Hi, Brian, Hi Katie. You know, I'm a big admirer of Alec Baldwin. He has had some tremendous highs in his life and some pretty devastating low points as well. He is fascinating because he combines interests in the arts, politics. He's got a really interesting backstory, and he's had this incredible life that's been full of highs and lows, and he understands the media culture probably better than anyone through the mistakes he's made in dealing with the media. We kind of watched Alec, I think, learn on the job and in real time as a public figure and someone you know, he's not just an actor, but just someone who's the quintessential New Yorker. Yeah. Probably no one except Donald Trump has had as many run ins with the tabloid media pack in New York besides Alec Baldwin. And the interview didn't disappoint at all. I mean, as any fan of thirty Rock knows, he's a really funny guy, but he's also very smart and articulate. And we had a conversation that ranged from Donald Trump, of course, to hosting a game show. You asked him some insightful questions about his personal life, the best directors he's ever worked with, his experiences with Tony Hopkins and made us laugh probably more than any guest has. You know, just I just realized by the way that you and I we could have a show together. We could we could be on in the morning, like at seven in the morning, like two hours from seven to nine, and I would be the stars. We'd like talk to people and you could do some news and I could do like some interviews and stuff. We could we could be on the internet. Yeah, g kitty, what is it like to do a two hour morning show from seven to nine every and it's hard? All right? Thank you for being here, and are very psyched, cab. We had so much to talk about. Where do we begin? I guess we have to begin with Donald Trump. I'm in the car coming here and he's doing this press conference, his first press conference, and I'm thinking, this guy hasn't had a press conference and so long. You would have thought he would have rehearsed, you know, we would have thought he would have had one of the greatest press conferences and just efficient and tight and presenting himself the right way. And instead he's on TV right now it's going very strangely. In fact, you were impersonating some of the things he was saying. NBC great organization, yet sure great and don't want to talk to you, and uh it's just uh feed fake news, fake like the Nazis would do that, say that. I, oh, you know, the Nazis said that that Hitler, but he liked to be on Hooker's in the Baktist gotten it's a fact, it's no in fact, everybody knows that. So we're just getting right into it here. I like, I don't know. I wish that people could see Alec because as he's impersonating Donald Trump, he's got that uh sort of perpetual the mask of anxiety. Oh with his lips, he's got the O phase going on. But I think the big question is why should Trump change? Now? You said that, you know, you're surprised that he's not rehearsing, that he's lashing out, that he's saying offensive stuff. I mean, what lesson would he have learned from the campaign that would motivate him to change. That's a very good point, and I don't expect I have no expectation of him changing, but I do believe I truly just you know, being and this is the I can't think of any other way to phrase it. Being a student of human nature as the direct result of what I do for a living and watching people and observing people and thinking what's really the real thing that's going on with them behind the mask they're trying to manage all the time, you know, what are they really thinking and feeling? And they present themselves in public a different way. I fully expected Trump to relax once he won. I fully expected him to say that there were insecurities he had, and there was a defensiveness and there was a pettiness that would have not completely abayed. It would subside to some degree, and he would go on to become more presidential, if you will. I think a lot of people alec are still having a hard time wrapping their heads around these words, President Trump. So how are you kind of processing it? And what's your attitude with the inauguration just around the corner? I think that, you know, I mean, there's nothing I can say that you know you haven't read or seen before in terms of other people expressing their opinions about this, because it's all people talk about all day long. It's it's pretty much. It's phenomenal. It's pretty much a phenomenon I haven't seen. But I will say briefly that, um uh, you know when other men one in my lifetime that I was not fond of, when Reagan won and even the more kind of uh difficult one in two thousand and the Florida thing and Gore and everything, and he won. But in each of those cases, a few weeks go by, a few months go by, and everybody settles in and they realized that that men, because they were both men, obviously, is not malicious in any way. Now we have a guy who's the president the United States who's a malicious person. He's a malicious person, and I don't think people are going to settle in. I think that the way he behaves and the way people reacting this is going to be this way for the next four years. It's not going to subside at all. What advice would you give members of the media, because I think there is a lot of you know, I think ratings, I mean, alec you know, all about all this stuff. As much as anyone, they can't alienate a huge segment of their audience who want to give Donald Trump a chance who believe in his sort of his approach to governing, and yet they also don't want to normalize what is too many people really repugnant reprehensible behavior. So I think they're kind of caught between a rock and hard place in a way. What what would you say is important in terms of media coverage in the next four years. Well, I mean that's a that's a big question, but I think that, Um. I think that there are two things that are the thing I see most vividly around Trump. One is that all of these men who and some women who diminished him and reduced him during the campaign, and some of them ran against him, have all signed on in in the way that partisan politics in this country demands right now, and because they all know that the only thing worse is that he doesn't win the election, they want the ryan. Everybody is signed on saying O, Trump's okay, Trump's okay, It's all going to be fine. Um. And that worries me because of these appointments. His appointments to me are very very, very frightening. I mean, I'm on the board of directors of People for the American Way, so I'm very concerned about the Court and a couple of vacancies that may come up, certainly a couple or three that will come up over the course of the next eight years if he is re elected. But when I think about Trump, now, what I think about is the word intervention. Is there anyone, I mean, his daughter, even who is close enough to him that a group of people can sit her down and coach her through something. And is she the one that can reach him and say to him, here's a list, very basically, here's three things you need to stop doing, and here's three things you need to start doing. Let's just begin there. I think she tried, didn't she like I mean, she was the one that brought our more in to talk to him at Trump Tower. Uh, there been Robert F. Kennedy, which is interesting. That's a whole another area. Now he's going to lead up the vaccine. I didn't realize Robert F. Kennedy was so anti vaccine. Very lily, that's a good word for vaccine. That's why I But you know, I think I think the Al Gore meeting sort of proved the point for those who are critical of Trump. That is, Ivanka brought Gore in. Gore talked to Trump for like over an hour, and then the next day he announced to A somebody who denies climate change, so I think people who are holding out. He wrote everything into focus for me, and I decided to bring in an assassin to literally take out the e p A. Mr President Elect. I didn't realize you'd be joining us today. How did the whole Donald Trump impersonation gig come your way? Alec? I mean, obviously they knew they had to have somebody once he became the nominee as somebody to play that, and they had all these people in the bullpen that had done it for them, Carrol