My grandma and your grandma was sitting bad fire, my grandma to your grandma, I'm gonna say, on fire, it's bad hine like glo, Jagomo, Jagomo, Get do less. Culture Girl, Pop the corks, pop the corks HINTI, Oh my goodness, we are here. It's the last culture podcast. To my right, you can't say it, but he is on my right. Let me tell you it's about And to my other right right is the laugh. The last is that my beautiful friend Matt Rogers. Guys, you think I'm beautiful. Beautiful guys, this is a sad announcement. This is gonna be the last episode for a few weeks. I I am even I was nervous there. I was like, what are you saying? Oh no, no, no, I just we're going on an even more extended hiatus. Well, Bowen is about to embark on a little trip. Go ahead, I'm embarking on a trip to the beautiful climbs of China, and um, it's gonna be a couple of weeks and then I'm back the end of the month, end of October. So then we'll resume last Culture Races and I myself going on my own trip tomorrow and where will that be. I'm going to Orlando, girl, And you knew where I was going because you know, I only vacation in one spot, Orlando, bitch. I only go to Orlando on vacation. I've been to Europe once earlier in the year. Now that I did, I'm good. We'll go to Orlando for the rest of my life. My boyfriend, Henry, it will be his first time at the Universal Orlando Resort and I am ready great. I'm really excited about it. Actually, i've been. I've been, I haven't. I have the app and I've been looking at the way times. I've been doing my research. This will be the first time I do Halloween Horror Nights, which is scary, super scary. I scared very easily, but I'm braving it. Well, wow, that's that's so exciting. And guys, we have an indelible guest with us, and we literally we were like, we're not gonna have an episode for a long time. Who can we get as a guest that will be a true goddamn home run, home run A draw draw. You know him, you know him. He's a writer, correspondent and seriously TV with amazing, amazing series such as Unboxing or Shutting Down bull shutting Down the Bullshit Incredible. UM. He's also he's also Carlos on the seminal podcast Welcome Tonight Vale and UM and he's the creator of the brilliant, brilliant, brilliant series Every single word. Guys, give it up for Dylan marriage. Guys. I love you. Oh, I love you. I truly love you. Guys. I feel like a fan girl of you. Guys. Guys, we haven't had our wine yet, cheers. We have some red wine. Let's talk about the brand of red wine wet. It's called La Flora more Flora le flori more, the Flower of Love. It's peanut noir um, probably bottled last month. It's a celebratory night because we have Dilan. I'm so excited that you're here. I'm so excited to be here. I'm good. Thank you for asking. I am. I have the cold that's going around to every single human. God. I've been willing it away because it can't ruin my Orlando trip. It won't nothing. What can ruin in Orlando? Alright? When I was six, I was going to go to Disney World for the first time. And I got sick, and I tried to hide it from my parents for so long because I didn't want them to know, and they were thinking about canceling the crip and because of your sickness, and then ultimately I pulled through. I was gonna say that was I was hanging on a moment. That that was Joseph Campbell Heroes journey Ship is literally like I stop breathing, did go. I thought for a second that you have one of those people that have never been to Disney World. No, no, no, I've been to disney World when I was six. I went back to Disney World when I was twelve. I haven't been since. But here's the ark of much for you. Here's the arc of disney World for you as you grew older. You go for the first time as a kid. It's the most amazing, mind blowing thing in the world. Magic. Yeah. And then maybe maybe some people are privileged enough to go. This is for me, atly speaking for myself. You go back when you're like middle school, and you're like, you think you're above it, and you don't, you purposefully don't enjoy it. And then you go back as an adult and it's the best. I haven't been as an adult type. I watched with bated breath. You're serious Fournits in Orlando, thank you, and the work was terrific. I mean, you know you let me tell you. So I'll be going to Universal Orlando. I am not going to disney World because I have some beef with Disney World and we're like, it's just not well, it's not being a racist that well, well, Walt Disney being a racist, you know, and also an anti Semitic. Yeah, well, yeah, the same thing ven Diagram. Well, yeah, I'm sure he was, like and I'm sure he was extremely racist, but like I feel like his claim to his claim to fame for me, it is his anti semitism. The rumor is that he was buried and Nazi regalia. This is right, But I think sure. I think someone told me that, and I think they're credible. You just you just went with I think told me that, and we trust I trust her. Okay, Well, you'll be at Universal. I'll be at Disneyland Shanghai. Yeah, where it's a little different. It's a little different. It's the biggest of the Disney parks. It's the single biggest. Like it's not as big as Disney World. They've got a really cool tron roller coaster that you have to do. Yeah, they have to report back to me on how it is. And they've got a sore in they or two. But it's sorn over the US. You guys do I understand, But you guys do roller coasters. I'm not a roller coaster person. I am, okay. And you know is that because you're not you get nauseous arts because it's it's fear. Um, I don't get nauseous. Although I went on a vacation with my husband last summer and we saw the craziest craziest ride where was. It was in Paris and it was at this Um it wasn't this like brick and mortar fair like amusement park. It was like a setup and um basically you you were strapped into a seat and you started spinning on its axis and then it was on this long thing and so yes, I've seen those things. Oh I can't do those carnival rodes. So no, right, So I decided when, because I know that my husband loves roller coasters, that I was like, you know, what if he says that it looks fun like I'm going to challenge myself to do it. I cried, No, I liked it. What this is like this is another Joseph Campbell here. No, I I involuntarily teared because the fear was so much. You were like anticipation, like the anxiety. And it's also just opens to my stomach like it's like it just drops. But you loved zero loved it. And it was easier when we like God, But eventually we started going backwards, you know what I mean, like like like it's dipping down and it's much easier to go backwards for your stomach. Okay, okay, okay, and then I just like gritted my teeth the whole time. Sure, yeah, I mean it's I can't do anything that really flips you around, like because I'll get very nauseous and I'm very my body is very sensitive to like the manipulation of like g forces like whenever like really kind of getting like funked around. But I mean I love to go fast and I love to be very high. Oh we see, that's the thing. Like I will love I will love a tower of terror or like a drop tower kind of thing. Those are those are fun for me. You're a fan. So how are you feeling. Let me tell you, Dylan, it's really tough. And so just for everyone that's listening, um, the I feel bad for everybody out there in California because you're Disneylands. Tower of Terror is getting changed people. It's being Guardians of the Galaxy, a movie that Bowen and I walked the fuck out. That's right. We got bored of it because what was that movie? Did you see it? Yeah? You did? I see it? Well? No, but like I don't really. I'm not a huge fan of any of these like franchise movies where it's so obvious that they're just selling you, like the thing to a brandy, And it's like Marvel, where it's like, and don't get me wrong, I love superhero movies, but Marvel only feels like you're in a gift shop. That just like it's because Marvel is now Disney is, and Disney is only about the bottom line totally. Disney will never join anything of quality again. But I feel like Disney is in their like name brand stuff, they're really good at masking. It was so like Finding Doria. I'm like, yes, I'm there, but you saw it. Finding Dori did you like it. Yeah, it was so let down. No, I couldn't even bring myself Finding Nemo, I cry, and without fail, every time I see Finding Doria is like finding Dory. I sobbed when what part spoiler alert when she when she meets them again? Yeah, okay, when she met that was beautiful, Oh my god. But then the rest of it was like also chosen Family. It's a queer Disney. It is a queer Disney movie. You're right, You're right, that's how I read. Okay, Well, then Dylan is just still a little more sophisticated than I'm just I'm just saying. I didn't even I literally didn't even watch a trailer for it. I was like, wow, it's a weird thing that happened to me. Where Like when a new animated movie is about to come out, I something about me already inherently wants to avoid every new animated movie Big Here, No. Six. The second I saw the trailer for it, I was like, I hate this Why? And then honestly, when I actually sit down and see them, I do sort of like them. But there's something about animated movies like I don't know what it is. I can't diagnose myself. I am. Once I see that there's an animated movie coming out, I'm like, already, wait, that's no. I don't know. You didn't justify that. I reject that because you're like, there's something about anim this whole swath of entertainment that I don't like. But I don't know what it is. I don't know. I'm telling you, I wish to be told what's wrong, because there's something going on where like, I'm really only excited if I know it's a musical, that's what it is. If it's if it's a musical, I'm all about. Like I knew Frozen was gonna be musical, and so I was like, yeah, of course, But also Frozen, isn't that shut up? Owen? Sorry too? Who was excited else? Against a girlfriend? Is that happening? No? I mean, but Adina Menzel said she's for it, right, right, right, Like anything, Frozen is also a queer narrative. I will appreciate that. I mean, it's liberal what we call a queer narrative because we're like love between sisters, were like, well, take care anything to women saying they love each other. The first time we saw Frozen, we were with a bunch of gay men. It was us and Dave Mazzonian and we were all, yeah, so all the gay men. So we were all there watching it and it was all gays and literally like we were all just kind of watching it, enjoying it. And then let it go happen and everyone was like, yes, you better work girl, you better let the rainfall or whatever it was, and the rainfall, let the rainfall rock. But um, then I saw it with a bunch of kids, and it was just different. It's like they