I'm honest enough to be on your podcast today to tell you that I still get stuck here sometimes. I probably never said it this honestly, but this is the podcast to be that real about it is that I have just.

I'm honest enough to be on your podcast today to tell you that I still get stuck here sometimes. I probably never said it this honestly, but this is the podcast to be that real about it is that I have just.

He's a crossover artist and we'll waste them one multi genre multi plata really wrong. You went to jail for an armed robbery at fifteen? Have you ever thought about what you'd say to that person if you met them?

He's a crossover artist and we'll waste them one multi genre multi plata really wrong. You went to jail for an armed robbery at fifteen? Have you ever thought about what you'd say to that person if you met them?

I guess it's the best question I've ever been asked. I've avoided this question.

I guess it's the best question I've ever been asked. I've avoided this question.

Do you truly believe that you're a horrible person? I can't imagine you're having a horrible heart weird throw to announce that we've reached three million subscribers. We're incredibly grateful for each and every one of you. If you enjoyed this episode, don't forget to hit that subscribe button so you never miss out on any of our new releases. We're dedicated to bringing you the content you love. Our team carefully analyzes what resonates most with you to bring on board the best experts and storytellers to help you and prove your life. Some of your favorite topics are sleep, science, weight loss, physical fitness, navigating breakups, habit building, and understanding toxic relationships. Upcoming episodes include one of the biggest names in health and science world, renowned relationship therapist, and your favorite manifestation expert is back to drop new findings. Hit Subscribe to not miss any of these episodes. If you think of someone who would love this episode, send it to them to make their day.

Do you truly believe that you're a horrible person? I can't imagine you're having a horrible heart weird throw to announce that we've reached three million subscribers. We're incredibly grateful for each and every one of you. If you enjoyed this episode, don't forget to hit that subscribe button so you never miss out on any of our new releases. We're dedicated to bringing you the content you love. Our team carefully analyzes what resonates most with you to bring on board the best experts and storytellers to help you and prove your life. Some of your favorite topics are sleep, science, weight loss, physical fitness, navigating breakups, habit building, and understanding toxic relationships. Upcoming episodes include one of the biggest names in health and science world, renowned relationship therapist, and your favorite manifestation expert is back to drop new findings. Hit Subscribe to not miss any of these episodes. If you think of someone who would love this episode, send it to them to make their day.

The number one health and wellness podcast.

The number one health and wellness podcast.

Jay Setty, Jay Sheetty.

Jay Setty, Jay Sheetty.

Je.

Je.

Hey, everyone, welcome back to On Purpose, the place you come to become happier, healthier, and more healed. Today's guest is someone that I have been dying to have on the show ever since the moment I saw him perform live and I got to give him a big hug the day after. This guest's story is truly unbelievable, truly inspiring, truly spectacular. I'm speaking about the award winning, Grammy nominated Nashville native singer songwriter Jelly Roll, who debuted top three on the Billboard two hundred All Genre chart and number two on the top Country album charts with his debut country album, and it earned him the biggest country debut album in Billboard Consumption chart. History. Jelly Roll was nominated for Best New Artist and Best Duo Group Performance for Save Me with Landy Wilson at the twenty twenty four Grammy Awards, a four times winner at the twenty twenty three People's Choice Country Awards, and the most nominated male at the twenty twenty three CMO Awards with five total nominations, capturing his first CMO Award for New Artists of the Year for the twenty twenty four CMO Awards. Jelly Roll was just nominated this morning for Entertainer of the Year, Album of the Year, and Male Vocalist of the Year. Jelly Roll is set to least his new album, Beautifully Broken, on October eleventh and launch his Beautifully Broken Tour on August twenty seventh. Welcome to on Purpose, Jelly Role.

Hey, everyone, welcome back to On Purpose, the place you come to become happier, healthier, and more healed. Today's guest is someone that I have been dying to have on the show ever since the moment I saw him perform live and I got to give him a big hug the day after. This guest's story is truly unbelievable, truly inspiring, truly spectacular. I'm speaking about the award winning, Grammy nominated Nashville native singer songwriter Jelly Roll, who debuted top three on the Billboard two hundred All Genre chart and number two on the top Country album charts with his debut country album, and it earned him the biggest country debut album in Billboard Consumption chart. History. Jelly Roll was nominated for Best New Artist and Best Duo Group Performance for Save Me with Landy Wilson at the twenty twenty four Grammy Awards, a four times winner at the twenty twenty three People's Choice Country Awards, and the most nominated male at the twenty twenty three CMO Awards with five total nominations, capturing his first CMO Award for New Artists of the Year for the twenty twenty four CMO Awards. Jelly Roll was just nominated this morning for Entertainer of the Year, Album of the Year, and Male Vocalist of the Year. Jelly Roll is set to least his new album, Beautifully Broken, on October eleventh and launch his Beautifully Broken Tour on August twenty seventh. Welcome to on Purpose, Jelly Role.

Yes, as you kept reading off, I was getting nervous. I was like, that's wow, this is all associated with me.

Yes, as you kept reading off, I was getting nervous. I was like, that's wow, this is all associated with me.

Oh, it's beautiful to see it. And you know you just said to me outside, you said, did you ever dream of this? And I said to you, no, I didn't dream of it, and you were saying it was the same back And I just want to take folks back to how we connected because I went to Clive Davis's pre Grammy party. That was the first time I've ever seen you perform, and I was just like, who is this guy? Like, that's a hard party to perform at. I feel there's short segments, it's moving fast, there's so much going on, and you came on stage and you had everyone in raptures. I remember like MGK was bopping a lit that stood on his chair on his table, like everyone was rocking out to you, and I was thinking, you had everyone in there, fully present, fully locked in. It was beautiful. So I posted it. I took a video, posted it. I thought nothing of it. I was just like, this guy's amazing. Can't way to follow his work, listen to more of his music? And then you DM me back and I was just taken away because you said you were aware of my work and you'd read think like a monk had a really low time in your life, and I was like, I was genuinely humbled. I was like, no way. I was like, I didn't have a clue that you knew who I was. And I was just so grateful and I wanted to ask you. They're like, how did you even get think like a monk? How did you find on purpose? Like what was the low time in your life that it found you out?

Oh, it's beautiful to see it. And you know you just said to me outside, you said, did you ever dream of this? And I said to you, no, I didn't dream of it, and you were saying it was the same back And I just want to take folks back to how we connected because I went to Clive Davis's pre Grammy party. That was the first time I've ever seen you perform, and I was just like, who is this guy? Like, that's a hard party to perform at. I feel there's short segments, it's moving fast, there's so much going on, and you came on stage and you had everyone in raptures. I remember like MGK was bopping a lit that stood on his chair on his table, like everyone was rocking out to you, and I was thinking, you had everyone in there, fully present, fully locked in. It was beautiful. So I posted it. I took a video, posted it. I thought nothing of it. I was just like, this guy's amazing. Can't way to follow his work, listen to more of his music? And then you DM me back and I was just taken away because you said you were aware of my work and you'd read think like a monk had a really low time in your life, and I was like, I was genuinely humbled. I was like, no way. I was like, I didn't have a clue that you knew who I was. And I was just so grateful and I wanted to ask you. They're like, how did you even get think like a monk? How did you find on purpose? Like what was the low time in your life that it found you out?

It's funny, man.

It's funny, man.

