You're listening to Moody Radio 89.3 mornings with Eric and Bridget.

You're listening to Moody Radio 89.3 mornings with Eric and Bridget.

Well, the Surgeon General reported in 2023 that one of the greatest threats to our health not cancer, not heart disease, not even car crashes. It is the topic of loneliness. It's at an epidemic proportion. But how do we address that in the church and our families and our lives? We're talking about that today with Pastor Keith Case of Memorial Presbyterian Church. Pastor Keith, this is a topic that's obviously close and dear to your heart. It's you're passionate about it. Why?

Well, the Surgeon General reported in 2023 that one of the greatest threats to our health not cancer, not heart disease, not even car crashes. It is the topic of loneliness. It's at an epidemic proportion. But how do we address that in the church and our families and our lives? We're talking about that today with Pastor Keith Case of Memorial Presbyterian Church. Pastor Keith, this is a topic that's obviously close and dear to your heart. It's you're passionate about it. Why?

There's multiple reasons for it. Personal ones. But I also see this incredible opportunity, you know, for us as a church. One of the things that I reference is, you know, this isn't the first time the church has faced an epidemic. When you look back in history, you look at the black plagues, for example, in Europe that happened. And one of the things that you see there is that the church was the ones who really showed up. Christians were the ones out in the streets caring for people in the streets and, you know, bringing people into their homes, into their lives and risking their lives in many ways. And Rodney Stark, an author, sociologist, he says that this is when the church really began to grow in Europe. And so, as other things have happened throughout history, you see the church stepping up and the loneliness issue is really, really big. It's an epidemic, as you said. And I think the church has this incredible opportunity to step up and do something about it. You know, we're uniquely positioned with the good news of the gospel to do something about it.

There's multiple reasons for it. Personal ones. But I also see this incredible opportunity, you know, for us as a church. One of the things that I reference is, you know, this isn't the first time the church has faced an epidemic. When you look back in history, you look at the black plagues, for example, in Europe that happened. And one of the things that you see there is that the church was the ones who really showed up. Christians were the ones out in the streets caring for people in the streets and, you know, bringing people into their homes, into their lives and risking their lives in many ways. And Rodney Stark, an author, sociologist, he says that this is when the church really began to grow in Europe. And so, as other things have happened throughout history, you see the church stepping up and the loneliness issue is really, really big. It's an epidemic, as you said. And I think the church has this incredible opportunity to step up and do something about it. You know, we're uniquely positioned with the good news of the gospel to do something about it.

So there's always been lonely people, though. I mean, there's always a all of us at one time or another have been lonely. So what takes it from just being, you know, I just feel like I need to be around people or I, you know, I went off to college and I miss my family. What takes it from being that to an epidemic? Because that's a pretty big step, I think. Yeah.

So there's always been lonely people, though. I mean, there's always a all of us at one time or another have been lonely. So what takes it from just being, you know, I just feel like I need to be around people or I, you know, I went off to college and I miss my family. What takes it from being that to an epidemic? Because that's a pretty big step, I think. Yeah.