Hammond, Carol, Taryn Killing left the show, and Tina, I guess, was the one I was told that recommended to Lauren that I do it, And I said this before and it was just such an amazingly weird thing for me, which is I had no idea what I was gonna do. Literally the moment the stage manager had my arm in his hand and leading me to the stage to do the dress rehearsal of the first show eight o'clock that night, I sat in a room and we watched tapes of him and in anything, I mean, I'm not a comedian, because comedians, to me are people who write their material to be a real comedian to write, and Tracy Morgan and Tina and so what. These are people who have that gift of right. I'm just an actor who says words of other people create. And we'd sit there and whether it was Tony Bennet or Broccino or de Niro or the little things I've done in an ancillary way in my work. That way, there's an element of appreciation for them, which is always important. And with Trump, I don't have that element of appreciation, which makes it difficult. So you wind up saying to yourself that it's not so much the voice, because I'm not going to sound like him that much. I'm kind of you kind of get to a thing that's like a caricature, everything swollen and bloated and and exaggerated. It's the look where the hair is what it is. But to me, the key to doing him was to be a man who paused regularly, almost metronomically, paused to dig for a word and never came up with the better word or a stronger word. So Trump will sit there and go I was talking to the president of Mexico who is just a fantastic person, a great, great person, And like I mean, whenever he pauses, you feel like there's like in some Cone Brothers movie. It's like a bunch of men in a filing room, like in his brain was sweating and breathing heavily trying to find a word. And then look at look at the look at the main nerve, the guy in the big chair. Then we got nothing we got And Trump's like, let me tell you something. We're gonna build a wall here in Mexico and that wall is going to be just a fantastic wall. And you know, it's like he's always pausing to come up with something with some rhetorical flourish or some muscular word, and he never gets it. Never. So I always try to build that into the impersonation where he's like, Melania, you know that I want just to be with some great, great people, you know for dinner. You know, you know what saying we don't want to be to do it seems so labored, right, and then you hear it and you're like, seriously, that's all you got. I wonder if I wonder truly if here is a guy I said to somebody that here's a guy who this is This is just my opinion, and I don't say this to pile up on him or be mean or what have you. This is just the reality which I find fascinating. Here's a guy who, through I guess the kind of odd uh nature of television, convinced a critical massive people, certainly not the majority of voters, as we've learned, but a critical massive people that he was this kind of whip cracking can do executive on this TV show, this reality show. Whereas in New York, where he lives and his home base of his company, Trump is not admired at all. When you see Trump in social circles in New York, he was endured, you know, he was always somebody people would nod to him and say, hey, how are you. Because of New York people at the very least respect other people who make a lot of money, and Trump has purportedly met a lot of money, so they've tipped their hat to him in that guard. But he's not an honored guest anywhere. He's not an invited speaker anywhere he's had a featured guest at some social event or a dinner. He's kind of an outcast in the world he lives in. When you when you got this gig doing Donald Trump for SNL Alec, did you think it was kind of a short term thing. Did you think, well, this will be fun during the campaign and now whole mother of god, I'm stuck doing this. Well, I didn't view it as being stuck in the in the sense that you know, when it came on, and I certainly thought he was gonna lose, And I definitely thought he was gonna lose, but uh, maybe not by much. But I just never never dreamed we would be where we are now. So when he won, there really was a part of me that sat there and thought, you know, I I emailed Steve Higgins, the exact producer who runs a show with Laurence, and I said, what's the schedule for the rest of the season again, I literally have it on my phone. I can show it to you. I'm like, how many more shows are you doing this year? I'm like, Wow, I just to go to Paris to do Mission Impossible and may I'm just to go to this place in this place in March. Are you making plans so you can be part of the show from here? I'm do it again. I don't think I'm gonna do it this week. I'm what I'm doing it definitely next week, and we're going to do the one for the inauguration. I mean, I have to say, you're so funny and it's so great watching you. And let's listen. We have a montage of some of your greatest hits as Donald Trump on SNL. Let's take a listen. What gives you the energy for all that? My deep love for America and a really really big handful of uppers that are meant for racehorces. I use a very private, very secure site what one can write whatever they want to. I know one will read it. It's called Twitter. You know, I can't quite say it on live television. Um, but basically, uh, you said you wanted to to grab them by the pussy. I deeply apologize. Are you trying to say apologize? No, I would never do that. What I am doing is Jina huge v China face is completely orange except around the eyes. Words wide sirie. How about kill lisis theory? What's your relationship with Donald Trump personally? Do you have one? No? No, I mean I would meet him in town. And and again, I mean you never want to be uh mean or impolite people like that. I mean, if you don't if you're not a fan of theirs or you're not some supporter of theirs. I never watched The Apprentice. I watched it like once when my brother Stephen was on. But I would never, you know, want to be rude to somebody like that to their face, even if they weren't, you know, somebody wanted to hang out with. So I would bump into him at events from here and there. And but also he also provided the location manager of a movie. I did uh an apartment in his building, the top floor of the International on the old Gulf and Western Building, and he allowed us to shoot a film there, and he stopped by more for shooting. And he's very gregarious and very fun. But I think what he's somebody is who he's uh uh. He wants to be appreciated. Yeah, when we're shooting the movie, he would welcome to go. Isn't this apartment great? Isn't this the most fantastic condominium you leather shot in in your entire Life's go ahead say it. And what I'm gonna say to you is before you speak of me, to say You're welcome. You're welcome. He wants gratitude and he wants recognition for what he does. So you haven't heard from him. He hasn't reached out. I know he's tweeted that SNL you know, has jumped the shark, etcetera appreciated Meryl Streep is overrated, and I thought that was great. Meryl Streep is overrated. I thought you really want to sit down with some advisors, like some acting coaches or something, or some PR people and the goat. Now, Donald, that would be a vivid example of what you shouldn't do. I have to ask you, since you brought it up, what did you think of Meryl streep speech at the Golden Globes. Well, I think that, um, you know, we were at a point now where that kind of thing where somebody in the arts, performers, you know, whether they're actors or musicians or what have you, that piggyback that kind of statement onto an event. We've seen a lot of that, and I think maybe people are kind of bored with that, and they don't they it's kind of predictable to them. However, I do give her my understanding of her. I mean, I'm a huge I'm completely in love with her, and I worked with her and at a great time and with her. I kind of give her a pass because she I think she was speaking as a woman. I think women are deeply hurt by what's happened and what he said and how he uh sounds like he treats women and views women or the less powerful. I think because she gave the example of the reporter right who had the disability. No, no, no, I I agree