Life UncutAm I an alcoholic? Emily Weir from sobriety to Home and Away
Hey Lifers!
In this episode, we sat down with the talented Emily Weir, known for her role as Mackenzie Booth on "Home and Away." Emily shares the highs and lows of her path into acting, as well as the challenges she faced with alcoholism, her path to recovery, and the realities of living with OCD and anxiety.
Emily shares how:
-Her success in acting wouldn't be there if she hadn't committed to being sober
-She realised she had a problem with alcohol
-Her life and friendship groups shifted after going sober
-Substances/alcohol can be the mask to what's going on under the surface
-To seek and get help if you have a bad relationship with booze
Em is a particularly insightful woman and in this chat, she opens up so vulnerably in the hopes that she can help shift the narrative of what an 'alcoholic' looks like.
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Life Uncut acknowledges the traditional custodians of country whose lands were never seated. We pay our respects to their elders past and present.
Always was, always will be Aboriginal Land. This episode was recorded on de rug Wallamuta Land. Hi guys, and welcome back to another episode of Life on Cut.
I'm Laura and.
I'm Brittany, and we have an interview that I am so excited to do today.
The person who's sitting right here in the room with us now.
The reason for that is because I got to meet Emily Weir off the back of Dancing with the Stars. So she's not only just a dancing extraordinaire. That's not why we're interviewing her, but I.
Definitely, I mean, what's part of it? Not runner up? Yeah, runner up, but very good for twenty three. Brather feels like first and you're supposed to pretend like you're not here. I'll introduce you in a second. I'm like Toros, you don't bring it on second, Okay. No.
So the thing is when we did this Dancing with the Stars, I got to meet em and she is literally a ball of sunshine.
She is a ray of sunshine.
You have to sit here and pretend like you don't know I'm saying all these wonderful things about you. She is also Mackenzie Booth. She's the actress that is on a Home and Away. But one of the conversations that we had in the green room of the Today Show was something that really stuck with me and EM. I can remember we were talking about having a celebratory drink and EM said, oh, no, not for me.
I don't drink.
And I had that moment which I should know better, where I'm like, why don't you drink?
That moment of like, what what are you talking about now?
Even though we have done episodes on sobriety before, we've spoken about it, it's still in that moment shocked me that my very initial reaction was what do you mean you don't drink? And then EM went on to explain a little bit about her story, why it was that she became sober curious and ended up deciding to be sober, her battles with alcohol, her battles with anxiety. But what Em said was I attribute so much of my success in life to the fact that I gave up drinking, And that really stuck with me. And she joined us at our live show in Adelaide. It was an amazing conversation and I'm so so excited to have you back here and to finally be able to do a podcast with you.
Emily. We're everyone welcome to lack Bunkers. I was so glad to be here. This has been a long time coming and I've been so keen.
Well, I so deeply loved the conversation that we had at a live show, and I was like, this needs to be for more than just a thousand people.
This needs to be out on the platform. Yeah. I know. It was such an amazing experience being there with you guys in Adelaide and having people come up after and like sharing their story about how much it resonated. It's like, Wow, it's so powerful what you guys are doing. So I'm so glad to be part of that.
Well, what I do think needs to be shared with more than a thousand people is your embarrassing story you're accidentally Oh no, which one, well you can pick, but you told a brilliant one about your unusual gym routine.
Yeah, but that was just with Adelaide, So show I share that again.
I mean, you can tell whatever level of embarrassingness that you feel comfortable with.
But I always think like the worse the better. We got to remember I had a problem with alcohol. I've got a problem with alcohol. So I got I got a truckload of these babies. Yeah, look, okay, I'll tell the other lay one because it's kind of fun. It is. It's also kind of impressive. I think I'm well impressed and I'm jealous. Yeah. So basically, when I first started on Home and Away, I was trying to get really really fit, trying to get a six pack for the bikini scenes, like we all just running on the breading whatever. I don't do that. I do still work out, but not to that like, you know, militant level. Anyway, when I was doing it, I found that there was a machine that you kind of jump up on and you swing your legs up and you crunch. Yeah, and so I think it's called the ab crunch, is it? Yeah? I don't know, is it? Yeah? This is at a gym, though specifically it's not like in the company of your own home. Absolutely not. I don't have a gym. No. It was at a gym, like in public anyway, And I was doing these weights. And I had done that ab crunch. I think that's good. Let's call it that. Yeah, the ab crunch many times before. But this particular day, obviously my abs were getting stronger, and I was like tensing and like, you know, really trying a lot harder. Anyway, I think I was on like rep like thirty five, and by the time I did a rep from thirty five to fifty, I started to feel really weird and like kind of like tingly and also like, oh, what's going on in my lower regions Netherlands.
Neds and in my nether regions and my nether region is part of the world.
Yeah, and I started to feel like, oh my god. And I kept going. I kept kind of pushing through it, and I I came, just to be clear, came came where you're orgasm. I orgasm. I reached climax. You crushed to come. I crushed to come.
That honestly, that'll be the tagline from the cup.
But yeah, so that's what happened. And it was like so weird, and then the embarrassing part and not so embarrassing parties, and God, I feel sorry for anyone who sees me at the gym now, but I now will save that till the end of my workout, just in case, just in case it doesn't happen every time. It doesn't happen every time, but has it happened again since? Yeah?
So you can control your orgasm in the gym that, But you know it's only the power.
I know. I'm sweating because I'm like, God, like, this is so full on that I do this. Yeah, I can. It's the tension of really pushing and trying hard and you continue through the crunch, and it's the motion of it. And it's not like I'm sitting there thinking anything, you know, when you masturbate your thinking about things to like get you there.
I'm not.
It's literally like a physical thing that like crept up on me and happened, and that has happened next second time.
The thing I love about this, though, is that you're like, I save it to the end, like it's a reward.
It's a reward for doing a workout.
He loves to work out, all well, you're not gonna orgasm at the start because it's over.
It's over. It's like, I'll save it to the end. And then I think sometimes I'm like you know, I'm like, oh, trying really hard with the crunches, and like people think I'm just like trying, but actually you're just coming for two minutes. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, this is my favorite. Great but okay, I know we need to move on. Okay, is it the episode happens to a lot of women? Though I do I don't think it does.
I think you are an anomally and it's a very special trait that you have.
