Hello, and welcome to Rewind with Karen and Georgia.

Hello, and welcome to Rewind with Karen and Georgia.

It is Wednesday, and that means that we're recapping one of our old shows with all new commentary and updates and insights.

It is Wednesday, and that means that we're recapping one of our old shows with all new commentary and updates and insights.

Beautiful insights. And today we're recapping episode thirty seven, which we named Liminal Space.

Beautiful insights. And today we're recapping episode thirty seven, which we named Liminal Space.

Remember I love that.

Remember I love that.

So Jordan is now as we take you back to October six, twenty sixteen. This was a wonderful year for podcasting as well as ironically for Drake. He was dating Rihanna. He had no idea what the future held for him, that he would be viciously, viciously roasted at a super.

So Jordan is now as we take you back to October six, twenty sixteen. This was a wonderful year for podcasting as well as ironically for Drake. He was dating Rihanna. He had no idea what the future held for him, that he would be viciously, viciously roasted at a super.

Bowl named and fucking roasted, named in shame, and I'm there for it. So let's listen to the intro of episode thirty seven.

Bowl named and fucking roasted, named in shame, and I'm there for it. So let's listen to the intro of episode thirty seven.

Let's settle in.

Let's settle in.

How do I look from this angle?

How do I look from this angle?

It's very odd, it's weird, right, we switch seats tonight. I think it's good.

It's very odd, it's weird, right, we switch seats tonight. I think it's good.

For the Liminal Space creative upset. WHOA you know about that? No, there's this thing I care. I talked about it. Oh maybe on the other podcast, but I have seven I'm sorry.

For the Liminal Space creative upset. WHOA you know about that? No, there's this thing I care. I talked about it. Oh maybe on the other podcast, but I have seven I'm sorry.

Oh I didn't tell you.

Oh I didn't tell you.

We haven't discussed that.

We haven't discussed that.

So let's cut cut, can we cut?

So let's cut cut, can we cut?

There's a thing they call it's the space that you get into when you're unsure or you're upset, or like right after something shocking happens or whatever it's. They call it liminal space. And when you're in that place, your brain is working like a peak at top performance. So that's why, like when they it's good if you're a creative person. If you get too comfortable in anything or feel too secure, it's bad because then you can't, like the thoughts don't come the right way. But if you, you know, like get into a thing like that's why, Like sometimes in stand up when you're on stage, like you know you're going to open with a couple jokes, but then you go into something new and weird because you can come up with something you didn't even know you were thinking of.

There's a thing they call it's the space that you get into when you're unsure or you're upset, or like right after something shocking happens or whatever it's. They call it liminal space. And when you're in that place, your brain is working like a peak at top performance. So that's why, like when they it's good if you're a creative person. If you get too comfortable in anything or feel too secure, it's bad because then you can't, like the thoughts don't come the right way. But if you, you know, like get into a thing like that's why, Like sometimes in stand up when you're on stage, like you know you're going to open with a couple jokes, but then you go into something new and weird because you can come up with something you didn't even know you were thinking of.

That's cool.

That's cool.

So as you're saying, stop going to the same cafe for me every day and ordering two scrambled eggs in a side of fruit and an Americano every single fucking day in my life.

So as you're saying, stop going to the same cafe for me every day and ordering two scrambled eggs in a side of fruit and an Americano every single fucking day in my life.

Well, I mean, are you writing somewhere near there or like yes, yeah I would, or you could order something different or go to a different cafe. Just do something that will make you uncomfortably so that your brain works differently.

Well, I mean, are you writing somewhere near there or like yes, yeah I would, or you could order something different or go to a different cafe. Just do something that will make you uncomfortably so that your brain works differently.

I love it.

I love it.

I getting it getting out of a pattern. Okay, and that's what.

I getting it getting out of a pattern. Okay, and that's what.

This is right now, Georgia.

This is right now, Georgia.

Is this of you and I looking at each other from a totally different perspective?

Is this of you and I looking at each other from a totally different perspective?

Yeah, which is different couches, witch, couches everyone.

Yeah, which is different couches, witch, couches everyone.

Yeah, it's not that big a deal. Actually it is.

Yeah, it's not that big a deal. Actually it is.

Like from the very beginning, that's how we've done it.

Like from the very beginning, that's how we've done it.

So this is sneat, I mean episode thirty seven it's going to be all about like the brand new thing.

So this is sneat, I mean episode thirty seven it's going to be all about like the brand new thing.

Also, now we're talking about the Bible, so.

Also, now we're talking about the Bible, so.

Open your there's so much the Bible there really is.

Open your there's so much the Bible there really is.

We should do a biblical episode. That would be that would be so boring.

We should do a biblical episode. That would be that would be so boring.

That would just put me back to like fucking grammar on high schools.

That would just put me back to like fucking grammar on high schools.

Like these stories again read my story at issue. The whole story is going to be in.

Like these stories again read my story at issue. The whole story is going to be in.

Caps, like the anger is none in all of Sant Francis grammar school.

Caps, like the anger is none in all of Sant Francis grammar school.

Totally.

Totally.

Okay, this is our first so I was thinking that this is our first episode back from the last episode was a live episode.

Okay, this is our first so I was thinking that this is our first episode back from the last episode was a live episode.

Yes, which is fun, so awesome. It went really well.

Yes, which is fun, so awesome. It went really well.

It was it went well, which I can now tell you that I'm surprised, yeah, because I was like, who the fuck knows what this is going to be? Like you and I sitting here talking about stuff. We know what that with that amounts to. But like having people react in real time and whether or not they were going to I mean, obviously if they were there, they were slightly on board.

It was it went well, which I can now tell you that I'm surprised, yeah, because I was like, who the fuck knows what this is going to be? Like you and I sitting here talking about stuff. We know what that with that amounts to. But like having people react in real time and whether or not they were going to I mean, obviously if they were there, they were slightly on board.

Yeah, but those people I'm not worried about. It's like, does it translate to like, I'm not gonna be totally honest, I don't fucking listen to live episodes of podcasts.

Yeah, but those people I'm not worried about. It's like, does it translate to like, I'm not gonna be totally honest, I don't fucking listen to live episodes of podcasts.

No, I don't either, No way, I'm like that.

No, I don't either, No way, I'm like that.

That doesn't that doesn't translate I'm not going to do that.

That doesn't that doesn't translate I'm not going to do that.

I don't want to hear you like pointing out things and talking about them, right.

I don't want to hear you like pointing out things and talking about them, right.

Or yeah, or just having a whole experience without me, because in these it feels like when I listen to podcasts, I'm like, I'm there too.

Or yeah, or just having a whole experience without me, because in these it feels like when I listen to podcasts, I'm like, I'm there too.

Yeah, that's the whole fun of it, I think, Yeah, so.

