I'm joined now on the phone by Laura Elizabeth Woollett. Welcome, Laura. So nice to have the subject of today's episode of Literary Ear with us. So, Laura, how are you and where are you speaking to us from today?

I'm joined now on the phone by Laura Elizabeth Woollett. Welcome, Laura. So nice to have the subject of today's episode of Literary Ear with us. So, Laura, how are you and where are you speaking to us from today?

Today I'm in Melbourne, just on my porch at home. It's warm enough today to be having some outdoor time, which is nice.

Today I'm in Melbourne, just on my porch at home. It's warm enough today to be having some outdoor time, which is nice.

Nice. You've written a short story collection and three novels, plus numerous articles for The Guardian, Kill Your Darlings, Sydney Review of Books and others. Is writing your full time gig?

Nice. You've written a short story collection and three novels, plus numerous articles for The Guardian, Kill Your Darlings, Sydney Review of Books and others. Is writing your full time gig?

Uh, no. I'm actually working right now as a bookseller two days a week, which is great. Um, yeah, I've had a lot of jobs in the past, um, around writing, but bookselling is actually one that still makes me feel like I'm in touch with the community and, um, get to see all the books that are coming through, which is great. And I'm also a mum. Uh, since October 2023. So that takes up a lot of my time as well. Um, looking after my little one, I.

Uh, no. I'm actually working right now as a bookseller two days a week, which is great. Um, yeah, I've had a lot of jobs in the past, um, around writing, but bookselling is actually one that still makes me feel like I'm in touch with the community and, um, get to see all the books that are coming through, which is great. And I'm also a mum. Uh, since October 2023. So that takes up a lot of my time as well. Um, looking after my little one, I.

Actually wanted to ask, what is your writing process? And I did wonder if it had been, um, if it had shifted since you did become a mum. So could you tell us about that a little bit?

Actually wanted to ask, what is your writing process? And I did wonder if it had been, um, if it had shifted since you did become a mum. So could you tell us about that a little bit?

Yeah, I honestly, I feel like my process changes from book to book, um, with and with everything that's going on in my life at the same time. So, you know, I've had times in the past where I would just write, like every spare moment. I would, you know, bring my laptop to work with me. And I would write on my lunch breaks and on the tram and stuff. Um, I don't do that anymore. I kind of have more dedicated writing days. Today is one of them, because my my son is at daycare. Yeah. And, you know, nap times and stuff, obviously. And Saturday is I'll usually have a bit of cafe time. Um, and I tend to work best at the moment from cafes. But during lockdown and stuff, I was very much working from home the whole time.

Yeah, I honestly, I feel like my process changes from book to book, um, with and with everything that's going on in my life at the same time. So, you know, I've had times in the past where I would just write, like every spare moment. I would, you know, bring my laptop to work with me. And I would write on my lunch breaks and on the tram and stuff. Um, I don't do that anymore. I kind of have more dedicated writing days. Today is one of them, because my my son is at daycare. Yeah. And, you know, nap times and stuff, obviously. And Saturday is I'll usually have a bit of cafe time. Um, and I tend to work best at the moment from cafes. But during lockdown and stuff, I was very much working from home the whole time.

Do you have a lot of author friends? Are you in a writing group or more of a of a solo cafe goer and writer.

Do you have a lot of author friends? Are you in a writing group or more of a of a solo cafe goer and writer.

Um, I have had writing groups in the past. They haven't really maintained, I guess. Um, yeah, I do have a lot of writer friends and people I catch up with, and I think those connections are really important for morale and stuff. Just like having people to talk about, you know, all the all your complaints with without it getting, you know, too far out there. But, um, yeah, I think those connections are really important. And having friendships with other writers like you often like discuss what you're trying to do and end up like giving each other like recommendations of things to read. And also just like being excited for each other's work, I think is such an important thing.

Um, I have had writing groups in the past. They haven't really maintained, I guess. Um, yeah, I do have a lot of writer friends and people I catch up with, and I think those connections are really important for morale and stuff. Just like having people to talk about, you know, all the all your complaints with without it getting, you know, too far out there. But, um, yeah, I think those connections are really important. And having friendships with other writers like you often like discuss what you're trying to do and end up like giving each other like recommendations of things to read. And also just like being excited for each other's work, I think is such an important thing.

