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The Double Pass with Josh McDaniels | 2014 AFC Divisional Round Ravens vs. Patriots

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Published Sep 3, 2024, 7:01 AM

Josh McDaniels is in studio! From Nuthouse East, the former Head Coach and Offensive Coordinator is with us to breakdown one of the wildest wins in Patriots playoff history: the 2014 AFC Divisional round game between the Baltimore Ravens and the New England Patriots aka "The Double Pass." Josh joins us in studio (0:33). We go back to January of 2015 (27:20). We get into these teams (1:08:19). We get into the game (1:28:20). We score it (2:00:45). 

Can we talk about the game day fit?

What do you mean what you wear? I wore two things specifically.

I like it. Yeah, maybe that's the Josh McDaniels visors, Welcome to Games with Names. I'm Julian Edelman. They're Jack and Kyler, and we're on the quest to find the greatest game of all time. On today's episode, we are covering the infamous two thy fourteen AFC Divisional Round game between the Patriots and the Ravens aka the Double Pass Game. We've already done it. This will be our second time doing it with who Josh McDaniel's the guy behind the formations and the double pass, six time Super Bowl champion, former head coach, our first head coach, and we're talking what it takes for young qbs to succeed in the National Football League. Always talk about it. They have a bucket.

Guys all had a bucket, and yours was a big bucket at the end, like you could handle whatever we gave you. Well, when you take a young quarterback, it's more like a cup.

Calling plays in two of the greatest comebacks of all time. When I'm going over in motion, what's going through your mind?

It's not man and then when I saw the guy start to creep in and he was gonna blitz, I'm like, we couldn't have drawn up like them playing a better defense for the play.

And what the hell is in that water at John Carroll University? For all these goddamn coaches back at John Carroll? Did Casario come in? And he?

When Chaplinsky and I got there, Cassio was a red shirt freshman.

Redshirt freshman.

He's like the only guy in the history of Division three football that red shirt.

And we wrap it up by creating our swaggiest touching fit of all time. Can't wait to read about this in the comment section. You gotta stick around to the very end. Let's go Games and Names of the production of iHeartRadio January tenth, twenty fifteen, Jellet Stadium, Focks Pro, Massachusetts. Jules, you need any lead up if we call the double pass? Nope, I guess it's just time to dust off the old thrown on. This is the double pass game, Josh.

Version you guys, man, you know who I played pickleball with last night?

Gronk's brother, which one the Gordyah? Yeah, he's pretty good, dude. He is, like it was s well.

First of all, he looks like an Olympic volleyball player. Yeah, he's tall as ship.

And I'm like and I was like, all right, I don't know if this guy's like he had touch.

Flank.

Yeah, like they pickled us one game and then we came back and beat him on the next one.

But I was like, damn, Robbie is really good?

Is he?

Ye? I could see him being good. Robs good at like pretty a lot of things. It's crazy. Remember how good he was at basketball? And I never knew he was. I never I was like I could. I wouldn't have imagined he was.

I can imagine him dunking and like ripping the hoop down, but I couldn't imagine that he was a.

Shooter as he was. He won the shot contest, I don't. I've talked about it on here. Teams know who was actually really good too a basketball Logan Mankins at All State And really that's awesome, Logan Mankins. I couldn't have ever I heard that he had to play like a center or something. Probably, but I bet you he was souper because he had big hands. He probably had good touch. I played against Orlando Pace in high school.

Yeah, dude never went inside the three point line.

Yeah, it was unbelievable. I'm like I was.

I was looking at him, going, dude going down to the on the block, there's like, you're like, shack, Yeah, nobody's and he would just stand outside and shoot threes.

Who else you played with? Welcome to Games with Names. Let's get into this real quick. Welcome to Games with Names. Today we are looking at the two thy fourteen AFC Divisional Round game, the double pass, the Ravens versus the Patriots. Here with Josh McDaniels, the guy who gave him my opportunity unity. You know, I'm having Billy Oh later on this week. He was the guy that held me back, jos Josh McNee was the guy who gave me the opportunity in the same offense to thrive to what I was at. But the first question we asked all our guests in one sentence, why did you pick this game?

I think this was well one that had I'd say it had to do you were significantly involved in it, obviously, but this was I think this is my favorite home game that I ever was a part of. We had some really good Super Bowls and those kind of memories. Yeah, the AFC Championship game in Kansas City sticks out to me. I had another one when I was younger against Pittsburgh and Pittsburgh. But I would say for home games, like the quality of the opponent, the way the game had to go, the way that it turned out.

I think this was probably my favorite home game that I was ever part of. Wow, is this the greatest game of all time? No, this is not the greatest game of all time.

It's in the top It's certainly in the top five or six for me in terms of Patriots games that I was a part of, no question about it.

What's life looking at right now? What are you doing these days?

Different? You know, different in a good way. Two kids in college, you know, and then still two girls now at home. I've been able to see them more.

My sons get ready to play a sophomore year at John Carroll Football. He's playing in the slot receiver, so got to work with him some of the summer. I'll be able to see him play. I've seen him practice now multiple times, which is great. A lot of pickleball. I'm probably as healthy as I've been in twenty years.

Is that that's what's keeping the weight down. You look, you look thin. Thank you looking good. Trying a little fluffy to get my fighting weight, trying to get the fighting weight. Yeah I am looking good.

Well I was getting a little fluffed the other way.

You know that people don't realize the coach's life. The coaches life is like the most stressful thing ever. If you look at it's like Obama when he first went into office, and you see when he went like when he left office, he looked like he almost died. Yeah, you know what I mean. That's when a coach goes through yearly, like literally, they eat the worst shit ever they have to. They have their schedules jam packed, especially with how Belichick was working these guys, and you know, they just sit and they watch film and eat fucking food all day long. They try to get a workouted, but they preach it, but they don't always get it in. But you know, it's it's a tough life and the stress is crazy. Now you talked about John Carroll, you know, how come, what's what's up with John Carroll? We had a lot of John Carroll guys. Can you explain that area and what that program? And you know, especially you know Ohio where you were from. A lot of these guys are from Ohio.

I think, look, Ohio's in the in the Midwest, and there's there's not as much to do. You're not on one of the coasts, and so the game of football in Ohio is like the thing.

Yeah, you know.

And so when you're growing up in Ohio, you know all the high school teams, you know, the Hall of Fame game comes there once a year. That's a huge week and a huge part of the the culture there. You know, everybody goes to the enshrinement, you know, so football is kind of like in the blood. And then to go to school there, I went with a lot of kids from Ohio, some from Michigan, Pennsylvania, Chicago, but you know, I think we all kind of were there for the same reason. At Division III, you're not there to make it to the NFL. You're not there to make a bunch of money. You're not you know, you're not there on a free ride. You're paying to go to school and you want to have as many years left that you can to play football. So you meet a lot of cool dudes that are there for the right reasons, and so when when that happened, when Bill gave me an opportunity, and then the next question, you know, six months later, was like, hey, do you know anything anybody else that kind of would be like you in terms of being accountable, work hard, smart, could learn. And it was like, yeah, I know Nick so and then I suggested Nick, Yeah, Casario, and then eventually we suggested you know, Ziggler and Chaplinsky and Kaylee and and it was kind of like almost like this unspoken thing like don't break the freaking chain, like don't be the guy that lets all of us.

Down, you know what I mean?

And and and you know, you know, when you're given a recommendation, you're thinking long and hard about who that guy is, you know, And so we kind of all put our name on somebody. Brian Davile did it for me, you know, Dave's wasn't from John Carroll, but we were together and that's.

How I ended up there.

And then we kind of all suggested somebody when when when Bill came to us and said, hey, is there another guy.

That you know?

And I think everybody just you know, deserves their own credit for upholding.

Their end of the bargain. Yeah, Now, what are these stories you know back at John Carroll? What was what was I heard? Did Caserio come in? And he?

So Caserio was when I got there, when Chaplinsky and I got there, and uh, Casiro was a red shirt freshman.

Red shirt freshman.

He's like the only guy in the history of Division three football that red shirt you.

Know, like like literally like like he he was so intent on like playing and like having all these records and breaking all this.

And it was like he and I get there and I'm like and I said, well, what what great is Nick in? And They're like, he's a red shirt freshman. I'm like, he's not just a sophomore, like like you know what I mean, Like I want him.

I wanted him to be like ahead of me.

So like if we ended up all right, he's gone, then I you know however that goes. But he red shirted, so he still had multiple years left to play. And when I was a freshman, it ended up being a fifth year senior was the starter.

Nick was the backup, and I was the third string.

Well, the fifth year senior who happens to be the head coach of John Carroll now Jeff Barman is his things, like, great guy. He broke his ankle in the first game. So Nick goes in, I'm the backup, and we play the rest.

Of the year.

Nick did a good job, and he was a really good Division three quarterback, really good Division three football player. And so he ended up playing quarterback the next four years. And and so I switched positions as a junior so I could play. I'm like, I'm not gonna you know, I was supposed to sit behind him the whole time and hope for him to get injured. I didn't want to do that, you know, So he ended up throwing to me the last two years.

Was great. Ziggler and I played a lot together. But yeah, Nick's can you explain the locker room situation of which guys which guy in the locker room? So I can only imagine Becauseiria was Dudley due Wright just fucking like, guys, we got to get our protein shake in right now, Yes he did.

He was the only guy the morning after like we would win a game, right, we go to the ridge, we come in the next morning, and everybody's like, you know, depending on what you did.

That night, right, Like a lot of guys would go out so they'd come in.

They'd be like this big slumber into the weight room the next morning and he would be like in the corner on a treadmill and it's like at eleven and it's like on a seven incline, like just like.

He'd like Drago and Rocky four.

And it was like the rest of us just looked at him, like, man, you come on, you gotta give it a break.

But he was That's how he was. He was.

He was high strung, was out in the back parking lot smoking cigarettes or what. No comment. Ziggy was a little Meszigs is real cool. Ziggs and I ended up we actually lived together.

I roomed with somebody different.

I wasn't not a football player in my first three years, and then Ziggs and I lived in a house together are my senior year, his junior year, and uh yeah, Ziggs was a great student. But he enjoyed his he enjoyed his free time. That's all I'm gonna say.

It's always yeah, I'm out of now.

I'm so proud of him. What are your thoughts on how he's doing as GM. That's really cool.

Yeah, I'm really excited for him. My brother's there, you know, as the receivers coach, and so I think he's really done a good job of trying to like he's taken what he needs to take from his experiences, but he's messing him with a different type of coaching staff, a different style, and they're they're figuring it out, you know, And I'm really excited for what he's trying to build there. And Demiko is a really good dude, good coach. He got a really good staff, a lot of good people down there. I got to visit the spring, and I was really impressed Stroud.

How you I mean, that's like lightning in a bald. Yeah, you know, he broke all the the molds of the Ohio State quarterback everything, the rookie. I mean, he went out in bald last year and good especial.

He was a really good player, Like you could tell watching his tape.

He was a real good passer. Yeah, like as good of a.

Passer as you're gonna see coming out, like just naturally gifted. And then all the questions about like all right, is he gonna acclimate quickly?

How long is it gonna take?

You know, all those things, and you know, handling adversity last year went pretty good. Hopefully this year goes better, but at some point they're gonna have to handle some adversity. But I thought he did a tremendous job as a rookie.