Yeah, that's the whole fun of it, I think, Yeah, so.

Yes, I But I also I was just nervous, and I kind of was like, I don't know, I.

Yes, I But I also I was just nervous, and I kind of was like, I don't know, I.

Was nervous about me because you've never seen me on stage before.

Was nervous about me because you've never seen me on stage before.

No, I'm too much of a narcissist. To be nervous about you. I mean, let's I was like, you're on your own. Okay, six sinkers, whim. I gotta get mine.

No, I'm too much of a narcissist. To be nervous about you. I mean, let's I was like, you're on your own. Okay, six sinkers, whim. I gotta get mine.

You know what?

You know what?

I think?

I think?

What if we added Dave Anthony permanently to the podcast.

What if we added Dave Anthony permanently to the podcast.

Well, probably shouldn't talk about this right now, but Dave.

Well, probably shouldn't talk about this right now, but Dave.

I did a show with Dave Anthony the other night and he was like, I think we should start doing like every three months.

I did a show with Dave Anthony the other night and he was like, I think we should start doing like every three months.

Oh my god, we all we all do all.

Oh my god, we all we all do all.

Our podcasts together. That was like, that was great.

Our podcasts together. That was like, that was great.

And also that was my sister's suggestion. I swear to god, she's batting a thousand. She was like, Dave was so funny on your show. I don't think I beat a lot to the doll up. I just like laughing at whatever the fuck garretts I do, though, you do. But here's the thing. It's learning to elbow your way to comedy. Conversation takes a takes a while.

And also that was my sister's suggestion. I swear to god, she's batting a thousand. She was like, Dave was so funny on your show. I don't think I beat a lot to the doll up. I just like laughing at whatever the fuck garretts I do, though, you do. But here's the thing. It's learning to elbow your way to comedy. Conversation takes a takes a while.

That's scary, it's scary.

That's scary, it's scary.

And also it's that thing of like, well, am I going to stop? This is the thing I'm gonna say? Going to be worth it to stop totally. It's a really hard thing to do.

And also it's that thing of like, well, am I going to stop? This is the thing I'm gonna say? Going to be worth it to stop totally. It's a really hard thing to do.

Interrupting people, especially people who are like, like fucking legit comedians that have been doing this for years and years.

Interrupting people, especially people who are like, like fucking legit comedians that have been doing this for years and years.

Is not my thing.

Is not my thing.

It's well And also if you do it and it's like a like a half tepid responsibly, it makes you never want to say anything again.

It's well And also if you do it and it's like a like a half tepid responsibly, it makes you never want to say anything again.

Like a stupid idiot.

Like a stupid idiot.

Yeah, when people would laugh when I said something, I wanted to go hug and eat each and every.

Yeah, when people would laugh when I said something, I wanted to go hug and eat each and every.

One of them so much.

One of them so much.

You guys want to understand how this is for me. But you did great. It didn't seem like you were having a hard time.

You guys want to understand how this is for me. But you did great. It didn't seem like you were having a hard time.

Oh, I had a lot of fun. I said, fuck it once you're in the moment exactly.

Oh, I had a lot of fun. I said, fuck it once you're in the moment exactly.

Well, and it's for fun. Those guys love you. Dave thinks you're fucking hilarious.

Well, and it's for fun. Those guys love you. Dave thinks you're fucking hilarious.

That's so nice.

That's so nice.

Yeah, and I never say that to my face, but I appreciate you.

Yeah, and I never say that to my face, but I appreciate you.

No, No, he can't. Okay, he's got emotional problems.

No, No, he can't. Okay, he's got emotional problems.

Everyone go the doll Up Live their last fun where guests on it. So if you really fucking love the live episode, yeah, that's how.

Everyone go the doll Up Live their last fun where guests on it. So if you really fucking love the live episode, yeah, that's how.

We warmed it up. That's how we heated it up. That's nice. Yeah, So the live episode and that was awesome. It was super fun. And also we get to meet a bunch of people, which is very cool. Afterwards, which I have to say, I went backstage because I was like, I don't want to meet people, like I don't I don't think i'll be good at it.

We warmed it up. That's how we heated it up. That's nice. Yeah, So the live episode and that was awesome. It was super fun. And also we get to meet a bunch of people, which is very cool. Afterwards, which I have to say, I went backstage because I was like, I don't want to meet people, like I don't I don't think i'll be good at it.

I don't like the idea of it.

I don't like the idea of it.

And then I was standing back there and said, you were already talking to somebody, And then I'm like what am I doing?

And then I was standing back there and said, you were already talking to somebody, And then I'm like what am I doing?

Like that's not allowed?

Like that's not allowed?

And then the second I walked out, whoever the first person I was to talk to, I was just like, Hey, what's going on? And they were so regular and normal. It wasn't like I had to do anything. It was just like having a nice conversation with a person that was happy.

And then the second I walked out, whoever the first person I was to talk to, I was just like, Hey, what's going on? And they were so regular and normal. It wasn't like I had to do anything. It was just like having a nice conversation with a person that was happy.

I've had years and years of experience of like talking to strangers because Ali and I do the like cocktail like food thing, and you go to these like cocktail parties and food parties and you get to fucking just talk to people and it's scary and hard, but the more you do it, the more you're just used to it and it's not a big deal.

I've had years and years of experience of like talking to strangers because Ali and I do the like cocktail like food thing, and you go to these like cocktail parties and food parties and you get to fucking just talk to people and it's scary and hard, but the more you do it, the more you're just used to it and it's not a big deal.

Yeah, especially strangers. But what was I gonna say? I don't know.

Yeah, especially strangers. But what was I gonna say? I don't know.

I guess this would be a good Oh. And the episode before that was the Jambinet episode. So it wasn't like a regular format, that's right. So this is like the first time we've done a regular format, like we're back for a long time. Yeah, from camp, it's been, that's right, it's been. My legs are really tan. My legs don't tan only in my arm, and I'm burnt on the back of my neck.

I guess this would be a good Oh. And the episode before that was the Jambinet episode. So it wasn't like a regular format, that's right. So this is like the first time we've done a regular format, like we're back for a long time. Yeah, from camp, it's been, that's right, it's been. My legs are really tan. My legs don't tan only in my arm, and I'm burnt on the back of my neck.

It's weird.

It's weird.

And I'm starting to wear this necklace all the time that I never wore before.

And I'm starting to wear this necklace all the time that I never wore before.

You know, friendship bracelet camp stuff. It's camp stuff.

You know, friendship bracelet camp stuff. It's camp stuff.

It's good luck when it falls off on its own, fucking bracelets of people.

It's good luck when it falls off on its own, fucking bracelets of people.

Fuckala, oh fuck you Madonna.