Your work, the love of a bad man and Beautiful revolutionary in particular, are based on heaps of research. Did the ideas for those books come from research or reading that you were doing, or did you go in knowing who and what you wanted to write about?

Your work, the love of a bad man and Beautiful revolutionary in particular, are based on heaps of research. Did the ideas for those books come from research or reading that you were doing, or did you go in knowing who and what you wanted to write about?

Bat. Yeah, kind of both. Like the concept for the Love of Batman was a concept I had. Like early on, I the title came to me before I had really written much of the book at all. Um, I knew I wanted to write a short story collection about women who had been, um, girlfriends or wives, lovers of notorious bad men through history. And so from there, I kind of, um, I knew a few cases off the top of my head that I was really interested in and wanted to look into, but I also was I started, you know, trying to find more, more cases like that and decided which subjects to write about. And um, so I did, you know, so much more research than actually made it into the book. And I would, you know, do a lot of reading on one case and then decide, no, I don't have a sympathetic point of entry for this character or I can't quite get there. So I would abandon things quite a bit as well. Um, I do love research, which helps. Uh, beautiful. Revolutionary. Actually, um, that book came out of a short story that I was intending to write For the Love of Batman, which, um, expanded, and in particular, um, my character, main character in Beautiful Revolutionaries named Evelyn Linden. But she's based on a real life woman called Carolyn Layton, who, um, when I began reading about her, she really fascinated me. But she was also quite difficult to pin down, um, especially in the short story form and especially like a first person short story, which all those stories are. So I ended up going so much wider and, um, it expanded into this 400 page book.

Bat. Yeah, kind of both. Like the concept for the Love of Batman was a concept I had. Like early on, I the title came to me before I had really written much of the book at all. Um, I knew I wanted to write a short story collection about women who had been, um, girlfriends or wives, lovers of notorious bad men through history. And so from there, I kind of, um, I knew a few cases off the top of my head that I was really interested in and wanted to look into, but I also was I started, you know, trying to find more, more cases like that and decided which subjects to write about. And um, so I did, you know, so much more research than actually made it into the book. And I would, you know, do a lot of reading on one case and then decide, no, I don't have a sympathetic point of entry for this character or I can't quite get there. So I would abandon things quite a bit as well. Um, I do love research, which helps. Uh, beautiful. Revolutionary. Actually, um, that book came out of a short story that I was intending to write For the Love of Batman, which, um, expanded, and in particular, um, my character, main character in Beautiful Revolutionaries named Evelyn Linden. But she's based on a real life woman called Carolyn Layton, who, um, when I began reading about her, she really fascinated me. But she was also quite difficult to pin down, um, especially in the short story form and especially like a first person short story, which all those stories are. So I ended up going so much wider and, um, it expanded into this 400 page book.

Yeah, that was quite a long book, and it was so interesting reading your take of Evelyn. I found it fascinating, all the ins and outs of everything she was going through and, um, her relationship with Jim Jones. Yeah, I thought it was just so well done. And I believe for that. You even visited the sister of Carolyn Layton, um, who Evelyn was based on, as you said. And can you tell us a bit about the notebook you found on your trip to California?

Yeah, that was quite a long book, and it was so interesting reading your take of Evelyn. I found it fascinating, all the ins and outs of everything she was going through and, um, her relationship with Jim Jones. Yeah, I thought it was just so well done. And I believe for that. You even visited the sister of Carolyn Layton, um, who Evelyn was based on, as you said. And can you tell us a bit about the notebook you found on your trip to California?

I spent two months in the US kind of traveling, but also doing research for that book. And, um, it's kind of funny in retrospect because I didn't know really know anything about arts funding. So I kind of just used my own savings and took myself on this trip and didn't realize you can, like, apply for grants and stuff to help you with that sort of stuff. I, uh, spent a few days with Rebecca Moore, who is the sister of Carolyn Layton, um, and her husband, and together, uh, they founded a website about Jonestown. And they are kind of the keepers of all the research, really, that, like, they're such important people. For anyone who is wanting to do any research on Jonestown, but they were incredibly open with me, and I got to ask Becky about her sister a lot. Um, but also, they were really helpful with putting me in touch with, um, other Jonestown researchers and survivors. So I interviewed people as well. But then I actually spent a month in San Francisco. Um, in a few days a week, I would be in the California Historical Society archives looking at documents. And yeah, one of the documents I found was just a little notebook, which, um, I think gives it a bit more credit than what it was. It wasn't a diary or anything. It just had little notes here and there. And I do remember finding a note in there, which I believe was written by Carolyn, but I'm not quite sure. Um, but it was a message which I, I don't know if I can quote it from memory, but I believe she wrote to Jim Jones and reading that message kind of like, okay, it gave me a sense of her voice, and it gave me a sense of their relationship in a way that, um, I might not have otherwise had. And I think, you know, like, um, even if it wasn't actually what I believed it to be, kind of finding something like that, your imagination goes in all these directions and fills in the gaps, I guess. So, yeah, that was an incredible, um, time and, you know, opportunity to spend time with all those documents. And I was, you know, looking at letters and photographs and everything just for hours every day. So really got in deep.