that that in her content, she's covering a broader spectrum. But I think what what what drives her as her being a woman where you know, I mean, Trump is someone who has abused power everywhere he's been in his life. I mean everywhere he's gone, he's abused power and people who were less powerful than him. But I do think that what she said was very smart, was very active. But I can see now where you know, there's people in this country they just want to they want to take a deep breath, and they want to right after the inauguration, we have to accept where we are and the task at hand. For people who are political opponents of Trump's, you know, whining about Trump and lampooning Trump and our mouth, our hand over our mouth, aghast, Oh my god, Trump's the president. We've got to get over that now. But you were just to get earlier in the conversation, though, Alec, you were saying, you know, you you went through sort of the stages of grief with other presidential candidates who you didn't agree with, but it was hard to get to that level of acceptance, if you will, the final stage and the Elizabeth Coogler Ross, you know, stages, agree with somebody like Donald Trump because he is a malicious person. So I hear you saying both things exactly. I think it is both things at the same time. I think, well, I think it's people will. The task is to move on and to use this to energize the the the entification, and if you will, the selection of someone to run against him. We need to find that person who's gonna win, and that needs to be job one. Number two. I think while he's in office, he's just not going to enjoy what other people have enjoyed. I mean, I think I think people are going to be the press, and he's invited this quite frankly, the press and the public that are not supportive of him. They're going to keep giving it to him right to the end. Speaking of the end, we gotta take a quick break, um to hear some messages from our sponsor, and we'll be right back. God, you're good. Everybody has been talking about Russia. It's in so many headlines these days, Briant and so. On our next episode, we're going to be speaking with a man named Bill crowd Or. He was once Russia's large as foreign investor. He is now a very strong and vocal anti Putin voice, and we really want to talk to him about the pros and cons of a closer relationship with Russia and get some better understanding about the risk reward ratio of a reset. Very illiterative, aren't I? So what questions do you have about Russia for Mr Browder? Leave us a message by calling nine to nine to four, six three seven. Oh, brother, Bryan is really really smart. No, don't set expectations too high now, he's gonna be crying. Worked with me at CBS UM and he went to Harvard and then Stanford Law School, and for some reason I was interested in media. But he's also like a political chunkie here. Always tell me he was sort of a producer helped me with the Sarah Palin interview. We spent like four days together in my den together coming up with all the questions for Sarah Palin has a photographic memory about all things political. I always tell the story that he got kicked at, that he got grounded in high school for sneaking out of his room to watch c SPAN. That's how big a nerd this guy is. Sad. What I love is the image of you um getting this job where you're on on the mic so to speak with her, where she says to me, where she says to you, I'm gonna go and do this podcast, would you like to come with me? And there's this Eve Harrington moment for you where you're like, yeah, I'll come with you. But I don't want to be on the air with you. Yeah, I don't want to be a producer. See, I want to be on the air. Well, that's why I want Brian to to be on the air. I want him to have that voice. Me to a plastic surgeon and in a few months I'll be Yeah, I'm gonna have a face cliff. I said to my wife, said I'm gonna have a face stiff when I'm sixty, which is almost Hey, I just turned sixty. They're timeless. Very well, you're a time but you're a timeless beauty. You're the prompt queen of all of media, and we know that. But my point is, I'm going to be sixty. I'm gonna be fifty nine in April. So a year after that, I'm sixty and I said to my I want to have a facelift. She said, no, Alec, don't have a facelift, because men, it looks so funny. I said, that's the point. I want people to gasp when they say, what a thing? What has he done? Because that's my favorite do anything for attention? What's my favorite New Yorker cartoon with a guy looks at the woman and the doctors in the office with the woman and he says, he says, I can't make you look younger, but I can make you look like you've had a lot of expensive plastic serion, just like Yes, okay, let's talk a little bit about well, there is one thing you and Donald Trump have in common, which is your proximity or you're the way that you've interacted, if you will, with the New York media, tabloid culture. Um, he to me seems to have utilized it with the notion that all press is good press, and you, to me, has what what expression did you use for Alex relationship with the New York tabloid media? Kind of careful now? Whipsawed by Yeah, a little bit whipsawd by it. Well, I think the only thing I can say to that is when you're provoked by certain people in the media, Um, I definitely did the wrong thing a handful of times, and it seemed like it happened. Uh, you know, Um, a lot of it has been very close succession. When you become that person that is a click bait or cover bait subject for like the New York Post and so forth, that's uh, that's a tough current to paddle your way out of, and there are ways to do that. But I think that I mean, you know, I write this in my book, My Memoirs, coming out in in April, And in my book I talked about how I walked down the streets of New York and there was a guy coming toward me, an elderly couple, and the guy was this very distinguished looking guy in a suit and a tie and a camel hair coat, this African American guy, and he took one look at me, saw that it was me, and it's like there's that unmistakable glint of recognition, and he kind of like shook his head and looked down to the ground. Because it wasn't like a week prior, the New York posted that I called this guy this racial epithet. It was a photographer from the post. Now, as I said repeatedly, if I was going to use a word that was a racial epithet, it wouldn't be something from a Rod Steiger movie from nineteen sixty nine and we're down and like so that you make them Georgia or something, but from the in the heat of the night or something. And I and I said, you know, there are other words. And when I grew up in my neighborhood, people might have used. But I went to have an interview with the d a's office. They called me in to have a hate crimes investigation, a preliminary investigation, and they were contemplating charging me with a hate crime for saying this to this guy. When we were done, I said, well, would be very beginning. I said, well, the guy's a photographer. Of paparazzi and a videographer. Is there a video tape? And there was this odd moment. It was this pause that the d A had this woman because what she was hoping that I would implicate myself in spite of the presence of the tape, that I'd say that I did something, because they're obviously they're wawyers who know that that's a possibility. As a pause, and she said, yes, there's a tape. I said, well, let's play the tape. And we play the tape and no, at no point in the day do you hear me say any of what he accused me of saying. But you do hear him say he walks back to the to the journalist that he's working with in Tandeman says, she was what happened? What happened? He goes, I think he called me, and there's a pause, he goes a coon or something. And you never hear them on the tape at all, and you hear everything recorded on the tape. So I said to the woman from the d a's office, I said, are you going to hold a press conference and announced that you did not discover And of course the answer was no. So the tabloids spatter you with all this mud, and you get covered with all of this mud, and in my profession, it damages your reputation, which is really all you have. Significantly. It takes you a lot of time to wipe all that off of you. And I