Want to be a great leader by Friday? You can, and it's even easier than you think. Dr. Kevin Leman will join us to provide information, motivation, and inspiration for work and life success. Learn why people do what they do and how to uniquely motivate them. Discover how to refine your leadership traits, explore best-result strategies, and create an intentional environment that matches your mission and goals. Uncover the secrets to managing that often-exclusive work and home balance and much, much more. Find out how to spark your world-changing potential.
Hi, friend. This is Janet Parshall. Thank you so much for downloading this broadcast, and I truly hope you hear something that encourages, edify, equips, enlightens, and then gently but forcibly get you out there into the marketplace of ideas. But before you listen and before you go, let me just tell you a little something about this month's truth tool. It's called living in the Days of Deception, and it's written by pastor Jack Hibbs. You know, Jesus warned that deception would grow worse as we grow nearer to the end times, saying, take heed that no one deceives you. And distinguishing truth from error has become an increasingly challenging task even in the church. Why I love this book is that Pastor Hibbs does a wonderful job of teaching us how to discern what is true from what's false, and also, at the same time, teaches us how to stand firm for our faith. That's really what in the market with Janet Parshall is all about being a good discerner, being a good Berean, measuring all things with the straight stick of truth. So I want to encourage you, if you can, please financially support this program and get a copy of living in the Days of Deception. It's yours for a gift of any amount by calling 877 Janet 58. That's 877. Janet 58. Or you can give online at in the market with Janet parshall.org in the market with Janet parshall.org. Scroll to the bottom of the page. There's the cover of the book. Click on through. Make your donation. And my way of saying thank you for supporting the program is to send you a copy of living in the Days of Deception, My Truth tool for the month of November. By the way, you might want to consider becoming a partial partner. Those are people who give every single month at a level of their own choosing. You always get the truth tool, but in addition to that, you get a weekly newsletter that includes some writing by me and an audio piece that only my partial partners receive. All of that information, again, can be translated to you if you want to financially support in the market. With Janet Parshall 877 Janet 58 877 Janet 58 or go to in the market with Janet parshall.org. Thanks so much for letting me take a moment. And now please enjoy the broadcast.
Here are some of the news headlines we're watching.
This time the conference was over. The president won a pledge.
Americans worshiping government over God.
Extremely rare safety move by.
A major 17 years. The Palestinians and Israelis negotiated.
This is not an excuse.
Hi friends. Welcome to In the Market with Janet Parshall. Thank you so much for choosing to spend the hour with me. Right. In full disclosure, I don't often do a lot of conversations with authors who write about leadership, and I'm going to tell you why in full transparency, because so often and I'm talking to a boatload of people from Guam all the way over there to the Cayman Islands and a ton of places in between, a lot of people think, well, I'm not a leader, so this isn't going to apply to me and click. They mentally, they figuratively or they literally turn off because they're thinking, well, I don't have a ministry, I don't have a business. I'm not the head of my shop. I'm not the head of my union. I'm not the head of anything. I'm not a leader. So therefore this doesn't apply to me. But then I thought to myself, yeah, but this particular book on leadership is written by Doctor Kevin Leman. And who wouldn't want to spend time with him anytime, anywhere, any day to talk about just about anything? And of course, I'm glad I made that decision because I wasn't five seconds into his brand new book, Be a Great Leader by Friday, and I realized that the man who gave us the birth order, right. This was going to have to factor into his thinking about leadership. And sure enough, I wasn't disappointed. So this is a book that applies to absolutely every single one of us. And I'm going to ask my first question to my good friend, Doctor Kevin Leman, why this book applies to everybody, not just CEOs, in a minute. But first, I want to give you the professional introduction. Doctor Kevin Leman is an internationally known psychologist, radio and TV personality. He's an educator. He's taught and entertained audiences worldwide with his wit and common sense psychology. The New York Times bestselling author of over 77 zero sports fans. He speaks frequently to CEO groups and businesses, including fortune 500 companies, Ypo, Million Dollar Roundtable, and Top of the Table. He's the founder of the Leman Academy of Excellence schools. That's a whole outstanding conversation in and of itself, particularly as the topic of school choice is now hotter more than ever. But having said that, take off your shoes. Kick back. Pull up a chair. Welcome, doctor Kevin Leman. It's a joy to be back with you again. I have missed you, friend. I'm glad to talk to you again.