Huge, huge step. Um, one of the. My favorite authors right now is a guy named David Brooks, the writer for The New York Times. And Brooks is, you know, done incredible work over the course of his life. He came to faith recently. He's a pretty new believer. But one of the things that he wrote recently, and he's got a book called How to Know a Person. He says, in the 60s in this country, we lost faith in our institutions, but today we've lost faith in our neighbors. We don't we don't trust our neighbors anymore. And you know where my family lives? When we moved in there ten years ago, we didn't really know any of our neighbors. There wasn't a lot of people out on the street. And we've been very invested in our street, in our neighborhood over the last ten years. But even so, it wasn't like the neighborhood street that I grew up on as a kid. So it feels that we have as a country, as a nation, become more and more nomadic, but not as not as like they were in the Old Testament where they traveled as a people group around. We're just individually nomadic. So I don't know about for you guys, but in my hometown, Chattanooga, Tennessee, part of the path was you go to school and you try to get into a really good school for, you know, high school, and then you go off to college and you have to go to a higher level, you know, nice school. And then you'd never come back to your hometown to come back to your hometown was kind of like, um, something's wrong. Something's off. You need to be going to Atlanta, Nashville, New York, LA somewhere like that to kind of be saying, oh, I'm taking things to the next level. And I don't I don't know how common that story is for everybody. But I shared yesterday with some college students at Palm Beach Atlantic, and a lot of the kids resonated with that story. And as I share that with other people, a lot of people resonate and they say, yeah, that is it. It's really about our career. And if you think back about the story of this country, this the story of this country was one about leaving home and going out and chasing opportunity, if you will, or looking for opportunity. There's other reasons involved. But if you think about the gold rush, for example, people traveling all the way across the country for this opportunity and choosing opportunity in many ways over community, and this is one of the challenges people face today, is, oh, we've got this awesome opportunity to go and, you know, work for this company in New York, but I'm going to leave my hometown or whatever it is. And and they do oftentimes choose it because we have become such a career driven or opportunity driven country. Another way you could say that is that greed has kind of become, you know, a big issue for us. I call it like capitalism on steroids, if you will. It's just kind of everything for more money, you know.

Huge, huge step. Um, one of the. My favorite authors right now is a guy named David Brooks, the writer for The New York Times. And Brooks is, you know, done incredible work over the course of his life. He came to faith recently. He's a pretty new believer. But one of the things that he wrote recently, and he's got a book called How to Know a Person. He says, in the 60s in this country, we lost faith in our institutions, but today we've lost faith in our neighbors. We don't we don't trust our neighbors anymore. And you know where my family lives? When we moved in there ten years ago, we didn't really know any of our neighbors. There wasn't a lot of people out on the street. And we've been very invested in our street, in our neighborhood over the last ten years. But even so, it wasn't like the neighborhood street that I grew up on as a kid. So it feels that we have as a country, as a nation, become more and more nomadic, but not as not as like they were in the Old Testament where they traveled as a people group around. We're just individually nomadic. So I don't know about for you guys, but in my hometown, Chattanooga, Tennessee, part of the path was you go to school and you try to get into a really good school for, you know, high school, and then you go off to college and you have to go to a higher level, you know, nice school. And then you'd never come back to your hometown to come back to your hometown was kind of like, um, something's wrong. Something's off. You need to be going to Atlanta, Nashville, New York, LA somewhere like that to kind of be saying, oh, I'm taking things to the next level. And I don't I don't know how common that story is for everybody. But I shared yesterday with some college students at Palm Beach Atlantic, and a lot of the kids resonated with that story. And as I share that with other people, a lot of people resonate and they say, yeah, that is it. It's really about our career. And if you think back about the story of this country, this the story of this country was one about leaving home and going out and chasing opportunity, if you will, or looking for opportunity. There's other reasons involved. But if you think about the gold rush, for example, people traveling all the way across the country for this opportunity and choosing opportunity in many ways over community, and this is one of the challenges people face today, is, oh, we've got this awesome opportunity to go and, you know, work for this company in New York, but I'm going to leave my hometown or whatever it is. And and they do oftentimes choose it because we have become such a career driven or opportunity driven country. Another way you could say that is that greed has kind of become, you know, a big issue for us. I call it like capitalism on steroids, if you will. It's just kind of everything for more money, you know.

So that priority of opportunity financially, you know, superseding relationally, that's kind of one of the root causes. Oh, yes.

So that priority of opportunity financially, you know, superseding relationally, that's kind of one of the root causes. Oh, yes.

