Missing in ArizonaA hermit. A mistress. A convict. Someone knows something.
Missing in Arizona contains graphic depictions of violence and may not be suitable for all listeners. There are people out there who have information that could help solve this case. Persons of interest, including someone who allegedly spoke to Robert Fisher after the murders, someone with whom he was having an ongoing affair, and the camper who located Mary Fisher's SUV and then himself disappeared. Some have key details but are likely not involved in any other way. Some may have helped Robert before the murders, some may have helped him after. At the least they can help us understand what happened. At the most they can help us find him today. Just proving he lived past April two thousand and one and did not die in the wilderness would be a huge break in the case. In this episode, I'm going to examine these people. Who are they, what do they know? What did they do? From iHeartRadio and Neon thirty three, I'm John Walzac and this is Missing an air the story of a man who disappeared after allegedly killing his wife and kids, blowing up their suburban home, and escaping into the wilderness. Twenty three years later. I'm hunting Robert Fisher and I need your help.
Sean.
April thirteenth, two thousand and one, three days after the Fisher house explodes, nine to fifteen PM, a phone rings at the Scottsdale Police Department. An informant shares the name of a man, Sean, who allegedly knows where Robert Fisher is hiding in the mountains. Detectives are intrigued. This is the second time in only seventy two hours that Shawn's name has come up. A US Marshall heard from a different informant that Sean was speaking to Fisher after the murders by phone. So now two sources have said that Shawn either knows where Fisher is or that he's currently in contact with him. Police interviews Sean. He confirms that he and Robert are friends. They met at Paradise Springs Community Each church seven or eight years ago. They also shared two close mutual friends, Ken Hodgson and Sandy Gillespie. In recent years, Robert acted erratically, Sean says, on hunting trips he would randomly shoot guns at inappropriate times. He was also likely having affairs, but Sean doesn't know with whom the area's Robert knows best. He says, our unit twenty three near Young and five B south north of Payson. Detectives ask if he's talking to Robert by phone. Absolutely not, He says. The murders are a tragedy. If Robert contacts him, he'll call the police immediately. In twenty twenty three, I speak to Sean by phone after Robert disappeared. After the murders, the police got hundreds, if not thousands of tips. One of the tips that they got was from an infour minute who alleges that you were speaking to Robert after he disappeared, trying to get him to turn himself in, and that he was in the mountains near Winslow. Can you address that? Was that accurate at all?
No?
No, no, I never spoke to Robert after that. I mean I would have made a cistans arrest, you know, and turn him in. That kind of behavior is unacceptable if he deserves.
To pay for his crimes. I mean I really liked his son. He was cool.
If Robert were to have reached out to anybody in terms of a friend, who do you think he would have reached out to?
Well, he had a pretty close relationship with pastor Ken Hodginson from Paradise Springs Church. I think Ken had some insight into his personality that went beyond anybody else that were just acquaintances with him.
I think Robert probably talked to him because that's what Ken does.
That's his speciality is helping people with their demons. He's as much of a therapist counselor as he is a minister.
Shawn never expected to hear from Robert after the murders because.
He knew my personality. I'm not going to go along with that. I mean, that's heinous, that's evil man. I was pissed for a long time out of smoke.
Check him.
Who would have come down to that, either made an assisting resident. He didn't go quietly. I'd had to shoot him. I was perfectly prepared to take steps. That's just some evil shit. So no, yeah, that's totally false. I'd be curious to find out who the informal was it said that Ken Hodgson.
Everyone tells me that if anyone knows Robert's secrets, it's Ken Hodgson. Ken and Robert grew up together in Tucson. Ken later became a pastor Robert attended his church in the lead up to the murders, Robert told Ken that Mary wanted a divorce. Ken later speculated to the FBI that Robert was gay. Even if he has inside information, though he's in a tough spot as a pastor, he's obligated to keep secrets, not share them except in extreme circumstances. After the murders, Ken feared for his safety. He no longer lives in Arizona. I try to reach him. He never responds Dale Hodgson, Ken's brother and Robert's former hunting buddy. If Robert confided in Ken and Ken confided in anyone else, it's likely Dale. Dale is also a key witness about another person of interest, the Hermit. I'll get to him in a minute, but first, when I contact Dale, this is what he tells me via email.