Well, hello. The feeling's mutual. I tell your producers I love Janet. Let's. Let's talk. So I'm glad to be with you, Janet.
Thank you so much. So go to my core question, truly. I mean, I think so. I'm not in the business of practicing discouragement. And if I want to have a conversation about leaders, leaders love these conversations. But people who don't consider themselves leaders go. It doesn't have anything to do for me. Aren't we all leaders? Don't we each have a sphere of influence?
I think so. I mean, I never thought I was a leader as a kid. I mean, you know my story. I graduated fourth in the bottom in high school. Couldn't get in college, got in college on probation, lasted a year in a semester. They threw me out. I became a janitor. And someone said, God does work in mysterious ways. I met my wife when I was a janitor in the men's restroom of Tucson Medical Center, one of our local hospitals, and her head nurse, by the way, pulled her aside and said, Sandy, don't associate with that janitor. He'll never amount to anything. So I had a lot of reason to doubt that I was ever a leader. But I discovered that once I became a believer, which was about 18 months after that meeting, my bride, um, you know, my whole life turned around and I saw that God gave me some gifts. And I used to apologize for humor. Well, how do you survive the view?
Exactly the.
View. ABC TV. How do you survive? The view. Talking about my book sheet music, which is about intimacy and marriage. How do you survive that without humor? That's exactly right. I realized that God, God gives us all different gifts. And people ask me, well, who's this book for? CEOs? I said, yeah, CEOs will love this book. I speak to CEO groups all the time. But wannabe people, wannabe leaders, husbands, wives. Yes. Um, it's really a book for everybody, the way the shepherd has sold in the hundreds of thousands. And that book is in hardback, uh, for 20 years. And in the book, business people ought to know their book stays in hardback for a year, and then they dump it into paperback. Right. So the way the Shepherd is sort of the big picture of leadership, be a great leader by Friday is sort of hands on. This is what you do. This is how you do it. So it's it's very practical.
Yes it is. And I love the way the book is laid out. It's there's there's so many questions that you ask. You you create what you call Lehman isms. Give us the working definition of a Lehman ism because they're so good.
Well, I get in so much trouble. I wrote a book called, uh, let's see, what's the name of it? I should pull it up. Where do you get old, Janet? You can't remember the titles of your own book, but in one of the books I talk about Proverbs three, and I demonize, uh, Solomon's words beyond measure. Uh, you just have to understand that. Well, here's a Lehman ism. No, those you serve and serve those, you know. Yes, that's a Lehman ism. Uh, you know, if you have to tell people that you're a leader. I got news for you, Jack. You're not a leader. So you have to have a presence. You have to have a visibility. Uh, and people today. I mean, let's face it, our world is changing at warp speed, and we need to create new leaders. And the way our our world has changed flip flopped in the past few years. It's been unbelievable. So yeah, I'm a hopeful guy, a positive guy. I think this book is going to contribute to people. I'm not the brightest bulb on the on the tree, but when I was a kid, they called me a wise guy. And now that I'm older, they say the man has wisdom. So take your choice.
A wise guy with wisdom. It doesn't get any better than that. Let me take a break. Because when we come back, I want to get into this discussion about how birth order does affect leadership style. And I'm not surprised that you folded that in. But boy, the more I studied this birth order stuff, the more I realized what an impact it has. So let me take a break. We're going to come right back with Doctor Kevin Leman. We're just getting started. You know this dear man. You know how he writes. He's got the gift of humor, but he has a triple PhD in common sense. Forget the fact that he's also got an earned PhD. But this is a man who really just in a Solomonic way. I'm going to pick up what he just said has a wonderful way of applying truths to us, so we know how better to function in the world around us. So the newest book is called Be a Great Leader by Friday, and he's got five winning plays to spark your world changing potential. Sounds pretty good, doesn't it? Well, the book is just that more with Doctor Kevin Lehman right after this. Discernment is so crucial in an age rife with error. So can we learn what is truth and what isn't? That's why I've chosen living in the Days of Deception as this month's truth tool. Learn to recognize deception and how to respond to misconceptions and untruths. As for your copy of living in the Days of Deception, when you give a gift of any amount to in the market, call 877. Janet 58. That's 877 Janet 58 or go to in the market with Janet parshall.org. Doctor Kevin Leman is with us. His newest book and he's written a whole bunch of them is called be a Great Leader by Friday. Five Winning plays to spark your world changing potential. So winning play number one is know yourself, maximize your strengths. And by no surprise, Doctor Lehman, you go right into this idea of birth order. Please share how your birth order really and truly number one helps us know ourselves. But number two, to what you just identified as the winning play, it really is a way of recognizing our strengths and our weaknesses.
