Toby, you and I were talking about this last week. It keeps coming up, uh, how technology is changing and morphing, and AI is now here, and it seems like it's taking over everywhere. And because of this conversation, we wanted to bring in a new friend to the program, Doctor Rosalie DeRose. Uh, to talk a little bit about this, because she is one of the workshop leaders of the Cold Conference, which is coming up on Saturday. And, uh, she's going to be talking about technology. And I just wanted to read this really quick because this is the descriptor of the workshop. Just the first couple of lines. We're losing our hearts, minds and souls to technology. In the words of one of my students, it has slithered into our lives like a python slowly squeezing its prey to death. This is a workshop I would like to attend. So Rosie, thank you so much for being here with us on mornings with Tom and Toby.

Toby, you and I were talking about this last week. It keeps coming up, uh, how technology is changing and morphing, and AI is now here, and it seems like it's taking over everywhere. And because of this conversation, we wanted to bring in a new friend to the program, Doctor Rosalie DeRose. Uh, to talk a little bit about this, because she is one of the workshop leaders of the Cold Conference, which is coming up on Saturday. And, uh, she's going to be talking about technology. And I just wanted to read this really quick because this is the descriptor of the workshop. Just the first couple of lines. We're losing our hearts, minds and souls to technology. In the words of one of my students, it has slithered into our lives like a python slowly squeezing its prey to death. This is a workshop I would like to attend. So Rosie, thank you so much for being here with us on mornings with Tom and Toby.

Well, it's it's wonderful to be here and thank you for being interested in it, because I think it's one of the most crucial topics that is not being talked about enough in the church, in the home and in general.

Well, it's it's wonderful to be here and thank you for being interested in it, because I think it's one of the most crucial topics that is not being talked about enough in the church, in the home and in general.

Mhm. Well, thank you for raising the alarm. Um, and speaking on it this weekend and meeting with us today. You're a professor of literature, English and homiletics at Moody Bible Institute. Um, but you've seen a lot. You've been there for several decades, and you have seen the changes in our culture and its impact on the students that you teach. I understand you actually lead your students in a fast every semester of of media. What what types of things come about as they let go of technology?

Mhm. Well, thank you for raising the alarm. Um, and speaking on it this weekend and meeting with us today. You're a professor of literature, English and homiletics at Moody Bible Institute. Um, but you've seen a lot. You've been there for several decades, and you have seen the changes in our culture and its impact on the students that you teach. I understand you actually lead your students in a fast every semester of of media. What what types of things come about as they let go of technology?

Well, I began the fast about 15 years ago with four days for freshmen, which everybody said was unheard of. It wouldn't happen. I began to realize that the tenor of everything had begun to change. I wasn't getting as much work out of the kids. A concentration at that point. I limited all media in the classroom. There was none under threat, and they had to do a four day fast in which they did nothing. I mean, they couldn't. Their parents had to get off the phone with them because they. It's like Hovercraft Parenthood today. And they had to, uh, they couldn't use their phone for anything except school. They couldn't use it as an alarm clock. They couldn't scroll on it at night. They couldn't listen to music, which is one of the huge complaints, the one I have the most trouble with with them, although it's the one that gives them great realization to they just their entire lives were dominated by them. And I have continued that, and I have actually 300 pages of findings which need to become a book, uh, about their responses in every conceivable area uh, marriage, romance, sacred space, anxiety, silence. It just goes on and on and on. And almost most people do not think they're addicted, and most of them come out saying they are addicted. They know it's dangerous. They know it has ruined. It has severely cramped their creativity. They know they isolate and go go to their rooms to watch movies instead of being with kids in the cafeteria. They know that they use it in chapel. I mean, it goes on and on, and that isn't even talking about the ramifications of pornography or all the rest of it. And so I have come down to, to a conviction that that I have no comprehension why this is not being preached upon. We talk about prayer, we talk about evangelism, we talk about family life. We talk about everything under the sun. And all of those are being eaten up or severely damaged by the phone, which is not in control. And it is daunting to see how little parents have done to do it. And the point is that the research is in I mean, we don't need any more research. The research is in about the damage it's done in in so many areas, uh, preoccupation, craving. People go through withdrawal symptoms. They feel like it's a third limb in their pocket, or I mean, another limb in their pocket like a python. And in my 300 pages, the metaphors go on and on with the kids just looking. They're very honest about it. If they're resistant, they're resistant. But, um, so much has been written and we we have not realized that this is affecting the spiritual life of your children. So it's one thing about the way it's affected social life, academics, but the way it's affected the spiritual life is, is much, much more crucial, crucial. And I think even if the cell phone is not responsible for 100% of the problems it is, I think the devil found a weapon. And I'm not telling you the cell phones, you know, is belongs to the devil, but I but I am saying he's using it. And I have several students that have given up, especially male. They have given up the cell phone for flip phones. And in order to control pornography, in order to change the, the, the, the texture of their life because they're not in touch with nature. People don't expect to be listened to and don't listen anymore.