were like. So I saw it twice in the same holiday weekend, once with my husband's family in California and was with my husband's family in Seattle because they both wanted to see it so badly. Yeah, and there are many toddsi with you twice to h oh yeah, I mean no, just dealing with the family. It was all the kids. It was like to bring the kids. And because we were around kids, um, we couldn't exclaim like during let it go, So Todd and I just whispered to each other up yes. As she started building her eyes castle, which is it's a there's a moment. There's a moment towards the end where she's like walking towards her balcony and she's serving her shoulders. She's giving her face, giving, mug giving. The hair comes down. Sleeves, girl, It's all about the sleeves. It's all about the sleeves. We're gonna say something about the ice castle. It is a beautiful moment. I love the ice Um. Okay, guys, where you're going to say something? Guys, I feel like a crazy person for saying this. But one of my favorite, not only just animated movies, but all all time movies, Girl, is wreck It Ralph. You've said this more. You hated it that I just wanted to. I think you would love the second another queer narrative. He's an outcasts. It's perfectly doesn't have friends queer. It's a perfectly good movie. But it's it's it's funny. It's just funny to me that you think that that's more creative and forward thinking than something like Monsters Inc. Because let me tell you what my problem with Record Ralph is, and then and then they can respond. The Record Ralph had the opportunity to expose us just so many different worlds, which it did. It exposed us like three worlds been. You get like the like Sarah Silverman, like go Kart world that they're in, You get um the record Ralph World, and then I mean the Jane Lynch, like the Lynch Halo type world. But then there's like not much else I wanted to see, like the narrative progress through. It's such a good movie, but all right, I don't think it's as good as Monsters jerking off to Monsters, inc. Dylan, Let's ask the question. We ask all of our guests, well, who you didn't even give Dylan an opportunity to Dylan. We're gonna say something I was just gonna say, remembered another amazing Pixar movie that did go into all the worlds was Inside Out. In actually didn't like it, but I thought that I didn't like it. I just was gonna say it's more controversial than people think, Like there are people out there that really don't like Inside Out. Why I don't get because they find a basic Colin said that when she was on the show, and I was like, I get my mask shup, but I cried, I love it. I love it. Well I'm wrong, Okay, Dylan, We're gonna ask you against one that means I'm wrong. Just so everyone knows when you're outvoted, it means you're wrong. So remember that I don't remember. We're gonna, okay, let's ask him when we ask all of our guests, what, okay, what what was the culture growing up for you that made you think cultures? For me? When did Dylan there and decided culture? I'm interested in that cultures And we we're talking books, TV shows, movies, but it's open to video games, whatever you want. It doesn't have to be any of those things. Either, could be your mom's cooking. You know. It was the moment in The Witches when Angelica Houston okay, and it went from her purple clutch two address that is so specific and beautiful, well it's amazing. And it was the and that mixed with the poster of the Witches and the poster of you know, you know those things when the poster is just so good that you stare at it for a while. I didn't object onto it. What what movie you wanted to be? It was the movie I wanted it to be, thank God, And that was the moment that it matched. So I feel like that is the That's like when I started my obsession with all of this stuff. And then I was that kid who like, I had copious Nates Silver style Academy Awards spreadsheets for Nate silver, Freate silver, but yeah it was Prenate silver. And and it's funny because that was like, I know I'm jumping around here, but this is this is my second which is that, um, you know, you don't hear like I didn't see people making Academy awards spreadsheets. But it's like when you're alone in your room, you're like, I must know, and you're like, I will make I like researched all of the awards that don't even get televised or get written up. Baptas to does. Sorry, I'm gonna start a kick starter for the Baptas televised. You're like National Board of Review top ten. Yes, And it was really hard to put. Any time there was a tie, it really upset me. Another row. Oh sure, you kept the statistics of what the precursors were saying, yeah, all year round, and so you could, and so I would. You would see years like the year that Ellen Burston won everything, but then Julia Roberts won the big ones for Aaron Prokovitch was in that year in two thousand. We're sisters about this baby I used to do. We talked this was like what our last episode was. It was prognosticating ostars. We had Brandon Scott Jones on and oh my god, and we all rain manage like the years, like what best to Let's let us try that? What's it again? We did this last time? This is repeat condom a new content. But if you could do it, the viewers will let me backwards. Come on, come on if you want to walk backwards, okay, so walk backwards or I could do okay. So like this year best pick were you want to take the best picture? Best spotlight, spotlight birdman? Um, okay, let's see twelve Years of Slave, which is the one thing people hold on too when they're like film isn't racist? Um okay, So then you're not even thinking numerically about this. This is no. Twelve Years of Slave was twenty and then her lucker her um got it. It's been has been a long time. It was the one that was not zero thirty nom so before that, this is so hard. Now all of a sudden, it's as like a very male movie. Oh Argo, Argo, Yes, Yes, yes, yes it was Argo, so twelve years a slave then Argo before that, No wonder why you forget it because it sucks. Before Argo was the King's speech. Before the King's speech was the hurt Locker, before the hurt Lockers two do nine eleven the art No, no knows the artists Argo the artist, uh, the King's speech hurt Locker. Then now we're in two thousand nine. This is sump Dog two eight, No Country for Old Men and seven It's your dream Girls? Wasn't not? No, No Crash was two six um before some millionaire before. I think No Country for Old Man was the Dreamgirls year. Yeah, no, No, No Country for Men was after dream Girls year was oh Man was the ar Babbel and Babble was definitely the year of Drink because because I remember that Jennifer Hudson was up there with Rinko and Adriana Yes, yeah, yeah yeah, and little Miss Sunshine was also nominated that year. But I know No Country of Oldman was before. But what was the year of dream Girls? I think that was that year. I don't think so. No Crash was broken back broke back. Crash was broken back. Well, I'm gonna look it up right now. But so the while, while while we're looking this up, the point is, I mean we all share this, Yeah, and so what is it? Did you explore this gay competition? It's gay sports, It's it's because we all have this instinct to like, see what what's gonna win. It's something about American culture, I think, and no, you know what it is. I'm reading Phoebe Robinson spoke right now, you can't touch my hair. It's so good. And her first her opening chapter is a love letter to reward shows. And then but then she sort of turns it around and she's like, but you know what, Like the reason I was so obsessed with that is because I wanted to be on that stage and I saw and she was like, like it it never made. That was my only escape into my ego of being like I can be this fabulous who's on stage and like maybe that was it for me, was and for for both of us, And we talked about this last episode. For both of us. It was seven oscars with one Titanic one that was like the big that was the seed that got planted for us, got the I have the result of what it was. And you know why we forgot it. It's because it's another fucking washed out white man movie That Departed. Oh what a shame, what a fame, What a shame? Listen to this bullshit. Years and years and years in a row. We got fucking The Departed and then crashed before that year, which is a cop out Million Dollar Baby, which is like a last minute Cleans would cop out Return of the King of the Chicago. Then Chicago, which, like Thank Christ, I saw five times in theaters, I rememorizes the whole fucking dance does have it? Dylan, I have to ask you a question because this was the big controversial moment in our Last time God, please thoughts on Mulin Rouge. Oh wow, you're outing me? Why you don't like? You hate it? What you stop? That's not here? Is what I have seen fifty times, the opening number of sparkling diamonds. If you want to talk about moments like the culture took my breath away. I so this sounds bad, right, This sounds bad as someone who like considers himself to be an artist. But I watched it and I got bored instead of finishing it. Understand, I watched this, the scene with the swing over over and over again past the time and then she comes down. That's an amazing moment. Yeah, but I know, you know what, I don't blame Dylan for this because our culture is so fragmented now and I have trouble sitting through movies. I have trouble sitting through show. I don't like to sit through movies. I find them long. But I don't understand, not at least watching Will and Rouge to be like, I gotta see what the rest of this favorite dream is going to be. It's a favor dream, favorite dream. Well, that is homework for you. Then you need to sit through Mullan Rouge. I mean Marin. I know we're talking to Dylan Marin, and he's not I haven't seen the sound of music though, Oh, you mean a post about it. Henry hadn't seen The Bodyguard, right, I said it when he when I told me that he hadn't seen the body You've never seen the Bodyguard. I know all the songs. The soundtrack is like the most important part. It truly isn't. It's about It's about it's about them Heaven and it's about Kevin and Whitney Ken and it's not that is an amazing, amazing film. It's incredible. She's a good actress. She's totally serviceable. She is her and Cinderella. She's fantastic. She's not she's not distracting in anyway. She's a phenomenal I wouldn't say phenomenal. Yes, I think she's great. The actor who played her sister, Yeah she was shelled, Yeah she killed and there there you need to watch it. I just thought it was unusual that Henry hadn't seen the bodyguard. But then I was like, also, to put the simple perspective, I haven't seen this. We all have our holes, but the bodyguard is so fucking OK. It's such a no, no, no, no. You know. This is what happened Matt and