Unreal, I mean, takes care of the ball too, took care of the ball, but he got better every week. Yep. He didn't see like if he made a mistake, Like first time he played against the Patriots the preseason, they did that, you know, they dropped someone in the flat on his own blitz and he threw a deep pick or something like that. Yep, he didn't do that again. No, you know, he caught him once and he learned from it. And that's that's how you get improvement and growth through players is and that's what you want to see from young players is not making that same mistake twice. You know, mistakes are always going to be made. Yep. The guys that become good are the guys that don't make him twice. Yep, he did a good job of I think he's I think he's well.

Coached, and they know they do a really good job of putting him in good positions. And I think he he loves the game and he wants to be great.

Are you watching a lot of ball right now?

I can, Yeah, I I do.

I try to.

You know, obviously, the preseason games, you know, it is what it is. You see some things there which you're I'm interested to see some of the young guys, but I'll be able to watch the games as the season progresses.

Here. Have you watched a little bit of may Drake may I have? What do you think I have them? I didn't.

I didn't get to see a ton of them in the spring. But he's obviously got great size, really athletic. I don't know where he'll fit in the whole, like you know, the style he'll play with. I'm interested to see how that develops, Like is he going to be a run a little bit of a runner like Josh Allen was in Buffalo. I don't think he's quite as big as Josh is, but like you know, guys like that that have those kind of attributes, you can use them to run the football too, you know. And so I don't think we've seen all that yet in the preseason, but I'm interested to see when he plays, if he becomes a little bit more of a dual threat guy, or if he's just a pocket passer and a big, tall, strong guy in the pocket. But the games I've seen, he's you know, he's done a good job.

And you know last night, you know he played and he had that third and fourteen on that first drive backed up and he got that with his legs, yep, which you know was cover five. Look, I think to man or something and he you know, that was pretty cool to see. Yep.

He's stepping up in the pocket, which is for a young guys, you know, like that's not always the easiest thing to get him to do. And I saw him multiple times last night.

Move forward the crunch in that crunch stock. You know he stepped up, he didn't. You know, there's a lot of times a young quarterback can't keep his eyes down field while he steps up. He takes off in one of those lanes. That's right. He delivered that football to Polk. It looked good. You know, he still needs to work his feet. He had too many throws where you know, he's like this and he's trying to do that. Yeah, you know, and he'll learn that, hopefully he does. But that was his mo His his feet aren't and.

I don't think he plays from under center much. Yeah, and you can tell, you know, the when when there's exchange issues, you know, usually that's.

Just time on task, you know.

And I doubt he He didn't do that much in college from what I gather, So I think those are the kind of things that'll take some time for him to just acclimate, because you can't be you can't be thinking about how to get the ball from the center.

Yeah, when you're dealing.

With backup center defenses and like what's where's the blitz coming from, and what's my read and what coverage are they playing?

You got it?

You can't be thinking about how to get the ball.

That's all. I mean. Foxboro High, right, That's that's right, Foxborough High, right, that's exactly. The One thing also pissed me off is the cleat thing he's wearing, those slipper cleats. Yeah, like the dude, you're too you're two thirty, you're sixty four. You can't be wearing dB one hundred and ninety five pound cleats.

The guard foot where the guard get him and it just slipped off, slipped off.

I didn't like that.

That made me mad. You got to protect those things, especially your quarterback. You learn how to play with the heavy cleat. That's right. What's up with Mayo? What's your thoughts on how Mayo's doing. I'm excited for him. Yeah, me too.

I uh Drod's look was a great player and uh, you know everybody. I think he had a ton of respect as a player, you know, captain, leader of the team, those kind of things were natural to him. And I think that, you know, this is going to be an interesting year for him as he goes through it, because each each step of the way will just be something he can learn from and grow from. And I feel like he has his own idea on how he wants it to be done, and he'll adapt it as this as the circumstances change as he navigates the season. But you know, it's hard to prepare for this, Like you can be around football all your life and all of a sudden you become a head coach and there's so many other things you're responsible for now. So I'm assuming he's going to just you know, he'll he'll acclimate to those like he's acclimated to a lot of challenges in his life, and I'm expecting him to succeed.

Yeah, I'm excited for him. You know, it's it's it's a dying breed, the defensive sided coach, you know, and he's one of like six, you know, and and you know, hopefully he finds you know, hopefully Van Pelt comes through and they have a good relationship and develop the young quarterback because ultimately his face in Drake May's hands. Yeah, I mean, that's that's what it is.

Yeah, that's I mean, they've talked about it all year. I mean from what I've heard that that's obviously gonna be paramount, you know, his development and whatever the plan ends up being for Drake in terms of when he's gonna play, how they're going to handle them and continue to develop him as he goes forward, is gonna be It's gonna be important.

That's the toughest thing. Like you know, they always say you can't you might as well start with Jakobe first, because you can never pull the kid once you put him in. Yeah, you know, And so that's gonna be an interesting decision what they have going into week one, you know, and you know Drawd he's a level headed guy. He's very smart guy. Yep, and you you listed all the characteristics he had. I mean, captain this that he checks all the boxes. I'm excited for his opportunity. Yep. Now, how developing young quarterbacks? Can you? Can you talk about that? You know, what's the process? Like? You were a huge part of help developing Tom Brady, right, that's when you first came in two thousand and two thousand and one. Yep, you developed him and the other guys. But what it developing a quarterback? What's that process like now? And who also makes that decision? Is the head coach, is the offensive coordinator, is it, you know, the quarterback coach or is it everyone's doing it their own.

I think I think you have to have a plan, you know, and that obviously starts from the head coach his perspective, and you have to you know, be able to agree on how you're going to kind of unveil that thing to the to the player and you know, and ultimately bring him along.

You know, you were a young player that needed to make progress every step of the way. Yeah, and this is no different.

It's just there's so much no notoriety and so much attention on the quarterback position. So if they're not talking about your arm angle, they're talking about your footwork. If they're not talking about that, they're talking about your eyes or your read or how you navigated the pocket. And there's a lot of things that go into playing it well. But I I at the end of the day, I think you got to take the player where he's at.

You know, when he comes in.

Whether that was Castle or Garoppolo or Stidham or Brissett or mac aidan O'Connell, like, you got to take the player where he's at. They're all at different spots, they all have been taught different things. They've all you know, digested different amounts of information. Some have played in different systems than than yours. Some have played in maybe some that were a little bit more like yours. And you just got to figure out, all right, what do they know? And I what am I going to try to you know, push forward to get him to progress the quickest, you know, I think I can get this and this done in OTAs okay, great cadence play calls footwork all right, good and in training camp you know, now I got to get him to see different coverages and understand defenses a little bit more, you know, protections, you know, and then you know, move forward. You know, ball security, and then the red zone is a different animal, and third down and two minute offense.

So there's a lot of things that go into it.

But I think it's just having a really good feel for where's the player at. Ye you know, can't just keep throwing stuff at him. Always talk about it. They have a bucket. You guys all had a bucket and yours was a big bucket at the end, like you could handle whatever we gave you. Well, when you take a young quarterback, it's more like a cup. You know, you got to put some some stuff in his cup, and when it gets to the top, you got to stop, you know what I mean, and then make sure that he you know, got has this and he can.

Do it well.

And then okay, so then when he's ready for more than you get him a bigger cup and then hopefully he ends up with a bucket and you got a bunch of stuff in there that you can do well. But there's no shortcut. There's no shortcut to it. And I think knowing where the players at is really important.

Yeah, it's now some you know a lot of people have been talking about, you know, the systems in the NFL. You got the West Coast system, then you have like our system, the Charlie Weiss Patriot system, and they say that the the West Coast system is pretty much it protects the quarterback, the offensive linement, help with the protections everyone, you know, everyone with the quarterback, you go where the ball is supposed to go. It's step system for the receivers. Is it harder to develop a quarterback in our system, because that's what people are trying to say, than it is in the West Coast system.

I think it depends on the way you look at that. If the goal is just to.

Restrict the volume of responsibility that you place on him right away, then it certainly could be. If at the end of the day, your goal is to have him understand how to handle all the problems and take care of those things that come up in the big games in order for him to help you win them, then maybe it's worth it.

You know.

That was always our mindset. Is basically what we're talking about here is who's going to do the stuff prior to the ball being snapped? Yea, All the quarterbacks have to do the same thing. Once the ball is in their hand. They got to understand what happened relative to the protection or the pressures. They have to read the coverage, they have to identify a guy that they think is open, and make accurate throws and protect the ball like everybody does the same thing once the ball snapped. Really, what we're talking about is pre snap responsible.

Pre snap responsibility. That's it.

And so I always looked at it like a mountain, like at the beginning, we're at the bottom, we're trying to climb it. And at the beginning when you start talking to him about making the calls and setting the protections and dealing with the run game and all those things that we, you know, we taught our players how to do. You know, it's it's harder because it's foreign. It's not that they don't understand it, it's just different. And so at the beginning, they're at the bottom of the mountain. You look up and you're like, God, damn, that's a tall mountain, you know. But always felt like, as we went through the first year, all right, you're getting up the mountain. You know it, I know it, we all know it. And then once you get to the top of the mountain, now there's nothing left to climb because you understand it. You understand how to manipulate the protection, how to solve your issues in prep with blood zero and those kind of things, and and and just be able to to to do it at a high level, you know, because I always thought, like, Okay, Tom, everybody knows Tom's won a lot. Well, Tom did it that way. Peyton did a lot too. You know, Peyton won a lot. He did it that way.

You know.

I know that pats some you know, in some way, shape or form. I'm able to handle some of those things as well. I just think having the quarterback never be responsible for any of that stuff.

You know, there's some downside to it.

You know, other people might argue that that's not the case, but I would say that, you know, there's there's pros and cons to both.

You know.

I love the I love the idea of having the quarterback able to understand it all.

I really do. I mean I did too. That's quarterback. That's what you paid all goddamn money, you know, fun five million dollars. Nowaday, can we talk about the game day fit? What do you mean what you wear? Yeah? Well, like for coaches, what what you know? Did I worked?

I wore two things specifically, what I like it. Yeah, maybe that's the Josh McDaniels vice. And I wore two things. I did two things specifically.

The reason I did it was so my kids, because we all look the same. Yeah, you go out there and you have the same exact outfit, and it's like when you have like a seven year old and a nine year old and you know, and they're up there in the stands and you know, somebody trying to So initially I did the white visor and the white long sleeves, you know, And that was the two things that I told him.

I said, I'll that's you can see me. And then then it just.

Stuck and it answers the other question that air monarchs are just dad swag?

Is dad swag? Is? It is? What it is? I was, I was, I was, I was.

You know, orthotics and everything I had. Guys, I hate the I hate the narrow shoe like it drives me crazy.

I was right there with you. We were just messing around.

Now, this is our guy, Jeff Angler, Angler, Angler, so Angler, this is this guy who makes orthotics.

Let me just tell you he comes up. The first off, these orthotics are like thirty grand each. They're like that's that's he's going over the top. Well for you, they're probably be cheaper, but there, Yeah, the team was probably know he was a cup of smaller. He made more money than I did. But he would he would roll up to Foxboro. He's from Pittsburgh. He rolled up in his motor home and he'd bring out all these contraptions and stuff and he'd be making your your your orthotics like there was some band, like there's drills and drills, but he'd be making tar and ship in like the parking lot, which is like fully illegal. I don't know.

I went to his house once to do so. You know how he does a mold to your feet. Yeah, So I got to his office and he has literally, when I tell you, he's got like if someone ever broke in there, I'm God blessed.

Don't don't let that happen.

He's got people's feet.

That you wouldn't even imagine. Like I was looking at him all and I'm like, oh my god, oh my god.

Like we're talking like I mean, it's like, you.