John, I do not know anything about Robert's personal life. I went hunting with him a couple of times, and that's it. I would love to see Robert brought to justice. I do not know about the hermit, or about anyone in his personal life, male or female.
Good luck Dale the Hermit.
Though Dale now says he doesn't know anything about the hermit. That's not what he told police in two thousand and one. In December two thousand, four months before the murders, he said he and Robert went on an elk hunting trip about twenty miles north of Payson. Dale's son accompanied them. They stayed at the Happy Jack RV Park near the town of Clint's Well, arriving the night of Thursday, December seventh, and leaving the morning of Sunday, December tenth. Robert stuck around a bit longer by himself. Much of the trip. Dale and his son went one way, Robert another. One day, while riding his ATV, Robert stumbled upon another man also on an ATV. The hermit, an older guy who lived in the area year round in a small trailer. Dale only met him twice for about ten minutes. He described him as a white male about seventy years old, five to nine, one hundred and eighty pounds, with whiskers, wearing insulated overalls and a black beanie cap. The hermit was from Mesa. He had a white collar career, possibly at Motorola. Then he had heart problems, quit his job, got a divorce, gave up on society, and retreated into the woods sometime around nineteen ninety three or ninety four. He started with a barebones trailer. Over time, he added solar power, a fridge that ran on propane, and possibly a TV, though he didn't watch it. He spent his days collecting firewood and only went into town once a month for medication. Robert loved all of this, the solitude, the languid days outside, a crisp pine scented pulsating breeze, and escape from society. The two men spent a lot of time together. Dale says alone after the trip, Robert told at least two other people about the hermit, Van Hodgson and a co worker who doesn't want to be named. Robert told the co worker that the hermit lived at a campsite in a shack like shed, which differs from Dale's description of a trailer. He said that while writing his ATV, he came across the hermit walking in the woods, which differs from Dale's account that both men were writing ATVs. The hermit gave Robert directions to his home. The next day, Robert visited him for five to six hours. The hermit had a dog, but was lonely. Robert said he also had a good supply of fuel and food, including wild turkeys, which he penned up in his yard. The hermit came into town only once a year for supplies, Robert told his coworker, which differs from Dale's account that he came into town once a month. He was a business person or maybe a lawyer. He got tired of his job and society and one day left it all behind. He cut off communication with the outside world. Robert said the hermit was in his forties, which differs from Dale's account that the hermit was in his seventies. Robert showed his coworker photos from the trip. Police never located them. They presumably burned in the Fisher House fire. Ken Hodgson told police that Robert and Dale both referred to the hermit as quote the guy with the cornpipe. Police asked Ken, Dale and the co worker if Robert expressed any hermit fantasies of his own. No, they said, in part because of his back pain. He might idealize that rugged kind of life, as millions do, but he wasn't cut out to live it. The details here come from interviews police conducted a week after the murders. They spoke to the coworker on April seventeenth, two thousand and one, and to Ken and Dale Hodgson the next day, April eighteenth. So I'm comparing contemporaneous accounts of the hermit, not fresh memories from two thousand and one to stale ones today, which otherwise could explain some of the minor discrepancies. The hermit is important for two key reasons. First, he inspired Robert, if not to live in the woods, then at least to dramatically alter his life. Their encounter was serendipitous. It came right before Robert fell sick with an apparent STI, days before his life started to pancake and rapidly collapse. Incredible timing. Second, and this is critical, Dale Hodgson told police that he thought Robert might be with the hermit, that he could have fled there after the murders, which makes sense. Robert meets a hermit in the woods four months before he kills his family. The hermit is cut off from society, he's not following the news. He has a stockpile of food and fuel. It's an ideal off the grid refuge. The hermit could have helped Robert without knowing what he did. Robert could have lied, for example, saying his wife kicked him out and he needed a place to stay. The hermit was lonely, he likely would have obliged. He would have welcomed company from a kindred spirit. Police attempted to locate him in two thousand and one. They apparently failed. Dale Hodgson and his son left the hunting trip early on Sunday, December tenth, two thousand. Robert stayed behind. Another friend, Steve Peach, arrived the night of time whose day December twelfth, meaning Robert had two and a half days at Happy Jack alone, two and a half days he could have spent with the hermit who when Steve arrived, Robert failed to mention, which seems strange right, almost like he decided to minimize who knew about him. Now, let me circle back to a lead I discussed in episode five. After the murders, a tow truck driver claimed he pulled Robert out of a ditch near Blue Ridge Reservoir. While I'm skeptical of this claim, I do want to point out that the hermit lived only five miles from the reservoir. In twenty twenty three, I interview Robert's coworker, the one he told about the hermit.