Well, I began the fast about 15 years ago with four days for freshmen, which everybody said was unheard of. It wouldn't happen. I began to realize that the tenor of everything had begun to change. I wasn't getting as much work out of the kids. A concentration at that point. I limited all media in the classroom. There was none under threat, and they had to do a four day fast in which they did nothing. I mean, they couldn't. Their parents had to get off the phone with them because they. It's like Hovercraft Parenthood today. And they had to, uh, they couldn't use their phone for anything except school. They couldn't use it as an alarm clock. They couldn't scroll on it at night. They couldn't listen to music, which is one of the huge complaints, the one I have the most trouble with with them, although it's the one that gives them great realization to they just their entire lives were dominated by them. And I have continued that, and I have actually 300 pages of findings which need to become a book, uh, about their responses in every conceivable area uh, marriage, romance, sacred space, anxiety, silence. It just goes on and on and on. And almost most people do not think they're addicted, and most of them come out saying they are addicted. They know it's dangerous. They know it has ruined. It has severely cramped their creativity. They know they isolate and go go to their rooms to watch movies instead of being with kids in the cafeteria. They know that they use it in chapel. I mean, it goes on and on, and that isn't even talking about the ramifications of pornography or all the rest of it. And so I have come down to, to a conviction that that I have no comprehension why this is not being preached upon. We talk about prayer, we talk about evangelism, we talk about family life. We talk about everything under the sun. And all of those are being eaten up or severely damaged by the phone, which is not in control. And it is daunting to see how little parents have done to do it. And the point is that the research is in I mean, we don't need any more research. The research is in about the damage it's done in in so many areas, uh, preoccupation, craving. People go through withdrawal symptoms. They feel like it's a third limb in their pocket, or I mean, another limb in their pocket like a python. And in my 300 pages, the metaphors go on and on with the kids just looking. They're very honest about it. If they're resistant, they're resistant. But, um, so much has been written and we we have not realized that this is affecting the spiritual life of your children. So it's one thing about the way it's affected social life, academics, but the way it's affected the spiritual life is, is much, much more crucial, crucial. And I think even if the cell phone is not responsible for 100% of the problems it is, I think the devil found a weapon. And I'm not telling you the cell phones, you know, is belongs to the devil, but I but I am saying he's using it. And I have several students that have given up, especially male. They have given up the cell phone for flip phones. And in order to control pornography, in order to change the, the, the, the texture of their life because they're not in touch with nature. People don't expect to be listened to and don't listen anymore.

We are talking about technology, not just from a standpoint of it can enhance your ministry. It is one of those things where in reality it is choking out our very existence and lives. And we're learning about this from Doctor Rosalie Derossett, who is a workshop leader for the Called conference. And this is actually the topic that she will be talking about this Saturday. If you want more information, if you'd like to join the conference online, you can just go to our website right now. Moody radio.org. Click on the banner that says called and Sign up today.

