I'm Chad Hennings, former Air Force, a ten fighter pilot, three time Super Bowl champion with the Dallas Cowboys, and this is NFL Player's Second Acts Podcast.

I'm Chad Hennings, former Air Force, a ten fighter pilot, three time Super Bowl champion with the Dallas Cowboys, and this is NFL Player's Second Acts Podcast.

I'm Peanut Tillman and this is the NFL Player Second Acts Podcast. Thank you guys for listening, Thanks for tuning in. I'm Peanut, my god, Roman, what's up.

I'm Peanut Tillman and this is the NFL Player Second Acts Podcast. Thank you guys for listening, Thanks for tuning in. I'm Peanut, my god, Roman, what's up.

How you doing. I'm doing great. I'm very very excited about it. I'm Jack right now.

How you doing. I'm doing great. I'm very very excited about it. I'm Jack right now.

Yeah. It's not even the doctor Pepper were drinking either.

Yeah. It's not even the doctor Pepper were drinking either.

No, it's like like share, subscribe, follow, let's preach the resume.

No, it's like like share, subscribe, follow, let's preach the resume.

Let's get right to it. There it is.

Let's get right to it. There it is.

He was a defensive lineman in the NFL for nine seasons, which is probably, i mean, one of the lower.

He was a defensive lineman in the NFL for nine seasons, which is probably, i mean, one of the lower.

Things that he did in life.

Things that he did in life.

He won three Super Bowls with the Dallas Cowboys, only three nineties era and before he entered into the league, he was a fighter pilot in the Air Force. And he is now cecil businessman, author and philanthropists. Guys, can we please welcome in Chad Hittings.

He won three Super Bowls with the Dallas Cowboys, only three nineties era and before he entered into the league, he was a fighter pilot in the Air Force. And he is now cecil businessman, author and philanthropists. Guys, can we please welcome in Chad Hittings.

Yo, Joe, you're like, g I Joe over here. Man, That's all.

Yo, Joe, you're like, g I Joe over here. Man, That's all.

That's all.

That's all.

That's the first first. Yeah, Hey, my dad in the locker room.

That's the first first. Yeah, Hey, my dad in the locker room.

Are you serious?

Are you serious?

It was fly Boy? Okay, you know, Billy Bates called me Flyboy. That's what kind of stuck.

It was fly Boy? Okay, you know, Billy Bates called me Flyboy. That's what kind of stuck.

I think.

I think.

I gotta call you g I Joe. That's the good one.

I gotta call you g I Joe. That's the good one.

Yeah. G I Joe was still hot in the nineties. Yeah, for sure.

Yeah. G I Joe was still hot in the nineties. Yeah, for sure.

I was a G I Joe kid. My dad was in the Army and he did twenty and I thought my dad was like roadblock, Like I wanted to do everything my dad did. I used to mortar pool, go to the the armory looking at all the guns, the Bradley's, the A brooms, the cobras, the apaches, like I've been in all those things as a kid, and I just thought it was the coolest thing. And the one thing that kept me from not joining the military was football. I just kept selling in football. If I wouldn't have got a scholarship to college, i'd have been in the army if I would and went, if I wouldn't have got drafted to the league, I just want to join the army out I went to OCS school and it's been an officer and just would have been in the military.

I was a G I Joe kid. My dad was in the Army and he did twenty and I thought my dad was like roadblock, Like I wanted to do everything my dad did. I used to mortar pool, go to the the armory looking at all the guns, the Bradley's, the A brooms, the cobras, the apaches, like I've been in all those things as a kid, and I just thought it was the coolest thing. And the one thing that kept me from not joining the military was football. I just kept selling in football. If I wouldn't have got a scholarship to college, i'd have been in the army if I would and went, if I wouldn't have got drafted to the league, I just want to join the army out I went to OCS school and it's been an officer and just would have been in the military.

But football just.

But football just.

Kind of gott in a way of that unfortunately.

Kind of gott in a way of that unfortunately.

Well that's the beauty of both those occupations. They're so similar, yeah, regarding culture, teamwork, striving for excellence and all that we do. And I come from that unique perspective, and it was easy to make that transition from flying in a fighter squadron I flew in the First Gulf War to you know, playing for the Cowboys. And I guess my true claim to fame guys is I flew my last mission in Northern Iraq in ninety two and I played in the Super Bowl the same year.

Well that's the beauty of both those occupations. They're so similar, yeah, regarding culture, teamwork, striving for excellence and all that we do. And I come from that unique perspective, and it was easy to make that transition from flying in a fighter squadron I flew in the First Gulf War to you know, playing for the Cowboys. And I guess my true claim to fame guys is I flew my last mission in Northern Iraq in ninety two and I played in the Super Bowl the same year.

Oh wow, thank you for your service.

Oh wow, thank you for your service.

No, that's how fast life changed for me. But you know with the different I mean with a compliment, the synergy in the in the cultures, yeah, and kind of the mission oriented purpose being in the military versus you know, playing for the Cowboys. At that time under Jimmy Johnson, it was all about we're not just winning games, guys, We're about winning super Bowls and that that was the first one that year.

No, that's how fast life changed for me. But you know with the different I mean with a compliment, the synergy in the in the cultures, yeah, and kind of the mission oriented purpose being in the military versus you know, playing for the Cowboys. At that time under Jimmy Johnson, it was all about we're not just winning games, guys, We're about winning super Bowls and that that was the first one that year.

So you were drafted the eleventh round right to the Dallas Cowboys.

So you were drafted the eleventh round right to the Dallas Cowboys.

That's how old I am.

That's how old I am.

But they don't even have eleven round them, like eleven round like whoa, Okay, that was back all right, got it. But you went to Air Force Academy, right, and so you served your three years five years, five years. So Number one, what were you doing on draft day?

But they don't even have eleven round them, like eleven round like whoa, Okay, that was back all right, got it. But you went to Air Force Academy, right, and so you served your three years five years, five years. So Number one, what were you doing on draft day?

Like?

Like?

What was that experience like?

What was that experience like?

Like were people getting drafted from the Air Force at the time, Like, what was that like?

Like were people getting drafted from the Air Force at the time, Like, what was that like?

And then kind of walk us through until you got there, you know.

And then kind of walk us through until you got there, you know.

Truly, the only other Service Academy graduate up until that point in time that was drafted and eventually played was another Dallas Cowboy Captain America, Roger Staubach. Yeah, Hall of Fame quarterback. He was twenty years previous to me, But there was nobody else that had through that experience. I never anticipated getting drafted. Gil Brandt, hall of Fame Cowboys player personnel director would always follow me around at these different All Star postseason things in college, at the different All American banquets, and he says, we're going to draft you. I said, I appreciate the sentiment, sir, but you know, I've got a commitment. I'm going to serve. And originally my commitment was eight years because I took on the addition because I wanted to be a pilot flying jets. So typical Service Academy commitment is five years, but I chose up it to eight years because I wanted to fly Jets. So technically playing in the NFL was never an option. So to answer your question, during draft day, I was I was actually down in the gym just working out, and somebody from my squadron called down, a hey, man, do you realize you were just drafted by the Cowboys. I'm like, well, that's cool. But here's the difference. Eleventh round draft pick in nineteen eighty eight, my signing bonus was like sixteen thousand dollars, man, So it was a lot of money. Yeah, compared today it's somebody's bar tab. But but no that it was just a difference in time and and for me it was it was really That's why I learned a lot about myself that if I profess to be an individual of character integrity, I gave my word, you know, I raised my hand to support and defend, made an off of office, to support defend the constitution of the United States. And and for me to be able to try to maybe lawyer up to get out of that commitment to go play in the league, you know, wasn't I going to have that? So I tried to succumb to the realization that planning in the NFL is never going to be an option for me. So I went in full anticipation of just being a doing a career in the military.