Yes, the hermit story is true.
The hermit and his lifestyle fascinated Robert.
And there were only like two or three of us who knew of this. A very small piece, very limited number of people knew.
That Robert admired the hermit's home for its minimalist efficiency and.
Because it was kind of out in the middle of nowhere, so it wasn't like you went to loot some scraps at home deep over or you found some on the side of the road.
So it was just kind of stuff that he yelp from your forest and stuff like that. And I know he mentioned.
It was almost like you didn't see it, so they actually saw the person before he said, we actually saw where he was living.
Summer twenty twenty three, our producer Chris and I decide to search for the hermit. We leave Phoenix Drive to Happy Jack.
It's thro on this like.
Windy rocky forest for a very rocky forest road, like through the forests. We've got a polar pop from Circle K and you can hear it jiggling around. I don't know how good the mic is. I hope it picks up the jiggling ice. Nobody else is on this road. It's very bumpy. There's a looks like it's spelled to rain. It's pretty cloudy, and it's seventy three degrees. It's actually really nice. We criss cross side roads, including one with a sizeable no trespassing sign. Should just go down it. Let's go down. Let's go down a little bit and then turn around.
Go what are they going to do?
Arrest us? Come on?
Some people just come out yelling at us as a shotgun or something. That's better than being arrested. We're just lost, just some lost to us. Looking for hermit. We find some shacks that could belong to the hermit. There's no way to know for sure, but one thing we can say by now, he's likely dead and regardless, this area has changed a lot since two thousand and one. It's much more developed. So moving on to Brad. Brad started a new job at the Mayo Clinic Hospital in Phoenix in December two thousand. He met Robert at orientation on Thursday, December seventh. The same day Robert left after work on the elk hunting trip Robert and Brad quickly bonded over their love of guns and nature, as well as their past military experience. In February two thousand and one, two months before the murders, Brad gave Robert a bunch of MREs Field rations three to five five cases. Each was ten to twelve meals, enough to last at least two to three weeks. Police never found them. They could have burned, or Robert could have hidden them somewhere. Brad was the last coworker to see Robert. They exited the hospital together around four pm on April ninth, shortly before the murders. Initially, police were suspicious of Brad, but later they determined it unlikely that he helped Robert in any way other than innocently gifting him some MREs. I agree with that assessment.
German shepherd man, this.
One is confounding. I don't know what to make of it. The night of April ninth, two thousand and one, a teacher named Marge Lopez witnessed something odd at Supi Middle School outside the National Junior Honor Society event. She saw a man tying up a blonde colored German shepherd. She didn't pay him much attention. When he walked in, he sat down next to her. It was Robert Fisher. Lopez asked about the shepherd, speaking in a harsh, monotone voice. Robert quote indicated very sternly that it was not him that was outside with the dog. According to a police report, Lopez said the man with the shepherd were the same black ball cap as Fisher. She was confident it was Fisher. There are only two options here. Either Lopez was mistaken or it was Fisher, in which case, what was he doing with the blonde German shepherd? And whose shepherd was it? If you're thinking maybe she saw Robert tying up his dog Blue, I doubt it. Blue was a different breed, an Australian cattle dog, not a German shepherd. He was black, white and gray, not blonde. And anyway, why would Robert deny that he was the guy outside.