I mean, and another example of this would be we have a staff member who's from Kenya and his first day on the job with me, we went to do a house visit for a shut in couple. You know, they don't leave their house. They have help, come and care for them. And we spent about an hour with them and we left. And he said, you know, man, I have to tell you, Keith. And he was trying not to offend me, but he said this would never happen in my country. You would never go and find people living alone in their houses like I totally isolated. There's no neighbors checking on them or anything. And in my country, these people would be living in our home, they'd be being cared for in our community, our neighborhood, our village, if you will. And that's been one of his big challenges as well, just with his kids, because he's like, man, my kids were cared for by the neighborhood. I could, if I had to be at a meeting. There was like their uncle, aunt, cousins, friends, neighbors watching their soccer game and telling me about it when I got home. Where is that today? You know, you have to travel, um, to go to soccer up in, um, you know, maybe gardens. If you live downtown, your other child has to go to Boca to do ballet. Your kids go to school out west in Boynton. It's it's so split up and you don't have this contained neighborhood experience anymore. So there's there's multiple reasons for it. But the biggest issue I just want people to realize is that the loneliness they may be experiencing isn't necessarily their fault. There's systemic things that are happening in our culture that have created a challenge for them to be connected at the level that we want, and we need to be connected.

I mean, and another example of this would be we have a staff member who's from Kenya and his first day on the job with me, we went to do a house visit for a shut in couple. You know, they don't leave their house. They have help, come and care for them. And we spent about an hour with them and we left. And he said, you know, man, I have to tell you, Keith. And he was trying not to offend me, but he said this would never happen in my country. You would never go and find people living alone in their houses like I totally isolated. There's no neighbors checking on them or anything. And in my country, these people would be living in our home, they'd be being cared for in our community, our neighborhood, our village, if you will. And that's been one of his big challenges as well, just with his kids, because he's like, man, my kids were cared for by the neighborhood. I could, if I had to be at a meeting. There was like their uncle, aunt, cousins, friends, neighbors watching their soccer game and telling me about it when I got home. Where is that today? You know, you have to travel, um, to go to soccer up in, um, you know, maybe gardens. If you live downtown, your other child has to go to Boca to do ballet. Your kids go to school out west in Boynton. It's it's so split up and you don't have this contained neighborhood experience anymore. So there's there's multiple reasons for it. But the biggest issue I just want people to realize is that the loneliness they may be experiencing isn't necessarily their fault. There's systemic things that are happening in our culture that have created a challenge for them to be connected at the level that we want, and we need to be connected.

There are some solutions the church can step in. But before we go too far, one of the things about Chattanooga that I found out this week is it has the best internet in the country.

There are some solutions the church can step in. But before we go too far, one of the things about Chattanooga that I found out this week is it has the best internet in the country.

It does.

It does.

Really. Every house has fiber optics. They each have a gig, the whole deal. I mean, it's the best, fastest internet in the country. Yeah. Does that lead to loneliness? Does the internet does technology as part of this? Also part of the problem? Yeah, I.

Really. Every house has fiber optics. They each have a gig, the whole deal. I mean, it's the best, fastest internet in the country. Yeah. Does that lead to loneliness? Does the internet does technology as part of this? Also part of the problem? Yeah, I.

Think you know what what what the internet has done is to help us connect in some ways in light of the system. So as we've been spread out, you know, my my kids, for example, have, you know, some kids in our neighborhood. But when I was a kid, I had so many, you know, kids that I played with and ran around with. And you think back like movies like Goonies and things like this, you know, they're about this camaraderie. Where does that exist? There are pockets of it, right? But for those who don't have that, the internet kind of serves as some a little bit of like a scratch of that itch, but it's not actually the real thing that we need. So I wouldn't say that the internet is the problem necessarily, but it is not the solution either. It's not the real solution that we need. Um, there's a author named Parker Palmer. He's a Quaker pastor, and he has this quote that says, if you if you want to see the soul, the soul is like a wild animal. It's Resilient, but you have to go and sit quietly for a few hours to really catch a glimpse of it. Right. The type of loneliness that we're experiencing is that people's souls are not being seen. You know, we're not we're not living in in the village anymore, where you actually can have the the time to really sit with each other for hours. Right. Um, and that's the kind of work that we're invested in. It's highly inefficient. Yeah. This is not how you build a megachurch. This kind of work that we're talking about. Yeah. This is this is how you really slow down and spend time with people. It was funny because I was with my, um, the same pastor yesterday from Kenya, and he said, you know, when I, when I sit down with people in America to have coffee or whatever it is, I feel like I'm sitting down for a job interview. Mhm. And things are really fast, kind of like fast paced Paste. And he's like, I'm just kind of going, when are we just going to slow down? And like, when can I just relax? And we're going to start telling stories and we're going to start laughing. He's like, where does that happen in this culture? And I was like, man, you're so right. I mean, I remember it happening as a kid and my family sitting around a big table with my cousins and all this kind of stuff, storytelling and maybe in high school or college. But where does that happen today?