So in twenty nineteen, my father passed away in March of twenty nineteen. He got sick in January of twenty nineteen, and I had spent the last three months of his life with him and every day because it was kind of one of those really kind of slow ninety data clients and I was coming out of.

So in twenty nineteen, my father passed away in March of twenty nineteen. He got sick in January of twenty nineteen, and I had spent the last three months of his life with him and every day because it was kind of one of those really kind of slow ninety data clients and I was coming out of.

That really really struggling.

That really really struggling.

And about a year later, I had gained like sixty or seventy pounds back right, because I'd lost a lot of weight at the time and I just felt it weighing on me. And we were going into COVID at that point too, and I had discovered you on YouTube and I think this, I don't remember when did you launch on purpose? Because I think this was yeah, yeah, So I just discovered the pod and I was watching just like the initial stuff, like I got into the super earlier stuff where you were just like direct to camera stuff before the pod, and then I was like, I should read this book. So my wife knows. Side note, I've always been obsessed with monks and like that whole. I live a very chaotic life, and I maybe romanticize this idea of disappearing too the mountains for a year and refiguring my life out Unlike every other kid that watched Dumb and Dumber, you know what I'm just saying, it's like, you.

And about a year later, I had gained like sixty or seventy pounds back right, because I'd lost a lot of weight at the time and I just felt it weighing on me. And we were going into COVID at that point too, and I had discovered you on YouTube and I think this, I don't remember when did you launch on purpose? Because I think this was yeah, yeah, So I just discovered the pod and I was watching just like the initial stuff, like I got into the super earlier stuff where you were just like direct to camera stuff before the pod, and then I was like, I should read this book. So my wife knows. Side note, I've always been obsessed with monks and like that whole. I live a very chaotic life, and I maybe romanticize this idea of disappearing too the mountains for a year and refiguring my life out Unlike every other kid that watched Dumb and Dumber, you know what I'm just saying, it's like, you.

Know, like maybe this will work.

Know, like maybe this will work.

So when I read it, and it was a really big transition for me, my father had just died. I thought my purpose had been taken away from me because to that point, music to me was a donkey to get to people, right, and that was taken away. I couldn't get to people the way I used to get to people. I was used to doing two hundred bar shows a year. So I'm trying to grieve my father and I'm going through this and we're all going through this national pandemic together. And of course the fear of it initially was really strong as well. And that was kind of that season of life that I got introduced to mister Jay shetty Man.

So when I read it, and it was a really big transition for me, my father had just died. I thought my purpose had been taken away from me because to that point, music to me was a donkey to get to people, right, and that was taken away. I couldn't get to people the way I used to get to people. I was used to doing two hundred bar shows a year. So I'm trying to grieve my father and I'm going through this and we're all going through this national pandemic together. And of course the fear of it initially was really strong as well. And that was kind of that season of life that I got introduced to mister Jay shetty Man.

It was really really cool because.

It was really really cool because.

I've always believed that what we put in our body comes out, and that's a lot deeper than just what we eat or drink. I think it's what we consume. You know, if I'm watching a bunch of murder mysteries, I'll feel a certain kind of anxiety if I watch them for a month straight. You know, if I'm listening to, if I'm listening to On Purpose or Doctor Despenser, these people that I look up to, Cuberman, you know, these guys that I think are just great.

I've always believed that what we put in our body comes out, and that's a lot deeper than just what we eat or drink. I think it's what we consume. You know, if I'm watching a bunch of murder mysteries, I'll feel a certain kind of anxiety if I watch them for a month straight. You know, if I'm listening to, if I'm listening to On Purpose or Doctor Despenser, these people that I look up to, Cuberman, you know, these guys that I think are just great.

You know what I mean.

You know what I mean.

Then I'm always putting out better stuff. So yeah, you have no clue how much your art helped me, and in exchange, I think my art's been able to help people. It's funny how iron sharpens iron without us even knowing each other. You know what I mean that I was being inspired by what you were saying and what you were doing.

Then I'm always putting out better stuff. So yeah, you have no clue how much your art helped me, and in exchange, I think my art's been able to help people. It's funny how iron sharpens iron without us even knowing each other. You know what I mean that I was being inspired by what you were saying and what you were doing.

Now, what you're doing is so inspiring. I mean, whenever I'm hearing you any music you put out, I'm like, I can pray to this, I can meditate to this, you know, I can dance to this. It's real heart music and soul music. And for me hearing that from you and the big hug you gave me at the Grammys, I was feeling so much love and so thank you because knowing that someone who was having such an incredible impact that I had somehow been connected to your life was really profound. But you spoke about your father then losing your father, What was your relationship like with him up until that point, and what was what walk us through that moment of losing him and what that felt like?

Now, what you're doing is so inspiring. I mean, whenever I'm hearing you any music you put out, I'm like, I can pray to this, I can meditate to this, you know, I can dance to this. It's real heart music and soul music. And for me hearing that from you and the big hug you gave me at the Grammys, I was feeling so much love and so thank you because knowing that someone who was having such an incredible impact that I had somehow been connected to your life was really profound. But you spoke about your father then losing your father, What was your relationship like with him up until that point, and what was what walk us through that moment of losing him and what that felt like?

He was He was like, really, we were really really close when I was a really troubled juvenile. My father was an alcoholic, My mother had her own struggles, and we wasn't as close whenever I was a kid because I was just so rebellious in spirit. But as I got in my twenties and finally got out of that revolving cycle of the judicial system, me and him started really getting close and I started leaning on him, and we would go to happy Hour three or four days a week, every day, and we'd go sit at the same spot at the same bar and the mumber and Street in Nashville called the ten Roufe from four to six.

He was He was like, really, we were really really close when I was a really troubled juvenile. My father was an alcoholic, My mother had her own struggles, and we wasn't as close whenever I was a kid because I was just so rebellious in spirit. But as I got in my twenties and finally got out of that revolving cycle of the judicial system, me and him started really getting close and I started leaning on him, and we would go to happy Hour three or four days a week, every day, and we'd go sit at the same spot at the same bar and the mumber and Street in Nashville called the ten Roufe from four to six.

And he was such an impactful man.

And he was such an impactful man.

Later in his life, he really started becoming enriched in his community in his church, helped with the Room and the End program for the homeless every Thursday. I mean, he just was a but he also kind of taught me that duality of man because he'd still throw one back and party. He wasn't like a square, you know, but he was like it was cool. So he kind of encouraged me, and we were really close. And he was one of those situations, Jay, that I didn't see it coming and he didn't either. We all thought he was good. I knew he was getting older. He was probably about seventy six, but he was still sharp as attack. And it kind of out of nowhere, he got a really he thought he just got sick, and it turned out that he'd had leukemia for a few years and just never even really checked on it. But he was one of them old tough dudes that never went to the doctor, didn't believe in you know. He was one of those guys that Grandpa's cough syrup in a good sweat will get any cold out of you know, drink a little burbon and go to sleep.

Later in his life, he really started becoming enriched in his community in his church, helped with the Room and the End program for the homeless every Thursday. I mean, he just was a but he also kind of taught me that duality of man because he'd still throw one back and party. He wasn't like a square, you know, but he was like it was cool. So he kind of encouraged me, and we were really close. And he was one of those situations, Jay, that I didn't see it coming and he didn't either. We all thought he was good. I knew he was getting older. He was probably about seventy six, but he was still sharp as attack. And it kind of out of nowhere, he got a really he thought he just got sick, and it turned out that he'd had leukemia for a few years and just never even really checked on it. But he was one of them old tough dudes that never went to the doctor, didn't believe in you know. He was one of those guys that Grandpa's cough syrup in a good sweat will get any cold out of you know, drink a little burbon and go to sleep.