Fuckala, oh fuck you Madonna.

No. I just mean like when you go to some party like and it's like sponsored by a company and they're like, put this bracelet on, I want to falls off. Your wish will come true, and I just like it's falling off when I rip it off of my fucking arm.

No. I just mean like when you go to some party like and it's like sponsored by a company and they're like, put this bracelet on, I want to falls off. Your wish will come true, and I just like it's falling off when I rip it off of my fucking arm.

It always that's stuff. That stuff always makes me want to go.

It always that's stuff. That stuff always makes me want to go.

Yeah. Well, since no wishes that I can think of, like stuff like this has ever come true, I don't need your bracelet.

Yeah. Well, since no wishes that I can think of, like stuff like this has ever come true, I don't need your bracelet.

I'm sorry. Wishes aren't a thing.

I'm sorry. Wishes aren't a thing.

I'm sorry to tell you.

I'm sorry to tell you.

I'm sorry to tell everyone karma and wishes are not true. Oh god, everyone just hung up on the podcast, Like half the women just hung up on this.

I'm sorry to tell everyone karma and wishes are not true. Oh god, everyone just hung up on the podcast, Like half the women just hung up on this.

Sorry.

Sorry.

Sorry, mercury is a retrograde?

Sorry, mercury is a retrograde?

What can I say?

What can I say?

Wishes aren't true?

Wishes aren't true?

It's not actually, Oh well, there's a at work, there's a website called is mercury and Retrograde?

It's not actually, Oh well, there's a at work, there's a website called is mercury and Retrograde?

And it either says yes.

And it either says yes.

Or no, And we look it up all the time because people are constantly making that joke, and then we're like, wait, let's just check and see if it.

Or no, And we look it up all the time because people are constantly making that joke, and then we're like, wait, let's just check and see if it.

Really is you actually no, Yes.

Really is you actually no, Yes.

I just almost split this drink out of the astrols when you said because it really is no, because someone made that, and I just love that. That's such a great it's the best eleven people make simple, hilarious stupid things. Kat Sollen, our friend who's a director, is a true come enthusiast, fucking talented as shit person. I begged her to make a send new design for our shirts and she did it and they look freaking incredible. They look like an old, like nineteen sixties pulp fiction book cover and I'm so happy with them.

I just almost split this drink out of the astrols when you said because it really is no, because someone made that, and I just love that. That's such a great it's the best eleven people make simple, hilarious stupid things. Kat Sollen, our friend who's a director, is a true come enthusiast, fucking talented as shit person. I begged her to make a send new design for our shirts and she did it and they look freaking incredible. They look like an old, like nineteen sixties pulp fiction book cover and I'm so happy with them.

And we're going to cool.

And we're going to cool.

We're going to keep posting new sayings and people can vote for what the sayings they want it to be. Oh did you know? Did you see the what they voted for? They voted for fuck politeness to be the next one.

We're going to keep posting new sayings and people can vote for what the sayings they want it to be. Oh did you know? Did you see the what they voted for? They voted for fuck politeness to be the next one.

Nice?

Nice?

Yeah cool cool?

Yeah cool cool?

Uh yeah.

Uh yeah.

Anyways, yeah, I didn't know there was voting going on.

Anyways, yeah, I didn't know there was voting going on.

I just fucking decided one week.

I just fucking decided one week.

You went totally rogues. Sorry, what's going to pass it by you? Of course?

You went totally rogues. Sorry, what's going to pass it by you? Of course?

I don't, please, Okay, I mean, of all the things I've tried to care about, vote away. I feel like we talked about that a while ago. Yeah, but I just didn't. I I feel like I'm missing out on life. If there was any tone in that, it was not towards you. It was I'm spending a lot of time. And this is not a complaint because I love my job. But it's the kind of thing where everyone once in a while, like I'll pick up my phone and look at email and I'll watch you talking to all.

I don't, please, Okay, I mean, of all the things I've tried to care about, vote away. I feel like we talked about that a while ago. Yeah, but I just didn't. I I feel like I'm missing out on life. If there was any tone in that, it was not towards you. It was I'm spending a lot of time. And this is not a complaint because I love my job. But it's the kind of thing where everyone once in a while, like I'll pick up my phone and look at email and I'll watch you talking to all.

These people where I'm just like, thanks, fucking.

These people where I'm just like, thanks, fucking.

Go fun because I'm a control of freak and just deal with like.

Go fun because I'm a control of freak and just deal with like.

I mean, just I'm very grateful for you.

I mean, just I'm very grateful for you.

You, thank you.

You, thank you.

You have a hard job. I can't wait to have you for myself again. I can go get Chuna fucking melts at Cafe one on one for real, it's been so long. I can pick your fries out and eat all your fries.

You have a hard job. I can't wait to have you for myself again. I can go get Chuna fucking melts at Cafe one on one for real, it's been so long. I can pick your fries out and eat all your fries.

You can have all the fries. I can't eat fries anymore.

You can have all the fries. I can't eat fries anymore.

Oh yeah, good. I can't wait until you're free again. I'm happy and I love your job, and I'm so happy for you, and it's great.

Oh yeah, good. I can't wait until you're free again. I'm happy and I love your job, and I'm so happy for you, and it's great.

I'm lying.

I'm lying.

I fucking want you for myself and I want my favorite friend to be the only thing that matters in your life.

I fucking want you for myself and I want my favorite friend to be the only thing that matters in your life.

I mean, that would be nice, it will be, but it but it's also cool because it's it's whatever. It's I used to have a job that actually takes up all my time and brain. But then it's then there's things like that where we're just like, oh is that what's happening?

I mean, that would be nice, it will be, but it but it's also cool because it's it's whatever. It's I used to have a job that actually takes up all my time and brain. But then it's then there's things like that where we're just like, oh is that what's happening?

Good?

Good?

I love that daddy has a job, but we miss daddy. Daddy wants to come home.

I love that daddy has a job, but we miss daddy. Daddy wants to come home.

That's what I'm saying. Hey, let's take a quick pee break and then get started.

That's what I'm saying. Hey, let's take a quick pee break and then get started.

The idea that I stated the words fuck you Madonna is a shame to me. It brings shame to my family. That is not the person I thought I was. That's not how I feel about Madonna.

The idea that I stated the words fuck you Madonna is a shame to me. It brings shame to my family. That is not the person I thought I was. That's not how I feel about Madonna.

No, but people, you change, you grow, you stop hating Madonna for whatever reason.

No, but people, you change, you grow, you stop hating Madonna for whatever reason.

That's true.

That's true.

I think I was going through a really dark time in my life and I wanted to kind of, you know, forget about who I was and who I grew up as, which was a Madonna want to be from day one.

I think I was going through a really dark time in my life and I wanted to kind of, you know, forget about who I was and who I grew up as, which was a Madonna want to be from day one.

