Ne-Yo is one of the most accomplished songwriters of the last 20 years. He tells Questlove Supreme about his creative process, working with Beyoncé, and recalls a pivotal moment on Amateur Night At The Apollo.
Quest Love Supreme is a production of I Heart Radio. Ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to Quest Love Supreme. I'm your hostess, love you. It's hot summer. It's hot, man, I'm talking to say I know that Fronte and and why you're not in New York City right now? Yeah, it's hot everywhere. Yeah, I just love DC. It's hot. I'm in l A. It's hot. It's just it's just wet, hot, hot hot. See someone hiatus right now. So you know, if I'm at work, then it's always sixty seven degrees, so I always have a sweater on. But this is one of the rare times which I'm not under freezing conditions. Sugar Seed are you? Are you an uber driver right now? Sugar Steve, what are you doing? I'm in a limousine heading to power lunch. Uh. And I was telling Neo and like about this earlier before the interview started. I can't expose. It's a very big thing, very big thing happening. And so you're basically going to see Elvis Scott Stello right. Oh shit, it's bigger than that. When whenever he gets a secret, if it's always Elvis Scott Stello I met I met one of your comrades on the play this morning. He kept waking me up out of my sleep. Who was that? Jeffrey Miller is a great, great trombone player. He's on he's uh on one of our records on Jami Recording stock com. Check it out. Yeah. He he woke me up twice, wants to tell me that he records to you. Uh. The second time he woke me up out of my sleep to share a joke with me about carrying his uh, his plunger, his toiletble plungers that he uses for a sex for his uh trump bones. You know you could have you could have bumped into worse friends of mine. Anyway, y'all we're here today. I will say that uh, our guests probably doesn't need I won't say I will say that he doesn't need an introduction. But he's one of my favorite bridge writers. Bridges Yo, you know Rare Bridges Undefeated. Our guest is indeed Um. He's a three time Grammy Award winning singer, songwriter, producer actor. Um collaborated with the best of them, from Jigga to Beyonce to Pitbull to Rihanna to Kanye The fabulous. I mean the list goes on and on and on and on and on and on and north uh. He's released seventh albums and his eighth um, which is entitled Self Explanatory, will be out by this recording in July. I believe the data platforms Yes July for teen eight track as well. Here three platinum albums. Prolific songwriter and producer and entertainer. Yo, ladies and gentlemen, please give it up for the one and only the one neo. What's up? Brother? How you doing? That was a hell of an introduction. I needed done like that from now on. Hey man, every every hero needs is H's theme music and his own fanfare. I love it. I love greeting brother. So for our listeners who can't see you right now, yes, you're in Yeah a house that looks like it's nothing but art deco lights, like time at home. Currently. This this is my recording studio that I'm currently And I tell people a lot of time that they were like, so what do you do with your spare time? What do you do when you're not doing music? I'm like, uh, music, that's that's that's pretty much. I do this because I love it. Man and and and with that being said, I couldn't have a house without a studio and it had to happen, So I built my own. I love it. Yeah, I was about to say, fante you you got your your blue light on as well. I feel like I had to keep the vibe going. Got to you. Where where are you from? Where were you born? Was born in Camden, Arkansas? Yes, deep deep deep South. Don't feel bad if you don't know where Campden is. No one knows where camp people and people from Arkansas don't know where camp I always thought it was vague. The Nevada, That's what I was confused. Why Why did the majority of my growing up in Vegas? I went to high school in Vegas, whole nine, like all of that happened to Vegas. My dad was a truck driver. Oh that's a cool that's a cool job. You wrote in the back of the camp. He had one of those calves with the beds in the back and everything. Like the reason he wasn't never because you driving trucks and doing using Yeah. Yeah. Do you have any siblings your parents? Are they musically inclined? Uh? My, everybody in my family does something in regards you music did playing an instrument or singing or rapping or whatever what happened. Everybody does something like my mom used to sing, my dad plays BASSI sings. My sister sings ridiculously. She's she's a she's an alien. Well you have to have to two sisters and a brother. One one sister sister and one one half sister on a half brother. You know, Papa was a bit of a rolling stone, regis. We passed no judgments. It is what it is. But um, but yeah, yeah, closest, closest to my my main I don't know if I called my main sister, how did that work? The sister that I share a mother and father with that that system, we're the we're the we're the closest you know, nor too, So you know, I go no disrespect to my other system, my other brother. You know, they just they moved around and did their own thing, and it is what it is. But um, but yeah, I grew up in Las Vegas under a very very musically inclined mother. She did everything, the music, everything, the thing you can think of being cleaning up the house to watching TV with the stereo playing type type situation. So Yeah, it was just always there, just always there. What was your first musical memory? First musical memory sitting in the sitting in the living room in front of the stereo, crying and not understanding why as I was listening to Billy Ocean's Sudden that baby that is an eighties baby right there. I know, Steve, he is hitting your sit in your groove right now. That's no meaning to me, like suddenly, no wife has new meaning. That's what I meant. That's what I said. He wasn't suicidal, his life has new meaning. Always suck it up a mirror, you right, I have to suck it up. Wow. No, No, that that's actually dope to hear it, because oftentimes I think people were rather ashamed that. I think that's the purpose of music is to either document a time period, like music to me is always like a musical polary, because it helps me remember what year it was, or what time it was, or what happened at a party, like oh yeah, Like whenever I hear you know ironic by Lance Marsett, I'm forever gonna remember, like, oh, my first car accident. You know, I'm just giving example, but I'm just saying that music does that what what do you think it was about that song that touched you? Um, you know what, To be completely honest with you, man, And I might have been maybe maybe five or six or something somewhere in there when this happened, but even now as a forty two year old man, it's it's something about some of the melodies that just gets you. Bro. It's just I think it was just I think that was the first time I realized the power of melody. You know what I'm saying that that hitting a certain chord on a guitar or a certain note on a piano could like like put goose bumps on your arm type thing, you know what I mean? Like I I didn't in mind you at the time, I didn't know that's what it was. But but thinking back now, it's like that's that had to be what it was because I couldn't have understood what he was talking about him from five, I don't know what I'm talking about, but the music, the way the melodies was hitting me, I think that's what it was. Yeah, And I have to ask in light of what what I what I loving lead up as the versus Comedy hour, You're going there, I didn't know it. But I'm not mad. I'm not. I'm not. I'm not. I'm not about gotcha journalism, not about putting the next man down? Are you rather perplexed? And and the thing is, I don't believe that music is dead. I just believe that the particular music I like, I have to search, like very far and wide for it, like I have to search for it. But for you, are you kind of perplexed that what what passes for music now? The fact that that type of melody might not necessarily be exposed to a mainstream audience as it once was. Mm hmm uh that that That's a beautiful question. And I have to say I definitely share in and where you are with that, you know what I mean? That? Mind you, I've I've I've put myself in a place where if I'm gonna be a part of this industry, I have to find a way to like a little bit of everything, you know, maybe not love it. I probably I wouldn't turn around in my car, but if it's on, I'm not gonna sit here and bad mouthed or or sitting here and not have a good time because they're not playing the kind of music that I want to hear quote unquote Do you still listen to the radio? Not as often as I once did? Uh No, not really. Normally, I'll go on you know, uh one of the streaming streaming joints or whatever and pull up what it is I'm looking for. That's that's that's easier for me than than sitting and trying to tolerate some of the things that because I mean, I'm I'm I'm from that place too, where I'm from the place where you know it was it was the intricacy of that that three part harmony, like that place and and and that's just like you said, you said it in my intro bridges, Like nobody writes bridges anymore. It's like people like people ain't got time for it to be good no more? Like which man? Like what are we all rushing towards? Thongs are like a minute long? Now? Like where are y'all going so fast? You know what I mean? Yeah? My son, my son, he has I don't know if you're owner he has. An artist he listens to is his girl Pink Panthers. I don't know if you're upon her. She put out an album. I