Sleep in a hot room with two blankets.

Sleep in a hot room with two blankets.

You'll be like, oh, like penitentiary dudes, it'll just try to sweat colds out.

You'll be like, oh, like penitentiary dudes, it'll just try to sweat colds out.

It's like, just sweat it out.

It's like, just sweat it out.

So those last ninety days were really cool for me, Jay, because I got to really spend the time with him. Like when he got sick that day, I showed up to his house, I put him in my car and drove him to the hospital closest to my house. And I got to drive up there every morning and hang out with him all day is you know, all the way until the end. And it was really cool because he taught me how to live, and he also taught me how to die. And uh, because man, he did it like a gangster. He did it just the way I thought my father would do it, you know, not a tear in his eye, not not not a worry in his face, just just a man of faith that was just kind of ready to go, you know.

So those last ninety days were really cool for me, Jay, because I got to really spend the time with him. Like when he got sick that day, I showed up to his house, I put him in my car and drove him to the hospital closest to my house. And I got to drive up there every morning and hang out with him all day is you know, all the way until the end. And it was really cool because he taught me how to live, and he also taught me how to die. And uh, because man, he did it like a gangster. He did it just the way I thought my father would do it, you know, not a tear in his eye, not not not a worry in his face, just just a man of faith that was just kind of ready to go, you know.

But it was but it hurt, you know, it hurt hard.

But it was but it hurt, you know, it hurt hard.

Was there a lesson or something he said at that time or was it just the way he was, just the.

Was there a lesson or something he said at that time or was it just the way he was, just the.

Way he dealt with it.

Way he dealt with it.

He Uh, he was, I think not even what he said. One thing he said, I'll never forget. That was funny, but it stuck with me. Was the nurse came in to give him his pain pills or whatever medicine it was, and he chewed it. It was a whole tough just swallowed it. I said that don't bother you, and he was just just as quick as he could say it. He said, sometime when the pills too hard to swallow, you just got to chew it right.

He Uh, he was, I think not even what he said. One thing he said, I'll never forget. That was funny, but it stuck with me. Was the nurse came in to give him his pain pills or whatever medicine it was, and he chewed it. It was a whole tough just swallowed it. I said that don't bother you, and he was just just as quick as he could say it. He said, sometime when the pills too hard to swallow, you just got to chew it right.

Stuck with me good, it's like.

Stuck with me good, it's like.

And I thought about that because I was like, that's so much bigger than just this particular moment, you know what I mean. But he was always full of those little one liner wisdoms. That's kind of how it was. He was the opposite of me. I'll talk to everybody a lot. My dad was very kind of reserved, and when he spoke, it really counted, you know what I mean.

And I thought about that because I was like, that's so much bigger than just this particular moment, you know what I mean. But he was always full of those little one liner wisdoms. That's kind of how it was. He was the opposite of me. I'll talk to everybody a lot. My dad was very kind of reserved, and when he spoke, it really counted, you know what I mean.

And what about your mother, because I've heard that sheilds she was dealing with her own mental health challenges when you were growing up. What was that experience like of you know, having a father that was this way? And then what was she like? And was she complimenting who he was? And how does she impact you?

And what about your mother, because I've heard that sheilds she was dealing with her own mental health challenges when you were growing up. What was that experience like of you know, having a father that was this way? And then what was she like? And was she complimenting who he was? And how does she impact you?

They were polar opposite. She was she struggled with drugs and just real mental health stuff. She started becoming really reclusive. There was a twenty year period in my life that I didn't see my mother outside of a nightgown, but maybe twice ever you know, I just never seen her come out of her room very much more or less out of our house. And I didn't understand anything about drugs at the time or mental health, but she really really struggled with that. But I connected music with her mental health right because the few times when she was out of that bedroom and at that kitchen table, she was thriving. I mean it was like and she would hold court and she was so special in how she dealt with people and she's still like this that she would come downstairs and sit at that table and it was almost like a light shot out at the top of the house. The whole family would come into the table. We wouldn't talk about it. We just like you would just see them start to Neighbors would start to come over, her girlfriends would start to pull up. She'd start playing music, smoking cigarettes, telling stories, talking shit, holding court at the kitchen table, and it'd be like a group of us have her four girlfriends sitting around the table. We'd all be standing around them some I mean like it was like a crowd trying to just just take anything she'd give us.

They were polar opposite. She was she struggled with drugs and just real mental health stuff. She started becoming really reclusive. There was a twenty year period in my life that I didn't see my mother outside of a nightgown, but maybe twice ever you know, I just never seen her come out of her room very much more or less out of our house. And I didn't understand anything about drugs at the time or mental health, but she really really struggled with that. But I connected music with her mental health right because the few times when she was out of that bedroom and at that kitchen table, she was thriving. I mean it was like and she would hold court and she was so special in how she dealt with people and she's still like this that she would come downstairs and sit at that table and it was almost like a light shot out at the top of the house. The whole family would come into the table. We wouldn't talk about it. We just like you would just see them start to Neighbors would start to come over, her girlfriends would start to pull up. She'd start playing music, smoking cigarettes, telling stories, talking shit, holding court at the kitchen table, and it'd be like a group of us have her four girlfriends sitting around the table. We'd all be standing around them some I mean like it was like a crowd trying to just just take anything she'd give us.

You know.

You know.

But that's where my love for music came in, because imagine you're ten years old and you don't see your mother in a healthy space very much. But when she seems her healthiest, there's always music playing. There's always this record player, there's always and I always tell the story, Jada, it was that you're old enough to remember this era that we didn't have Google, we didn't have a bunch of thesauruses, so.

But that's where my love for music came in, because imagine you're ten years old and you don't see your mother in a healthy space very much. But when she seems her healthiest, there's always music playing. There's always this record player, there's always and I always tell the story, Jada, it was that you're old enough to remember this era that we didn't have Google, we didn't have a bunch of thesauruses, so.

You just had to believe people.

You just had to believe people.

So they would just tell these wild stories about I don't know if any of these stories I heard about all these songs are true. But she would always set up a song first for a big story and then play it. So we were like all on the edge of our seat and she'd hype up a song that we'd never heard and then play it. We were all like listening, like we were watching a movie, like the first time she played Coward of the County or The Gambler, Like we're like ears locked, you know what I mean, or that.

So they would just tell these wild stories about I don't know if any of these stories I heard about all these songs are true. But she would always set up a song first for a big story and then play it. So we were like all on the edge of our seat and she'd hype up a song that we'd never heard and then play it. We were all like listening, like we were watching a movie, like the first time she played Coward of the County or The Gambler, Like we're like ears locked, you know what I mean, or that.

Oh, oh, come my baby, you know, We're just all like She's like, listen, listen, listen. She wait for the good parts. We'd all get goosebumps at the end of a song. And it really really kind of brought that being young to me. I was like, Oh, this solves problems, this brings people together, this makes sick people better. Like there's something happening with this vibration that's different. And I probably tend Jay And right then I was like, I want to write songs.

