The issue of pay for magistrates and judges has again come up, this time at Judicial Service Commission interviews for the deputy chief justice position. Free State Judge President Cagney Musi warned that court officials aren't properly paid, which opens them up to falling into the trap of corruption. The Judicial Officers Association of SA threatened to take to the streets last year over the big pay gap between magistrates and judges. Mbuyiseni Ndlozi is in conversation with JOASA President, Neelan Karikan, Member of the Magistrates Commission, Hennie Britz and Research and Advocacy Officer at Judges Matter, Mbekezeli Benjamin.