Know, Ray Lewis and this guy and a golfer and an NBA player and I'm not going to name it, but it's like okay, and it was like it was like I'm literally hundreds hundreds of feet molds.

Rex Ryan would have loved it. Yeah, he would have loved it.

Bro, you make him sound like the Walter White of orthotics cooking up.

That's exactly what he was. He literally would roll up in a motor home and he'd be cooking up these guy damn orthotics in the back.

Well we were how many of us were hooked on that? Like we didn't want to We don't want to get them from anybody else.

Oh you couldn't. I still don't. Yeah, I me. I still get them not making as much. Oh yeah, all right, just stay in the Rebuk sixteen people on here we got This is a segment Josh, when we go back into time around January tenth, twenty fifteen. We talk about pop culture. We talk about pop culture. Remember one movie was taking three of yours. I mean, if you have.

As good as taking one, but I mean no, But.

I think all these movies are pretty much they're just taking. Yeah, and I watch them all and I love them. I'm entertained every time.

He uses that that voice when he talks, I'm going to give you an option.

That's exactly right. It's like a low voice and it's like you just feel like you're going to let my doughta go. That's right where I'm going to come and find you very specific set of skills, exactly, that's right. The number one song All about the Bass by Megan Trainer. Daughter likes that song. It's all lot about that your daughter does. Yeah, it's crazy. It's I know my daughters liked it back then. It's it started. You know, we just hit on the kid bop version, my boy, so we don't we don't have to hit it. Hear anything about booties and stuff, that's right, you know. Around this time, David Letterman says goodbye after thirty three years night of the Late Night Show that he was he was a stud I never I don't. I didn't realize it was this late. I thought it was more like early two thousands, because when you were going on Late Show, it was already Colbert, right, we went Colbert and then Allen Fallen.

So you didn't go on till literally after this year.

Yeah, after this year, after this year. Wow, he was great. He was left Shark sweeps the Internet after Katie pe one of those things like this. See you're kind of like trying to do your old David either Day David Letterman thing. I mean, you watch you got to watch all the great look at them Our's third David Letterman. There you go. W N Some great movies that came out this year. American Sniper, The Hobbit, Battle of Five Armies, Interstellar, all in theaters. I didn't see The Hobbit or the I didn't see that American Sniper. Yeah, I saw that. It was badass. That was a good movie.

He made so many pump up videos for you using the Interstellar soundtrack.

You love that right around this time.

So these guys when he was playing, Yeah, these were guys.

We were around for a while. I've been around too long.

He needed he needed you to be making pump up videos. I think I was making these these yes, highlight films. I thought I thought you.

I thought you would race out of the building after treatment and go home and like make a highlight video of yourself.

Absolutely to Interstellar, Interstellar. Have you heard Hans Zimmer. He's gonna be in LA next week or New York. I want to go see him. He's a great soundtrack guy, is he? Yeah?

Would would you see any of the content that he would be putting out, like when he was playing.

No good good nothing, no nothing never, not even growing pets on what on what?

The only thing I saw, The only thing I saw that you did was that you and Dola were the police officers.

I saw that. I did see that. Yeah, what did you see? You know, you see them all, and you see them all. You got kids come up.

To be like My kids probably saw more than I did. Actually, my kids there were I was leaving and they were like, where are you going. I said, I'm going to Julian's and they're like for what. I'm like, I'm like, I'm going to do his podcast.

Like what are you really? Oh yeah, they're all excited. They probably have seen that. Little McNuggets, Little McNuggets. What's life like for Josh McDaniels in twenty fourteen.

During this time, I had four and I so my littlest one just turned two, and then I had a two of four, an eight, and a ten. So I was in it, it in it, you know, and so, and all of them are in grade school or not yet in school. So those are good times. I mean, you know when you had one but I mean like those are cool times. There's not as much drama. Yeah, you know, they're not into problems. They you know, have minor issues.

Being a coach is tough man, you know, like having to deal with those problems and then having to deal with you know, the team.

Took two of mine to the Super Bowl this year, and that was the last time I did that, last time that I took two. Why because the other two were two and four? Yeah, So I'm like I I you know, and then they all started going. You pay three thousand dollars for them to watch like, you know, Mowana, you know four times, you know what I mean, Like it's the most expensive movie you've ever seen in your life. So when we went to when we went to Houston to play Atlanta, the night, you know, the night after you win the championship game is so like you're having all these conversations, right who you to get the tickets to and who's coming and all that. And we were sitting on the couch and I was like, what do you want to do the girls? I'm like, just let's just bring them all whatever. And so like we have we have pictures like there, they have their iPads right, thank god they were allowed to bring them in, you know, and then headsets and they're just watching the games going on, you know what I mean, Like, you know, but at least after the game you have those memories, you know.

Those are great memories. Yeah, man, you seen all the media Butterfly now Bill on TV lately. I've seen them a little bit.

I haven't seen like I mean, I saw him on the draftee some of the draft with McAfee. I haven't seen the recent McAfee's have been doing some other stuff, but I mean I know he's doing a few things right.

Inside the NFL, inside the NF podcast.

Yeah yeah, McAfee, McAfee. So the first second week in September, it will be a big week.

You know, yeah everywhere.

Two hardest fucking people, the two hardest people to get on my goddamn podcast, Bill fucking a check guy that I took a lot of pigs, nice nice pig days for right, nice paydays. And then Tom. I knew you're gonna say, I can imagine Tom. Yeah, it was so tough. But you know they'll go do McAfee show. Yeah.

Coincidentally, you see them, but they're the guys, you see the most every every stinking podcast. He's getting a haircut on a podcast.

Tom, I mean, what are we doing? What do we need to do? What?

What does your podcast need to do?

You know, I don't know.

We might need your help.

We might we might need you to text me. That's what I was asking you. You know, like you know I haven't you haven't you.

Have a board, like a board of trustees for this show, and the.

Board Ernie, Ernie is our guy.

I like he remember the crew at this point.

What's what's your craziest Ernie story, Ernie?

Well, I mean, that's that's a long there's some there's a long list of us. Well, the when he took the header before we played Atlanta, Like he took the header, and the best was when he came back out and he was bandaged like like a war like a.

Hero, and it was like we're still in practice. Remember when he came back out, all the players started like clapping for him, the slow clap for I was like, I.

Was like, what is going on?

I remember he was bleeding.

So then that night, you know, we practiced on it and then every night we had a staff meeting, right we go to the staff meeting.

Ern still got the bandage. He's still bandaged up. Like it was like it was like a mass unit, the same frestage. I don't know, I'm not going to comment on that. I didn't change it, but I know this, he still had the bandage, you know.

What I mean?

Like I would have got out of the bandage and maybe put like you know, like like I don't know what I would have put on, but it was, yeah, like a hat or something.

But he was like, no, I'm gonna keep wearing the banded.

Hey, you gotta gotta you gotta coach Hurt. Yeah, you gotta coach Hurt.

And is funny because you know, in a I have a couple, Ernie. So when we were in the pre the night before the Super Bowl in eleven, so we're in the meeting, the staff meeting. This is the final staff meeting prior to game day.

This is evening. You guys are curfew supper last up. Right, there's a phone that rings.

Bill started to talk already, right, and that's when he's like making like he's basically like, this is the last thing we're going to talk about, right, and the phone rings, and I'm like you know, at that point, you're just hoping it in yours, right, And I always had mine off anyway, So I'm like, Okay, I'm good.

And then I look over to the left and it's Ernie's and he answers it like Bill's literally like where you're at, and I'm where Ernie is and he he he like looks down, he grabs it, looks at the phone, then he flips it up and he started talking, and I think it was Christine and he's like, he's like, you know, tells her like basically.

He's in a meeting and I'll call her back.

And I'm going like, I'm like, there's only one person in that staff meeting that could have done that and not gotten like the death stare. And it was Ernie, because if I'd have done that, Bill would have looked.

At me and wanted to just kill me. Oh my god. But it literally he hung the phone up and I'm going, oh my god, and Bill just kept going, just kept going out. Then he put it.

He hated the whole like, you know, like the Nike you know, you know he loved this read these rebox shoes.

Good good brand. Yeah, he loved these rebox shoes.

So when the league came out and made us wear Nike, he just put tape over the Reebok logo on game day and or his old rebacks for like fifteen years or whatever whenever we went to Nike.

I don't remember when that was.

He's superstitious on the on the low because he wore the same shit all the time, all the time, all the time, all the time. Let's go back.

Well before we do that, what we're talking, Ernie, I'd love to know two things from you. What was the best nugget Ernie ever gave you? And what was the worst nugget he ever gave you.

There won't be any worst nuggets, honestly, because he never really he shared stuff with me, like he had video and things from Montana like doing drill work, and he really he was he had so much knowledge about almost everything, you know, and so he really footwear, quarterback, play situations, adjustments.

He was just he always helped, always helped.

It wasn't always like like fifteen things, but there was like.

You mean to tell me, there hasn't been one Ernie Card where you're sitting there, Ernie Card, Oh, well, that's not a nugget.

If you're talking about Ernie cards, that's a whole different story. Yeah, he was, does anybody do the viewers your car?

So Ernie would, he would, he would do all the defensive cards right.

On Thursdays and it started on Fridays, That's when it started. So it was like Bill would say, I got the cards on Thursday night in the staff meeting, which meant Ernie had them because Bill wasn't gonna draw him. Yeah, you know, he had other things to do, and so Ernie's Ernie's So Ernie would.

Draw the cards.

And it was like so we you know, as an offense, we didn't know what was coming. Kind of more preparing, you like to get ready for the game. Mike get a blitz heer, Mike get coverage, Mike get something else, who knows, and he he would always take it off of like something they did. But there was times where like, you know, as an offensive coordinator, you're like, we've had a pretty good week so far, and like the last thing you're looking for is like an absolute disaster on Friday's practice, right, Yeah, No, they weren't. Fast Fridays in New England were Championship Friday Championship May Championship Friday, and so we would go. We would like, you know, we would he would hand us the cards and I would just ask one of the QC's like, do we have any grenades in there?

You know what I mean?

Because they would like flip through it and he'd be like, yeah, there's a few, you know what I mean.

It's just like, oh, man, what are we doing the defense?

And Tom, you know, Tom hated it.

Oh, he'd be like, that's not they don't.

Do that, you know what I mean, just like legitimately, like get angry about it.

And I would be like, just let it, got it right, let it go. I mean, we we get a play call from when the defensive coordinator did it back at UOP in nineteen eighty two when he was a defensive coordinator. Quality control guy ran a blitz zero in this one like the one time it was ever called in the history of the game. But that guy was associated with it. So we did it back. Do you have like a marketing deal with these guys? Yeah? Clean, clean, clean, little little electrolates in there to get keep that that water in your muscle. Look at you, pH levels just have less muscles. Now I'm older, I'm almost fifty. No, you're not. I'm forty eight.

You look good, you're good man, I'm almost fifty.

Like Richard Green.

My little girl the other day, she looks she she heard me say that because somebody had asked me how old it was, and she stopped for a minute and she's like, you mean to tell me in twenty two years, you're going to be seventy.

And I was like when she said that, I was like, whoa. I'm like, that's that's not that far away. Twenty two is.

Not like that's a long long time.

I don't know, but I mean that, like like she went right to the seventy marker on me. I'm going like, can I get to fifty?

First? Seventy birds?

How old are you now? Thirty eight?

You got a little grays in there, I'm Gray's heck, look at you distinguished.

Yeah, I'm trying to be like you guys like Richard g Richard Greer, baby, you know, George cleaning, Richard gear, Richard.