turned to the woman, thinking, you know, one statement from you to the press would say, we conducted this investigation, and so what's the point of this investigation. Is it just to we view of a burden or are you willing to exonerate me in the process. And they did nothing. The d a's office didn't They would not make a statement. They did nothing. So you are left, for the most part, to perform this function for yourself, which is very time consuming and very very painful. Now I learned some profound lessons from getting fired from MSNBC above the flurry of things right around two thousand thirteen and two thousand fourteen, which is that the less you have the press in your life, the better you want to cherry picket and just do every now and then you in my business, which is one thing, and I'll finish with this. One thing people don't understand is the fulcrum for the the reison debt for my relationship with the press is nearly always contractually obligated the people I work for him me a contract and say you must talk to some percentage of these people to promote this project, and if you don't, you're in breach of your contract. Otherwise, I sincerely doubt I would do you know any percent of what they asked me to do? Why do you think it was so relentless over that period of time, Alec? And because I feel like, you know, it became a weird kind of sport and that do you think they somehow smelled weakness or vulnerability or your reaction to it made it more enticing to cover you. I think it was one of bury people who they have some who they think has some other potential. Meaning that was a time when people were coming to me. I mean I had some pretty prominent people come to me. And aspect a run from mayor in two thousand, UH went to Blasio one. I mean I had people. I mean I was on the cover of New York magazine. They said I was going to run for the Senate twenty years ago in advance of the campaign. Um, the do you think it was to cut you off at the knees. Politically, I think it was I think that they want to damage people who all hope they have a dream, a desire to reduce and to null of by all people that are their political opposites, whether they're there in the arts, whether actually bona fide political figures. I don't think that they look at me as somebody who's some virile political candidate, But I'm somebody who is a loud and persistent, opinionated, opinionated yet rock in their shoe in terms of their I mean, I'm constantly pissing on the Post, and I mean, let's let's put it this way. The Post is nothing but a mouthpiece for Murdoch. It hemorrhages money. It loses tens, if not hundreds of millions of dollars a year the Post, and Murdoch and his family maintained that as a as a as a a forum for them to launch their political pi they've kind of backed off. I'm wondering why you're kind of poking them in the with a sharp stick right now, because I feel like, you know, I I read the stuff when you went through this sort of phase where you were in there in their target or and and I was always thinking, it's nice that Alec has made his peace with them, or they've made his their piece with him, and they're not kind of I don't think make peace with them. Yeah, I don't think you ever do, know, just a question of it. They move on to somebody else, and they move on, and I'm not as as interesting for that those purposes anymore. You know, they'll give it to they'll give it to Merrill for the next couple of months over what she said, and they'll they'll identify somebody else who their staff. It's like that bullpen you see on TMZ, and they all sit around shooting the breeze about what stories that they think are the most tabloid worthy, and and that energy moves on and meanders to other other people. So I mean, right now, you know, for me, um, if you could write a check to some organization and pay them to never see your name in the paper again, I would be the first in line to write that check. And that includes The New York Times. By the way, Well, it's interesting a couple of years ago media, really, you've got a lot of attention for writing a piece about how you were retiring from public life. What did you mean by that? And have you have you done that since then? I think that that that number one again, that that idea was to ever think that I could have a successful relationship with the media, to talk about my work and with any joy or any um uh kind of collegiality, deal with the media as a necess as a necessary element of my work, like I go into rooms periodically. I just came from the press conference in Los Angeles at the t c A. And to always be going into these rooms with these people and dealing with them and hoping that they would have some desire to and s and and and subsequently ability to interpret even remotely who you really are. I'm that way. No, No, you're to get people. You're not malicious. And but my point just to finished that The point is that so the answer is that was a bit premature for me to put it in. I probably should to put it differently, which is that is I've tried to minimize that as much as possible. I mean, I have been through this Trump thing, for example, offered the cover of every magazine you could possibly imagine. I've been offered untold hundreds of thousands of dollars to put the wig on and walk in and do you know what speaking fees are in this business. I've been offered a ton of money, and I agreed with Lauren when we started that I wouldn't do that. I wouldn't monetize this gig at all. Really, I just says, that's why we announced on the show, on the on the on the in the media that they pay me the S and L guest fee of fourteen dollars a show to do the show. This isn't about money but a proposed what you're saying, and I don't want to dwell on this, which is that, uh that the idea that I could make it fun and I could make it relaxed, to make it easy, and I'd have my relationship with reporters and things like that and try to handle it a certain way. That's over. That's what died, and that is that I can never trust because the media is so desperate for funds. Now, all media sources are so desperate for clickbait and ratings that they will go to any lengths. I mean, I say this to you of old people, and I remember, I don't I really don't enjoy saying this. It kind of makes me sad. But like when I had this thing where I left this message from my daughter on this tape, NBC and their producers in the Today Show producers went and got Harvey Levin and put him on the air before me, and I was doing thirty Rock, and everyone in my life was saying to me that I would get a gift basket that said from your NBC family. I thought, oh, my god, I think I might be in the wrong family if h Mattlauer is going to interview Harvey Levin before me, and nobody even contacted me. They put Levin on, and I mean, everybody knew how to reach me, and I was working for them. And when they did that, I never did the Today Show ever since then ever, And that was in two thousand seven, And I said to my that's ten years ago. And I said to myself, not with any anger or any hatred. I just said to myself, I need to have less of this in my life. Did you ever talk to him out about it? Not? Really. There was a quick mention of it because he guessed it on thirty Rock, but there really wasn't anything to say because certainly Matt didn't make that decision as producers did. It wasn't really up to Matt So. But but when you make that thing, I mean out of anger and frustration. I hoped that I would never have to speak to the media again. But believe it or not, I certainly have reduced it a great deal. And I made exceptions for people who have law degrees from Stanford University. But we appreciate it. But I called the Stanford rule. So can we talk about your upbringing and kind of how you got into all of this, because I think a lot of people don't know. You grew up on Long Island in the nineteen sixties. Your dad was a school teacher, your mom was a housewife, you were one of six kids, money was tight. How did that upbringing affect your choice of career and kind of how you've pursued your life. So that's really a very important theme in the book I wrote, which is that that there were other things I dreamed of doing. There were other things I wanted to do, and people