I. This is a historic moment. Matt suited. Matt and Sudy came over my apartment back when the Sound of Music I was airing, and we were like, oh god, we gotta tune in for this fucking train wreck. And then my DVR wasn't working, and then Matt like did a terrible job of hiding his disappointment and disdain, and so then we were like you know what for me? And we were like, all right, let's just sue. He were like, yeah, let's just watch the original sound of music because Matt's never seen it. We put it on. Matt falls asleep within the first thirty minutes. I think it was adrenaline because I was so excited to see the Carry version and that when that didn't have of a life By carry, I mean, come on, did you guys hear um? So there was all that kind of back and forth between fans and like people in the know, like should there be a live audience for these live musicals or not? And now they have made the decision. There will be hair sprayed, there will I think for both there's going to be a live audience for what He didn't they learn from Legally Blonde when they aired it on MTV, which was like totally fine and great, but it was much better than what what they're doing that it's so awkward, those silent moments. I was pro no audience because until until I saw it, because I was like, well, the thing is like you wanted them, you want everyone at home to see the show, But then it is it's it's more but it's like half movie, half show, right, No, I I'm it feels it feels a little too. It feels a little too mid century or even like before that, it's like, oh like when it was all on a sound stage. No, I've come around on this did be like Greece, is that dynamic enough for you? One over Lemonade at the Emmys? That was bizarre tragedy because how different were they? I think that that was Yeah, I was directed by the guy who directed Hamlet, right right, right right. I didn't like Greece life because you were because I was just just disengaged and I was tired, and um yeah, and I was you know what. I was with my friend Matteo and my friend Amanda, and we were both just like you know what, we were just we were just going into it being like dour And that's probably like unfair. Yeah, that absolutely is unfair. And it's absolutely why you didn't die because it was perfectly That might be a comment on our viewing practices, now, well this is It's so it's interesting to me because like whenever anyone has anything negative to say about these live musicals, I there's something about me that's like, come on, man, like they're trying so hard, Like people had all this, Henry had all this negative ship to say about Queen Latifa, and I was like, the woman's doing like a live musical. She's like performing, this is like kids like Whiz. I was just like nah, I was like, I think that this is really fun and like also like we all collectively felt that about the Whiz specifically because it was like really cool to just see an all black cat. Absolutely, but then I will go in on Peter pan Oh, yeah, for sure, for sure. And that's the thing is that I've I've come into this with a preconceived notion that these are gonna be failures because the first two were bad, and so the WIDS was st refreshing because it was good and Dana Owens, I'm really excited for Harris has awesome. Did you see it on? You ever see it live? Yes? And I, in fact, Joe Firestone and I went and do you know the Muni in St. Louis of course, so we went to see it at them. It was incredible. That's great college days, college days, that's a good I got funnel cake fried funnel cake fries. Oh my god, Please describe what Okay, not merely as good as you would imagine, but basically so imagine funnel o cake put it into rectangles like like little strips of strips deep fried, double deep fried, and then the dipping sauce. Okay, you're you're thinking French fries. You're thinking catchup, right, catch up out put in frosty anyway, So I sat and ate many orders of that. Well, Joe and I watched hair Spray Live phenomenal, but yeah, I love hair Spray. Yeah, that's like, that's gonna be fun. I think Rocky is gonna be great too, Rocky Rocky all on the whole has I think a weaker cast than um hair Spray does, Like it's like Victoria Justice. Sure, I mean hair Spray. You got Ariana Grandee. I think Ariana Grande is going to be so good. It's gonna be great. It's gonna be good. But the star is Tracy turn Blood, so I can't wait to see what she does. Yeah, I think she's gonna be great. I really do. Star is gonna be Tracy and it's that new girl. It's always a New Discovery introduction. Um, yes, guys, should we move on to our topic. Yeah, let's move on to our topic at hand, which the title of this episode is the issues at hand. Guys, we're gonna be kind of taking a little bit of a break until November, so it's going to be right before the election that we get back together. So there's been so much fucking garbage going on, a lot of garbage, and I know that your job is seriously like like entails that you tackle a lot of this garbage. Um, how do you how do how do you approach it with like the the amount of levity that is required of your tone of voice for the whole for the whole site or for the whole um, you know, channel like that must be, that must be. I think the way I always think about it is that these are like the hardest issues to talk about, but you have to make it accessible for people. And I've come, I've like worked in many worlds and existed in many worlds where it's had to where we're like the way you talk to someone who's like to teach them when it's very dry and it's very didactic, exactly that's the perfect word, and it's too didactic. And then but like if you like go in, if you kind of punch them in the gut, like with a wrench or like that's that's what you punch them with a wrench and the gut. That's like the wrong metaphor. Um. But I the imagery I mean is like, um, you kind of like the anesthesia is comedy, and then the you perform the surgery. That's how I see, Yeah, of course. And and it's like the way you get people to listen and then once you disarm them, then you can sit them down. I mean, I think what I've learned from doing work on the internet is no matter how no matter what you say, no matter how you carefully say it, people are going to disagree with you. Disagreement I love, but people are going to be um deeply offended by what you say. And I say, um, you know who the people who I'm offending are mostly like straight white men. Yeah yeah, yeah, so um that's yeah. But but I how do I deal with it? I don't know. I mean, I just think it's like all of these waves were riding and he's turn off at some point. I want to know, because you know, we spoke with was it Nicole Silverberg? We talked about this with She writes for g Q, and sometimes she'll get a lot of aggression. Um, I would imagine you get a lot of aggression towards you. Dylan and I have talked about this in private because I had a day and it was it is I remember. But you know what compared to what Dylan gets gets, you know, Dylan gets projectile, crazy, crazy things, which is why I ask, I want to know, does it doesn't hurt your feelings? Um? I think it? You at first, it did? Right at first, You're like, oh, you want me to die? You know, like, uh, I do this unboxing series and one person sent me a message just today that said you should unbox your own suicide. And but but so when you first get that, it's like I won't get out of bed, you know, and then you just become numb to it because but that's not what but but but but what I mean is like, and I say this all the time, it's like the day that a collective of women of color is like, you have deeply offended us, I'll be like I'm doing something wrong for sure, you know. And then but but it's like if you follow all of these people back to their profiles, they have swastikas and they're calling themselves openly white nationalists. So it's like so you know what it's like, I'm like, I'm not I'm not mourning the laws. It hurts you're not a fan, I'm losing. It hurts your feelings at first because it's hurtful language. And then you walk it back in and you say, oh, this person is has their own disease, and so therefore, you know what am I going to do? Stop doing my work? And that's why, like you do have to just let it roll off your back, I guess, because what are you What else is that? What are the other options? There's there? Yeah, there's no other option because you're not going to teach them, you know, And I mean, I do think it is important to know that these people are people. And I mean this in in the like way of radical acceptance, like I would never even think about the things that they write to me. But that being said, you follow them back and they're just like this high school boy who is I mean by follow them back, I don't mean follow them back. You see what their profile is and you're like, oh, you're just a high school boy, like just figuring it out, like what a disservice this world has done to you? You know that that like you think that when you see someone who doesn't look like you express opinions that challenge your worldview, that they need to die, and you see this all around like like we grew up. I don't want to lose sight of the fact that we were growing up at a time when Eminem was the biggest, biggest dealt and the havoc that Eminem rot for queer boys growing up, and we ignore that now because because the Internet wasn't around then the way it is now to have like what I wouldn't have, what I would give to have read a think piece in seventh grade being like Eminem is bad for teenage boys, even if I saw people pile up on that, and teenage boys be like, oh stupid, stupid, like just to know that that thought exists, but you're so alone, you know. That's one of the most hurtful things to look back on my adolescens and know that he was so pervasive and and he got away with so much blatant, violent homophobia and also the cover of his album was his dead wife's body in his trunk And do you do I remember I bought I bought the Eminem Show album. I bought it because I felt as a young person. This is what I'm supposed to be listening to and if I don't have this Eminem Balbut but the same reason why I lied about my favorite band being Limp Biscuits when I was asked, because I couldn't say because that would mean I was gay. So again in a way of like, you know, holding myself back and making myself into what everyone else was, I bought that Eminem Show album. If you look through the cover art of that album, it's him killing his audience. He murders. I think that's Is that the one with the curtains on the front. Yes, yeah, yeah, that's the one I had to And I also bought it because I was like, I will make myself like this right, Like I don't want to say like Britney Spears. I don't want to say like the Bodyguards