We are talking about technology, not just from a standpoint of it can enhance your ministry. It is one of those things where in reality it is choking out our very existence and lives. And we're learning about this from Doctor Rosalie Derossett, who is a workshop leader for the Called conference. And this is actually the topic that she will be talking about this Saturday. If you want more information, if you'd like to join the conference online, you can just go to our website right now. Moody radio.org. Click on the banner that says called and Sign up today.

Yeah, that workshop specifically is called Mindful or Mindless Speaking Truth About Technology with Rosalie de Rossi. And you have mentioned this more than once, doctor Rose, that you don't know why pastors aren't preaching about this, that people, Christians aren't talking about this more. Do you have any works or thoughts on on maybe creating something specifically for pastors to use, maybe with their congregations?

Yeah, that workshop specifically is called Mindful or Mindless Speaking Truth About Technology with Rosalie de Rossi. And you have mentioned this more than once, doctor Rose, that you don't know why pastors aren't preaching about this, that people, Christians aren't talking about this more. Do you have any works or thoughts on on maybe creating something specifically for pastors to use, maybe with their congregations?

I have so many thoughts about creating many things.

I have so many thoughts about creating many things.

As rosy As do we.

As rosy As do we.

I am retired and I do teach still two classes a semester. I'm ending my 56th year, which is unbelievable. But, um, yes, I do. And I really do need to write this book. I've been talking about it for four years because I've got so much material. I am stunned by pastors. I only had heard one person do a series on it. That was Erwin Lutzer. I'm sure there are other people that have done it, but it is not being done, and it is that I see people using their cell phone during communion to text. That's blasphemous. I see people not correcting their children. I see people letting their. Do you have. I have so many students whose whose parents casualness has not monitored their fall into pornography when they were seven and eight years old. You know, they're I don't I have mothers that no longer cook meals at night or ever have a meal without the phones around, and it's almost like an orphanhood of children. The sacred space issue. No respect for this space that is now given to the Lord, in which you no call to put away the cell phone, no call to say, or just a whole message on what this has done to our relationship with the Lord and our ability to listen to a sermon. Delayed gratification. I mean, I'm a I could rant about this forever, and it sounds like that I know we're never going to get away from it. We? Our issue is not that we let it go. The issue is we have got to develop a philosophy of theology and control our lives because it is harming our inner self. It in Psalm Psalm 115 four says, but their idols are silver and gold made by human hands. They have mouths but cannot speak. Eyes but cannot see. Ears but cannot hear. Noses but cannot smell. They have hands but cannot feel. It has desensitized us. It has made us insensible. Our senses are no longer alive.

I am retired and I do teach still two classes a semester. I'm ending my 56th year, which is unbelievable. But, um, yes, I do. And I really do need to write this book. I've been talking about it for four years because I've got so much material. I am stunned by pastors. I only had heard one person do a series on it. That was Erwin Lutzer. I'm sure there are other people that have done it, but it is not being done, and it is that I see people using their cell phone during communion to text. That's blasphemous. I see people not correcting their children. I see people letting their. Do you have. I have so many students whose whose parents casualness has not monitored their fall into pornography when they were seven and eight years old. You know, they're I don't I have mothers that no longer cook meals at night or ever have a meal without the phones around, and it's almost like an orphanhood of children. The sacred space issue. No respect for this space that is now given to the Lord, in which you no call to put away the cell phone, no call to say, or just a whole message on what this has done to our relationship with the Lord and our ability to listen to a sermon. Delayed gratification. I mean, I'm a I could rant about this forever, and it sounds like that I know we're never going to get away from it. We? Our issue is not that we let it go. The issue is we have got to develop a philosophy of theology and control our lives because it is harming our inner self. It in Psalm Psalm 115 four says, but their idols are silver and gold made by human hands. They have mouths but cannot speak. Eyes but cannot see. Ears but cannot hear. Noses but cannot smell. They have hands but cannot feel. It has desensitized us. It has made us insensible. Our senses are no longer alive.