think it was last year ten songs eighteen that's like fantastic volume warning the whole album up. But he is my sixteen, my youngest son. But yeah, that's that's kind of where the youngest, that's what it is. I'm really I'm really curious as to why that is, like like because even even when I was even when I was sixteen, like it was about it was about the story of it, you know what I mean, Like like I don't know, maybe maybe I was a different little six year old, but like, uh, what's what's the joint? What's the joint? The song is ten minutes long. Luther Van Drugs Long Ago as a Superstar. That's a ten minute song and it feels like two minutes because you just enjoy that ship so much that it passes quickly. But that song is ten minutes long and you wouldn't even don't even know it, but it's it's about the beginning, middle, and end of a story. I used to listen to music for that, yet no more. Yeah, now, bro, I think we got like it's the tail wagon the dog like in that you know, people are making music specifically for streaming services, and so they know a one minute or one and a half minute song will naturally be streamed more in five minutes than a five minute song would be once you know what I mean From a business and commerce standpoint, that's that's that's smartest. Hell music, music art is not supposed to be inspired by commerce, at least not in my personal opinion. That's just supposed to come from the heart somewhere. And if it's coming from the heart, it might take a little longer than a minute to get my point of cross. And but that means that my song is played on the radio. Now damn all right, Well here we are. I learned that lesson with I think really with the Old Town Road. I spun it at a party once and thought, you know, okay, I'll put it in one like back when it was red hot. I would that would be my first record, my stalling record until I find out what I really want to play. And I looked at the thing and it was like two minutes and twenty seven seconds, and really, whoa like I had to play it twice. I meant, the Billy Ray Cyrus thing stretches it a little bit to like seventeen seconds, but yeah, man, it's it's It's also maybe that this generation doesn't need uh a lot of time to express itself. I won't say that doesn't have much to say. They do have the language, they have the words. It's like mean culture, yeah, statement, next statement. But they also have new words that we didn't have before. Where we used to be taking forever to say a gas like trigger you used to have to think them on that ship didn't exist. There's a whole sentence about what that ship really was like, like the lingo is gonna change with the with the times, as you know, as as long as young people, it's always gonna be lingo. I ain't mad at that far. Yes, I just wish that I wish that everybody would just slow the hell down. I feel like, you know what I feel like why music is suffering is because nobody's taking the time to keep it good. No more like everybody is, as you said, everybody trying to get their stream of numbers up. And it's like, listen, we'll worry about quality later. Right now, it's just let's just get it out there. We can get these numbers up. That sucks. I just I just hate that we in this place now. Man. Really, it's not all young people. That's not everybody understand, because there is a section of young people that are appreciating the nineties right now that are discovering neo soul and all of that and making it new againstide mean, you know, listen, just get the baby some love. There's always exceptions, but you know, the masses. The mass situation right now is, you know, a song needs to be a minute long because I got something to do. What do you have to do? What you ain't got trying to listen to some good music. I don't get it. I don't get I used to tell people on the radio, listen, if you want to find good music, it's not going to be the ship that easily comes to You're gonna have to go find it. And I'm on the radio telling you that the good ship is that what you're easy on the radio? Okay, we had we we we We're repeating some things, but I'm sorry, go back. I feel like I feel like this show is now turning into the corner of do the right thing. There's there's one other element is that I feel like might play a very very strong factor. Okay, Now, I I am not anywhere near good enough to say that I am a piano player or a guitar player or a drum player good enough to tap around and find what I need. Right, But I recall a time where music was kind of like a really really exclusive club. You had to know what you were doing, you had to be good at you had to be good at what you was doing. Like now, anybody can do it. Anybody can do it. It's it's it's the door is the it's the y m c A. Come on in, y'all. That's that's where. That's where we're at now. So of course, if you got just anybody doing whatever, of course things are gonna suffer. That the quality is gonna suffer. There was a point in time where the quality was up because the cats that was doing it quality. Taking nothing from anybody today, I'm not saying the names. I'm not doing that for my bashing. I'm just saying that now I mean to take something to take something like Djane. You remember when you had to like learn timing and like like figure out how to mix records. And now you push your button and you got and you're done. You're done. You push your button. Yeah, yeah, I think those tools are just gonna have to push people to like be creative in a different way, because I mean even though like even with DJ, and it's like, if you have the records, you can give me a mirrors hard drive right now, and I wouldn't know what to do with it, you know what I'm saying, Like, you still have to know how to play the records. You know, there's just a still skills, a skill set that's involved. But with now, with technology, in many ways good and bad, it's leveled the playing field so that the barrier of entry is pretty much non existent. Well, no, it's the same thing with with like bro with with with auto tune for example, Yeah, you gotta know what you're doing with auto tune to make it do what it do right, you're gonna be out, you know, and and and and so and so it's the same thing with DJ. I understand that there's there's a technique to it, but you can't deny that back day, before the buttons came, you had to be a little bit better and what you're doing, you know what I'm saying. You had to be good. You had to be that dude a little bit like and and the same thing came to playing instruments, The same thing came with singing. You know what I'm saying. That's that's why we're kind of seeing what we're seeing right now, is it's not the craft itself. I don't feel like it's as respected as it once was. Like nobody's blood, sweat and tears to get good at this no more. You know that means the bottom is gonna fall out, right, y'all know that right bottom fell out, or God willing, somebody comes along and saves us. Do you remember the first album that you purchased with your own money? The first album I purchased with my own money? Uh, surprisingly was not an R and B album. It was the far Sides. Wild was the wild Ride? It was all right, yes, the first one, huge huge far side fan. Yeah, yeah, easily something like that. You know, it's weird. Uh that album was a hard sell for me and the very deep getting. I didn't like Your Mama. It was cool. But was it the remix that turned you around? Or was it just know when I heard for Better for Worse? Yeah, damn, all right, all right, when I heard your Mama, I just started corny and I ignored them and well, yeah, you know, like when Richard Nichols and A J. Shine were producers. A J. Shin was like Philadelphia's stretching Barbato and he had a copy of the album and I looked at the album cover and it was just the craziest thing I've ever seen, which is really weird because when he put for Better for Worse the one, I feel like the album cover, that's the that's the soundtrack to the album cover Worse. But but when I heard those Fender Rhods, like that just totally I don't know, it's it's just it's just open the whole portal. Literally, after I heard for Better for Worse, I told Rich like, we need to keypboard player and he was like, I know this like this guy living in my house named Scott Storch. And that's how Scott came into the group. Wait, speaking of which, I'm just realizing I didn't realize that you were the third writer of Let Me Love You. I've always thought that was just Scott and Cam. Yeah, shout out to my man, Cam. No, that was me. Yes, I was absolutely there for that. Oh man, man, I've known Cam like I've known Cam since I k known Scott since they were like Yeah, Hi, I thought Cam wroke those lyrics. Yo. I was like, no, no, no, no. We definitely we definitely went back and forth on that. That was. That was my first time I ever worked with cam and it was I just remember because I remember being such an easy situation because I worked with other writers since then, and it's egos getting away and you know, well I will route this much, you know, and all of that stuff gets in a way. That was not the case when this song came to be. I feel like that might be why the song this so well, because it was just such a uh it was it was like it was just love. The whole situation was just loved. Nobody was was tripping off of who got what percentage, nobody was was trying to do more than they like. It was just a love situation, you know what I'm saying. Shout out to them, man, man, Shout out to camp, Shout out to Scots Storch. That's to a large degree, that's where my career started because that was the song that that finally got me the