The Paulden Survivalists.
We reported this one in episode nine. On April first, two thousand and one, while returning to Scottsdale from a wedding in Sedona, Robert unexpectedly stopped at a survivalist compound in Paulden. He made Mary Wade in the car She had no idea what he was doing. He disappeared for an hour, then came back. This is obviously mysterious. Who were these people? Why did Robert meet with them nine days before the murders? Did they in any way help him? I don't know, but I found something of note. According to Phoenix Magazine, that area was at the time a hot spot for outlaw biker gangs, including the Skull Valley chapter of the Hell's Angels, based in Chino Valley, only ten minutes south.
Of Paulden Brian Ballard.
On June twenty seventh, two thousand and one, four Scott Steel detectives followed up on a lead from a local inmate that Robert Fischer stayed with a man named Brian Ballard after the murders. A woman nicknamed Ninja, whose real name is redacted in a police report, allegedly helped. From the report quote, it was reported that had brought Fisher to after the murders, Detectives interviewed at least eight people, including Stacy Metcalf, an inmate in Phoenix, Donovan Solstak, s l z Stak, also an inmate in Phoenix, Sally Metcalf, Jessica Baker and two neighbors who lived across the street from possibly a safe house where Robert Fisher stayed after the murders. The neighbors didn't have any information on Fisher, but there was a lot of traffic into and out of the house. They said they suspected it was used to deal drugs. That's all I got from a records request. I was unable to reach anyone named in the report. However, I did identify Brian Ballard as Brian Douglas Ballard nickname Purebread, ilias Mark Laylor, La Lar occupation drywall contractor. Date of birth July twenty seventh, nineteen sixty one, so he was the same age as Robert Fisher. Height six ' one wait one hundred and seventy five pounds, hair, blonde, eyes hazel, so in some ways he physically resembled Fisher too. He has an extensive criminal record, including charges for drug possession, larceny, forgery, trafficking, stolen property, assault, weapons related defenses, disorderly conduct, shoplifting, and driving while impaired. On July twenty first, two thousand and one, three months after the Fisher murders, a Phoenix police officer pulled him over and issued him three citations. Five days later, Phoenix police raided the home he shared with his girlfriend, Colinda Lee Davis eighty twenty four North twenty ninth Avenue, which, if you're curious, is twenty miles from the Fisher House. They found meth syringes, drug pipes, counterfeit bills, and pieces of counterfeit checks. Ballard said he was working as an informant for the Glendale Police Department. He claimed he would obtain counterfeit bills from a guy named Tuma, then turn them over to the cops at his house. During the raid, or at least four other people Skyler Lee Writtenauer, Sandra Luis Radell, Michael Thomas Beck, and Augustine Vdalas Velasquez or Vasquez. The spelling is inconsistent in a police report. The report also names Michael William Lampy Lampe, Carl a Pert, and Lester Whitezel, though it's unclear how they're tied to the case. On August fifth, two thousand and one, ten days after the raid, Ballard was pulled over again while out on bail by the same cop who stopped him on July twenty first, in his front pocket, the cop found seven hundred and eighty milligrams of meth. Ballard claimed the pants were not actually his, but he quickly gave up that ruse. Yes, he said, they're my pants. Yes, it's my meth. The officer also found a jiggle key used to pick locks on his floorboard, as well as keys to other vehicles, all of which Ballard claimed were his. It's unclear if Phoenix police were aware that Ballard was a person of interest in the Fisher case. They raided his house a month after. Scottsdale Police investigated whether or not he sheltered Robert after the murders. Robert wasn't known to use illegal drugs, but he was seemingly addicted to opioids. He had a prescription, but it's possible he also obtained them illegally, which could explain a connection to someone living in a house used to sell drugs. When arrested in two thousand and one, Ballard was described as an unemployed addict. If anyone from the criminal underworld helped Robert after the murders, it likely would have been in exchange for money. They may not have even been aware of what he did. If I were law enforcement Here's what I do. Now, Double check this lead. Interview Ballard and everyone else tied to his case. Compare his fingerprints which are on file to Prince recovered from Mary's forerunner. If the keys found in his vehicle in two thousand and one are in storage, see if any fit the fore runner. Examine other evidence recovered from his house. Check his medical records, see if he was ever treated at one of Robert's hospitals. Finally, if Ballard had ties to someone who produced counterfeit ca and checks, he could have easily had ties to someone who produced falsified identity documents which Robert could have used to escape. So I'd review document forgery cases in the Phoenix metro from say, nineteen ninety eight to two thousand and four, Track down the forgers and interview them. Also, let me say this, if you were involved in a legal activity in two thousand and one and helped Robert Fisher escape or know who did, you could still be eligible for reward money. The cops don't care about you. They don't care about drugs or fake bills from twenty three years ago. They want to catch a guy who killed his wife and children. Please come forward or at least submit information anonymously to law enforcement or US. We'll tell you how to reach us at the end of.