But I guess, like I don't want to move on from it. Yeah, I do want im Sorry, do you do it in silence or do you yeah, let it come like you just let it out. I think the first time it happened, I kind of was like oh oh, like oh wow, but like oh like just like oh, you know, and then I guess it's now, so it's not like I'm like silent.
I just not think anyone who's listened to this episode that ever sees you at a gym is going to think of this.
I know, hopefully no one ever finds which you might go to have fun on the app branch. Take me back.
Okay, you've been on Home and Away for quite a while. Hour, but when and how did you get into acting.
Oh good question. So basically I feel like this is such a unique, not a new, unique story. Like I came out the womb sort of wanting to perform, right, just always kind of making my family, putting them through like watching like Christmas shows with me, just like doing fifteen different numbers. So it kind of was always wanting to perform. Then I got into dancing. Then I got into musicals when I was a kid. Yeah, and then I kind of reached puberty and stopped all of that, and I like did singing and piano lessons, like all the things, and I kind of found like boys and drinking and fun and it was no longer cool to be a drama nerd or an arts. Yeah, it just wasn't cool, and I cared about so badly about what people thought. So I just kind of like ditched it, even though it's something that I really really wanted to do. And then it took me until I moved away and went to London for nearly three years. And it was there in London when my drinking was at the height that I kind of decided that, you know, I was going to come back to Australia and pursue acting and performing again. And so yeah, I came back. I got into acting lessons. Then I got into acting school on my first go, which was really really lucky, because that can be really it can be a long process for people. And then I got into theater. I did professional theater for quite a few years, and then worked in donut shops and hospitality to try and break my way into Sydney. Hand in hand, yeah, hand in hand, all of that stuff. And then yeah, and then I auditioned for Home and Away. And after I'd been sober for about six months and I got Home and Away.
Can you tell us, though, how you got Home and Away? Because you originally weren't the one who was going to be auditioning, No, I know.
Okay, So basically, my best friend who I had lived with, Bella. She and I lived with my other best friend as well, Meg, three of us actors living together, trying to make it, trying to crack through, and obviously we all have different agents and different agents and different briefs. Anyway, I'd been into Home and Away a few times for different roles, and I'd gotten pretty close, and then Bella came home and she was like here's the audition brief for Mackenzie and I was like I read it. I was like, oh my god, that's my role, Like that's mine. I want it. And I said to her, can I ask my agent about it? And she was like absolutely, you can, like made the best man win? What a legend. Wow, we're just probably expecting to win. She just probably, yeah, yeah, probably like I'll say the right thing, but yeah. And so I asked my agent. I said, can I audition for Mackenzie Booth? And she was like no, they don't want to see you. I was like what why and she was like they just like they've seen enough of your work this year, Like they don't want to see it. I was like, they don't think you're right for it. Yeah, they don't think they you're right your essence is, you know whatever. I was like, no way, anyway. I hustled annoyed my agent for like a week, called every day. I was like I want to please, can you get me in the rooms? Get me the room, get me in the room, get it Really annoying anyway. She finally got sick with me and was like okay, I'll try and they had a cancelation. Someone was sick so they couldn't make their audition. Can you be there? And I was like yes, and then the rest is history.
How do you go from not even being on the cards for an audition yeah, to changing their minds? So like, how does that flip happen so fundamentally or was it within that one audition that they were like, oh, actually we can see this, Like have they given you that insight?
Oh? Like why they didn't want to see me?
Yeah?
As in like how they went from being like it's definitely not going to be hurt.
Yeah, like all of a sudden after one audition, seeing you in a role that they hadn't even though they'd seen so much of you in that year.
Yeah, it's interesting. I mean, no, I haven't had that. It's a really good conversation I should have with the producers. I mean I knew they liked my work because they were getting me in for particular roles, So I knew that they knew I had capability. I don't know why they didn't see me as Mackenzie. I think maybe I think when I was drinking, so the other times I had auditioned, I kind of like was a bit of a had a bit of a wet blanket over my existence, you know, like I was, which look looking back at old self tapes, I can see it now, like there's just a different energy that comes through, And I think I was sober and I just kind of brought a different energy that I didn't have previously. How did your friend react? A few things here? How did your friend react? Are you still friends? Absolutely? Who was it? Do we know? Who was it? Someone we would know? Well, she's now a musician. She's like gone to do music, and she's an incredibly talented musician and she's on the up and up. But Belleri is one of these like hippie, laid back, free love, really good open human being. And she was like, Babe, it's meant to be you, Like it's all good. That's so lucky. I would not be like that, just so you know, like it's not that cool, especially with.
Like often you think in female relationships, the competition nature that comes in when you're both vying for the similar roles, like the jealousy that can come into play, that's such a rare attribute to find in a friend.
Yeah, and she has taught me and continues to teach me a lot about that. You know, I think I was kind of born with a lot of competitiveness, and then it's kind of, you know, instilled in us to kind of constantly be aware of that. And as I get older, like you know, I really try and steer away from that, Like sometimes it's my first thought, and we don't really have control of our first sought, but we can have control of the second. And I really try and reframe it now, because comparison is the thief of all joy, it is true. Okay, a few acting questions. Do you do you cry on your own? Can you cry on command? Or do you need like the drops of saline? The tear blower? The tear blow which is like a menthal blower that a makeup artist will and it burns your ebal and it burns your eyeball and then all these tears come out. No, I don't. I don't use the tear blower. No, I think, I mean, how deep do you want to go into this? I'll just go I think, ya'll, you'll cut around it. You'll cut around it because I'm long winded and I'm trying not to do. But basically, I think for me, one of the biggest attractions to me and acting growing up is that I didn't often feel comfortable in real life to be vulnerable just due to family situations. There was you know, kind of violence in the house and things like that. I felt very repressed, and so when I started to do acting, I recognized that I could use kind of the repressed sadness and anger and fuel it in a way in a space that I had permission to do it, and it was actually utilized and you know, rewarded basically. So that's kind of how it started for me, Like the ability to be vulnerable, that was the initial attraction. Now obviously playing McKenzie and having to cry very often, there is like a process that I go through. If I know it's a really big scenes like scenes throughout the day, I really try and get into like the thing that's underneath that connects me to Mackenzie. So if like she's upset about if there's a grief, it's like, okay, when have I experienced grief? Like what does grief feel like? Where does it sit in my body? And I kind of do like a breathe, I just breathe into it, breathe into it, breathe into it. You know, and if she's lonely, like loneliness, Like the thing is something about loneliness really gets me, Like if I feel really lonely and really scared and just kind of trying to mold those two worlds together. It is a technique that you kind of everyone's different, but you kind of hone it and like train it over time and it does become easier.