Whatever is there, it's your gear.

There we go. We'll be right back after this quick break. Sports World. In twenty fourteen, twenty fifteen, we were the Super Bowl champ. Yeah, baby MVP was Aaron Rodgers always had those MVPs National he had won ring fifteen years ago. National champions were Ohio State Heisman Trophy winner Marcus Mariota. Shout out to Oregon Ducks, Baby, Oregon Ducks. Where's he at now? Washington, Washington, someone's been waiting watching. He didn't play last week. Nowhere, he didn't play last night. No, No, he's back. That's that's the best job in football, being a known backup guy.

So you gotta play until you gotta play.

Randy Johnson, Pedro Martinez, John's Molds and Craig Bigio all inducted the Hall of Fity year. That's a year. That's a crew. American Pharaoh became the twelfth horse and the first since nineteen seventy eight to win the Triple Crown. That was that long ago. That's crazy. We were at that race and the Derby. That's not the last new pictures of you at that race. I remember. I think a lot of people have pictures of us at that race. I definitely do.

Were you there, No, never been because it was usually right around the draft.

Yeah, it's almost always on the coaching staff. Were kind of horse race guys. So I was wondering, it's always on draft weekend. It's hard for us to know. We don't even know who's playing.

Who's on what? What's on? Second? Now, the US.

International team is this Brandy?

Is this one? Brandy? No? This is for That was in like two thousand.

That was like two I was like, did an episode with her? Awesome?

That was awesome. But this is when we defeated Japan five to two to win the World Cup. Didn't we lose the year before or the year after let me double check or the year after? This was like the redeem ref talk. Ron Witter and Scott Green retired prior to this season. Who's your favorite? Who's your favorite? I like Gene Jean? Yeah, that was your favorite? That was my favorite? You don't like Jeene? I do?

I really like Jane Jeans. Jean Jean's great. Geane had a kid that went to Kent John Perry, Perry.

He was cool.

I really like Van I thought he just doesn't he just does such a good job of like the game just keeps going.

Yeah, I'll tell you. I don't like What's Who's the guy? Scott Novac just looks like a principal. He just looks like he might be. He probably is. Range judge I have they all have jobs. Not a hocolaue guy either, not a hockey guy. Yeah. He got too loud, with too much, with it too much. I like talk under the hanging off of him. Can if you looking like a linebacker, barely get his false smart? Can we get some pliability in those arms? Suit? Come on, Hydra, he's just like above Cleete Blakeman. Come on, bro a buff Lakeman.

Oh my god, I love deeper that.

You laughed at his joke. He's a he's a McDaniel's head.

I'm a stand brod.

He's not gonna. He's gonna when you leave after this, He's like, you guys heard laugh my joke? All right? What teams? Uh? What teams know? How did you grow up liking? You're from Camdon You're talking about like pro and college? Who did you?

When I was a young I mean, it was hard not to like. It was hard not to support.

Ohio State and the Browns because of where I grew up. But my favorite college football team back then was the Florida State Seminoles.

Seminals loved, loved Charlie Ward. He was the quarterback.

Casey Weldon was before him, and then Charlie Warre and I just I rooted for Bobby Bowden to eventually get over the hump and beat Miami and win a national championship, and they did eventually.

But that was my favorite college football team.

You get some Snoop Menace talk on this spot, some what Snoop Menace?

Who's a national championship game? When they beat Virginia Tech.

No, that's what that was. After that, that was with Peter Warwick. Okay, that was the one.

The one in ninety four, I think it was when they won and they had Kes McCorvey and Tomorrow Vanover and Kevin Knox and those guys were playing.

They were a beast in football. The football game n CUAA ninety four are good victocy That year I forgot about that was that Mark rickt was yes year.

Before he went to Georgia. Yeah, that was my favorite team.

And then, honestly, I don't know why I had like kind of like an affinity for the Lions. That was back when Eric Kramer and they actually did some decent things.

Back there with Barry.

Barry was hard not to like when you got to see Barry on TV, like that was like musty TV.

Yeah, Barry Sanders, Yeah he was. He was unreal. That's who every kid wanted to be just.

Watching him play with such his running style was so different than everybody else, I mean, and his legs were just so massive, and he the way he cut on astro turf was like illegal.

Yeah, and he just he too liked the physics. Literally he walked away from the game. He was still healthy and he could have played. And I watched the thing on him. He seems like a great dad and stuff. You know him and his relationship with his dad was always a little weird. It wasn't weird, Like he loved his dad, but his dad was always kind of tough on him.

Yeah, Like always said that he was the third best running back of all time behind Jim Brown and him, and then he he would do publicly, he would say she had the third best running back of all time behind Jim Brown and me. Jim. Now you you coached at Michigan State. You got just for one year? For one year? Was sabing? Was that part of ready? Right after I graduated from Carol And so did did you think Nick gave you a recommendation of.

Bill, Sure, I don't, I mean, I can't.

Yeah.

Brian, So, Brian was a second year GA. I was a first year GA. So he was a year older than me, Brian dab dable. So when I got there, Brian was already in his second year and so I was in my first year.

So that was a huge experience.

For me because coming to New England with Bill after being with Nick, it didn't seem like such a like a oh my gosh, yeah, you know what I mean, because I'd already like, all right, I know what this is like.

You know, after having been with Nick. What are the similarities and differences Nick is?

Nick is not afraid to really detail it out, you know what I mean. Like there would be like a cover one tip sheet for the DB's that was like this thick that's just cover. That's one defense, you know what I mean. It's like, holy cow, you know, if you do this, do this, you know got that, you know. And he believed in.

Preparation, preparation, preparation. It was relentless in that regard.

Bill was very much the same, but less like he would try to simplify. I thought, you know, as much as he could, you know, and we might play cover one, but he's not going to overwhelm you with you know, too much detail. But I mean, honestly, there's their personalities are a little different. Everybody thinks Bill is what you see in the media, and as you know, it's not like that, you know. So it was fun, It was really It was great for me to have a chance to be with Nick before going to.

Bill baptize you into it, no doubt. You know, we all forget Anakin was the Jedi first. Okay, he was a Jedi. There you go, Jackie. Let's break down these Ravens. Give us a rundown.

Let's get into these.

Ravens, get into the game. Okay, this was the year.

The Ravens went ten and six. Is in the Hardbar era, of course, Gary Kubiak's loan season as OC in Baltimore. Yeah, and then on staff, oh yeah. And then on the other side of the ball, we have mister Blitz zero himself, Dean ps Dean p.

That fucking Dan Pan Peece. You remember what Randy Moshi said yell at Deep Pries all the time. What do you used to say? He dps Blitz fucking zero loasting goddamn ring my goodness, oh man, man, was it plexico? Yes, bro, Oh my god, I've still got PTSD from that as a fan.

Geez.

And now we're talking Nick Say, and we're talking Bama CJ Mosley's rookie year. He was a beast, Elvis Duomerville, Terrell Suggs, Sackville twenty nine sacks that year. We're in the post ray Lewis post ed, Reid Era. Those guys left in twenty twelve, we're in twenty fourteen. Here they were the sixteen and the AFC going into the playoffs. And this was a banner year for Joe Flacco, I mean, absolutely turned it up, best year of his career through for twenty seven touchdowns, almost four thousand yards, just bawling out.

Yeah, backed up by Tyrod. This is a good team.

Heck of a team, bro, Steve Smith.

Really good team, really tough, really well coached, and they had a lot of info on us, like we had, you know, played enough and it was like, you know, twenty twelve AC Championship Game, twenty thirteen, we went there and played them twenty fourteen, you know.

And dating back to my rookie year, yeah. Nine.

I mean there was a lot of.

Like rivalry people this is this was a rivalry are a good eight years, no doubt. We you know, it was like us, it was our out of division rival It usually bounced from them to the Colts, then went to Denver. Yeah, but they had a huge chunk of that.

Yeah, I mean, it just you knew it was going to be a challenge to beat him.

It's a great organization.

They're really well coached, you know, and they were stable, you know, like it wasn't like things were fluctuating all the time, like who's the coach. You know, we played against the Jets and the Bills, and it was like, you know, every every few years, it felt like you're getting you know, used to like, all right, this is the new coach. He hired these two new coordinators, so the system's going from this to something else. And it was like for these guys, there was a lot of consistency and stability, and so they were able to accumulate a lot of knowledge on us. We had basically the same situation, you know, you know, going into to playing them, and so I just felt like familiarity breeds contempt a little bit, and so we had played so many games against them, and it was like, Okay, here we go again. Like Sugs. I could still hear Suggs on the field, like when we would when we would say a code word. You know, Suggs was one of him and Lewis and Reid obviously were incredible, but they were also incredibly intelligent and so like yeah, and so like you're yelling a word and then he's going, it's going on, It's going over there, It's going there, and I'm like, gosh, dang, like we got to switch everything, you know what I mean. And it's like it's such a pain in the butt when you're dealing with that.

But they were tough.

They were physical, as you know, we prided ourselves on being the same way, and you know, so we played a similar.

Style of football, if you will.

Both wanted to be good in the kicking game. You know, both took a lot of pride and a lot of scrimmage turnovers.

It was all those things.

So it was almost like you're playing, you know, a close relative, you know, And even though they weren't in our division, we played them a lot, so it felt like they were and you know, they always talked about how they weren't they didn't fear us and all that. I don't you know, I don't know why anybody would fear playing somebody else, But like they talked about it a lot, and and you know so and they got.

Us a couple of times. Yeah, I know this game isn't it didn't have ray or ed, But can you can you talk to the listener about having to try to prepare against those two guys.

Yeah, that's I'm sure like when you talk about a defensive coordinator trying to get ready for Manning or Brady, you know, those guys that were really intelligent and could play the game in their mind too. That's what that felt like when you were getting ready to play. Read Lewis Suggs to me, there's not that many teams that I've coached against where I would say that there was the volume of players that they had at one time that were as instrumental in terms of knowing what was coming, seeing the formation, overplaying tendencies, being able to adjust, getting.

Their team mates in the right position.

It was really hard to you know, because as a coach, you want to prepare your team as best you can.

You also want to try.

To scheme some success.

So it's not like make you know, good luck jewels, you know, get out there and get them on every play. Like, there's definitely places where it's like, all right, jewels, you're gonna got to come through here, and you came through you know a ton. It's just you want to try to help your players as much as you can by giving them something that's like, Okay, this is gonna work, and it's it's gonna not trick the defense, but there's gonna be an element, a little foreshadowing.

There's gonna be a little you.

Know, a little you know where it's simpler to have some success.

And it was hard against them. It just wasn't That was not simple. Yeah, it wasn't simple.

I just remember anytime we'd play ed Reed or bray Lewis, Bill would show like a twenty play cut up on just both of those. There'd be a thirty minute team presentation, like to start the day of just a highlight of these two. This guy will fucking blow you up, like just that kind of shit. Yeah, oh, cover three, that's what you thought, And like Edward agreed to be in the second, you know what I mean, Like.

His favorite thing to say to us was that they don't need to play with safety defense because they just played post safety and Ed covers both sides of the field.

And it may and it like got in your head as like I'm like, you know, as a coach, you're like, oh, man, like can we throw it back there?

Or no? Ever? You know what I mean?

Like I remember Tom, like we'd have conversations and it was always part of the conversation.

But that that's that's a tribute to the greatness of the player.

Yeah, because when you're looking at him going he can cover everything back there and you're thinking about that, that makes you question whether or not you know, you can do something. Oh yeah, Bill loved ed Reid, didn't he like just loved it, loved him.