Yeah. As a reminder, the original title on the birth order book. One of the publisher was able had it coming, and they said, Lehman, you can't have a title like that. But, you know, seriously, you have to know yourself. And for all of you who are leaders or want to be leaders, check this sentence out. You can't lead anyone you don't know. So you have to start with knowing yourself. And the key to leadership is getting behind the eyes of the people that you serve. I throw out for suggestion do first born children by product like us youngest children. The first born child who's buying a car has read Car and Driver magazine. They love the specification page. A baby of the family like me. I could care less about the specification page. I might walk out of the car lot and say Shazam! Do you have a teal green one with a gold trim? I'll take it. And 60 payments later. I'm wondering why I bought that you know, car with all that gold on it and glimmer. So you have to get behind the eyes of the people you lead. And by the way, they don't care what you know, folks, until they know you care. Amen. Yep. Absolutely. So this isn't rocket science. This is a very simple, basic books that I think leaves the reader with. You know what? I think I can do this.
So just as a review and by the way, there isn't a book that Doctor Layman hasn't written that I wouldn't suggest to you. This is a man who's rich with wisdom, but for those who've not yet either studied or read anything about the birth order and I, I really want to encourage you to do that, because knowing yourself is germane whether you're interested in leadership or not. I think it's very biblical to do that introspection, to understand how God hardwired you. But give us, if you'd be so kind, some of the traits of the firstborn, the middle child, the last born, the only child.
Yeah, well, the firstborns, we'll start with them. They have the they they're the ones that actually have pictures in their baby book. They're the ones that parents practice practice on. I call them the lab rat of the family, but they're natural leaders. They got in trouble for what their younger sister or brother did. I don't care what he did. You're the oldest. I expect more to you, young woman or young man. So they tend to be organized. Organized. They tend to have that perfection bug. And I remind people that perfectionism is slow suicide. Don't go overboard on trying to be perfect. You know, Romans 832, I think says all of us are imperfect. All of us have, you know, failed and fallen short of the glory of God. Don't forget that one. So again, firstborns are the benchmark, the. To give you a couple facts. The first 23 astronauts in outer space 21 firstborns, two only children who are their psychological cousins, not a middle child or a baby in the bunch. So the National Academy of Sciences, glutted with firstborn born children. First borns are achievers. There are doctors. There are. They tend to go into those technical areas. There are chemists or biologists or ever. Perfection is paid off. You're going to find a predominant number of first born children. Now the second born children, they're the opposite of the first in almost all families. Isn't that interesting? And those middle children, God love them. I think they're the peanut butter and jelly. The sandwich. They're the best part. They. They never had mom and dad to themselves. They endured hand-me-downs. Uh, they're not very complicated, but they're the most likely to keep their feelings inside and not really share how they feel. They sort of have a mantra of, uh, can't we all just get along? And then there's us babies. I mean, I love to tell people that us babies, I mean, the old comedians Billy Crystal and, uh, Eddie Murphy and Drew Carey, Jim Carrey, Martin Short, Chevy Chase, Steve Martin. I mean, I can go on. They're all babies of the family. Charlie Chaplin, the the father of comedy, baby. The family. So us babies. And I grew up in a family of three. Janet with a sister who was perfect. I mean, she would iron the Davenport if she gave her the opportunity. Uh, and a brother who was near perfect. And then me. Well, I shrunk myself years ago. I couldn't compete with them, so I graduated, like I said, right at the bottom of my class. I was a class clown. And all of us. If you look at the birth order in your family, give that one word that describes that older brother or younger sister or whatever. And you, you can pretty come pretty close to just saying, hey, listen. Yeah, that's that's our family, all right. And so fingerprints I love to bring this out because identical twins have the same DNA. But when I discovered this, I don't know if you've ever done this, Janet. You laugh and cry at the same moment. But I read this that identical twins have different fingerprints. Well, why did Almighty God give us different fingerprints as twins to help the FBI? Or was this God's way of saying no? You are my son. You are my daughter. You are different than everyone else. So if you're trying to be like somebody else out there and this goes all you wannabe leaders, please stop today and realize you really are a one of a kind. His scripture says that our maker even knows the number of hairs in our head. He knows when the sparrow falls. So is the God that you worship big enough for most of us? No, we don't give God the incredible credit he deserves in just making us all so different. So part of being a good leader is figuring out who you are, and then knowing who you lead and doing it in a visible, caring way. You're the shepherd. They're the sheep. And sheep aren't stupid. They won't follow a leader or a shepherd that doesn't have some authenticity to them. Yeah.