Absolutely just really.

Absolutely just really.

Changed my life in every way. Don't go for second best.

Changed my life in every way. Don't go for second best.

At least we didn't make fuck you Madonna merch was all I'll say. I was smart enough to know.

At least we didn't make fuck you Madonna merch was all I'll say. I was smart enough to know.

Can you?

Can you?

One time I made a neva joke about Madonna on the Grammys. This was like twenty eighteen or even earlier than that, because it was kind of like the glory days of Twitter. Man, those Madonna fans and I guess I'll just say it.

One time I made a neva joke about Madonna on the Grammys. This was like twenty eighteen or even earlier than that, because it was kind of like the glory days of Twitter. Man, those Madonna fans and I guess I'll just say it.

Gay men came after me, fuck you bitch, where I was.

Gay men came after me, fuck you bitch, where I was.

Like, and then I kind of looked at it. I was like, yeah, you know what, You're right, that's fine.

Like, and then I kind of looked at it. I was like, yeah, you know what, You're right, that's fine.

I take it.

I take it.

I delete it.

I delete it.

Yeah right, that's peak.

Yeah right, that's peak.

That's peak fame or peak influence influence. That people will come after you for talking shit about someone they don't even know. Yeah, which I feel like murderinos kind of do that. And I'm so grateful for that.

That's peak fame or peak influence influence. That people will come after you for talking shit about someone they don't even know. Yeah, which I feel like murderinos kind of do that. And I'm so grateful for that.

I think they are Madonna level supporters. I think so too, And we're very lucky.

I think they are Madonna level supporters. I think so too, And we're very lucky.

We are so appreciative of everything you guys do, for all that shit talking that goes on on the super Bowl, on Twitter, on Instagram.

We are so appreciative of everything you guys do, for all that shit talking that goes on on the super Bowl, on Twitter, on Instagram.

To defend the indefensible. You go out there for your girls, knowing knowing you're wrong. Of course I didn't mean fuck you Madonna, She's my hero.

To defend the indefensible. You go out there for your girls, knowing knowing you're wrong. Of course I didn't mean fuck you Madonna, She's my hero.

Well, let's blame retrograde, which, by the way, it is not right now, but it will be once this comes out.

Well, let's blame retrograde, which, by the way, it is not right now, but it will be once this comes out.

Let's blame Mercury on retrograde. Is that what it is, is that what we're supposed to play really spiritual.

Let's blame Mercury on retrograde. Is that what it is, is that what we're supposed to play really spiritual.

If you didn't know that about me.

If you didn't know that about me.

Actually, Alice Nagasta, who writes these shows up for us, put it in the notes. Yeah, Mercury is not in retrograde right now.

Actually, Alice Nagasta, who writes these shows up for us, put it in the notes. Yeah, Mercury is not in retrograde right now.

But she said that when this comes out, it will be.

But she said that when this comes out, it will be.

It's currently not while we're speaking exactly, but when you're right, but in next Wednesday, or maybe in three wednesdays, whatever it is.

It's currently not while we're speaking exactly, but when you're right, but in next Wednesday, or maybe in three wednesdays, whatever it is.

Whenever this is happening, to your ears, it's in retrograde, so be careful. It's on retro grade, in retrograde, around retrograde don't slip in the shower, is all I'm saying.

Whenever this is happening, to your ears, it's in retrograde, so be careful. It's on retro grade, in retrograde, around retrograde don't slip in the shower, is all I'm saying.

And if this is twenty thirty five, that none of this applies to you, and obviously.

And if this is twenty thirty five, that none of this applies to you, and obviously.

And how is your fucking how's your battery pack?

And how is your fucking how's your battery pack?

How's your duty jets and skirt?

How's your duty jets and skirt?

How are you listening to this?

How are you listening to this?

All right?

All right?

Battery pack?

Battery pack?

I don't know.

I don't know.

They definitely are wearing big batteries.

They definitely are wearing big batteries.

Everyone do. Is they charged by a battery pack?

Everyone do. Is they charged by a battery pack?

Okay? So now it's time to get into the first story on this episode Liminal Space. It's Georgia going first this week and covering the Ruth Talia Sias murder. So let's see who went first four episodes ago.

Okay? So now it's time to get into the first story on this episode Liminal Space. It's Georgia going first this week and covering the Ruth Talia Sias murder. So let's see who went first four episodes ago.

Oh my god, I want to say, I don't care you want to go first?

Oh my god, I want to say, I don't care you want to go first?

You want me to go first?

You want me to go first?

Uh, whatever you want, it's your.

Uh, whatever you want, it's your.

Choice, Okay, let me go.

Choice, Okay, let me go.

Okay?

Okay?

Is that rude?

Is that rude?

No?

No?

All right?

All right?

So this one actually speaking of Cat's someone who made our shirts signe. She sent this to me and I had never heard of it, and it's oh nice, pretty bananas.

So this one actually speaking of Cat's someone who made our shirts signe. She sent this to me and I had never heard of it, and it's oh nice, pretty bananas.

Okay? All right, So we.

Okay? All right, So we.

Start with nineteen year old Ruth Talia Sias sayas.

Start with nineteen year old Ruth Talia Sias sayas.

Let me start. We start with nineteen year old Ruth Talia Sayas.

Let me start. We start with nineteen year old Ruth Talia Sayas.

She was raised on the outskirts of the capitol in a working class area of Peru. So outside of the working class area of Peru, and she was studying at a local university and she lived with her family like normal girl, cute girl, regular, nineteen year old. On Saturday July twelfth, twenty twelve, she was the very first contestant on the new reality show that was like a quiz show called El valor de la verdad, which is translated to the value of the truth.

She was raised on the outskirts of the capitol in a working class area of Peru. So outside of the working class area of Peru, and she was studying at a local university and she lived with her family like normal girl, cute girl, regular, nineteen year old. On Saturday July twelfth, twenty twelve, she was the very first contestant on the new reality show that was like a quiz show called El valor de la verdad, which is translated to the value of the truth.

You knew that.

You knew that.

I just wanted to guess because I've never taken Spanish and I know what dad means.

I just wanted to guess because I've never taken Spanish and I know what dad means.

So it's a new quiz reality quiz show that's just come to Peru. The show's premise is that a contestant is asked a series of personal questions like during an interview, a private interview with a production company on the producers varying seriousness the questions, and they're hooked up to a fucking polygraph. Okay, So the contestant is later asked the same questions but in front of a crazy studio audience, and it's like, what's that The money show?

So it's a new quiz reality quiz show that's just come to Peru. The show's premise is that a contestant is asked a series of personal questions like during an interview, a private interview with a production company on the producers varying seriousness the questions, and they're hooked up to a fucking polygraph. Okay, So the contestant is later asked the same questions but in front of a crazy studio audience, and it's like, what's that The money show?