soundtrack. I don't want to say like all of these things, like hiding this this part of yourself and all. The reason I brought this up is that all of these people who send me this hate, they look like young Eminem's right, and it's it's I feel and I'm not being altruistic here. I feel so bad for what we do to teenage boys, you know. And this is an alter way of looking at it, um or alternative say that word anymore. You were halfway This is an alternative way to look at it. But like, there is a real privilege of queerness because you get to see the world. You're like thrust to the outer reaches of the world and then you get this better perspective on the world. And by queerness, I don't just mean queerness, I mean any kind of minority status that any otherness see get just get this like really amazing perspective of the world. But I feel bad for them because from that vantage point, you're starting to see what the machine does to these people, right And um, I mean this is not to say that I'm going to respond to them and start a dialogue because if I'm getting, you know, however many messages a day, I get like, that's not worth my energy. My energy is not going to be spent how having a meaningful conversation with these people. But it is the public private dynamic of these are things that you would never ever say to my face exactly right, Well, you said something to me when we were talking about this, um that you were like, what I want to do is just sit them down and be like do you really want to do you really want me to die? Is that how you truly or you want to do that? Like I want to do that? Like Marina Bramovick piece, it's like here's a gun, here's a knife, and it's like do you want to do this to me or do you want to do something else? You know? And um yeah, like it's it's it's kind of insane. I also think that this is just time when the way you release things on the Internet is you're releasing it to a to a platform where people can truly say anything. And if you think back to television in like the nineties, like if an episode came out and a gay couple kissed on it, right, like, it's a much longer process. You don't comment on that, you I mean you comment on it if you are so incensed. You take it upon yourself to write a letter and then you put a stamp on that letter that you spent money on, and then you put that envelope in the mail and then the mail goes to the like channel that broadcasted it, and then there's a mail center. So it's like there were so many, um, there were so many filters. Yea, there were so many filters. Um can I am? Okay, So you're just talking about sort of both of you talking about sequestering away. It is like these like interests as kids. Um can I just I don't. I haven't done this before the show? Um okay, Ham Sandwich, she's she used to be dropping. Now she's now, she's she's transitioning, she's trans um During coming National Coming Out Day this week, she wrote this, really, I had this beautifully written thing about the closet. Can I read it? Okay? The closet is a stupid phrase. It's a cute see hetero friendly euphemism for what is actually solitary confinement in a prison of pure fear, the walls of which appear out of nowhere after you've spent some chunk of your life thinking we're roaming free like everybody else. There was a key placed within reach. But that key is made of a kind of courage. No one in straight culture ever said you need to have because the walls themselves are built out of a cowardice. That's straight people have never had to confront, which I think, which I think speaks to like these people. Um and then there's one more thing. Every lgbtwo person has escaped their cell through sheer force of will and on their own. We've all taken an irreversible and costly step, and often the only reward we get for it is the company and solidarity of others who have taken that same step. That's why I'm more proud on this day than than that fucking stupid week in June. And then she ends up with um. She says, she talks about how she could come out twice, once it's gay and then once it's trans. And then she says, all LGBT people, even the ones whose guts I fucking hate, are beautiful for this reason. So I think that was anyway. Yeah, so I think that's true. It's something and it's so interesting because you know, now, whenever I meet somebody LGBT, it's like you do you feel an instant, familiar, already in love for that person, because it's true, no one else does know. You really don't know. Well, that's what it is, it's like, and that's what the thing I responded most to in Ham's and Ham's writing was that like, um, she's saying, like you like you're escaping out of your own out of your own will, Like that's god like what a what a crazy like lonely thing. I mean I also think like within the lgbt q q I A community, there's um like a strong amount of mask privilege and a strong amount of white privilege, and of course, but which is present, for the record, in every minority community. And I was talking about this with some one. But it's like I was talking about this with my friend, UM. She's an actor and she's currently uh filming a show, UM, and it came up because she's wearing contacts for the show. She's a black woman, and she was telling me that everyone would come up to her and be like, your eyes are so beautiful, and it's like that light privilege of like, and so we were we were talking about is it it's this thing present in all minority communities of like who is closest to white and who's closest to mail you know, um, and who's closest to like straight acting. And so I was talking to, um, there's this really great guy, representative Brian Sims. He's amazing, he's so great, he's so he's so smart and the way, so he's this very mask, presenting um uh, gay white guy state senators at in Pennsylvania. Yes, state legislators in Pennsylvania, and he was saying that he understands that the opponent of his community looks like him, and and the opponent of minority communities looks just like him, so they're more serious. They're going to take him more seriously because he looks like them. So he's like, I'm willing to fight for all of these people because I know this awful thing is true, that they take me more seriously just because for so many people, being gay is just a fact, right, Like they're just like, like I think of like Neil Patrick Harris, what I consider him a queer? No, what I like? But it's like, is that my person? Where is that my avatar? No? But um. For a long time though, that was it. Didn't you feel that for me? I felt like that, I mean, to be honest with you, that was it for me when I was in high school, when I found out that he was gay and openly gay and playing a role that was straight on television and accepted as part of the mainstream culture on a network like CBS, which I even knew at that age was bullshit like because it is um. I was like, wow, this is my hero, and I remember, I remember I felt I remember I felt like a genuine crush on him and a genuine love for him, and like sort of like an obsession, Like I remember I would go home and I would google him and listen to and find out the project he was. And I also found out that he was involved in this like concert version of Sweeney Todd that he did with Patti Lapone, and I was like, wow, this person has so many varied interests, but like they're able to succeed on a mainstream level and they're gay and they're out and saying it like it's crazy, Oh my god. And this is like pre Sewn Hayes saying he was gay, and like sure, I mean, Ellen being out like meant something. But to be honest with you, like I guess like the first time I saw myself, which is my own privilege. No no, no, but I mean I think that that is great and important. And I didn't I don't mean to knock him. I mean to just say it's it's an echo of what you're saying, which is like it's so fucked up that that's like one of the only ones that we have to and we have to like in some cases pretend to identify with right right right right right, and we're like and and and I'm you know, yeah, I mean that's It's the what I wanted to knock was the culture that made him be the only one not him, No, no, no, And you know what because even he I'm sure, like is it fully out as himself? You know what I mean? Like no, I think this is what Dylan saying that he was able to still like sustain his own career um because because he just had all the other like points in the checklist that were like, oh, you're know that he was completely straight acting and playing an extremely like almost vulgar straight and there was that like element of like, oh he you know, like there's there's the like magic element. But what he's passing right and his thing for a while was his like type was disgusting straight man, like not even in How I Met Your Mother? But also what how Old and Kumar? I wonder how that is going to stand the test of history, Like I wonder how I won the performance and How I Met Your Mother is going to Yeah, I don't read decades from now, especially after this election, right right, that's interesting. How are you guys doing? Okay, I went, I went canvas saying last week and you guys phone banking and banking, I was calling uh members of the Democratic Party in Michigan to make sure that they got their absentee balance. So it wasn't like I was calling undecided voters in Florida. I wasn't like confronted my head on. I got a couple of responses that were like, it's none of your business who I vote for. Between me and my god. Between me and my god was one. And also, um, can we count on you to support Hillary November eight? Like, hell you can? And they's a like Democrats. It's registered Democrats that are in the system. For that reason, I would say, how am I doing with it? I'm exhausted. I'm so fucking tired that now I'm just desperately trying to see the humor in it, because I do think that it's that I do think that, like I think he can't come back from this. I'm I'm still fighting, like I still will go in the phone bank and I still will, you know, do all I can. But I'm really beat down by it. And I'm also missing the I'm missing the kind of social media that took itself less seriously to be honest. I really am, I'm I'm, I'm I'm. I'm seeing now like I'm respecting people a lot less, which I really didn't wish. I had to family members of mine that come out and say these certain things where I'm like, wow, I have to I'm never going to forget this. Now. It's a new kind of arrow where it's like you're fine, You're really finding out what people really think and it's scary because you don't have the commonality that you thought you had with everybody, and it is scary and it's making me really tired. And also I haven't been sleeping as well, and I think this is Yeah. I also think it's like ludicrous that people