kind of enticed me into trying this. In every month or whatever period you want to use to calibrate it, that I remained in this business, things got better. I got a job right out of school, out of acting school, I went to Los Angeles, I got work. I just kept working. I just kept lightening one off the other. I was changed shooting, and I was like just working, working, working. Then I got into you know, primetime TV. Then I got into supporting roles of movies and bigger roles in movies, and they all just had this momentum but the entire time, and I will say this pertains to inside the body of the work I've done. And this is a big part of what the book is about, is I never really often got to do what I wanted to do because my background left me obsessed with I had to make money and not be like my dad. So when I worked, it was always like I gotta I gotta work, I gotta keep working. I gotta make as much money as I can. I don't want to, you know. My dad didn't uh you know. He was a school teacher, and there were things in his colleagues and other school teachers did that they didn't want to do to supplement their income. I mean the father My father had friends of his that were younger men who painted houses in the summer. Well, they had floor polishing companies where they sent out men to banks and clean the floors of hospitals and banks. My father had friends talking about teachers, teachers who when the summer would come, they ran travel agencies and they went and did they went on cruise ships. So they had some crazy supplemental work that they did, and my dad didn't do that. He Everything my dad did was a paycheck from the school. He coached football, he coached rifle ry, he did a lot of different things. Wasn't the money or was it the gravy train that was so enticing? Or was it the work? Wasn't that enticing? It was necessary? Well? That was that was the problem. Was What was enticing was the work. And what got in the way was my need to make a living. So there were many many opportunities to work and do things I wanted to do, and you know, different than acting. No no jobs within the business. Some some you know, monster directors saying come with me to Australia for six months and we're gonna make a movie and the sequel while we're down there, and you're gonna play the lead role in this gigantic blockbuster movie and me turning and going, oh, I can't do that. I'm married I just had a baby, my wife I was married to Kim. My wife's not coming to Australia for six months with my daughter. So my life getting in the way of that, or or somebody saying, here's a movie you're gonna do, that's the movie you need to be doing it. We don't have any money. We don't have any money to bring your family come to the Caribbean and we're gonna be shooting it on a boat. And it's an extraordinarily interesting project, but we can't bring your family down. We're gonna pay you fifty cents to do the movie. And I go, oh, I can't do that. I can't leave my wife. And I'm remarried and have have three kids. So everything has been family and I'm not complaining. I'm not asking for like a medal here. I'm no different than anybody else in that way. And then I would turn around and I have to do a job to make money, and and I would I'd have to supplement that. And so without beating at the death in a patchwork of decisions, I had to make countless scores of decisions over the years. There's things I might have done that would have made me um more uh what's the word, you know, kind of cemented in my career and everything would be a lot more of Tom Hanks whatever. Yeah. I don't like to compare to other people because they are who they are, but I would have had a much more easy time of things. Now. Having said that, I mean, I think your career choices have been so that's interesting and smart and had you've done such a variety of things ale that I have done everything, you know, and I think, I mean, I think your life and career have been far more interesting because of that. But let me ask you this, and I don't want to just turn it on you, but you know, you're probably you know, you're one of the four or five most famous women in the history of the news business. And you did a show which was the number one show in the morning, and you were like, like people wake up and brush their teeth. You know, they might as well just had a tooth rush with you on it, you know, because you were so a part of their lives on the morning show. And when the time came for that to end, that was your decision for it to end. Im, assuming you couldn't kept doing it forever, I could have, right, and when when you didn't want to do it anymore. If you don't mind my asking why, I think for me, I the show itself had become a little repetitive. Um, I wanted a new challenge. Uh. I wanted to leave before people wanted me to leave in a way, I mean, I think, and I had an opportunity to do something. I had an opportunity to try something new and be challenged. And you know, I think, you know, sometimes I wonder about that. I could have stayed. I could have been celebrating twenty five years while Matt was celebrating twenty and UM, I think for me, it's just I didn't want my life to be that one thing and that one thing alone. And I think probably motivated by some of the things that you've been motivated by. I think that people don't realize it no matter how lucrative the job is, no matter how famous you are, and there are a few people who were as famous as successful as you've been. Uh, you do you know, twenty years goes by and go wait a second, you know, I would like to just do something different. And for me, I mean, the biggest thing in my life now that dictates what I do is that I met someone and I fell in love and I got married, and I'm fifty nine years old. Pretty soon I have three children three and under. We have three children in three years. And so when someone says to me, come to a movie. There were two examples that I don't want to mention the details and offend anybody, but there are two examples of movies like La La Land. They were like, we we don't really want this Ryan Gosling guy. They're gonna have to go to him. They said, is there anybody you recommend me hired now that you're not going to do it? As I really like Ryan Goslin. He reminds me he's a younger. I said, you really what you really want to be younger me? And that's what whether be Ryan Goslin. Um. But um, well, these two films. Somebody came to me and said do you want to do this film? And there were both people who I had on a list of people who if they called me, I wouldn't even think about it. I would just do it. Two directors, both men who I really admired so deeply, and in both cases I said I can't do it because of my wife and my kids. One was like, let's go to the city for five weeks and we can't bring your family have no money, And I thought, I don't want to. I don't want my son to wake up and go because my wife will do that with on FaceTime. If I do go away for a day or so, my wife will we will FaceTime. And my son's looking at me like, you know, you're not around the corner in the bedroom or you know, in the bathroom brushing your teeth, and I just don't want to miss that. So I've so I say no to a variety of things, whether it's a money gig or creative gig, and then I go do match game. What was that match game was? They came to me and said, would you do ten episodes? Because I love you, but I saw you on television doing that and I was like, why on earth is Alec doing. I'm gonna tell you real quickly, which is that they said, let's do a ten We're gonna do ten episodes in the summer block and I can put the money on my charity because I'm always looking for these cookie ways to fund my charity. Capital one commercials Amazon Echo commercial for the Super Bowl all the funds go to my charity. Then we did match game and it was very successful and they said would you do more? And my wife said to me, go ahead and do more and and don't give the money to charity. This is the charity. Uh. And it's something that is it something that was in my bucket list of things I wanted to do as an actor. No, but at the same time it meets full on the criteria of what I need. Is that it's in New York. I don't have to travel. I can stay home with my family. And that's a