Oh, oh, come my baby, you know, We're just all like She's like, listen, listen, listen. She wait for the good parts. We'd all get goosebumps at the end of a song. And it really really kind of brought that being young to me. I was like, Oh, this solves problems, this brings people together, this makes sick people better. Like there's something happening with this vibration that's different. And I probably tend Jay And right then I was like, I want to write songs.

Wow.

Wow.

I came down like a week later with a poem, you know what I mean. I didn't know how to write a song, so like I wrote a poem, you know what I mean?

I came down like a week later with a poem, you know what I mean. I didn't know how to write a song, so like I wrote a poem, you know what I mean?

Did you sing in perform it for her?

Did you sing in perform it for her?

Oh? Yeah? Every time? Oh dude.

Oh? Yeah? Every time? Oh dude.

It got to the point where, like and if she was downstairs with her girlfriend, she'd called me up there to read whatever. The most one I wrote was. She was very looking back now, you don't realize how much that feeds the positive side of reinforcing a little dreaming you as a kid. But she I don't even know if she did it, but she hammered it home because she made me feel like the bell of the ball. I mean, she'd be like, Jason, come down here, little Jelly, Come down here, little Jelly, and I'd come down. She goes show pat that thing you wrote last week, and I'd run back up get my little sheet of paper and I'd come down like, check this out Pat and Pat would act like it was the coolest thing ever.

It got to the point where, like and if she was downstairs with her girlfriend, she'd called me up there to read whatever. The most one I wrote was. She was very looking back now, you don't realize how much that feeds the positive side of reinforcing a little dreaming you as a kid. But she I don't even know if she did it, but she hammered it home because she made me feel like the bell of the ball. I mean, she'd be like, Jason, come down here, little Jelly, Come down here, little Jelly, and I'd come down. She goes show pat that thing you wrote last week, and I'd run back up get my little sheet of paper and I'd come down like, check this out Pat and Pat would act like it was the coolest thing ever.

You know, it sucked. Of course I was ken. It was horrible, you know what I mean.

You know, it sucked. Of course I was ken. It was horrible, you know what I mean.

But they were super, super complimentary, and that was something that really encouraged me.

But they were super, super complimentary, and that was something that really encouraged me.

Do you still have any of those original poems?

Do you still have any of those original poems?

No, dude, we are such a white trash family. We lost all our pictures, all our poems. We lost everything.

No, dude, we are such a white trash family. We lost all our pictures, all our poems. We lost everything.

Man.

Man.

Yeah, I can imagine. Just no matter how bad you think it was, it would be fun to look back, Oh for sure, see what you were writing about.

Yeah, I can imagine. Just no matter how bad you think it was, it would be fun to look back, Oh for sure, see what you were writing about.

Just to see that. I'd love to see some of the my home videos. I was watching the I forget her name. I think her name is Sadie. She's with the Duck Dynasty family, but she's a pastor now, and they were showing a video of her standing on her kitchen table when she was two going three, going Jesus.

Just to see that. I'd love to see some of the my home videos. I was watching the I forget her name. I think her name is Sadie. She's with the Duck Dynasty family, but she's a pastor now, and they were showing a video of her standing on her kitchen table when she was two going three, going Jesus.

Forgives everybody, He'll love.

Forgives everybody, He'll love.

You, and then fast forward and she's twenty eight now and she like runs a mega church, and it was like, oh, that's funny. I wonder there's any videos of me being a little asshole. Yeah, I'm running around wrapping the people.

You, and then fast forward and she's twenty eight now and she like runs a mega church, and it was like, oh, that's funny. I wonder there's any videos of me being a little asshole. Yeah, I'm running around wrapping the people.

That's beautiful, man, that's beautiful. It's uh, how does he go from that to then being incotrated to the thirteen Like, I feel like, you know, that's ten years old. You say, it seems like there's the ability to find joy. You're looking back and smiling, but then thirteen, that incarceration journey begins.

That's beautiful, man, that's beautiful. It's uh, how does he go from that to then being incotrated to the thirteen Like, I feel like, you know, that's ten years old. You say, it seems like there's the ability to find joy. You're looking back and smiling, but then thirteen, that incarceration journey begins.

It deep rooted insecurities. Early.

It deep rooted insecurities. Early.

I was always a bigger kid, always struggle with an eating disorder. I just I think I ate my emotions whenever I was younger in feelings and what was happening in my environment, in the household and outside. So I had a little chip on my shoulder naturally as a young kid, I was I've always said this and it's but it's true. Excuse my language is, big kids become are one of two ways. They're either very shy and very timid, or they're very funny and can be very aggressive. And I was the funny, aggressive, big guy, you know what I mean. And I carried that in my neighborhood was you know, I mean, it was happening. It was a very active area, you know what I mean. It was a very very normal, middle lower class neighborhood in the nineties, So there was just so much crap happening. It was so easy to get involved. When you're a kid, you're just looking for any kind of acceptance, any you know, any any sense of belonging, any sense of want, and the streets will always give it to you, you know what I mean. They're they're, they're they're praying on it. They're they're they're they're praying on it and praying for it that it happens. And I just immediately got washed into it just and I also was one of the people in my family that had a I've probably never said this this way, and I hope I'll get in trouble. I didn't have a good relationship with how I looked at money, you know. I looked at money as the way out of this particular situation, and I was willing to do whatever it took to get that. And I had no morals about it. I had no moral compass at all.

I was always a bigger kid, always struggle with an eating disorder. I just I think I ate my emotions whenever I was younger in feelings and what was happening in my environment, in the household and outside. So I had a little chip on my shoulder naturally as a young kid, I was I've always said this and it's but it's true. Excuse my language is, big kids become are one of two ways. They're either very shy and very timid, or they're very funny and can be very aggressive. And I was the funny, aggressive, big guy, you know what I mean. And I carried that in my neighborhood was you know, I mean, it was happening. It was a very active area, you know what I mean. It was a very very normal, middle lower class neighborhood in the nineties, So there was just so much crap happening. It was so easy to get involved. When you're a kid, you're just looking for any kind of acceptance, any you know, any any sense of belonging, any sense of want, and the streets will always give it to you, you know what I mean. They're they're, they're they're praying on it. They're they're they're they're praying on it and praying for it that it happens. And I just immediately got washed into it just and I also was one of the people in my family that had a I've probably never said this this way, and I hope I'll get in trouble. I didn't have a good relationship with how I looked at money, you know. I looked at money as the way out of this particular situation, and I was willing to do whatever it took to get that. And I had no morals about it. I had no moral compass at all.

You know.

You know.

I mean, I I looked back at those years, Jane, I'm so embarrassed to talk about them.

I mean, I I looked back at those years, Jane, I'm so embarrassed to talk about them.

I was such a I was.

I was such a I was.

I was still a bad person in my early thirties, but I mean I was a really horrible kid all the way into my mid twenties.

I was still a bad person in my early thirties, but I mean I was a really horrible kid all the way into my mid twenties.

I was people always like, You're the nicest dude I've ever met.

I was people always like, You're the nicest dude I've ever met.

I'm like, I'm so glad, y'all haven't met nobody that need me twenty years ago, you know what I mean. But yeah, So I just immediately started getting this shit. And the first time I caught a real case, i'd gotten, well, we got caught with weed and stuff and all that little two days and juvenile stuff. But I'd gotten a fight with a kid, and back then, they had the chain wallets, and when we were wrestling, I grabbed a chain wallet to try to hit them with it. And that was a strong arm robbery case. So I ended up in the system for like twenty something months when I was like thirteen, for that strong arm robbery.