Truly, the only other Service Academy graduate up until that point in time that was drafted and eventually played was another Dallas Cowboy Captain America, Roger Staubach. Yeah, Hall of Fame quarterback. He was twenty years previous to me, But there was nobody else that had through that experience. I never anticipated getting drafted. Gil Brandt, hall of Fame Cowboys player personnel director would always follow me around at these different All Star postseason things in college, at the different All American banquets, and he says, we're going to draft you. I said, I appreciate the sentiment, sir, but you know, I've got a commitment. I'm going to serve. And originally my commitment was eight years because I took on the addition because I wanted to be a pilot flying jets. So typical Service Academy commitment is five years, but I chose up it to eight years because I wanted to fly Jets. So technically playing in the NFL was never an option. So to answer your question, during draft day, I was I was actually down in the gym just working out, and somebody from my squadron called down, a hey, man, do you realize you were just drafted by the Cowboys. I'm like, well, that's cool. But here's the difference. Eleventh round draft pick in nineteen eighty eight, my signing bonus was like sixteen thousand dollars, man, So it was a lot of money. Yeah, compared today it's somebody's bar tab. But but no that it was just a difference in time and and for me it was it was really That's why I learned a lot about myself that if I profess to be an individual of character integrity, I gave my word, you know, I raised my hand to support and defend, made an off of office, to support defend the constitution of the United States. And and for me to be able to try to maybe lawyer up to get out of that commitment to go play in the league, you know, wasn't I going to have that? So I tried to succumb to the realization that planning in the NFL is never going to be an option for me. So I went in full anticipation of just being a doing a career in the military.

So you went to the name of Air Force Academy, right, Yes, I don't think a lot of people understand the commitment it takes to go to a military institution at that part. So could you explain the the schedule that a student athlete slash student has to go through when they go to West Point, the Naval Academy, Air Force Academy, Like, give them a little bit of background to that.

So you went to the name of Air Force Academy, right, Yes, I don't think a lot of people understand the commitment it takes to go to a military institution at that part. So could you explain the the schedule that a student athlete slash student has to go through when they go to West Point, the Naval Academy, Air Force Academy, Like, give them a little bit of background to that.

You know, it's a very prestigious academic institution. I think I averaged twenty credit hours per semester that I was there, aside with all the military things that are expected. You're up at five point thirty six o'clock. You know, let alone make your bed, clean your room, do all that. You march to the breakfast. You got your academics. You're in a uniform as a freshman or a fourth degree, you have to march in these marble strips and you greet all the upper classmen. You go through different military training in the summertime, I went through like survival training, survival escape resistance training, which they call seier training. You do different internships, you visit different military basis to kind of get an idea what is being in the active dute to military is. Like I went and I did what at the time was called the T forty one program. I went through a simulated pilot training program where going into my senior year, first class year, I flew at T seventy two Cessna and got to the point where I could solo, took a check ride simulating what it was going to be like going through pilot training the following year. So it's a very intense mind, body, spirit, holistically training regimen to prepare you to be an officer. I'm nineteen, twenty twenty one, twenty two years old.

You know, it's a very prestigious academic institution. I think I averaged twenty credit hours per semester that I was there, aside with all the military things that are expected. You're up at five point thirty six o'clock. You know, let alone make your bed, clean your room, do all that. You march to the breakfast. You got your academics. You're in a uniform as a freshman or a fourth degree, you have to march in these marble strips and you greet all the upper classmen. You go through different military training in the summertime, I went through like survival training, survival escape resistance training, which they call seier training. You do different internships, you visit different military basis to kind of get an idea what is being in the active dute to military is. Like I went and I did what at the time was called the T forty one program. I went through a simulated pilot training program where going into my senior year, first class year, I flew at T seventy two Cessna and got to the point where I could solo, took a check ride simulating what it was going to be like going through pilot training the following year. So it's a very intense mind, body, spirit, holistically training regimen to prepare you to be an officer. I'm nineteen, twenty twenty one, twenty two years old.

Yeah, that's what I'm saying, Like that, I don't have the discipline to do that, but I guess you learn it.

Yeah, that's what I'm saying, Like that, I don't have the discipline to do that, but I guess you learn it.

Well. I'll tell you what you talk about your parents before your father's I grew up on a farm in Iowa, so I was doing a lot of this stuff. That was my regiment in life was the aspect, if you want anything in life, you got to work for it. Yes, I mean no, He's going to do it for you. And it was that Middle America upbringing was what you know, prepared me for the academy. Then I built upon that, and then going through the actor of the Air Force built upon that. It's constantly, as I subscribe the sense of being, of living a life of excellence that you know, you got to be your best self every day, you encourage others to do the same. In any organization that you're affiliated with, you encourage it, you know, to rise to a higher noble purpose or cause it's not about me. It's not about the individual, it's about the team. And you know that's something that I have tried to live in my life and I've been very grateful to have been on some pretty awesome teams.

Well. I'll tell you what you talk about your parents before your father's I grew up on a farm in Iowa, so I was doing a lot of this stuff. That was my regiment in life was the aspect, if you want anything in life, you got to work for it. Yes, I mean no, He's going to do it for you. And it was that Middle America upbringing was what you know, prepared me for the academy. Then I built upon that, and then going through the actor of the Air Force built upon that. It's constantly, as I subscribe the sense of being, of living a life of excellence that you know, you got to be your best self every day, you encourage others to do the same. In any organization that you're affiliated with, you encourage it, you know, to rise to a higher noble purpose or cause it's not about me. It's not about the individual, it's about the team. And you know that's something that I have tried to live in my life and I've been very grateful to have been on some pretty awesome teams.

Yeah, so what went into you choosing the Air Force Academy?

Yeah, so what went into you choosing the Air Force Academy?

Why not?

Why not?

Was the point one? On the Naval Academy. I don't even if they had the Coast Guard, if they even had any.

Was the point one? On the Naval Academy. I don't even if they had the Coast Guard, if they even had any.

Coast Guard Merchant Marine Academy, they had both for one probably for me the beautiful most Colorado who can argue with front range of the Rockies, you know, the being in Colorado. Uh, it was a phenomenal campus, and just being there, I was more of a say, a mountain guy than I was going on the East Coast. But at that point in time too, they had a very up and coming football team. I wanted to play Division I college football. I wasn't highly recruited out of high school. I grew a lot when I was at the Air Force Academy and I really blossomed. I was actually recruited as a tight end. I'm actually today, I'm probably more of your prototypical tight end in the league than I am a defensive tackle. But you know, after I made the switch after springball my freshman year, and you know, I guess the rest is history with that.

Coast Guard Merchant Marine Academy, they had both for one probably for me the beautiful most Colorado who can argue with front range of the Rockies, you know, the being in Colorado. Uh, it was a phenomenal campus, and just being there, I was more of a say, a mountain guy than I was going on the East Coast. But at that point in time too, they had a very up and coming football team. I wanted to play Division I college football. I wasn't highly recruited out of high school. I grew a lot when I was at the Air Force Academy and I really blossomed. I was actually recruited as a tight end. I'm actually today, I'm probably more of your prototypical tight end in the league than I am a defensive tackle. But you know, after I made the switch after springball my freshman year, and you know, I guess the rest is history with that.