Think you know what what what the internet has done is to help us connect in some ways in light of the system. So as we've been spread out, you know, my my kids, for example, have, you know, some kids in our neighborhood. But when I was a kid, I had so many, you know, kids that I played with and ran around with. And you think back like movies like Goonies and things like this, you know, they're about this camaraderie. Where does that exist? There are pockets of it, right? But for those who don't have that, the internet kind of serves as some a little bit of like a scratch of that itch, but it's not actually the real thing that we need. So I wouldn't say that the internet is the problem necessarily, but it is not the solution either. It's not the real solution that we need. Um, there's a author named Parker Palmer. He's a Quaker pastor, and he has this quote that says, if you if you want to see the soul, the soul is like a wild animal. It's Resilient, but you have to go and sit quietly for a few hours to really catch a glimpse of it. Right. The type of loneliness that we're experiencing is that people's souls are not being seen. You know, we're not we're not living in in the village anymore, where you actually can have the the time to really sit with each other for hours. Right. Um, and that's the kind of work that we're invested in. It's highly inefficient. Yeah. This is not how you build a megachurch. This kind of work that we're talking about. Yeah. This is this is how you really slow down and spend time with people. It was funny because I was with my, um, the same pastor yesterday from Kenya, and he said, you know, when I, when I sit down with people in America to have coffee or whatever it is, I feel like I'm sitting down for a job interview. Mhm. And things are really fast, kind of like fast paced Paste. And he's like, I'm just kind of going, when are we just going to slow down? And like, when can I just relax? And we're going to start telling stories and we're going to start laughing. He's like, where does that happen in this culture? And I was like, man, you're so right. I mean, I remember it happening as a kid and my family sitting around a big table with my cousins and all this kind of stuff, storytelling and maybe in high school or college. But where does that happen today?

Yeah, it's funny because we live here in South Florida, up north. We had snow days and you kind of would look forward to those because you would have a day or two where you had no agenda, you had no plan because school was closed. You really couldn't get to the grocery store. You were snowed in and everything. We don't have nothing stops down here. We're always.

Yeah, it's funny because we live here in South Florida, up north. We had snow days and you kind of would look forward to those because you would have a day or two where you had no agenda, you had no plan because school was closed. You really couldn't get to the grocery store. You were snowed in and everything. We don't have nothing stops down here. We're always.

Hurricane days. Yeah.

Hurricane days. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, but putting up shutters. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, but putting up shutters. Yeah.

So everybody's contained. Yeah.

So everybody's contained. Yeah.

You know, but it's just that mindset of just slowing down is something this, this community just has a real hard time doing that, I think. Yeah.

You know, but it's just that mindset of just slowing down is something this, this community just has a real hard time doing that, I think. Yeah.

Yeah. And there's, um. Yeah, it's so fast paced. There's always something, you know, stimulating that you can go do and, you know, really, really cool things happening. But on top of that, not only do you have that entertainment piece, but what I've found, especially since Covid, is as the housing market has increased and inflation happened, people that were just working one job before are now working 2 or 3 jobs, and there's this whole entrepreneurship thing that's happened, which is cool, but it has maximized people's bandwidth, so they don't have even these little windows to take time to be with friends. You know, they're just constantly going, grinding, trying to survive here. So it's another pressure on people that I've.