How do you find and I guess you may not have anything to compare it to since I thing's been such.
A big part of your life.
Yeah, but in terms of dating and being an actress, yes, have you ever experienced like how do people interpret that and how do they react to that? Because there's obviously scenes that for some people would make them insecure or for other people they're like are you acting now?
Is this the real you? Like are you really tummy? Yeah? You're so quiet?
I don't know.
I mean, did you go to the gym today?
And totally there must be some people who may be intimidated by the career of acting.
Yeah, I mean absolutely, And like actors, we're all different, but like we are, like we're pretty dramatic, you know, there's a lot of things that go on. I mean people that I've dated, I always take my hat off to them because I would find it even being an actress an actor, I would find it hard watching someone i'm in love with like hook up and go to bed with on screen quote unquote with someone else. I mean, it really is for me. It's such a choreography. But you know, and there's nothing like I haven't had an experience where I've you know, wanted to date a coast or anything like that. I've been really lucky in that way, because I think that can be really hard. But yeah, no, I think it is intimidating probably for some people. But the people that I have dated, it's kind of I don't know, they kind of understand it. And you know, there definitely has been I would be lying to say, like there hasn't been people I've dated who haven't been insecure about it. But I try and just kind of keep it really open and honest and like if you have any questions, I know it's fucking weird, like come and ask me, you know, like you can meet the people I'm working with, like there's nothing because it is like it's an odd thing as I'm sure as like a romantic partner to experience, so yeah, you know, and with the whole like are you acting now? Like are you crying?
Yeah?
I mean there have been plenty of arguments in people with people that I've dated with, They're like, oh is this just you acting? Oh really? And I'm like, yeah, like good one, Yeah you using the acting card. So yeah, I mean it comes up, but I'm like whatever, because I act all day of my life as a job. I really crave authenticity as soon as I step off A said, So it's like the most real version of me is when I'm like not on set, Like it's just because you can't live in that space too long. It's just not good for you because it's not real. So it's all brand. I'm just I'm literally playing dress up every day. Like sometimes I walk around on set and I'm like, I've just got like little shoes, like these high heels on a little top in a house that's not really real. It's just it's like we're all just little barbies, like walking around make believe. It's all make believe. You know, it's incredibly fun, but it's also like, oh, wow, like this is I still have Yeah, I still have pinchb moments. Where I'm like, this is just we're just on a set pretending to be people. It's wild.
And I so deeply want to talk about your journey towards sobriety and like what your relationship was like to alcohol in your twenties, because I think the big thing is is for most of us, we see our twenties and you know, eighteen nineteen, it's like the time of binge drinking. It's not deemed as there being any issue if you do party hard or you do you know, drink to excess.
It's kind of just like a right of passage.
For a lot of people, it's almost applauded, right, Like you know, man, I passed out on the weekend, you know, teenage friends and I was like, oh fucking that was crazy.
You know, like that's sorry everyone.
There's no one that looks at that time or it's very rare to go, Okay, I have this is a problem. I mean, most people justify it as though you're either the life of the party or it's part and parcel of.
Being in your twenties. What was that experience like for you? Yeah, exactly that it was just that thing of I just remember being so excited to start drinking. My mother, bless her. I guess she was worried of what happened to happen, because it happened. But you know, she was super super strict on me, so I wasn't like the kid at home who was like, you're allowed like two cruises if you go to this party in grade ten. It was like you are not allowed anything ever, No, which kind of inflamed more of a rebellious streak in me anyway, So I was like on the hunt. And I'd always remembered always always having such an excitement about booze, like something around it. And I think that's just being young, but even from a very young age, like like five or six, just being like I want that wine, like I want I want to try from six, yeah, Like I just remember like asking my mom if like you know how your parents had a wine. There'd be like a little bit left. I'd be like, can I try it? Can I try it? I'd really want to try it all the time, and she'd be like no, like stop asking me, which is just weird, like so weird that your mum was worried about you. Is when you wear our collsage, you're six, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, so weird, so weird. And then her dad was anarcolic, so so weird. But anyway, I quickly was just like right into it, like right into it with everyone from like thirteen fourteen and just going hard. And what I noticed is I could out drink everybody. The amount that I could drink was just a lot, and I would never ever vomit. But when you say you could out drink everyone, like, what was it that you were doing? That was then a problem?
Like cause if you're like it was fine, I was, you know, I could drink more than them, but I was still no.
It was a personality shift that kind of got worse as I got older. When I was younger, I guess it was more disguised and like this is all new and this is all fun and we're all being dramatic, and it laid dormant, like the well of the problem itself until I got a bit older. But when I say older, I mean like, you know, seventeen. But basically what would happen is I'd be life for the party, up on the tables, thinking I'm Beyonce, and then like one drink over and then I'm the devil, like I'm on the sniff for a fight. I want to like fight with people. I'm trying to be below the belt, like with my best friends, randoms, anyone, anyone. If I was in that mood and someone came into my line of sight that it was on, it's nuts. It's nuts to think about now.
When you say you're egging for a fight, you mean a physical fight, or you were just like a bit of a bitch to be around.
It started off being a bit of a bitch to be around. But I guess the more things that were chaotic in my life, it depended on like the scale of how much I would unleash when I drank. I wasn't looking for a physical fight, no, I mean that was a result of some of the times when I was being such an asshole when I was drinking. Naturally, people like shut the fuck up. But that was a result. But it wasn't that. It was more wanting to have like a sparring emotional fight, you know, just an emotional fight, like I wanted to spray anger and make people feel bad because I felt so bad inside. Did you ever put yourself in a dangerous or unsafe situation countless times. Seriously, by the grace of the universe, I don't even know how in some of the situations I put myself in, not only in this country, but overseas. I've troubled the world, Like I've traveled Europe. You know, I've been in the middle of Greece, like waking up in like a garden bed and no one can find me for like twelve hours because I started to have Bloody Mary's at like nine o'clock in the morning, and by three o'clock in the afternoon, I'd passed out and no one could find it. Like just crazy stuff to happen all the time.