tough, tough part in this career. Is because I have young kids. Is that I just I don't want to travel anymore. I just don't. And what is your charity? Focus on the arts? Mostly? I mean when we we did Capital One and we've made big gifts, you a million dollar gifts to n y U, my Ama Monitor round About Theater too. I think you're a big guil and you very graciously came into the show with us Guild Hall in East Hampton, Hampton Film Festival, a lot of smaller people for the American Way, Peter, some political things, but mostly the arts. Mostly the arts. But I bet people were equally skeptical about Alec Baldwin playing this character on thirty Rock. I mean when I first saw that show, I didn't know that you could be funny like that. So amazed you say that, No, No, I mean truly, it was like a revelation, and you were for that whole period. I mean, in my mind, at least, by far, the funniest person on television. And I still clothes well, no, because most people couldn't execute it the way you did. I mean I think I think that role was really all about how you played the part and how dead pan you were. And I mean I still think about every time I put on a tuxedo, which is not very often. It's after six? What am I a farmer? Damn? I wish this event were tonight. It's not tonight. When is it February? Why are you wearing a tux It's after six? What am I a farmer? You know that's turned into a very popular Jeff? Is that how the kids say a Jeff or Giff? I think it's either way right now, I don't know. In fact, we have a question for you, Alec from one of our listeners in Phoenix, Arizona, Jack these are prerecorded questions. Hi. My question for Alec Baldwin is his character that he played on thirty Rock Jack Donneghie. Does he have a favorite memorable line that sticks out to him? Thank you? Right? Um, well you mentioned that after six and one of my Farmer. That was one of them. When the when Carrie Fisher was on the Late Carrie Fisher, who we loved, came on and I was thanking her. She was a veteran writer there in the comedy constellation. And when she left my office, I turned to Tina. I said, don't ever introduced me to a woman that age again. I don't ever ask me to talk to a woman that age again. That was a good one, Um, but you're laughing. Uh right, I was Tina's Uh. There was this wonderful actor who played Tina's agent who was like this preternatural man child. He was like a little boy in a suit. And I said, did I said that you and I know a few things about women, don't we. John whatever his name was, He goes, I've seen a few bras, but I think my old time. Um, I mean, I guess the two scenes that stand out for me most when they came to me, this is emblematic of that show. They came to me and said, you're going to play. We're gonna do the Patty Duke thing, and you're gonna act opposite yourself and you're gonna play a gay Mexican soap opera star. And I said them, I go, come on, come on, you guys, come on. And they said no, no, no, You're gonna play they hand a relishimo and be the gay Mexican soap opera star. And we did it. I shot against myself and at the end, I look at the guy. I go, I look at the general, the general, and I go, you really are super gay. And the General goes, okay so, and I just love that he goes he's like this mustache. She goes okay so. And I love when we did hand to release him and that was like just so absurd. And I guess the end when we had to finish the show and I had this long, weird monologue to tell Tina that I loved her, and uh the speech that I say, lemon, there is a word which comes from the old German, and I go into this long which comes from the German luba, which means to be pleased, which is from the lube, was from the verb blue bell, which means to be pleasing. And I go into this rambling nonsense thing. Before I even finished tea, he goes, I love you too, Jack. And when we shot that scene at the end, it just was like a knife in me. I couldn't believe because it was like the best. And even though I whined and complained, but I was there about certain things. It was the best job I'll ever had. It was the best. Were you sorry? I mean, why did it have to end? Well? I think Tina very Tina smart, and she's smart and always and not just in writing jokes. Tina was the you know, the principal producer of the show, and she knew that she wanted to go out before we had gotten down. There was no juice on the rind anymore. She didn't want to jump the show. And she had two kids, said two kids, and she wanted to. I think I think that to to write and produce and star in that show. I mean I always say the same thing, which is not at all, uh a critique at all, But I knew we were going to go off the air when Tina came into rehearsal one morning and laid down on the couch, which he had never done in the six years prior. And the second season was a short order, was thirteen episodes, and we came into the seventh season, the final thirteen episodes, and Tina came in one day and she just lay on the couch and kind of like moaned softly. She was so tired. And I looked at some people, I was like, this is over, We're done. So what's on your what is a part of your current poo poo platter of professional responsibilities right now? Well, I'd like to use the phrase topas myself more Kati, if you don't mind. Seems upper East side thing, you'd say, very kind of dated side of Kawa. Yeah, the side of what's your Manila? The Well, I'm gonna go to Emilio esteve as his new movie called The Public and uh, that's a name I haven't heard for a long time. I love Amelio. He's a great, you, very serious filmmaker. He did this wonderful film with his father called The Way which Martin Sheen crosses the the Great Hike in Spain, and Amelia did a movie about the staff of the CINCIDENTI Public Library takes over the library, and I play the hostage negotiator, which tries to talk about of it because they're threatening all these budget cuts and they want to broom out all the homeless people and they want to kind of fluff up the library all the rich trustees. And I love Amelia. He's just such a sweet guy and so into it, because when you make a movie, you want to be with somebody who's clear. He's very clear. So I have that my book is coming out. I'm gonna do a lot of press for that. Was writing a book fun for you? Was it? Well? I mean I don't need to tell you. I mean you've done a lot of writing. It's like what you put in and what you don't put in and what you leave out and should people would go crazy. I don't know, you know, just because of all these life experiences I have had, whether it's you know, my husband dying of cancer or these really interesting experiences I've had working at different network. Um you you, I'm gonna say something that's gonna sound funny, but and some of it they might be funny, But it's like there's people who just owe the public a memoir. I'm not one of those people. I don't think I owe the public and memoir, but you are certainly one of the people who owe the public and memoir because people love you so much. I kind of get that. I mean, I kind of get how much people love you. I'm kidding, but people love you like boundlessly and you should come. I can't believe you haven't written a book to invite Alec tell me about Mission Impossible. Well, we're gonna go off and do the movie. And uh, it's always the way it is with those guys were with some slight exceptions. It's like Tom flies around the world and saves the world and jumps out of this and jumps off of this and then I'm in an office. I go to a set in London. They shoot in London, the sets, the stages, and I'm honest set with Tom, and I'm like, I thought, I told you to stop doing that thing. I don't want you doing that jumping off that thing again. Tom goes and jumps off another thing and blows up another thing that I'm saying, what's wrong with you that you remember our last conversation where I told you don't do that again? You know, look, whatever the thing is, I'm the head of the CIA and I work with him now. And what was appealing about doing this movie for you? You know, I've made so many movies and I haven't made a lot of movies like that in a while. I spent a lot of time doing Dirty Rock. I would be in Indie Land doing movies where budgets are tight and tough compromises, I mean really painful