Where does he rank on the all time Mount Rushmore of like guys that weren't Patriots that Bill loved high I was gonna say, I always that.

Weren't patriots that he didn't coach. There's a caveat there.

Lawrence Taylor would be there is no Mount Rushmore.

There's Lawrence and then then there's the Mountain.

Yeah that's Ed Reed is he's on.

He's in, He's in the Mount Rushmore.

Is there anybody else in there?

Yeah?

I mean ed was Edward was such like Troy.

They were different players. Edred was a completely different player than Troy. You know, we ended well, hell we ended up with a lot of the guys that he loved Rodney Junior, Like it was like if we loved him enough, we would try to get him like Randy.

But like I'm just saying, like there was some show.

There's a love show.

All the miked up clips with them talking ship to each other pregame, it's, oh.

Yeah, yeah, he's something.

But that's that's what happened. That, Like you know, like you you you like them enough.

I don't know, I never made those kind of I like these two guys like you're dating.

It's like you're dating, like you know, you.

Chilling right now? Okay, chilling, we're chilling chilling on that. Now. What's the breakdown of this defense? What do you remember from this game? Planned? Deps? Dean? Was you played coach?

Yeah, he he coached against us a long time, so or with us a long time.

So he knew.

Like I think a lot of gets too much, gets overblown about that kind of stuff. But he obviously knew some of the things we did, so that was hard to like really get them on that kind of stuff.

The element of surprise is usually out with just your fundamental stuff. Yeah, it's just tough, you know, because they've seen it so much.

This was probably the most physical and physically tough team we would play. You know, now we played C at the end and they were very similar. But up to this point this was as tough physically of a football team on defense that we'd played, no doubt about it.

It wasn't like.

The most skilled, like you know, super speedy that it wasn't about quickness and that was not them.

This was about hitting you in the face. And they didn't let you run the ball. They crushed the pocket. Crushed the pocket if you head onto the ball. Hellodia was young, Nada was on the team. They had I mean na A Jern again. I remember Jern again hit Tommy the one time and almost I mean he knocked him, he knocked his wind out of him. But but then it was like they had all those big guys like Dumerville who played mostly in sub and Suggs who played all the time.

But then it was like they.

Had that that multitude of guys like Upshaw, McClellan, McPhee that were bigger, like they didn't even belong in the category of linebacker, you know, it was like a defensive end, you know. And so they would put them all out there in passing situations and then it was like if they didn't get an edge quick, it was just power.

And they just brought everybody to the quarterback.

And so we knew we couldn't hold the ball along running it was going to be difficult. And they were the best red zone defense we had played all season to that point by far. And so I remember on Tuesday of this week, Bill had a conversation with me, and these were always tricky conversations and it wasn't the only time we had it, but he said, I don't you know, I don't know how much time we want to spend messing around in the running game.

You know.

He's like, I just don't you know, I don't think we're going to win the game that way. That's not where our strength lies, that's not where our advantage is.

And so he was willing, you know, whenever he always said something.

Like that to me, always say like, okay, well tell me, what what does that mean?

Like, do you not want me to put any runs in? Like ever?

No, well, no, I'm not saying that, you know, Like, but I mean, like I don't think I want to spend a lot of time running the ball, you know. So then then I then he'd like leave and I'm like, I still don't know. I still know like what I'm doing here, you know. But then but but I'll say this, like this is one of the unspoken things did. I think our players did an incredible job of and they did it because I think Bill taught him how to do it. Was in a bit as big a game as this was, we're going to say we're not doing this, and you could you could get your feelings hurt if you were like an offensive lineman or the full back or a half back. You're like, wait a minute, Like, what do you mean We're not going to run the ball. We're not even gonna try, you know, and why because our advantage was in the passing game, and that's the way we felt best about winning.

Like it'd be like the Celtics.

The Celtics are one of the best three point shooting teams in NBA history, right, well, they're not going to just pound the ball in the paint all day and hope that they can win inside, you know, against the Nuggets or whoever they play, you know, they're gonna they're gonna do what they do and beat you with skill and speed and shooting and all. And that's basically what he was saying was, look, we can try it.

And we had a couple a couple.

I think we only ran seven times, you know, and that was literally just to kind of like give me a playoff to think about the next pass. Honestly, that's about what it was, because it was like we did not go into it thinking we were gonna run thirty six runs.

We weren't.

We were only going to run a couple here and there and then throw it the rest of the game. But you guys were able to hear that, and we would try to say it in the right way so where like guys would go, Okay, I understand while we're doing this, let's buy into what we're doing and be really good at that, and let's go win the game well.

With without a doubt. And you know, that's something that was on the wall when you'd walk in mental toughness doing what's best for the team when it isn't necessarily best for you. That was something that we all knew going into every game that we were a game plan offense. So there were times where we didn't run the ball, or where I had to run a bunch of go routes and clear out routes and all these routes and very few times all these routes, you know, right, all these you know, those kind of routes, but you know it was all for a reason, because we were a game plan offense. To get back to it, and you know, that's very different than a team that does what they do. There's like that. It's like teams that are game plan teams that are complete, they throw the game plan out every every post game and then it's all brand new. That's kind of what we tried to do. And then there was teams that did what they did. You know, Steelers on defense, they run the same cover fucking four for the last twenty years. You know, So like it's one of those things. But that's tough, and that takes a lot of trust for coaching staff in the players right that can handle that, you know, and we just so happened to always That's what the types of teams we had, guys that you know, understood that it.

Was tough to go in there and tell like Dante, yeah, you know, like you know, because you're having this conversation and you're like, Okay, well here we go, Like now I'm not I'm gonna go I'm about to go in there and tell the offensive line coach he's like one of the best offensive line coaches in the history of pro football, that we are not going to run the ball in this game, you know what I mean, And you've got to try to finesse it, you know what I mean. It's kind of like telling your wife you want to go on like an extended golf trip, you know what I mean, Like, Hey, I would like to go to Ireland with who, you know what I mean. And then you're like and then it's like how long and you're kind of like you're tread and water really, you know. I remember going to talk to Dante about it and he was like ever, and I'm like no.

So I looked at my.

Call sheet the other just just today.

And I'm like, we had we had runs in and we ran a few, we just didn't run a lot.

You know what I mean.

But the intention was to basically win with skill in the passing game. Yeah, that was what they end to to slow down the rush by getting the ball out.

We didn't.

We didn't think we're we don't want to stand there and hold it forever because it wasn't. That was not going to be the That never worked for anybody that year against.

Baltimore, without a doubt. You got any good Scarnikios stories, funny ones. Coach Scar was, he's a legend. He's kind of.

Like, yes, I have I have a great Scarnaki story. Yeah, so Dante Dante. Every Friday when we would finish practice, right, that was our day as coaches like that, we got out before like you know, it was close to midnight. Yeah, so we would like we would get in there, we would grab our little fast our with the fat Friday food, right, and we'd come in and we would like sit down and as soon as the tape was loaded up, we were supposed to run through the film and then we hand the corrections like that we said we needed to make the next day when we watched it with you guys on Saturday, we would hand that the bill before we would leave we didn't have a staff meeting, so it was like so the coaches were like, get your food and get in there, you know what I mean, Like, I'm gonna get out of here, right. So Scar would always he would lay on the ground. We would have the table here and we'd be watching the screen. He would lay over here on the ground on his back, right, and Dante was like, you know, by the end of the week, we're all wiped out, right. So Dante would be over here and he would intermittently do sit ups, and then when he wasn't doing sit ups, he was asleep. And so like we would be watching a play and be like, you know, we'd miss a te or something, and always let the coaches like you guys say what the correction is, you know, and some the g the QC would be writing it down, and so we like and I have the clicker.

We watched it and missed the t. Nobby said anything, rewind it? That be said anything, And I look over there, Dante's just like just cast on the ground, you know what I mean.

And then and then I go just put, uh, you know, handle the te on the right side.

And then he'd go, yeah, handle the T and then he would start doing sit ups again until until he would you know, and then he would just when he when he laid the head back down, he was going again, and then he would do sit ups.

That's what that. That was his routine. Scar. Scar would be the first one in the building first off, because I remember when I first got.

I made the coffee. I would be the I remember I was. I was determined to be the first one in the building once like before four. Yeah, you had to get there at four.

I got there at four, like to beat him one time my rookie year. I was like, this is way too early. But he would get in this swim X and he would he would swim like like an Olympian in the swim X for like thirty minutes. Like he had a crazy routine. He was very fit and that's why he would. He's probably like eighty now, No, he's in his mid seventies. He looks great.

Yeah, we have breakfast, he and Ivan and I have breakfast every once in a while.

Yeah. I was coaching Ives is great.

Ives was great. Ives is lost a little weight, He's doing great. So he's like got this emeritus status. I don't understand, like I keep asking like, how did you get that? Well, I know how he got it, But he like goes to the facilities. I'm like, he eats breakfast, then he'll like get a workout in, then I'll go to practice, then I'll come in and eat lunch, and then they'll take off.

You know. It's it's it's my country, great day, It's Country cub ives. I mean, I've seen him there a few every time I visit. I'm like, so, I thought you were retired five years ago. He did?

He did instead of he's not going to Lifetime Fitness.

He's absolutely not. No, that's free, that's right, that's right for the soul. That's so dope. Jack, Let's break down the pass.

Hey yeah, let's get in these pats AFC champs for the sixth straight year. This was a twelve and fourteen for the third trade year, Bill's fifteenth year in New England. Pretty crazy, josh Oc of course, Maddy p d C. This was Jimmy G's rookie year. We lost some talent in the offseason, lost to Keith Leeb, lost Brandon Spikes, lost Logan Mankins, but replaced sort of not really replaced, but brought in Darryl Reeves, Brandon Browner, Brandon Lafel, junk back re signed Jules Big.

Signing not bad, not bad. Remember when you were out.

There moonlighting and free agency? Yeah, I remember that.

I was in San Francisco some of the most sleepless nights of my career.

I just you know, I was like Bill, I was like, you can't let this guy go. Oh we're just starting.

Well, he's at the Giants. You know, did you go to the Niners?

Did you go to the Niners and the Giants that went.

Giants might and then Niners. So Niners offered me more money than I signed for.

Well, I mean the cost of living out there is exorbitant.

You know what I mean? Fine cheese out there.

You and Harball in there talking numbers.

Me, Harball, we're talking numbers when he was fighting.

Harball was fighting with the gm like they're like, it's publicly no remember that with the Niners.

Yeah, and he's over here asking me how much you want? You know, I won't get it, Dime.

You were like the only team in pro football that like built their offense around you.

I know That's what I Yeah. Yeah, But you know when I first when Josh first gets in there.

I remember when you came and talk to me after the thirteen after the twelve season. Do you remember that, No, was it twelve or thirteen.

When I broke my foot? No, thirteen was your first? Good year? Was thirteen?

They're like numbers wise. Yeah, And you remember you you came and talk to me at the end of the year. This is before free agency, and you said, you said, you know, I didn't know. I thought I was going to be a Billy Oh guy. And I'm like, I'm like, well, you don't have to be one or the other, like I said, you know.

Like I will.

We'll make this fun. And we did and it was great. But I remember you were nervous, like about being a billy Oh guy. I'm like, BILLYO is one of my best friends. Like you can be both be both guys.

We're different. I Alwa's yell at Josh. You know, like, you know, Billy Oh drafted me, but you you know he don't want to get him My opportunity bro.

Earned his opportunity catches and to break them back, someone had to murder someone and someone had tears some groans for that to happen.

