Are we in the midst of a reading crisis? News outlets are constantly reporting on the death of reading. School test scores by measures like the “Nation’s Report Card” say math and literacy levels are down to their lowest rates since the early 1990s. Schools aren’t even assigning full books in class anymore. We talk to children’s book author Jason Reynolds, an active teacher in Chicago public schools, and a professor who’s looked into the actual research and says the literacy crisis doesn’t even exist. 

Our guests this week are author Jason Reynolds (buy his new book Soundtrack here), professor Paul Thomas, and teacher Kelsey Clodfelter.

For links to research and more, check out our newsletter. 

If you liked this episode, check out: Do audiobooks count as reading? and Should schools ban phones? 

Have a question you want us to answer? Email us at mannynoahdevan@gmail.com or leave a voicemail at ‪(860) 325-0286

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Are we in the midst of a reading crisis? News outlets are constantly reporting on <a href="https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2025/10/education-decline-low-expectations/684526/">the death of reading</a>. School test scores by measures like the &ldquo;Nation&rsquo;s Report Card&rdquo; say math and literacy levels are down to their lowest rates since the early 1990s. <a href="https://www.nytimes.com/2025/12/12/us/high-school-english-teachers-assigning-books.html">Schools aren&rsquo;t even assigning full books</a> in class anymore. We talk to children&rsquo;s book author Jason Reynolds, an active teacher in Chicago public schools, and a professor who&rsquo;s looked into the actual research and says <a href="https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2025/07/28/naep-reading-crisis-test-scores/">the literacy crisis doesn&rsquo;t even exist</a>.&nbsp;
Our guests this week are author&nbsp;<a href="https://www.jasonwritesbooks.com/">Jason Reynolds</a> (buy his new book Soundtrack <a href="https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/747031/soundtrack-a-novel-by-jason-reynolds/">here</a>), professor <a href="https://paulthomas701128.substack.com/">Paul Thomas</a>, and teacher <a href="https://www.tiktok.com/@stillateacher">Kelsey Clodfelter</a>.
For links to research and more, check out our&nbsp;<a href="https://open.substack.com/pub/mannynoahdevan/p/debunking-the-reading-crisis-jason-reynolds?r=j003&amp;utm_campaign=post&amp;utm_medium=web&amp;showWelcomeOnShare=true">newsletter</a>.&nbsp;
If you liked this episode, check out: <a href="https://pod.link/1780210954/episode/Njc0M2I1Njc2MWVmMWU2NjNmNzM1NDBj">Do audiobooks count as reading?</a> and <a href="https://pod.link/1780210954/episode/NjdiYmFkZWJjNjY1NjM4ZDQ3ZjAyZThm">Should schools ban phones?&nbsp;</a>
Have a question you want us to answer? Email us at&nbsp;<a href="mailto:mannynoahdevan@gmail.com">mannynoahdevan@gmail.com</a> or leave a voicemail at ‪(860) 325-0286
EXCLUSIVE&nbsp;NordVPN Deal ➼ <a href="http://www.nordvpn.com/nst">http://www.nordvpn.com/nst</a> &nbsp;
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Join Manny, Noah, and Devan — three best friends and journalists — as they settle dumb arguments by actually doing the research. 

Each week, they start with a debate or discussion. Why don’t men ask follow up questions? Should schools ban phones? Is dating an AI chatbot cheating? Then, they go out into the world, talk to experts, conduct experiments, and find the answer.

NO SUCH THING is an explainer podcast about pop culture, the internet, and whatever weird thing your group chat can’t agree on. If you’ve ever had a take so strong you had to fact-check it, this show is for you.

New episodes on Wednesdays.

For more information, please subscribe to our newsletter at www.nosuchthing.show.

And if you have any questions you’d like us to get to the bottom of, email us at mannynoahdevan@gmail.com or leave a voicemail: ‪(860) 325-0286.

Join Manny, Noah, and Devan &mdash; three best friends and journalists &mdash; as they settle dumb arguments by actually doing the research.&nbsp;
Each week, they start with a debate or discussion. Why don&rsquo;t men ask follow up questions? Should schools ban phones? Is dating an AI chatbot cheating? Then, they go out into the world, talk to experts, conduct experiments, and find the answer.
NO SUCH THING is an explainer podcast about pop culture, the internet, and whatever weird thing your group chat can&rsquo;t agree on. If you&rsquo;ve ever had a take so strong you had to fact-check it, this show is for you.
New episodes on Wednesdays.
For more information, please subscribe to our newsletter at <a href="http://www.nosuchthing.show">www.nosuchthing.show</a>.
And if you have any questions you&rsquo;d like us to get to the bottom of, email us at <a href="mailto:mannynoahdevan@gmail.com">mannynoahdevan@gmail.com</a> or leave a voicemail: ‪(860) 325-0286.

NO SUCH THING

Join Manny, Noah, and Devan &mdash; three best friends and journalists &mdash; as they settle dumb arguments by actually doing the research.&nbsp;
Each week, they start with a debate or discussion. Why don&rsquo;t men ask follow up questions? Should schools ban phones? Is dating an AI chatbot cheating? Then, they go out into the world, talk to experts, conduct experiments, and find the answer.
NO SUCH THING is an explainer podcast about pop culture, the internet, and whatever weird thing your group chat can&rsquo;t agree on. If you&rsquo;ve ever had a take so strong you had to fact-check it, this show is for you.
New episodes on Wednesdays.
For more information, please subscribe to our newsletter at <a href="http://www.nosuchthing.show">www.nosuchthing.show</a>.
And if you have any questions you&rsquo;d like us to get to the bottom of, email us at <a href="mailto:mannynoahdevan@gmail.com">mannynoahdevan@gmail.com</a> or leave a voicemail: ‪(860) 325-0286.

Kids can’t read anymore. Does it matter? (with author Jason Reynolds)

https://api.omny.fm/orgs/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/clips/00d460a0-6772-4d26-aa10-b42c0162d9dc/transcript