But you know, like you described this idea of you would have that one drink and then you had this like personality change, and your version of it is extreme, but I would go so far as to say that a lot of people had that. Like if you've nicknamed your alter ego, you're drinking alter ego, then there's a flip. And like when I was in my twenties, it was ra ra. I know you have an alter ego name true prow Prue. It's not someone you want to mess with.
Psycho brew to ego. I didn't have one.
Yeah, but I also think I mean, you know, in the conversations that we've had, Brit, like, you've never really gone through a period of your life where you've had a problem with drinking.
No, I absolutely haven't. And that's what I mean.
Yeah, which is why it's fascinating. But I probably would call it gigi anyway. Okay, that's what I fit in. I probably call it gig though, yeah, if I did right.
What I take from that, though, even though yours is like such an extreme version of it, is like so many people do tip over that mark and then they pick fights with their boyfriends or they pick fights with their girlfriends. And I don't mean in a necessarily overtly aggressive way, but they're passive aggressive. They say things that are nasty that they don't know why they've said them, and the next day they wake up and their partner's like, hey, you were not cool.
Last night, and you're like, sorry, I guess I'll try not to do that again.
But then the behavior repeats itself absolutely, And I know for me, like it became an issue in my relationships. It was the people who I was dating in my life who would say, I don't like the way that you are when you drink.
It's not nice to be around.
And it took me a really long time to get to a place where I realized actually I was the problem, not them.
When I was drinking. When did you have the revelation that something was wrong, that this wasn't fun anymore? Yeah, it's so funny. It's like that thing, isn't it. Like you're the last to find out that it's you, you know what I mean, Like everyone else need And the truth is people would say to me all the time, you need to stop. My friends tried to have interventions like I ruined that many family Christmases, like you know, but again it was under the guys of like, you're twenty five, and I was like, I'm twenty five. Yeah, And so I kind of just fobbed it off. Every time someone tried to be serious about it with me, I'd be like, I'll get over it now, I'm not. And I was in just such denial. I was just in such denial that I really didn't think it was the alcohol that was the problem. You know. I'd go as far as say I would attribute it to like anxiety, to like trauma, and all those things are underneath the surface of alcoholism for me. But alcohol only exacerbated them, it didn't clear them out. It actually made them worse. But i'd gotten back from overseas. I was dating someone the time, I'd had a plethora of like really bad instances all happened, you know, like ruined family Christmas, ruined my relationship with my cousin for a while. You know. There were things that had happened across like a short period of time. And I'd had a fight with my partner at the time, and I was very much inebriated. I had blackout, like I didn't remember what happened, but I had ended up at my mom's house. There was like a physical altercation between us, nothing extreme, just like me trying to leave them trying to make me stay, me being like I want to go, and blah blah blah blah blah. And then there was a physical thing trying to get out the door. And then I ended up at my mom's house and I tried to pick a like verbal fight with her and she was just like, you know, go the fuck to bed, like I can't. And I just remember in the morning, it was like a Tuesday, do you know what I mean, it's like a fucking Tuesday. And it makes me so sad to think about, just like to what I put my mom through, having to see her daughter like with a problem, and you know, and she'd had experience that growing up as well, and it's just so scary anyway, And she came into my room that morning and she kind of looked at me this weird epiphany where I was an old lady in my dream that morning, which sounds really hippy dippy, but it happens to be true. And it was like me drinking a muggt a piano by myself with gray hair and talking to myself, this is a dream that you had that night and you were that morning. So my mum opened the door in the morning, like looked in, looked at me with disappointed eye, shut the door. Then I went back into that like half micro sleep, and yeah, it was this thing where I was like at a piano and the like camera like zoomed out, like if I'm the perception, it zoomed out and there's this old woman talking to herself, laughing, and no one's around. She's by herself talking to herself because she's gone nuts. And it was like me as an older woman, and would you say you were an alcoholic? One hundred percent? I am an alcoholic. It's that thing, being an alcoholic. You don't recover fully. It's there's no cure for alcoholism. You have a day to day reprieve and you commit to sobriety and you do things to counteract the alcoholism. But I am definitely an alcoholic. Yeah.
When you wake up from a dream like that and you had this epiphany, yeah, because I think for a lot of people there's this back and forth in terms of like trying to be sober, going back to drinking, trying to be sober. When you kind of had that realization and you can say, like I am an alcoholic, When was it that you understood and learned that that means that's forever. That doesn't mean you take a break and then you go back to it. How did you learn Okay, well this is me and this is what I'm dealing with and this is a long term problem.
Such a great question. It's a weird thing because I kind of stopped drinking that day because I was like I felt everyone pulling away from me. I felt my partner pulling away from me, my friends, my mom. Like I'd felt like people don't want to be around me anymore, and so I kind of made a commitment that day to like not drink, and then I started to have a really good time because people liked me more, people wanted to be around me. And now when you have alcoholism, they say, you know, it's you have a big ego, low self esteem, but it's covered by this big bravard. So people liking me and being like you're back, we love you, Look how funny you are. You didn't need to drink, you know. I rode that way for a long time. It wasn't until only in recent times actually, like in the last couple of years that I had a nervous breakdown in sobriety. Like I had a nervous breakdown and I wasn't committed to working a recovery program. I kind of just had stopped drinking. But the thing about alcoholism is alcohol is the medicine, right, Like it keeps what you think calm and sane because you're feeling so out of control. What I was, I can only speak of my experience, but what I didn't treat was the disease of alcoholism which is the disease of thinking. It's the way your mind thinks. It's addictive, it's compulsive, it's obsessive, it's an obsessive nature. And so my alcoholism drifted because it wasn't being treated with recovery. And by that I mean a twelve step program. By that, I mean you know, seeking help like all of those things. And I wasn't doing that. I was just abstaining from actually drinking. And so my alcoholic thing went into heaps of different avenues.
What were they like, So the way I'm interpreting this is like, yeah, you have an addictive personality and you channel that addiction into something else.
Yeah. And so for that it was my weight became a huge thing. I was working out three hours a day, I was counting calories and I was like, this is amazing because I'm just thinking I'm killing it. And also, we live in a world where they're like, you're skinny, amazing, You're beautiful, total beautiful, You're an actually look at you look so good. You've lost too much weight. Oh my god. I meanwhile, like, you're starving, but you never so much reinforcement. Yeah, but I actually did that thing where and it's so sad like as women, right, like we just fuck man. I would be excited by the prospect of the hunger feeling because it meant that my stomach was shrinking. Yeah, I was excited by that.