But we're here back may. Still we're still in the back may. I didn't say that earned the back may. Josh brought in Dola, he brings it. He brought in I remember.

The first year he sat back, Josh, the first year he come back, there was like we brought in Dante. We brought in what his name, Anthony Dante Stalwart. Yeah, we brought in Jabbar. We were bringing in all the old guys. I'm sitting here. That's why I didn't. I really didn't like Josh at first. I'm like, this guy's already trying to replace me. I thought I was going to be you know, then all the all the old guys come in. Let's just being a young football player. Yeah, you don't really know. Learn, you learn, you learn. Now, what's the relationship with the coaching staff developing with Belichick? You know, what's that? How was that that room? You guys are all cool? It was it all like he's the principal. You guys are all the teachers, Like what what was the dynamic of that? You know, like just the coaching room, the locker.

Room, you mean, like the meeting room, like where we had our staff beings and all that.

Just that community. You guys's community. Like there's the player community, there's the medical community. The coaches are our own community.

It was you know, it was very very organized, and we always knew kind of like, you know, what was coming next. You know, our schedule was no different than yours in terms of like when we had to be wear next and all the rest of it. I thought he did a tremendous job of he We understood what was going on at each step of the year as it went as as well as I'm sure any other staff does, because he included us so like when it was free agency, or when we were preparing for the draft, or when there was a contract issue with somebody, or you know, he didn't just like we just didn't like have to read it on the internet, you know what I mean. He included us in there, and he and I thought that was helpful because it was helping coaches that we didn't know any of the stuff we were getting prepared for, you know, young coaches getting prepared to take a step forward and all that because we were learning the calendar year, we were learning all the things that happened. We're learning some of the things the ways that that the those things.

Got resolved, which was great. I thought our.

Staff meeting room was very comfortable. Like people think of him as like this real, like, you know, hard to be yourself around kind of guy. And it was like almost the opposite for us, Like we go in the staff meeting and you just you're you if you know, Pepper would have a big cup of meat, like he'd have like steak and chicken instead of be eaten then you know, other Dante would be doing sit ups and you know what I mean, like you could kind of be yourself.

And Bill, Bill was a Bill was.

An assistant for a long time, yea, so he understood, like we're not all going to be the same. And what he did such a tremendous job of was.

He asked for.

Input and he and he'd say, hey, let's go over where we're at on the roster, you know, after the first two weeks of training camp, okay, And so we would meet as an offensive staff and we would go through the players and say, hey, you know, Julian's having a great camp. He's in good shape, you know, healthy, blah blah blah blah blah. You know, here's the plan going forward with every player. Yeah, with everybody and then we would present it to him.

He was the best listener. That's what the magic for him was. He really, he really.

Because he gave away the responsibility to do that, and then when he when we came together, that's when he listened, and he was so intent on gathering what you had that he didn't have.

He didn't know.

He wasn't in the receiver room, he wasn't with us in our walkthroughs or anything like that, so he didn't really have that intimate knowledge. And then he would just take it in and try to help himself make good decisions.

And that's what you know. It baffles me on this whole narrative that everyone has on Coach Belichick that he was he's not inclusive or or you know, like it's just what everyone thinks. Oh, he's so old school, you know, he doesn't listen to other people. It's his way. Well, like he was honestly, he was a guy that would take information from anyone. Yeah, I remember he would come up to me and during the middle game, what are you seeing? And if you gave him the right information, he keep coming back to you.

Yeah, you remember, he would tell us, yeah, I'm gonna come ask you. Just don't make up a store.

Just don't make up a story, because if you do that once then he'll never come back to you.

Yeah, just don't make up a store.

But he was gonna rely on the players because you're out there on the field, you see it better than we do, Like all we can see is a picture.

So it's just it's crazy that he there's this narrative ever since, you know, he hasn't been the head coach where you know, like, oh he you know, it's his way or the highway. Like anytime you hear any sport talk people talking about it, they're like, oh, this guy doesn't listening to nobody. He does it all this. You know. It's just it's crazy to me. How long did it take for you to gain his trust though?

You know, I mean my first few years I was on defense. You know, from from O one toh three. I was the lowest guy in the totem pole for.

Sure, which was common. He would always cross coach, flip them the coaches, which is genius. Keeps great.

Yeah, we uh, you know, my first I realized my first year his thing was you're gonna do work at the standard that we expect and the reason he expected it was because we're not gonna be able to win championships unless we all produce work at this level. And so I was doing the pads when I was younger, which you had to draw the whole game and then input it all accurately, and if you made any airs at all, like he would hand the pad back to you when it was done.

When you handed it to him, that was just the beginning. Then it would come back to you.

And like my first one came back to me and there was like seventy yellow sticky notes, little ones with like this guy was on the numbers. He wasn't plus two, you know, or this he was a three technique. You had him as a two I or whatever. And he was basically telling me with.

That, like we see it all.

This is how we do work here.

And so I learned that, and then by the end of my first year, I was much I was much closer.

To what he wanted.

And then you know, I was able to work with Rack and Mangini, you know, those guys on defense and Bill for three years.

It's the nmorder around here. That's oh all right, Eric, all right?

And then and and rob Ryan and Pepper and those guys. That was a good defensive staff, and Bill was in there a lot, so I was able to see that. And then we had a great team. So I learned a lot from guys like Lawyer and Bruskie and Rabel and McGuinness and being able to see the way they received the information was great too. And then I'd say, you know, at the end of the three Super Bowl, he met with me the next day and he asked me if I would be ready to make the flip and go coach the quarterbacks, you know four And so I hope at some point after during that year one that I kind of earned his trust in terms of the way I would work and what what my standard personally was going to be. And and then it just kind of carried from there.

A lot of yellow stickies, a lot of yells at first at first. Then it changed. Everyone's mistake makes make mistake, the good ones learned from it.

Snailing is the best part of the process, if you'll learn from it, If you learn from it, that's right.

Is that a bit of like a make it movement?

When Bill asked you to switch onto the offensive side, that I feel.

Like that or I think there was a I don't. I don't think you've ever really made it. I think it was a.

I felt very proud of having the opportunity that he was about to give me, but I didn't.

That didn't That doesn't amount to anything until you go do the job, you know. So I was excited about it, and uh, I was happy that he would think enough of me to give me a chance to do it.

But there was a lot of work to be done after that. How many times you sleep at the facility? Never is there who I go home? I go home with the guys that were notorious. Maddy Pee was there. There was people that did.

But I just even if I was going to go home for four hours, I was going home. I was gonna I walked into each one of my kids's rooms every night and just did the right thing as a dad. Yeah, and you know what I mean, sleep my own bed, you know, and make sure that I saw him. You know, at some point that's what you gotta do. I mean, some people do it the other way. I just feel like there's something to be said about that.

Definitely, definitely, Jackie, let's get into the game. Set the stage, all.

Right, Patriots entered this thing number one seed in the AFC. As we talked about, Ravens enter number six, came off a win in hines Field, beat the number three Pittsburgh Steelers thirty to seventeen in the wild card round. So we gotta buy the Patriots. We that is gotta buy coming into this week?

Was that crazy? Didn't Flacco hit a deep sideline pass to the Jacobi guy? No? That was that was in twelve.

Yes, Okay, now I remember that one. Patriots clinched in week fifteen of this season. They're six AFCAST title and leading up to this when it was a cold day baby twenty degrees, but it was like eight.

What the feels like at kickoff?

So uh, in another one of these these great Ravens Patriots battles like we talked about.

Can you explain to the listener, like how we took these these bye weeks? Yeah, it was going into the playoffs, yeah, and.

We were Look, we were fortunate that we had more than one. Yeah, like some teams, you know, you do everything you can to get one, and that's great and you make the most of it. I think people always assimilate the bye week with well we're gonna we're gonna rest up and get healthy.

And that's true.

But I think we always thought of the bye week as, Okay, how what can we do during the bye week to make sure that we're going to have give ourselves a chance to have some advantage depending on who we play. Yes, and Bill was great, you know, for years he had always told us this was like I would say, after Thanksgiving, he would he'd always talk to us about listen, you know, if we can find anything that is unscouted that we can work on for these next four or five weeks that might give us an advantage in January, let's start doing it. And so we would practice, you know, we would practice things, gadget stuff, et cetera. You know, maybe some tempo things, low red zone, whatever that we weren't necessarily going to run on December tenth or December seventeenth. We were getting them ready, and then during the bye week we would really apply those to the opponent we were going to play or had a chance to play, you know, because we didn't know who it was going to be. But he he was really good at that, and so we always took time to try to do that. We didn't just like hey, guys, make sure you get treatment and get some red. It was it was always a purposeful bye week. You know, hey, we're not doing this as well as we need to be doing it. So like we're gonna do a blitz drill, you know, and make sure that we're good on our protections on third down. We're going to do a cover one period, you know, because we know we're gonna have to beat man coverage in the playoffs. Or we're going to do a third and goal period in the red zone because we know those plays are going to be huge factors in winning and losing in the playoffs.

And and for us.

We always had a period where it was like, is there any gadgets or a little different plays we could run.

Gadget speen trick plays, Yeah, that might.

Be able to give us, you know, just an advantage of big play, some momentum something.

What about this formation breakdown? Remember when I think who brought we were talking about Baltimore Rave Baltimore. So this was this was during this was.

During the bye week, and he brought it up and we saw it in Alabama game. So Alabama scored I believe it is against LSU they did something very similar where the tight end lined up as the tackle, they took a linement out and they somebody reported ineligible.

So we were like, that's a pretty good idea, you know.

And I think the execution of the whole, like the lineman coming out of the game, like the lining up in the formation and not acting like we did like we just robbed a bank, was important, you know what I mean, we did and like so we that's where we chose who was going to do it. And so Veren, who love Shane Vereen to this day, you know, is like he's the like you're gonna report ineligible, you have to go to the official. I remember having the conversation and you have to tell him this, I am reporting ineligible. I'm an ineligible player, you know. And I remember Vinovich was like okay, and I think his you know, his wheels were turning. I don't remember if Bill told him before the game or not. But then when Shane went to do it, he did it. But they lined up to us like we were in a normal formation. Yeah, and there we got three I think we got three plays and the big thing was Bill made Bill made the call on that hold it until the second half.

Hold it to the second half. He didn't want them talking about it at halftime. Oh so he wanted, he wanted, and we did this off and on anyway, like we would hold something just so you couldn't have a twelve minute meeting and say, look, if this comes up again, here's.

What we're gonna do.

You have to do it on the sideline, and you know, scrambling on the scrambling on the sidelines a little different than doing it at and the white board at halftime.

What situation do you have to be in to like kind of apply these gadget plays like down by fourteen?

Like what's the kind of like.

No, I think I think honestly as a as a oach when you're calling it. I think, honestly, at the end of the day, it's kind of like.

A feel thing, you know.

For me, I always kind of did it in two different ways, one of two different ways.

Either we have some momentum and I'm going for the cherry on top of the.

Sunday, or we need to create momentum or we or we don't have any momentum and I need it back quick.

Like it was one of the other you know what I mean, Like you remember in the AOFC Championship game against Kansas City, how many times did we call the flea flicker to get it? What we We killed it like four times in the game and finally got it in overtime and we he threw it away because it was covered decent, but I was like, I'm trying, I'm trying to get it again and again and again, and we didn't ever really got it until we got the overtime. So I think it's just one of those things where you kind of got to feel one or the other. Either you're going for the jugular or you need you need to save your yourself, or yeah, you need to say an extra life. That's right, get that mushroom like in Mario, that's right.