are trying to talk about this election with impartiality. Oh, I saw this Jeep commercial before the movie I was. I just went to and this Jeep commerce. You know when it's like a commercial that plays before a movie, so you know, it's like extended cut, fancy version. So it was like basically, no matter who you are, Jeep is for all Americans, and um, it was shots of bumber stickers that support different ideologies, but never something so political like abortion, black Lives Matter or abortion. It was like, I support our troops, uh, save the earth, the most innocuous bullshit and not one. So then it was a split screen at the very end and half of the car closed and it was a blue car and the bumber sticker was Democrat and half of the car was read and it was a bumper sticker and it was Republican. I think, what is going to happen? He's like, first of all, is everyone will get a jeep everyone? First of all, let's go get it. This is sponsored thanks to jeep. Um. You know when on podcast they always say like our friends are cheap and it's like what, but Dylan, that reminds me, um squarespace, what is it a snack box? Whatever? Are you ever craping a snack? Why spend seventy dollars a week? Anyway, I just wanted to say that it is like, what are those now iconic red hats that say make America great again? Like is that going to is no candidate in the future of American politics ever going to have a red hat again as part of their campaign because it's so iconic, you know, like I think it goes away. I don't know about that. I don't I think it's I think I don't know that. I think what we're living through is so different. Well think about this though, I mean, he's he's doing. What he's doing right now is he's he's trying. I think he knows he's kind of flailing a little bit. He knows he can't win, so he's doing he's trying to do as much lasting damage as possible. He's trying to ruin her life. I mean that's clear, like and um, he's ruining. I think he's ruing a lot of people's lives. I mean, now these women are, whether they really wanted to or not, are all kind of forced to come forward. We all know that coming forward about your assault is like very personal and very difficult. But now I think that women that might have told their family members are told their friends in the past that has happened to them, now that this is happening with Donald Trump, I'm sure they're being pressured. I mean today they're just just an hour before we started, I saw there's an Apprentice contestant from season five that came forward with Gloria Allred and on camera gave a statement about her sexual assault, a detailed, eleven minute taped confession about a sexual assault that she endured at the hands of Donald Trump. And this is not stopping because you know that there's countless women. What scares me is the fact that it doesn't matter, it doesn't adder to people. It's and like The Day Show just did a segment about these people being like, he wants to grab them by the pussy. I want to grab them by the pussy. I wish I could grab as much pussy. Or the women who are like I'm sixty five and I would love if someone would grab my pussy. It means I'm cute and I'm like, So basically, what you're saying is you consent so you can see you consent. So fine, but still no, this is what Dylan saying is that the impartiality is complete. It's like when Seamless does the put an eye with her or I'm with him? Aren't you longing for the days of John McCain and or Romney is just like they're so different, I think, Yeah, I mean we're talking about this, Yes, Okay, So I watched the movie Game Change two nights ago because I figured this would be fascinating to watch now. And Sarah Palin, I believe was the was the beginning of this um well, she got a real beginning of this is when Reagan the first thing he did in office was kind of educcasion, because then that that that's what and that's how you got That's how you got a big, dumb electorate that you can control. So that's why we have we have today. But in terms of this beginning of the Tea Party, in terms of this people being proud of the fact they were uneducated and you know, left behind, that started with Sarah Palin because they saw in themselves, they saw themselves in her, a charismatic every every woman who was up there on a national stage, and she spoke to them. And what she said to everybody was like, look, I'm not an insider. And that was what they had to do with her because she truly didn't know any That was the first time in American politics that like inexperience was was virtuous and it was like, wow, so there's someone up there that can get up there who is really truly like me. Meanwhile, when no one considers the fact that she shouldn't have been up there in the first list. She was being used as a tactic to win. Like it's just funny this like this this mentality of like he says, what I think, Well, you shouldn't be president, right right, And it started with Sarah Palin because she did give birth to the tea party. And in one of the last scenes of Game Change, which is a movie that's been um, you know, spoken on by people like Nicole Wallace and Steve Schmidt, who are depicted in the movie as being quote like so accurate that it gave them chills, Like this is the last scene, is uh. Sarah Palin has played by Julianne Moore, is determined to make a concession speech alongside John McCain. She's like, I got quite a speech I'm going to make next to you, and he's like, no, that's not appropriate. I'm going to make the speech. You'll stand up there with me and that'll be fine. And he turns around and walks away, and she's still there and she's dect deducted, and before he gets out the door, he turns around and walks back to her and says, you're one of the leaders of the party now, Sarah, and people are going to be looking to you for what to do. Don't get corrupted by Limbaugh and the rest of the crazy people because it's not real, because that's sucking. John McCain's fault too for even pick oh, it's fully well. Here's the thing John mccainn has presented in the movie is like a very noble person, but unfortunately the politics of it all and then needing to win got to him. And it was really his advisors that were like, you cannot win this election with Joe Lieberman, which is who he wanted to. He wanted it to be a split ticket with a Democratic vice president Joe Choice. And they were like, this is not going to help you because what we need to do statistically is reinvigorate the base and also went back to independent. So you need somebody that's gonna excite everyone because they hold a gun and also get them excited because you're involving someone else. Like, the gender gap is very wide, we need to close it. And they went through all the I guess female possibilities and chose the most quote unquote charismatic choice, and it was Sarah Palin And there you have someone who just did not know anything. It wasn't that she was too dumb to know it, it was that she didn't know it and the volume of information that she had a um take on was just too much for any person, and she had a breakdown. So funny though, because you watch old because like like Cocker did a thing on this way back in the day, Like they posted the gubernatorial debates from when she was running for governor, and she was able and like she's asked a question on abortion, and she was able to very skillfully dodge that question and going, you know what, like, of course our cases where that would be the only option, the only viable option, but um, in most cases, I would choose life. But like she's saying that and obviously you don't agree with it, Like I don't agree with that, but she said it in a way that was actually she was and she was like she she she knew what she wasn't in over her head, and it was like, oh, she's probably a perfectly fine politician at the state level. But then like you just like shoot her up that you gave her this meteoric rise just to make this a little more macro and human. I always wonder about that in is like is that part of the human condition? What is is? Well, I just think like I would like to believe that we are humans who have our convictions and we have our ethical ground to stand on. But I also think like it has so much to do with circumstance and like what you believe. And it's like, can power and fame turn you into a monster? I think game Change and the story of Sarah Palin would argue that it can Donald Trump even and with Donald Trump as well a much on a much more relevant and grand scale. So is that a human failing? Well, I just I just mean to understand these people as humans, right, Like if you want to even humanize, Like it's like that chapter in The Bluest I went Tony Morrison humanizes this character who is the most violent, despicable character of the whole book, And you didn't think it was possible. It's like, are we you know, maybe like will ultimately get that chapter for Donald Trump. Everyone has a story, every everyone has a story. But I just think that like that is like something to consider. Like we were talking about with internet rolls and internet harassment, It's like, oh, there were things that led to this moment and what if like we went back to you as a kid, Like we'd like to think everyone was Damien, you know from the then. Um, but it's like it's not. We love thinking that. I mean, this is not a new idea. It's like it's like, um, you know, the banality of evil? Right, Like why did so many people join the Nazi Party? It's not like they were all Damiens, you know, but it's like how easy is it to just join this like in in true horrendous evil? Yeah, so I don't know, it's it's I mean, I do think that this movie. I mean, if and if no one has seen The Game Change, I would recommend people see it. Um it really pretty much because you like her in the beginning, like it's it's interesting, you know what will happen and so you're questioning it and of course, but what I think is so great about this movie is Julianne Moore is such an amazing actress. She plays her and you really feel the frustration. You feel her try and answer these questions, but she just can't. She just doesn't have the capability to take on and memorize all these things. And for what amount of the things that there she was supposed to know. She did a pretty good job. I mean, she made it through that vice presidential debate, which was insane like that she was able to do that from knowing nothing. But what happens to that character. I think her tragic flaw was like she fucking loved the attention and so she saw that she got thet because they say in the beginning of the movie, they set her down to vet her and they're like, the biggest concern we have is that you're a creationist. And she says, my father was a science teacher. You know, I grew up and I accept evolution. I