Kelly, have you enough room in your library to house a copy of every book that Doctor Gary Chapman has ever contributed to us?

Kelly, have you enough room in your library to house a copy of every book that Doctor Gary Chapman has ever contributed to us?

Well, if I don't, then I would build onto the house because it's worth it.

Well, if I don't, then I would build onto the house because it's worth it.

Well, let me tell you something. You no longer need to build on to that. We've just saved you a tremendous amount of money in your building budget, because Moody Publishers has done what I would think is an impossible feat, and that is to take all of these great bits of wisdom from Doctor Gary Chapman over the years, throughout his career, and actually edited and condensed them down into a very usable. What I'm going to call a handbook. What Moody Publishers calls the simple guide for a better marriage. But this thing is a war plan is what you need. Because we know that inside of a marriage. Well, there's a lot of warring that takes place between the enemy and the couple and often between the couple. And I'm a man with 23 years of those married years. And I know that it can be a battle, but this really, truly is an exceptional resource. And we are very, very glad that we have Doctor Gary Chapman to join us here and chat about it this morning.

Well, let me tell you something. You no longer need to build on to that. We've just saved you a tremendous amount of money in your building budget, because Moody Publishers has done what I would think is an impossible feat, and that is to take all of these great bits of wisdom from Doctor Gary Chapman over the years, throughout his career, and actually edited and condensed them down into a very usable. What I'm going to call a handbook. What Moody Publishers calls the simple guide for a better marriage. But this thing is a war plan is what you need. Because we know that inside of a marriage. Well, there's a lot of warring that takes place between the enemy and the couple and often between the couple. And I'm a man with 23 years of those married years. And I know that it can be a battle, but this really, truly is an exceptional resource. And we are very, very glad that we have Doctor Gary Chapman to join us here and chat about it this morning.

Hey Doctor Chapman, good morning.

Hey Doctor Chapman, good morning.

Well good morning Kelly. Steve, good to be with you guys.

Well good morning Kelly. Steve, good to be with you guys.

Well we're very, very grateful for the time this morning. And, uh, when this came across our, our we, we get our pre-releases. And so we've had these in our hands for several weeks, uh, before the, the title had been released. And what a great treasure trove of knowledge and wisdom. Tell us how this whole project even came about. Doctor Chapman.

Well we're very, very grateful for the time this morning. And, uh, when this came across our, our we, we get our pre-releases. And so we've had these in our hands for several weeks, uh, before the, the title had been released. And what a great treasure trove of knowledge and wisdom. Tell us how this whole project even came about. Doctor Chapman.

Well, you know, a number of years ago, I wrote a magazine article every month for, I don't know, six years or so with just little short, you know, articles on various topics. And of course, when they published that, they belonged to me, you know. So I started reading them again a year or so ago. I thought, man, this is good stuff, you know? So I said to John Hinckley, who works for Moody Publishers, I said, John, how about reading some of these things? See what you think about. Let's put them in a book. They're simple. They're short chapters. They deal with a whole lot of topics on marriage. And I said, you read them. Pick out the ones you think are really, really, really, really good. Put them in categories and at the end write some ideas on how they can actually do something in response to this. Turned out really, really great. I'm excited about it because I found today people like short chapters if they're going to read a book. they want and they want it to be practical. And that's true of every chapter. They're short and they're practical. So yeah, I think it's going to help a lot of couples.

Well, you know, a number of years ago, I wrote a magazine article every month for, I don't know, six years or so with just little short, you know, articles on various topics. And of course, when they published that, they belonged to me, you know. So I started reading them again a year or so ago. I thought, man, this is good stuff, you know? So I said to John Hinckley, who works for Moody Publishers, I said, John, how about reading some of these things? See what you think about. Let's put them in a book. They're simple. They're short chapters. They deal with a whole lot of topics on marriage. And I said, you read them. Pick out the ones you think are really, really, really, really good. Put them in categories and at the end write some ideas on how they can actually do something in response to this. Turned out really, really great. I'm excited about it because I found today people like short chapters if they're going to read a book. they want and they want it to be practical. And that's true of every chapter. They're short and they're practical. So yeah, I think it's going to help a lot of couples.