So true, so true. And you break this down. This is all under the first winning game plan. And this is all about knowing yourself, knowing your birth order, knowing your strengths, which you write are also your weaknesses. And then you ask us to work it out at the end of every chapter. This is hands on, I love this. This is from a teacher who wants us to own the contents of this book, to really apply it to our lives. So you've got a section where you call it, work it out, and then you end it with thoughts of a successful leader so we can hear from other people who are leaders. And that's just plain number one. There are five in this book, by the way. It is inimitable Doctor Kevin Lehman style, just this pragmatic hands on grounded in wisdom, biblical wisdom of ways in which we can all be a great leader by Friday. By Friday, I already got a good kid by Friday. So now I want to be a great leader by Friday. Doctor Kevin Leman is with us. We'll take a break. We'll be right back after this. Break. Internationally known psychologist, bestselling author and really fantastic human being. Doctor Kevin Leman is our guest. He's adding another book to over the 70 titles he's written about on parenting, marriage, family and education, including his birth order book. This brand new one is called Be a Great Leader by Friday, and in this he lays out five winning plays to spark your world changing potential. And by the way, I'm just skimming over these. And my idea here is not to give you the total contents of the book. It's to whet your appetite. So you will get the book and you will apply the principles to your life. So the second winning play is very simple and straightforward. Grow your leadership traits. Now you say that there are three types of leaders, which I thought was fascinating. What are those three types and is there a strength and a weakness to each?
Well, you know yourself as a former teacher, Janet, that a teacher, for example, has to be an authority, not an authoritarian right. Authoritarians will spurn rebellion, and you certainly can't be permissive. Now, whether you're a teacher or a CEO or CFO or a manager, you have to realize that if you're in authority. Well, let me give you the big question here. Let's everybody think about this one. Is God an authoritarian? Does he grab us by the scruff of the neck, or twist our earlobe and say, you will acknowledge me? No, but he is the supreme. What authority says every knee shall bow. Every tongue will confess. So the leader. I don't care if you're in a used tire shop or if you're in a dental office. And by the way, dentists are firstborns in huge numbers. Um, you really need to understand the word authority. That's that balance you need where you listen to the people that you lead. You know, we mentioned Shepherd before, and I think this is sort of funny. Leave it to a group of psychologists to pull this one off. But they actually found a shepherd with a huge flock of sheep, and they put in a impostor who wore the shepherd's clothing, the actual clothes the shepherd wears every day. And they digitized his call and bellowed it out across the field of all these sheep. And it was interesting because all the sheep turned and looked at the shepherd. But guess what, Janet? They wouldn't follow. The shepherd and sheep are supposed to be stupid. I think they're pretty smart. And so that leader has to have that tough and tender quality where people see their heart, they see their authenticity, they see they care and they'll follow. I mean, my youngest daughter, um, I'll never forget I was at a one of those parent teacher things and the teacher said, well, your daughter Lauren is a natural leader. I said, well, why do you say that? And he said something I never forgot. He said, well, at lunch when she gets up, everyone follows her. I said, bingo. Okay, you sold me on that. But you want to you if you're if you've got a great leader, you work for a great leader. I got news for you. You want to please him or her? I got to interview Herb Kelleher was the former chairman of the board at Southwest Airlines. He was the youngest child in his family. If you've ever flown on southwest, I'm here to tell you you have fun on Southwest Airlines. And he insisted that fun was a part of southwest and his one of his quotes I'll never forget. He said, we are actually in the service business. It's incidental. We also fly airplanes. Oh, wow. Yeah. And I know myself I have eight charter schools, two in Colorado and six in Arizona, and I have signs in our schools that Lehman Academy of Excellence, where learning is fun. Well, see, my framework is if it's not fun, I don't want to do it. I'm the baby of the family. I'm like all those comedians, my when I go to New York and I do one of those New York morning shows, my litmus test is does the lighting guy or the audio guy laugh or the cameraman laugh? If they laugh, I figure I've connected with people and and I'm here to tell you if Mrs. Uppington was on the line with us. My dear wife of many, many years, she would say, leave me. Your humor has got you in trouble. Why don't you tell them that part about. Yeah, it does get you in trouble once in a while. Especially when you're right. Humor. Because some of those first born children don't realize that some of the things that I write to make people laugh, it's tongue in cheek. Yeah, but you don't want to write. Hello. This is tongue in cheek.