attention, you know what I'm saying. For a long time, I was I was the little negative wrote the Mario song that was that was my name. You talked about the process of you discovering your voice. So my sister was born with with just she she came out to womb High, see like just in there easy. It takes her, takes nothing. I had worked for mine a little bit. You know. Um, I knew I could, I could hold the note. I wasn't tone deaf, but I wasn't. I wasn't I wasn't my sister, you know what I mean. And and in our house, you know, the standard became my sister so and so you know, I I felt, if you're not just below that. So it took a little minute for me to just really really get comfortable with my voice. Um, a lot of Michael Jackson, a lot of Stevie Wonder you know what I'm saying. Mom's actually put me onto to both of these gentlemen. Uh, and it helped me get more more comfortable with just how my voice sounded. I used to really not like the sound of my voice because for when I couldn't do what my sister could do technically, she had the ad libs and all of that stuff right. And then my mom was like my hero, and she used to listen to a lot of like you know, husky voiced singers, the O J's and and your teddy peas and you take them off that and I didn't have that, you know what I mean. So so I didn't like. I didn't really like singing at first. And then she introduced me to UH To, to Michael Jackson's Off the Wall, Not Off the Wall. She introduced me to uh songs in the kid like she introduced me to to what they just how they were doing, what they were doing with their voices, and they helped me become more comfortable with my own because it was a similar timber. They're kind of that nasally high thing, you know what I mean, And and just help me get more comfortable with it, but not comfortable enough to sing four people. It was at the height of what I was doing. I'm in the tenth grade. And if ever um upset about something, mad at something, whatever the case, maybe I got a little red notebok gonna my bed, I pull it joint out, I'll write a quick song, sing it to myself. I don't know, pick up back under the bed and gone by my business like like my friends didn't know. For a long long time, I did because it wasn't fun him. It was it was for me. It was therapy for me, you know what I mean. So I went to a performing arts high school for for visual designers, a drawing paint and whatnot, and um, every year this high school, Las Vegas Academy for Theater, Performing and Visual Arts, every year they would do something called pop Concert. And this was primarily for the dancers and and the choir majors and and you know, the the techie guys that do the lights and all of that. It's like a like a like a super glorified talent show. Think you know, they got smoke machines and stays the biggest thing going on it. Yeah. Yeah, So of course this is a major deal to the whole school. Everybody except the art majors. We were kind of left out of that. They adn't really there were really nothing for us to do. You may get backs up now we find we got lights on it, all right. Cool. So we were kind of like the grassy nold kids like they wouldn't when nobody studding us because the whole the rest of the school is on pop concert, pop concoles, popcorncers. The kids crying in the cafeteria over choreography. You know, it was fucking six like so it sounds like so this particularly year, me and me and the Grassy Nold kids, we decided, you know what, we're gonna do something to just to just kind of take the piss out of this whole situation, right, So we pulled strokes. Of course, I pulled a short strong that the plan was to somehow get into the talent show. Because you had audition to get into the talent show, so that was a hard part get into the talent show. And then once you got on stage, turn around, mooning the crowd, runoff like that was. That was what we was gonna do. That was our plan. I pulled the short. This was the plan. It was. It was kind of like just a big fuck you to everything that you're y'all making such a big dollogy. No one's getting signed from this, this this this talent show. Guys calmed down and that was always saying that to everybody. Okay, so how are you gonna get on stage? You? Art majors were always assholes, man, I'm sorry, completely on purpose. We thrived on being an asshole. We did it on purpose. But okay, so so I go to the choir the quiet room to audition. I sang Boishman in the row. The choiet major instantly asked me, why are you not in my class because I'm not a singer. I was like, yes you are whatever, Yeah, you in? Alright, cool, bye gon, alright, I got in. How did you get in? Worry about? I got in? All right? Cool? Get there. It's the day of everybody's excited. All my own ways of sitting in the front. I don't know how the hell they manage that, because just something that you have to get tickets too. But we find out in damn it. We always degrassive. No, kids always find a way. Anyways, my turn to go up. They introduced me, Uh, show your love for Shaefer Smith. That's my real name, jeer Um. I walked out on stage to no applause, because, mind you, the kids at the school know me as uh, the little dude with the braids that I draw your picture if you give them ten dollars, Right, this is who I was at this So the music starts and I can't make this up. The music starts and I look up at the crowd and all of a sudden, nobody's there. Everybody's gone. I don't know it just it just in my in my head, everybody's gone, the crowd is gone. All I can hear is the song. So I just started singing. I sang the whole song, sets said one place, eyes closed, sang the whole song. I lives and all all of that, all of that song and no applause. All of a sudden, it was like, I can't it was up this because it was it was definite. It was like, where the hell did this come again? They were shot. Let's think with the braids. That will draw you a picture for ten dollars. This is who I was all of a sudden, you know what I'm saying. So so that at that moment, suddenly, you know, the following days it's girls saying hi in the hall and ship that that I knew. I wanted all of that. You know, A buddy of mine, hey, me and some friends we had a singing group. I don't know if you want to join the group, Uh yeah, sure, all right. And then once I got into the group and met you know, some like minded gentlemen that wanted to do the same thing. We sent around creating three four part harmonies and whatnot. That's when it That's when it was finally like I could I could do this for a living, like I could really, yeah, I could. I could do this. So you just left the grass and old people like you just rolled out on them like I mean friends and friends and we was always at but you know it's it's at the same time I'm in, I'm spending a little bit more time in the choir room a little bit. I have to ask this question your class of idea. So that said, did you go back to your twenty three union? And I did? I did you ste on him? Yeah? I don't. I'm not. I'm not a stunt turn if that man, I'm my flex is real life. It's like, you know what I'm saying, I'm gonna I'm gonna put this ship on, but not say I put this ship on. I'm gonna just wait for you to notice that I got that ship on, Like you know that's me. That's me. You know, I'm not gonna draw attention to the diamonds, but should you see them? God damn, you know that's me. Imply so you know I went and mind you, the most famous people there was myself apparently the drummer from the group The Killers went to the same high school as me and um at seven oh two. Right, it's seven o two, seven o two, seven oh two, on their way out as I was on my way. Okay, I just knew, y'all. Okay, I just knew. Yeah. But um uh, she's an actress, beautiful chocolate actress. She was on the True Blood show. Routina, Routina. We went to we went to school together. Yeah, man, yes, old, Routin Old. But you know what I'm saying, Queen Sugar, wo man, nowadays this is a blessing of get oos. I ain't even trip hell. Yeah. So the thing is, you're saying that your gift of journaling or writing poetry was sort of your your stress reliever. You're that you let off steam. Um, did anyone ever hire your services as like, uh you know quasi cr no divirgiac as a right right something? All the time? Yes, all the time. Yeah. I used to do a lot of that for football players. That's football played for our school because there was no football at our school, but Rancho was down the street. And yeah, I know a lot of them, guys. Yeah, I write write poems that they get their girlfriends or yeah, listen, but ten dollars and dollars and doars. I'll let you say, you go for it bucks, I'll never went hungry. I would like to know what your process was then as opposed to now. Um, as far as writing with the song, um, are you a person that can get an idea of just words without melody or knowing what type of song it is? Or you know, do you have to sit and listen to the song or how different is your songwriting process high school post high school versus what you do for a living now? I can honestly say that when it was, you know, back in high school, before before the stakes got high, you know, so to speak, there was a there was a freedom to my writing that that dwindled over time, you know, as as I got into that place where it's like, all right, you've had success, now you gotta do it again, and so now you're overthinking every thing you do because it's like, oh, is it as good as that thing? Before that, it was kind of just writing whatever came to mind, and there was no wrong way, you know, sometimes it was it was a cadence that came to me. No melody, just no words, just a caduce then then not