I'm like, I'm so glad, y'all haven't met nobody that need me twenty years ago, you know what I mean. But yeah, So I just immediately started getting this shit. And the first time I caught a real case, i'd gotten, well, we got caught with weed and stuff and all that little two days and juvenile stuff. But I'd gotten a fight with a kid, and back then, they had the chain wallets, and when we were wrestling, I grabbed a chain wallet to try to hit them with it. And that was a strong arm robbery case. So I ended up in the system for like twenty something months when I was like thirteen, for that strong arm robbery.

Hey everyone, it's Jay Chatty and I'm thrilled to announce my podcast tour. For the first time ever. You can see my on Purpose podcast live and in person. Join me in a city near you for meaningful, insightful conversations with surprise guests. It could be a celebrity, top wellness expert, or a CEO or business leader. We'll dive into experiences designed to inspire growth, spark learning, and build real connections. I can't wait to see you there. Tickets are on sell now. I had to Jay Shetty, don't me and get yours today? Do you truly believe that you're a horrible person. I can't imagine you're having a horrible heart.

Hey everyone, it's Jay Chatty and I'm thrilled to announce my podcast tour. For the first time ever. You can see my on Purpose podcast live and in person. Join me in a city near you for meaningful, insightful conversations with surprise guests. It could be a celebrity, top wellness expert, or a CEO or business leader. We'll dive into experiences designed to inspire growth, spark learning, and build real connections. I can't wait to see you there. Tickets are on sell now. I had to Jay Shetty, don't me and get yours today? Do you truly believe that you're a horrible person. I can't imagine you're having a horrible heart.

Yeah, I don't.

Yeah, I don't.

I kind of leaned towards I don't know if I had a bad heart as much as I leaned towards kind of the Damascus thing where I think I was just a really less than admirable person.

I kind of leaned towards I don't know if I had a bad heart as much as I leaned towards kind of the Damascus thing where I think I was just a really less than admirable person.

I was desperate and delusional. I say it.

I was desperate and delusional. I say it.

I was a desperate, delusional dreamer in the desperate park got me in a lot of trouble. I encourage delusional dreamers. Be a delusional dreamer. Just don't be a desperate delusional dreamer, you know. But I definitely was consciously making really horrible decisions. I just had such an anger. I was just so mad at life. Everything that wasn't right was everybody's fault of mine. I had such a victim mentality. I took zero accountability for anything in my life. I was the kid that if you asked what happened, I immediately started with everything but me, you know what I mean? And it took years for me to break that, like years of work, solid work to just like break that. It also has took in years of work for me to even forgive that kid, years of real intensive work to just be like, you know what, because when you're sixteen and you do something very manipulative and you look back at it, Jay, you're like, man, that was super manipulative. Like, man, what was I thinking back then? That's just I knew what I was doing. I knew I was being being manipulative. Man, I was also sixteen. I was a kid. And I know that because I now have a sixteen year old and Jay, Man, she's the smartest kid's cool And of course everybody thinks they got the coolest smartest kid. I'm no exception, you know, but she's the smartest. She's so much smarter than me. She's so much better than me. She's gonna be everything I wasn't in life. It's going to be so fun to watch. But she'll still do shit that'll make me go, oh, she's sixteen.

I was a desperate, delusional dreamer in the desperate park got me in a lot of trouble. I encourage delusional dreamers. Be a delusional dreamer. Just don't be a desperate delusional dreamer, you know. But I definitely was consciously making really horrible decisions. I just had such an anger. I was just so mad at life. Everything that wasn't right was everybody's fault of mine. I had such a victim mentality. I took zero accountability for anything in my life. I was the kid that if you asked what happened, I immediately started with everything but me, you know what I mean? And it took years for me to break that, like years of work, solid work to just like break that. It also has took in years of work for me to even forgive that kid, years of real intensive work to just be like, you know what, because when you're sixteen and you do something very manipulative and you look back at it, Jay, you're like, man, that was super manipulative. Like, man, what was I thinking back then? That's just I knew what I was doing. I knew I was being being manipulative. Man, I was also sixteen. I was a kid. And I know that because I now have a sixteen year old and Jay, Man, she's the smartest kid's cool And of course everybody thinks they got the coolest smartest kid. I'm no exception, you know, but she's the smartest. She's so much smarter than me. She's so much better than me. She's gonna be everything I wasn't in life. It's going to be so fun to watch. But she'll still do shit that'll make me go, oh, she's sixteen.

You know what I'm saying.

You know what I'm saying.

Like all the time, like I have moments where I look like, dude, I think you could build a rocket, And then I have moments when I'm like, I think you put your shoes on wrong.

Like all the time, like I have moments where I look like, dude, I think you could build a rocket, And then I have moments when I'm like, I think you put your shoes on wrong.

Today, you know what I mean, She's sixteen, you know.

Today, you know what I mean, She's sixteen, you know.

So I've been able to do the work and forgive myself for being that, for being what I was. But I definitely did a lot of work to change my whole outlook on people and love. That's why I'm such a hugger man. I was not a touchy guy, dude. I was a fist bump, stay away from me, flat faced.

So I've been able to do the work and forgive myself for being that, for being what I was. But I definitely did a lot of work to change my whole outlook on people and love. That's why I'm such a hugger man. I was not a touchy guy, dude. I was a fist bump, stay away from me, flat faced.

You know.

You know.

I was kind of a jail guy. And now I'm like, I just I joke all the time.

I was kind of a jail guy. And now I'm like, I just I joke all the time.

Jah. I didn't cry until I was thirty three. Now I can't quit.

Jah. I didn't cry until I was thirty three. Now I can't quit.

I mean, it's like if I thought I'd caught up by now, but I mean I still just just for no reason, I'll just sob.

I mean, it's like if I thought I'd caught up by now, but I mean I still just just for no reason, I'll just sob.

I love that. What does it take what's blucking us from forgiving ourselves?

I love that. What does it take what's blucking us from forgiving ourselves?

Mmmugh?

Mmmugh?

I think accepting our responsibility in what we did. It's really hard for me. That was the hardest part of forgiving myself was just really when I quit running out of it was this person's fault, It was that person's fault. It took a long time for me to, as my father would say to that peal of realizing that maybe it was me. You know, it's the classic quote on relations and chip number twenty seven. You look up and go, now, there's no way I picked twenty seven crazy with you know what I'm saying, like, at some point, maybe I am the problem. And that's the first thing I did to forgive myself was just almost like the basic principles of AA. I just had to admit, like, you know what this is, this is me. This is all a reflection of the way I've carried myself. And yeah, things happened to me in life that created this, And yeah, there was a lot of I don't look at people and go what's wrong with them?

I think accepting our responsibility in what we did. It's really hard for me. That was the hardest part of forgiving myself was just really when I quit running out of it was this person's fault, It was that person's fault. It took a long time for me to, as my father would say to that peal of realizing that maybe it was me. You know, it's the classic quote on relations and chip number twenty seven. You look up and go, now, there's no way I picked twenty seven crazy with you know what I'm saying, like, at some point, maybe I am the problem. And that's the first thing I did to forgive myself was just almost like the basic principles of AA. I just had to admit, like, you know what this is, this is me. This is all a reflection of the way I've carried myself. And yeah, things happened to me in life that created this, And yeah, there was a lot of I don't look at people and go what's wrong with them?

