I want you to write a letter to yourself as a kid, knowing to think of that age. And I wrote a letter to myself like, yeah, you know, like it's okay to like be a weirdo. Like if you get picked on for that, that's cool. And one day these guys are going to come to your concert. And then I wrote a letter to myself as an adult but as of the eight year old self, and I couldn't get through the letter. I mean, I'm bawling, crying. Oh, I have a letter frame of my house. It's just such a great reminder to be a kid at heart and not be too hard on ourselves. We're all big kids at the end of the day, trying to figure this crazy thing called life out. Hey everyone, welcome back to On Purpose, the number one health podcast in the world. Thanks to each and every one of you that come back every week to listen, learn and grow. Now. I know that you're listening because you want to be happy, you want to be healthy, and you want to be healed. And I am so excited to be talking to you today. I don't believe it. My new book Eight Rules of Love is out and I cannot wait to share it. With you. I'm so so excited for you to read this book, for you to listen to this book. I read the audiobook. If you haven't got it already, make sure you go to eight Rules of Love dot com. It's dedicated to anyone who's trying to find, keep, or let go of love. So if you've got friends that are dating, broken up, or struggling with love, make sure you grab this book. And I'd love to invite you to come and see me for my global tour Love Rules. Go to Jay shedytour dot com to learn more information about tickets, VIP experiences, and more. I can't wait to see you this year. And it's not always that I get to do this, but I try and sit down with guests that I have really deep, meaningful relationships with, and I like to share that with you because I find that when these relationships develop organically offline, then when we bring them online, usually after a couple of years, you get to experience something Specially. You get to hear two friends talking. You get to hear people not scared of being interviewed. You get to hear me not being confused or fluster about where I want to go. And I really hope that this interview is going to do that for you. I'm speaking to someone who needs no introduction. I'm speaking to someone who I absolutely admire, respect on so many levels. You're going to see that throughout the interview. And I'm speaking to someone who became one of my dearest friends without meeting him during the pandemic. I'm speaking about the one, the only, Joe Jonas, one of the kindest, sweetest, most down to earth humans. I know there is not a bad bone in this guy's body. He's given me memories that will last a lifetime. I'm so grateful that he's finally on on purpose. Joe, Wow, thank you. Welcome to It was from the I need you to introduce every show from the nicest person I know. I'll do it. Let me be the voice of God at your events. Please we have a show tomorrow. You can do it. I'm so thrilled to do this. Yes, your podcast has been on my top lessons every week. Life changing and it's interesting how I've quite I'm kind of late to the game. I discovered Jay Shitty a bit further along in my meditation journey than most. When we first met was via zoom. Actually The first time we met was in front of like thousands of people online, and then we didn't actually meet in person until I probably a year and a half two years later. Yeah, my brother met you twice before. Yeah, Nick met you twice. Yeah, So I was quite jealous, and I was like, maybe it's not Maybe he's not real. This is an AI version of this person that was created. But I'm glad to say you're real. I'm glad that we've become so close and you've been so helpful for me. I might on my personal walk with whether if it's the Brujonas brothers, to personal things I'm going through that I've expressed with you, and on a bigger scale of just like the days that we live our lives for everyone else, and how I'm able to function like a normal human being when i go home again. So it's really helpful. So thank you. No, and I want to give you some credit for this, because I think a lot of this stuff happens behind the scenes and people are unaware, especially with someone like you. You've been popular and famous for so much of your life, and you know there's so much written about people and so much you hear about people, and there's so much you don't hear. And I think in my line of work, where I get to see them behind the scenes of a lot of people, I like to be able to share that because I think it's important. So what Joe's talking about for anyone who's listening or watching back at home, is we did this charity event thanks to and I would give a big shout out to David Johnson, right because yeah, David Johnson. Yeah, because David knew that. David felt that we would connect. And we did this event for Wee Day and it was Joe, Lily Collins, and myself and Lily and Joe were hosting, and I was asked to teach a meditation and literally seconds after this meditation finishes live online to thousands of people, I get a message from Joe, like probably literally in the next couple of hours saying, Hey, I'd love to do a medic tation like that for my friends. And I'm like, cool, that sounds great, let's do it. And I thought nothing of it. I was like, yeah, that makes sense. He obviously enjoyed it. That's great. Love that, and so we did it. So we set it off for that Sunday. I think it was a Sunday, right, and he set up a zoom link. He sent me a zoom link and we started this thing and like maybe I can't remember how many people who joined the first one. First one is probably close to like six or seven people. Oh, was it really okay? Right? It was pretty intimate. Yeah, I'm if I'm correct, Yeah, and then cut to you know, after the first few weeks, more people started to join, and there was always the same ten, but for sure sometimes it was like thirty people were on his zoom Yeah, and all different walks of life, people from all over the world. Obviously, when we're in proper lockdown and a lot of things were happening in the world, it was really the best thing to have at the end of your week or the beginning of your week to just get together and meditate with people and then have a discussion whether people and you were so kind and you've still we still do this, so you're still so kind to take time out your crazy schedule to answer any questions or even give advice. And sometimes it's just an open floor to talk and express how everybody's feeling. And it was so helpful for me. But it's also I think really been a wonderful experience to give back to all my friends or at least to be able to present a comptable place where they can just be themselves and talk about their emotions and not feel embarrassed about it. And it's been incredible. Yeah, the impressive plot to me though was and obviously you gave me beautiful friends and family and people like Greg and you know, Vanessa Hudgens been on the show. I met her through the zen Zone. She took about she met Cole Cole, her boyfriend that her now boyfriend who played played for the Pittsburgh Pirates for years and are my good friend Christo one day? So they invited him one day on the zoom and then yeah, then Vanessa met Cole through this zoo like and so there's been like romance that has come from this. But it's it's really special and I'm glad we kept it up and obviously everyone's life kind of got back to normal, but we still wanted to do it. I saw a few people last week and they were like, when are we doing it again? We have to do it yet obviously it's become like a norm for us. Well that's what I was going to say that the impressive part, and now we'll put a bow on the bromance and start getting to an interview. Everyone has been listening. But the most impressive part is that we did it for seventy five weeks, Like I think when I calculated, it was like seventy five eighty five, maybe even did a few more. And I think it's that level of consistency that I admire in someone like you. You know, anyone can do one and anyone