compromises are made in order to try to make the film. And uh, you know, I went and did It's Complicated with Merrill, which was you know, they spent a lot of money on that movie. Was Nancy Meyers who gets a lot of dough to make her films, and it's very comfortable. But I haven't made I hadn't made a lot of those. And when you're on the set, it's just remarkable, like what money and they wanted on screen. They're all very responsible people, and there's no one who was more of a thrill to work with than Tom Oh. He's just unbelievable. He's unbelive. He is unbelievable. He just is like, let's the days he wasn't shoting he was on the set because he's a producer. He'd come up to me and say us yeah, and he'd even to give me an idea. He'd say to me, what do you think about this? He's like a machine, you know. I said to Michael, what do you do to unwind when this is over? I said, what do you go? Like? What's your guilty pleasure? What's the thing you do in between? He said, what's my guilty pleasure? Because when we're done, he said, I find another script? And I started all over again. He's I just love to shoot. I love to shoot. And I thought, if I was you, i'd love to shoot too, because it's pretty good life he has, you know, and he's just he's I'm dying to go over there and do that with him again. I just don't know what I'm doing yet. Did you like working with Scorsese and The Departed? Because I thought that was one of your best roles, those kinds of films. I mean, you were a guest. Really, you're not playing a big part, so it's what you get to watch. I mean, you do your scenes. When I did The Aviator, it was really a thrill to watch Leo. I have this bottomless admiration or and then to do The Departed with that crowd, and you know, Marty is obviously one of the top examples of people who they see the movie, they know what they want, what they don't want. You know. One of the first films I ever made was Working Girl with Mike Nichols, and he was just a dream in that sense, which was you know, he'd say, what do you think of this? And you'd have an idea in the rehearsal and he'd say, no, I don't think it's that, and he like right away it was it was like he knew rather than us kind of masturbating for a day after day of like trying to figure out what the movie is, he knew what the movie was and he knew what he wanted you to do, which is a great uh pleasure. You You've worked with so many extraordinary people. Is there someone you admire the most? I wouldn't say the most, but the person that comes to mind about is Tony Hopkins. When I want to go to the Edge with Tony and he had just come from doing Nixon before that, and I wrote this in the book, I tell this story like when we were in the Canadian Rockies, which was the most beautiful place I've ever been. My sister Beth came to see me, and she comes into the woods uh to see me and greet me. At the end of the day, and Tony was lying on the ground on an air mattress. They made like a little bed for him because he'd hurt his back. And he's reading the newspaper. And I said, Tony, I'm sorry to interrupted you. Would like to introduce you to my sister, my sister Beth, And Tony puts down the newspaper and he gathers himself up and he stands up very slowly, and he raises himself up and he takes my sister's hand. He says, Elizabeth, with a great pleasure to meet you, and kisses her hand. And my sister, who was married had six children. I literally saw her like kind of like swoon. She developed it all behind my great pleasure to meet you. You are such a good mimic. He was killing me. And my sister was like, oh my god. She was like completely gonna wet her pants because Tony Hopkins kissed her hand. And you admire him so much because he's so elegant, talented, gracious, so varied. Can you do a kat impression? Much more important? Why can you do a Katie impression? No? No, but but he doesn't mean, he doesn't mean Tony Bennett. Do me a good quick Tony Bennett thing. Come on. When we did the show, we had begged Danny Bennett to have Tony come on, and he finally did come on and uh, and he played I played Tony and so funny to say this to me. I played Tony Bennett and he played Uh Anthony di Benedetto, who was a Tony Bennett impersonator who I sued, I read, I sued the big Jesus out of it, and I said, tell him the name you're using your act now. He says, I go by the name Phony Bennett. So we said to Danny would he come on with us? And Danny said, yeah, but my dad really doesn't quite get it, like what are you guys up to? Like he just wants you to say to me, what is it you guys are doing? And I said, well, we obviously make it silly and stupid. And there's a lot of stupid thing about him, you know, have having having had his life as a womanizer. You know, I met a gal once it had toenails that were like a stack of bob a cute Frido's. He said, Lamas silk and tough phone cream for nails was the commercial. And uh and and Danny said, what is the thing? And I go, well, underneath it all, there has to be something joyful. Im positive, I said, in the positive is that Tony reminds us that the business is supposed to be fun. We're supposed to be having fun and not complaining and and and stressing out all the time we do the show. The show's over, it's one o'clock. He packs up his bags. He's ketting to the elevator. Now it's probably closer to one thirty in the morning. Back then he was like eighty years old. And uh. He and the cast came out, some of them to have their picture taken with him on their phones. And Tony turns to them and says, your kids are terrific. This has been a million dollar night. And he said the phrase, this has been a million dollar night. And we always are like, oh my god, he's such I love him and I love Danny. I mean, the two of them together. Did you see zenn of Bennett? Oh, my people who are listening to this, get that documentaries Zen of Bennett. It's such a great one. And you had a big role in his recent n idea of Birthday at Radio City. Right out, I played Tony Bennett and we brought on Phony Bennett again, so so funny. Before we leave this podcast, we just got to ask about your podcast, which is a huge hit. So we're trying to learn from you. How long have you been doing it, how long do you want to keep doing it, and what do you think makes it so special. Well, in the way that we talked about work that I did that was dictated by my life and my kids and so forth. That I came up with the idea of doing a radio show. Lisa Burnbach was going to be my co host. Is very witty and funny, great writer Lisa Brenbach and preppy handbook, and we were gonna have a news person and a culture person. That idea, which is a lot of work and a lot of writing and a lot of producing and staffing. These people came to from w n y C and said, don't do that. Do this you and Mike and you interview people into a podcast and you try to access people you know in the business who you might have some context with it, are famous or successful, I would have you or admired. And the only thing that I do in my show that is the is it? You know? It is a decision I don't want to say technique, but is to have a longer format like this where people can relax. Rob Mills, who's the head of ABC, who was the guy that's my executive at ABC for the match game work that we do. I love him and he's one of the biggest reasons that I do match game because I love Rob so much. I'm when I go do match game. We do have fun. It's it's silly and dope, I know, And I'm sorry I've disappointed you in doing that. I understand. I'm gonna go home right away. I'm gonna start looking up the things you've done that you've disappointed me, and I'm gonna email you. See by the way I came across this, what was that about Katie? Hello? You know we've all disappointed her at various moments in our lives. It's okay, it's a sort of growing up. I feel like I feel like I'm her brother, and she's like you that's what you're wearing for Halloween. And that's the lamest constume I've ever seen in my life. What do you zoro? What is that? Like a little weird mask on? But um, the uh, the podcast. The thing is that Rob said, he said, what I love about your techniquecause he says, I call it the warm bath interview technique. He said, you just get your your subjects to come into that warm bath with