I spent two months in the US kind of traveling, but also doing research for that book. And, um, it's kind of funny in retrospect because I didn't know really know anything about arts funding. So I kind of just used my own savings and took myself on this trip and didn't realize you can, like, apply for grants and stuff to help you with that sort of stuff. I, uh, spent a few days with Rebecca Moore, who is the sister of Carolyn Layton, um, and her husband, and together, uh, they founded a website about Jonestown. And they are kind of the keepers of all the research, really, that, like, they're such important people. For anyone who is wanting to do any research on Jonestown, but they were incredibly open with me, and I got to ask Becky about her sister a lot. Um, but also, they were really helpful with putting me in touch with, um, other Jonestown researchers and survivors. So I interviewed people as well. But then I actually spent a month in San Francisco. Um, in a few days a week, I would be in the California Historical Society archives looking at documents. And yeah, one of the documents I found was just a little notebook, which, um, I think gives it a bit more credit than what it was. It wasn't a diary or anything. It just had little notes here and there. And I do remember finding a note in there, which I believe was written by Carolyn, but I'm not quite sure. Um, but it was a message which I, I don't know if I can quote it from memory, but I believe she wrote to Jim Jones and reading that message kind of like, okay, it gave me a sense of her voice, and it gave me a sense of their relationship in a way that, um, I might not have otherwise had. And I think, you know, like, um, even if it wasn't actually what I believed it to be, kind of finding something like that, your imagination goes in all these directions and fills in the gaps, I guess. So, yeah, that was an incredible, um, time and, you know, opportunity to spend time with all those documents. And I was, you know, looking at letters and photographs and everything just for hours every day. So really got in deep.

The intrigue I love that. I love the little note that you found. I think it was something like, um, father, if we don't want to die today, we better get to work. Yeah. That's it. Amazing that you found that you really got in deep to the to the research and yeah, absolutely paid off. The novel was great. I really love novels, and short stories hold a special place in my heart, and I so enjoyed in your latest book, West Girls, in that it was presented as a series of vignettes or short stories that were all interlinked. It was a really effective way for me as a reader to get into each of the characters minds. Did you set out to write the novel in that way, or did it just evolve?

The intrigue I love that. I love the little note that you found. I think it was something like, um, father, if we don't want to die today, we better get to work. Yeah. That's it. Amazing that you found that you really got in deep to the to the research and yeah, absolutely paid off. The novel was great. I really love novels, and short stories hold a special place in my heart, and I so enjoyed in your latest book, West Girls, in that it was presented as a series of vignettes or short stories that were all interlinked. It was a really effective way for me as a reader to get into each of the characters minds. Did you set out to write the novel in that way, or did it just evolve?

It definitely evolved. So the earliest stories were actually written back in, um, like 2017, 2018 as standalone stories and sort of I think it was around 2020, I was procrastinating from another novel, which I ended up abandoning. And part of this really came from, um, being based in Melbourne and being in like heavy lockdown and separated from my family in WA and not able to visit them for two years. I kind of had a new interest in like longing for Wha. Which was, um. Yeah. A lot stronger than anything I'd ever experienced about my hometown. And I sort of, um, sublimated this desire to go back home with, like, writing about wha. So, um, I had the idea for just a few stories set in Perth, and that kind of expanded. And then, um, I, on top of that, started rethinking these older. There were about three stories that I had already written and started rethinking them, um, and wondering if maybe, um, this character who I ended up calling Luna Louis, um, if she could be the same person from one story to another. So I had these stories about a pre-teen girl traveling around with her mum, and then I had another story about, um, a grown woman who is married to a To a diplomat and living in Jakarta. And I started thinking, I guess, like, oh, what if this character is the same person? What do the intervening years of her life look like? So that took me, you know, on this path which ended up being West Girls and the structure of West Girls? Um, not everyone likes it, but it it's something that I enjoyed. Where, um, one story will be from about Luna or from her perspective, and the next story will be about a completely different character. Um, and I was really playing with this idea, which I think anyone who's familiar with Perth will sort of relate to, um, of having, you know, not that many degrees of separation between people. So if you talk to someone for long enough, I think you'll find like, oh, your sister knows this person who I also know something like that. So I was playing with these connections, which aren't necessarily that vital or meaningful necessarily, but to give a sense of how these characters all live in the same universe, I guess.