whatever the case. And then sometimes it was words I used to so I used to uh, my my training, so to speak. But if you want to call it that, I would just go somewhere and looking around the room, find a word, a phrase, a picture of something, create a story around it, and then write a song based on that story, just to just to sharpen, you know, just to sharpen the tools. So it could be it could be a word, it could be you know, somebody saitting with guitar, and we said and create melodies that way, then the words over the melody, like there's no wrong way as long as we got to that that you feel when you know, like yeah that thing, you know what I mean. I want to thank you for validating me. Oh yeah, thank you for validating me right now. No, because you know, I wrote a book on creativity and I was trying to um give various exercises. Well, the first thing I told people is that they have to embrace boredom more because when you're silent, when you're board, when you're still, that's when the ideas come to you. And you know, I was just suggesting games that you could do like branding exercises where you know, uh, I think Carly Simon used to randomly open a national geographic page and look at one sentence and then based a whole song on that. And so do hear you say that? Yes, I'm glad that you validated me, because I don't consider myself a songwriter, but I figured that for writing, that's a great exercise to do. Oh yeah, yeah, I mean it's because if you don't, you your songs tend to become stagnant, you know what I mean, Like, there's there's the okay, there's let's write about love, Let's write about sex, Let's write about money, let's write about girls. These four things are always gonna, you know, float to the top for the for the younger generation, that's just kind of is what it is to be young. I get it. But if you just focus on those four things, then all of a sudden, your songs kind of starts sounding and like it's like, all right, well, well, you need you need new ways to say the same ship, if that makes any sense, And the only way to do that is to step outside your comfort zone to find a word that it's actually difficult write a song about graphite what but hot cold on hot? What? What? How do you sing? Because you can wrap it easy, but singing is something step away from from I love you, So never let me go, you know what I mean? Like, step away from that and figure out another way to say to to get that same It's that same point across, but with different words and different phrases and different melodies. Like I used to I still do. I can't lock into one specific genre of music because you know, if if it's if it's hip hop, is these these three melodies that every hip hop artist is using, right, So that's a very small bowl. If it's R and B, you know, it's these chords, it's the church chords. It's that type of Bible. Okay, that's cool. I step outside of that, listen to some country music, listen to the melodies over there, step outside. I listened to some some some Hindi music or whatever, just melodies that you wouldn't typically go to too and it and it helps just expand your your your library of sound. You know what I'm saying. When you sit down and do it, you got more ship to play with as opposed to I love you, So never let me go And you know, the latest church song made over with R and B lyrics on it. I want to ask, what are your taboo? No? No, was right? Okay? I hate your my mind all the time, maybe you all my mind. I think about you all the time. Yeah, those those hurts, those hurts, it's just so come on, man, like you ain't even try you you phone, you phoned it into that like that's yeah. I hate that. I hate the phone lyric, not not never mind you the phone delork, not the simple lyric because you can say it simply and it's still be clever. Still have have you know, look kicked to it. Smokey Robinson is the king of that, the king of I'm gonna just say it, but the king of simplicity. Yeah yeah, but it's but but still but still flyover like simple but fly not just simple for the sake of simple. Like. I used to have an issue with the whole concept of repeating one word over and over and over and over and over and over and over. It used to it used to bug me because it's like, why there's so many words, there's so many words. You mean rhyming, rhyming words with words, and you mean like my my my my mom, like just saying one word, baby, This is why why I have the utmost respect for the Dream, because the Dream find a way to do that ship and it don't bug you. I don't know how, but it don't. But hey, you know what I'm saying. It works for him. Shout out to the Dream. How the hell you do that? Because I'll be trying that ship. It's like, no, that's no, this hit, this is not it. Of your contemporaries, who are the you know, the people that you respect the most and who are your I guess you could say you're I'm about to say Mount Saint Helen's uh the four presidents? Yeah whoo? Who who's the Mount Rushmore of of songwriters? For you? Of songwriters? Um see, that's that's that's an interesting question. I've actually never been asked that question before. It's always who's just your amount Rushmore like favor? Like so so if for that question the question you didn't answer, you didn't ask them, well, okay, let me let me reask instead of who do you respect? Now? Who writes a song today that you're like? Damn, I wish I wrote that? Like, is there a song that's like man I wish I had a crack of that, Like, damn, I've I've I've heard one or two Drake records where the lyric was clever enough to where I'm like, oh, I did not think of that. That was that was good? That was good. Yeah, that that hurt. I've heard. I've heard one of two records from him, uh in that space. I don't know. I'm gonna be real honest with you. I don't know a lot of the newer newer generation, right, I don't. I don't know their names, you know. No, no disrespect to anything like that, but it's just I have to be I have to be enthralled in the record today and take it upon myself to go back and look at who wrote it, who produced it, and if I don't, if I don't feel like that, then I'm not. I'm not gonna waste the time. I'll let it be what it is and keep it moving up. On Victoria, she's a right, I really like her. Victoria Money. I consider artists, but yeah, she's what she's a. Oh, she's Ariana she but she's an artist, like you know, like he said, but yeah, I love music, Yeah, yeah, yeah, shout out to Victoria Monday, shout out to shout out to the girl her, who's your Mount Rushmore before you? As in that's the level of the pinon game that I would like my Mount Rushmore, ultimate Mount Rushmore be an artist, writer, whole on because all of these guys kind of embody all of that. Uh. Five gentlemen, Michael Jackson, Prince, Sammy Davis Junior, Stevie Wonder, and Marvin Gay. Five Yes that grew up in Vegas, grew up in Vegas. The rat Pack I was. I fell in love with the rat Pack. My mom brought it home, and of course I gravitated. It's the same because he was the one that looked like me. So yeah, man, that's what it was. If you're in a rut, what's the process of you dealing with it? Do you have other hobbies or other other things that you get into like sometimes if I I mean a great example is whatever the movie or or I write a book, or I do something else creative and that will make me miss music. So do you have like another pivot that you go to if you're ever in a trap of not being able to finish the song? I think the I think the key word is pivot because you kind of have to pivot because if you don't, you sit there and force it until yeah, exactly that. So, so the thing for me has always been a step away from it, you know, as hard as that maybe sometimes because you know that that whole defeated thing starts setting, it's like, damn, I let the song beat me. No, you're not defeated, it's not done. Relaxed, you can come back. I'll step away and not normally for me, I'll you know, play street fighter. I'm I'm a I'm an absolute beast. That street fighter challenge man, anyone who's your body? Nobody me? Or are you? Oh dragon? Dragon? I don't so I'll do that or you know, uh remember that the practice I'm telling you about where I just look around the room and find another word and just just something something to get the wheels turning it again. That's all I really mean. And that's if that normally helps, and normally helps. See, that's that's how I play word or so I guess I should sort of channel to actually writing lyrics because I actually I treat my word old game like I'm writing a song. I should have been writing songs by this point not as hard as people make it. What's the average time that you'll spend writing a song? Like, how how fast does it come to you? I like that? So what song to the right? So when I first started getting attention, so to speak, I used to prop myself on how fast I could write a song. That's kind of where my name. That's kind of where the name Neo came from. Uh Dion Evans, Evans main rescue piece. He gave me the name because he I like, we'll talk. Give me an hour. I could give you seventeen records records and say seventeen smashes, right, seventeen records, you know, seventeen you might three of them, joints might be something, but seventeen records now, so now it's definitely more of a quality versus quantity thing. Whereas then that same hour, that where I could get where I gave you seventeen, I take that hour to give you two, but it would be two smashes. You know what I mean too? That I know too that I know we're going to hit the mark because I spend Yeah, because I took the time to make sure that I was doing what exactly what I