Yeah. And there's, um. Yeah, it's so fast paced. There's always something, you know, stimulating that you can go do and, you know, really, really cool things happening. But on top of that, not only do you have that entertainment piece, but what I've found, especially since Covid, is as the housing market has increased and inflation happened, people that were just working one job before are now working 2 or 3 jobs, and there's this whole entrepreneurship thing that's happened, which is cool, but it has maximized people's bandwidth, so they don't have even these little windows to take time to be with friends. You know, they're just constantly going, grinding, trying to survive here. So it's another pressure on people that I've.

So so what can the church do.

So so what can the church do.

So we as a church started these things called story groups. I have a counseling degree as well, and I'm a therapist here. And I as I was doing training, I got exposed to a similar concept. We've taken it and tweaked it, did. But really what it is, it's a it's a group of 10 to 12 people that gather and there isn't a Bible study. There are biblical principles driving the work that we're doing. But as we step back and we see loneliness as this big, big issue, we're, like, not concerned about helping people memorize Scripture. Right now, what we're trying to do is create an experience for people where they get to experience the love of God. And what we do is 10 to 12 people sit together, they commit for a semester, and every week, one person volunteers to share a story of their life. And the setup is, hey Eric, if we want to really get to know who you are, what's an important story that we need to know? So they come sharing that story. It's a two page story. We ask them to write it down. It's really important that you write it down. It kind of contains the content, if you will. And what we're doing is we have created like a time travel machine in some ways, where we're going back in time with this person and a lot of times the stories that people tell, they are painful stories. Some of them are are joyful stories as well. But as you know, joy and pain are always kind of wed together. But they go back in time and they talk about, man, the time my parents got divorced and I saw my dad walk out of the house, right. And and essentially what the group does is nobody's quoting scripture to them. Nobody's trying to fix the person. They're just sitting there noticing what they're feeling. And at the end of the story, what we give back to that person is what I was feeling as they told the story. So when your dad walked out the door, I just felt my gut sink and I felt overwhelmed by sadness. Um, somebody else. I felt so angry for you in that moment. And what's happening is, in a way, we're creating the friends and the community that we all needed in that moment. But we didn't have because mom was probably overwhelmed by that reality too. Brother and sister were just like, oh my God. You know, everybody was just kind of in shock, so nobody could really be there for each other. And we're creating, in a sense, a space where that happens. So what what people experience is transformational presence. And it's it's really an emphasis. You know, churches will emphasize different things they sometimes name, you know, their churches after those things they emphasize. But we have really emphasized the incarnation of God, the God who is with us. That is so important. And I come from a Presbyterian background. We're all about the sovereignty of God, and God's in control of everything. And there's, you know, there's comfort in that. But for me, the real comfort is not been so much that as I've gotten older, it's been that there's a God who is with me in everything. Because just because God's in control doesn't mean bad things don't happen, right? I mean, like, look what happened to Jesus, you know, like, so Jesus was on the cross, like, so I don't if I'm using that theology of God's in control of everything, thinking that that's going to help me avoid pain in life. It's not a reality. It's not true. But to know that there is a God who understands my pain and is with me in my pain is is transformative.

