Joan is joined by Rich Logis, founder and executive director of Leaving MAGA. He discussed his journey from a hardcore MAGA supporter to a Trump critic, revealing that his departure took a year due to strong community ties and the "liberating but painful realization" that his political beliefs were based on lies. He cited the Uvalde school shooting as a pivotal moment.

"After that day, Joan, I quietly left MAGA," Logis told WCPT. "I only told a few people. I privately left. And when I did that, something was gnawing at me that that wasn't enough. I was always very unapologetically public in my support for Trump; I felt that I needed to reciprocate and I needed to be unapologetically public in my renunciation of MAGA. And it was on August 30, 2022 when I published a mea culpa and in that mea culpa I said that I was wrong, that I hurt others, and that I was sorry that I supported Trump."

Logis also talked about his five-step guide for re-engaging MAGA supporters, stressing the importance of respectful conversations and understanding motivations -- "first empathy, then education," in the words of his ebook.  

Catch "Joan Esposito: Live, Local and Progressive" weekdays from 2:00 to 5:00 p.m. Central on WCPT (heartlandsignal.com/programs/live-local-progressive).