No more. I look at people and go what happened to them? But I've that is no excuse not to not to move on.

No more. I look at people and go what happened to them? But I've that is no excuse not to not to move on.

And I was tired of forgiving everybody but me, and I couldn't figure out what the problem was. I was like, I forgave everybody. I don't have a bitter heart about nothing, like you haven't forgave you, And man, I just.

And I was tired of forgiving everybody but me, and I couldn't figure out what the problem was. I was like, I forgave everybody. I don't have a bitter heart about nothing, like you haven't forgave you, And man, I just.

It hit me like a ton of bricks.

It hit me like a ton of bricks.

You went to jail for an arm rubbery at fifteen. Have you ever thought about, or maybe you have even met them, but have you ever thought about what you'd say to that person if you met me?

You went to jail for an arm rubbery at fifteen. Have you ever thought about, or maybe you have even met them, but have you ever thought about what you'd say to that person if you met me?

I guess it's the.

I guess it's the.

Best question I've ever been asked. I've avoided this question hoping because I don't know how to answer it. Jay, I really want to have a conversation with them. I've thought about reaching out. This has been twenty four years ago now, and I just don't know how that would even start, you know, how it would go about it? Because sometimes I wonder if they might have even seen me in passing and are aware of my success, and I wonder if they've even correlated. I mean, I've obviously dramatically changed. You know, I was fifteen, dude, you know what I mean. I couldn't grow facial hair at all. You know, I didn't I hardly hit puberty. I still had my hay voice when I did that rivalry. So I've thought about that a ton, and they're definitely on my list, my men's list.

Best question I've ever been asked. I've avoided this question hoping because I don't know how to answer it. Jay, I really want to have a conversation with them. I've thought about reaching out. This has been twenty four years ago now, and I just don't know how that would even start, you know, how it would go about it? Because sometimes I wonder if they might have even seen me in passing and are aware of my success, and I wonder if they've even correlated. I mean, I've obviously dramatically changed. You know, I was fifteen, dude, you know what I mean. I couldn't grow facial hair at all. You know, I didn't I hardly hit puberty. I still had my hay voice when I did that rivalry. So I've thought about that a ton, and they're definitely on my list, my men's list.

I just haven't made it that far down yet.

I just haven't made it that far down yet.

What do you think you would say?

What do you think you would say?

I would just ask them to understand. I would ask them to just one forgive me, because there's no excuse and that the first accountability is no matter how old I was, I had no business taking from anybody. Just this entitledment that I had the world owed me enough that I could come take your stuff. Just what a horrible, horrible way to look at life and people. It's what a horrible way to interact with the earth, you know. And I would apologize for that first, just flat just one accountability is what I'm so big on now.

I would just ask them to understand. I would ask them to just one forgive me, because there's no excuse and that the first accountability is no matter how old I was, I had no business taking from anybody. Just this entitledment that I had the world owed me enough that I could come take your stuff. Just what a horrible, horrible way to look at life and people. It's what a horrible way to interact with the earth, you know. And I would apologize for that first, just flat just one accountability is what I'm so big on now.

Jays just looking at me, an I go, man uh.

Jays just looking at me, an I go, man uh.

And then I would hope they would give me a little grace as I explained to them that I was fifteen and I was just trying to be. I don't know what I was even trying to be. When I look back now, I don't know what my thought.

And then I would hope they would give me a little grace as I explained to them that I was fifteen and I was just trying to be. I don't know what I was even trying to be. When I look back now, I don't know what my thought.

I don't have.

I don't have.

This is how I know I was fifteen because there When I try to make logic of it, I can't.

This is how I know I was fifteen because there When I try to make logic of it, I can't.

There was no logic to what I did. It made absolutely no sense.

There was no logic to what I did. It made absolutely no sense.

And I learned so much from it and the way that I interact with people. And I hope that they would see that I've made it my life's mission to change and to change people, because that's what I'm representing the most.

And I learned so much from it and the way that I interact with people. And I hope that they would see that I've made it my life's mission to change and to change people, because that's what I'm representing the most.

In what I do.

In what I do.

With my This whole thing for me is I think people cheer for me Jay because they see a little bit of me and them, or they see their cousin or their I'm a family member, they relate, and I speak for an unspoken group of people, you know, and I hope they would know that. You know, money doesn't create character, it reveals it. Right, if I was an asshole, what a great time to start, you know what I mean, What a great time to show the world.

With my This whole thing for me is I think people cheer for me Jay because they see a little bit of me and them, or they see their cousin or their I'm a family member, they relate, and I speak for an unspoken group of people, you know, and I hope they would know that. You know, money doesn't create character, it reveals it. Right, if I was an asshole, what a great time to start, you know what I mean, What a great time to show the world.

You know.

You know.

I think that I'm trying to diligently prove myself that I'm I've not only changed that I took the platform serious and it's making me change more every day, you know, the responsibility that God's given me, and I would hope they would forgive me.

I think that I'm trying to diligently prove myself that I'm I've not only changed that I took the platform serious and it's making me change more every day, you know, the responsibility that God's given me, and I would hope they would forgive me.

That's beautiful. Even sitting with you for a few moments and the few interactions we have had, it's so evident to me that you've done so much work, Like it's so clear, it's so clear, and I think you remind everyone of the potential we do want to see in humanity, Like it's like that's what we want to see. Like when we see someone struggling, we want to see them figure out how's that transformation? And I think what you were saying that when people see you, I think they're reminded that, oh it's possible, Oh it's real, or it can be genuine like it it's so genuine to your care when you're talking about it to me, like I feel the vibration of just you know, the growth and transformation you chose. What I'm fascinated by is how did it affect you at the time to make a mistake in your early years? How long did that end up putting you in jail for that time?

That's beautiful. Even sitting with you for a few moments and the few interactions we have had, it's so evident to me that you've done so much work, Like it's so clear, it's so clear, and I think you remind everyone of the potential we do want to see in humanity, Like it's like that's what we want to see. Like when we see someone struggling, we want to see them figure out how's that transformation? And I think what you were saying that when people see you, I think they're reminded that, oh it's possible, Oh it's real, or it can be genuine like it it's so genuine to your care when you're talking about it to me, like I feel the vibration of just you know, the growth and transformation you chose. What I'm fascinated by is how did it affect you at the time to make a mistake in your early years? How long did that end up putting you in jail for that time?

That's the time I got charged an adult, So I still have that felling on my record of this day for that crime that was I did a few years. I mean I came home right, I've made bond right before I was seventeen, So I did two and a half years, and then I ended up having to go back and do another few years for the actual case when it settled out.

That's the time I got charged an adult, So I still have that felling on my record of this day for that crime that was I did a few years. I mean I came home right, I've made bond right before I was seventeen, So I did two and a half years, and then I ended up having to go back and do another few years for the actual case when it settled out.

What does that experience do to a young person? Walk us through that, because I feel like you're now looking back at it when you're, you know, late thirties, But when you're looking back at it, it's a different perspective to like when you're actually fifteen in jail for two and a half years, going back in and out cases. What does that do to the mental health of a teenager.

What does that experience do to a young person? Walk us through that, because I feel like you're now looking back at it when you're, you know, late thirties, But when you're looking back at it, it's a different perspective to like when you're actually fifteen in jail for two and a half years, going back in and out cases. What does that do to the mental health of a teenager.