So we as a church started these things called story groups. I have a counseling degree as well, and I'm a therapist here. And I as I was doing training, I got exposed to a similar concept. We've taken it and tweaked it, did. But really what it is, it's a it's a group of 10 to 12 people that gather and there isn't a Bible study. There are biblical principles driving the work that we're doing. But as we step back and we see loneliness as this big, big issue, we're, like, not concerned about helping people memorize Scripture. Right now, what we're trying to do is create an experience for people where they get to experience the love of God. And what we do is 10 to 12 people sit together, they commit for a semester, and every week, one person volunteers to share a story of their life. And the setup is, hey Eric, if we want to really get to know who you are, what's an important story that we need to know? So they come sharing that story. It's a two page story. We ask them to write it down. It's really important that you write it down. It kind of contains the content, if you will. And what we're doing is we have created like a time travel machine in some ways, where we're going back in time with this person and a lot of times the stories that people tell, they are painful stories. Some of them are are joyful stories as well. But as you know, joy and pain are always kind of wed together. But they go back in time and they talk about, man, the time my parents got divorced and I saw my dad walk out of the house, right. And and essentially what the group does is nobody's quoting scripture to them. Nobody's trying to fix the person. They're just sitting there noticing what they're feeling. And at the end of the story, what we give back to that person is what I was feeling as they told the story. So when your dad walked out the door, I just felt my gut sink and I felt overwhelmed by sadness. Um, somebody else. I felt so angry for you in that moment. And what's happening is, in a way, we're creating the friends and the community that we all needed in that moment. But we didn't have because mom was probably overwhelmed by that reality too. Brother and sister were just like, oh my God. You know, everybody was just kind of in shock, so nobody could really be there for each other. And we're creating, in a sense, a space where that happens. So what what people experience is transformational presence. And it's it's really an emphasis. You know, churches will emphasize different things they sometimes name, you know, their churches after those things they emphasize. But we have really emphasized the incarnation of God, the God who is with us. That is so important. And I come from a Presbyterian background. We're all about the sovereignty of God, and God's in control of everything. And there's, you know, there's comfort in that. But for me, the real comfort is not been so much that as I've gotten older, it's been that there's a God who is with me in everything. Because just because God's in control doesn't mean bad things don't happen, right? I mean, like, look what happened to Jesus, you know, like, so Jesus was on the cross, like, so I don't if I'm using that theology of God's in control of everything, thinking that that's going to help me avoid pain in life. It's not a reality. It's not true. But to know that there is a God who understands my pain and is with me in my pain is is transformative.

But and it's not just that God sees me in the pain, but it's the people I'm sitting with. You talked about our needing to know that I'm seen. Yes. If you're sharing your story and people are saying back to you, here's what I feel. You're you're feeling seen.

But and it's not just that God sees me in the pain, but it's the people I'm sitting with. You talked about our needing to know that I'm seen. Yes. If you're sharing your story and people are saying back to you, here's what I feel. You're you're feeling seen.

Totally. And and it is, it is so life giving. You know, in my time doing this, the times that it has been the most life giving for me, I would go to a story group from seven to like 830. Afterwards, at least half the group would go to dinner down on clematis. After that we'd go get dessert. After that we would end up at my my friend's hot tub. So and this was an all guys group. We'd stay up till like 12:00 at night. This was my night out and I would wake up on. That was on a Thursday night. I wake up Friday morning feeling like a kid again. And that takes, you know, you look at that time that was like five hours that I was spending with my friends, and it would be in those last final hours that I would finally get to a place where I had felt relaxed and slowed down enough, and I had processed and connected at a pretty deep level, but that I would start asking the questions that I didn't even really realize I was carrying around with me all day. You know, maybe it was a theological question. Maybe it was a question about how to care for my wife or something I was struggling with. But I would finally be so like at rest that I could realize there was a question there, you know, and there was something there that I wanted to talk about. So it was it's so it's been so transformative in my life. It's the thing that we get calls about the most as a church. We've also set aside $300 for anybody who goes to our church that wants to start going to counseling, because we see counseling as a super huge, important thing. And we've also started a counseling center at our church called the Providencia Counseling Collective. And we have a fund because we want to make counseling accessible to people. And it's, you know, with inflation and different things, it's very challenging. Sometimes the people who need counseling the most can't afford it. So we have this scholarship that's set up. And, you know, people can get help if they need it or if they want it.