This episode the Unit ten Rancher.
Some people theorize that after the murders, Robert fled to a remote ranch somewhere in Arizona, disconnected from society. Maybe he's living there today. They say, I find it hard to believe that he's still on some isolated property in state twenty three years later, but it's certainly possible that he used one as a layover while escaping. That exact scenario played out in a high profile way in nineteen ninety seven, when the FBI found Chevy Keyhoe, a white supremacist, hiding under a fake name, on a Utah ranch one hundred miles northwest of the Grand Canyon. Keyho helped kill a family in Arkansas, including an eight year old girl, and has suspected ties to the Oklahoma City bombing. Meanwhile, one of Robert's friends told police that before he killed his family, Robert befriended quote a rancher up in Unit ten. Unit ten is a hunting area sandwiched between Williams, Arizona, and the Grand Canyon. Another friend said that Robert quote had a ranch near the Grand Canyon, presumably not that he owned one, but that he frequented one in the area. The unit ten rancher has never been identified. There's one more Rance related lead. I purposely left it out of episode five. Tell me about the Cherry Creek story lead.
Yeah, this one is bizarre.
True Crime Arizona host Brianna Whitney.
It was in the late two thousands and this woman named Jesse Clanbal and her friend were going to the Cherry Creek Store to give people an idea of what that looks like. It's a really small convenience store that has some groceries, but it's more like a like a gas.
Station convenience store.
And it's in Young and.
It's in Young, right, so there's not much off of the road in Young, Like this is the main store that's there, which is.
Just south of where the Forerunner was fould right.
So tinytown in the woods. If you're listening and trying to visualize this tinytown in the woods, one road, not much around it. The Cherry Creek Store is probably the main grocery store, but when you think of it, it's like a gas station convenience store to set the scene, and Jesse Clanbial was living in young she had young kids at the time. She and her friend went to the Cherry Creek store to get whatever they needed to get and at the front was a picture of Robert Fisher. You know most wanted. Here's his picture that we've all seen a million times. While they were in there, this old man, I think with an oxygen tank came in with like aanch hand, a younger ranch hand, and she said that. When they got to the front counter, the old man said, why do you have a picture of my friend?
What is that?
And you know it's Robert Fisher. He's wanted for murdering his family. As this old man got real irate and upset, like, no, this man lives on my ranch with me. He would never do such a thing. He's a great person. This cannot be him. Why are you paid to him in this picture? No way, you have the wrong person, and got really upset at the fact that he claimed whoever was on his ranch was in this picture. And I guess eventually he asked the ranch hand, you know, let's go, let's go, let's get out of here. And so Jesse watched this go down and thought, well, that was a weird interaction, and ended up calling the FBI with the tip. The problem is that nobody could track down who the old man was or what ranch he lived on in the area. And you might think, oh, maybe there's a couple of ranches. No, there's a lot of ranches in northern Arizona, so to know exactly which one we're talking about would be nearly impossible.