Well, here's the perspective. Jay.

Well, here's the perspective. Jay.

Imagine us as adults now to me and you go have a conversation. I go, hey, man, let's go spend three months in the mountains together, not use our phones.

Imagine us as adults now to me and you go have a conversation. I go, hey, man, let's go spend three months in the mountains together, not use our phones.

Just fellowship.

Just fellowship.

You look at a like, great idea, right, You're like, it's just three months, it'll be fun. I mean, I think this will be great. We'll bring our wives, we'll invite other people. Let's actually make a thing of this now because us, because we know in our age that three months is but the hardest we're working three months. But I might be need to break we need You know, when you're fifteen years old, three months is your life. It's an entire semester of school. You're now going to be a second year freshman, or you're going to have to make up these whole classes next summer because of three months. You know. So imagine getting thrown into that vortex for three years. I missed high school, I missed any kind of normal socializing, any kind of what would be growing up, what would be developing in those airs. And I was developing in a room and I did a crime that deserve this, by the way, But I was developing in a room with stone, white walls, a conk, a steal commode, and a steal bunk and a six by eight sel six foot wide, eight inches long. By the time I was an adult, I had to sleep with my legs curled, couldn't stretch all the way out. You know, I'll never forget being seventeen realizing I grew enough that I couldn't fit in the bunk no more length wise. So you go through these things as a juvenile. And do you ever see Blow? You gotta watch the movie Blow. It's incredible. It's a crazy movie. It's about a guy named George Young Young that was a huge Johnny Depp played a huge Shiny Death fan. But he was a big weed dealer and he finally got some federal time for moving, you know, hundreds of thousands of pounds of weed. And the joke he says in the movie is I went to prison with a bachelor's degree in marijuana. I left with a PhD in cocaine because he came home and ended up being the biggest cocaine dealer in American history. So that's the true though. That's how that impacts us, Jay when we're in these situations. Our judicial system is set that when you put the worst of the worst in a room together and give them nothing to do but talk, argue and fight, you're only making smarter criminals. They're only when there's no outlets. Because there was very few outlets for us. Even as a juvenile, we didn't have no outlets. I didn't get my diploma, I didn't get my ged until I was twenty five. In adult jail, we didn't have real classes. We didn't have a real wreck yard, an exercise program, a mentorship program. At the juvenile we didn't have anything. I mean, they treated us like lifers, you know, orange jumpsuits. And these were hainous crimes we were committing. And I understand that I am huge on discipline, Like I'm one of the few people that even in my justice reform doesn't anywhere do I believe people shouldn't be incarcerated. I think that I've learned some of the greatest things in my life and that it's changed my life. But what changed my life the most of those facilities. Was later when I started getting resources in them, when they started and education units where I could get my ged and they had a Christian program that I could go to call Jericho breaking the walls down, and these were the things that I started learning, these fundamentals, and they had AA in NA and I started being getting access to different kind of books and literature and these things.

You look at a like, great idea, right, You're like, it's just three months, it'll be fun. I mean, I think this will be great. We'll bring our wives, we'll invite other people. Let's actually make a thing of this now because us, because we know in our age that three months is but the hardest we're working three months. But I might be need to break we need You know, when you're fifteen years old, three months is your life. It's an entire semester of school. You're now going to be a second year freshman, or you're going to have to make up these whole classes next summer because of three months. You know. So imagine getting thrown into that vortex for three years. I missed high school, I missed any kind of normal socializing, any kind of what would be growing up, what would be developing in those airs. And I was developing in a room and I did a crime that deserve this, by the way, But I was developing in a room with stone, white walls, a conk, a steal commode, and a steal bunk and a six by eight sel six foot wide, eight inches long. By the time I was an adult, I had to sleep with my legs curled, couldn't stretch all the way out. You know, I'll never forget being seventeen realizing I grew enough that I couldn't fit in the bunk no more length wise. So you go through these things as a juvenile. And do you ever see Blow? You gotta watch the movie Blow. It's incredible. It's a crazy movie. It's about a guy named George Young Young that was a huge Johnny Depp played a huge Shiny Death fan. But he was a big weed dealer and he finally got some federal time for moving, you know, hundreds of thousands of pounds of weed. And the joke he says in the movie is I went to prison with a bachelor's degree in marijuana. I left with a PhD in cocaine because he came home and ended up being the biggest cocaine dealer in American history. So that's the true though. That's how that impacts us, Jay when we're in these situations. Our judicial system is set that when you put the worst of the worst in a room together and give them nothing to do but talk, argue and fight, you're only making smarter criminals. They're only when there's no outlets. Because there was very few outlets for us. Even as a juvenile, we didn't have no outlets. I didn't get my diploma, I didn't get my ged until I was twenty five. In adult jail, we didn't have real classes. We didn't have a real wreck yard, an exercise program, a mentorship program. At the juvenile we didn't have anything. I mean, they treated us like lifers, you know, orange jumpsuits. And these were hainous crimes we were committing. And I understand that I am huge on discipline, Like I'm one of the few people that even in my justice reform doesn't anywhere do I believe people shouldn't be incarcerated. I think that I've learned some of the greatest things in my life and that it's changed my life. But what changed my life the most of those facilities. Was later when I started getting resources in them, when they started and education units where I could get my ged and they had a Christian program that I could go to call Jericho breaking the walls down, and these were the things that I started learning, these fundamentals, and they had AA in NA and I started being getting access to different kind of books and literature and these things.

But all through my juvenile years, Jay, none of that. You're just sitting in there.

But all through my juvenile years, Jay, none of that. You're just sitting in there.

You know there's kids that went to juvenile my age and came home and couldn't never could read and write.

You know there's kids that went to juvenile my age and came home and couldn't never could read and write.

Well, yeah, no, I appreciate that perspective. And it comes back to what you keep referring to is this principle of accountability. And I think accountability gets a bit of a hard rap right now, Like it's a difficult reputation that accountability has because talk to me about the difference between accountability and self sabotage or self blame. Right there's a difference huge, and I can tell you know it because from the way you're using the word. But I think people get scared of accountability because they think, well, if I think it's all my fault, right, then maybe I shouldn't be here, or maybe I don't matter or I'm not enough? How do you see the difference.

Well, yeah, no, I appreciate that perspective. And it comes back to what you keep referring to is this principle of accountability. And I think accountability gets a bit of a hard rap right now, Like it's a difficult reputation that accountability has because talk to me about the difference between accountability and self sabotage or self blame. Right there's a difference huge, and I can tell you know it because from the way you're using the word. But I think people get scared of accountability because they think, well, if I think it's all my fault, right, then maybe I shouldn't be here, or maybe I don't matter or I'm not enough? How do you see the difference.

There was a poem called the Guy in the Glass. Have you ever read this poem? It's an incredible poem. I used to have it memorized, but I read it in jail and I hung it up on my jail mirror, and until about two years ago, it was on the mirror in my bedroom every day, my whole as long as me and my wife have been together. It's something I live by. The Guy the pretty much says that you can be king for a day and get pats on the back in life as you pass, but it's only heartache and tears if you fool the Guy in the Glass. That was the moment where now, if there's a triggering thing that happens in my life, I used to the old mentality was who did this? First thing I do now is I go straight to the mirror and go what could Jason have done differently? What could I have really done differently to avoid this situation? Because once I learned that there's accountability, this old head once told me, if I'm running up a flight of steps and I slip on a step and fall whose fault is it is a mine of the steps or what's it's mine? He goes, what if there's a cracking of steps? I go, it's the steps? He goes, You think, and I go, well, for sure, that's the variable. Right, there's a cracking of steps, it's the steps fault.