And you had to provide a little context here to what Josh mentioned and broke down with Baltimore and Raven. It was a November twenty fourteen game Bama LSU helped Bama. Bama pulled it out in overtime. Lane drew it up in ot Blake Sims to Brandon Green for twenty four yards, got him down to the one. Yep, And that's what the women game pulled out O T was pretty crazy. Lane Kiffin designed that. Huh do you think Lane designed that?

Was it with Lane?

It was with Lane?

Yeah, so Lane was there in fourteen.

Yep, Lane called it.

Yeah, that didn't surprise me. Lane's a good coach. Lane. He always finds me that ship. Another great visor, maan, another great ri advisor. I love.

He's a advisory. Group chat huh, group chat advisor?

Coach, we're gonnadvisor. This do you have to wear your advisor to do the group chat? Oh? The group chat without being on that's the group chat.

You know how many of those I have in my office?

Probably a bit.

And there's different years because they change.

They changed, and you get like the he'd have like the military advisor, or like breast cancer.

I like the I wore the breast cancer like I didn't like the other peaks.

I'm with you.

Because Bill would drop the visor every once in a while in a Miami game. You ever give him a look like coach, No, that's my thing. No, I just know because maybe you know your daughter up you know, in the stands, be like nobody. No, already wore the white with the white, so I was good.

Thereby he doesn't have the white sleeves, So that's all right, you're not You're not there.

He's not stealing me, not swagger jacking.

But did the did the hoodie sleeves ever get like O D blown out when you push him up?

Or no? They bounced back.

They bounce back because.

I always wore like it was like a you know, like a tighter Every once in a while you'd have to cut like the little edge just so it wasn't like, you know, like like you know, when you're done with the game, like your veins are ready to you want take an iv.

Yeah, that's what I would always keep my tape on from IVY because it makes me look way more rainier. I won't be looking tight. Look, guys, I took a shot. No, it was because you lose your circulation, then your veins could get even crazier.

Should we should we get into this game?

All right?

Back back to this cold, cold day in Foxborough where the feels like is eight at kickoff this fe and back to our boy Bill Denovich is roughing this thing.

Yep.

The Ravens come into Foxborough. Start out hot flackout, completes his first eight passes, gets two on the board, quick kamar Ake and Steve Smith. Smith beats Darrell Reeves for the first time like ever in that matchup that dates back to Jets against Panthers, Bucks against Panthers. Revis had his number man, but Steve got him for a couple and got him for a TD there.

Uh.

Then the Pats get back on there with a Brady Rushing touchdown cuts it to seven. Then a dol It t ties it back up, erased the first fourteen point deficit. Then before the half, Tom throws a brutal pick which leads to an Owen Daniel's TD.

Jack said, brutal, brutal, Sorry, he said that.

He said it was a brutal pick. You didn't say it was a brutal pick, And I didn't say. I didn't say it was a brutal pick at all. I just that it was an interception. He said it was a brutal pick. Tom, if you're watching, Jack said, this.

Situationally, this kind of brutal.

I mean when I see over the middle, you know.

The you know, the interesting part about that was, and this is probably as bad of a circumstance.

That we had.

I bet you that you and I can remember we had run four plays and we were down fourteen zero.

Yeah, we didn't have the ball.

Well, they scored and then we got the ball back. We got a first down, then we went first, second, third down, punted it. Then they scored again. So it was like fourteen nothing. And I remember the feeling in the stadium, you know, because they start you could start to feel the panic. Oh yeah, a little bit, and they're like you could hear those little murmurs like, oh, we're gonna get blown out here.

We had that in the back of our mind because they blew our the brakes off us. And know nine, my rookie year.

Was fourteen to nothing and we had run four plays and I was I remember, I remember going we got a score on this drive.

You probably thought to yourself, thank god, we don't have to run the ball on this.

One where it says Brandon Bolden was our leading rusher for three carries seven yards.

Now, can you explain to the listener when you're down fourteen points in a in a must win game, a winner, go home game, what do you do as a play caller? Are you throwing that script completely out? Are you going back to fundamental plays that you know that we know how to work. What was the mindset when we go down fourteen the first I'm not even the second time, and then you know, transitioning after when we got it to the second time.

I think the first time when you're first of all, we have to have poise if we're going to ask you to have poise. So I mean, I can't lose my mind on the sideline and then tell you guys to be calm on the field. So I think for me in those types of situations, it's stick.

With what we're gonna do.

We don't even have enough evidence to make a change, Like, we've run four plays, so should I switch the game plan?

I don't know. We didn't, we haven't done anything.

So to me, it's we don't have enough evidence for me to make a decision like that. So it's basically, hey, calm down, let's just try to get one on the board and keep playing. We got a long way to go, which we did, and then you know, you make it fourteen to seven. We got a little confidence now we know we can drive the ball on them, and then you know, eventually we tie it up at fourteen. But I I've always felt like The biggest tug of war you go through as the play caller.

In a elimination game is doing something.

That's not in your comfort zone, like you wanna, like you want to hurry up and get fourteen points on the board, Like there's no I don't have any calls on the call sheet, So I'm not gonna go to my my chunk passes and shot playlist and call like four of them in a row and hope that they all work. Like you can't you start playing the game like that, The next thing you know, you're gonna get sacked or strip sacked, or throw an interception or turn the ball over. And now it's like being in quicksand when you're an elimination game, the more you struggle, the quicker you go down, you know. And so to me, that took me a little while to learn that. You know, like, take a deep breath and stay with it. You guys are good enough on the field. You're gonna make plays. Let's just call the things that are.

Now.

If there was an adjustment that we felt like we had to make, then you make it.

But we didn't have enough evidence right there.

But I think you got to try to, you know, you got to try to sow your breathing down, honestly and just go to the next series and see if we can strain together some good plays.

Yeah, it's exactly what we had to do. And I always remember, I always remember you saying in all our comeback from behind victories that you you know, we can't win it all one play. No, you can't. You can't get the points in one place. So if we all collectively do our job one play at a time, that's when we're going to give ourselves the best opportunity to go out and win. That's right, you know. And and that's kind of what we did. Now, what are the halftime adjustments going in after this? So you know you had in the back pocket, we had our formations, we had Raven, and we talked about them.

I remember remember that on the board, like, hey, all right, we held these purposefully, Baltimore Raven. Is there any questions on what we're gonna do with the operation?

Okay?

I think I even put up there like just be ready on the double pass, you know.

And then we talked about a couple.

Other things because they were playing a little bit more man to man coverage than we thought they would, and you know, so I felt like there wasn't a lot of adjusting to what they were doing because I think we were dictating it because we were throwing.

We were just throwing. That's what we were doing, you know.

So I don't feel like it was you know, like a crazy big like, hey, let's swing this, other than we knew we were going to spring something on them that we hadn't done yet.

That was the big thing.

The two drives that really put us in the second hole was when we got the ball back in the second quarter with a minute forty something left and it was tied, and we didn't do what we always try to do, which is take the last shot and score something, and then we go three and out to start the third quarter. It was like the game could have been completely different in our favor, and yet we didn't take advantage of the opportunities with this possessions, you know, And and so now we end up, you know, falling behind by another fourteen, by another fourteen that justin forceet TV from Flack after a three and out to start the third but get back get back into it with the gronk TD cuts it to twenty eight twenty one then with four to twenty left in the third, after we scored that touchdown, I remember, that's that's when you came up to me, I did. I said, do you need any lead time for the double pass? And you and you said what? And I said, do I have to tell you that it's coming? Meaning like you need to take.

Your red gloves off or whatever you know exact.

You're cutters or whatever.

They are, Like, what do you do? Do I need to tell you that this is coming? Like fuck, five minutes in advance? You're like, no, no, no, yeah, yeah's what you said. Just throw it, just call it whenever you want. I'm like, okay, you know, so we so we did. Yeah, that was the first touchdown, was the one we actually did the Raven Baltimore formation the first time. First time, we're down by fourteen, and then when we scored one, that's when we went.

With the double pass. A double pass. Speaking of double pass, which we had actually called earlier in the season against the Chiefs.

Against the Chiefs, right, just didn't we just didn't throw it over there? We called it and you know it was Dola gonna throw it, wasn't it?

Was it you or Dola? I don't remember. I watched this morning. It was gonna be you, Okayna.

But Dola was like saying coverage, like we couldn't do it.

Was trying to call you off when you were.

In Yeah, can we go into the second time I threw the football.

Twenty nineteen in Philly.

Yeah, we can do that. It was a great story, Juice's story.

Jesus told his side, your side, my memories really fucked up.

The night before the game. This is the story.

Yeah, so we well this wasn't the same play.

No, it's a different play. Throw it here, throw it back and set up the catch and run. And in the what we we always did like a little ballroom, which always felt like you guys loved that.

I loved it.

To reiterate, it was almost like a very comforting feeling when you walked out of there, like we all we all got it.

Yeah, we all got it. And it was loose and and so. But it wasn't always loose depending on like the games. Sometimes we go in there running hard and stuff.

I no, but that was that was But but I don't think we ever went in there like it wasn't like a big like, it wasn't like a big like teaching session at all.

It was I would I would call the play, you guys would get on.

You would do it and walk through it, and that was it.

But if you had like a new player coming in that had a big role, that was different, you know, like if he was nervous and we were all kind of watching them too as well.

And Julian Julian, well, I'll tell him to tell two stories quickly. The when he came back in two thousand eighteen eighteen eighteen, So the walkthrough because we played on a Thursday night so we didn't have practice.

I didn't have any practice that week because it's just walk throughs. Well had no he does.

He does the hotel like walk through and he's soaked because he's like running routes in the ball like but nobody else. And Tom always had like a little lacrosseball and he would bounce it to you to like show you.

And Julian is literally like you could see everything, like he was just drenched, and I remember the other guys were like looking at him, like what is going on with this guy? I'm like, yeah, he's a little he's he's obsessive compulsive. Right now, I think he needs to play a game.

I dot up a wheel for you in the first possession. He so anyway, the Philly So, the Philly game was the second throw that night in the hotel.

The night before the game, we go walk through it. Tom dribbled bounces the ball to Julian. Julian gets the ball and.

Then he looks, he looks and throws it to Phil Bill just wandering up the field trying to get at the defense to come this way, and Philly catches it. And I look at him and I'm like, you can do that, just throw the ball over, throw the ball, and I think we actually did it again, just so he so he.

Would like do it right, you know what I mean.

And then we get in the game and he gets the ball and he looks down the field and Philly's open, and then he lets it go and I'm just like and then he caught it, and I'm like, I don't know. Those are the ones that's coaches where you're just like, that's a hell of a play.

Figures, if I would have flipp my hipsky was in my face, I would have got you got you did get I got drilled. He got drilled, drilled, I come running off. When I come running off.

You're fucking dangerous, Yure, you are dangerous.

You're dangerous.

But that was all I remember because you were the only one that threw a touchdown past that game.

Oh yeah, So I remember like like and then he would come in the next day and he would put ice.

He would have his shoulder wrapped in ice in the and he would sit in the front, you know by but like, yeah, I gotta you know, I always come in like the last person to come in to wait.

He would just be like, I'm like, coach, you got the door. Don't worry, you got that. I say that the tradeing used to have called the ice fed in front of everyone.

Looking like you just threw a complete game shutout.

Yeah, literally, like it's Randy Johnson after a nine inning.

Oh my, I will say that pass your dangerous Maverick moment in Philly put jewels at five of six, one hundred and forty one yards and two tds as a passer.

There you go. This is reading. Had to be exceptional.

That had to be amazing.