What makes you decide to be a fighter pilot? I mean, I know it's the coolest thing. I mean, top gun, top gun, all these things are out. I mean, is that the swagger's position? Like is the fighter jet or Those were.

What makes you decide to be a fighter pilot? I mean, I know it's the coolest thing. I mean, top gun, top gun, all these things are out. I mean, is that the swagger's position? Like is the fighter jet or Those were.

The guys that I could use some military vernacular, but those were the individuals that I really up to it. And I had some sponsors, retired military individuals that would take cadets into their homes. Yes, and I was very fortunate to have. My sponsor was a retired one star general. His name was Bob Earthquake Titus. This guy flew f fours in Vietnam, had shot down three meigs. Was just Billie badass, and he would tell me stories and just share experiences of leading men into combat, of having the experiences of where his faith played important role of you know, doing things you don't necessarily want to do, but you do have to in support of your wingman. And again you raised that hand, you gave your words, so you have to be willing to put yourself into harm's way for a greater good. And you know, as a young man twenty two years old getting ready to graduate, you know, light my hair on fire, let's go, let's get after this. And that's where I lived that life for four years.

The guys that I could use some military vernacular, but those were the individuals that I really up to it. And I had some sponsors, retired military individuals that would take cadets into their homes. Yes, and I was very fortunate to have. My sponsor was a retired one star general. His name was Bob Earthquake Titus. This guy flew f fours in Vietnam, had shot down three meigs. Was just Billie badass, and he would tell me stories and just share experiences of leading men into combat, of having the experiences of where his faith played important role of you know, doing things you don't necessarily want to do, but you do have to in support of your wingman. And again you raised that hand, you gave your words, so you have to be willing to put yourself into harm's way for a greater good. And you know, as a young man twenty two years old getting ready to graduate, you know, light my hair on fire, let's go, let's get after this. And that's where I lived that life for four years.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So, out of the forty five combine missions that you flew, is there one that kind of sticks on in your mind?

So, out of the forty five combine missions that you flew, is there one that kind of sticks on in your mind?

You know, not necessarily it was the combat missions. But I was based at ari Bentwaters Woodbridge in England. They're called the Twin Bases, and we in our initial ferry flight, we flew a four ship of a tens from that base to Insulin, Turkey, which is outside the city of a Donna, And for the A ten. For those of you who don't know, in the A ten, oh yeah, the world, you know, just quick sidebar with that. That whole plane for those of you if you're looking it up on Wikipedia or whatever right now. But the A ten was designed as a close air support aircraft. Yes, the whole plane was designed around that thirty milimeters gap and gun called the Galway Avenger shot depleted uranium tip hike explosive and scendary bullets four thousand rounds a minute, you know, bullet thirty millimeters about EA big. I could shoot a tank from over fifteen thousand feet away three miles, penetrate over two and a half inches of armor, you know, and disable or take out that tank. I mean, it was an awesome, awesome piece of machinery to fly. But the mission that that stuck out my mind was in this initial ferry flight. And the eight ten is at the time underpowered. It's not as fast as your F sixteens, your F fifteens, your F one eleven's that were in the Air Force inventory at the time. It was slow. So it took us, you know, about seven and a half eight hours to fly and you're flying over the Mediterranean and we had just flew around the boot of Italy in the Mediterranean, and I ended up having engine problem my number two, my right engine, and it ended up having to shut the engine down through an emergency procedure. And at this point in time, the aircraft's underpowered, your single engine, you declare an emergency. We ended up diverting with one of my wingmen into the island of Suda Bay Crete. That was something that will always live with me as like how you work together with your wingmen. I was flying the jet, going through emergency procedures, my wingman, one guy, you know, navigating, communicating with the FAA or the air traffic control. Another guy's helping me work through the procedures. It's just the same thing, like on a team when I'm down. And it was in my stands playing for the Cowboys, looking over at Charles Haley and saying, Okay, what do you got man? He goes, Okay, he's coming down on it. You know, you talking back and forth, same type of communication, same type of brotherhood. Yeah, that went back and forth. And again that's why I relate back that the two two occupations were so similar in culture.

You know, not necessarily it was the combat missions. But I was based at ari Bentwaters Woodbridge in England. They're called the Twin Bases, and we in our initial ferry flight, we flew a four ship of a tens from that base to Insulin, Turkey, which is outside the city of a Donna, And for the A ten. For those of you who don't know, in the A ten, oh yeah, the world, you know, just quick sidebar with that. That whole plane for those of you if you're looking it up on Wikipedia or whatever right now. But the A ten was designed as a close air support aircraft. Yes, the whole plane was designed around that thirty milimeters gap and gun called the Galway Avenger shot depleted uranium tip hike explosive and scendary bullets four thousand rounds a minute, you know, bullet thirty millimeters about EA big. I could shoot a tank from over fifteen thousand feet away three miles, penetrate over two and a half inches of armor, you know, and disable or take out that tank. I mean, it was an awesome, awesome piece of machinery to fly. But the mission that that stuck out my mind was in this initial ferry flight. And the eight ten is at the time underpowered. It's not as fast as your F sixteens, your F fifteens, your F one eleven's that were in the Air Force inventory at the time. It was slow. So it took us, you know, about seven and a half eight hours to fly and you're flying over the Mediterranean and we had just flew around the boot of Italy in the Mediterranean, and I ended up having engine problem my number two, my right engine, and it ended up having to shut the engine down through an emergency procedure. And at this point in time, the aircraft's underpowered, your single engine, you declare an emergency. We ended up diverting with one of my wingmen into the island of Suda Bay Crete. That was something that will always live with me as like how you work together with your wingmen. I was flying the jet, going through emergency procedures, my wingman, one guy, you know, navigating, communicating with the FAA or the air traffic control. Another guy's helping me work through the procedures. It's just the same thing, like on a team when I'm down. And it was in my stands playing for the Cowboys, looking over at Charles Haley and saying, Okay, what do you got man? He goes, Okay, he's coming down on it. You know, you talking back and forth, same type of communication, same type of brotherhood. Yeah, that went back and forth. And again that's why I relate back that the two two occupations were so similar in culture.

How much did you wait, because like, what's the weight limit or something to go from like a plan.

How much did you wait, because like, what's the weight limit or something to go from like a plan.

I had received waivers from my height and weight to be able to fly. I was too big, actually too big.

I had received waivers from my height and weight to be able to fly. I was too big, actually too big.

I was wondering about that.

I was wondering about that.

I was too big for the ACES two ejection seat. Yeah, so they weren't sure if I cleared the tail for everyone had to punch out of the aircraft because I was just too big. I was, I think I reported Initially I bulked up. I came in about two seventy two seventy five, huh, and then I ended up the end of that year. I was like at two ninety. Yes, So it's just I was wondering about that.

I was too big for the ACES two ejection seat. Yeah, so they weren't sure if I cleared the tail for everyone had to punch out of the aircraft because I was just too big. I was, I think I reported Initially I bulked up. I came in about two seventy two seventy five, huh, and then I ended up the end of that year. I was like at two ninety. Yes, So it's just I was wondering about that.

Yeah, my dad worked on fighter plane injection seats for the sixteenths.