Do you want to be a millionaire? Who wants to be a million?

Do you want to be a millionaire? Who wants to be a million?

Yeah, it's like that kind of seriousness level with lights and shit. So they're given their questions again and their answers are voted like by the polygraph, whether they're true or not. Okay, So for each truthful response that they give, they win money. If they lie according to the polygraph test, they lose all the money they made. So they can keep going with questions and if they're correct and they are not lying about them, they win money. And the questions get more and more personal as the show goes on, and the contestant has the option of calling it off after each answer. So they've only won a certain amount, they can be like and they've answered like some really personal question, they get them done. So she's a very first content on this show, this little nineteen year old university student, and she went on because she wanted to open a salon and she had already saved a ton of money, but she needed the money from the show to bring her closer to buying that salon. And she was like, okay, making a spectacle of herself to get the money. So every contestant gets to bring on her house to bring on three guests to the show, who are like sitting there being interviewed and filmed the whole time. She's answering these personal questions. So she brings her parents. It's Liencio and Vilma, and they're like sweet baby angels. I watched I watched it, and the dad said that he was afraid of what I might learn about my daughter when he was introduced. But they were all jovial. They were all like, you know, this is gonna be fun. We're going to win some money. No one thought it'd be that insane because they thought their daughter was like a normal human being.

Yeah, it's like that kind of seriousness level with lights and shit. So they're given their questions again and their answers are voted like by the polygraph, whether they're true or not. Okay, So for each truthful response that they give, they win money. If they lie according to the polygraph test, they lose all the money they made. So they can keep going with questions and if they're correct and they are not lying about them, they win money. And the questions get more and more personal as the show goes on, and the contestant has the option of calling it off after each answer. So they've only won a certain amount, they can be like and they've answered like some really personal question, they get them done. So she's a very first content on this show, this little nineteen year old university student, and she went on because she wanted to open a salon and she had already saved a ton of money, but she needed the money from the show to bring her closer to buying that salon. And she was like, okay, making a spectacle of herself to get the money. So every contestant gets to bring on her house to bring on three guests to the show, who are like sitting there being interviewed and filmed the whole time. She's answering these personal questions. So she brings her parents. It's Liencio and Vilma, and they're like sweet baby angels. I watched I watched it, and the dad said that he was afraid of what I might learn about my daughter when he was introduced. But they were all jovial. They were all like, you know, this is gonna be fun. We're going to win some money. No one thought it'd be that insane because they thought their daughter was like a normal human being.

I mean, you know.

I mean, you know.

So.

So.

The third guest was her boyfriend, Brian Leva.

The third guest was her boyfriend, Brian Leva.

He was a twenty year old cab driver. He was raised down the road for a move Talia, and he'd stuttered since an old boyfriend of his mother had pushed him down the stairs when he was only eight.

He was a twenty year old cab driver. He was raised down the road for a move Talia, and he'd stuttered since an old boyfriend of his mother had pushed him down the stairs when he was only eight.

Oh so he's just like this normal.

Oh so he's just like this normal.

Dude, but he had a stutter. The host says, you seem nervous. What are you so nervous about? And he said that she may have cheated on me. And he was like a very stoneface and like clearly nervous through the whole show.

Dude, but he had a stutter. The host says, you seem nervous. What are you so nervous about? And he said that she may have cheated on me. And he was like a very stoneface and like clearly nervous through the whole show.

So here are the questions.

So here are the questions.

Some of the questions she was asked, have you ever skipped school without your mother's knowledge? If you found one thousand souls, which you return them souls, it's like, oh my money.

Some of the questions she was asked, have you ever skipped school without your mother's knowledge? If you found one thousand souls, which you return them souls, it's like, oh my money.

Yeah. So she revealed that.

Yeah. So she revealed that.

She had a thousand wandering souls.

She had a thousand wandering souls.

Yeah, would return them to their homes.

Yeah, would return them to their homes.

She revealed she had a nose job, and that she didn't like her body, and that she wished she was white, and that she was only with her boyfriend Brian until someone better came along.

She revealed she had a nose job, and that she didn't like her body, and that she wished she was white, and that she was only with her boyfriend Brian until someone better came along.

The one that was there, the cab driver.

The one that was there, the cab driver.

Yeah with the stutter yeah, And that she was ashamed of her parents' manners, and that she didn't actually work at a call center like they thought. She danced at a nightclub.

Yeah with the stutter yeah, And that she was ashamed of her parents' manners, and that she didn't actually work at a call center like they thought. She danced at a nightclub.

Oh shit, here we go, Here we go.

Oh shit, here we go, Here we go.

So the mom is begging her to stop, and at one point Brian says, I don't want to hear anymore.

So the mom is begging her to stop, and at one point Brian says, I don't want to hear anymore.

The boyfriend.

The boyfriend.

So, okay, we're at question number eighteen, and she had won at this point with this question, she would have won the equivalent of fifteen thousand US dollars, which is almost ten months wages. Wait, no, no, no, I'm sorry. She could have went up to fifteen thousand US dollars. At that point, she had won five three hundred dollars, which was almost ten months wages in Lima.

So, okay, we're at question number eighteen, and she had won at this point with this question, she would have won the equivalent of fifteen thousand US dollars, which is almost ten months wages. Wait, no, no, no, I'm sorry. She could have went up to fifteen thousand US dollars. At that point, she had won five three hundred dollars, which was almost ten months wages in Lima.

With this question, she'll win this.

With this question, she'll win this.

The question number eighteen was have you ever accepted money for sex? And she answers yes, oh, and the polygraph confirmed that it was true. And she says, just twice, ne need money. We were in a bad situation. It hasn't happened since and it won't happen again. And her parents are like crying and like clearly shaken badly. It's fucked up, man, she said. So at that point she's like, I'm done. I'm not going to win up to fifteen thousand US dollars. I can't do this anymore. I mean, I wonder what the other questions were of I was like, that was the one that was only fifteen.

The question number eighteen was have you ever accepted money for sex? And she answers yes, oh, and the polygraph confirmed that it was true. And she says, just twice, ne need money. We were in a bad situation. It hasn't happened since and it won't happen again. And her parents are like crying and like clearly shaken badly. It's fucked up, man, she said. So at that point she's like, I'm done. I'm not going to win up to fifteen thousand US dollars. I can't do this anymore. I mean, I wonder what the other questions were of I was like, that was the one that was only fifteen.

Or five thousand dollars? Yeah, what were the other questions? Who knows?

Or five thousand dollars? Yeah, what were the other questions? Who knows?

She says.

She says.