And part it's interesting because of what Robert Fisher did for a living, that he was cardiovascular and respiratory tech at the Mayo Clinic, And so I think you highlighted the importance of this man rolling in with an oxygen tank because it's a little anecdotal piece of information, but it ties into what Fisher did professionally.
Yeah, exactly, I think that part stands out. And when I talked to Robert Fisher's sister on the phone, she also made mention of that she felt that this was the most credible tip because she said she could see Robert helping somebody. He knew how to work an oxygen type tank. He was a respiratory therapist at the Mayo Clinic, very well renowned. So yeah, I mean, could he have been living there.
Sure, or maybe the man had dementia and was confused.
We just don't know, and that's what's so frustrating.
If you like this show, please download our first two seasons, Missing in Alaska and Missing on nine to eleven. For updates, visit neon thirty three dot com or follow me on Twitter at John Waalzac joenl Czak.
Thanks for listening.
There are three people left who are critical to this case. I'm going to discuss two of them now and save one for next week. First, the mistress, who could be one of at least four different people. In episode six, Robert's friend and co worker, Ashley's Zarsty said there were persistent rumors that Robert had an affair in the nineties with a nurse. For years, the nurse's husband left Robert threatening voicemails. It was enough to force him to move to a different hospital. Then, in nineteen ninety nine, Robert cheated on Mary with a masseuse, a one time fling at a motel. Finally, in the lead up to the murders, there was rampant speculation that he was having another affair. Confirmation seemingly came when he got sick with at least one or more a s TIS and transmitted syphilis to Mary. So was robertson fidelity in two thousand and or two thousand and one, a quick flame, an ongoing affair, or both. Would any of these women or men help him before, during, or after the murders? Did police investigate the nurse with whom he allegedly had an affair in the nineties, and most importantly, if he was having an affair in two thousand and one, who was the other person? I found four candidates. First, an unknown woman who lived in Prescott Valley, Arizona, not far from Robert's mom. Her name is redacted in police reports. Second, a woman I'll call Rita. I know her name, but for privacy's sake, I'm choosing not to name her. It's not something I can do ethically at this point. Rita's name surfaced in two thousand and one, right after the murders. Police obtained a credit report on her, but they were instructed to stop there because they didn't have any concrete evidence that she was involved with Fisher in quote an extraordinary capacity. Third, a woman all called Tina Tino worked with Robert at the Mayo Clinic Hospital. I emailed her last year. She responded, asking how I found her, then saying quote, I'm going to pass on any further discussions on this fourth a woman all call Sandra. She also worked with Fisher at Mayo. I also emailed her. She said quote, I don't have any more information to share with you that wasn't given at the time of the horrific thing that he did. Best of luck and hopefully someday he'll be found one way or the other. For now, that's all I have. Any further action needs to be taken by law enforcement.
Moving on to Greg, the.
Camper who found Mary's SUV in the woods north of Young on April nineteenth, two thousand and one. That day, he was driving home from Arizona to Oregon. When the sun started to set and the weather deteriorated, he stopped for the night set up a campsite. As twilight sank into the forest, he started walking down a rugged dirt road. He spotted a glint of silver an squv. He knew it could be Fisher, but come on, really, he figured it so unlikely. He returned to his campsite, had dinner, and fell asleep in his wood paneled white van. The next morning, he circled behind the suv on a hill. He peered through binoculars. It was a Forerunner. He saw movement blue, Robert's dog. Then he drove forty minutes north to a gas station, where he used a payphone to call two friends in Mesa, who in turn called the Scottsdale Police Department, sparking a massive manhunt in rugged terrain. Meanwhile, Greg disappeared. He left the state quickly. Police were unable to reach him for a month. Finally they tracked him down and spoke to him by phone at his brother's home in Oregon. Investigators have always suspected that he possibly helped Robert escape, that he drove him to freedom. Police reports describe him as a transient camper who roamed the nation and made money working odd jobs pouring concrete slab, for example. He first heard about the Fisher case on the radio on April nineteenth. With darkness and snow descending, he stumbled upon the Forerunner while gathering firewood.