Yeah, my dad worked on fighter plane injection seats for the sixteenths.

A matter of fact, same ejection seat. Yeah.

A matter of fact, same ejection seat. Yeah.

If you could pick any plane, any fighter plane to fly, which one would it be?

If you could pick any plane, any fighter plane to fly, which one would it be?

And why you know, I'd always go back to the A ten if I had to do you know what we did, but I would The plane that I would like to fly that was probably the most fun was a T thirty eight. And the reason why is, you know, supersonic jet trainer that we flew. The plane would roll seven hundred and twenty degrees a second, so it could go around twice in a second. You know, we mess around, you lift your leg up, slammed the yoke over and like a corkscrew going down finding the air. But it I want to do that. I've lived in life like but it, but no that it'd probably be a thirty eight just but again I could, I couldn't fit into it. I certainly couldn't fit into it.

And why you know, I'd always go back to the A ten if I had to do you know what we did, but I would The plane that I would like to fly that was probably the most fun was a T thirty eight. And the reason why is, you know, supersonic jet trainer that we flew. The plane would roll seven hundred and twenty degrees a second, so it could go around twice in a second. You know, we mess around, you lift your leg up, slammed the yoke over and like a corkscrew going down finding the air. But it I want to do that. I've lived in life like but it, but no that it'd probably be a thirty eight just but again I could, I couldn't fit into it. I certainly couldn't fit into it.

Now.

Now.

Oh god, that sounds like it's so fun. I actually want it.

Oh god, that sounds like it's so fun. I actually want it.

Went to Thunderbirds a few a few years ago and I'm pulled nine gs and it was the.

Went to Thunderbirds a few a few years ago and I'm pulled nine gs and it was the.

Coolest I've ever done. I kid you not.

Coolest I've ever done. I kid you not.

I'm up there and the guy was like, you know, you gotta breathe. So I try to do the breathing, but he was like, all right, pin at you ready, and I was like, yeah, let's go, let's go, and he flips it he and I'm just like, oh my god, this is so cool.

I'm up there and the guy was like, you know, you gotta breathe. So I try to do the breathing, but he was like, all right, pin at you ready, and I was like, yeah, let's go, let's go, and he flips it he and I'm just like, oh my god, this is so cool.

Don't faint.

Don't faint.

Don't faint as we go.

Don't faint as we go.

I'm feeling it. I'm like okay, and he's like, yeah, how you doing. I was like, my bad, I didn't. I didn't breathe. I need you to pull nine more g's so we can do it again. So he was like, all right, all right, all right, I'm about to pull some geez and he just and I'm like, and you have this g you got the G suit on. And I'm like digging my heels and I'm squeezing my butt together and I'm digging my calves in the in the seat, trying to try not to pass out and keep that blood right there. Man, it's the coolest thing. If you've never done it. I don't know if I'm giving it grace the way I'm describing it, but it's probably one of the coolest things that I've ever experienced.

I'm feeling it. I'm like okay, and he's like, yeah, how you doing. I was like, my bad, I didn't. I didn't breathe. I need you to pull nine more g's so we can do it again. So he was like, all right, all right, all right, I'm about to pull some geez and he just and I'm like, and you have this g you got the G suit on. And I'm like digging my heels and I'm squeezing my butt together and I'm digging my calves in the in the seat, trying to try not to pass out and keep that blood right there. Man, it's the coolest thing. If you've never done it. I don't know if I'm giving it grace the way I'm describing it, but it's probably one of the coolest things that I've ever experienced.

And you're smoked.

And you're smoked.

It's physically exhausting because it's called an l one maneuver and it's literally you're trying to prevent the blood from pulling out of your head into your lower extremities. Positive g's will do that, so it's like, okay, graphic weighted to the best describe it as like you're constant pay and you're trying to go to the bathroom. Yeah, yeah, that's what you do. And you can pull that if you're in a Just imagine doing that for thirty forty seconds at a time, multiple times in an hour and a half to our mission. If you're doing what they call BFM basic fighter maneuvers, are in a dogfight. But man, that's one beauty about flying the eight ten. I didn't have to pull a lot of those, Jesus, But explain what basically when pulling a geep, like pulling nine g's that's like nine times your body weight going against you. There's gravitational force pulling against you. So your two hundred pounds, say whatever, that's eighteen hundred pounds coming down on top of you.

It's physically exhausting because it's called an l one maneuver and it's literally you're trying to prevent the blood from pulling out of your head into your lower extremities. Positive g's will do that, so it's like, okay, graphic weighted to the best describe it as like you're constant pay and you're trying to go to the bathroom. Yeah, yeah, that's what you do. And you can pull that if you're in a Just imagine doing that for thirty forty seconds at a time, multiple times in an hour and a half to our mission. If you're doing what they call BFM basic fighter maneuvers, are in a dogfight. But man, that's one beauty about flying the eight ten. I didn't have to pull a lot of those, Jesus, But explain what basically when pulling a geep, like pulling nine g's that's like nine times your body weight going against you. There's gravitational force pulling against you. So your two hundred pounds, say whatever, that's eighteen hundred pounds coming down on top of you.

And after I flew, I got to the ground smoked. I hadn't take a nap because I had to. I have like an hour to get home. So I went inside the bay the hangar. I took it now for about thirty minutes, and then I had enough energy I drove home. I drove an hour home and then got in the bed again. And it's probably one two o'clock in the afternoon, and slept about four or five hours, and then woke up and then went to sleep about say ten or eleven o'clock and slept again. Like when I say smoked, never it felt like I played two games I played a game on Sunday in another game on Tuesday, like completely just smoke and you guys go up and down all the time in a day for like training and stuff.

And after I flew, I got to the ground smoked. I hadn't take a nap because I had to. I have like an hour to get home. So I went inside the bay the hangar. I took it now for about thirty minutes, and then I had enough energy I drove home. I drove an hour home and then got in the bed again. And it's probably one two o'clock in the afternoon, and slept about four or five hours, and then woke up and then went to sleep about say ten or eleven o'clock and slept again. Like when I say smoked, never it felt like I played two games I played a game on Sunday in another game on Tuesday, like completely just smoke and you guys go up and down all the time in a day for like training and stuff.

Right, Well, you acclimate to that. And it's not every mission you're going to be pulling nine GE's, but you do acclimate after what it's just your body, I commented, used to it.

Right, Well, you acclimate to that. And it's not every mission you're going to be pulling nine GE's, but you do acclimate after what it's just your body, I commented, used to it.

Yeah, So, what was the hardest thing you had to learn or Yeah, the hardest thing you had to learn to do as a fighter playing as a fighter jet plane like probably fighter pilot.

Yeah, So, what was the hardest thing you had to learn or Yeah, the hardest thing you had to learn to do as a fighter playing as a fighter jet plane like probably fighter pilot.

Probably the attention to detail. I'm a big picture guy. I don't like minutia. I don't like details, I don't like nuance. But that was a thing with being a fighter pilot. It was the little things that matter. You have its procedure, it's there is Flexibility is the key to airpower when you get missions that there's a lot of times that we would brief a mission, whether training or a combat mission, and you brief a certain scenario. Then you get out to your target area and you talk with a fact you talk with a nailo guy in there, a guy on the ground, and the whole tactical situation that you had brief changed, so now what do you do? You know, and it's just the training that you have. You you end up making the adjustments and go just like making halftime adjustments. You know, at halftime in a game. It was the same there, but there's a little more at stake. But that's where I think for me, it was the ability to think outside the box to develop that skill set, pay attention to detail and thinking outside the box and being creative, you know, on the spot and think quick you can't there's you can't hesitate.