Right, right. Exactly.
Oh, well, what are you going to do with me, Janet? I'm just one of those youngest children.
You can't do much about it. You are who you are. So, going from the authoritarian leader, tell me about now the permissive leader. Because you would.
Think Maria knows exactly how life ought to be. Yeah, he ought to know how other people are. And he knows exactly what's right. He challenges people. And by the way, this is Maisie who has joined our conversation. Who is my my daughter's little dog who's decided to bark. Bach, and I'm either going to kill her or put her outside and just a second. So hang on. But the authoritarian, they tend to be heavy handed. Look at politicians.
Yes.
Lyndon Johnson. Quite frankly. I mean, the guy was a tyrant in many ways. And when you look at political leaders, you'll see people who are maybe much more laissez faire or laid back. Uh, you'll find people who were negotiators and compromisers. If I gave people a pop quiz and said, name a former president known for his diplomacy. He's passed away years ago. But his diplomacy in foreign affairs, especially with China. Most people would say Richard Nixon. Mhm. Yeah. Well, Nixon guess what. The middle child.
Wow. Wow.
They're the born negotiators. But the authoritarians again they spark rebellion. And the laissez faire people, the permissiveness, They breed rebellion as well.
So let me pick it up at that point when we come back. And by the way, there's so much in this book, friends. I'm not going to get through all of it in an hour. But if I've got you thinking, I've got you doing some personal introspection. And you know what? I will have done my job. Now it's your job to get the book, be a great leader by Friday. Five winning plays to spark your world changing potential. Don't you love that? There's optimism in that subtitle. That means you and I do have world changing potential. If you don't hear anything else this hour, hang on to that. Back after this. Tired of the endless, biased spin you hear on mainstream media and in the market, we're using God's Word as our guide as we examine today's events, and we want you to be informed and bold about his truth. This is a listener supported program, so if you value what you hear and you want us to continue on your station, become a partial partner with your monthly support, call 877. Janet 58. That's 877 Janet 58 or go online to in the market with Janet parshall.org. We get to spend the hour with Doctor Kevin Leman and a conversation. By the way, that's going far too quickly. A formal reintroduction again if you're just joining us. Internationally known psychologist, radio TV personality, educator taught and entertained audiences worldwide. He's a New York Times bestselling author, over 70 titles. He talks frequently to CEO groups and businesses, including fortune 500 companies, Million Dollar Roundtable, top of the table. ET cetera. And he also, by the way, has six count them Academy of Excellence schools. And I've got a link to that because I tell you what, what a wonderful idea. This is a man who put shoe leather into his ideas. And if nothing else, I hope he's remembered not just for his writing, but for what he's done for education as well. So his latest book is called Be a Great Leader by Friday, and in this book, he gives us five winning plays to spark our world changing potential. And we've been looking. First we looked at the birth order because that has an absolute compact impact on the way in which we lead. But the second winning play is to grow our leadership traits, and we're taking a look at the kinds of leaders that are out there. And Doctor Lehman did an excellent job of unpacking what it means to be an authoritarian leader, not authoritative, but authoritarian. Now we've moved to the permissive leader. And, you know, in this touchy feely world, Doctor Lehman, in which we live, you would think, oh, the permissive leader, everybody's going to turn and they're going to follow that shepherd because they're permissive. We're going to just sprinkle the fairy juice and let them be creative and do their own thing. And it's going to be great. Everything's going to be fine. But that's not the case. Talk to me about the downfalls of this.