We can hear your passion in this and and and the passion. I mean, I'm feeling it, and I'm convicted. Honestly, one of the things that I know that my pastor has done is ask us to bring our actual Bibles to church, and not just to use it our phones. And that is something I have not done yet, but I'm going to do that starting this Sunday, because I'm hearing that now through some of what you're mentioning and the deadness of our souls that's emerging because of our use of technology. For everything.

We can hear your passion in this and and and the passion. I mean, I'm feeling it, and I'm convicted. Honestly, one of the things that I know that my pastor has done is ask us to bring our actual Bibles to church, and not just to use it our phones. And that is something I have not done yet, but I'm going to do that starting this Sunday, because I'm hearing that now through some of what you're mentioning and the deadness of our souls that's emerging because of our use of technology. For everything.

For everything. It's not running. We're not running it. It's running us. One of the problems with the evangelical world that happened with TV, since I can remember practically back to, you know, prehistoric ages, is that I always joke I dated Dwight L Moody, and then when people say, really, I get mad.

For everything. It's not running. We're not running it. It's running us. One of the problems with the evangelical world that happened with TV, since I can remember practically back to, you know, prehistoric ages, is that I always joke I dated Dwight L Moody, and then when people say, really, I get mad.

Yeah, because he actually dated your friend, right, Rosie?

Yeah, because he actually dated your friend, right, Rosie?

But anyway, it you know, I. Why? What is going on that that we have so little sensitivity to the essential spiritual lives of our I'm not a mother, but our children. I care about my students. What is it that has made us join? We push off things for a long, long time with a kind of legalism, and then we all of a sudden drop all the cautions and absorb it completely and become exactly like the world we do.

But anyway, it you know, I. Why? What is going on that that we have so little sensitivity to the essential spiritual lives of our I'm not a mother, but our children. I care about my students. What is it that has made us join? We push off things for a long, long time with a kind of legalism, and then we all of a sudden drop all the cautions and absorb it completely and become exactly like the world we do.

Just that. We get so uptight about everything, and then all of a sudden all of the barriers come down and in like a flood, it's almost like a tsunami, right where the waters are withdrawn. And then all of a sudden, boom, they come in, the destruction comes and we don't know what to do with it at that point.

Just that. We get so uptight about everything, and then all of a sudden all of the barriers come down and in like a flood, it's almost like a tsunami, right where the waters are withdrawn. And then all of a sudden, boom, they come in, the destruction comes and we don't know what to do with it at that point.

That's right. We look at we look exactly like the world. There is almost no difference. Even I know that. I mean, my, my students talk about the quote. I mean, I have hundreds, like I told you, 300 pages of quotes of students talking about what what the issues are and what they feel and they feel. They feel. Absolutely. They say it's a it's a fidget toy. It's a phantom limb, a toxin I willingly ingested. I realized I no longer had a choice to choose differently. I have been attached to a pocket sized ball and chain.

That's right. We look at we look exactly like the world. There is almost no difference. Even I know that. I mean, my, my students talk about the quote. I mean, I have hundreds, like I told you, 300 pages of quotes of students talking about what what the issues are and what they feel and they feel. They feel. Absolutely. They say it's a it's a fidget toy. It's a phantom limb, a toxin I willingly ingested. I realized I no longer had a choice to choose differently. I have been attached to a pocket sized ball and chain.

And it goes on from there.

And it goes on from there.

Yeah, these quotes are just amazing that you've assembled, and we would love for you to to truly write this book. It is. This is the time. This is the season for it. I know you've talked about it for a while, but this is the season.

Yeah, these quotes are just amazing that you've assembled, and we would love for you to to truly write this book. It is. This is the time. This is the season for it. I know you've talked about it for a while, but this is the season.

Long time. Yeah.

Long time. Yeah.

Let me can I transition just a little bit with you because you're going to be talking about this passionately as one of the workshop leaders of the Called conference. Tell us a little bit about the called conference that's coming up on Saturday.

Let me can I transition just a little bit with you because you're going to be talking about this passionately as one of the workshop leaders of the Called conference. Tell us a little bit about the called conference that's coming up on Saturday.