You know, I've got I'm holding your book in my hand right now, Doctor Chapman, and I'm smiling because I see that right there, right there at the beginning of chapter one. Um, I and I'm going to read this, this opening line. And the reason I'm smiling is because I had the exact sort of same thought that, that you write about, and I'm sure that there are so many other people that when they got married or thought about getting married, maybe they were they were waiting and dreaming about what marriage would be like. They had the same thought. Before I got married, I dreamed about how happy I would be when Carolyn and I were at last enjoying life together as husband and wife, I had visions of all the wonderful things my wife would do for me. Well, how did that work out for you? Right there at the beginning, Doctor Chapman. Oh, boy. How'd you work through that? I can tell you how.

You know, I've got I'm holding your book in my hand right now, Doctor Chapman, and I'm smiling because I see that right there, right there at the beginning of chapter one. Um, I and I'm going to read this, this opening line. And the reason I'm smiling is because I had the exact sort of same thought that, that you write about, and I'm sure that there are so many other people that when they got married or thought about getting married, maybe they were they were waiting and dreaming about what marriage would be like. They had the same thought. Before I got married, I dreamed about how happy I would be when Carolyn and I were at last enjoying life together as husband and wife, I had visions of all the wonderful things my wife would do for me. Well, how did that work out for you? Right there at the beginning, Doctor Chapman. Oh, boy. How'd you work through that? I can tell you how.

I did lots of struggles, which we did not anticipate. Because when you're in love, you don't think you're going to have a lot of problems. I mean, you know, life is just wonderful. But what I didn't know is that euphoric state that we call falling in love has an average life span of two years. We come down off the high, and my wife and I had dated two years before we got married. I came down pretty soon after the honeymoon. You know, wait a minute here. What's going on? But I think, you know, God used our struggles. I probably never would have had empathy for people who are struggling if we had not gone through struggles. And I think that's part of what God used to push me into the ministry I've had through the years of just trying to help couples, you know, find answers and how to solve conflicts without arguing, you know, no need to argue. If you're going to win, you win the argument they lost. No fun to live with a loser. Why would we create one?

I did lots of struggles, which we did not anticipate. Because when you're in love, you don't think you're going to have a lot of problems. I mean, you know, life is just wonderful. But what I didn't know is that euphoric state that we call falling in love has an average life span of two years. We come down off the high, and my wife and I had dated two years before we got married. I came down pretty soon after the honeymoon. You know, wait a minute here. What's going on? But I think, you know, God used our struggles. I probably never would have had empathy for people who are struggling if we had not gone through struggles. And I think that's part of what God used to push me into the ministry I've had through the years of just trying to help couples, you know, find answers and how to solve conflicts without arguing, you know, no need to argue. If you're going to win, you win the argument they lost. No fun to live with a loser. Why would we create one?

Ooh.

Ooh.

That goes good.

That goes good.

That is a bumper sticker if I've ever heard one right there. It's no fun to live with a loser. Why would we create one? I love it, you know, you start the book off with an explanation that the marriage Foundation is truly a contract and covenant. And what we know is that, yes, marriage is a covenant relationship where the most important relationship is not between the husband and the wife, but it is between the husband and Christ and the wife and Christ. Because if we are motivated by being pleasing to God, then we aren't going to put those expectations on to our spouse to be that everything. Like you had said in that very opening line, I thought, hey, this is going to be great. She's going to make me happy. All of this stuff is going to be wonderful, and you put that onto someone. And the fact is, our spouses were never created to meet all of our needs. Talk to us a little bit about that. The contrast of why, in our human frailty, we put that on our spouse. But yet in God, in his grace, he has designed it, that Christ is the most important person for us.

That is a bumper sticker if I've ever heard one right there. It's no fun to live with a loser. Why would we create one? I love it, you know, you start the book off with an explanation that the marriage Foundation is truly a contract and covenant. And what we know is that, yes, marriage is a covenant relationship where the most important relationship is not between the husband and the wife, but it is between the husband and Christ and the wife and Christ. Because if we are motivated by being pleasing to God, then we aren't going to put those expectations on to our spouse to be that everything. Like you had said in that very opening line, I thought, hey, this is going to be great. She's going to make me happy. All of this stuff is going to be wonderful, and you put that onto someone. And the fact is, our spouses were never created to meet all of our needs. Talk to us a little bit about that. The contrast of why, in our human frailty, we put that on our spouse. But yet in God, in his grace, he has designed it, that Christ is the most important person for us.