understand evolution. I saw fossils when I was young, Like, I get it, but I just can't deny that I see God's hand and everything that we have, and I believe that God created all this. And they're like, Okay, so we have someone that understands it, but like know, for spiritual reasons, wants to believe this other thing. But then, like that wasn't the public persona that she gave. She gave the true fundamental and that is not necessarily truthful to what she apparently believed, but it was on a mass level what was gonna get her the best attention, the best, you know, the most followers. There's this author bar Tune Day Thurston and he How to Be Black, and he has one chapter it's like if you want to be famous, quickly be a black conservative talking and it's so true, like like if you want to be known, say the right thing that will make you exceptional. You know. That's so funny. So that that reminded me of that part of Yeah, you wonder like how much of this this ship that Stacy dash does she believe or like or like, honestly is she just like was that a job? That the job? Honestly? It may have been a job. You never know, because it was just funny because I watched so when I was in when I was in college, the way I got mine news. I would have my classes from eight to five and I would get home and I would run home to see what to see what my girls were saying. I love the view. I love the view. But now it's so sad. Recently it's so we'll be still there, but we'll be so checked out. Um and like it's not really what it was because I can't. I don't. I just don't know who these women are anymore. Like back in the back in two, it was like you had Elizabeth Hasselbeck. God love her, you know what I mean. But she represented what she wanted to represent and what she needs to represent really well. She works up and Friends. She was on Fox and Friends, but then I think she kind of quit to go do family stuff. So I think that's where she is now. But she, as much as frustrating as she was, was so important. And this is and they had Nicole Wallace on the show. Nicole Wallace's like, no, I like the Coole Wallace I watched and like she's a good presence to have it. Like I'm like, stop talking. I don't know. I don't think that when your first date next to Rachel Matt, like, I don't want to listen to you. I want to listen to this lesbian because yeah, but is that because of your political views? A line more? Absolutely, and I don't want to hear Nicole Wallace weighing on how Hillary sounded shrill. I don't know saying that. I know she actually said that, she said not shrill, but she was like, yeah, but Hillary came off a little to you no that moment and I was like, all right, Nicole, just during the post debate coverage anyway, Okay, The point is early days, like oh eight air review, you had Sherry saying the world was flat. You had but that was why you wanted to watch it. I mean, yeah, entertainment value and also you had like the fact that real news was coming it. Yeah, and it was so funny because everyone took the view, so even Rosie on the View loved it. Come on, firecrack, firecrack. Even that, even that, I went back and watched the first videos where she like starts going in on Trump, and I'm like, oh, she's so good. But you know what, though, how right was she She was? Absolutely? She was. She nailed. She was funny to me that he is obsessed Donald, He's obsessed with her. You you choose to bring her up on the first and most watch debate and now it's the most watched debate in history, and you're like, okay, that's you're choosing to dine on this hill. Sorry, Donald, you're gonna bring up Donald. You're gonna bring a Rosy O'donald. It's insane. Okay, we didn't ask you how you were doing with this election, how are you doing? Um, I'm um, he's got to remain professional hunting you, yes, you know what, and you got to keep his head above wall. We don't have to talk to much about work and talked to much about election. I feel mean, it's a fascinating time to like, I feel like this is like, let's get to know America. You know, like that's this is the segment of the long running news magazine show America. That is, well, let's sit down and really get to know America. Are you surprised about what you're hearing? No, it feels like we're dredging up the bottom dwell, it's all coming out. It's like this is the end of a corporate retreat when everyone's like, I think he's an asshole, and then everyone's like yeah, yeah, and it's like we're about to leave in an hour. Oh my god, that is so good. Yeah, it's well, it feels like that, but it's you're getting to know everyone. And yeah, you're you're getting to know you get a direct line to everybody. And now, I mean every we say this, every election. Social media has never been like this any election before. And I the like thing cultured is to be like social media ruining our society. Let's go back to books, you know, and it's like fuck you, Like, being on social media doesn't prohibit you from reading books, doesn't prohibit you from like taking part in the legacy of culture. This is part of culture. And to put this blanket statement out and say like, well, social media is ruining the world, it's like no, no, it's not. No, it's a it's a medium to speak. You might not like what you're seeing, but social media, I believe, is like, first of all, I have a career because of the Internet. I've been told so many times like I'm not right for my face, isn't right for this kind of experience. And then the Internet, which is much more democratic, just shows that people actually don't care. You know, what executives tell you in a border meeting is not actually what people want to see. It's what they want to see, so you bypass that. And then, um, god, the amount of times we've been told I'm sure all three of us that were too niche. We were we were recently told niche And okay, I'm so how much can we share that is comfortable? I just want to I mean, it was a it was a very gay Show fun like Matt wrote this. Matt wrote the script of years ago, and we read it again a couple months ago when we were trying to punch this up. It still holds up, and we're like, you know what, let's pitch that we're so excited about this to a place. And then development folks were like, you know what, thank you so much anywhere. Yeah we know, we all know, so then you're okay. So I just mean to say that the internet has provided this fascinating cyber ground for people to express their opinions and for people to also explore new thoughts, and for people to follow threads. Yeah. Yeah, of core, Like I'm like an old like Greek or Roman towns, it would just be the town scrub where everyone just going totally. And now there is a much bigger town square. And it's so amazing that we can communicate with people who were on platforms that are built for that. You know, it's not just like this room where people are shouting. It's like, I mean, and but then like what are the algorithms? Like, we don't know that something like twitterism more real algorithm. And then the last thing I'll say is that when people ship on hashtag activism. It's like shipping on poster boards, you know. It's like it's like being like, well, fuck posterboard signs, and it's like, how else are you gonna get the message? Yeah, it's just a way to say the message. And the hashtag is a great like filing system for the world. You're just like I'll click on this and I'll see what people are saying. So that's just this Like it's like the most juvenile thing. Like when people getting up on the Kardashians because they have like enough ing else to say about like critiquing pop culture. It's like, actually, they're brilliant, Like they are artists and they will be considered artists one day for what they have, how they have manipulated, and we'll be pronouncing the name. Um. I mean, I'm not a huge fan of the show. I just mean like, I just mean, yes you are. I just mean criticizing them by default of course, and then criticizing hashtag activism because you hear people that you respect criticizing hashtag activism. I have to shout out a genius comedic moment I saw one time in Reverse of the Kardashians. It was Molly Khan and Aril Carlin's show Um Expert, And it was this sketch where um Um Molly goes they're they're reading there, they're like tabloids, and she goes the Kardashians like, I don't even pay attention to them? What is it keeping up with the Kardashian at the name of the show? I don't even know and Ariel goes, yeah, that's the name of the show, wasn't there, And then the whole sketches like Kim Kardashian, why is she even famous? And Ariel goes, well, I'll tell you and proceeds to give up power point presentation on why Kim famous And it's like, Kim Kardashian is an entrepreneur, Kim Kardashian is uh reality show personality. This is why she is famous? And also why is anyone favor I feel like asking the question why are the Kardashians famous is, if you really think about it, one of the dumbest questions you can ever ask. They've really that whole family is like just drilled to the core of what fame is and they hacked it and they should be praised for it. Anyway, it's like we know why they're famous. Ask why someone else is famous, Like we know we have full you know why the Kardashians are famous. I do want to say before I said I wish social media didn't take itself so seriously. I think what I'm upset about is Facebook, because this is why I don't like about Facebook lately. It's all the different kinds of emotions that you can visibly see people having to everything. It just feels very like, yeah, get inflamed. It's like, and you have to remember that Facebook is like leaching off of us. I feel like, you know what I mean, Like that's to me, it feels like not not even just like an encouragement of our emotions. It feels like a manipulation and like a you know, um, I think it just sets the tenor for the conversations to be high, which I think is actually useful. Sure, I guess, just like I don't know what we're gonna say. I was just going to say that it's a we don't know the system behind it, right, we don't. We don't because we don't understand or control the algorithms. Something like Twitter is a radically different platform. Twitter is just completely chronological. Yeah, um where Yeah, I'll always have a problem with people that are like, I see what you're posting, and what you really should be posting isn't this. I'll just always have a problem with that. And it's like you have a problem with people. You've said this before. People police just don't be be the police like on social media. I just don't. I don't do you do? This is an honest question that I don't necessarily have an answer for. But do you think there is like honest discourse that can or useful discourse that can come out of Facebook? It