can be like inspired for a week, but to be inspired, and through our conversations, I've continued to see that, like to be inspired and consistent with something for that long and then to inspire a community to do that, it requires someone really special. So I really am so impressed by that, and it became the model of how I work with so many people where I realized that you taught me that you were like, hey, just don't make it a one on one, like bring people along for the journey. And so you really inspired me in that way. And anyone who ever asked for meditation, I started saying to them, makes you invite your friends? Because Joe did this thing and it inspired me and I genuinely think it's changed the model of how I work with people, what I feel like as well. You know what I miss so dearly was just that connection of being around my friends obviously everyone and family. And I was also getting tired of these like Zoom parties where you're playing games and you're like, all right, this is not happening. This is not working for me anymore. So the idea that you feel on an emotional level you can connect with people, and also there's accountability of like you kept your camera on and your audio on, so everyone was able to be actually meditating with each other and feel that difference because we know how it usually goes when you're in a zoom meeting or a party, Like half the time you're hitting the mute button and cameras off. You're doing something, so you're on a bicycle while you're doing it. So it was nice to be present and do it. Yeah, let's let's get into it because I really want to. I really want people to hear about your journey, especially your personal growth journey as an amazing husband a father, Like, just you know, this incredible growth journey you've been on it, and I think for people who've known you for such a long time. I remember coming to events last year and you've got all these new young audiences. Then you've got audiences you've been with you for all these years. When did you start realizing you wanted to work on yourself? Like, when was that like a idea or a thought a seed? When did it start? There was a There's been a few hurdles that I felt like I probably need to take care of myself physically mentally. I think the biggest one that comes to mind many years ago I released a solo album, so I did a record alongside with my brothers. We kind of all started to feel like we had separate personal interests professionally, and I'm in no not I'm really proud of now. I like it even more than I used to. I think at the time there was a lot of cooks in the kitchen. And when you're like performing at the level that the Jonas brothers were back when, and you know it was just chaos and craziness and number one albums and the song would break records on YouTube and things were happening in real time, you kind of think like, all right, this is the norm, Like this is going to happen for me too, and I think that's like obviously a really bizarre thing to even think about, But that started to become like, Okay, anything we touched, I think is going to really take off. And I had kind of a wake up call when I released this album and they didn't perform as well as say the Brothers stuff. And also forgot that the years and years of hard work that we put into the to the Brothers music to even get to a level where that many people are listening to our songs. And I took it really hard, but I didn't realize how I actually felt in the moments. I figured, Okay, well, I'll just get back on the road and you know, start promoting this. And I had like a bit of like a lifespan with this album. I knew that the next Brothers project was right around the corner, so at about a year and a half to really focus in on this album called Fast Life, and I was in here. I was here in New York after the album was out and it didn't really do much, and started reading reviews, started seeing the reactions, and it hit me like a ton of bricks, and I started feeling like physically ill and I really told myself and I believed that I was sick, so I would go to the doctor. I started going to the doctor like every other week, and then it became like every week, and it was almost like a joke with my friends. Were like, oh, Sunday Funday, Joe was going to the hospital again to get a checkup. And I would do like full body checkups and look at the doctor and be like, doc, like you gotta like all right. I would do ultrasounds on my stomach. I would. It became a thing where it was coming cool because I'm like, I'm I'm a hypochondriac. I'm just I'm overthinking these symptoms or creating these in my mind. And one doctor finally just said to me, They're like, have you thought or spoken to a therapist? And I was like me, no, why would I Why would I ever need therapy? And it kind of just hit me after I left, and I was like, oh my, like, oh my god, maybe they're right. Like the doctor's like, I have all of your results here from the last like three visits, and you have nothing wrong with you physically, like you're you're in great health, but obviously there's something going on and She's like, I'm I would think I would this is what I would suggest. So sure enough I started seeing somebody and I was like, oh, this is this is why. Right before that window where I started speaking to somebody, I would be I was here in New York and I'd go on these bike journeys and I would ride my bike from eight in the morning to eight at night and stop it along the way. But it was like an escape for me, and I wasn't able to look at my phone. I wasn't able to think about the album, wasn't I was just a kind of checking out. So I was like still running away, avoiding the problems. But I thought this was like, oh, this is what I needed. A minute I got the bike, I'm feeling sick again, and so I started talking to therapists and really dove into all of that pain and trauma that I created for myself. And and it was weird that it stemmed from something as simple as like, oh the album didn't do as well as I thought. Would you think, like, it's not the biggest deal in the world. But I think in my brain, I was pushing myself so hard and I had these expectations really set high that brought me into the Walk of therapy and then the walk of meditation with you. And I mean that's years and years later, but that's how I started kind of saying, Okay, I think I need to take care of myself and I'm not this fifteen year old kid anymore that can just run run, run, run, run and bed fine. Yeah, and it's it's amazing actually the other way around too. I don't know if you've ever thought about it this way, but it's like you said, like, oh, I shouldn't have maybe felt that bad that this solo album didn't do so well, But it's like, how old were you when you did the solobum. It's probably about twenty one, twenty two years old, yeah, yeah, and so it's like you're still a young Yeah, that's what I mean. You're scaring it out exactly and you still And that's what I wonder. It's almost like going away from something that was a shure fire win to try something new and potentially out there and risky, and moving away from like a you know, tried and tested formula of the Brothers actually requires a lot of courage and most people try and hang on to what's tried and true and would be scared to do what you did. And so I think there's also a lot of like, yeah, it took a long courage come to that realization. Yeah, those like trend words flash in your brain. Like I saw a headline like, oh failure, and I took that word and that was my identity of that album. Years later I was like what, I wouldn't even listen to the songs as well, And years later I started listening to them again and obviously going through the work and realizing that, like you said, yeah, that journey to deep of faith to actually do something else rather than just be pigeon held to like this is the comfortable place, this is the breadwinner. I'm good here. Yeah. I was like, I'm taking a leap of faith on my own and that's a big enough. It doesn't matter how many people listen to it, if