At the end, my mother, my father, my brother and sister are the most beautiful things in the world to me. I love them all with all my heart. Brian, forgive me for making you go through this. And as the credit roll, she goes down on her knees before them and begs them for forgiveness her parents.

At the end, my mother, my father, my brother and sister are the most beautiful things in the world to me. I love them all with all my heart. Brian, forgive me for making you go through this. And as the credit roll, she goes down on her knees before them and begs them for forgiveness her parents.

What the fuck?

What the fuck?

Yeah kind of game show is this?

Yeah kind of game show is this?

Yeah?

Yeah?

So the show finally aired on Saturday, July twelfth, huge fucking hit, Like becomes number one, and she becomes like kind of a soelebrity in that world, but not like in a good way. She's just like talked about all the time. And Brian, her boyfriend, becomes a public fool and the Peru in Peru, like machoism is such a big thing, and he was humiliating from all these people, and people people in the small town recognize him and kind of humiliate him, and he's like fucking broken and sorry.

So the show finally aired on Saturday, July twelfth, huge fucking hit, Like becomes number one, and she becomes like kind of a soelebrity in that world, but not like in a good way. She's just like talked about all the time. And Brian, her boyfriend, becomes a public fool and the Peru in Peru, like machoism is such a big thing, and he was humiliating from all these people, and people people in the small town recognize him and kind of humiliate him, and he's like fucking broken and sorry.

But did she get any of that money?

But did she get any of that money?

Yeah? Okay, she got all of that.

Yeah? Okay, she got all of that.

She won what she like, she at least got.

She won what she like, she at least got.

She stopped so.

She stopped so.

She stopped after that true question.

She stopped after that true question.

Okay, so she was she wasn't lying about having had money had sex for money, So she stopped at basically our equivalent of fifty three hundred dollars.

Okay, so she was she wasn't lying about having had money had sex for money, So she stopped at basically our equivalent of fifty three hundred dollars.

So he's being followed.

So he's being followed.

Around by like by the media and being asked all these questions. Someone asked him how he felt about making being made of a fool, and he said, I'm ashamed all the things I learned on that show. How would you feel? And the new person said, but they say that if you love someone, you can forgive them, and he says, depends on what they did, the things she said that day, I can't forgive. But then in other interviews, he says that it had all been a setup, that he and ruth Talia had broken up months before the taping, and she had asked him to pretend to be her boyfriend on TV and that she'd share the money with him, and he hadn't given her.

Around by like by the media and being asked all these questions. Someone asked him how he felt about making being made of a fool, and he said, I'm ashamed all the things I learned on that show. How would you feel? And the new person said, but they say that if you love someone, you can forgive them, and he says, depends on what they did, the things she said that day, I can't forgive. But then in other interviews, he says that it had all been a setup, that he and ruth Talia had broken up months before the taping, and she had asked him to pretend to be her boyfriend on TV and that she'd share the money with him, and he hadn't given her.

Any of the money.

Any of the money.

So it sounds like he's making this shit up to make himself sound a little bit better, right, because he's so fucking humiliated.

So it sounds like he's making this shit up to make himself sound a little bit better, right, because he's so fucking humiliated.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Eight weeks after the premiere of the show, on September eleventh, twenty twelve.

Eight weeks after the premiere of the show, on September eleventh, twenty twelve.

Ruth Talia disappears uh so crazy media circus.

Ruth Talia disappears uh so crazy media circus.

All the news programs covered it in Lima, but one of the hosts called her the prostitute of elve Lord de la Verdad, like she was known as like a whore and nobody cared about it because of that, and her parents had like a beg to get me the attention and get this covered and to try to find their daughter. Days after the disappearance, police find a body of a young woman buried in a well and covered by rocks and concrete on a piece of land on the outskirts of Lima, and the land belongs to Brian's uncle. So later that day, oh my god, this is so fucked up, and there's video of this. So the media and the mother, I'm sorry, The father and the sister are at the site where they're excavating trying to figure out if it's their sister and daughter, and the dad is on the phone on a cell phone, like crying and it's awful, and it turns out that it is her, and he's just like losing it and if you're sensitive, you shouldn't watch him break the fuck down. Then a reporter and her cameraman go to the home where Vilma, the mother is sitting vigil with some of her friends and doesn't yet know that it was her daughter that was found.

All the news programs covered it in Lima, but one of the hosts called her the prostitute of elve Lord de la Verdad, like she was known as like a whore and nobody cared about it because of that, and her parents had like a beg to get me the attention and get this covered and to try to find their daughter. Days after the disappearance, police find a body of a young woman buried in a well and covered by rocks and concrete on a piece of land on the outskirts of Lima, and the land belongs to Brian's uncle. So later that day, oh my god, this is so fucked up, and there's video of this. So the media and the mother, I'm sorry, The father and the sister are at the site where they're excavating trying to figure out if it's their sister and daughter, and the dad is on the phone on a cell phone, like crying and it's awful, and it turns out that it is her, and he's just like losing it and if you're sensitive, you shouldn't watch him break the fuck down. Then a reporter and her cameraman go to the home where Vilma, the mother is sitting vigil with some of her friends and doesn't yet know that it was her daughter that was found.

And the reporter says she gave her CONDI and.

And the reporter says she gave her CONDI and.

Says and realized she didn't know about it, and then the reporter said, man, they found your girl. So this fucking reporter told her, which is so ugly, So Brian's brought in for questioning and he confesses. He says that he called Ruth Talia as she was leaving school and they made plans to meet up. He says, I waited for her by the bridge. She got into my motor taxi and I said, let's go have some wine. She says, okay, and they went to his house, his apartment that he rented, and they had sex and then afterwards they started to fight, and she says, she tells me, I don't know what I'm going, what I'm doing with a poor motor taxi driver. And he says that's when I grabbed her by the throat, and that he admitted that he choked her for thirty seconds or more, and he says, I thought she had passed out. I listened to her heart, I didn't hear anything. I grabbed her and shook her, but nothing. I got scared. And during the trial, Brian's lawyer tried to pin the blame on the TV show, saying that they had humiliated him and so Beto Ortiz, who's one of the most famous television journalists there, they called him to testify. So it was later found that the majority of his confession was false, and there was a witness who was a young boy from the neighborhood, and he said that the night she disappeared, Brian had paid him fifty souls to let him know when ruth Talia got off the bus, and he said he had seen Brian another man force her into his motor taxi. And the court determined that Brian's accomplice was his uncle, who owned the property where her body was found, and the motive was robbery, and they had tried to get ruth Talia's bank security code so that they can get the winnings from the show, oh for themselves, and they were both sentenced to life in prison. So then the second season of Elva Laura was they only had celebrity contestants because they said they can deal with the media, which is like, how could you even have a fucking second season, But at least that's that. And oh, I wanted to say that a lot of this information and it's really hard to find information. I mean, there's no this isn't like a stort I ever heard about before. So the California Sunday magazine by Danielle el Er Cohn, he wrote this really great story about it, and that's why I got a lot of this information and then all over the internet as well.