you and they relax. Actually twenty minutes go by and they start telling you who they really are. It's true. But don't you think it's true that there's something more intimate about this. There's something more relaxed and revealing as a result. But I think, listen, you've interviewed, infinitely, I mean to the innth degree, more people than I have as a result of all of these different things you've done, whether it was with NBC and beyond, and you've interviewed countless more people than I have, mostly in those tighter TV segments of six or seven minutes or so. And what I find is that when you interview people, is that the length of the podcast and the length of time we have, which of course we cut down, provides us with a chance to let them give it to us. We don't have to try to take it. If they feel you're not predatory, If they feel you're not trying to facilitate something with them, and you let them make let it be their decision, they will very often tell you the things that they might not have otherwise. Before we go, I have to ask you two quick family questions. One from your early childhood. You know you're one of six. It's you obviously have a close relationship with Beth, who came to visit you on that set. But your brothers, you know, particularly Stephen, your politics could not be more different than his. It must be a strange dynamic and a family with more than one person in show biz. As they say, how has that affected your relationship with your siblings? Alec, I always wondered that about you. Well, I think that that by and large, over time, these spasms that happen where people act out a certain way that one side is an approving of they have like any family, were no different than anybody else. There's some ramification, there's some period we were seeking some detant there. You know, with my brother Stephen, he is uh and we've had this conversation. And I'm not saying this to be you know, mean spirited or whatever. He falls right into that Trump dynamic of a percentage of Trump's support, it's not all of them certainly, which is uneducated. My brother didn't go to college. He went right into the business. Uh, he's got a lot of anti government sentiments. You know, he doesn't like paying his taxes. I mean it was in the paper that he almost got arrested for not paying his state income taxes and so forth. And uh, there's uh, you know, there's a Fox News component to this, a DNA to this about people who need their politics predigested for them, you know, like most people. I know, I don't need people to give me. I want to read things and get information from the New York Review of Books in the New Yorker and the New York Times, but other sources as well. Um, and I don't need that stuff pre chew for me. And the other side seemed to need a lot of that. These people need people to articulate their opinions and tell them and kind of shape what they're thinking. Hannity's telling you what you really mean is this, and what you really need is this, and my brother was kind of fallen victim to that. I think has that created some tension between you or yeah? Yeah, yeah, oh yeah, oh sure. I mean I decided he would email me and say, you're gonna do that Trump thing? He said, I said, yeah, he goes. He said, you're just playing right into Donald's hands. He said. Now, when Trump won, there was a kind of a stinging effect that had to me, which was, I mean, you know, I don't believe that Trump won as a result of you know, five or six critical things, and some of it was, you know, we didn't get the best Hillery on the campaign trail either, by the way, but the and I'm a great admirer. First I just thought that could have gone better. But yeah, there's been some tensions about it because I I don't think he understands what he's doing. You know, when I listened to Trump today in the car on the way here, and again I don't say this with any malice. I don't enjoy saying this. I think that he has some kind of neurological disorder. I think he has something wrong with him physically, because he just is stuck in this kind of flailing rhetorically flailing He's like a guy who's drowning. In lifeguards school, they tell you you've got to slap the guy across the face was drowning. I'll still drown you too. Trump is borderline hysterical sometimes, and that's not going to work for us, for someone to be in that in that job. I love that Alec uses words like paripatetic and metronomically. He's an amazing vocabulary. You do. It's awesome and it's such a it's such a pleasure to listen to someone who is so fascile with the English language. I just wanted to say that as it very hard to craft the words I say in such a way that they sound just so fantastic to the American people. I try so hard, I really do. Cut that schmaltz with a big orange knife right there. Yeah, all right, we've got to go, but before we you I just have to ask you one final question. Not to sound like cheesy, but I'm so happy that you're in such a great place. I feel like professionally things are going so well for you, with the exception of the match game, that you're doing so many greats highly you know, I don't know, you just I feel like you're just in a in a great place, but also in terms of your personal life, and you know, it's so nice to see you have this really second chapter with Hilaria, and I'm curious, what is it about your relationship with Hilaria, about your children, about where you are in life personally that that's working so well for you. Well, before I answer that, let me say that I have uncovered the match game analogy for your career, and then, as as a devoted Today's Show watcher and a worshiper of you personally, when you came down a staircase, I think it was a Halloween show when you were dressed as Marilyn Monroe, when you did Diamonds or a Girl's best Friends at a low point and you were busting out of some like lamb a cost to with some chiffon costume, I said, my god, where has my Katie gone? What happened to her? She's gone? Than thank you for reminding that diamonds are girls, but you can google that, by the way, trying to Oh, it's it's, it's it's It was amazing. And so having said that, um, the answer to your question is, you know, my wife is a very self actualized person. She knows who she is and where she is and what she wants. And there's not a lot of self sabotage there. That's not a lot of unnecessary, uh you know, psychological. The treat is surround with her. She's a very very very smart and wise young woman. So I'm lucky, and my kids are very lucky. She's a great mom. You know, we're on this journey together and I'm just really lucky. I'm so lucky to have met her. She's such a she's such a decent and she does not complicate things unnecessarily. No drama, she's not yeah, she's like yeah, you just without even commenting on it. She just her nature is to sidestep the drama very effectively, you know. And she's changed. Her life can be quite cant and mental. But diamonds a girl's best friend. On that, on those notes, on those many notes, Ale, it's so fun having you. Thank you really so much for coming by. Um really happy, really happy for everything, Catherine Anne. And let the record reflect he was kissing her hand as Tony Hopkins. Yes, yes, close friends call him Tony, Tony, I call him Tone. You know, if you're close to him, you call him tone. Yeah, you hurt me, you cut me into the that's only a Stanford wallgrad could. It's nice to meet you. It's very nice to meet you too. Pleasuring this of pleasure. Thank you, Alec. As always, we want to thank Gianna Palmer for producing the show and Jared O'Connell for engineering and mixing it. Thanks as well to Mark Phillips for our theme music, which I've been listening to in the shower not really. Also, remember you can email us at comments at correct podcast dot com. You can find me on social media. I'm Katie Couric on Twitter and Instagram and Katie dot correct on Snapchat. I religiously follow Brian Goldsmith, so Brian tell us your handles so everyone else can to add Goldsmith be on Twitter. Best of all, you can rate and review us on iTunes. Don't forget to subscribe as well. Thanks so much for listening. We've had fun talking. We hope you've had fun listening to us and asking great questions, and we'll talk to you next time. Bye,