everybody loved it, hated it, whatever, ye doing it for me and I lost touch with that. Yeah, but that commitment as well, even at that early age. When when was it you started to see a therapist, It was around that same time, right twenty two. Yeah, like that that commitment to that truly working on yourself in a reflective way, like that's that's a big deal, even at even at that age, you like to accept that you need help then to find help. What was that like for the rest of your family? Like how was other people reacting to it? Because I feel like today when people try to seek help often it's in And I met your parents, they're absolutely wonderful. I met your brothers, they're they're wonderful. Like, you know, I've met met all your partners. I don't think I met Kevin's wife, met you know, go thro your partners of the crew. Yeah, yeah, And I know that I've interacted with the family, and so I'm like, I can imagine that they were positive towards it. But what was it like initially? Like how does that feel like to your parents? I think, you know, our dad has been the most incredible person to go to with pretty much anything. I mean, he was a minister for many years, then he was our manager for a good amount of years. Then around the same time it became like dad solely again, which was actually great because we had I had like my dad to go to about stuff. But you know, when you start that journey of like seeking outside help, it is I think as a parent it would be a little bit it's going to take a beat to realize like, oh, you're not the only one that can give advice now. But also I get it, I you know, I think my parents are really mature in that sense where they respect medical professionals. So I think if like the person has the degree to be able to give that advice, then I think that they're going to feel more comfortable. I mean that there's been people that I think I've gone to for advice that my dad was like, I haven't raised my hand to say this is my opinion. I don't know if this is the right person for you, but let's find somebody with like a couple of doctorates. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, that's fair. That's fair, that's good advice. Yeah. Nor your parents are so sweet whenever this because it's so easy to you know, find anybody like google the closest therapist or person or life coach or whatever it may be. But to actually have somebody who knows this key. Yeah. I love what you said though about how like you're like, you know, I had to realize that the brothers had spent all these years building something and then obviously you're trying to do something on your own, Like, how is your personal creative process changed since then? Like how have you adapted since the first round of the Brothers too doing your own thing to now wow doing yeah likes? How have you changed that? Wow, it's changed quite a bit. I feel like with DNC I had and for those are listening or watching, I'm in a band as well with my brothers called DNCUM. We have a song. Cake by the Ocean was our first song I wrote for the band with Justin Trannor and great song, thank you great on stage and that song and the way it took off actually was the first bit of feeling of Okay, this other style of music that I really love to create. I can also pursue and follow this butterfly and see where it takes me because I can bring this back to the Brothers. So I've been able to go on my own and I think grow as a writer and a producer and creator and have that time and then bring it back and it's really great. Now we have such respect for our individual ways of writing and producing. And when Nick and I wrote our most recent album, we had like two different rooms going. So Nick was writing something with somebody and I had another room going, and we kind of like brought the best ofs and then came to the table and said, here's what I'm thinking, here's what I'm thinking, and we like kind of work together. We used to just argue our way through songwriting sessions, or everybody wants the chorus, you know, it's like I want the chorus. My voice sounds good on this, and we're like, oh, I really want to sing this because I kind of think it relates to something I'm going through more. And that was just like, now, it's quite nice that we're meeting each other really at the same place. You know, we're all fathers. We're all in this great place where like not it's not like one brother's like trying to find the next yacht party and one's like tucking you kids into bed. It's like really actually living the same place in our lives. And that makes a huge different when it comes to music. I think, yeah, yeah, and the new music it feels that lyrically and we can actually tell this grown up story and that's essential. Yeah, that's so exciting to hear, actually to hear about how if you're working in a team when you're in a similar place in life. Often there's a bit more empathy. There's been one understanding there. I think it's it's comparable to like any career path. Yeah. I mean if if you're writing a film with a good friend and one wants to write a love story and the other's like, no, I want to write a war film, and that's that's that. There's gonna be no love in it. It's like, definitely gonna be tough. Yeah, And so I think we felt that when we wrote songs, it'd be like one person's going through a heartbreak and the other one is like, well I just started seeing somebody. It's like, and I know that's really on the romance front, but that those heads budded. Yeah. Also, I've gotten the opportunity in the last couple of years to write music for film and TV. And I love putting a thinking cap on of somebody else. So playing it, I'm thinking as the character, Yeah, what would they feel and what so everything? During the lockdown, I wrote a song for an animated film called Rumble about like wrestling monsters, so putting putting on thinking cap of like all right, what would they sing about? And then just recently wrote a song for the film I shot last year, Devotion. The director about six months later asked me if I would be interested in writing the end credit songs. So I got to write with Ryan Tedter and harv who wrote he was Born of the Regime of Peaches for Justin Bieber, and I got my buddy Khalid a part of the song. And that was a really special experience because I also got to think about what it was like for the main character in the film and his relationship and how it was comparison to my relationship, and people that are just away from their families and friends a lot, and just what that feeling of you don't have to feel like you're alone. I'm always there for you, whether if it's spiritual or mentally. It takes that mindset. Yeah, I mean that was a lot of the crew for Voon. They were the ones that were part of our zen zone, right, So it's cool, it's really special. Yeah. I mean, actors, at least the actors I've run into. Meditation is so key on set. I mean when you're having even if it's like a split second where you have to get into character and just take a second and get it and be like all right, where am I? Where did I just come from? And it may sometimes be a little conversation in your own head. And I found it immensely helpful in scenes. Some of the tools you've given me that um I keep in my back pocket and I use whether it fits on stage or I'm about to hit a terrible golf shot, I can think about right breathing. Yeah, I can't improve anyone's golf game, then I can't even improve my owns. Yeah, that's yeah, my meditation doesn't Someone told me meditation and golf. Hey man, there's a book there. Yeah, that's when I when I get gonna go. With Master Class, you can learn from the world's best minds, anytime, anywhere, and at your own pace. You can learn songwriting from John Legend, entrepreneurship from Richard Branson, or even learn the power of personal branding from Chris Jenna. With over one hundred and eighty classes from a range of world class instructors, that thing you've always wanted to do is closer than you think. 