It definitely evolved. So the earliest stories were actually written back in, um, like 2017, 2018 as standalone stories and sort of I think it was around 2020, I was procrastinating from another novel, which I ended up abandoning. And part of this really came from, um, being based in Melbourne and being in like heavy lockdown and separated from my family in WA and not able to visit them for two years. I kind of had a new interest in like longing for Wha. Which was, um. Yeah. A lot stronger than anything I'd ever experienced about my hometown. And I sort of, um, sublimated this desire to go back home with, like, writing about wha. So, um, I had the idea for just a few stories set in Perth, and that kind of expanded. And then, um, I, on top of that, started rethinking these older. There were about three stories that I had already written and started rethinking them, um, and wondering if maybe, um, this character who I ended up calling Luna Louis, um, if she could be the same person from one story to another. So I had these stories about a pre-teen girl traveling around with her mum, and then I had another story about, um, a grown woman who is married to a To a diplomat and living in Jakarta. And I started thinking, I guess, like, oh, what if this character is the same person? What do the intervening years of her life look like? So that took me, you know, on this path which ended up being West Girls and the structure of West Girls? Um, not everyone likes it, but it it's something that I enjoyed. Where, um, one story will be from about Luna or from her perspective, and the next story will be about a completely different character. Um, and I was really playing with this idea, which I think anyone who's familiar with Perth will sort of relate to, um, of having, you know, not that many degrees of separation between people. So if you talk to someone for long enough, I think you'll find like, oh, your sister knows this person who I also know something like that. So I was playing with these connections, which aren't necessarily that vital or meaningful necessarily, but to give a sense of how these characters all live in the same universe, I guess.

Absolutely. That is so Perth for someone who lives in Perth and has for quite a while. Absolutely. We all know everyone somehow. Um, and there are so many cultural references in West girls that were familiar to me. Perth, as you said, it was very familiar to someone who lives in Perth, but also what girls were interested in in the late 90s and early 2000 when I was a teen. Like what impulse spray they were wearing, who they were listening to. So how much of the book was inspired by your own personal experience of both Perth and just growing up here and in Australia?

Absolutely. That is so Perth for someone who lives in Perth and has for quite a while. Absolutely. We all know everyone somehow. Um, and there are so many cultural references in West girls that were familiar to me. Perth, as you said, it was very familiar to someone who lives in Perth, but also what girls were interested in in the late 90s and early 2000 when I was a teen. Like what impulse spray they were wearing, who they were listening to. So how much of the book was inspired by your own personal experience of both Perth and just growing up here and in Australia?

Yeah, so much of it. Um, yeah, it was really, you know, like even though the characters get into like outlandish situations sometimes, like, I'm starting from this point of like, complete familiarity and, um, the world that these characters grow up in is very much my world for the most part. That I grew up in. Um, yeah. And that was kind of a bit of a change for me, because I wasn't doing heavy research because I already had this knowledge base that existed. And, um, yeah, you know, I think growing up in the 2000, like it's a time that I think in general, millennials are very nostalgic for a lot of reasons. But, um, I think there's this nostalgia, but also this acknowledgement of like, that was kind of not a great time in a lot of ways. And, you know, especially like the diet culture and stuff. And, um, you know, my characters, a lot of them are some of them are models, some of them are just girls who are aspiring to beauty and glamour. So how that kind of impacts their girlhood, I guess, and also the women they grow up to be.

