Bron is joined by Marie Vakakis (Mental Health Social Worker and couples therapist) to chat about working with couples who stonewall, withdraw, and shut down. Marie unpacks the Gottman Method's "Four Horsemen" and shares exactly what to say and do when a couple's session starts to unravel. I found the episode really helpful for individual work, too!

They chat about:
👉🏽 The Four Horsemen: Criticism, Defensiveness, Contempt and Stonewalling
👉🏻 The specific antidotes to each pattern, including the "I feel, when, I need" formula
👉 How to recognise nervous system overwhelm and pause a session safely
👉🏿 Common mistakes early-career clinicians make starting out in couples work

Guest: Marie Vakakis, Accredited mental health social worker and couples therapist

LINKS
Marie's practice - The Therapy Hub
Marie's podcast - Inside Social Work podcast
Marie's other podcast - This Complex Life podcast
Marie's website
Marie on LinkedIn
The Seven Principles for Making Marriage Work by John Gottman
Fight Right by John and Julie Gottman
Marie's previous Mental Work episode on couples work

THE END BITS

Mental Work is the podcast for psychologists about the realities of working in mental health, with an early-career focus. Hosted by psychologist/researcher Dr Bronwyn Milkins.

Support the show by buying me a virtual coffee ☕🍵

Have a question, episode idea or just want to say hi? DM Bron on Instagram, leave a comment on the Spotify episode, or email mentalworkpodcast@gmail.com

Apply to be a guest / YouTube (with captions & transcript) / Website

CREDITS

Producer: Michael English

Music: Home

Commitment: Mental Work believes in an inclusive and diverse mental health workforce. We honour the strength, resilience, and invaluable contributions of mental health workers with lived experiences of mental illness, disability, neurodivergence, LGBTIQA+ identities, and diverse culture and language. We recognise our First Nations colleagues as Traditional Custodians of the land and pay respect to Elders past, present, and emerging. Mental Work is recorded on unceded Whadjuk Noongar boodja.

Disclaimer: Mental Work provides informational content. Mental Work is not a psychological service and being a listener or guest does not establish a therapeutic relationship. Content should not be considered a replacement for professional consultation or therapy. All views expressed are personal, subject to change, and do not represent those of any affiliated employer, service, or organisation past or present. Efforts are made to ensure accuracy, but opinions may not always align with fact. Listeners are encouraged to thoughtfully assess the information presented and report any inaccuracies or concerns via email. Further information can be found here.

Bron is joined by Marie Vakakis (Mental Health Social Worker and couples therapist) to chat about working with couples who stonewall, withdraw, and shut down. Marie unpacks the Gottman Method's "Four Horsemen" and shares exactly what to say and do when a couple's session starts to unravel. I found the episode really helpful for individual work, too!
They chat about: 👉🏽 The Four Horsemen: Criticism, Defensiveness, Contempt and Stonewalling 👉🏻 The specific antidotes to each pattern, including the "I feel, when, I need" formula 👉 How to recognise nervous system overwhelm and pause a session safely 👉🏿 Common mistakes early-career clinicians make starting out in couples work
Guest: <a href="https://www.thetherapyhub.com.au">Marie Vakakis</a>, Accredited mental health social worker and couples therapist
LINKS
<ul>
<li>Marie's practice - <a href="https://thetherapyhub.com.au">The Therapy Hub</a></li>
<li>Marie's podcast - <a href="https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/inside-social-work/id1791244160">Inside Social Work podcast</a></li>
<li>Marie's other podcast - <a href="https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/this-complex-life/id1459084811">This Complex Life podcast</a></li>
<li><a href="https://marievakakis.com.au">Marie's website</a></li>
<li><a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/marievakakis/">Marie on LinkedIn</a></li>
<li><a href="https://www.gottman.com/product/the-seven-principles-for-making-marriage-work/">The Seven Principles for Making Marriage Work by John Gottman</a></li>
<li><a href="https://www.gottman.com/product/fight-right/">Fight Right by John and Julie Gottman</a></li>
<li><a href="https://www.mentalworkpodcast.com/working-with-couples-with-marie-vakakis/">Marie's previous Mental Work episode on couples work</a></li>
</ul>
THE END BITS
Mental Work is the podcast for psychologists about the realities of working in mental health, with an early-career focus. Hosted by psychologist/researcher <a href="https://www.mentalworkpodcast.com/about/" data-airgap-id="8">Dr Bronwyn Milkins</a>.
Support the show by <a href="https://www.buymeacoffee.com/mentalwork" data-airgap-id="9">buying me a virtual coffee</a> ☕🍵
Have a question, episode idea or just want to say hi? <a href="https://www.instagram.com/_mentalworkpodcast/" data-airgap-id="10">DM Bron on Instagram</a>, leave a comment on the <a href="https://open.spotify.com/show/5ifKADwT3mw6yYDZb9rHji" data-airgap-id="11">Spotify episode</a>, or <a href="mailto:mentalworkpodcast@gmail.com" data-airgap-id="12">email mentalworkpodcast@gmail.com</a>
<a href="https://www.podpage.com/mentalwork/p/guest/" data-airgap-id="13">Apply to be a guest</a> / <a href="https://www.youtube.com/@MentalWorkPodcast" data-airgap-id="14">YouTube (with captions &amp; transcript)</a> / <a href="https://www.mentalworkpodcast.com/" data-airgap-id="15">Website</a>
CREDITS
Producer: Michael English
Music: <a href="https://home96.bandcamp.com/" data-airgap-id="16">Home</a>
Commitment: Mental Work believes in an inclusive and diverse mental health workforce. We honour the strength, resilience, and invaluable contributions of mental health workers with lived experiences of mental illness, disability, neurodivergence, LGBTIQA+ identities, and diverse culture and language. We recognise our First Nations colleagues as Traditional Custodians of the land and pay respect to Elders past, present, and emerging. Mental Work is recorded on unceded Whadjuk Noongar boodja.
Disclaimer: Mental Work provides informational content. Mental Work is not a psychological service and being a listener or guest does not establish a therapeutic relationship. Content should not be considered a replacement for professional consultation or therapy. All views expressed are personal, subject to change, and do not represent those of any affiliated employer, service, or organisation past or present. Efforts are made to ensure accuracy, but opinions may not always align with fact. Listeners are encouraged to thoughtfully assess the information presented and report any inaccuracies or concerns via <a href="mailto:mentalworkpodcast@gmail.com" data-airgap-id="17">email</a>. Further information can be found <a href="https://www.mentalworkpodcast.com/p/disclaimer/" data-airgap-id="18">here</a>.

Mental Work is the podcast about working in mental health for psychologists, with an early-career focus. Hosted by Psychologist Dr Bronwyn Milkins.

Mental Work is the podcast about working in mental health for psychologists, with an early-career focus. Hosted by Psychologist Dr Bronwyn Milkins.

A closer look at the everyday challenges faced by early-career mental health workers, so they don’t have to go it alone.