Probably the attention to detail. I'm a big picture guy. I don't like minutia. I don't like details, I don't like nuance. But that was a thing with being a fighter pilot. It was the little things that matter. You have its procedure, it's there is Flexibility is the key to airpower when you get missions that there's a lot of times that we would brief a mission, whether training or a combat mission, and you brief a certain scenario. Then you get out to your target area and you talk with a fact you talk with a nailo guy in there, a guy on the ground, and the whole tactical situation that you had brief changed, so now what do you do? You know, and it's just the training that you have. You you end up making the adjustments and go just like making halftime adjustments. You know, at halftime in a game. It was the same there, but there's a little more at stake. But that's where I think for me, it was the ability to think outside the box to develop that skill set, pay attention to detail and thinking outside the box and being creative, you know, on the spot and think quick you can't there's you can't hesitate.

That probably helped you in football too. Oh yeah, I.

That probably helped you in football too. Oh yeah, I.

Mean that's what I'm saying. This is everything.

Mean that's what I'm saying. This is everything.

That's exactly what react to you not even thinking, you just react.

That's exactly what react to you not even thinking, you just react.

That's exactly.

That's exactly.

And a lot of it, you know, when you're flying pulling geez, it's it's muscle memory. A lot of that is muscle memory, but it's it's putting yourself through the discipline of having to do it over and over and over and be willing to fail and learn from those mistakes and do it over and over and over. Is where you know, again it's a skill set, set me up for life with that.

And a lot of it, you know, when you're flying pulling geez, it's it's muscle memory. A lot of that is muscle memory, but it's it's putting yourself through the discipline of having to do it over and over and over and be willing to fail and learn from those mistakes and do it over and over and over. Is where you know, again it's a skill set, set me up for life with that.

You spend five years in the Air Force, there's a five year commitment, how do you go.

You spend five years in the Air Force, there's a five year commitment, how do you go.

Well, actually, the only I'm doing four My commitment was eight years.

Well, actually, the only I'm doing four My commitment was eight years.

Oh you're eight okay.

Oh you're eight okay.

But this is how I call it a god thing, guys, just because in nineteen ninety two a lot of part of ninety one ninety two are armed forces. If you recall in nineteen eighty nine, in the nineties, the wall came down from Berlin. Soviet Union is now no, the Cold War scenario essentially over. We just did our thing, you know. Then our armed forces are trying to downsize and not enough guys get out. So they made waivers. They waived my commitment time. So I went from eight years to four years. And this is where I raised my It's a crazy story how it all went down, but I raised my hand and said, hey, you know, I'll get out of the Cowboys. Jerry Jones had just bought the team from Clint Murchison and you know Tech Shram and coach Landry at the time in eighty nine. And I'm like, you, guys, do you know you know who I am or whatnot? But they said, yeah, well come on, we'll give you work out. So I ended up flying before I separated, flying from England at London Heathrow Airport, flew back to Dallas to do a workout, you know, not sleep. I had a you know, a god thing. I had a phenomenal workout because I stayed in shape. When you're deployed, there's not much to do except workout, you know, and bulk up ended up having a great workout. Coach Johnson came up to me afterwards and said, Chad, you know, we like what we see. When can you get out? I said, you know, I said, coach. I literally slut him. I said, coach, I don't know. I'll go find out. I'm going to find out. So I went back some in my paperwork. Within three weeks, I was out processed out at the Air Force, moved my wife and myself from England back to the States, getting ready to go first uh training camp. That's how fast it happened.

But this is how I call it a god thing, guys, just because in nineteen ninety two a lot of part of ninety one ninety two are armed forces. If you recall in nineteen eighty nine, in the nineties, the wall came down from Berlin. Soviet Union is now no, the Cold War scenario essentially over. We just did our thing, you know. Then our armed forces are trying to downsize and not enough guys get out. So they made waivers. They waived my commitment time. So I went from eight years to four years. And this is where I raised my It's a crazy story how it all went down, but I raised my hand and said, hey, you know, I'll get out of the Cowboys. Jerry Jones had just bought the team from Clint Murchison and you know Tech Shram and coach Landry at the time in eighty nine. And I'm like, you, guys, do you know you know who I am or whatnot? But they said, yeah, well come on, we'll give you work out. So I ended up flying before I separated, flying from England at London Heathrow Airport, flew back to Dallas to do a workout, you know, not sleep. I had a you know, a god thing. I had a phenomenal workout because I stayed in shape. When you're deployed, there's not much to do except workout, you know, and bulk up ended up having a great workout. Coach Johnson came up to me afterwards and said, Chad, you know, we like what we see. When can you get out? I said, you know, I said, coach. I literally slut him. I said, coach, I don't know. I'll go find out. I'm going to find out. So I went back some in my paperwork. Within three weeks, I was out processed out at the Air Force, moved my wife and myself from England back to the States, getting ready to go first uh training camp. That's how fast it happened.

Yeah, we've had this. I mean, I've probably had this feeling or moment when I was twenty two. How were you when you enter the league twenty two? Twenty two, twenty two? Yours a little bit different. You're a bit of a grown grown man at twenty seven. Is your rookie year. What was your welcome to the NFL moment? You're coming that locker room, you think you've accomplished some stuff.

Yeah, we've had this. I mean, I've probably had this feeling or moment when I was twenty two. How were you when you enter the league twenty two? Twenty two, twenty two? Yours a little bit different. You're a bit of a grown grown man at twenty seven. Is your rookie year. What was your welcome to the NFL moment? You're coming that locker room, you think you've accomplished some stuff.

Did you go to the mission?

Did you go to the mission?

I was, I was respect Did you go to the White House? Oh? This is this is well he's walking around here warm moon. H yah we uh My welcome to the NFL was. We had been scrimmaging for a couple of weeks. We were going to go down to San Antonio. We were training camp US in Austin. We're gonna scrimming the Houston Oilers. So I'm talking dating myself here again and we're on the sidelines. My coach position coach Butch Davis was the first time we get to hit somebody else. You know, it's live. Everybody's live. I said, okay, coach, everybody's live. Everybody's live. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you'll go out gill him. Second series, I was in there. We do a little stunt in the middle. I come around the corner and I ear hold Warren Moon. We're in the Red Jersey. Guys blew up, big brawl fight. Jimmy goes get that rookie out of here, and I'm sitting there. He said, there chuning me up and down, and he goes, what the heck do you think? I said, coach, Butch told me I'm pointing out. But Butch told me it was live. And I look over Butch, but just walking the other way, somebody come to Jess, Well, I realize how it is man, So uh yeah, that's right. It was a hilarious I laugh with Butch about that now.

I was, I was respect Did you go to the White House? Oh? This is this is well he's walking around here warm moon. H yah we uh My welcome to the NFL was. We had been scrimmaging for a couple of weeks. We were going to go down to San Antonio. We were training camp US in Austin. We're gonna scrimming the Houston Oilers. So I'm talking dating myself here again and we're on the sidelines. My coach position coach Butch Davis was the first time we get to hit somebody else. You know, it's live. Everybody's live. I said, okay, coach, everybody's live. Everybody's live. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you'll go out gill him. Second series, I was in there. We do a little stunt in the middle. I come around the corner and I ear hold Warren Moon. We're in the Red Jersey. Guys blew up, big brawl fight. Jimmy goes get that rookie out of here, and I'm sitting there. He said, there chuning me up and down, and he goes, what the heck do you think? I said, coach, Butch told me I'm pointing out. But Butch told me it was live. And I look over Butch, but just walking the other way, somebody come to Jess, Well, I realize how it is man, So uh yeah, that's right. It was a hilarious I laugh with Butch about that now.