By chance.
He said, it was parked exactly where he camped seven months earlier. He noticed the log across the road and thought, quote that'd be kind of cute if he Fisher went down this road and pushed that log across it, so anybody driving down there would just turn around and leave. Then he saw on suv poking out of the bushes.
Quote.
Now, I've been doing this camping stuff for about ten years. I know the different styles of camping. There's loitering, there's camping, there's homesteading, there's free loading, and then there's hiding. This guy was part hiding. You wouldn't camp like that. Greg turned around and walked back to his campsite. I kept the fire burning real good, he said, But I didn't stand near the fire. I stood out in the dark because it was a real dark night cold. He noticed that whoever the suv belonged to didn't light their own fire, which quote raised an eyebrow. At that point, he gave it fifty to fifty odds that it was actually Fisher. The next morning, he was approached by Robert's dog, Blue, who he described as quote a dingo looking thing. The dog came about halfway to me, he said. He was acting real strange, whining and trying to wag his tail at the same time. If he even had a tail, I can't remember. He was wagging his butt anyway, and he would look at me and then look back at the ditch behind the car. There's a little dry wash back there, and I figured, well, he Robert killed himself. He's laying down in that ditch, and I really didn't want to go look at it because it might be an ambush or something. I went back and put out my fire and threw dirt on it and drove straight up to Heber. I was kind of at a loss of what to do. I don't use telephones. I don't even like them, especially payphones. They just take my money and I don't get nothing out of it.
Yet.
Despite his disdain for coin guzzling phones, Greg called his friends the Jackas, then sped away way as investigators and the media converged on the Forerunner. Greg spent the night twenty one miles north above Chevlon Canyon Lake. The next day he hit Winslow Flagstaff Page. He crossed into southern Utah, drove through the Escalante Staircase area, emerged near Bryce Canyon, and continued on to Oregon. Investigators asked how he felt about Robert Fisher. I'd like to see him shot dead. He said, wherever you find him, because it's going to take what seventeen years before you could ever kill him. You know, it costs so much money and all that crap. Shoot him right there and just say, well, we don't know what happened. That's my opinion. It save you a couple hundred grand. Investigators chuckled, but they were still suspicious. Why didn't Greg stick around? Why did he leave so quickly? The original detective John Kirkham died in two thousand and six. The investigators who took over the case, including Hugh Lockerby, declined a comment. What did you make of the man who located the forerunner? I mean he just kind of hit the road and was hard to track down.
Pass okay.
For an entire year, I try to find Greg. He doesn't have much of a paper trail, a fue old addresses here and there. I write letters, no response, send emails, they bounce back, call possible numbers, not him. By late twenty twenty three, there's nothing left to do but try to track him down in person. In December, our producer Chris and I hop on a plane. We fly to Seattle, drive down to Oregon, start knocking on doors. Over the years, I've done this repeatedly. It's always a waste of time, an act of desperation.
It never works.
Until it Greg does Henderson next time I'm missing in Arizona.
It's a fore runner. Holy shit, there's the job that damn.
You can reach us by phone at one eight three to three new tips that's one eight three, three six three nine eight four seven seven, by email at tips at iheartman Media dot com, tip s at iHeartMedia dot com, online at Neon thirty three dot com, or on Twitter at John Wallzac, j O n w A. L. Czak. This episode produced by Taylor Chacoine. Paul Decan is our executive producer. Chris Brown is our supervising producer. Panna Rose Snyder is our producer. Paul Gemberline is our researcher, Ben Bolin is a consulting producer, and I'm your host and executive producer. John Wallzac recreation voiced by Ben Hackett, header's voiced by Taylor Shackoyne. Cover art by Pam Peacock Neon thirty three. Logo designed by Derek Rudy. Our intro song is Utopia by Ruby Cube. Please download the first two seasons of our show Missing in Alaska and Missing on nine to eleven, and if you're so inclined, give us a five star rating. Missing in Arizona is a co production of iHeartRadio and Neon thirty three.