Yeah, so much of it. Um, yeah, it was really, you know, like even though the characters get into like outlandish situations sometimes, like, I'm starting from this point of like, complete familiarity and, um, the world that these characters grow up in is very much my world for the most part. That I grew up in. Um, yeah. And that was kind of a bit of a change for me, because I wasn't doing heavy research because I already had this knowledge base that existed. And, um, yeah, you know, I think growing up in the 2000, like it's a time that I think in general, millennials are very nostalgic for a lot of reasons. But, um, I think there's this nostalgia, but also this acknowledgement of like, that was kind of not a great time in a lot of ways. And, you know, especially like the diet culture and stuff. And, um, you know, my characters, a lot of them are some of them are models, some of them are just girls who are aspiring to beauty and glamour. So how that kind of impacts their girlhood, I guess, and also the women they grow up to be.

I really enjoyed your sometimes really acidic takes on their experiences and on their characters and how they present themselves, and also how you deal with beauty. And with Luna turning herself into Luna. Luna to become really exotic and an international model was really interesting. It was such a journey to go on. R.F. Kuang's Yellowface came out at around the same time as West Girls, and of course, that novel also deals with cultural appropriation, but in a very different way. Have you read that book?

I really enjoyed your sometimes really acidic takes on their experiences and on their characters and how they present themselves, and also how you deal with beauty. And with Luna turning herself into Luna. Luna to become really exotic and an international model was really interesting. It was such a journey to go on. R.F. Kuang's Yellowface came out at around the same time as West Girls, and of course, that novel also deals with cultural appropriation, but in a very different way. Have you read that book?

I still haven't read it. Yeah, I've read a lot of criticism and like reviews of and I do think I'll read it one day when I'm in the mood, but I think almost having a book out at the same time as my book that was dealing with the same subject matter, I was kind of like, well, I've already written the book, you know, um, I think it might be of more interest to people who haven't spent that time thinking about those issues as much. It makes sense that books are coming out about cultural appropriation and racial misrepresentation, whatever you want to call it. Like it's obviously, um, an interesting time, I think, especially with algorithmic beauty and what beauty means today on Instagram and stuff, where racial blurring the lines and stuff is quite, uh, rough. And um, also that combined with like the sort of, um, culture of like wanting, uh, I guess, to come across as less privileged than you actually are. And sometimes that means people assuming that, um, you know, people who aren't white, uh, have things, um, you know, easier even if they don't. But people sort of, um, assuming that to be called privileged is an insult, and therefore they want to present themselves as less privileged than they are, I think is definitely a thing. Um, so it was interesting to explore those Is sort of, um, subterranean motivations and senses of entitlement with Luna, because she is a character who I think, um, like myself, she grows up in a blended family. She grows up with, um, siblings who are half Indonesian. Um, so in a way, she does feel quite entitled to present herself as not white. Um, and I think that entitlement was such a central thing to her character and also such a central thing in general, I think, to, um, white womanhood more generally.

I still haven't read it. Yeah, I've read a lot of criticism and like reviews of and I do think I'll read it one day when I'm in the mood, but I think almost having a book out at the same time as my book that was dealing with the same subject matter, I was kind of like, well, I've already written the book, you know, um, I think it might be of more interest to people who haven't spent that time thinking about those issues as much. It makes sense that books are coming out about cultural appropriation and racial misrepresentation, whatever you want to call it. Like it's obviously, um, an interesting time, I think, especially with algorithmic beauty and what beauty means today on Instagram and stuff, where racial blurring the lines and stuff is quite, uh, rough. And um, also that combined with like the sort of, um, culture of like wanting, uh, I guess, to come across as less privileged than you actually are. And sometimes that means people assuming that, um, you know, people who aren't white, uh, have things, um, you know, easier even if they don't. But people sort of, um, assuming that to be called privileged is an insult, and therefore they want to present themselves as less privileged than they are, I think is definitely a thing. Um, so it was interesting to explore those Is sort of, um, subterranean motivations and senses of entitlement with Luna, because she is a character who I think, um, like myself, she grows up in a blended family. She grows up with, um, siblings who are half Indonesian. Um, so in a way, she does feel quite entitled to present herself as not white. Um, and I think that entitlement was such a central thing to her character and also such a central thing in general, I think, to, um, white womanhood more generally.

A quote from Jessie Too's review of your novel West Girls in the Sydney Morning Herald really stood out to me how you explored what it means to be a Winona in a world made for Gwyneths. Would you like to speak to that?

A quote from Jessie Too's review of your novel West Girls in the Sydney Morning Herald really stood out to me how you explored what it means to be a Winona in a world made for Gwyneths. Would you like to speak to that?