But he was just trying to get you going going.

But he was just trying to get you going going.

I was a literal guy, you know. He thought, Okay, you don't hit anybody with the red jersey. Everybody's live. Coach, you said, everybody's live.

I was a literal guy, you know. He thought, Okay, you don't hit anybody with the red jersey. Everybody's live. Coach, you said, everybody's live.

Literally everyone we've had on this podcast, when they've done they scrimmaged with another team. They was like, oh yeah, the team brawl. We had a big old team brawl like that was just the thing to do. Even back when you play we played.

Literally everyone we've had on this podcast, when they've done they scrimmaged with another team. They was like, oh yeah, the team brawl. We had a big old team brawl like that was just the thing to do. Even back when you play we played.

Man, we would always scrimmage. Raiders are always coming to town, and it was like every other every other series was a brawl.

Man, we would always scrimmage. Raiders are always coming to town, and it was like every other every other series was a brawl.

I think they're the dumbest thing ever, because you know somebody's gonna get hurt at some point.

I think they're the dumbest thing ever, because you know somebody's gonna get hurt at some point.

Because I loved him, I love We did it with Miami.

Because I loved him, I love We did it with Miami.

Yeah, big big brawl in Miami and Caroline.

Yeah, big big brawl in Miami and Caroline.

I love practicing against other teams because you get tired of seeing your own teams the same place. And like you said, man, competition ratchets up and emotions will fly. I mean, you guys were so much. It was it. We look at the game now and we think it's different than we played. So I know in the nineties what the game was, Uh, the physical conditions that you guys play. I mean, at least we got a day off every seven days. I don't even know if you guys had that.

I love practicing against other teams because you get tired of seeing your own teams the same place. And like you said, man, competition ratchets up and emotions will fly. I mean, you guys were so much. It was it. We look at the game now and we think it's different than we played. So I know in the nineties what the game was, Uh, the physical conditions that you guys play. I mean, at least we got a day off every seven days. I don't even know if you guys had that.

We go we got a single practice that was our day off. Yeah, we get an afternoon off OR'd be a walkthrough. But you know then, but you how the game is above you. I talk to those guys that played in the seventies, how that the physicality of Yeah, man, there's no such I mean quarterback, everybody goes on. There's no rough in the quarterback at.

We go we got a single practice that was our day off. Yeah, we get an afternoon off OR'd be a walkthrough. But you know then, but you how the game is above you. I talk to those guys that played in the seventies, how that the physicality of Yeah, man, there's no such I mean quarterback, everybody goes on. There's no rough in the quarterback at.

The y they had two steps, yeah, two steps.

The y they had two steps, yeah, two steps.

So it's crazy.

So it's crazy.

We're going to take a short break and we'll be back in a minute.

We're going to take a short break and we'll be back in a minute.

What was it like when you walk into that locker room and what was that ninety one ninety two and you got Hall of famers all over the place, a locker room that is well now known as probably one of the wildest locker rooms ever assembled in the NFL history.

What was it like when you walk into that locker room and what was that ninety one ninety two and you got Hall of famers all over the place, a locker room that is well now known as probably one of the wildest locker rooms ever assembled in the NFL history.

We just didn't know it at the time.

We just didn't know it at the time.

What was that like going from where you were.

What was that like going from where you were.

At to that locker room.

At to that locker room.

It was culture shock, like you wouldn't believe. I sometimes sat there and clicked my heels together. I'm not in Kansas here anymore. It I've never laughed so hard in all my life being around some of these fellas. Just the humor and there's a lot of testosterone flowing. But these guys, I can honestly say, from all those Hall of Famers, I've never been around a group of guys that were more selfless do whatever it took for the team to win. And I'm talking you know Troy Manemmet Smith, Michael Lervin, Larry Allen, Charles Haley, you know Darren Woods and all these guys Hall of Famers and future Hall of Famers. That it was unbelievable and it was a great leadership laboratory really on seeing the elite of the elite performing at that level and what it took to continue to perform.

It was culture shock, like you wouldn't believe. I sometimes sat there and clicked my heels together. I'm not in Kansas here anymore. It I've never laughed so hard in all my life being around some of these fellas. Just the humor and there's a lot of testosterone flowing. But these guys, I can honestly say, from all those Hall of Famers, I've never been around a group of guys that were more selfless do whatever it took for the team to win. And I'm talking you know Troy Manemmet Smith, Michael Lervin, Larry Allen, Charles Haley, you know Darren Woods and all these guys Hall of Famers and future Hall of Famers. That it was unbelievable and it was a great leadership laboratory really on seeing the elite of the elite performing at that level and what it took to continue to perform.

How did you find that balance of twenty seven as a rookie. You have all these other people who were probably leaders, but you come from the different world. Like where was that balance at? And now how did you actually get used to that? Like, I don't know, I don't know if anybody's ever had an experience like that.

How did you find that balance of twenty seven as a rookie. You have all these other people who were probably leaders, but you come from the different world. Like where was that balance at? And now how did you actually get used to that? Like, I don't know, I don't know if anybody's ever had an experience like that.

Pretty much as well.

Pretty much as well.

What was intriguing to me is I was you know, when I came in, guys would be guys like you said, you wanted to be a soldier. Little kids when we grew up, we played you know, we played Army, Yeah, or you played you wanted to emulate your favorite sports hero, professional athlete, whatever that is. And it was that when I got in that locker room, guys were not intrigued. It could have cared less what I did at the Air Force Academy regarding my football career, but hey, tell me about find those missions? What was that like?

What was intriguing to me is I was you know, when I came in, guys would be guys like you said, you wanted to be a soldier. Little kids when we grew up, we played you know, we played Army, Yeah, or you played you wanted to emulate your favorite sports hero, professional athlete, whatever that is. And it was that when I got in that locker room, guys were not intrigued. It could have cared less what I did at the Air Force Academy regarding my football career, but hey, tell me about find those missions? What was that like?

Yeah, I'm like.

Yeah, I'm like.

You know, here, you're a you know, you're an all pro and you want to hear about my RinkyDink find a mission in Northern Iraq. Yeah, yeah, tell me about that. And that's what it was really intriguing. And that's where kind of my mind opened up to that individual value. You never know don't have that. My perception of reality was not necessary reality in regards to the other guys, they're just normal dudes that have a specific talent and they've learned how to utilize those skills that skill set for you know, something that's pretty special. And but you know, to your point, it's it was all about, yeah, you know, realizing what I could offer to the team. And just from a little bit different perspective regarding you know, guys, I've been in the real world. You know, I had, I had a real job, and you know, particularly for the rookies coming in there just out of college, and it's I'm telling you, you know, it's like, hey, guys, it's not about you. I mean, you're a rookie. You got to prove it all over every day when you go out there. You got to prove yourself and and you got to pay that price every day. And and that's why I think those teams are so special. Yeah, I mean, we should have gone for in a row back in the day. But it was a great experience.