Yeah. You know, if we don't have a relationship with Christ, then we're likely not going to be a good husband or a good wife because Christ is the model and his his lifestyle. Peter said about Jesus, he went about doing good. You know, and also let this attitude be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus, who though he was God, he didn't demand his rights. He stepped down, humbled himself, got on a level ground with us, and then stepped down further to death on a cross. So that's to be our attitude. And that's really what turned our marriage around. When God changed my heart and called me and said, you know, you're not you don't have the attitude of Christ toward your wife because, you know, I was telling her, if you just listen to me, we can have a good marriage, you know? And she wouldn't listen to me. And I blamed her. But when I really got that straight and asked God to give me the attitude of Christ toward her, then I started asking her three simple questions. Honey, what can I do to help you? Second, how can I? How can I make your life easier? And third, how can I be a better husband? And she was willing to give me answers, you know. So rather than demanding and expecting, we're called upon to reach out to the other person. We're to represent, you know, the attitude of Christ toward them. You get two people doing that, and you're going to have a great marriage.

Yeah. You know, if we don't have a relationship with Christ, then we're likely not going to be a good husband or a good wife because Christ is the model and his his lifestyle. Peter said about Jesus, he went about doing good. You know, and also let this attitude be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus, who though he was God, he didn't demand his rights. He stepped down, humbled himself, got on a level ground with us, and then stepped down further to death on a cross. So that's to be our attitude. And that's really what turned our marriage around. When God changed my heart and called me and said, you know, you're not you don't have the attitude of Christ toward your wife because, you know, I was telling her, if you just listen to me, we can have a good marriage, you know? And she wouldn't listen to me. And I blamed her. But when I really got that straight and asked God to give me the attitude of Christ toward her, then I started asking her three simple questions. Honey, what can I do to help you? Second, how can I? How can I make your life easier? And third, how can I be a better husband? And she was willing to give me answers, you know. So rather than demanding and expecting, we're called upon to reach out to the other person. We're to represent, you know, the attitude of Christ toward them. You get two people doing that, and you're going to have a great marriage.

Yeah, marriage does take a lot of intentionality. And it's not all love and roses and, and, you know, just coming up flowers and sunshine and all of that all of the time. It's it's that's just not a realistic view of it. And I know Doctor Chapman is we're rolling into spring and then summer. Maybe there are folks listening right now who've got wedding plans on the books and, um, I don't know, you know, what their, their current situation is like. I don't know if they've sought out counsel ahead of marriage or not or what, but, um, to help them avoid ever coming into a counselor's office and and telling that counselor on down the road to to five years from now, I don't want to be married anymore. What advice would you have for them at this point, heading into marriage for laying that foundation for marriage?

Yeah, marriage does take a lot of intentionality. And it's not all love and roses and, and, you know, just coming up flowers and sunshine and all of that all of the time. It's it's that's just not a realistic view of it. And I know Doctor Chapman is we're rolling into spring and then summer. Maybe there are folks listening right now who've got wedding plans on the books and, um, I don't know, you know, what their, their current situation is like. I don't know if they've sought out counsel ahead of marriage or not or what, but, um, to help them avoid ever coming into a counselor's office and and telling that counselor on down the road to to five years from now, I don't want to be married anymore. What advice would you have for them at this point, heading into marriage for laying that foundation for marriage?

I'd say learn everything you can about marriage before you get married. We did not I didn't even I don't know if they had books back then on marriage, but I never saw one. But this book would be great for a couple just getting married because it's got 31 short chapters on 31 different topics related to almost every aspect of marriage. So sit down before you get married. Each of you read the chapter and say, ooh, that's interesting. Did you know that, uh, how do you think we can handle that? What do you feel about that? You know, just working through that. And then when you get married, you've got these things in the background at least. So when things do happen, you say, oh, yeah. Remember what we read about that. Learn everything you can. I wrote another book actually called things I Wish I'd Known Before We Got Married. You know, 12 things I know now. I wish I'd known then. Uh, but you put that book in this book. A simple guide for a better marriage together, and you're going to have some good premarital counseling.