what happened up here. That's always been the hardest part for me, because I can hear it done up here already. I just need to get it out of here and into the world. And it's somehow through that process of that transition from my mind to the world, ship changes and things happen, and all of a sudden, it don't sound like it sounded in my head no more. And now it's like a ship. I fail right, step away, beat somebody with street fighter come back to fix the problem. That sound like finete for our sens. No, yeah, no, you have to walk over. That's not straight up for real. I wanted to ask you man specifically about your work with Stargate, because I don't have like really great charmistry together. And uh, I remember we've met on a few occasions, but I remember this was probably like god, this is like oh seven oh six, um, but your first album in my own words, it just dropped and we was in Atlanta, and um, it was that drama. Drama was having a party. If I feel like it was, it was, it was drama. But anyway, some part in Atlanta and I saw you. I was like, oh man, it's Neo and you were like in there. I was surprised that you were even there. You like had the hat all you like super chill. I was like, oh wow, like you were like super quiet enough, and I just walked up. I was like, yo, man, like sexy loves the join off a new record and he was like, YO, appreciate it. You know what I mean? And like, but but I love that song man. And you in Stargate, like y'all have chemistry, man, like, talk about that process of working with them, what it's like. Well, firstly, I was. I was so chill that night because I was. I was shipping on myself in my soul inside because I'm like, oh my god, it's this, it's people, and I know that person. I know that person too. I just calm down, relaxed, three to four and my mind this is what happened in my mind. Outside it's like, yeah, oh no, I was, I was. I was losing it. But um, Stargate. The beauty of Stargate is how genuinely humble and just kind of I hate to use the term regular, because there's nothing regular about they level of talent, but they're just ordinary people, Like you'll never see these cats with the big dumb jewelry. You're never here yet, star Gate at the top of the joint. They don't do that. They let the music speak for itself. These cats have figured out simplicity. It's like they came along right on time where it was like, you know, again, no distract to anybody. But we got to that place where the producers are celebrity to now right. So you you so enthralled and making sure that everybody know that this is you, and you do so much to the track that you ain't leaving room for the song. Now, where does the song fit over all of this beautiful, amazing ship that you've not done on this track? Here comes Stargate with listen, we're gonna give you a skeleton and let you put the meet on. We're gonna let you let the song create the body because that's what because technique, that's kind of what it's supposed to be. It's a marriage between the two. You know what I'm saying. It's it's the foundation that's holding up the structure, that's holding up the structure, and that's that's what they do to the point where you know they'll give me like so so sick for example, was that that harp and a drum and that was it and that's what I wrote too. And then later on they went back and put the chords and like theylled it up. You know what I'm saying, sexy love same way, doom doom doom doom that and uh doo doo doo. That's it. Wrote the song. They go in later and put into the bells. And what's was later wrong because it could to make to make the track mailed to the song, you know what I mean. No, it's like it's like cast what caste doing that? Like, No, I gotta make sure everybody know this my track. I did this, damn that song whatever the song I did it. They're Swedish if I'm not there, from Norway brothers from Norwegian mothers, Yes, which kind of again speaks to your point. Quest. It's it's it's different over there because there's a there's a different level of respect for the craft over there. Like these cats that they will sit on that piano, they will get on that guitar, they will get on their drums. They're playing everything, you know what I'm saying, and and it's it's it's fun for them. It's like the fringe benefit of it is that you make money, but that ain't why you doing it. You're doing it because, like you, when we finished, so sick, but we said, the studio listened to that ship ninety times that night, just onesome yoya yo, like just just joy, you know what I'm saying, like that, and then comes out and does well and it's like, all right, cool. But in that moment, honestly, even if the song had come out and not done well, just what we felt when we finished that joint was like that. That was it. That's what you do for, not the not the screaming your name, and not the the money of it. Those are those are all fringe benefits. Those should be French benefit based on the fact that you did something from your soul and the world agreed with you. That's how that's supposed to work, not the other way around. I would like you to talk about the left I um show the cut Yeah yeah, so the cut um that was that was me. And remember the guys told you right after that the situation with the with the talent show that a friend of mine was like, hey, at the same group. I won't know if you wanted to say that was the group that was us. We caught ourselves envy because we were from Nevada. Just yeah, it was I thought I went into it, but but not a lot. Um. Yeah, the cut was after Apollo. We did Apollo Amateur United Apollo, and things did not go to plan. I'll say that, um, what you're saying, Uh, well, I mean while I'll put it this way, Salmon didn't come out. Okay, he was doubled. He was double dutch in the corner or he was ready. What did you what did you say? What did you say? We sang? We sang Players in the Hood by Danielle Jones And to this day, every time I see Donnie Jones, I apologize to that man for murdering his son the way we did on that stage. It was it was. It was not good. It was not good. But we was younger, we was cute, and there was a lot of girls in the audience, so they kept us alive. But it had not been for that he was he was in the corner like, am I going, I'm going, Man, it was bad. It was bad. So yeah, after you what wait, you gotta walk me through the process. What is it to do? Like everything, even to the house bend, Like, what what is the process when you do? Uh? So time? So so basically you you you send them at the time you send them, you send them the tape of what you do, and they say, yeah, we'd love to have you. Uh come on down mind you, they don't pay for you to get there, and they just if you can make it, come on, follow, follow, So you get down there. Now what's supposed to happen is you're supposed to come down a day early so that you can rehearse your song with rate you and the cruise who it was at the time when we was a shout out to my man, rate you, I do not blame you, brod. That was us. That was our fault. Um, we didn't do that. We showed up the day of the show with a tape because we thought that it was gonna let us play our music off our tape and it was like, no singers have to use the band. We haven't rehearsed with the band. Well, while we are not here yesterday. Anyway, it turns out Ritchie and the crew didn't even know the damn song at the time. They had no idea what the song was, so they had to learn the song and then had to learn how we wanted to come out to the song. It was, Yeah, it was. It was completely messed up. Oh many lessons learned, so many another song in hindsight, Oh no, no, no, that that had to happen. That had to happen. It had happened exactly the way it did. We needed to be knocked down a couple of pigs because we we had done. We had done all that could be done in Vegas. We did every talent show one you know what I'm saying. We did all that and we just we went in there like I should this thing, Like we really literally walked into place needed that. Oh yeah, oh yeah this yeah, this Vegas. Yeah we do that. Yeah. When after we got off that stage, it got back to the back, we all ran in the bathroom and just stood around and stared at each other for like fifteen seconds and all buzz out crying at the same time. It was bad. Yeah, So after the Apollo we was like bad. We gotta redeem myself. You got so, you know, shout out to my man Corey. Corey was like our manager. He was a part of the group and he was the manager. He was the one that was. You know, he was the one that that wasn't afraid to talk to people. You know, we ran up on Diddy one time. I was like, hey, let us sing for you that. But Corey was also the one that could never be on time to anything. He's like I did. He told us be there by eight. That shower type situation now was stouts Corey. I don't know where Corey is currently. Probably that out to my man Corey Park. We got to the cut, uh two days or right, because he was like, is there a band we need to rehearse with that? Good? Like no, no, no, no no, no, no, y'all got y'all got tape of music? Yeah, okay, cool, we could use the tape. Why aren't we used to tape? We went in with an original song that we've written called pillow Talk. I think we did okay. It wasn't terrible. It wasn't great by any means, but it wasn't terrible. And we wind up losing to a girl that got on stage and got next to Neked and I see gave her, uh two more points and he gave us. Yeah, the judges of the CUD I can't remember it. And no, I think it was. It was it was guest judges every different every every every episode. So I think it was one of the judges. But he literally said it on the show. He was like, he was like, you know what, I wasn't really crazy about the song, but when she started stripping, I gave her a note damn, like damn. But everything happened for a reason. Everything happens for a reason. That was one of the last shows that we did as a group before we finally decided, you know what, let's just do you remember performing with us out in Vegas when Jay brought me out? Was that all right? So I literally okay, So, you know, as president of def JAM, you know, at that point, I felt comfortable enough with Jada, you know too rib him or you know, joke with him, like you know, most people just treat him like the King, like the good version of d I mean, like they don't mix words or whatever. But you know, I felt like a little comfortable where I just called him up randomly about something and I would say that you were one of the artists that he always he always advocated for, He always fought for it, Like he was basically trying to figure out which one of you guys that he wanted on the next Roots record, uh, you know prominently either like Crossette or you or you know tr like one of you and um. So when he got word that you were in town, he's like, all right, keep your eye on him. Because at that point I was not familiar. You know, I have my head under the stand when it came to like any music that you know wasn't the music. Already had my record collection and you came out like someone owed you money, Like I didn't realize, Oh you didn't know he had it like that talk. And the first I wish there was a videotape because there's a thing. There's a thing with Jay where he turns around real slow like and I hate when that smuggie. I told you so look he'll give me. He's like yeah, because it's like the cherry on top. You're like, well wait a minute. Now he was killing it. I was like, oh my god, this he's going for James Brown Tammy Show levels. So I knew the importance of where I was at. I'm like, let me get this straight. The Roots and Jay Z and me, oh my show my act. All right, so you leave envy and then what's the process of how do you get the attention of record labels? Um So I left left Envy. But in the while we were in and me again shout out to my man Corey, you know, constantly moving around trying to trying to get things in popfor us. We met this cat who had a boy band signed to Hollywood Records, you know at the time that was Disney's Yeah, and a group out of a group called Youngstown. They were they were never got huge, huge shoes, but they did well enough. So it was like it was a concept where it was like, write some songs from my group, and I try and I'll help y'all get y'all help y'all get signed. Type of situation. So you know, we wrote the songs. Was what it was like at this time. I know nothing of publishing, I know nothing of any of that. I'm just like, we're gonna get it. We're gonna get a deal. Yeah, yeah, right, a song whatever. So after I broke up, after the group broke up, I I basically started being managed by that guys. Now his name was names uh Dubs. Everybody called him Dubs Dubs Wilson, and he was he was the one that was kind of moving, moving me around, you know, showing me that different people. I was living with this cat by the name of PAULI. Paul the producer he did Uh Teacher Moses his first album. Oh yeah, Paul, Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I actually met that. We actually met Teacher. I met Teacher through that whole situation. I vocal vocal producing, arranged that whole first album. I didn't. I didn't write. I didn't. She she did all the writing herself that I was. I was. I was infatuated with right itself. Yeah, I just come in and you know, through harmony here in that time. Okay, Still, that's dope. That'sn't that's music history. Like, what is your patients level with vocal producing? Because I ate it? Um, I don't do it anymore. I'll say that you see it. Yeah, I'm not so so. Shout out to my man's sauce, Uh Curtis Bills, a sauce of formerly of the group Something for the People. Remember, Something for the People. Sauce is my vocal producer, ranger. You know what I'm saying. And so if I wrote it, he's normally the one that's gonna take it with the artists and and and get it, get it recorded properly because he has the patience for that. I do note that's what you need, all right? So can I say or I won't ask for specific specific names, but you know, because it's real, Like there's certain artists that I hate working with because you got a Jedi mind trick him. You know, they don't want to do another take. So are there artists that you've had that situation with where like they catch your attitude or don't want to do it the way that you give you one more take? Yes, your silence is telling me everything I've been in. So I've been in with people that that people that you know. I've been in with people and it's like it's either it's either that or if they're so anal, Like, Yo, did you hear the breath on the beginning of that? Let me just get that breath one more time? No, just just on the very on the very top, Let me get that. Let me get again one more time, not one more time, one more time for the breath. I just gotta get the breath that sounds like Beyonce Rihanna Man. That took an hour and thirty minutes. For the breath. It's not a word. It's just a breath at the top of the word. Hour in thirty minutes. Wait, I gotta be I gotta ask you. Was it Beyonce? It was not? Okay, it was not Wait do you remember do you remember uh a bronx tail when they had that now you can't leave moment? Yeah. I had that with her once and never again. Like it was about figuring out ending of a song, and I was like, I said the wrong thing. I said, no, no, maybe stuvans it's cool. We could just do with the regular ending. We're good and he like oh, And she's like, oh, we're gonna get this right and I said, well, it's lunch break now, so we can just come back into He says, no, we're gonna do it right now. I don't care if it takes three hours. And it was the now you can't leave moments. So yeah, that's the that is. That is the Beyonce and I'm familiar with. But it was but when I when I worked with her, I wasn't needed. I wasn't there for a lot of it like she she had it. I didn't have to. That was that was one of the things that made me fall in love with her even more, Like I didn't have to feed her no notes, here's the next note. I got it, okay, all rights Like she's like, I wouldn't got coffee. I came back, the song was done. Okay, Well, well what y'all got doing today? What y'all doing? Because if that's the case, then what's your what's your favorite what's your favorite song of hers that you've done? That you you come back and heard her finished product and was like, oh ship, yeah, thinking one that I did with her that I didn't sere that way about everything did because mind you so, so at this point, at this point, I know a little bit about how to sell a record, right, I know that you can't sing the wreck ridiculously well because you mess around scared artist off. Right. You have to keep it kind of middle of the road, just just good enough. You know, Oh, you're talking about making the demo. You're talking about making the demo? Yeah, OK, yeah, I did not know. Oh yeah yeah. So anything that I did for anybody, I sing the demo and send it to them and they and they like it, dislike it, whatever case may be. So be honest, and you do it dry dry dry one you know one takedown, I have Melany, I have harmony ideas here and here and not in Stone, but here's it would be a good place for a harmony. Here would be a good place. That's all that's always needed when I come back, And it's the airplaceable that you we all know and love now so irreplaceable, uh, flaws and all you know it's right. I'm them on and I'm a bit Yes, yes, that dry, every everything, all the all of that that's heard, that's all heart. I wrote If there's a joint on that same album call if if You let Him Take Me from you another where she just went to church on the ship, like just yeah, I've never felt so useless in a session then a session with Beyonce, like I did not need to be there at all. Is there a song of yours that vocally you wish he could have been there in the room for it, just because it wasn't the way that you envisioned it? Yes, okay, Yes, it just didn't do what it was supposed to do. Uh. So I love Luke James. Luke James is my guy. Luke James has one of the best voices that I've heard in a long I wrote a song for Luke James, and what happened was the original the original key of the song was way higher then he was then he sings in his regular voice, so they had to drop it down to where he sang. And if anybody knows anything about when you take a high key song and drop it down, it kind of takes a little energy and little energy from the record. So when I heard it back, it was like, damn, there three notes lowered. Then I initially gave it to him and I wasn't there when he cut it, so I'm like, as much as I love Luke, this is not. No, this is not That's not what the song is supposed to be. But by that time it was too late. The song came out. I didn't really do anything, didn't. I'm sorry. I like the shine I did. It didn't. Yeah, it didn't. It didn't do much of anything, but take another from Luke again, an amazing singer, just amazing dude. Period. That was just that was just a moment in time where it's like, if if I knew that they were gonna drop it down that many, that many keys, I would have I would have just been like no, do let's come else, let me let me do something makes more sense in in the realm where you like yeah, because it just it just took. It just took all the all the energy from the record, Like yeah, it happen. Like when I first heard Champagne Life, man, I was like, yo, dog, that's the one right there, This's gonna be the one. I wish Champagne Life was You're magnum Opus. That's my all time favorite song of yours, And I wish that ship would have because I felt it was like an anthem there ever was a black excellence anthem. Yes, I've seen it, and I wish that song was just like way way bigger. Are there songs of yours that are not your your, your out the gate hits that you you know, wish we're bigger singles or that that jam worked. I'm not a I'm not a dictator, meaning I'm not to do going you know what the hell is jumping? Hell with jumping. I liked this song that's a single, living long. I'm not that dude. Right. There's a small group of people that we all get together and we pick what song is gonna make the album, What songs gonna be singles, you know what I'm saying, and everybody respects everybody's opinion. My manager, Tango, this is one of the oddest creatures on the face of the planet because Tango don't even listen to music. Yet Tango can always the one that's gonna go whatever reason. But that always knows, Like Nina, the whole room would be like, hey, he's like, nah, trust me be and damnit, it would be being I'm telling you it's it's the most frustrating thing in the world. But so him just just a small group that that I do this with, which means that there's been a multitude of times wherever songs that I wanted to be singles that didn't wind up singles. Mirror from the first album, I wanted to be a single. I wanted that to be a single. This was before de Gen realized that I could be sexy. They didn't vieve me a sexy said that was like, hey, it's all good. You know what. At the time, I was priding myself on not being that R and B dude, you know what I mean, Like they're like, okay, if I can step on stage, you know, four in a three piece suit and get the same screens that you can't with your chest out who winning, Yeah, alright cool? Right, So because of that, I guess they was like, you know, mirror not not when we're all right cool? Uh, Champagne Life, that whole that whole album, the Libra Scale album was just man, it was just so many things that went wrong, so many things that went wrong. I take I take my take responsibility for the things that went wrong. So the Libra Scale album was what what what Champagne Life was on when we went to when when I came back from doing the Red Sales movie, and then uh then another movie called Battle Los Angeles. So I so in the process of doing these movies, I'm sticking real close to the writers, real close to the directors because like this, I want to I'm learning, Yo, I want to know how to do this. I know I could tell a story in three minutes. I want to have to tell a story in two hours. How I do this right? I guess I'm not asking the right questions. So I go back to death Jam and I say to them, so for my fourth album, I want to do like a thirty minute maybe forty or five minute little mini movie and let the album be the soundtrack to the movie. And I'm like, okay, that's a that's a pretty dope by there. Okay, bring us the script. Cool. Notice I said thirty forty five minutes, right, this is before I learned that in the world of screening and script writing a page e crate to a minute. I didn't know this. So whereas I told him thirty forty five minutes, I brought them a script with a hundred forty five pages in it and then like, um, what you what were doing? What you want us to do with this? What the this is not thirty minutes? This ain't go This ain't So I had then take the hundred forty five pages and bust it down to thirty pages, which took way way long, because again I'm green to this. I know what I want to do, I just don't know how to do it. So bust it down to thirty. By that time, the clock is taken. We ain't got time to shoot no movie. All. You know what, Let's do this, Let's do four, Let's do five long form music videos. So the video of Champagne Life video for UH one of a Million, the video for for Beautiful Monster. Yeah, I just it. It didn't It just didn't go the way I was supposed to go. Man, it just didn't go. Households go. We got three videos in said we can give you no more damn money to hell with you. To be continued, We're not doing it. Champagne like was all supposed to be the first single, and then we come to Beautiful Monster. But then all of a sudden in the ninth inning, everybody switches up and he goes, well, not, we think Beautiful Monster should go first. And I'm like, no, because I know what beautiful Monster is, beautiful monsters chasing closer. I don't want to do that the moment. Let that be that. Let's let's do you hear this record? Let's go here, Na, No, no, you gotta you gotta international fan base. Now you gotta feed your fan base, oh internationally? Can I ask? Is this Jay Brown talking? Is this l A Reid? Like, who's the Who's at the drive? Who's the wheel? Uh? Is the little bit of all of them is? Yeah? Everybody, everybody. Everybody got the hand on the wheel and it's pushing at this point. At this point, this is the fourth album, This is after year the gentleman. So everybody's hands on at this point, right, so right, and you're you're the gentleman there with so now it's like, all right, all right, he's proven. Let's you know, let's let's let's pay more attention than we ever had before. Almost to a fault, because how did you go a Beautiful Master first? Micro managed Beautiful Monster? Did you know what it did? It did well overseas, which we know what was gonna do, because that's what it's for. I didn't do it over here. And then and then they put out Champagne Life, trying to pick trying to clean up behind Beautiful Monster, because Beautiful Master. They let it rock for a little while it wasn't picking up, so they all right, we're moving on, moving on the Champagne Life. Champagne Life comes out. It's moving, it's moving, it's moving. We want to drop another single? Why let it know? Let why would you drop the legs off of this? It's going You got a heat rock with this next one. Okay, if it's a heat rock, now it's gonna be a heat rock. Let it live. They don't want to let it live. Chop the legs off the Champagne Life with the next single, which did not do well either. Then we went we ended ended everything off with one of the new which which kind of, you know, at the very least level of sut you know, I wouldn't. I wouldn't in the red after the Damn album, one of the million levels out, but it didn't, it didn't do what everyone anticipated. Uh yeah, I was really really down at them at that period of time. I just remember being real sad a lot because it just just so many things went wrong. I'm like, there's no way that this is this bad of an idea for all of these things to be happening like this. And then I'll never forget that year I got invited to Princess Grammy party. I mean, he's always used probably the party of his house, so so you know, that was silver lining in the dark clouds. So we went to the party. I remember we're in the in the pool house and there's like a like a plexiblast thing over the pools are literally standing on the pool. I thought that was cool. Um, So he's on the little stage with his band rocking out. He sees me, puts his guitar down, be lines to me and said what comes to my ear and whispers and says Leebra Scale was a good album and don't let anybody tell you different. Wow, but this is But did you know what was? But Neo, did you know what? He was whispering everybody's ear? Sorry, this reminds me of all the stories that you told me that that's don't even do. That's kind of what he does. You know. We had one other encounter where I was I was drinking Sla vodka and he leaned over to me at the party and said, it's bad for you. And that was that was the thing that he did before we before we wrapped. I just wanted to um, I always want to know, uh the song time Luke for Sherman showcase about it? Let's talk about it? Yeah, man, me and that's me and my wait do you know credit? Do you know? Yeah? We met. We met on set. I think the day that you that y'all take, we met because I think the demo on that and like right right now, Yeah, that day he was like he was like, yeah, man, you sounded just like walking the Scotty on the joint, like but but yeah, they yeah, we we did that, man. And I was like Yo, this is like crazy high. I don't know who they're gonna get to sing it. And then I guess maybe like a month later, Diallo shout to Diallo he came. I was like, yeah, man, we got Dio to do it. I was like, funk, yeah, that's perfect. So what was it like for you? How did that song like come to you? Like? What did you think? Like? What was it like on your side? Brouh Diallo reached out, it sent me told me about the show, the Sherman Showcase Show, and uh, I asked me if I wanted to be a part of it. I'm like, yeah, man, I've always want to do funny stuff. I don't never get the funny roles. Just for whatever reason, I got something funny, all right, I thought I was. I guess I'm not anybody you killed that ship man? Well, well thank you. Tell We'll tell some of these damn casting directors that I'm funny. It's like it's fun I don't never get it. No, I'm always always get the music roles, all right, you're starving artists, and that's what that's what I get all the time. So he sent me the record because at first I asked I was like, I need to write something. He was like, you can, but I have I have an idea, and then he sent to him. I'm like, oh, I don't need to do none of this to that d like it was a real song, like like you'll realized that, like all the best word that watched the show. We was like