You know, here, you're a you know, you're an all pro and you want to hear about my RinkyDink find a mission in Northern Iraq. Yeah, yeah, tell me about that. And that's what it was really intriguing. And that's where kind of my mind opened up to that individual value. You never know don't have that. My perception of reality was not necessary reality in regards to the other guys, they're just normal dudes that have a specific talent and they've learned how to utilize those skills that skill set for you know, something that's pretty special. And but you know, to your point, it's it was all about, yeah, you know, realizing what I could offer to the team. And just from a little bit different perspective regarding you know, guys, I've been in the real world. You know, I had, I had a real job, and you know, particularly for the rookies coming in there just out of college, and it's I'm telling you, you know, it's like, hey, guys, it's not about you. I mean, you're a rookie. You got to prove it all over every day when you go out there. You got to prove yourself and and you got to pay that price every day. And and that's why I think those teams are so special. Yeah, I mean, we should have gone for in a row back in the day. But it was a great experience.

Tell me, the mindset you have to have your flying a mission and then that same year you're playing in a freaking Super Bowl.

Tell me, the mindset you have to have your flying a mission and then that same year you're playing in a freaking Super Bowl.

You know, it went through a lot. For me. It was just the transition of being a pilot, yeah, having that mindset to now I'm a defense Jimmy tried to put me at a defensive end we had coming in. I think we had five defensive linemen in camp. And this was back in the day when two days were two days. Oh yeah, it was in Austin, Texas. You guys been in Texas, it wouldn't be unusual. I learned a lot about myself because first practice, I think I lost fourteen pounds in a tow to day and I didn't know about hydration at the time. You know, for fourteen pounds, you know, I had to drink two and a half gallons of water just to make it even net zero. And so I learned a lot about IVS and hydration at that point in time. But you know, I ended up making the team, but I was inactive for my first eight games. And you talk about a blow to the ego here from former Outland Trophy winner, unanimous All American, you know, academic All American. Suppose the guy that's was the man you know in college football. Now I'm not even dressed. I'm standing on the sidelines and for me, it wasn't granted I hadn't played football in four years, but for me, it was a blow. I went up to coach Johnson halfway through the season. I said, Coach, I'll do whatever it takes to get on the field. He said, okay, Chad, you're running down kickoffs. I was at L four or five, right down the middle. I was. My job was to run down there and blow up the wedge.

You know, it went through a lot. For me. It was just the transition of being a pilot, yeah, having that mindset to now I'm a defense Jimmy tried to put me at a defensive end we had coming in. I think we had five defensive linemen in camp. And this was back in the day when two days were two days. Oh yeah, it was in Austin, Texas. You guys been in Texas, it wouldn't be unusual. I learned a lot about myself because first practice, I think I lost fourteen pounds in a tow to day and I didn't know about hydration at the time. You know, for fourteen pounds, you know, I had to drink two and a half gallons of water just to make it even net zero. And so I learned a lot about IVS and hydration at that point in time. But you know, I ended up making the team, but I was inactive for my first eight games. And you talk about a blow to the ego here from former Outland Trophy winner, unanimous All American, you know, academic All American. Suppose the guy that's was the man you know in college football. Now I'm not even dressed. I'm standing on the sidelines and for me, it wasn't granted I hadn't played football in four years, but for me, it was a blow. I went up to coach Johnson halfway through the season. I said, Coach, I'll do whatever it takes to get on the field. He said, okay, Chad, you're running down kickoffs. I was at L four or five, right down the middle. I was. My job was to run down there and blow up the wedge.

Love it.

Love it.

And that's how I got on, you know, on the punt team on that So I volunteered to play special teams as a d tackle and that's where I you know, tell a lot of guys, it's you do whatever it takes and and the more things that you can do for that team. You guys know this, more difficult to is for them to get rid of you in the long run.

And that's how I got on, you know, on the punt team on that So I volunteered to play special teams as a d tackle and that's where I you know, tell a lot of guys, it's you do whatever it takes and and the more things that you can do for that team. You guys know this, more difficult to is for them to get rid of you in the long run.

And sometimes the lower they pay you, yeah, they pay you less when you can do a lot of things.

And sometimes the lower they pay you, yeah, they pay you less when you can do a lot of things.

Yeah.

Yeah.

See special teams, special teams.

See special teams, special teams.

No special time, not my thing.

No special time, not my thing.

So, your military veteran, NFL veteran, you've had two good careers and two jobs. I want you to talk about what was it easier for you to transition out of playing football Because you were already, you already had two really good jobs, or you had two careers already.

So, your military veteran, NFL veteran, you've had two good careers and two jobs. I want you to talk about what was it easier for you to transition out of playing football Because you were already, you already had two really good jobs, or you had two careers already.

That's probably the most difficult transition was actually after football, after the second trend or during the second transition. And I'll say this was because you know, again the comparable cultures. And I went from you know, military, they're telling you what to do. You're gonna buy this mission, this mission, you know, then making the team with the Cowboys. You know your mission is. You know what your mission is when football games? You work out off and do whatever it takes. Right. But now I get to the point I can be whatever I want to be. Yeah, who am I? What do I want to be? And that's where I think my struggle And that's where I counsel and mentor a lot of young guys that are separating from the military and or professional athletics. First question, I'll ask, who are you, Peana? Who are you Peena? You know I played so many years in the league, blah blah blah. I know, man, that's what you did. What you do does not define who you are? Who are you as a person? What's your identity? Wrap around? And that for me was trying to figure that out going through a lot of self awareness, a lot of asking myself certain questions in that regard. And when I figured that out, that's where I realized that, man, I can do anything that I want because I know who I am and word I just want to serve.

That's probably the most difficult transition was actually after football, after the second trend or during the second transition. And I'll say this was because you know, again the comparable cultures. And I went from you know, military, they're telling you what to do. You're gonna buy this mission, this mission, you know, then making the team with the Cowboys. You know your mission is. You know what your mission is when football games? You work out off and do whatever it takes. Right. But now I get to the point I can be whatever I want to be. Yeah, who am I? What do I want to be? And that's where I think my struggle And that's where I counsel and mentor a lot of young guys that are separating from the military and or professional athletics. First question, I'll ask, who are you, Peana? Who are you Peena? You know I played so many years in the league, blah blah blah. I know, man, that's what you did. What you do does not define who you are? Who are you as a person? What's your identity? Wrap around? And that for me was trying to figure that out going through a lot of self awareness, a lot of asking myself certain questions in that regard. And when I figured that out, that's where I realized that, man, I can do anything that I want because I know who I am and word I just want to serve.

Yeah, and how long did it take you to figure that out, to figure out who you were?

Yeah, and how long did it take you to figure that out, to figure out who you were?

Well, it took me. I mean I struggled with that for a good year year plus. When you say struggle, what is that, Well, it's it's like, Okay, I felt because growing up on a farm, being in the military, being a professional athlete, that I had to jump into something right away. I mean, if I'm not doing something, I'm wasting my life as opposed to taking my time figuring out where I want to be, what best works for me. I jumped into a couple of things that I probably should have too quickly, and you know, I got an MBA and getting burnt financially and a few opportunities things that that I kind of learned the hard way. And that's where the council guys, take your time, if you're financially able to do that, take your time and invest in what your passion is and where you feel that you can plug yourself into.