I'd say learn everything you can about marriage before you get married. We did not I didn't even I don't know if they had books back then on marriage, but I never saw one. But this book would be great for a couple just getting married because it's got 31 short chapters on 31 different topics related to almost every aspect of marriage. So sit down before you get married. Each of you read the chapter and say, ooh, that's interesting. Did you know that, uh, how do you think we can handle that? What do you feel about that? You know, just working through that. And then when you get married, you've got these things in the background at least. So when things do happen, you say, oh, yeah. Remember what we read about that. Learn everything you can. I wrote another book actually called things I Wish I'd Known Before We Got Married. You know, 12 things I know now. I wish I'd known then. Uh, but you put that book in this book. A simple guide for a better marriage together, and you're going to have some good premarital counseling.

Well, one of the things that you do point to that is necessary for a relationship, really, of any kind, but certainly in marriage is the fact of loving unconditionally. So whether that's toward our children, toward our spouse, toward our parents or siblings, there is still that uniqueness in a marital relationship about loving unconditionally. And Scripture says a lot about this in terms of forbearance, because that is really, really important. And we look to Ephesians four and it says, you know, that we, with all humility and gentleness, with patience, bearing with one another in love. That's a general statement to all. But for our marital relationship, long suffering, forbearance, mercy, grace, compassion. These are all key words that are really verbs that we have got to actually be intentional about giving to the other person. Why is that so important?

Well, one of the things that you do point to that is necessary for a relationship, really, of any kind, but certainly in marriage is the fact of loving unconditionally. So whether that's toward our children, toward our spouse, toward our parents or siblings, there is still that uniqueness in a marital relationship about loving unconditionally. And Scripture says a lot about this in terms of forbearance, because that is really, really important. And we look to Ephesians four and it says, you know, that we, with all humility and gentleness, with patience, bearing with one another in love. That's a general statement to all. But for our marital relationship, long suffering, forbearance, mercy, grace, compassion. These are all key words that are really verbs that we have got to actually be intentional about giving to the other person. Why is that so important?

Well, I think, you know, Jesus said, A new commandment I give to you that you love one another. And here's the new part. As I have loved you. He loved us when we were dirty, rotten sinners. So if your spouse is not loving you and not treating you well, we follow the example of Christ and we love our spouse even when they're unlovely. And you'll have to have God's help to do that, because that's not natural. What's natural is to love people who love you. But if your spouse is not loving you, at least you don't feel loved by them. You say to God, Lord, you know what's happening here. And you know how I feel about them right now, but I know you love them. And so I'm opening my heart. And Romans chapter five and verse five says, the love of God is poured into our hearts by the Holy Spirit. So, Lord, I want to be your agent for loving my husband, loving my wife, even if they're not very lovely. And God can give you the power to do that. And nothing is more powerful in having a positive influence on your spouse than loving them in meaningful ways, even when they're not expressing love to you. Love stimulates love. You know, most of the time we're criticizing them and that's that's having a negative influence on them. But you love them in spite of the way they might be treating you. You're going to have a positive influence. You know, we've always said you can't change your spouse. And that's true. We can't change them, but we can influence them. And loving them when they're unlovely is the most powerful influence you can have on them.

Well, I think, you know, Jesus said, A new commandment I give to you that you love one another. And here's the new part. As I have loved you. He loved us when we were dirty, rotten sinners. So if your spouse is not loving you and not treating you well, we follow the example of Christ and we love our spouse even when they're unlovely. And you'll have to have God's help to do that, because that's not natural. What's natural is to love people who love you. But if your spouse is not loving you, at least you don't feel loved by them. You say to God, Lord, you know what's happening here. And you know how I feel about them right now, but I know you love them. And so I'm opening my heart. And Romans chapter five and verse five says, the love of God is poured into our hearts by the Holy Spirit. So, Lord, I want to be your agent for loving my husband, loving my wife, even if they're not very lovely. And God can give you the power to do that. And nothing is more powerful in having a positive influence on your spouse than loving them in meaningful ways, even when they're not expressing love to you. Love stimulates love. You know, most of the time we're criticizing them and that's that's having a negative influence on them. But you love them in spite of the way they might be treating you. You're going to have a positive influence. You know, we've always said you can't change your spouse. And that's true. We can't change them, but we can influence them. And loving them when they're unlovely is the most powerful influence you can have on them.