depends on who you are. Um, yes, Like my answer is yeah, I've had Um, you've learned that you've learned from I've learned from talking to people. I don't know if like honestly we've all become better because of it and been like at the end, Wow, this is a great conversation. I think we've all changed. But like, for example, I mean I posted Michelle Obama speech of the d n C and I had like a teacher from high school comment on it that was like I'm sorry, but she's wrong and this this, this, this, this, and then posted like a graphic from like obviously like very slanted conservative website. Yeah, something like that, and it started a full blown battle. And what it kind of revealed to me was like how defensive people on that side will get because it's like because they have a lot of a lot of because that's what it is. So right now, the Republicans and like, um, anybody that is supporting Trump right now, they're doing so because they're angry, and they're doing so because they feel like they're not being heard and they're not being listened to and they're not being cared about. And so when something happens like this guy posts on my wall his opinion and then everyone jumps on board, and it's you're dumb, that is why he's like this in the first place. So it's like that's something I've learned from this is it's like I've observed the kind of Piranha mentality Facebook and mentality. It's kind of like and you see someone say something and then it's like, yeah, they're right, I'm gonna like their post. And it was like it was interesting because like I would say I would make a comment and it would get thirty likes and his would get none, And I was like, wow, and a little part of me the back of my house was like, yeah, we're winning, And I was like, you're being in the parana right now. You just want that, Like you just want and it's not that you don't believe what you're saying, but it becomes a situation where it's not a fair fight because you're on my feed and you know what I mean, we're not actually getting the conversation right now because we're on my feed and we're on my home turf. It's like when you go to Fenway Park and you're the one Yankee fan, you know, odds are you're going to get a comment. So like that's such a good point, and you know, and so basically like when it comes to Facebook and when it comes to the whole bit, it's like there's a lot to be learned in the way that we communicate with each other, and there's a lot to be learning, like how to better, um, get these things across and like but really, like if you expect to have a totally honest discourse, balanced discourse on Facebook, you're not going to get that because you have the potential for people to side with you without even saying anything. So it's it's it's difficult and it is by nature slanted, and I think that helps Facebook because it gets people excited. I think I appreciate Facebook a lot for like you know, when a Vida came out, also big moment that I come on, it's don't cry for me, are just don't I never left mad existence, I can't my problems. Don't keep your distance. Okay, I'm sorry, don't go. Have I said too much? Nothing more I can think of to say to you anyway? Um the image getting out of the rabbit hole, okay, so you know how she comes out onto the Like that is when I see Facebook being most successful, is that now everyone has a balcony. So not like what you're saying, Matt about the comments, I totally agree with, like, um oh, I really owned him, you know, like I eviscerated him all caps um. But it's more it's it's like I don't think that when people come out and they're like, this is a speech I had planned and I'm going to share it. I see such value in that. Like in the last week with women sharing their sexual assault story, I'm not interested in the conversation that has come like anyone arguing with them about it. But I love that I get to listen to it on a platform that then I can scroll to the next one. And if there's a hashtag, I love that I can click on that hashtag and then I can read other women dealing with these stories, you know, and because how else are you gonna get their stories? Do you ever feel concerned though, that, because we're all becoming more accustomed to typing these out, that we can't actually articulate them human and human. I mean we're doing there right now. I don't know we are think I think there is even even if like I'm having a day where I like spend it all on the computer, I have an adjustment period where it's like I gotta talk to a human right now, and there's like a bit of getting my sea legs back, Like you know when you're ice skating and you like forget how to walk for a second. No, I am a perfect ice skaters. You're Tara Levinsky. Ye know, well who I am is exactly. Don't you ever forget it? Bit I'll come at you with my stick, this, selings, this, this. You know that that adjustment period is so it's that applies to anything because I'm because any time I go back to China and I'm using Mandarin, Mandarin Mandarin. As soon as I get back on the return flight and I'm I'm talking to us to an English speaker, I'll be like, oh, so sorry, and then that's going to be like my first full phrase of English that I've spoken in weeks, and I'm like, whoa, what's English? So yeah, that's that's interesting. Wow, you won't speak English for two weeks, you know what. I'm worried. And maybe I've talked about this. The language barrier is getting bigger and bigger the older I get and I have I have less of an excuse for it because like, growing up, like my Mandarin proficiency would track with my age and be like, oh, you're a kid, of course you only know kid words. But now that I'm an adult's pizza pizza pastasia and then um, but then like but now that I'm this, like this like you know, beautiful, beautiful man, I'm gonna and this is just how this is just like this is just um the like the culture in China and guess culture, um is that like people just point out like like my relatives are absolutely be like why your mandarin's gotten much worse, and he'll say that. They'll say that without like being too without being malicious. They're just like making an observation. They're like, Wow, your mandarin is terrible, and I'm going to take that. I'm just I'm really going to let that affect me. And i mean, wow, God, it really does that, doesn't it. No, it doesn't bomb because you don't live there. I know, but I think they are sort of they feel owed the you know, the the conversation. So I'm gonna like, they're gonna ask me about the election. I've listened, I've like, I've translated my answers over It's so fun. Do you think their perspective will be on this election? It's so interesting to go somewhere else in the world and listen to people. No, but you know what it is like and people say this, but like the rest of the world really does like im Bradford. This guy, Bradford Jordan's was tweeting he's in he's in Hong Kong right now, but he was tweeting about how um like he like. The day after the morning after the debate, um like, these kids were huddled around a phone watching the entire debate and being like, I can't believe this is what's happening in America. The same thing wasn't happening in Europe. So I'm gonna I'm gonna go back to China and they're gonna ask me, like why we don't understand how he got there, and I'm gonna be like, yeah, well here's what I think, Like I have to articulate these very complex here's something. Let's end this conversation with that question, Dylan, how did Donald Trump get here? Um? I was just gonna say that. I mean he got here through television. Yeah, he got here through television. And I grew up on a block where he built one of his skyscrapers. So he blocked our river views, so like here, oh yeah, um, and I that is like so I grew up yeah, like I just I always structurally knew of him as this guy who blocked our river views. And that's the sense. Like we were living in a rent stabilized building, um, and there was applausea across the street from us, and it was always under construction, and then he came in and he whipped it up into shape and he like made it be a Park and you're like, at what cost? You always had that question, like what what are we paying for here? And then he erected the skyscraper. Um called it the tallest skyscraper in the world. On the side, yeah, I mean that was the record that he was going, this is the tallest skyscraper in the world, and it said like ninety plus stories and then you saw you learned that they were counting the lobby as like twenty and so it's like, but that all, it says everything. All he needed to have the biggest vertical structure in the world. I always say this about the World Trade Center, America's dick. Yeah, yeah, I mean it's it's this, like I do think this is America's need for size is going to America's obsession with size is going to kill us because, like I mean, in this very direct way with climate change, like everything needs to be as big as possible. And then you go to Europe and you're like, i'll have ice, please, and they're like, no, we don't, we don't have that, and you're like, what I want this heaping with ice? I want a big cup of fluid. How did Donald Trump get here? Um, I think we were talking about this with game change, like off the air, I think, like this week, I think I think it's that it's like you could, Okay, let's let's go backwards Trump Tea Party, Sarah Palin Reagan. There you go, Hubert how break. My opinion is, I think that everyone's really confused in America right now between celebrity and real I think I think it's become one. I think everyone's just really fucked upification. I think, yeah, I think people genuinely take a lot of these celebrities who really should be taken seriously seriously, and I think that's what that is. I think that's so right. And you know, who the hell is she? I have to say, sorry, he's crafted his own image. That's yeah, he's he's curated whoa what? And then and then is a skill? This is gonna. I think that it's time. It's time for I don't think so Honey now, Dylan, I don't know if you're familiar, but I don't think so Honey is a centerpiece. It's what people tune in for, that's what they live for. They listen to Lost Culture Race as they sit through an hour and twenty two twenty three minutes of a podcast and they say, God damn it, that's right. I haven't even gotten to the best part, which is I don't think so. I don't think honey, and it's about to happen. We have sixty seconds to rail against something in culture that's bothering us on a deep, deep level. UM, do you have something that you like to talk about tonight, Bowen? We give you the courtesy of going last. Y. I know what I'm gonna talk about, but let's in keeping with tradition. You want to go first? Or should I? Can you go first? Because I have only