I mean, I don't know if I really relate to that assessment because I think, uh, I mean, being a Winona is like, not a bad thing. And I think a lot of people would rather be a Winona. Than a Gwyneth. Um, but I think definitely in Perth in the early 2000. Um, there was very much like a these were the pretty girls. These are the. Girls who are ideal and top tier. And that meant, you know, being blonde and tanned. And if not sporty, then adjacent to men who were playing sports. Um, so I think that that beauty ideal did exist at the time. Um, but I also think at the same time there was this, like, very strong, not like other girls, um, impulse as well. And I think Luna is one of those girls who feels superior to the, um, the, you know, quote unquote pretty, pretty girls. Like, um, she does feel like she's different. And, um, because of being different, I think she considers herself better in some ways. So there is a really interesting dynamic there where, um, you know, the the brunettes, um, can sometimes feel like not the ideal beauty type. But then there is also like, um, I don't have this superficiality. I'm a, I'm a different kind of girl. Um, so that dynamic between Luna and in particular, um, a girl called Caitlin was really interesting to play around with.

I mean, I don't know if I really relate to that assessment because I think, uh, I mean, being a Winona is like, not a bad thing. And I think a lot of people would rather be a Winona. Than a Gwyneth. Um, but I think definitely in Perth in the early 2000. Um, there was very much like a these were the pretty girls. These are the. Girls who are ideal and top tier. And that meant, you know, being blonde and tanned. And if not sporty, then adjacent to men who were playing sports. Um, so I think that that beauty ideal did exist at the time. Um, but I also think at the same time there was this, like, very strong, not like other girls, um, impulse as well. And I think Luna is one of those girls who feels superior to the, um, the, you know, quote unquote pretty, pretty girls. Like, um, she does feel like she's different. And, um, because of being different, I think she considers herself better in some ways. So there is a really interesting dynamic there where, um, you know, the the brunettes, um, can sometimes feel like not the ideal beauty type. But then there is also like, um, I don't have this superficiality. I'm a, I'm a different kind of girl. Um, so that dynamic between Luna and in particular, um, a girl called Caitlin was really interesting to play around with.

Yeah. And it had such an interesting outcome as well. I've seen on your social media posts, and also knowing now that you're a bookseller, that you are an avid reader. So what makes something a good read from your perspective? I mean.

Yeah. And it had such an interesting outcome as well. I've seen on your social media posts, and also knowing now that you're a bookseller, that you are an avid reader. So what makes something a good read from your perspective? I mean.

Part of it for me is also about timing. I think some books just come to you at the right time in your life and like, hit you and like, appears like what you're craving at the time. Um, but I think, like, voice is such a important thing to me and also a sense of place. Um, right now I'm reading Boy Parts by Eliza Clark, who, She's an author from Newcastle in England. So north of England. And like, it's such a funny, darkly funny book, which is what I tend to go for. Um, but yeah, just everything, you know, the dialogue and the voice of the narrator, it you can really feel like not only this is a real person, but like, even without describing, um, the city that much like, you feel like you're somewhere different. I'm quite drawn to books which transport me somewhere and that really feel like this is a world that the author knows well. And, um, they're putting you in this world. But I also, I like dark humor as well. I prefer when books are funny and maybe not taking themselves too seriously, but also still having those like dark themes.

Part of it for me is also about timing. I think some books just come to you at the right time in your life and like, hit you and like, appears like what you're craving at the time. Um, but I think, like, voice is such a important thing to me and also a sense of place. Um, right now I'm reading Boy Parts by Eliza Clark, who, She's an author from Newcastle in England. So north of England. And like, it's such a funny, darkly funny book, which is what I tend to go for. Um, but yeah, just everything, you know, the dialogue and the voice of the narrator, it you can really feel like not only this is a real person, but like, even without describing, um, the city that much like, you feel like you're somewhere different. I'm quite drawn to books which transport me somewhere and that really feel like this is a world that the author knows well. And, um, they're putting you in this world. But I also, I like dark humor as well. I prefer when books are funny and maybe not taking themselves too seriously, but also still having those like dark themes.

And having read your work, I think you do. Gothic and dark humor quite well as well. So it comes off. Comes off in your writing. Um, so what's been on your mind lately and what are you are you working on next?