There was a poem called the Guy in the Glass. Have you ever read this poem? It's an incredible poem. I used to have it memorized, but I read it in jail and I hung it up on my jail mirror, and until about two years ago, it was on the mirror in my bedroom every day, my whole as long as me and my wife have been together. It's something I live by. The Guy the pretty much says that you can be king for a day and get pats on the back in life as you pass, but it's only heartache and tears if you fool the Guy in the Glass. That was the moment where now, if there's a triggering thing that happens in my life, I used to the old mentality was who did this? First thing I do now is I go straight to the mirror and go what could Jason have done differently? What could I have really done differently to avoid this situation? Because once I learned that there's accountability, this old head once told me, if I'm running up a flight of steps and I slip on a step and fall whose fault is it is a mine of the steps or what's it's mine? He goes, what if there's a cracking of steps? I go, it's the steps? He goes, You think, and I go, well, for sure, that's the variable. Right, there's a cracking of steps, it's the steps fault.

He said.

He said.

The steps didn't have a choice to be there. You had a choice to run up them. Man, those are the moments where you're like, oh so, and then if I can assess that I did everything right, that's how I avoid self blame. Real self assessment, honest self assessment to go because a lot of times we just don't honestly assess ourselves. Something I learned through AA that I love so much is going home and having these like you assess your day, you write what did you do?

The steps didn't have a choice to be there. You had a choice to run up them. Man, those are the moments where you're like, oh so, and then if I can assess that I did everything right, that's how I avoid self blame. Real self assessment, honest self assessment to go because a lot of times we just don't honestly assess ourselves. Something I learned through AA that I love so much is going home and having these like you assess your day, you write what did you do?

What do they call it? Like a moral inventory?

What do they call it? Like a moral inventory?

Right, and having these real moments, and then you get freedom because sometimes you find out it ain't you and then you're like, you know what, I actually did pretty good by this. Then you can start handling your business and then going down the line all right, well where did this fall apart?

Right, and having these real moments, and then you get freedom because sometimes you find out it ain't you and then you're like, you know what, I actually did pretty good by this. Then you can start handling your business and then going down the line all right, well where did this fall apart?

You know what I mean? And then you can start checking your boxes.

You know what I mean? And then you can start checking your boxes.

But I've learned that even and then it'll always come back to you, because even if it's somebody you hired to do a job and they fail to do the job, still hired that person to do the job, that was still my own going and that just changed everything. I had to do it that way, though, Jay, because I was a chronic. I was the spider Man. Mean, you know what I mean all the time, Dude, it was everybody.

But I've learned that even and then it'll always come back to you, because even if it's somebody you hired to do a job and they fail to do the job, still hired that person to do the job, that was still my own going and that just changed everything. I had to do it that way, though, Jay, because I was a chronic. I was the spider Man. Mean, you know what I mean all the time, Dude, it was everybody.

You know what I'm saying. I had Taim, but Tim at Tim, it was never me. You know what I'm saying. Turns out it was pretty much always me.

You know what I'm saying. I had Taim, but Tim at Tim, it was never me. You know what I'm saying. Turns out it was pretty much always me.

But I love that you can laugh at that and say that, right. I think that's the I think that's the beauty of it when you start realizing that even when you got it wrong, it wasn't this like deep dark paint. And it was just like we're young, we're stupid, we think about things. We were kind of we're kind of trained to believe the problem is not us, and when we do make it us, we don't need to hold it as like this heavy dark weight. It's like, oh wait, let me just relieve myself of this stupid idea I have that it's not me and maybe if it is me.

But I love that you can laugh at that and say that, right. I think that's the I think that's the beauty of it when you start realizing that even when you got it wrong, it wasn't this like deep dark paint. And it was just like we're young, we're stupid, we think about things. We were kind of we're kind of trained to believe the problem is not us, and when we do make it us, we don't need to hold it as like this heavy dark weight. It's like, oh wait, let me just relieve myself of this stupid idea I have that it's not me and maybe if it is me.

I love that poem Guy Guy in the glass. Question and opinion on that, how do you think that? How do you encourage people to get over that? Because that's a real thing you're saying is to be like when you do assess it, you there is a heavy, heavy feeling for me. I just started finding freedom in it to be like like you said, it was more. I started looking at less like damn, I'm enough to more like, oh I can let that go. I blew that? What did I?

I love that poem Guy Guy in the glass. Question and opinion on that, how do you think that? How do you encourage people to get over that? Because that's a real thing you're saying is to be like when you do assess it, you there is a heavy, heavy feeling for me. I just started finding freedom in it to be like like you said, it was more. I started looking at less like damn, I'm enough to more like, oh I can let that go. I blew that? What did I?

I started taking this mentality of I don't lose.

I started taking this mentality of I don't lose.

I learned, you know what I mean? Like like I said, yeah, like we don't this team, we don't. We might screw stuff up, but we don't. Just we learned something. It was all valuable. Yeah, what do you think? What do you think that process?

I learned, you know what I mean? Like like I said, yeah, like we don't this team, we don't. We might screw stuff up, but we don't. Just we learned something. It was all valuable. Yeah, what do you think? What do you think that process?

There's two things that come to mind. One of them is in the monk tradition, our highest self is called the monk mind and our lower self is called the monkey mind. And so whenever you're acting in that way, it's compared to a monkey. So if you see a monkey, and obviously you're not going to see a monkey in most places, but at least in India. When you see a monkey, monkeys are crazy. They're silly. They're jumping brands to brands, they're swinging around, they make you funny sounds. They're playful. They'll show you their teeth to scare you a little bit. They'll steal your credit card and trade it back for a banana. They're like, they're silly. And the reason why the mind is compared to a monkey is because it often acts like that. It's silly, it's unreasonable, it's awkward, it does funny things. And so when you look at the mind that way, you're like, oh, it's just a monkey, Like it's okay, Like it doesn't have to be this serious, heavy thing. You recognize that the mind's nature, the mind's propensity, is to be that way. And then you go, wait a minute, I wouldn't judge a monkey if it did that. So let me not judge myself. Let me free myself of that guilt and shame. And I think the bigger thing there is Guilt blocks growth. Guilt doesn't make you want to grow. It might make you start to grow, but it won't help you grow long term if you keep guilting yourself. Shame is not going to help you shift. If you keep shaming yourself, you're so only gonna shift. It may shift you a tiny degree, but it's not going to cause a transformation. And so guilt, shame, and judgment don't help you grow, shift and transform. And I think so many of us have to realize that it's just not a useful emotion sustainably. It can be useful in the interiom to like get you off your backside and get you going, but it's not a where I see you today. It's not like love and grace and compassion, like these things are sustainable. These things are infinite, whereas shame, guilt, and judgment are finite reasons for motivation, they run out. I don't know if that makes sense. Yeah, So that's how I see it. Yeah, that's how I see it. And that's big to touch on, especially with shame. That shame spiral for me has been my biggest demonally. I mean, it's the monster in front of me all the time.