Yeah. Well, it's basically a women's conference with the purpose of equipping women in ministry leadership. And of course, it's at Moody. And there's an online option also, and it has 18 different workshops with very strong keynote speakers. I don't have the names right in front of me about that. They're not names that are familiar to me, but they would be to most people. And then today, tomorrow there's a pre-conference training intensive on sexuality with Julie Slattery, who I who is an expert on the subject and I hear great things about. And you can register for both of them at Moody conference.com.

Yeah. Well, it's basically a women's conference with the purpose of equipping women in ministry leadership. And of course, it's at Moody. And there's an online option also, and it has 18 different workshops with very strong keynote speakers. I don't have the names right in front of me about that. They're not names that are familiar to me, but they would be to most people. And then today, tomorrow there's a pre-conference training intensive on sexuality with Julie Slattery, who I who is an expert on the subject and I hear great things about. And you can register for both of them at Moody conference.com.

Okay. Thank you so much. So go to go to Moody conferences.com. Go to Moody radio.org/chattanooga. If you're more familiar with that you can get there from that you can register for this workshop. And the others. There's many to choose from. And once you register, I believe you have access to the workshops for a certain amount of time. So even if you can't get them all in that day, you'll have some time.

Okay. Thank you so much. So go to go to Moody conferences.com. Go to Moody radio.org/chattanooga. If you're more familiar with that you can get there from that you can register for this workshop. And the others. There's many to choose from. And once you register, I believe you have access to the workshops for a certain amount of time. So even if you can't get them all in that day, you'll have some time.

And doctor DeRose, let me ask you this. As we're wrapping up our time with you, people are realizing right now how addicted they are to this tool that they felt that they controlled. And you talked about a fast. How do you actually begin it? And what are the first steps to really start this process, to loosen the grip that this technology has on our lives?

And doctor DeRose, let me ask you this. As we're wrapping up our time with you, people are realizing right now how addicted they are to this tool that they felt that they controlled. And you talked about a fast. How do you actually begin it? And what are the first steps to really start this process, to loosen the grip that this technology has on our lives?

I would suggest that if you don't think you can go longer than that, take a 24 hour period, put it away. except for the absolute necessity of, I understand, checking in or something to do with work, and then begin to study your responses and you will know a lot very quickly. Then, if you can, I would say everybody needs to do a day's fast once a month to remind them just how buried they are, and then don't do anything. Don't listen to music, don't don't do technology of any kind unless you absolutely have to and begin to go outside. You're going to be very nervous at first. Smell the breezes, look at the sky, go down the street without it. You know, I always say to somebody, we we think that the phone is God, that it keeps us safe. I live in, I live in pretty much a hard area of the city, and I don't carry my phone when I walk. You've got to die of something. And if it's your time, it's your time.

I would suggest that if you don't think you can go longer than that, take a 24 hour period, put it away. except for the absolute necessity of, I understand, checking in or something to do with work, and then begin to study your responses and you will know a lot very quickly. Then, if you can, I would say everybody needs to do a day's fast once a month to remind them just how buried they are, and then don't do anything. Don't listen to music, don't don't do technology of any kind unless you absolutely have to and begin to go outside. You're going to be very nervous at first. Smell the breezes, look at the sky, go down the street without it. You know, I always say to somebody, we we think that the phone is God, that it keeps us safe. I live in, I live in pretty much a hard area of the city, and I don't carry my phone when I walk. You've got to die of something. And if it's your time, it's your time.

Wow. That's true.

Wow. That's true.

Sounds funny. The phone is not going to keep me safe. If God wants me, he wants me. If it's over, it's over. We we depend on it for everything. We don't even need God anymore. Our children, we hover over them like they're. We're keeping them safe. Check in, check in. We don't even let them grow up and trust God on their own.

Sounds funny. The phone is not going to keep me safe. If God wants me, he wants me. If it's over, it's over. We we depend on it for everything. We don't even need God anymore. Our children, we hover over them like they're. We're keeping them safe. Check in, check in. We don't even let them grow up and trust God on their own.