like half the acapellas he does, like and it's not like m P or like it's where are these records coming from? That? Then Capella is you know one that's always also bugged me. It's it's not primo, but it's a high text, The Sun God, the Comic record, common Sense in a ghetto in Chicago, Like that's too perfect for a common perfect somebody made that one. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know that the one, uh, I know for the one he just did the record with God, the Dre record, the Animals, the on Compton. I listened to that an Animals is the one. I'm with you. Animals is that one is dope? He chopped up Okay, this is because but now he chopped up some. It's like some guy from Detroit, Like he samples a lot of like Indie twelve inch like Sandbox automatic, like he does a lot of that. But I just want to know what his filing system is, Like he just listen. You don't believe that he's got it all on his head because it's like he has to take time to figure out loops, figure out drums and now figur about acapellas and practice scratching them sits. That's it's like four extra jobs. I think he I can't believe because knife is like that to a degree, like knife pull like vocal samples and stuff like you know, cut he would. I think sometimes it comes to them as they're making the beat, and it's just kind of recall you know what I mean, like this will sound good with that. So see if any memories of because you engineered or uh for some of the people that don't know, Uh, Sugar Steve uh was a full time engineer at Electric Ladies Studios. Uh during the time of d'angelo's Voodoo album and some other things. Actually, you did two premium songs. You did you track uh for common Uh the Sun God one he was just talking about. I was saying, for that, Oh, that's right, high technology, that's right. By that point we were just you know, everything was getting done Electric Lady. But you also for the sixth Cents. Oh yeah, we were. You were there for that, and you were there for Devil's Pie. I'm actually on the skit with you right after the sixth Cents or right before right before the six right before retrospect me like that. We I was like going, I'm the worst that making skits. And of course I even said later you know, someone called Prince Paul up to do these skits correct, because you know it was a lasting on my mind. But do you have any memories of a primo like well, yeah, the Devil's Pie um sessions very memorable because I had never seen anything like that, you know, being done by even average stack of record Like he had his stack of records, like it was at least a hundred deep, and he was just going through stuff. Nope, nope, nope, nope, nope, nope, nope. And after a while, like I after forty five minutes, and I just went into the break room and are you talking about for for when he was putting up Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean yeah, he kept coming up with the slice and the pie and yeah, you know, trying to eat and yeah, I've just never seen anything done like that, you know, by anybody. And then and we were doing on two inch, so it was just the amount of precision that that's when we realized. That's what I realized, Like, oh, dude is not normal. He's really not. He's not. He's really not. And it sounds even though it sounds, uh simple, it's really hard to damn. Now I'm thinking all these things now, I would want to ask him why he uses deep snares instead of crack snares, with the exception of coming for that ass which like that was a departure for him, but it's like next week anyway, anything else we wanna. I wish we could have asked him, um man, I think we well. I wanted to get into Uh's second album. I did not like physical stamina. I appreciate physical stamina. Now you know what it is, you know, I don't. I didn't know. I don't know what it is. But okay, So you know when when I remember that album, an Ladulf Half Life came out the same day and we were on tour together UH, like in ninety seven with j RU and and and us, it didn't hit me like the first record. No, not at all. I'm not saying it was a bad record, but it tested my patients. It tested my patient The moments on that record were like high because like like fucking invasion that frustrated, frustrated nigga, fucking um cowboys and I didn't with Cowboys because of the dice and what you call it? What was the other joint? Um? The one fucking whatever when he redid the oh right right, oh my god man, that was the one. I was like, you know what I didn't like. I don't think I like when I felt one day was half cooked. I can yeah. First of all, it was like an interlude and it was released as the first single. That was the first single, yeah, dog like and that's back when like labels were sending you like by that point, I was sending a few DJ pools, so it was like, you know, Sticker New j Rule, the damnage to one Day, and you know, there was like, uh like there was like bus sheets, tim sheets on there with the DJs of the country, like, oh man, he's going hard, hard on you know, on Biggie and Foxy Brown and you know, and I got it and I played it and it was just like there was no hook, yeah, and it was kind of I felt it was very convenient how he just tiptoed around when hip hop got to the West Coast. Yeah, and then it got to the West Coast, I was like, hey, shut night and I got a plane ticket home man that that night. One day. Yeah, he did kind of Yeah, damn. That was because the first when I heard what You're playing Yourself, which well, yeah, one day it was like a white label preview and then you Playing Yourself came out and damn we I never got to ask him what was Biggie's reaction to your Playing yourself? Oh man? Because I mean obviously, I mean when you feel some sort of way if absolutely like yeah, yeah, yeah not for real, for real? Well, uh, what is your alright? Closing out, what is your bill? Boss bill? What is your Desert Island premiere album? Were singles? Song? Song? God? Um, can you come back to me? This? This is hard? Um part me wants to say mass appeal, but then there's all right, non single, non single? What is yeah? One song, it's all you get, non single, primo, non single, Sodgers funds too so so does that counter know? No so, non single, non single? Give me whatever about j RU, give me whatever, whatever, whatever you want to do. It's whatever. I gotta do my thing. I gotta oh, y'all, cruise whatever the best Phillips jo off the second j album, Give Me That, Give me um three okay three, give me that, give me uh, give me Above the Clouds? Was that a single? Technically it was the B side, but I'll let you have okay, give me above the Clouds and give me man ship and give me ex today that X to the next. Okay, that was a single and it was a single, funk it was a thing. Okay, all right, non singles, Okay, give me yuh m, give me take to and pass. There you go. I'll take that well on behalf think this show does not care about my reflection to whatsoever. Yeah, that's that's Steve. This is the second week ago we did this. We got a minute left give us. I liked what you're saying about the labels on the records. They're hypnotizing their magic. I agree with him about all that. For me, it was Soul Records, the two circles, watching them go around the circles. Yeah, that's a good one. I mean I had the same experience growing up with the with the Delight and street Wise and and Bell Records if you ever heard of them. Um and now it's the Jazz Records, the C t I s and the e c ms that the labels are I think an under rated part of the record experience. Um and and then his whole thing about um about taking the turntables apart and really being uh in love with how turn tables work. And then you know, just how something that that he was so enamored with when he was so little became his entire career and he you know, really took it to the next level. All that. It's just incredible. It was true buns and single it was it was a yeah, you know it's weird and other reflection I happened yo yo here scientific I dated the person to whom to honey Buns was directed, Yes, and it was kind of a Jay Rue versus a mirror movement. Also exclusive anyway, anything else, Uh Steve, Nope, well Boss Bill Fontigoelo, thank you Agatting for mare. This was uh love Supreme and Vandura and we will see you guys on the next go rounde. Thank you. What's Love Supreme is a production of my Heart Radio. This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora. For more podcasts for my heart Radio, this is the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows,