South Africa’s matric, or National Senior Certificate (NSC), results often attract attention due to the seemingly high national pass rates. In recent years, these rates have averaged between 87 and 90 percent, which on the surface suggests significant progress in the education sector. However, these figures alone do not fully capture the quality of education or whether students are prepared to compete internationally.  Mbuyiseni Ndlozi is in conversation with Wits School of Education Professor, Prof. Leketi Makalela.