Well, they're driven by people have to like me and we haven't talked about it, but leaders, uh, you know, Harry Truman said it best, you know, uh, it stops here. You have to make tough decisions as a leader. And if you look at Jesus Christ in His ministry on this earth. He always told the truth, you know? Um, but like when they found the woman who was adulterous and they threw him down and, you know, stoned, the woman wanted to kill him. What did Jesus do? He. We don't know what he wrote in the dirt, but he wrote things that the accusers all backed away one at a time. My guess is he probably wrote down some very specific things that some of those people did in their life, and they backed off. And his last words to that woman was go and sin no more. Right. You know, we've all fallen short. We've all made mistakes in life. So that leader has to have empathy. He has to be able to listen. But he makes tough decisions. And he or she calls a spade a spade. You know, one of my little Lehman isms is excuses make the weak weaker.
Mm.
Don't accept excuses. Why don't you shut off excuses from people? You'd be surprised. how how the complaining goes down in the office when people see that they can't manipulate you one way or another. And the other thing I would add about it ties back to birth order. But if you're that youngest child in the family and you sort of fly by the seat of your pants and you meet people well, and you're affable and all those things, you better surround yourself with some people who tend to pursue excellence in life. They tend to be a little bit on that perfection scale. You need people who are highly organized in your group. You don't want to have a bunch of firstborns in an office or a bunch of only children. I was doing a presentation to the Pima County Medical Society here in Tucson. They bring me in once in a while to be their speaker, and I mentioned certain areas like anesthesiologists, their first born children, only born children in huge numbers. And one of the anesthesiologists came up to me afterward and he says, well, I'm not so sure about that. Lehman. The next day, the guy calls me. He says, Kevin, we have 11 anesthesiologists in our office. You're not going to believe this. We have eight firstborns and three only children.
Wow.
I said I believe it. I don't want a baby. The family anesthesiologist. Oh, or a few CCS off. Who cares? Night. Night. Doctor Lehman forever. Hello.
So?
So realize that your strength. Those of you who struggle with perfectionism and your leaders. Let me share this with you. What makes you a good surgeon? Which makes you a good anesthesiologist? What makes you a good accountant? It's the same skill that works against you in your relationship with your husband or your wife, or with your kids. Your wife puts together a beautiful dinner. You're lucky enough to have a wife that cooks, that are getting hard to find these days. And you sit down to dinner and the first thing you say is, what's with the carrots? Well, I got news for you, Charlie. You might be wearing carrots shortly.
So, yeah, you.
Found a flaw. But leaders need to be encouragers. I call it vitamin E encouragement. I asked a CEO just a few months ago. What? What do you do when someone on your staff does something exceptional? You know what she said? She said I send them an email. That's the second dumbest thing a CEO could do. The dumbest is ignore it completely. But an email? No? How about a personal note? How about walking down to that person's office? How about taking them to lunch? The three hours of great leadership are relationships, relationships, relationships, and and now that we're in such a high tech mode in our country today, the leader who has the technical skills but also as the personal skills is the one that's destined to be a great leader.
Yeah, yeah.
It's all about people, isn't it? Absolutely.
Always about people. Wow.
So the counterbalance to all of this then, and this is like goldilocks's porridge is not the authoritarian but the authoritative leader. Tell me about those hallmarks.
Yeah. The authoritative leader is one who's going to ask for help, is going to ask for suggestions and wants input. And by the way, if you're sitting in one of those business meetings around the oak table and the vice president comes in and he's got a big problem and he throws it out, and you think you have the answer in your back pocket. My advice is lay low, just lay low for a while and let some people make some suggestions. And then and then it might be the time to say, you know what, I love what Sarah said. And John, I think you're going right down the right path. But what if we took John's idea and Sarah's idea and coupled it with this? Now, nobody likes somebody who's hogging the the limelight, okay. In this day and age, you need to get along with other people. And people today, by the way, are very easily offended. I know in the school world, in our in our charter school systems at Lehman Academy of Excellence, we'll have a kid call another kid a name, and the parent is in the principal's office saying, Mike, son is being bullied. Well, I got news for you that's not bullying. That's just a kid being a kid and saying something he shouldn't say. But parents today sort of melt down. They're overprotective. I mean, someone wrote a book called Free-range Parenting. I wish I would have written that book because it certainly is a Liman title, but we overprotect children way, way, way too much today. And it's unfortunate because the belief we have in our people, our kids, the belief we have in our workers, our, our, our colleagues, that goes a long way in putting together a a workplace that's fun to go to. And so many places today are toxic because people do power plays so powerful. People become powerful at other people's expenses. And that's not a biblical thing. It certainly isn't a way to live life, and it certainly isn't satisfying. So you want to build each other up, as Saint Paul said, you know.