It's so hard to fight against that when you have so many people affirming how good you look. And I think that there's so many people who are listening to this who will relate to the fact that potentially the unhealthiest they were was when everyone was telling them that they looked.
The best undred percent definitely for me, but that's the thing, I didn't know that that was my alcoholism kind of trying to like sneak out into that right so, and I thought it was healthy. I'm running every day, right like, I'm getting all these accolades. And I was so green in the industry too, like this entertainment industry. If you don't have good mentors, good people to look up to you, you can really get away with you really quickly. And then obviously one of my big ones and it's still what I work on now, is codependency. I'm a co co koe is I'm a koe. I'm a coco koe. So yeah, learning about that particular behavior in kind of love and love addiction, but also just that codependency, like only knowing how I am through how my partner is that kind of shadowing stuff like that. Yeah, so that's also something that it came out in during that time. And then when I had a nervous breakdown, my therapist at the time was like, I think you might be suffering from being a dry drunk, which is someone who is an alcoholic but doesn't actually deal with the alcoholism in an emotional way. What did that manifest?
Like when you say, you know, you went through a breakdown for you and you're dealing with anxiety, like, well.
What happened? So weird? So weird. So basically I just one day stopped sleeping in terms of insomnia or yet choosing not to no no no. I literally I went to bed one night and I felt like I couldn't sleep and I didn't have a good night's sleep. But rather than it just being like that thing when you're like I'm not having a good sleep, like who cares, I became I woke up and I felt sick and like I couldn't I was like, ha, but if I don't sleep again because I know, da da da da repetitive thought and like the anxiety, like the cortisol that was running through my body at the time. And this is the thing about the body, right, like the body tells the truth. It was like my system, I was burnt out. I was in a relationship that I wasn't thriving in. I was acting against my values in a lot of situations. I was basing a lot of my decisions based on fear. I was very body like A lot was going on, and I think my whole system just got enough of the bully within and was like pay attention, bitch. And it did that through the vice of me not being able to sleep. So I actually had my full attention on, like I can't sap, I can't sleep, and I have anxiety anyway, and so when I couldn't sleep, I was like, what's going on, what's going on? I'm going crazy, Like why can't I sleep? And then that cortisol like became a cycle, and it was like just worried about sleeping, couldn't sleep, anxious about being anxious. Like this whole repetitive thing happened, having insomnia about being an insomniac, you know, and so it was just this crazy looping cycle and it was wild. It was the wildest six months.
When we were at the Adelaide Live show, you spoke about how you had almost like sobriety had become part of your identity. You were like, I'm a sober on now and you know, everyone congratulates you, and it's kind of like you wore it as a bit of a not a badge of honor. I don't want to say, but like it does become part of your identity to be able to say that with pride. But you mentioned that you had a moment where even though you had been sober for so long and you went through this period that you woke up feeling like you needed to have a drink this one day.
Yeah, for me becoming more aware of what kind of mental illness that I suffer with really and still it's hard to accept, Like it's hard to accept. There are times where I'm like, and this is part of the alcoholism. So I'm like, am I, Like, am I not? Do I really have anxiety? Like do like you know, like do I? It's like no, the evidence is overwhelmeding, you know, but I still have days where I don't want to accept it. I don't want to be someone who's sick or unwell or have a disease, right, Like, it's really hard.
Well, even on a base level, humans don't want to admit or accept that we are flawed or they are have flaws.
Yeah. Absolutely, And now I can honestly say I'm a grateful alcoholic, Like I'm grateful that I'm have anxiety because it's given me so much more compassionate. It's made me wake up and get to know myself in so many ways. But back to your question, because I know I get lost. Yeah, there was a particular time when I was in this suffering, like this emotional turmoil, not being able to sleep, very depressed, anxious, all of that, and I thought, well, if it doesn't shift, I could always drink. You know, if it doesn't shift, it can always drink. And also I used to have this thing where I really recognized with a friend of mine when we're having a chat and she went, so do you think you'll like never drink again? And I was like, you know, to be honest, if I get nominated for an Academy award, I'm gonna rent out a hotel room, put all the blinds down and like get fucking wasted, And that's the disease, Like it was a reward, like the thing that nearly fucked up my life. If I got something that I really wanted, I would destruct it by getting fucked up, So you know what I mean.
But the thing is as well, is when you've used and it's almost like I think about my relationship with alcohol in my twenties, and it was that I was insecure. Yeah, it made me feel confident and I felt like I was the life of the party, and it made me be able to do the things that I don't think I could have done with it. And so then what do you do when you take it away? You have to deal with all the things and all the insecurities that are there that you've been using alcohol to masks, and so how do you then deal with that when you're like, cool, I don't have this blanket anymore.
I have to deal with the anxiety.
I have to deal with all of these things that this has been cloaking, and yes it's been creating more problems, but I haven't had to deal with it when I'm the life of the party.
How do you deal with that? It's really hard. It's really really fucking hard, and that's just that has been my experience. But the thing is the alcohol, the substance, whatever it was, right like, whatever it was on the go, that was just putting me a step away from ever actually dealing with the actual problem, with the insecurity, with the unworthiness, with the social anxiety, with the not feeling enough. Like the alcohol masked that for me and it made me feel really calm and great and loud. But as soon as you take that away, you then have to look inward like what am I doing and why am I doing it? And where is this coming from? And you have to reflect and seriously, that is hard stuff. A lot of stuff came up for me, and a lot of stuff comes up for a lot of people. Which is why I strongly advise if you are listening to this and you do think you have a problem, do not do that alone. You know what I mean, Like, have support around you. There are so many free services, so much you can research and do. And you know, taking that inward journey of sobriety when you have to feel your feelings and you can't escape them and you have to understand where they have come from that's a really big, brave, courageous journey. But on the other side of that pain is freedom, more freedom. I have more freedom now than I ever had when I was drinking. I have more freedom now, you know, And that is because I had to look at the problems, and I continue to look at the problems, and I continue to go in there with adequate support around me and look and talk and communicate all of that with people, you know. And I don't have many secrets anymore, you know, I don't like I was a really I was. You're as sick as your secrets. Like I had a lot. I had a lot built up, a lot repressed, and a lot I couldn't talk about. I don't feel that way anymore.