all them songs. We was like, yo with an album, listen word without I'm down to do more now that I know you're down to do more because we Yeah, now that I know that, Oh yeah, can we get a Sherman show case to say we're taking on so long? Yeah? The data, well it's what I mean, you know, like everything else, COVID push us back. But the new season, I believe it's coming in the fall. We we did the music, all the music and all that's been done, but you know, we got pushed back from COVID, But the new season is coming this fall. Though I'll let me, I will happily revive the character. Yes, okay, Can I ask about self explanatory real quick? Yes, yes, yes, I just want to know because back to this conversation that we were having in the beginning of the show about music and whatnot, I'm curious to how you continue in the legacy on this album and by still keeping it fresh. Okay, So so this album I started designing eighteen and then you know, of course COVID pandemic, quarantine and all of that stuff hit and just throw a monkey wrinch and everybody's situation that happens. So um, a good half of this album I had to I wand up having to kind of do over, you know, because it's like you work with a producer in teen you do a song's all r yeah, it's for the album. You didn't pay him yet, and then y'all ain't spoke and then you called me two and he's like what happens? Like that's so good? So we had we had to redo some stuff. But overall this album is it's definitely me as me. I mean, I called itself explanatory because I feel like I've been here them in twenty years. Do you really need an explanation to a Neil record at this point? Not really? Right, not really not really do you understand what this? But on top of that, um, this is this is me acknowledging what's going on right now. I can never become it. I'm forty two let me alone. I can never become it, but I could acknowledge it, you know, I can acknowledge it. I can acknowledge the parts of it that I did, you know. So, So there's one song in particular, so actually the first song on the on the album UH cat from the newer generation. His name is a France If you ever heard the name before, look him up. Yeah, he got something. He got something to the point where I let him feature on the album the name of to join his land Lowess. It's quality record, but it doesn't sound like typical neo. It's more the song of the song leans a little bit more towards his his generation, and I'm just kind of you know, uncle on the side of the thing. But I'm never I'm never the cat that's gonna jump on the record and not be me. I can that that. That could never. I can't do that. So even if it sounds a little more Uh contemporary than than than normal, it's just me acknowledging the changes and the evolutions that have happened in R and B. Well, at the same time, I'm gonna still get my bridges. I'm still geting my three, four or five part harmonies where I could and get him in there. All that is gonna be on his album as well. Um, it's it's just me celebrating the fact that I get to do music for a living top. That's that's pretty much what this album is. Yeah, that's dough man. Oh and I've been to tell you too, man, like good man, I love Yeah. I thought that was so dope, like y'all chop up. How does it feel like that was? Yeah? That was another one that I felt like should have got way more attention than it did. But you know, I can't. I can't tell people what to do. And she's got her own, like you be, creating panthems for the fellas and the ladies. That's it's kind of amazing and like progressive to think progressively in a way. It's that's kind of dope. It's misindependent. I know that. But I'd like to say she got her own. Yeah, yeah, black, I like we say she got out man. Oh, I want to see you you see it? Working with her? We gotta yeah, I gotta yeah see it. Man. She's like amazing, right, love talk about working with her? Yeah, man, so so Um, she wrote the hook to let Me love you and I love you. You learn to love yourself. The funniest thing. I was like, because I heard that leok, I'm like, yo, where did you come up with that? And she said, oh my a meeting, that's what they say, We're gonna love you, love yourself. I'm like, yeah, that is the realist person alive. I remember that is actually that session we were sitting in the back was at Westlake Studios on Santa Monica and we were sitting that room off of the A room, and uh, I was looking at the tattoos on her arms. She has pictures of dogs, but it looked like a four year old drew a dog and it's just a bunch of them, like all over her arm. I'm like, what is it? Anyway, I'm I'm sitting there because I'm I'm in awe of her, because mind you, I'm I'm zero seven, you know what I'm saying, Like, I'm from there. I finally get to work with us, So I'm geeking out and I'm like, yo, I'm sorry, You're just supposed to be way bigger than you are. And she was like, yeah, but I don't want it. I want to go to Taco Bell and I'm like, what she's I want to go to Taco Bell. I want to be able to go to Taco Bell and get a taco if I feel like, if I get any bigger and people don't my fact, I can't go to Taco Bell. I'm like, that makes a lot of damn sense. So I guess we gotta figure out a way for your music to get the recognition it loves. But you being there still going to Taco Bell. She's like, she said, I'm working on the next thing. You know, he comes up with the videos with little Maddie dancing and and half the world don't know what's he looked like, yet the whole world loves of music. I'm like, she figured it out, and it's just victory. Stories like that just just make my heart smile, man, because because I just remember sitting there with her, like, how are we gonna get you to Taco Bell? They need to hear this music, but we need you got to get your Taco Bell. How are we gonna do this? She did? She figured it out. Now, Now I have one question, because I was one day old, I didn't realize that you wrote mac Wild's is owned it? Yeah, I still spend that to this day grab songs that you wish you would have kept for yourself. Um not when they do well, you know what I'm saying. I look at it like if it came out and it was a hit on it came out clearly that's where it was supposed to be. Now when it come out in it don't do well, I'm like, well, damn, that's how he's gonna do. I should have kept it. I could have did better than that. Another another question, because you were one of the staff writers of the Empire series, how much how much pressure was that, Like at the top of the season where I would imagine even the summer before, it's like you gotta have like whatever fifteen songs or whatever, Like what's the division of labor where like how do they assign those songs to get done for it? Because every episode of Empire had at least like six to seven ready made, like real sounding songs, not just like you know whatever they would just play on the background of a different world, but like really fully produced no no, no, Gordon gar Trail songs. But how much how much pressure was that? Like was this the stuff inside at your your cannon that you had in the back already or were you like custom making these songs on the spot? Well, I didn't. I didn't come in until the following season. The first first season that none of that was me. I didn't none of that second season is when they when they when they pulled me, and it was honestly a really pain painless process bro the day. And I don't know if it was just because it was me, but they was basically like, well, what what you got for us? Well? What do you need? What? What what what you got? Oh? Well damn, all right, Well well let me look into you know. And then I got to meet Jesse, I got to meet uh, you know, yeahs and and and I have to meet Surrey and all of them, and like kind of really developed kind of a friendship with them to where it's like, all right, I know how to write a song for you. Now, I know what your voice does. Now I know I know what works? What doesn't you know what I mean? So they really rolled out the red carpet for me. It made it very easy for me to produce anything that I needed to produce for the show. Definitely sweet. Well, I want to thank you for you know, doing the show with us. And you know, thank you for thank you for the records, thank you for the records, thank you for the thank you for the bridges. Let it up especially, and you should audition. Maybe you start auditioning for like some romantic comedies. I see like maybe starting out it's like a sidekick situation and being the funny funny if you want to do. I just I see that. I see that for you, you're doing it. No no, no, no, no no no no no. I know I feel I don't want to do I'm won't say I don't want to do a romantic comedy because if the rad will come on, I'm gonna do it. But I want to be play a paraplegic white man who just realized kind of mom was black. I want to do something that's so not me. You want to be lieutenant? Come on, man, I'm trying to tell you. I want to be something that's so not me that when people learn this meeting, oh damn, Okay, that's what I want to do. I understand, that's what I want to do. I understand you went real far to the left left. I need that. I need German chef just got shipwrecked in Africa. Have to learn how to make showcase Season three Wars Family Fonte, Did you hear that? Neo? Come on to write that song for you. I can tell it's so and a little and sugar Steve and I'm paid Bill and uh Lieutenant Dan over here. This is quest Love Supreme. Thank you for doing this and we'll see you on the next peground. Quess Love Supreme is a production of my heart Radio. 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