Well, Doctor Chapman, let's talk about the power of patience along with that, because it seems too often, and I know this happened in my marriage. You know, you we can think that, okay, we've got a situation here, but I'm going to make up my mind to love my spouse, even though he's being unlovely right now. I'm going to love him anyway. Okay, I loved him even though he was unlovely today. And hopefully he's going to be lovely tomorrow. Well, tomorrow rolls around and we're back at arguing again where it could have been. Patient. Patience is often a an intentional thing and we've got to learn patience. But could you share a little bit more about what that's going to look like over the long term in marriage. Because that's more of a marathon kind of a thing sometimes. And we we lose patience pretty quickly.

Well, Doctor Chapman, let's talk about the power of patience along with that, because it seems too often, and I know this happened in my marriage. You know, you we can think that, okay, we've got a situation here, but I'm going to make up my mind to love my spouse, even though he's being unlovely right now. I'm going to love him anyway. Okay, I loved him even though he was unlovely today. And hopefully he's going to be lovely tomorrow. Well, tomorrow rolls around and we're back at arguing again where it could have been. Patient. Patience is often a an intentional thing and we've got to learn patience. But could you share a little bit more about what that's going to look like over the long term in marriage. Because that's more of a marathon kind of a thing sometimes. And we we lose patience pretty quickly.

Yeah. You have sometimes said to people who hurt their spouse would not come for counseling, their spouse would not read a book on marriage. And, you know, just express no interest in the relationship. I won't even talk about our relationship. I said, don't, don't learn, don't speak their love language for three weeks and expect them to turn around. I call it a six month experiment. What if you express love intentionally in a way that's meaningful to your spouse at least once a week for six months and see what happens? I have seen again and again and again before that six months is over. The other spouse begins to warm up, and before the six months is over, they're reaching out and reciprocating love. And so again, it's a powerful influence, but we're not doing it to manipulate them. We're doing it because God commanded us to love people who are unlovely, and we're just God's agent in ministering to them. But what happens is we're so desperately in need of love. All of us. We. It's one of our deepest emotional needs. We do tend to reciprocate when somebody loves us, when we know we don't deserve their love. So it's it's powerful.

Yeah. You have sometimes said to people who hurt their spouse would not come for counseling, their spouse would not read a book on marriage. And, you know, just express no interest in the relationship. I won't even talk about our relationship. I said, don't, don't learn, don't speak their love language for three weeks and expect them to turn around. I call it a six month experiment. What if you express love intentionally in a way that's meaningful to your spouse at least once a week for six months and see what happens? I have seen again and again and again before that six months is over. The other spouse begins to warm up, and before the six months is over, they're reaching out and reciprocating love. And so again, it's a powerful influence, but we're not doing it to manipulate them. We're doing it because God commanded us to love people who are unlovely, and we're just God's agent in ministering to them. But what happens is we're so desperately in need of love. All of us. We. It's one of our deepest emotional needs. We do tend to reciprocate when somebody loves us, when we know we don't deserve their love. So it's it's powerful.

Well, Doctor Chapman, one of the things that you really focus on in the book is about negative emotions. That's one of the most important things that I think that you have in the emotion, anger and conflict management section of the book is what do you do when you have those negative Emotions toward your spouse because we all have sort of this almost a, a built in default that when we have hurts and hurts build up in us, there's this protective measure that we take, which is to sort of withdraw, to stay away from that which is unsafe. But that can lead to disconnection in a relationship. And that's a hard road to go back. And you just outlined that idea of those six, six months, as you said, a six month experiment, but that long term anger that somebody might have. How would how would you help them sort of reframe their perspective on their spouse, even though they're dealing with that long term hurt and even that anger toward them?