You've mentioned a few times about this anxiety that's really it's ugly head. But where did that come from and when did it start? And what I mean by that is was that something that preceded the alcoholism and the drinking and something you always battled or is it a byproduct of the alcoholism?
I definitely so. When I had my first anxiety attack at nineteen, I was already drinking then, so the drinking had already started. I don't think the anxiety was a result. Well it could have been. Actually, it could have been a result of the partying and the drinking. But I also had OCD as a child, and I still have ocd's another things. Yeah, so I had that as a kid. I know, this is just a really fun mixed bag. It's actually no, but it's just like, what doesn't she have? No?
But it's because these things are all linked. They are all anxiety, they all live within the same family.
They actually are, they actually are. That is such a good point.
And so you also get to orgasm when everyone on demanding exactly like you can't exactly, you can't take it.
I don't have it, and I'm left handed creative. Yeah, we're only nine percent of the world. It's hard. You can't write a birthday card anyway. So I had OCD as a kid, and then I didn't know what that was. Everyone just laughed at me because I was doing weird stuff, like blinking twenty three times before I got off the bus. I mean it was really cool. That is strange. It was strange and like just weird things. Yeah, and my parents didn't know what the fuck was going on with me. I didn't know what was going on with me. It's just one of those things that you just do because I was trying to control. I felt so out of control that I was trying to control the outside anyway. And then that kind of continued. I got more sneaky with my OCD, and so it wasn't as overt because obviously I didn't want people to like, not like me or not hang around me. I think the anxiety was already there due to the OCD. But I think when I was nineteen and I had my first panic attack, that was after a very big night weekend of drinking, and I didn't know what was happening. I thought I had toxic shock syndrome from my tampon because I'd left my tampon in too long. You know, when you did that, you were clubbing, and you're like, I'm going to die. I was like, oh my god. Mom called the ambulance, like I'm dying, like I've got toxic shock. And she looked at me and she didn't know what the fuck to do, and she called the ambulance, and the ambulance came to the house. After my first panic attack, one of the guys lit a cigarette cause he's like, you're not dying, You've just had an anxiety attack. I was like, what's that. He's like, you just you've just got anxiety. I was like, what is that? What is that? But also there was no conversation around it. Then there was no conversation, and I went to a psychiatrist and she said to me, do you have anxiety in the family. I'm like nah, She's like, so no one in your family suffers from anxiety. I was like, no, what is this? And she goes, do you have alcoholism in your family? I was like everywhere. She's like, there it is, That's what it is. Everyone. No one doesn't have it. I was like, what do you mean and she's liked, well, then everyone, you know people drink to mask their anxieties, Like that is something that happens, not all people, but that is what happened. So when the anxiety diagnosis happened, rather than stopping drinking, I drank more because I was like, I don't want to have a panic attack, Like I don't have another panic attack and everywhere, So I to cure the amount of quarters all running through my body, I just drink more. And that's when the drinking really went WII.
So when you got to this point where you were like, this is you know, because you've almost had like two separate revelations. You had the revelation of I'm going to stop drinking. Then you had the revelation of, like, no, this is I have just diverted the issue into another part of my body, and this is what it is that I'm dealing with. What was the next steps? Like, how do you then go I can't do this on my own? Was it a Google search? How do you then build a community around you that takes care of you?
Such a good question. I was really fortunate, like people were put in my path at the exact right time who had good, strong recovery and a good strong program. Just by chance that happened, and so I was kind of led towards a recovery program and it absolutely changed and saved my life. It is a big commitment. I had to really like commit to my recovery. I had to put it first, you know, and I had to do those things. But in terms of I mean, there's not there was seriously not a self help book. I haven't like cited or like a monk. I don't know you know, like I really went through like a transitional period of wanting to understand more about my internal life and like why I suffer the things that I suffer, and how I can best nurture myself and things like that. So there is one hundred percent. And when I refer to these recovery programs, due to the anonymity of them, they are available online. You can do a simple Google search about any kind of addiction that you're suffering with, and you'll be directly led to where you need to go, which is a community of people who are like minded and want the same thing to kind of live a sober life.
Did you ever have a moment, being that you're in your twenties at the time, where you were like, this is too young and this is something that feels shameful or feels embarrassing to talk to my friends about.
One hundred percent. I was so distracted, That's the thing. I didn't even I was so asleep, you know what I mean, Like I was so not awake to what was actually going on with me. And I was so angry. God, I was angry. I was an angry girl, and so yeah, I I didn't want to show any vulnerability. I didn't want to say, like I'm scared, what's wrong with me? I have with thoughts sometimes like I tap the light and I do wit, you know what I mean, Like I didn't. I was running away from everything that I was like, and what I was was just a really scared, really scared little girl, you know. And she still lives inside of me, unless she lives in all of us. But she just wasn't getting the nurturing that she needed. And part of that nurturing is being able to say, like I'm scared, and I couldn't do that because I was just masking the opposite, like I'm hard, I'm tough, I'm you know, and I just wanted to be the fucking rock and roll like yeah, I did across me, you know, like I wanted people to fear me because I was so fucking scared of everyone. Because we see vulnerability too as a weakness totally.
We see the second somebody cries or admits that they need help they have a problem, yeah, which is completely inaccurate. That's the way we always present ourselves like I don't need I'm the strong one, I'm the rock of the family.
On friendship, I don't need help, do you reckon?
The biggest misconceptions are around alcoholism, because I feel like the first thing you think of when you hear the word alcoholic is somebody elderly on a park bend on a park bench in a paper bag that you know they've got teeth missing, and like, you know, that's what I feel like most people initially go.
To yeah, yeah, and seriously, like we're all a sneeze away from that arsatics No, but it is like it's fascinating, Like even for myself, I thought the same thing. I was like an alcoholic. That's like an old person who, like you know it, doesn't have that shit together. But no, it's the biggest misconception. It really is like I was an alcoholic from a very young age. And what needs to happen is people who are comfortable with talking about their sobriety should talk about their sobriety because it looks like so many different things, you know, it really really does. And the thing with alcoholism specifically is like it only gets worse, you know, if it's not treated like it doesn't. Alcoholism doesn't ever really often get better, and if it does, it's very minute. So if you ask someone who feels like you might have a problem, like, no, I'm investigating.