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Give one annual membership and get one free Go to Masterclass dot com forward slash on purpose today. That's Masterclass dot com forward slash on purpose terms apply. But tell me about that transition, because I think, like you know, I've seen you on stage, You're a natural performer. Always. I always tell you, like I see these pictures come out and like, did you just remind me of Freddie Mercury, Who I Love right? Like who I Love Like? Queen was my favorite banks going up and and so any footage I've ever seen of watching Freddie Mercury live is just unbelievable. And so that comes very naturally to you've done it for a long time. What was it that even gave that shift? When I heard you acting? And because you'd just for everyone to realize too, you'd be on set, like you'd be in all these random locations then like logging into zen Zone on your phone and like, but what was what brought that transition about? Like where where did that impetus come from? Well? Like where did that excitement come from? Yeah? Well, when I was much younger, I always wanted to act. I always wanted to Like I always put on a show in our basement. I had the Joe Showed. It was like a talk show that I put on and imitated late night talk shows. And then there was a popular TV series on that Nickelodeon called All That that was like a kid's version of SNL and I wanted to be a part of that show. I was like, these kids are allowed to be wacky and fun on TV. This is amazing. And then years later, you know, doing stuff with Disney. We did camp Rock, and we always like dabbled in film and TV and I and I had opportunities along the way, but music was always my main focus, and that took up a lot of time and the limited amount of weeks or months of the year that I was making an album where I was a little bit quiet season We're still like, we're still working, and not until really the Lockdown, where I saw an opportunity of time and started auditioning and having conversations. I had a conversation with JD the director Devotion, which I just straight up told him, I'm like, look, I know I'm not the first choice. I get that simply because I don't have the credits to prove that I could do this. But I will work so hard for you. I will prove to you that I can do this. And I sent itself a tape in and it was a life changing experience. I mean, I'm lucky that I'm a part of a film like that, or I should say I'm very grateful that I'm a part of a film like that where I'm surrounded by such great talent and just soaking it up. I knew day. Once showing up on set, Jonathan Majors, who plays Jesse Brown, one of our leads of the film. I mean he was in character at the table read in his flight suit, and I was like, oh, okay, this is this is real, and I just felt so excited to just learn. And it's a bit of addictive because when you have somebody that is that in character all the time, it rubs off on you. So like all the other guys, we started dressing in nineteen fifties clothes and then we started like afterwards, I still was shaving every day like they were in the Navy, and I just like I loved that aspect of it where you really trying to dive in. Yeah, and you were working out a lot too, right, Like I swear during that movie you're like, well all these I'll tell you what I showed. I showed the day the fitting was. I showed up to set and I saw all these photos mostly just like shirtless photos of these actors, and I was like, oh, I need to get I need to get. Like I thought my two days was enough and I was like, I gotta and they were like looking at their ages and I was like, man, this guy's like sixty seven years younger than me. I was like, all right, I gotta keep up with these kids. But yeah, it inspired me. They like work out, and we did a lot of military training where we were like we were doing group runs and you know, just working out on set a lot because we're just sitting around and and I think that's why meditation really came in handy. Working out came at handy on set. What they don't tell you about being in these beautiful films is that there's a lot of downtime. Yeah, waiting around and if you're not number one or two on the call sheet, then you're probably just hanging out and waiting for them to be like we need you in the background. So a lot of time spent and I was just like built a little workout. Yeah, I built a gym in my back of my car essentially, and I just would and I had a shower so if I got sweaty, would just shower in the trailer and then get ready again. And meditation, I mean we do with end zones on set. We would do these zooms where we did meditation on set. It was really amazing. Where did that workout to come from? For you, because that's why I was too much earlier, right, Like you discipline, your ability to apply your mind, your consistency, Like those things are not always common because you know, especially when you're being autistic and creative, sometimes you need spontaneity and you sometimes just have like an autistic moment. But you've been able to balance the two. Like where did that work ethic develop? Like how early was that? When did that? Was that from parenting? Was that from the brothers? Like where did that come from? You know, I chopped some of it up to my parents. My parents they worked really hard. I mean I watched I didn't really click when my dad, you know, he was very much in debt, putting his energy focused money into the Brothers. When we started, I mean, the guy was like three four jobs. He was driving every day from New Jersey. You drive us to the city to record a song, drive us back. I mean it's like an hour each way if you're lucky and there's no traffic. And then on weekends he's a minister. It's just like wow, joking into a lot of hats and also cattering to like an entire church, and yeah, their stuff. So some of that and so I think just when it comes down to it, I just want to keep pushing myself. And I'm also I'm so grateful that I get to do what I love for living. Every day I wake up and write a gratitude list, and on that list, it's usually one of the top four things is I'm grateful that I get to do what I love for living every single day, especially when there's so many people out there and there's so much music constantly coming out, and on the acting side, there's so many great actors out there that are constantly you're you're seeing and to be a part of a film like that, or to have music pop up on Spotify New Music Friday or wherever it may be, I'm like, I am so immensely grateful that I get to do this and continue to get to do this, And that makes me want to work even much that much harder because I don't want to just say, Okay, you know what, the Brothers are big enough, We're playing these big venues. We're like, it's like, great, this is a nice paycheck. I'm you'll see me every year. Guys. It's like, no, I want to like, how do we make this? Like, how do we make the music better. How do we make or bigger, bigger meaning like sonically, and how do we how do we connect more with our fan base and where they're out in their life because they're growing up with us and they have And it feels so great when we can listen to the music and say, I'm so proud of this because it connects on so many different points and I'm all being a part of a film like devotion emotionally, a beautiful true story and other things that I'm working on. Just I try to make sure that I'm really passionate about it. Yeah, yeah, and that comes across. And I love that point you made about your parents. I mean I think about that often with my parents, who were both immigrants, and my mom moved to London when she was sixteen years old, which I can't imagine what that feels like. You know, English is not their first language, and then you're starting out from scratch like nothing. And then when I was she was like making us breakfast, me and my sister, dropping us to school, going to work, getting us picked up in the evening, making us dinner, like you know, just like taking care of us, and I just I always become my mum's work ethic, and I think that's I can I feel that similarity where