Says and realized she didn't know about it, and then the reporter said, man, they found your girl. So this fucking reporter told her, which is so ugly, So Brian's brought in for questioning and he confesses. He says that he called Ruth Talia as she was leaving school and they made plans to meet up. He says, I waited for her by the bridge. She got into my motor taxi and I said, let's go have some wine. She says, okay, and they went to his house, his apartment that he rented, and they had sex and then afterwards they started to fight, and she says, she tells me, I don't know what I'm going, what I'm doing with a poor motor taxi driver. And he says that's when I grabbed her by the throat, and that he admitted that he choked her for thirty seconds or more, and he says, I thought she had passed out. I listened to her heart, I didn't hear anything. I grabbed her and shook her, but nothing. I got scared. And during the trial, Brian's lawyer tried to pin the blame on the TV show, saying that they had humiliated him and so Beto Ortiz, who's one of the most famous television journalists there, they called him to testify. So it was later found that the majority of his confession was false, and there was a witness who was a young boy from the neighborhood, and he said that the night she disappeared, Brian had paid him fifty souls to let him know when ruth Talia got off the bus, and he said he had seen Brian another man force her into his motor taxi. And the court determined that Brian's accomplice was his uncle, who owned the property where her body was found, and the motive was robbery, and they had tried to get ruth Talia's bank security code so that they can get the winnings from the show, oh for themselves, and they were both sentenced to life in prison. So then the second season of Elva Laura was they only had celebrity contestants because they said they can deal with the media, which is like, how could you even have a fucking second season, But at least that's that. And oh, I wanted to say that a lot of this information and it's really hard to find information. I mean, there's no this isn't like a stort I ever heard about before. So the California Sunday magazine by Danielle el Er Cohn, he wrote this really great story about it, and that's why I got a lot of this information and then all over the internet as well.

That is fucking crazy, the idea, the idea that that show continued on after the first contestant was murdered.

That is fucking crazy, the idea, the idea that that show continued on after the first contestant was murdered.

I mean, that's intense.

I mean, that's intense.

Remember when Jenny Jones, the Jenny Jones Show that a lot of young people won't remember. It was like one of those like nineties talk shows like Jerry Springer had on. Like it was like a confession episode of I'm in Love with You And a guy brought on his friend and told this guy that he was gay and he was in love with him.

Remember when Jenny Jones, the Jenny Jones Show that a lot of young people won't remember. It was like one of those like nineties talk shows like Jerry Springer had on. Like it was like a confession episode of I'm in Love with You And a guy brought on his friend and told this guy that he was gay and he was in love with him.

Yep.

Yep.

And the guy he told shot and killed him.

And the guy he told shot and killed him.

Yes, I do know that story because my old boss was one of the EPs on that show.

Yes, I do know that story because my old boss was one of the EPs on that show.

I had to go to court.

I had to go to court.

H That was like a huge scandal at Telepictures, breaking the company for that. No, it was horrible. And it's that kind of thing of like what's the line when you're producing TV? Everything is two numbers? Who butts in seats, eyes on screens? How do you do a show that's going to make people watch it? And especially in those days of like the early days of spreading and Jenny Jones.

H That was like a huge scandal at Telepictures, breaking the company for that. No, it was horrible. And it's that kind of thing of like what's the line when you're producing TV? Everything is two numbers? Who butts in seats, eyes on screens? How do you do a show that's going to make people watch it? And especially in those days of like the early days of spreading and Jenny Jones.

All that shit.

All that shit.

Let's keep going with that.

Let's keep going with that.

But also why did they have a hit?

But also why did they have a hit?

Oh they had a hit because it's a girl who is exposed that it wasn't hit, that's not the baby daddy, and blah blah blah, and now they're in a fistfight and all that shit, and like that was the norm.

Oh they had a hit because it's a girl who is exposed that it wasn't hit, that's not the baby daddy, and blah blah blah, and now they're in a fistfight and all that shit, and like that was the norm.

So like you had, you had.

So like you had, you had.

They were trying to think of shows and produce shows that were.

They were trying to think of shows and produce shows that were.

Exploiting people most exploited. Well, the art scandalous.

Exploiting people most exploited. Well, the art scandalous.

The article I got a lot of this like basic information from uh was really interesting. So the show that the article that this is from, where they talk a lot about the actual show and how much it had to do with it and what like about reality shows in Peru was called the Contestant from California Sunday Magazine and so they talk a lot about that, and it's just like, I mean, who who would agree to say those things? But if you're in a poor fucking city and you need money, I mean, you'll do anything exactly.

The article I got a lot of this like basic information from uh was really interesting. So the show that the article that this is from, where they talk a lot about the actual show and how much it had to do with it and what like about reality shows in Peru was called the Contestant from California Sunday Magazine and so they talk a lot about that, and it's just like, I mean, who who would agree to say those things? But if you're in a poor fucking city and you need money, I mean, you'll do anything exactly.

It's total exploitation of people. And also that is such an ugly version. I think there was an American version of that show, and it wasn't on for very long I didn't know that because you can't. The nature of a show like that is is scandal. So like, if people are admitting things that no one gives a shit about and no one wants to talk about and that aren't that isn't like borderline, then you don't have a good show.

It's total exploitation of people. And also that is such an ugly version. I think there was an American version of that show, and it wasn't on for very long I didn't know that because you can't. The nature of a show like that is is scandal. So like, if people are admitting things that no one gives a shit about and no one wants to talk about and that aren't that isn't like borderline, then you don't have a good show.

And they're not gonna heard someone who's like, no, I've never had, never got paid for sax.

And they're not gonna heard someone who's like, no, I've never had, never got paid for sax.

Nope, I work in this place. You know, they find the most.

Nope, I work in this place. You know, they find the most.

Yes, they are only going to have people on there that are going to tell them what they want to hear. And and more so, the one of the weirdest things that I ever experienced in working in television is there is this very strange subset of people. And if you work in casting in like any kind of reality version of television, you know there are people who try to get on every single show and they're not. It's like, if it's a show about couples, they'll submit for that. If it's a show about you know, whatever the fuck it is, they want to they want to be on.

Yes, they are only going to have people on there that are going to tell them what they want to hear. And and more so, the one of the weirdest things that I ever experienced in working in television is there is this very strange subset of people. And if you work in casting in like any kind of reality version of television, you know there are people who try to get on every single show and they're not. It's like, if it's a show about couples, they'll submit for that. If it's a show about you know, whatever the fuck it is, they want to they want to be on.