Well, Doctor Chapman, one of the things that you really focus on in the book is about negative emotions. That's one of the most important things that I think that you have in the emotion, anger and conflict management section of the book is what do you do when you have those negative Emotions toward your spouse because we all have sort of this almost a, a built in default that when we have hurts and hurts build up in us, there's this protective measure that we take, which is to sort of withdraw, to stay away from that which is unsafe. But that can lead to disconnection in a relationship. And that's a hard road to go back. And you just outlined that idea of those six, six months, as you said, a six month experiment, but that long term anger that somebody might have. How would how would you help them sort of reframe their perspective on their spouse, even though they're dealing with that long term hurt and even that anger toward them?

Yeah. And I think the negative feelings that we have, and I remember when I had negative feelings toward her, you know, uh, we don't we don't deny our feelings. We just say to God, Lord, you know how I'm feeling and it's not positive. And you know how I feel hurt and I feel rejected, or I feel neglected or whatever else you're feeling or angry, you know? Uh, but, Lord, I want to be a positive influence in this relationship. So I'm asking you to give me wisdom on how to do that. And one way to do that, of course, is speaking their primary love language. Another way is to seek to affirm them in things that you can affirm. I did have a lady tell me one day, she said, Doug, chairman, I can't think of anything positive to say about my husband. I said, well, does he ever take a shower? She said, well, yes. I said, well, if I were you, I'd start there. You know, honey, I appreciate you taking a shower. I said, there are men who don't. But you look for there's always something that you can be positive about. But by nature, if we just do what comes natural with negative feelings. We're going to have negative comments and negative behavior and we make things worse. But with positive comments, affirmations of positive things about them and reaching out to love them in a way that's meaningful to them, we're going to have a positive influence on them. It's amazing what can happen. You know, people have asked me, can one person change a marriage? Well, one person can't create a healthy marriage, but one person can improve a marriage because they change their own attitude and start behaving in a positive way rather than a negative way. Then they're going to be a positive influence, and they're going to feel better about themselves, because nobody ultimately feels good about criticizing their spouse and yelling at their spouse and spouting spouting off all kind of negative things. You don't walk away feeling good about that. For a moment. You feel like, well, I got that off my chest, you know? Yeah, but now you've made things worse. So, you know, God can help us apply the things that we talk about in this book. And all of them are very, very practical.

Yeah. And I think the negative feelings that we have, and I remember when I had negative feelings toward her, you know, uh, we don't we don't deny our feelings. We just say to God, Lord, you know how I'm feeling and it's not positive. And you know how I feel hurt and I feel rejected, or I feel neglected or whatever else you're feeling or angry, you know? Uh, but, Lord, I want to be a positive influence in this relationship. So I'm asking you to give me wisdom on how to do that. And one way to do that, of course, is speaking their primary love language. Another way is to seek to affirm them in things that you can affirm. I did have a lady tell me one day, she said, Doug, chairman, I can't think of anything positive to say about my husband. I said, well, does he ever take a shower? She said, well, yes. I said, well, if I were you, I'd start there. You know, honey, I appreciate you taking a shower. I said, there are men who don't. But you look for there's always something that you can be positive about. But by nature, if we just do what comes natural with negative feelings. We're going to have negative comments and negative behavior and we make things worse. But with positive comments, affirmations of positive things about them and reaching out to love them in a way that's meaningful to them, we're going to have a positive influence on them. It's amazing what can happen. You know, people have asked me, can one person change a marriage? Well, one person can't create a healthy marriage, but one person can improve a marriage because they change their own attitude and start behaving in a positive way rather than a negative way. Then they're going to be a positive influence, and they're going to feel better about themselves, because nobody ultimately feels good about criticizing their spouse and yelling at their spouse and spouting spouting off all kind of negative things. You don't walk away feeling good about that. For a moment. You feel like, well, I got that off my chest, you know? Yeah, but now you've made things worse. So, you know, God can help us apply the things that we talk about in this book. And all of them are very, very practical.

Well, that that key is that the individual needs to go to the Lord, which reinforces the fact that the most important relationship in the marriage is the individual and their relationship with Christ, because we simply just cannot do marriage apart from that successfully. It's true.