I'm like, I worked this hard because I saw my mum worked that hardy like humble beginnings. It really is like, I'm really glad the way we grew up. Like I mean, there was a moment where all four boys or in one bedroom and four boys meaning our youngest at the time was the youngest brother was the baby, and we're like teenagers and we're starting this band. We play these big stages and go back and sleep in the same bedroom. And at the time I hated it because I was like, ah, but it's also now I'm like, that's what made me who I am today. And yeah, I think if it was a different situation, I don't know if I would be in the same mindset. Yeah, speaking about that though, Like one thing I've noticed with you from the time we have spend together and even with everyone else, whether it's online or offline, it's like you're super grounded. You make everyone feel comfortable around you. Like I remember when we were like hang out last year in New York, and you know, I'm always mindful. I'm like, are you sure you want to go there? Like you know, is you're gonna be surrounded by people, and like you were so cool when people came up, and you know, you could always bump into groups of people who are just happy to say hello to you. And you've always you seem very comfortable with obviously you've done it for a long time, but you're very comfortable with people. You're very easy with people. You're very grounded. I don't I don't notice ego and arrogance when I talk to you, and I see how you deal with your team, your friends, everyone in your life, and it's really beautiful to watch. And I really appreciate that because when I was in the monastery, it's like the most we were trained to believe that the most admirable quality in someone was humility. Like that was seen as like the crown jewel of all qualities, was if someone could be extremely accomplished but be humble, and that doesn't mean that they think they're worthless. It just means that they still treat everyone with respect. And I see that in you, and so I wonder was arrogance and ego ever a challenge? Was that ever? Or was that just obviously we'll have it when we're young and it goes away, or was it something that you got more used to with fame, Like how did I just want to hear your story with that, because I feel like, yeah, it's just special watching you where you are now and just how effelice it is. It's it's interesting because there's been definitely times I feel like I've been affected by the feeling of being on stage and feeling larger than life. At times, this feeling is like, you know, you're only way to put it as like the quarterback that wins the high school football game, like we're doing it every night on stage, that that energy and yeah, it's just it's trippy, you know, and I definitely can affect you. I am really grateful that I've had two guys to do this with. Um brothers keep you pretty accountable, and we stopped each other around a lot. I think that humble beginnings was also essential, like don't forget where you came from and all those things are so easy to just forget. Moved to LA and get a big house and like you're retired, like whatever, don't talk to me, I'm hiding out. And to each their own, I just I still don't know what the ingredient ones, but the magic ingredient was. But I think it's a bunch of different things. And I think also just getting older and like finding my own like happiness outside of the brothers, outside of music, outside of film or TV, just like on my own personal front of being able to you know, a bit of separate church and state in that sense where it's nice to just have something for myself and soap. And I am speaking to her obviously my wife for those who don't know what to talk about or who I'm talking about. You know, we were very particular with like sharing our relationships, so we didn't really post anything about a relationship till like we were engaged, like and it was nice for the first time to actually just have something for us, for me that I didn't feel like I need to share with the world. And um, I think you know she is also keeps me humble and accountable, and it's um been amazing to have a partner like her. I wind up my wife all the time. She's she does the same thing to me, Like my wife keeps me so helpful and so grounded, and so I'll wind her up by saying really egotistic things around her a whole time just to see actually reacts, and she never takes it as a joke. Like to her, it's like, you've got even joke about being arrogant. I can look in the mirror a certain way. Yeah, well I gotta looking selfiees A said, if I look at it, she's like, why are you doing that pout? Like what is wrong with Yeah? And she yeah, she'll she'll tell me straight up. She'd be like, they're not gonna work it with those shoes right, quote, Like yesterday I was like wow, planning on it. But and there's like obviously a lot of great things that come from it, yeah, things, But I think it's been really helpful to have outside of brothers, even like accountability when it comes to face, having a partner who's like supportive and also trustworthy and and you you know, has your back, but also will we'll keep your head on straight. Yeah, definitely. I couldn't agree more. I think about that all the time that I can't imagine how hard it is to create that. Obviously, Sophie has an incredible career herself as well, so it makes it somewhat more understanding. But I with my life, it's like I met rady before everything happened, and so it's been really wonderful to be understood in that way as well. Yeah, there's like a sense of challenge as well. Yeah, like as you're becoming this amazing influential person and there's so much coming at you, to have a support and obviously she also has an amazing career, but it's also to see both like do your thing and be supportive and like, you know, the days you can of the week that you don't get to see your partner, it's just stuff and so and now my life just work really hard so I can be home more. Yeah, and that's been something I've learned. You know that I I enjoy time off because I used to just be like I have a week off, Oh where what city am I going to? And now I'm like, I actually understand why it's nice to just chill. Right, You've got a door over children too to thank you. Just incredibly grateful to be a dad. Yeah, it's an amazing feeling. Yeah, what do you think you've learned by First We'll start with being in a relationship, Like what do you think you learned about yourself or something that you grew by being with Sophie that you didn't have before, Like a skill and ability, a mindset and approach to life. What came through that relationship with Sophie. That it's not some like cute relationship that you just you have. I've had my fun, I've dated before plenty, but what it's just so different with self is that that blew me away. It's just like the forgiveness the partner, the friend that I have, Like we're each other's best friends and we grow together. I mean, so many different amazing experiences that we've had in just five some years. It's just trippy to us. We're like, ohoh, we really have lived a life and it's just been amazing to like, at times save each other. You know, we've gone through so many heavy things together as a couple and individuals, and to know you have that support no matter what, it's just amazing. Yeah. I love hearing that. Man, it's beautiful. And yeah, I agree. There's so many things now you can go on and on about, but yeah, I feel the same way. Like when I met Robbie, It's like I don't think I ever knew what a genuine like understanding relationship look like. Like yeah, like I feel understood. Yeah, I remember there was a big moment in our relationship where we were had a rocky phase and I like called it off and she was understanding, and that blew my mind. Yeah, that somebody could be and you break up with someone and they understand and I panicked and got back what they're like right away. But it was the best of It was obviously the best decision ever. I was not the breakup part. That was the dumbest