Yeah. Excellent point. So what are some of the hallmarks of a healthy leader?
Well, number one, they're visible. Number two, they're great listeners. Number three, they're action oriented people. They are decisive. You know, they'll listen, but they'll come to a decision. They're not interested in pleasing everybody. By the way, I wrote a book called The Pleasers years ago, and it's the female gender that tends to be the pleasers, and the men tend to be controllers and not to go off subject, but it's interesting that the pleaser will find the controller to marry. It's like a moth to a flame. It's not good. It's not healthy. So great leaders. I mean, you can spot a great leader a mile away. They have a sincere interest in other people. I just was hired by a huge, uh, automobile agency. And I sat there in the corner with my styrofoam cup of coffee, waiting for the head guy to show up, and he didn't even see me in the corner. And I liked it that way because I watched him and he went around to 45 managers, and I listened to the conversation. He was asking about people's husbands and wives and kids. And how's your son doing at college? That's the mark of a great leader. He shows a genuine or she shows a genuine interest in other people. And those are the kind of people that workers will want to follow. They'll want to please, they'll want to do a good job. So again, it's back to those three R's relationship relationship, relationship.
Yeah.
Well so tremendously important. Okay. So let me just in deference to time and there's so much more in the book, friends. It's again, it's called be a Great leader by Friday five winning plays to spark your world changing potential. I'm giving you a flyover. But this book is really wonderful. Hands on applies to every single one of us because we all have a sphere of influence. You're a leader in that sphere of influence. So play number three. Know those you serve and serve those. You know, I love this because it really takes us out of the world of me ism. And this you hearken back, you were making some cultural observations to which I think you're spot on. The rise of narcissism is ridiculous. I don't know if social media has fed into that. And while there's a rise in narcissism, there's the the snowflake problem now where people are so unbelievably, easily offended and we are uncaring. I mean, lack of kindness now is a hallmark of the culture in which we live. So all the things you said before are great. So this idea of knowing those you serve and serve those, you know, this goes back to something you said earlier. People don't care how much you know until they know how much you care. Let me ask you to dig into this one a little bit more when we come back. It's a fabulous book. It's right there on my website. Go to in the market with Janet parshall.org. Click on that red box. It says Program Details and Audio. It will take you over to the information page. There's a much longer bio for Doctor Kevin Leman. On the right hand side there's the book. Click on through and it'll take you to a place where you can get the book. I also have a link to the Leman Academy.com that's part of the Leman Academy of Excellence schools out there. You want to find out more about this back after this. We have the pleasure of visiting with Doctor Kevin Leman, who's an internationally known psychologist and a New York Times bestselling author, His latest in a long line of outstanding books is called Be a Great Leader by Friday. Five winning plays to spark your world changing potential. I'm not going to get to all five friends, and that's okay, because now you're going to be curious enough. You're going to want to get a copy of the book, and that's a good thing. But here's winning play number three. Know those you serve and serve those you know. And you take the birth order. And you really look at the way in which we interact with people. But I loved one of your Lehman isms, engage with people in such a way that every person thinks he or she is your favorite. That's almost a mr. Roger isms in there. I just love that. How does that apply to leadership?
You know, we.
Don't know many people like that, but all of us know some people like that. They just have a genuine way of making you feel like a special person. Those are the people that will take the time to inquire about how your son or daughter is doing. You know, I talk about essential vitamins of a leader in this book. And number one is vitamin A, of course, which is accountability and attitude. You have to be in a position as a leader where you're not afraid to hold people accountable, but you also have to have an attitude that says, hey, we all make mistakes. We move forward. You know, vitamin B, behavioral expectations as a leader. Are there expectations? Do people really understand what you want as a leader? And I mean, I can go through Sears caring and D is discipline. And I mean these are basic things. But what I want to underscore is encouragement. We've talked about that a little bit in Saint Paul. Talks about that encourage one another. But when I'm speaking to a group of people, I'll love to get their attention by saying praise is destructive with children. And I mean, it's like you could hear a pin drop. What did he say? Praise is destructive. Everybody knows praise is good. Really? I don't think it's good. I think it's bad for kids. It's bad for people. It's false. It's phony. It's not long lasting. Where encouragement responds to what someone has done, it's their actions, you know, rather than, oh, you're the greatest employee or the greatest kid in the world because you did this or that. It's shallow. It doesn't last. So I've tried to encourage people just to think in terms of being an encourager. If you praise someone, by the way, the only one worthy of our praise is is is our Lord. Our pastor reminded us the other day he was talking about problems. He said, don't focus on the problems, focus on the problem solver. And isn't that simple?