TV making or whatever the fuck, they'll do.

TV making or whatever the fuck, they'll do.

Yeah, and they'll try to like they know TV well enough to know that they have to be interesting in certain personality types and and because it's it is a good way to make money if you, you know, if you're the right person.

Yeah, and they'll try to like they know TV well enough to know that they have to be interesting in certain personality types and and because it's it is a good way to make money if you, you know, if you're the right person.

But obviously just get one chance.

But obviously just get one chance.

Yeah you would think, but I mean these are people that are just like, well we'll go over here, Well we'll try to be on the Amazing Race, Well we'll try to be on the Marriage ref. Well we try to be on this. And that's what when I worked on the second season the Marriage Ref there was this one tape where they were like, brought us down to casting because they're like, you're never going to believe what you're about to see. And it's like this weird couple that like it's there's sexual overtones who are like this is they don't know that this is inappropriate, that like this isn't going to get them. It's just this weird shit. And one of the people in that casting department was like, oh, yeah, we had them.

Yeah you would think, but I mean these are people that are just like, well we'll go over here, Well we'll try to be on the Amazing Race, Well we'll try to be on the Marriage ref. Well we try to be on this. And that's what when I worked on the second season the Marriage Ref there was this one tape where they were like, brought us down to casting because they're like, you're never going to believe what you're about to see. And it's like this weird couple that like it's there's sexual overtones who are like this is they don't know that this is inappropriate, that like this isn't going to get them. It's just this weird shit. And one of the people in that casting department was like, oh, yeah, we had them.

They tried to be on whatever.

They tried to be on whatever.

Show she had worked on before WOA, And it's just like these people that are kind of like, we know, we're kind of interesting and kind of weirdos and that that works.

Show she had worked on before WOA, And it's just like these people that are kind of like, we know, we're kind of interesting and kind of weirdos and that that works.

Yeah, we're very different and we're wild, and let's get on fucking tell I just want to get on television.

Yeah, we're very different and we're wild, and let's get on fucking tell I just want to get on television.

Do you see that the real World?

Do you see that the real World?

This season is like everyone thinks they're just going on the real world, but for each each person on the real world, they find they're like enemy.

This season is like everyone thinks they're just going on the real world, but for each each person on the real world, they find they're like enemy.

Oh and they have to live in the house too.

Oh and they have to live in the house too.

And it's like, this show is interesting enough if you cast it well, these people are just going to make their own fucking and and you edit.

And it's like, this show is interesting enough if you cast it well, these people are just going to make their own fucking and and you edit.

It back and say, because no one's watching TV anymore, so they don't have good ratings, so it's not interesting enough to make a ratings hit. And that's all anybody cares about. And because all of television is owned by like four companies, Yeah, they have this insane grasp on the money.

It back and say, because no one's watching TV anymore, so they don't have good ratings, so it's not interesting enough to make a ratings hit. And that's all anybody cares about. And because all of television is owned by like four companies, Yeah, they have this insane grasp on the money.

Who gets the money?

Who gets the money?

The story is like nobody has any money, but that's actually not true. They're making millions of dollars because even in like a depression, people still watch TV. People still you know, advertising still works. But it's it's this, it's really sick and crazy, that kind of shit where you like that thing where you're watching TV and you're just like, oh, this isn't I don't feel like who I'm seeing is what I'm really seeing. Yeah, So the idea that your story is about a person who actually did the thing really and suffered by it.

The story is like nobody has any money, but that's actually not true. They're making millions of dollars because even in like a depression, people still watch TV. People still you know, advertising still works. But it's it's this, it's really sick and crazy, that kind of shit where you like that thing where you're watching TV and you're just like, oh, this isn't I don't feel like who I'm seeing is what I'm really seeing. Yeah, So the idea that your story is about a person who actually did the thing really and suffered by it.

Yeah, but she I don't know if she felt it didn't seem like she was. I mean, I guess she was kind of embarrassed and stayed at home a lot, But it's.

Yeah, but she I don't know if she felt it didn't seem like she was. I mean, I guess she was kind of embarrassed and stayed at home a lot, But it's.

Like she didn't seem like she was.

Like she didn't seem like she was.

She seemed like confident about having done it for the right reason and for the reason, which was to make her life better, even though she like you know, tore her family apart.

She seemed like confident about having done it for the right reason and for the reason, which was to make her life better, even though she like you know, tore her family apart.

Yeah, well you'd think that that makes your life way worse. Also being murdered, Yeah, I mean because that shame. Shame is the thing people can't deal with, Oh Jesus, shaming people, especially like you were saying, like like that culture where men have to be men, you can't come out and be like, h yeah, yeah sometimes I do this, which is like, you know, yeah, not in a judgmental way of that person's lifestyle, but this is like a cultural thing of where women are supposed to be like wives and mothers.

Yeah, well you'd think that that makes your life way worse. Also being murdered, Yeah, I mean because that shame. Shame is the thing people can't deal with, Oh Jesus, shaming people, especially like you were saying, like like that culture where men have to be men, you can't come out and be like, h yeah, yeah sometimes I do this, which is like, you know, yeah, not in a judgmental way of that person's lifestyle, but this is like a cultural thing of where women are supposed to be like wives and mothers.

And especially in Peru, I feel like it's you're not supposed to.

And especially in Peru, I feel like it's you're not supposed to.

It's not.

It's not.

It's like so much less accepted and understood than it is here as it is here.

It's like so much less accepted and understood than it is here as it is here.

Well, crazy, crazy, right.

Well, crazy, crazy, right.

I Mean that's the thing too. When you were saying, like you should you should watch it because he's all upset or whatever, I would never watch it.

I Mean that's the thing too. When you were saying, like you should you should watch it because he's all upset or whatever, I would never watch it.

No, it bothered me a lot. I never watched that.

No, it bothered me a lot. I never watched that.

The fact that the cops didn't keep him away from the from the cameras is upsetting. Like his daughter, his other daughter, tries to shield his space a couple of times, but there's nowhere to turn, Like there's cameras on every on every single angle of this man telling someone on the other line that they found his daughter, Like there's nowhere for him to go to get out of the fucking.

The fact that the cops didn't keep him away from the from the cameras is upsetting. Like his daughter, his other daughter, tries to shield his space a couple of times, but there's nowhere to turn, Like there's cameras on every on every single angle of this man telling someone on the other line that they found his daughter, Like there's nowhere for him to go to get out of the fucking.

Out of the camera. That's disgusting. It's just really sick and sad. And then the woman who uh told the mother in invertently the reporter, Yeah, the reporter.

Out of the camera. That's disgusting. It's just really sick and sad. And then the woman who uh told the mother in invertently the reporter, Yeah, the reporter.

She quit doing news after that. Wow yeah, yeah, esuching in this.