decision, but I realizing, like the fact that she would be supportive. I realized that this person is loves me so much that they were willing to put aside their stuff for me, And I'm like, what the like, how how could I ever lose that? Yeah? And as special, Yeah, it's really special, it's beautiful. What about what about with the kids? Are becoming a dad? Like that's another These are major life transitions, right like going from being with the brothers to then doing your solo thing, then coming to therapy figuring that out. Then you know, these are major life transitions. And I think I'm not a dad yet, so I'm always intrigued to get get dad tips. And I mean Willard joined many many meditations many zen zones, which is very sweet, but like, yeah, what what would you say have been the greatest lessons and that for you the biggest, Yeah, the biggest, the greatest. I mean, there's so many. I got amazing advice before I became a father. Just before becoming a parent, I reached out to like my favorite people that are parents and the ones that I really respect how they raised their kids. Had a lot of questions for them, but the biggest question was like, if you can give me one big piece of advice, And almost all of them and this sounds just kind of cliche, but they were just like, literally enjoy every moment because it moves by so fast. And I think about my own father and I'm thinking, I'm like, you know, he blinks, and I'm like, his sons are in his thirties, it's like most of his sons and it's just like, and I'm a big kid at heart, and I also like I encourage other parents to just be a big kid. Another person mentioned, you know, they watched their son. They watched this like somebody walked by with their child over a puddle and that parent was like, no, no, we don't jump in puddles and he was like, I never want to be that parent. I want to be the parent that like explores that because you know, there's plenty of clothes at home you can change into, and like that imagination is so important for young kids and I had that growing up, and I want to be like that. And I understand if you're on your way somewhere fancy whatever. I get. There's there's obviously times maybe jump into puddles, not always the best, but like the message there is, imagination is so key. And if I was ever held back from like being wacky and silly and putting a show on for my family or friends in my basement, I wouldn't be where I am today if I if I didn't love the music, if I didn't if I wasn't allowed to listen to music that I listened to, there's a lot of things and I don't get it. That's a big question. Those are I mean, it's a big comment. There are music, there are certain music I didn't get to listen to it growing up. But I will say, like it molded me to who I am today, and I think the imagination thing is so key. Yeah, No, I think that's a beautiful point and it's it's interesting how that's really coming out in child psychology now. Like everything you're saying, I think is true because we're seeing through the research that when kids are too limited or restricted or put into this like rule system of like this is right and this is wrong, and this is okay and this isn't like as a child, it definitely limits your understanding I mean, I mean, I mean actually interviewing a ton of people who are like child trauma experts or people who have like deeply studied that area, and it aligns with what you're saying. And so it's it's beautiful to hear that, and it's nice to hear that you had it and you continue to pass it on. Oh yeah, And I think one of the most amazing things I've done and I haven't framed at home. This is one of my first experiences in therapy, and the therapist asked me to write a letter to like essentially, they asked me to think about what I see when I when I'm like when you say okay, And I'm no therapist, so excuse me for presenting this in and you probably know this method, but I want you to write a letter to yourself as a kid knowing to think of that age. So for me, it was between ages like seven and ten. And they're like, all right now, like I want you to like look at it. There was an empty chair. I want you to look at the empty chair and really visualize yourself, like visualize yourself, like what are you wearing, how's your hair? Look are you what are you playing with? Are you like sitting there? Are you? Are you nervous? You distracted? I'm like I can see myself essentially. And then I wrote a letter to myself and like to my younger self like yeah, you know, like maybe don't date this person whatever, just like funny little things to even like personal things, like it's okay to like be a weirdo, like you get picked for that. That's cool, and one day those guys are going to come to your concert like whatever, Like just funny things. And then I wrote a letter to myself as an adult but as of the eight year old self, and I couldn't get through the letter. I mean, I'm bawling, crying trying to write this letter. And I wrote it with my hand. I'm not strong. I'm not very strong with so I wrote my left hand. So it's really squib like squiggily and oh I have the letter of frame to my house and it's just such a great reminder to to be a kid at heart and to like not be too hard on ourselves. Ye, we're all big kids at the end of the day, trying to figure this crazy thing called life out. Yeah, totally. I love that exercise. I think it's such an important one and it's like everyone should definitely do that. Oh it's amazing. I mean I found it to be an emotional thing. Some people find it to be the funning game, but whatever it is, I loved it and I passed it on. Yeah, no, I think it's so I think so powerful. One are other things that we've talked about meditation, of course, and I'd love to know more of your practice now as well. But what are some other habits that you've picked up along the way. It sounds like you're a collector of like definitely, yeah, you know, like, yeah, I like to think I'm a collected gratitude list. You talked about this letter to kids, we talked about meditation, Like, what are some of the other collections from other people? That's good, But I think the most recent are direct the director of the Votion JD Right above his monitors, he had what do you want them to feel? And I just fell in love with that little quote and I wrote it on a mirror in the dressing room um that we traveled with, so it wasn't just writing on some BACKSTA like left it for everyone, and that really helps me before I go onto stage, like what do I want them to feel? Especially after like a long day. Let's say your voice is tired, you're mentally drained, or you're like all right, we're playing the same show, like gotta find like like what about? And then that always reminds me. I'm like, there's somebody out there that's their favorite song or look for that person? Or if I'm tired, like these people spend all their day getting ready for today, like I want them to. Like if I went to a concert and I it takes me a lot to go see a show because I'm like, all right, this has got to be somebody I really want to see. Yeah, you want to see that? What you think is that you want to leave going? That was amazing? Like how do I bring that for them? And same like what do you want to the field? And it's really powerful. So I've taken that along the way. My morning routine is I think pretty locked in now. My streaks are pretty good on my meditation app so like i'd pretty much wake up and the first thing I do is meditate. Sometimes it's like a moving meditation where I'm like, I can be brushing my teeth or doing something, but I'm like in silence and I'm just kind of walking through the steps. And then I write a gratitude list and it's anywhere from I'm grateful for the beautiful morning, I'm grateful for a couple of coffee, this and keep me going to like a larger thing. I'm grateful for my health, like the fact that I get to be able to walk on them two feet and do this, and obviously the list goes on, and then working on my Italian So I really don't quiz me, but I'm slowly slowly working on that. What's