And having read your work, I think you do. Gothic and dark humor quite well as well. So it comes off. Comes off in your writing. Um, so what's been on your mind lately and what are you are you working on next?

Yeah. Um, so I'm working on my first non-fiction book, and it's progressing very, very slowly. Um, I've been thinking about the issues in it since about 2022. At least I would say. And I'm doing research, but it's been such a huge process and, um, I can't say too much about the subject matter, but, uh, it is like a mix of, um, scientific research, which is a very new thing for me and a very challenging thing for me, and psychology and so forth. Um, hormones. Uh, but also a lot of, um, you know, cultural analysis and especially interrogating gender and so forth, which is something I've done in my fiction a lot more. And, um, there's a bit of memoir in there, too, but I am interviewing people as well. So going going beyond myself and writing about these issues. Um, but yeah, non-fiction Fiction is very much a change of pace from fiction, and I think coming back to fiction when I'm done with this book will be a huge relief.

Yeah. Um, so I'm working on my first non-fiction book, and it's progressing very, very slowly. Um, I've been thinking about the issues in it since about 2022. At least I would say. And I'm doing research, but it's been such a huge process and, um, I can't say too much about the subject matter, but, uh, it is like a mix of, um, scientific research, which is a very new thing for me and a very challenging thing for me, and psychology and so forth. Um, hormones. Uh, but also a lot of, um, you know, cultural analysis and especially interrogating gender and so forth, which is something I've done in my fiction a lot more. And, um, there's a bit of memoir in there, too, but I am interviewing people as well. So going going beyond myself and writing about these issues. Um, but yeah, non-fiction Fiction is very much a change of pace from fiction, and I think coming back to fiction when I'm done with this book will be a huge relief.

It's such a treat after this. Yeah, but it sounds fascinating. I look forward to hearing more. And can you tell us about your upcoming Paris adventure?

It's such a treat after this. Yeah, but it sounds fascinating. I look forward to hearing more. And can you tell us about your upcoming Paris adventure?

Well. Visas pending. Um, we're still waiting on our visa application to come through. And I'm a bit, um, concerned about that, but I have a six month residency at the Kissing Studio in the Cité des Arts in Paris. And that's, um, program through Creative Australia, which, um, I applied for once before and got rejected. And then I was like, no way is this gonna, you know, do better than my last application. So I was like, extremely shocked when I was approved for this experience. And, um, yeah, we're sort of uprooting ourselves to Paris for six months, which is going to going to be amazing. Hopefully, if we can get there. Yeah, but I'm going with my my son and my husband and it's really like such a special thing to be able to write in a different environment and to bring my family along with me. So the plan is to keep working on the nonfiction, but also to develop ideas and stuff for my next novel, which, um, I do have an idea. I have a lot of ideas, but doing the work to actually make it into a book is the hard part.

Well. Visas pending. Um, we're still waiting on our visa application to come through. And I'm a bit, um, concerned about that, but I have a six month residency at the Kissing Studio in the Cité des Arts in Paris. And that's, um, program through Creative Australia, which, um, I applied for once before and got rejected. And then I was like, no way is this gonna, you know, do better than my last application. So I was like, extremely shocked when I was approved for this experience. And, um, yeah, we're sort of uprooting ourselves to Paris for six months, which is going to going to be amazing. Hopefully, if we can get there. Yeah, but I'm going with my my son and my husband and it's really like such a special thing to be able to write in a different environment and to bring my family along with me. So the plan is to keep working on the nonfiction, but also to develop ideas and stuff for my next novel, which, um, I do have an idea. I have a lot of ideas, but doing the work to actually make it into a book is the hard part.

Sounds really exciting and such an amazing opportunity. I hope that you and your family have get your visas first of all, and that you have a wonderful time in Paris when you get there. Laura, it's been fantastic speaking to you today. I really appreciate your time on what is supposed to be your writing day. So off you go. Now go and get some writing done on that nonfiction piece. I hope to read your work in the very near future. Some new work from you and all the best.

Sounds really exciting and such an amazing opportunity. I hope that you and your family have get your visas first of all, and that you have a wonderful time in Paris when you get there. Laura, it's been fantastic speaking to you today. I really appreciate your time on what is supposed to be your writing day. So off you go. Now go and get some writing done on that nonfiction piece. I hope to read your work in the very near future. Some new work from you and all the best.

Oh thank you.

Oh thank you.