Totally. And and it is, it is so life giving. You know, in my time doing this, the times that it has been the most life giving for me, I would go to a story group from seven to like 830. Afterwards, at least half the group would go to dinner down on clematis. After that we'd go get dessert. After that we would end up at my my friend's hot tub. So and this was an all guys group. We'd stay up till like 12:00 at night. This was my night out and I would wake up on. That was on a Thursday night. I wake up Friday morning feeling like a kid again. And that takes, you know, you look at that time that was like five hours that I was spending with my friends, and it would be in those last final hours that I would finally get to a place where I had felt relaxed and slowed down enough, and I had processed and connected at a pretty deep level, but that I would start asking the questions that I didn't even really realize I was carrying around with me all day. You know, maybe it was a theological question. Maybe it was a question about how to care for my wife or something I was struggling with. But I would finally be so like at rest that I could realize there was a question there, you know, and there was something there that I wanted to talk about. So it was it's so it's been so transformative in my life. It's the thing that we get calls about the most as a church. We've also set aside $300 for anybody who goes to our church that wants to start going to counseling, because we see counseling as a super huge, important thing. And we've also started a counseling center at our church called the Providencia Counseling Collective. And we have a fund because we want to make counseling accessible to people. And it's, you know, with inflation and different things, it's very challenging. Sometimes the people who need counseling the most can't afford it. So we have this scholarship that's set up. And, you know, people can get help if they need it or if they want it.

Well, there that that was a lot. And I guess what I, what I was thinking as you were talking is you're building that your personal growth financially becomes less important as you have these friends around you, I would think, and it's you start thinking about, oh, I could take a job in whatever city that is, or you start thinking, do I want to take that job and leave my friends that are here? You start thinking differently almost when you're going through this process instead of financial growth.

Well, there that that was a lot. And I guess what I, what I was thinking as you were talking is you're building that your personal growth financially becomes less important as you have these friends around you, I would think, and it's you start thinking about, oh, I could take a job in whatever city that is, or you start thinking, do I want to take that job and leave my friends that are here? You start thinking differently almost when you're going through this process instead of financial growth.

It's relational growth. It's emphasizing and prioritizing that community. Well, we've got to have maybe a part two to this conversation down the road, Pastor Keith, because there is still so much to discuss about loneliness and what steps we can take to overcome. Pastor Keith is with Memorial Presbyterian Church. We've got links to him at Eric and Bridget. Org.

It's relational growth. It's emphasizing and prioritizing that community. Well, we've got to have maybe a part two to this conversation down the road, Pastor Keith, because there is still so much to discuss about loneliness and what steps we can take to overcome. Pastor Keith is with Memorial Presbyterian Church. We've got links to him at Eric and Bridget. Org.

All right. Thank you so much for just really helping us through this and maybe giving us I don't I wouldn't recommend you go to the first person you see and start saying, here's my story. Sure. But maybe it's something you could start thinking about in your head. You know some of those things and you wouldn't want to just blurt it out. But maybe there's someone you'd want to sit down and say, I've been thinking about some things. Would you like to sit down and have some coffee? And if you have a friend that you would encourage, maybe just sitting down and just just talking, just spending some time together? I guess that's what you're saying. Really? Even no agenda. Just let's just spend time together and talk. Yeah.

All right. Thank you so much for just really helping us through this and maybe giving us I don't I wouldn't recommend you go to the first person you see and start saying, here's my story. Sure. But maybe it's something you could start thinking about in your head. You know some of those things and you wouldn't want to just blurt it out. But maybe there's someone you'd want to sit down and say, I've been thinking about some things. Would you like to sit down and have some coffee? And if you have a friend that you would encourage, maybe just sitting down and just just talking, just spending some time together? I guess that's what you're saying. Really? Even no agenda. Just let's just spend time together and talk. Yeah.

And I would recommend the David Brooks book as a starting point for people. It kind of gives a framework for how to have these types of conversations.

And I would recommend the David Brooks book as a starting point for people. It kind of gives a framework for how to have these types of conversations.