the why Italian specific? Right? We want to Italy on our honeymoon, and I just did not like that. I had to like be my hands were held by our translator the whole trip. So I'm on this romantic trip and then I'm like, do you mind asking if they have anymore, and I'm just just like embarrassed, but also like I took that and was like I want to go back here on our own and like not have to have anybody helping us out. It was like that brought me and then just it is amazing, Yeah it is. I love to learn more. I love that. I love what you were saying earlier, because I think that mindset for anyone who's performing, anyone who's done this for a long time, Like you know, I think a lot of people or most people who don't know me well, don't know that. I started speaking on stages and at events when I was eighteen years old, and so I'd done what I'd done for ten years before anyone cared or knew what it was. And when I hear what you're saying, it's like when you've done it for that long. I became more grateful when people actually cared, because I was like, I would do this for ten years. I'm like five people showed up, and so you know, when you start doing it and more people care and more people are interested, you become more grateful. But there was something beautiful. There was an interview with Vanessa Bryant, Kobe's Bran's wife after he passed away, and she was telling a story. Actually, I think she was giving a speech, and she told this conversation that she had with Kobe, and she said that, you know, people always asked Kobe why he played when he was injured, or a lot of people didn't know that he played when he was injured. But every time I'd ask him why he played when he was injured, it said that I'd played because that person has saved up to come and watch one game, and they want me to play in that game. They came to watch me, and if I don't play, then they won't have got to see me, and they may not be able to afford to go to another game ever again. And so I'm going to play even if I'm injured. And every time I think about that, and it's exactly what I heard in the essence of what you were saying that it's like people have come here to see us. It's like, what do you want them to feel like? When you live in that way, it's like every show becomes it's your first time, right, It feels that way because it's that person's first time, even if it's not yours. And I think that mindset is so beautiful and so especially when you see it across all these amazing people who who perform for a living, who are doing this week in week out, and the fact that you share that it speaks volumes for anyone out there who's wanting a career in this light, whatever it may be, any career that's on stage. You've got to have that in your hat because otherwise think it's really boring, really unfulfilling, and really dry really quickly. So anyway, you reminded me of that. That's a beautiful story. Yeah, I had to share it. What a legend he had found strength even when he's injured. Just it's amazing. Yeah, it's amazing. But I like that, what do you want to make people feel? I think that that's such a great way to live, Like you've just given a mundre for life, Like even if you're not a performance, I feel like it's just in general being more present with somebody. I mean, you know, there's there's times feel like you can't really even bring a lot to the table literally dinner table. Somebody calls you say, hey, you want to get dinner tonight, and you've been running running running, You're like, I don't think I can give you one hundred percent of myself mentally or physically, even like just to be in your presence, Like I just it's okay to give you the rain checks. I'm passed on the rain checks. Sometimes you're just like I I want you to be able to have my full attention, and I try to put that to play more often. How have you managed to keep so many good relationships? Like during this busy career, a hector career, Like it's most people end up becoming lonely and successful, right, And when we did Zen Zone, I got to meet all these wonderful human beings. And it wasn't just people in the industry. Like it wasn't like a I just sent a note out and whoever comes. It's like, these are people that know you and you know, and like when we would talk and like you know, there would be banter back and forth and you could tell that there was a real relationship. Of course, there's bandmates, there's there's people, but it's like, how have you managed I'm intrigued by that idea because I think it's less common and I think it's fascinating that it's not just the amount. First of all, you have a quantity of relationships as well, but they're also quality as well, Like what did you do to do that? I've had the same kind of friend crew for a long time. Like the older you get, your your friends gets tighter, some of which, like you said, I'm lucky that I get to work with some of my friends. I mean that's sometimes a dangerous game, but I think we've worked long enough where we've like we're still friends even if we've gone and done different career paths and come back together. But I think it's been essential just to get I think, and I always need FaceTime and I don't mean by FaceTime on the phone, and like literally FaceTime with that person or people, And I think it's really important for the relationship and just checking in, you know. I think it's so interesting how somebody gave me this device years ago. When we see our friends like going through something we know they're going through, they've lost in the family, or a situation that's pretty heavy, and we usually you think, like I don't want to bother them right now, And a lot of people are thinking that more than you would think. And how easy it is to pick up the phone or just shoot a text. Um. I've been trying to implement implement that a little bit more. I'm still not great at it, but I definitely know that, Like it's something that I have felt on the other side and I'm going through something kind of heavy, and like people might go like, I just want to give them space maybe they need. Maybe I shouldn't pretend like I know what it's like. It's somewhat nice to to be reached out to or to reach out. That's beautiful, man, And I know you do that. I think that's the thing. When I'm sitting in this interview and the whole time, I've been thinking, like, this guy actually does everything he's saying he does, and it's I genuinely respect it. It's it's so hard to really walk your talk. It's so hard to like really emphasize every you know. I remember even you know, just when when we were traveling together last year for that couple of the shows, and it was just, you know, you were going through so many family things as well in between, yeah, and I'd say you were constantly there in available and trying to make sure, you know, trying to figure it out and like that was what you guys were talking about, Like you know, it's a you could tell just how much love and how much which connection there was there with you know, with family and when when you look at family, family is obviously such a central pillar to your life, like in every sense of the word, the brothers, your parents, your your wife, your kids. You know, like the fact that the crew family, the team family. Like if you had to give not advice, but your reflection on like what keeps family to get together despite so many differences, despite doing business together? Like what have you? What have you come up with? Because there has to be something that keeps someone after all this time, like inspired to keep family together when it and it's not just business, right, it's more than that. I think we learned a while back that if it's just business twenty four or seven, which it was, like, it would implode, which it did. We broke up as a band and we wanted pretty much nothing to do with each other for a while. And when we decided to get back together as a band, there was a lot of like, all right, we have a lot to work through, and we did. But once we stepped back into this crazy world of what we do we made