But isn't that good? Yes, and.
I know in the morning I just. The first thing I say in the morning is, God, this is your day, I praise you. Uh, many times I'll say what I said earlier to you, that I know that the day is going to come when every knee shall bow and you're going to come back and and I just thank you for your goodness and your graciousness and your love. And it goes on and on and on. I mean, you praise God all day long. I mean, I'm a believer in thought, prayers, but part of the vitamins that you must be able to master as a leader is vitamin N, which is no.
Yes.
As a parent, I mean, parents today want to be their child's best friends. I remember I'm so old. I remember Janet when kids used to obey their parents.
Now parents obey their kids. So with that paradigm, Janet. But I'm glad as a.
Teacher, I mean, I have we have these six schools in Arizona and two in Colorado. And it's amazing to me the expectations that we put forth for the kids. I wish someday you could come to Tucson. If you do, I'd give you a personal visit at our school and you wouldn't believe it. The kids walked down the hallways like little lambs. They're not pushing and shoving. They walk single file from their homeroom to art or music or to P.E. and that's the expectation and the expectations we give to the parents and the kids are. We're different. We're not like every other school. And we thrive on on vitamin E, which is encouragement. And again, to make encouragement really work, you have to understand that vitamin N is a part of it, because as a leader, you have to say, hey, time out. We've gone too far. We've got to bring it back to the center point.
Yeah.
Wow. You know, at the end of this particular play, ironically, you quote Fred Rogers, if you could only sense how important you are to the lives of those you meet, how important you can be to the people you may never even dream of. There is something of yourself that you leave at every meeting with another person. Boy, if that was our perspective, it would really change the way in which we interacted with people, wouldn't it?
Yeah. Wouldn't it for sure. And, you know, I'd add to that John Wooden, the great basketball coach who won ten national titles. He never told his team at UCLA he was a basketball coach to go out and win. And when I discovered that, I said, wait a minute, what was that? He never told him to go out and win? No, he told them to play the game of basketball the way it should be played. And I would say to all of you faithful listeners of Janet Parshall, wherever you are in life right now, play the game of life the way it should be played. I mean, how profound is that? It's pretty simple, but it's also profound. Mhm.
Exactly right. Well, let me just say the last two because we're not going to be able to get into them. But you can just give me a quick summation. Winning play. Number four refine your leadership strategies. And number five I particularly love craft your own unique intentional culture. How does one do that? How do you craft your own culture?
Well, you're you're the model. You know, culture's interesting. It's like the wind. Uh, you can't see it, but you sure can feel it. And I know as the guy who's got his name on Leman Academy of Excellence, I bring people into our school, and what I really. I have to tell you, I get a psychological jolly or something from this, but people always tell me, Kevin, I didn't know there were schools like this.
Mhm.
Well, there are schools like that because we have set the high bar. Uh, you know, we don't allow excuses. We're no accountability. But we love the kids. I was in Mesa, Arizona, where we have one of our schools and the snarky lady was in the audience. And she said to me, she said, why would I send my kid? Why should I send my kid to your school? Amen. And I thought for a second, I said, well, because your kid will feel loved. And, lady, if you can beat that. More power to you.
Wow. Wow. So important. I got my math wrong. You know, when you and I first talked about these schools, did you ever envision you would have eight? I need to correct my math. It's six in Arizona, two in Colorado. Do you see the Lord.
Opening the door from.
Eight?
My high school counselor told me he couldn't get me to reform school.
And look how wrong they were. A sense of humor. My wife always says.
We make plans. That God laughs.
Yeah.
Well, you know what? I think you've done pretty good for a janitor. I'll tell you what. Thank you. What a treat. I've so missed our conversations. Keep writing, keep influencing, keep encouraging. Thank you for being a role model for us in so many things. The latest book is called Be a Great Leader by Friday. Five Winning plays to spark your World Changing Potential. And there's a ton more in the book. As much as I got the irreplaceable gift of one hour of Doctor Lehman's time, there's so much more in the book. Read it and think about people. The three R's relationships, relationships, relationships. Take that away. That's important. Thank you, Doctor Lehman. Thanks, friends. We'll see you next time.