the vague formations I have something and I really don't know how I'm gonna talk about this, but I'm about to. Okay, here we go. Matt Matt Rodgers. I don't think so, honey. Times starts one minute, time starts now. I don't think so, honey. Taylor Swift, where is your Hillary Clinton endorsement? I swear to god, Taylor Swift, I don't think so, honey. How come every other pop star and every other notable celebrity can give their fucking endorsement? You are so transparent, Taylor Swift. I don't think so, honey, I'm never paying to see you on concert again. I will rip your fucking albums off the internet. I will. I will make sure you never get another or sent for me unless you come out and support Hillary Clinton in this election. I think it's fucking ridiculous and cowardly. You put your own image over the bettering over the betterment of this nation. And it's so stupid you're saying, I'm this close to overexposure to Kanye West is not an excuse for you to not come out and do the right thing right now. I'm talking every other celebrity, people with just as much to lose as you. You're still gonna have fans if you come out and say the right thing. Seriously, if Beyonce I can do it, if everyone else can do it, why can't you. Your voice is going to make a difference. And I know you know right from wrong. Please, I don't think so, honey, any excuse you might have a cellar swift in doors Hillary Clinton. I don't think so, honey, of you don't that's one minute, Wow, Matt, thank you. Okay, I'm so mad that she hasn't said something. She has so much influence she can she can. Yeah, she can fucking take a ship at the at St. Peter's Basilica and still have all. And that's why I'm saying, like it matters, Like the celebrity bullshit is why Donald Trump is up there. It matters what Taylor so fucking says, Like it's so stupid, but you know it matters. So why doesn't she just say something? Absolutely, she's been dead silent about this whole thing. She doesn't care about the country fans anymore. We are we're supposed to believe. I don't know, it's so stupid and transparent. I hate her. I agree, I agree. Okay, all right, you got it out, You're good. This is this is the point, baby, I truly all right. I'm ready. I'm ready for something. You're gonna give me time. This is bowen yang. So I don't think so, honey, And it starts right now. I don't think so, honey. People who are still afraid of Chippotle. I have been going every I went the week that the oakole I broke out, and I still enjoyed a delicious burrito bowl with smoked tabasco. Honey, I had. I got my life with white rice, black beans, chicken, and now they have Theresa. What's not to love? Get your aster chapole. I don't think so, honey. People who who you know what? Let me ask you this, how much of your fear of Chippole, your stigma of Chapole? How much of that is linked to the cuisine, to the country of origin. You think it's disgusting and it's risky because it's Mexican. I don't want to project, but I think that's what it is, honey. I don't think so, honey. I love Mexican food with my favorite food. And if you don't like Mexican food and any any kind, I don't think so, honey, that's your loss. Enjoy your fucking cheerios that you eat for dinner, you fucking idiot plebeian. I love Chipole. I had it three times this week, and I loved it. It got better with every single consecutive meal. I don't think so many I had three days in a row. How about that. I don't think so many people who don't like to probaly, who are too afraid to be Coli, it's har umnless, you'll live. It'll be a good story to write your fucking novel. And that's one minute. I had Chipotle for lunch today, A bit that might have been my best. That was your best one ever. That was my most impassioned. Okay, I'm proud you really spoke well about about that lunch food. Oh I love it. I love Chipotle so much. I'm you know what, Originian, Colorado. I've been to the first Chippole. I've been a rider died Chipotle stand since two thousand three. Wolright, that's amazing. You know, one time I went on a Valentine's Day date Chap Dylan seconds a topic I do Dylan Maren last I don't think so. I don't think so, Honey is beginning now? I don't think so, honey. Lady Gaga, where is your performance of white ally ship for Black Lives Matter? Okay, you have built a fucking career on being a social justice warrior. You came out and in two thousand and nine I fucking loved you because you accepted awards by saying this is for God and the gays. Then last year you made this amazing, amazing song for the Hunting Ground to talk about sexual assault on college campuses. Fucking amazing. And then this year amid Colin Kaepernick's amazing protest where we could at least talk about disagreement. You were chosen as the super Bowl halftime performer, and you put out a statement that said you were so glad to do this for the fans, but most importantly America, completely missing an opportunity to say black lives matter. And unless you dedicate your performance to black lives matter and police brutality, I can no longer take you seriously as a pop star who is a social justice warriors. Let me tell you today that isn't I don't think it's how you do. I don't think it's funny for everyone. Every piece of ship that's gonna come on the show and that's been on the show so far, fuck you that you haven't done it right. Dylan Maron just took a pop star to task. She will hang her head and because of this episode and if you've been on this show, fuck I never made the connection from her super Bowl, her halftime show opportunity to Colin Caperne, she needs to be an Ayelly. She she can't. Just she's been completely silent about that. Yes she can't, but that they think she can't be a single issue activist pop star. She hasn't been. I'm sorry, I will say she has not been. She's been an advocate of her sexual assault victim, she's been an advocate for the gays she I'm but I want to give her some credit. She's put herself out. She put herself out there, I think, and she has put herself out there. I also therefore from my girl, because I of her like like just deep love everything. And I was astounded by this amazing woman who could blend her very pop, very mainstream entertainment with like real I mean she she gave a speech on don't Don't Tell with a senator. She was like actually pairing with lawmakers. She made transgender lyric whenever win whatever song. You know? Okay, but can I ask you to get through a D at the end? But you know, well sure sure, totally already said orient um and I'm still on board. So okay, But here can I ask you this is it? Would it be um distasteful of her to I mean she it wouldn't be distasteful of her to show support. Would she'd be taking up My question is would she be taking up space over another pop star such as Beyonce? He was so vocal or Kendrick lamar Or because she just has to perform white ally ship that, you know, she just has to show what it's, which she's so smart. I know she knows what that is, you know, like it's uh, she would do it tastefully. Yeah, and and just like but that's exactly what she did with gay rights. She you know, she identifies as bisexual, I believe, yeah, and and uh, a lot of pop stars reneg on that. But but but she she she actively also you know, championed other people. She walked the red carpet and a meat dress for Don't Ask, Don't Tell with escorted by military people. And so she's always been able to really she has been able to marry American institutions with new ways of thinking about them. This is forgotten and the gaze, and I wish you could do that about like this is for America. And this is also where I stand on police brutality. Um. Yeah, So I have high hopes for her. And look, look, we can't forget her. Most her most compelling advocacy for art arriving in eggs, arriving eggs, which I think is her best egg transport. That is, that is the funniest fucking thing and she knows how that's what. That's when I was sold on her. Was like, God, she's fucking I just did. I got golden moment after Sorry, I just did a show Mateolan and Christie Chello hosted Battle of the Divas at Union halland it was so fun. That's going to happen again in November nine, you guys, and I'll be back. Um. But I defended Beyonce and David Mazzoni defended Lady Gaga, and I knew the moment I lost. I did lose. Beyonce lost in the Battle of Deer the first Lady Guy because David whipped out the egg and I was like, honestly, you can't compete with her arriving in an egg at them. You can't compete with the Grammy is. She pressed the Grammys on the right and like she while she was in the egg carpet, she pressed her face up against it and was like she was like she was trying to herself so funny. I love it, Um, guys. I'm a little sad. Why about what? Because I my instinct was to be like right, just towards like Taylor Swift about this thing, and I feel I fear that, like and I'm like talking about how like social like like I feel like I don't know about this whole situation as dimmed. Well that first of all, I don't know it'll be over soon. And second of all, this was and I don't think so, honey, sandwich with pop star activism, bread and a fun little freedis metal. I think that the the message of this ad't mit, honey, is we expect more of our girls we do know here. No, I mean this very serious. If you are a pop star who is going to adopt a socially progressive platform to sell an album such as for every fucking album, yes you can't use feminism and pop feminism to sell white feminism at that and for that matter, yes, white feminism squad goals your token. We were But when and I went to that telesip concert and Zodubook came trotting out and we knew she was the token, and we looked at each other. I want to end on this. Kelly Clarkson called Donald Trump repulsive. Thank you, Kelly, You've always been my number one girl. Guys. They think I think you're perfect. I think you guys, are amazing. You're the most perfect. I think that you're beautiful, and I think you're using your powers for good. And I think God fucking blessed God, La Praise Buddha, Praise Shiva, Vishnu and all of God herself and God herself, you have amazing success. Now, this has been the last Coast Races podcast. We're gonna be missing you, guys. We're gonna be taking a little bit of a break. But b and I hope you have a wonderful time. And I hope you have a wonderful time. Oh, I'm gonna get my life on the fucking Revenge of the Mind. I'm gonna get my right on the tron ride. Honey, girl, you better send me. I'll send you. I'll reviews and photos and videos FaceTime. Are you doing on ride video? No, that's so, I don't think so. Thanks guys. By This has been a Forever Dog production executive produced by Joe Cilio, Alex Ramsay, and Brett Bom. For more podcasts, please visit Dog Productions dot com. To the Rule