Well, that that key is that the individual needs to go to the Lord, which reinforces the fact that the most important relationship in the marriage is the individual and their relationship with Christ, because we simply just cannot do marriage apart from that successfully. It's true.

Yeah. No, you're exactly right. That's why our relationship with God affects every relationship we have. But once we have a positive relationship with God and know that he's forgiven us of our failures because none of us are perfect, and we allow His spirit to control our lives every day. Lord, sit on the throne of my life. Give me wisdom in what I do, wisdom in what I say. We're going to have a positive influence in the world, not only in our marriage, but also in the lives of everybody that we encounter. And we choose. We choose to have that attitude, and we ask God to continue to pour his love into us so we can be his agents for loving our spouse as well as other people that we encounter.

Yeah. No, you're exactly right. That's why our relationship with God affects every relationship we have. But once we have a positive relationship with God and know that he's forgiven us of our failures because none of us are perfect, and we allow His spirit to control our lives every day. Lord, sit on the throne of my life. Give me wisdom in what I do, wisdom in what I say. We're going to have a positive influence in the world, not only in our marriage, but also in the lives of everybody that we encounter. And we choose. We choose to have that attitude, and we ask God to continue to pour his love into us so we can be his agents for loving our spouse as well as other people that we encounter.

Hey, Doctor Chapman, before we run out of time here, I do want to know if we could just touch briefly on, um, the other people that can come into the marriage and either bless it or create problems if we're not careful in our relationship with those people who are sort of on the outside of the marriage, but still a part of that marriage, and I'm talking about the in-laws. How can we create healthy relationships with our in-laws? Because sometimes if we're not careful with our relationships with our in-laws, when there are issues in the marriage, the in-laws can end up taking sides. That just turns into a big hornet's nest. And we don't want that either.

Hey, Doctor Chapman, before we run out of time here, I do want to know if we could just touch briefly on, um, the other people that can come into the marriage and either bless it or create problems if we're not careful in our relationship with those people who are sort of on the outside of the marriage, but still a part of that marriage, and I'm talking about the in-laws. How can we create healthy relationships with our in-laws? Because sometimes if we're not careful with our relationships with our in-laws, when there are issues in the marriage, the in-laws can end up taking sides. That just turns into a big hornet's nest. And we don't want that either.

No. Absolutely right. I have several ideas in that chapter on, uh, dealing with in-laws. One is to recognize that, uh, we can't control our in-laws, but we should try to have a positive experience with them if they choose to speak to us and give us advice when we're not asking for advice which they should not be doing anyway. But if they do, just say, well, I think I appreciate you sharing that. I'll give some thought to that. You know, rather than arguing with them and say, well, you don't understand. And then later on you can actually say, you know, uh, can I just share with you one thing we like to be with y'all. But before you come, could you just call us and let us know? Because sometimes you show up and we're in the middle of something, and it just kind of creates a lot of anxiety. So if you just give us a ring before you come over, that would be super, super helpful. And they might be a little upset at that moment, but they'll go home and think about, you know, you know, they're right. We need to give them a ring. Just say, hey, would this be a good time to stop by and see you? So, you know, that's just one one little aspect. But I think we do have to treat them with respect and do everything we can to to hear them when they're saying something to us. Listening to people who are talking, I don't care what they're saying. Even if they're angry, listening to them, letting them express it, asking questions about clarifying what they're saying that's a positive step in the right direction, rather than arguing back and telling them you're wrong and da da da. And now and then you both walk away thinking, oh man, we're never going to get along with each other. We can get along if we're willing. First of all, to listen to the other person and try to understand what they're saying and what they're feeling.