And also like I think if you're someone who feels like they have a problem, it's probably also because you've been told by the people who care about you that you have a problem with it, like it affects your relationships more than anything. But when you say that, like, the first thing that comes to mind for me is this idea of like mummy wine culture. Like when you think of you think of an alcoholic, and you do think of this like person who's destitute. They're homeless, they're you know, like they don't have anything around them, and they're going and buying a bottle of bourbon in the middle of the day. But my exposure now as being a mum is people who you would not think are alcoholics who have kids and who are working from home and just have been picking up a drink from ten am in the morning, yeah, pouring themselves a wine. And like, I guess for me, they have been the most surprising conversations I've had and really thinking, like because you have three little kids, like how are you in this situation?
But I think it's an illness that doesn't discriminate one hundred percent. And there's a really good quest. And I think it was Viola Davis who said it, Oh queen, a queen, I mean, oh my god. And it was something about human beings problems, right, like there are rich people and there are poor people, and everybody has the same problems, everybody. It's just that poor people don't have the resources to mask it. Yeah, And that's the same with addiction. It's so true. It's just the problem, the diagnosis, the disease. It is the same whether you are from the low socioeconomic whether you're from the high. But if you're up here, you are more of a functioning alcoholic because you have the resources to cover it. That's it. It doesn't mean you don't have a problem. It really doesn't. And I say that with compassion, but it is that thing like you know, alcoholism, addiction, any of these things. This is not just for people who are of a certain class. This is for everyone. And just because you may be able to have an assistant to pick you up in the morning or you know, it doesn't mean if you're drinking in a way to mask something, if you're drinking to hide, if you're drinking to numb if you're you know, the intention is why you're ting. It's for everyone, Like, it really affects everybody.
So if there's somebody, let's listening right now that loves to drink, they sometimes binge drink, they're listening and they're like, well, am I an alcoholic? Like what's the difference between being an alcoholic and actually having a problem and just really loving to do the life of the party and loving that feeling totally?
What is that line? What would you say? It's really hard? I mean, And I see, I can only speak on my experience because I think people come to the recognition of having a problem through so many different things, a variety of different ways. This doesn't apply to everyone. There are so many people, so many of my friends and family who can drink and have the best time, you know, and that's great, Like they just don't suffer with this thing. But I'll speak on myself, Like I knew that there was a problem because I would wake up and have so much shame, hot and cold sweats, just this like really deep internal like sick. I felt ill, like I felt emotionally spiritually like sick with who I had been the night before. The things that I would do were so outrageous, and just because I had that jeckyline hide thing where I was like two different people and you like have to call around and be like what did I say? What did I do last night? And I think that was a really I was so fortunate because that was so obvious there was something wrong. But that doesn't mean all alcoholics are jeckyl and Hyde either. You know, people can just drink to excess, People can just feel socially anxious and numb and then they can't kind of stop. There is so many different ways that you can come to this realization and it's really hard. And what you said to Laura about people noticing around you, like people who love you, that's always a good indicator too, But it's really about the individual and how they come to it. You know. I was just actually quite fortunate that mine was so obvious.
Well, what has been the impacts on your life since you have stopped drinking? And since not just stopping drinking, but finding a solution that is helping you manage all the aspects in which you can kind of then funnel this into.
My life without alcohol. There's absolutely no way that there really and I mean that there is no way that I could do what I do now if I had been drinking, if I was drinking, because that was my main that was my whole life was when can I get the next drink? When can I relieve myself of being in this head in this but like when can I escape it? And what I do now? I can be present. I mean I still, you know, have other things I can get stracted by, but like I can be present, I can be real with myself and I'm on the pursuit of being really authentic like I can't. There's just no way that if I was drinking that I would be as fortunate as I've been to have the career I've had this far. But and career is one thing, right, But just like the person I am, I feel like I really thought, you know, my alcoholism led me down a path of really feeling like I was a bad person, deeply bad, like deeply unworthy, deeply like messed up, fucked up all that, like I'm crazy and if anyone comes too near me or gets to know me too much, they'll know and they'll abandon me. And that this journey of recovery and sobriety has allowed me to go into all of that, and I no longer feel that way about myself. You know, there are days, oh my god, like we're women of a patriarchy, like hello, Like it's not all fucking great, but I'm much more in the realm of liking myself, which is huge, Which is huge because it changes everything and also the impacts on your relationships around you one hundred percent. Yeah, Like I've been able to be there for people in a real way, Like I'm not manipulating or conniving or I mean, I still have my bad days, but the people I choose to surround my energy with too, And like a lot of people for by the wayside, right like when you stop drinking, like when you stop a certain behavior, a lot of relationships that once used to be really buoyant now no longer serve you. And that's okay. Like it doesn't mean that they're wrong, It doesn't mean anyone's wrong. It just means that I'm now more not selective. But I really try and put my energy towards people who kind of feel the same way about life as I do. Not in terms of sobriety, all my friends drink I just mean in terms of the kinds of people they are on the inside and sometimes addiction can you can hang around some pretty interesting folk.
Well, I also think when you're in that space of drinking, you hang around with people who enable your ability to do it. They're the people who want to go out and party. They're the people who and that's what the friendships are built on. So then when you stop, you have no reason to spend time with them because they're not wanting to go and do the bond at Ronty Walk.
You know, no one wants to go see sculptures by the scene.
Apparently, what's a commonality out with anyone? Because we we have a commonality. You don't ask your friend that loves to surf if they want to go play tennis when they hate tennis and then they want to surf.
You ask the friend that loves tennis like you.
Ask You might, you might ask them to play tennis that's still a sport, but you might not ask them to go and get a bag on a Saturday.
You know, well I would never ask anyone, But you know what I mean, Like that is the commonality. It's what bonds you together. But it's so interesting when we say that, right, because I think about this a lot, like what bonds you together? Commonality is like tennis and like whatever, Like I.
Don't know why I had that analogy by the way, you know, surfing tennis.
I'm like, no, it was good. But in terms of, you know, commonality of being drinking, Like I was talking to my friend the other day and We're talking about colism and he was like, oh, yeah, I'm going away with the boys this weekend. And I'm like, yeah, cool, cool cool. He's like, you know, we were talking about drinking and stuff, and I said, could you go away with a group of men and not drink? Like could you as all men who go on away in a boys strip? Could you not drink? Could you not do drugs? Could you just actually be? And he's like absolutely, no fucking way, yeah, because what would they do like comba, what would they do? And so what is that? So it is bonding people together, but it's not actual bonding. It needs a permission slip to do things or to say things that can be not taken as seriously, or you can show parts of yourself. You know, there is when people drink, they do show some sides of themselves that they would another wise show and it would add back. It is exactly that. It is a permission slip.