Well, it took me. I mean I struggled with that for a good year year plus. When you say struggle, what is that, Well, it's it's like, Okay, I felt because growing up on a farm, being in the military, being a professional athlete, that I had to jump into something right away. I mean, if I'm not doing something, I'm wasting my life as opposed to taking my time figuring out where I want to be, what best works for me. I jumped into a couple of things that I probably should have too quickly, and you know, I got an MBA and getting burnt financially and a few opportunities things that that I kind of learned the hard way. And that's where the council guys, take your time, if you're financially able to do that, take your time and invest in what your passion is and where you feel that you can plug yourself into.

So what are you doing nowadays to keep you busy?

So what are you doing nowadays to keep you busy?

That's the beauty I could do. I do a lot of different things. I have commercial real estate business based in Dallas where a boutique real estate firm called Rubican. I do a lot of public speaking. I talk on things that we're talking on right now, core values, identity, living excellence. I've written three books, authored three books, you know, and now same things. I started a men's ministry called Wingman, and it's all about discipleship of particularly bringing young men up and realizing who they are, you know, as men. So I do a lot of philanthropy and then you know, I'm a husband and I'm a father. I just became a grandpa. Man about it's it is life transformation. When you see your child being born is one thing, but when you see your child give birth to another child, you realize that it's the legacy that this is going to go beyond just me, and that's something that's multi generational. To me, that was very humbling and it realized that, you know, now I really need to work harder to improve the world around me and to make it a better place for my grandson.

That's the beauty I could do. I do a lot of different things. I have commercial real estate business based in Dallas where a boutique real estate firm called Rubican. I do a lot of public speaking. I talk on things that we're talking on right now, core values, identity, living excellence. I've written three books, authored three books, you know, and now same things. I started a men's ministry called Wingman, and it's all about discipleship of particularly bringing young men up and realizing who they are, you know, as men. So I do a lot of philanthropy and then you know, I'm a husband and I'm a father. I just became a grandpa. Man about it's it is life transformation. When you see your child being born is one thing, but when you see your child give birth to another child, you realize that it's the legacy that this is going to go beyond just me, and that's something that's multi generational. To me, that was very humbling and it realized that, you know, now I really need to work harder to improve the world around me and to make it a better place for my grandson.

Out of all the hats that you wear or the ventures that you're doing, what's one of the ones that gives you the most gratification.

Out of all the hats that you wear or the ventures that you're doing, what's one of the ones that gives you the most gratification.

Being the man of God my faith? Yeah, and that translates to everything else that I do as a husband, as a father, as a member of my community, all that derives around that aspect of my identity as to who I am.

Being the man of God my faith? Yeah, and that translates to everything else that I do as a husband, as a father, as a member of my community, all that derives around that aspect of my identity as to who I am.

We always talk about your influence, what makes you who you are, how you're able to accomplish all these different things, and it's usually because of people pouring into you. And so if I was to bring up this situation Mount Rushmore, who would be on your Mount Rushmore of influence on.

We always talk about your influence, what makes you who you are, how you're able to accomplish all these different things, and it's usually because of people pouring into you. And so if I was to bring up this situation Mount Rushmore, who would be on your Mount Rushmore of influence on.

You to be help you get to where you are right now?

You to be help you get to where you are right now?

I think my parents would be first and foremost just instilling in me that sense of purpose, work, ethic, et cetera. But then I'd go back to my high school football coaches. You know, other than my parents, you know, an immediate family, my coaches were the men that had the most impact on my life that I wanted to emulate. I wanted to be like my high school coaches. And that's again not the sidebar, but I encourage coaches that a lot of times, you know, because of certain personal situations and family situations with kids, they don't have that, and the coaches are maybe a lot of times the last obstacle before that kid goes down the system or before he falls through the cracks. And for me, I love coaches, and I think that coaches coaching is one of the most noble professions that there is. So on my rushmore my parents, in my high school, my coaches early in my career.

I think my parents would be first and foremost just instilling in me that sense of purpose, work, ethic, et cetera. But then I'd go back to my high school football coaches. You know, other than my parents, you know, an immediate family, my coaches were the men that had the most impact on my life that I wanted to emulate. I wanted to be like my high school coaches. And that's again not the sidebar, but I encourage coaches that a lot of times, you know, because of certain personal situations and family situations with kids, they don't have that, and the coaches are maybe a lot of times the last obstacle before that kid goes down the system or before he falls through the cracks. And for me, I love coaches, and I think that coaches coaching is one of the most noble professions that there is. So on my rushmore my parents, in my high school, my coaches early in my career.

Do you want to make that all four? You get four? I was going to let you my.

Do you want to make that all four? You get four? I was going to let you my.

Mom and dad, and then my two coaches, Ryche Morgan and Jerry Ecknrod and Darryl Schumacher. I'll give you some more my high school football coaches and wrestling coaches wrestle too. Yeah.

Mom and dad, and then my two coaches, Ryche Morgan and Jerry Ecknrod and Darryl Schumacher. I'll give you some more my high school football coaches and wrestling coaches wrestle too. Yeah.

Did you win a state or anything?

Did you win a state or anything?

Yeah? I won state.

Yeah? I won state.

You look like you want to What was your wing class?

You look like you want to What was your wing class?

I was a two hundred and fifteen pound heavyweight fifteen in high school. Yeah. I graduated six four two fifteen. When I went into the Air Force Academy, I graduated six six, two fifty five. So I just I was a late bloomer.

I was a two hundred and fifteen pound heavyweight fifteen in high school. Yeah. I graduated six four two fifteen. When I went into the Air Force Academy, I graduated six six, two fifty five. So I just I was a late bloomer.

Twenty four sacks, though you're showing them mauling. That is good, man, Chad. Appreciate you honestly, Man, thank you. I I didn't even know your story until we read it. It's beautiful what this game of the NFL has all done for all of us, and how it's let us all be in each other's lives first and foremost. Thanks for your service. Thank you for your dad, my dad, everybody that served this country.

Twenty four sacks, though you're showing them mauling. That is good, man, Chad. Appreciate you honestly, Man, thank you. I I didn't even know your story until we read it. It's beautiful what this game of the NFL has all done for all of us, and how it's let us all be in each other's lives first and foremost. Thanks for your service. Thank you for your dad, my dad, everybody that served this country.

Man.

Man.

Yeah, it really is truly awesome. Your story is amazing. I continue to hear you. You talk, you do all these other things. I want to look up your wingmen ministry as well. I love the concept of that. So thanks for joining us, man.

Yeah, it really is truly awesome. Your story is amazing. I continue to hear you. You talk, you do all these other things. I want to look up your wingmen ministry as well. I love the concept of that. So thanks for joining us, man.

I really appreciate it, man.

I really appreciate it, man.

Thank you. Guys enjoyed it.

Thank you. Guys enjoyed it.

Yeah, you're my wing man.

Yeah, you're my wing man.

Yeah, man, I'm your freaking wing man.

Yeah, man, I'm your freaking wing man.

There you go.

There you go.

I like it'll be goose. Yeah, appreciating Goose goose cat taking out bro.

I like it'll be goose. Yeah, appreciating Goose goose cat taking out bro.

I don't.

I don't.

This is a new version. This is a new version. This this is the new version. Am I doing? You cut me off?

This is a new version. This is a new version. This this is the new version. Am I doing? You cut me off?

So I was going, I didn't know.

So I was going, I didn't know.

Y'all for listening, please like, share.

Y'all for listening, please like, share.

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Subscribe, follow, Apple Oh, give us five stars. iHeartRadio Apple podcasts. Give us a listen if y'all don't listen.

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