No. Absolutely right. I have several ideas in that chapter on, uh, dealing with in-laws. One is to recognize that, uh, we can't control our in-laws, but we should try to have a positive experience with them if they choose to speak to us and give us advice when we're not asking for advice which they should not be doing anyway. But if they do, just say, well, I think I appreciate you sharing that. I'll give some thought to that. You know, rather than arguing with them and say, well, you don't understand. And then later on you can actually say, you know, uh, can I just share with you one thing we like to be with y'all. But before you come, could you just call us and let us know? Because sometimes you show up and we're in the middle of something, and it just kind of creates a lot of anxiety. So if you just give us a ring before you come over, that would be super, super helpful. And they might be a little upset at that moment, but they'll go home and think about, you know, you know, they're right. We need to give them a ring. Just say, hey, would this be a good time to stop by and see you? So, you know, that's just one one little aspect. But I think we do have to treat them with respect and do everything we can to to hear them when they're saying something to us. Listening to people who are talking, I don't care what they're saying. Even if they're angry, listening to them, letting them express it, asking questions about clarifying what they're saying that's a positive step in the right direction, rather than arguing back and telling them you're wrong and da da da. And now and then you both walk away thinking, oh man, we're never going to get along with each other. We can get along if we're willing. First of all, to listen to the other person and try to understand what they're saying and what they're feeling.

So often, though, we we allow our emotion to hijack the situation. Um, what about technique then? If someone's in that situation where we can't really listen because we're more concerned about the hurt that they've caused to us, what are some of the things that you would say to somebody? Practical things, as far as here's what you need to do in that situation. What would you say to them?

So often, though, we we allow our emotion to hijack the situation. Um, what about technique then? If someone's in that situation where we can't really listen because we're more concerned about the hurt that they've caused to us, what are some of the things that you would say to somebody? Practical things, as far as here's what you need to do in that situation. What would you say to them?

I think if you can say to yourself, this person is made in the image of God, and I don't know where they are in their relationship with God, but I know that I have a relationship with God, and I want to treat them the way God would treat them. You begin thinking that way because God listens to us. I don't care what you have to say to God. You can express your anger to God and whatever emotion you have and God is going to, he's he's happy to hear what he already knows it, but he's happy to hear it. And so, Lord, help me to be a listener. We're not by nature listeners. Huge thing. Help me to be a listener. Lord, give me your big ears to hear what they're saying, to try to understand them and affirm whatever I can. Well, I can now see. I can see how you'd feel that way now. It never crossed my mind, but I can see how you'd feel that way now. Now you're not enemies. You know you've listened long enough to understand where they're coming from. And if you try to put yourself in their shoes. Look at the world through their eyes. It's not. You may not agree with them, but you can see how they would come to feel that way. And you express that, and you're creating a positive influence in the relationship.

I think if you can say to yourself, this person is made in the image of God, and I don't know where they are in their relationship with God, but I know that I have a relationship with God, and I want to treat them the way God would treat them. You begin thinking that way because God listens to us. I don't care what you have to say to God. You can express your anger to God and whatever emotion you have and God is going to, he's he's happy to hear what he already knows it, but he's happy to hear it. And so, Lord, help me to be a listener. We're not by nature listeners. Huge thing. Help me to be a listener. Lord, give me your big ears to hear what they're saying, to try to understand them and affirm whatever I can. Well, I can now see. I can see how you'd feel that way now. It never crossed my mind, but I can see how you'd feel that way now. Now you're not enemies. You know you've listened long enough to understand where they're coming from. And if you try to put yourself in their shoes. Look at the world through their eyes. It's not. You may not agree with them, but you can see how they would come to feel that way. And you express that, and you're creating a positive influence in the relationship.

All right. Talking with Gary Chapman A simple guide for a better marriage. Quick practical insights. Every couple needs to thrive. And this is available through Moody Publishers. You can find it at Moody books.org. You can find it at Amazon. Doctor Chapman, thanks for making time to talk to us about this this morning. Such rich wisdom in this. And I know it's a wisdom that was earned. So this is good stuff. Thank you so much for spending time with us today.

All right. Talking with Gary Chapman A simple guide for a better marriage. Quick practical insights. Every couple needs to thrive. And this is available through Moody Publishers. You can find it at Moody books.org. You can find it at Amazon. Doctor Chapman, thanks for making time to talk to us about this this morning. Such rich wisdom in this. And I know it's a wisdom that was earned. So this is good stuff. Thank you so much for spending time with us today.

Well thank you. I enjoyed being with you guys. Keep up the good work. God bless.

Well thank you. I enjoyed being with you guys. Keep up the good work. God bless.

You're listening to mornings with Kelly and Steve on Moody Radio from the Word to Life.

You're listening to mornings with Kelly and Steve on Moody Radio from the Word to Life.