You're like, well, my inhibitions are lowered, so I can tell you all the things about myself that otherwise if I was to tell you these things when I was completely so, but you might.
Think I'm weird.
Yes, but you're sharing and I'm sharing, and it becomes this mutual space and I do think most people who have experienced it would agree. Like you go out for a drink with someone who was an acquaintance and then you have a big night and at the end of it you're best friends and it changes that relationship really. So it's like for a lot of people, they use it as a binding agent, you know, for their friendship totally. And it's so interesting, isn't it us as human beings? It's like, why isn't it enough just to be here? Like why do we need the bonding agent? And I'm not saying don't do it. I just find it so interesting.
Why you know, you're all best mates, you're going away on a trip together, but there's no way you could do it if you weren't drinking. So are you best mate? You know, just all these human needs that we have, we kind of neglect them, and so we numb out the feelings or we numb to reconnect to those feelings. And I think booze is kind of that lubricant for those kind of connections. And I just find it, really it's so interesting. It's so interesting, and it's not bad or good or here and nor there. But I'm so glad that I can say, like, I don't need to have a drink to connect with the people I love, Like I just I've done enough work that I don't need that anymore. And it's interesting when you you don't have to tell us, but actually you are you dating? I'm dating? Oh yeah, I'm dating.
One person exclusively or just just you know, just dating.
I'm not. I don't really spread my wings too far, like I don't. Is this a riddle. We're trying to work this out. Okay, I'm sort of dating. It's something that's not solidified. It's just h yeah, the doors. Yeah, you can tell us off, Mike.
So when you have been dating previously, slash, when you met your person, now, do you find it difficult because I feel like the go to here is hey, hey, you wanna grab a drink, like, let's catch up for a drink.
That seemed to be the go to for dating.
What has the response been like when someone someone asked you for drinking, You're like, I don't drink.
Yeah, yeah, it's literally that, like, ID don't worry. But also, okay. When I first got sober, I was working Do you guys are the imperial in Yeah? Yeah, okay, so I worked. I ran Priscilla's down there, so I kind of exposed myself to the world of alcohol, Like I was working in bas but sober, but sober, so I like, through exposure to that, I don't have a weird thing being around people who drink, which is one of the best things I ever did in my recovery, is like to not fear the bottle itself. So when people say, you know, hey, do you want to go for a drink? I say, oh my god, toads, let's go for a drink. I don't drink, don't care if you drink. Obviously, I don't have any interest in dating someone with a drinking problem, but it doesn't bother me if they want to drink. But generally, you know, if they're cool and legit. They'll be like, oh no, we don't have to go for a drink, let's go for a coffee instead, or you know, lah la lah. I'm like, yeah, great, so but it kind of works that way. But I'm very upfront with them.
I feel like it's a really great way of just weeding out people instantly. Like if people have a problem with it, then they're not going to be the right people for you. Like it's a pretty clear cut way of navigating who were worth investing your time in totally.
And I have this saying now too. It's like, if I tell the truth, I can't get that sick, do you know what I mean? So if I just can be straight up and just be like.
That was gonna ask do you feel like on a first date or very early on you have to explain your past and what you've gone through and how you've gotten to where you are in a form of not just letting them know, but almost a form of protection for yourself, Like this is what I'm in through. Yeah, if you're going to be this heavy party animal, that's going to be probably not great for my life.
Like we'll wed that out now. Do you feel like you need to be really upfront with them early on. I mean I kind of gauge it, you know, like I wouldn't sit there and probably go through all my trauma. But like if I yeah, like you know, so OCD blinking twenty three times in the bus led to you know, also can come at the gym. So that love that. Yeah, yeah, no I don't. I kind of yeah, like if it comes up, I'm more than happy to talk about it. I kind of have like ritted out any shame around my story, like it's something I still continue to do. But I kind of yeah, it doesn't phaze me. It's enough to know like that I don't drink, and if they have questions, I have answers. But you know, I guess they can gauge probably from me being like I don't drink that if they're a party animal, they ain't going to cause it's not the right person. And then a second day and that's okay with me, you know. And that's something you naturally will find out along the way too, you know, like you just yeah, you just find it out.
Well.
I love that you are coming on and sharing it and to reiterate that there is no need to have any shame. And I know you've moved past that, but if it's anyone that's listening that does feel that, I imagine that is an emotion that most people in your situation would feel at some point, and it is something you moved through. But you coming on and speaking so openly about what you've been through your OCD, your alcoholism.
Was going to come up that with that fun for everyone. Sneaky little bagg of always trips up when you crep up on you. Yeah, and he just didn't here blinking right now, No, But I mean I just thought you were sleeping. This is.
It's these sorts of conversations that change like it changes the face of it. Because the reason why people feel shameful is because exactly that image that we spoke about, that picture that we all have of what constitutes someone who's an alcoholic, and so nobody who doesn't identify with that wants to believe that they could possibly have those issues or could possibly be dealing with those things. And so I agree with what you said earlier in it it's so important for people of all walks of life to talk about it because it just gives a face too and allows people to go maybe this is what I'm dealing.
With totally, and when I was younger or whatever, ajo, I don't even have to be younger, you know, if you're just someone who is curious or questioning or whatever, Like it's so nice to have people in the public forum who go, yeah, I have this thing and it's okay and there's it's workable and all that kind of stuff. And I also just want to like, I feel like at points of this podcast, you know, I'm not at all shaming people who drink, like if you can not all come across that road, because it really like alcohol, yeah good, because alcohol should be enjoyed by those who can do it. And still to this day it wasn't my lot in life, but you know, and hopefully not the lifetime it will be. But you just, you know, there's absolutely no shame if you're someone who enjoys a fucking party, like, good on you man, Like that's.
Awesome, and thank you so much for coming, and during the podcast, we absolutely adore you.
Oh I love you guys so much. Thank you so grateful to do it. Oh my god, it's been my pleasure. I'm so good to have you, like talk to have you both it's good to have both on my podcast. He the company.
Baba counter.
The company a bamacuta, A welcome that day, the day, the