sure that we try to take some time just for us as brothers, as a family, like go on trips together, like let's that's men, not let's not talk about work. And it's weird because work is also like what we love, so music does come up. But there are moments where were like, let's just go ski together, Let's go play golf. I mean, golf, it's kind of our It's the one thing I guess we all can relate on. I'm not. I mean, we just went play golf and nickspert the I mean, this guy can plays like thirty six holes in one day and then he's like, all right, cool, we're gonna do that seven am tomorrow. I'm like, buddy, I need a break. So we have hobbies outside of work that I think that's essential for us, and even like with my parents and stuff like just hanging out. You know, let's just let's let's challenge each other without talking about business, because we're like in a business with our dad at times. We're in and out always like it always we can't help ourselves because we all love music, we all love what we do. We love supporting each other. But it is nice to say, you know, what let's just not talk about. Let's just do something as a family or as friends, as brothers and keep that relationship healthy as much as we can. Yeah, Joe, You've been so generous with your time. When everyone who's listening and watching to know that it's currently Friday night and it's eight twenty four pm. Joe's had a busy day. Tomorrow you're performing at Global Citizen. It's me really exciting Global Citizen at Central Park. I've never played the show, and yeah, I mean quite the flex. I mean, I mean, what a great cause. And I'm getting texts like you're playing Central Park tomorrow. I'm like, maybe, but I'm really excited to show the stage with some of these legendary acts. I can always say that I played a show with Metallica. Yeah. I never thought i'd be saying that. Yeah, it's awesome, but no, I'm so grateful for your time. Is there anything that I haven't asked you that you really wanted to share or something that was only a hot online and you're like, oh, I really wanted to talk about this, but I didn't. I feel like you did. We kind of tapped into it a little bit on like the Daily practices, But one thing I've recently done, I find I kind of stole from Greg over there, which has been helpful. Actually, I like recently deleted social media off my phone. Oh wow, it's been like and I'll still like download Instagram occasionally just to check in on messages because it's like literally a new email at this point. But I it's been nice because I just needed the break, and it's been really helpful to be present with my friends and family. And I know there's other ways of doing it. I'm not saying it's bad for you. I mean there's there's other ways of of like setting the alarms and timers, but for me to don't even have it on my phone, I'll tell you what. I'm just like so much more aware and the and goes to the full circle like being present with my friends. I'm just like way more like in it, which has been really nice. I love that, and that's and that's hard. But the only thing I miss is like a couple of funny memes my friends will send me. Other than that, I feel like I'm pretty like aware, which is nice. Yeah, yeah, I mean, and I've been loving all the spontaneous tiktoks oh, yeah, a lot of fun. Yeah, I can't. I'll get back on there eventually. UM. I love that I can showcase that person my wacky personality. Like I got more people coming up to me on the street these days thaying I like your TikTok than your music, And I'm like, all right. I was doing an interview the other day and I'm set outside having coffee and as young lady came up and just like excuse me, and I was like, this is perfect timing. I'm about to do an interview. And she's like, I love your TikTok. Not unexpected, but I appreciate it. I appreciate it. And then I was like, I guess I should ask about your TikTok. That's awesome. I love that. Man. No, and I'm glad you shared that. I think it's so important to take these breaks to disconnect, to be present. But we end every interview with the final five, and these are fast five, so one word to one sentence maximum. So you've got to be on your toes, which you're very good at. So here are your final five, Joe Journas. The first question is what is the best advice you've ever received? There's a lot. I mean, I think this has been essential for growing up. Our dad always said, live like you're at the bottom bottom, even if you're at the top, not saying it, but the top. And I never was. But I think I've gotten a place where I could be feeling myself and that's been that brought. That's a great people back to humble beginning conversation. That's a great piece of advice. All right, we never had that on the show. I love it. Question number two, what's the worst advice you've ever heard? This isn't going to hurt? And then I got my first tattoo. That's true. Yeah, that was bad advice. I like that, all right. Question number three, what's something you used to value that you don't value anymore? And maybe it's just for the time being, but social media. I mean I'd taken this break. I realized it's really needed for my life, taking a little time off and just nice to be aware in present. And so I thought that was like forty minutes of my day in the day, just scrolling myself to be, you know, to bed being like now I'm dreaming about goats laughing on a mountain. Why U great dream? But you know, it's like I can just go to bed, Yeah, it's huge. That's a huge one, or wake up and not feel like anxiety from seeing some craziness. It's just nice to be like present and aware or being like jealous. You're not somewhere in the world with these people that you sometimes see. You're like, Okay, I'm with myself or my friends, people that I love. It's quite nice. That's a beautiful, beautiful description. All right. Question number four is how would you define your current purpose. I think to just be open to learning and growing. I think I realize that what I do is really incredible because I can make people feel a certain way and conduct a crowd in a sense. And I'm one of many but you that get that opportunity, and I know how how great of an opportunity that is. And so yeah, I think my purpose is to make people feel Yeah, hopefully good. Definitely more emotional at times for the song. Definitely good, definitely good. Fifteen final question, if you could create one law that everyone in the world had to follow, what would it be, be nicer to everyone, be nice for people. Yeah, we definitely need that. Let me do we definitely need that. Yeah, you're the many. Thank you so much for doing this. Thank you so grateful. No, I'm so grateful you did this. I know we could go on for I know we can do it for hours a lot. This is one of ten, this is this is the first time. This is the first one you have come on any time one. Yeah, I would love to. Yeah, You're got to come on an it and I'm so great for you came one. I wanted to document this chapter of our journey together too, so that every time we can do it and look back and yeah, I watched a little screening remember when, Yeah, why was I wearing that? Yeah, maybe I'll no, yeah, but I love that. Thank you man, Thank thank you so much everyone who's been listening and watching back at home. I hope you enjoyed this episode. I think there were so many great insights, exercises, tips from Joe. I want to make sure that you Joe's not on social media, but you can tag him anyway so that he knows when. But please tag Joe and I on TikTok, on Instagram, on Twitter, whatever you're using, so that we can see what you learned, what you took away, what you're practicing. I hope that you're going to put some of these great insights and tips into practice for yourself. And I hope you got to know Joe a little more deeply and a little more through my lens and through my eyes in the way that I've got to know him. So thank you so much for listening and watching. I hope you shared this with a ton of friends, and a big thank you to Joe, and a big thank you to each and every one of you.