Yeah. We had the the one in the Super Bowl to Dion Oh man, he was close to it. He almost made that he almost made that catch. That was it. I shouldn't have thrown it. That was nuts. What you mean was he open?

You know, he got him.

It was like, just buy him.

The guy did a good job of peeling on it. Yeah, but the rest of the defense was over there.

That game was a.

Blur point three.

That's perfect.

That's perfect.

That's perfect. Someone say that's pretty good, bro. Someone say, let's get back at the game.

All right, So we uh were moving here into the third quarter, we talked the Gronk TV cuts it back to twenty eight twenty one.

Four to twenty left in the fourth is the double.

Pass moment in the third? In the third in the third, in the third, four to twenty Oh, I'm not.

I mean, no, guy, just get a baby. He made me watch the game again. I got this in my hand. Yeah, not just in there. You know, everyone talks about you know, these offensive geniuses, they always have this. They could just they know the place.

And then later after that game's tied back up twenty eight, twenty eight, Flacco throws a pick, his first pick in a long time in the playoffs. Yep, Devin and couldn't capitalize on that bough punt give him back the ball field goal. Down thirty one to twenty eight at this point, then in the fourth get the ball with ten minutes left, go on a nice ten plays, seventy four yard over five minute drive that ends into Jojo Lafel touchdown up thirty five, thirty one.

Yep. That was the drive of the game. That was.

That was a really and it was all passing, you know. And I remember the one thing about that that drive was we didn't need to do anything in a hurry, So trying to force the ball to go further down the field and take more chances holding on to it longer, yeah, was not really something that we had to do because we only needed to score once. Yeah, So it was like, okay, like we can take a three step, we can hit something short.

Which goes into play calling. Adjusting, you know, he had to adjust. Josh had to adjust from being down fourteen. Yep. The psychological battles of keeping the team that a we're sticking with what we're doing, then being down fourteen again, we're you know, we're we're we're trying to fight for time this that to now reverse engineering it to like all right now times on our side, we don't have to rush.

No, which is that's that's and it helps the protection helps protect. We're gonna we're going to take short profits and do that. And I thought that that was a methodical, Like you said, ten plays, five minutes, we're just trying to take the profit, keep moving it down the field. And then when we had our one chance, you know, Joe had single coverage.

I believe it was.

Cover one, and you know, you know, Tommy made a great throw and Jojo made a great catch, So it was it was different. The mindset of that drive was like, just keep we don't have to do we don't need two touchdowns.

We already started feeling the momentum coming though, yeah we did, you know, and the momentum is real when you feel that in the momentum fuels the confidence of the unit that's out there.

The loudest I've ever heard that stadium was when you threw the double passing score that I've never heard that stadium. That stadium has been loud a number of times in our lives. That was the loudest noise that I personally had heard, like because it was almost like, you know, like we we came back once then we're down two touches and so they're like, oh no, not again. Then we come back again and and to do it that way with you hitting dance. I mean, that was as noisy as I think. I can never remember it.

That was. That was a fun That was a fun play, but it wasn't over so well.

Before we do that, we let we have players on.

We like to walk through, like a specific moment jenneral from the Big Game. We've heard Jules's perspective, We've heard Danny mcdola's perspective of that play. I love to hear your like beat by beat perspective of that double pass play.

So down seven, then they punted, got the ball back.

I remember it.

Was ready and I had already checked with Bill, you know, like we're good. He goes whenever you know, whatever you want to do it, I'm good. And you know, because I always felt like whenever you're running something, it's a little bit screwy. Yeah, you know, just you better check with your big boss and make sure that you're you know, you're not doing it, and he doesn't want you to like fake punts, and you know, so was he already signed off.

Whenever you want to do it, and I.

Just didn't feel right about doing it, not like I wanted to get a first down and then do it.

I didn't want to do it like the first play of the drive. I didn't want to.

Do it on second and eight, like after the first play of the drive. I wanted to, like, can we get a first down and then once we get the first down, let's try it, you know what I mean?

And so we did.

We got a first down, and then I think it was right around midfield and it was kind of the right time to do it, and Dean acquiesced.

He brought the star Blitz off the side that we threw the ball to. He gave us.

We didn't know we were going to get that, but it made the play better because we only had one guy out there that we needed to block and it wasn't two and so was that gronk out there? I think it was Gronk out there. And then Danny did a good job of hesitating and going by. But you know, after I asked him if he needed anything time, he said no, Bill had already you know, signed off on the whole thing, and I just really wanted to get a first down. So it wasn't so like almost like desperate, like we gotta try this right off the bat, you know what I mean. I want to, yeah, get a little get a little bit of a momentum going in the drive and then give ourselves a chance to see if we could hit it. So and it was perfect because it was on our sideline. I love doing those things when they're on your sideline.

So when you're seeing when I'm going over in motion, what's going through your mind? It's not man.

And then when I saw the guy start to creep in and he was gonna blitz, I'm like, I don't know. We couldn't have drawn up a better like them, playing a better defense for the play. It was really just gonna matter whether the corner bit it or he didn't. And you know, Danny did a good job of bluffing it and then went by.

You mentioned, you know, want to do a playlia like that after first down and doing it on your own sideline. These little details? Is that like to factor him with your play calling? Is that innate? Is that something with reps? Like where do you pick up those little details when it comes into your crafts and play call?

I think it's just probably experience.

You know, I don't like I think when you're coming off the sideline and like the defense is kind of ready for almost anything, you know, Like, I don't think that's a great time to like spring your craziest play on them all the time. I think it's almost like you run a play, you run a second play. Oh, you got a first down. So they're kind of like, all right, they're just driving the ball. They're just trying to do the same stuff they've been doing, you know, throwing the ball here.

Dink and dunk, which is what I wanted them to be thinking. And they got.

So we get a first down, and we're into a drive. The defensive coordinator he knows we're not going fast. He's into his drive now, you know what I mean, meaning meaning Dean's you know, you kind of get into a rhythm of the drive itself.

Each drive is.

Different, and so we we first down, play huddle, second down, play, first down, go back to the huddle, you know what I mean. So now Dean's in his rhythm too, and so.

Again the it just I thought that was a better way to do it, honestly, then go out.

There and be desperate and try to hurry up and get to it. And you know, people don't realize these you know, I don't know how it's in other places, but there's a department that studies and gives everyone around the league what they're doing to our coaches, and they look at it. These guys study it so that you know, you could always see when it's the best opportunity. He's probably seen this situation go down. May not be this specific trick play, but a different trick play that you know, a team off of. You know, a big play makes another big play feels desperate, you know. So these guys they're always watching the game, yep. And that's how they get their experiences, not only through coaching it, but watching other coaches. The great co coaches will use their experiences and implicate it into their.

And I've made I've I've called enough plays and made enough mistakes when I was younger, you know, to like, all right, well that sucked, you know what I mean, Like that totally wasn't the right time to do that, you know, And you just I think learning through your failings as you're going is a helpful thing.

So you have a little bit of wisdom, you know, after you've put enough pelts on the wall, you know where now you kind of know like that's I remember not to do that because of this game.

And I tried it and it backfired, you know.

And the other thing I would say about this is, and you would attest to this, we practiced those things, and we didn't act like they were like so special that it was like impossible for us to succeed at them.

I treated those.

Things like almost like a play action pass, like a flea flicker or a double pat like if you rapid enough, what's the difference.

Other than the ball handling?

And yeah, like but I trusted you enough and we repped it enough where I was like, I didn't call it and go like this like what's gonna happen? I called it going as long as the defense is gonna give it to us. I've seen us execute this many times.

Look at he's got this smile, like, yeah, tell him how many times I hit it in practice?

I think I overthrew him three or four times.

You were gloves too, right, Yeah, because always ships on quarterbacks when they wear their gloves.

Yeah, but I'm not gonna take my glove off. Well that's why that's the thing is you take it off.

Then these guys Baltimore might have been perceptive enough to.

This guy Michael Jackson.

Out there gloves like lad Guerrero, come on now.

Yeah.

But but to coach his point, I think that's a that's cool that like it's not one of these like super trick plays and like crazy things. Because we were watching we did the the AFC Championship in in Arrowhead with Ernie and there was a fleaflicker on that drive in o t Yeah, like just a regular play, Like that's a testament to that practice.

And it was, and it was like a comfort level for you as the play caller, like I don't feel like I'm about to mess the game up because I've watched us and I trust our guys enough and trust you guys to do it. So and you don't either. You're not thinking like, oh god, he called a flea flicker.

You're just like, but what it is, what it is, He's got to block the goddamn safety rights furg Steelers.

And Yeah, but to get back to this drive, next gen stats will tell us this was the first time a player in a playoff game has had a nine yard reception and a fifty one yard TD in the same drive. It's next gen stats for you guys.

I don't back what the that's that'll never that'll never happen again.

Ever, that's like Haley's comment, nobody's ever gonna have a nine yard I remember.

One d T pass in the same drive.

In the same divisional round.

He he knows, Josh, those is ship because I remember it was what was Indianapolis where a house to punted on a slant and then I almost broke the.

The reverse in the in twenty twelve.

Yeah, and I come off to the sideline and he comes up to me. He goes, he can't get three more yards. You would have been the only person in the history of the game. But at that time return one and.

Rush one d for the sick and McCaffrey just run, catch and throw.

Recently yeah here, yeah it happened. But at that point, should we put a bow on this bad boy? Put it all right?

So Flacco leads him down nine plays fifty three yards, gets in gets in territory Doron Harmon with the pick picky punt.

A lot of them get a lot of that beast beast closer.

Flaco gets the ball back though tries the Hail Mary unsuccessful.

Pats win thirty five thirty one. We'll going thank god he pushed the guy at the end.

Smart play.

That was the balls up to the logan. Ryan a smart football player.

Yep, very anything just because you're a coach, you're a smart guy. Anything we missed from this game that you want you did some preparation that you'd want to make sure we hit that we didn't talk about already.

No, I mean, you guys kind of got the idea of the opponent, kind of got the the our game plan was very unique.

You know.

We didn't intend on going in there and trying to you know, mash it at him running the ball and all that. You know, I don't believe that was the deal. And then the gadget stuff and we talked about the swings and all that. But I mean, I knew this. I felt getting ready for this game. They were the sixth seed. I felt like, this is probably.

The best team that we're going to play the AFC in THEFC.

Well, that's how it always was with Baltimore. I did.

I felt like I didn't know who would be in the other game. You know, I think Indye beat Denver n Yet this this team was really something, and.

Then Indy was soft as cat shit forty five seven.

Soft, my god soft.

But uh, back to this one real quick. We mentioned it earlier in this game, the the disparity between running and passing. Tom Brady threw the ball fifty times in this one, fifty times Blacko through a forty five. So if you like, I bet you that they runs did we run? They technically thirteen because they credit Brady with six rushes, but I mean really seven, Like you said, seven runs Brandon Bolden three for seven.

And a rushing touchdown. Yeah, Brady that those were like his most proud moments.

When he ran it was a thousand yard rusher.

We know, we know, we heard about it in those walkthroughs night before games with the Lacrosse Bowl. So was he with the knail downs?

He was deliberately doing those really close, so he wasn't losing yards towards his career?

Was he it looked like it. I don't think he was doing that. I don't have enough information. I don't know, I don't know. I don't know the answer to that question.

Patriots would go on to beat the soft soft Indianapolis called forty five to seven then going on.

So they were really good football teams. But I just was always mad at him.

I know, we're we like to rag on him on this pod. Uh, but we do it in jest. We we're just joking. The Pats would go on to win there for Super Bowl, beating the Seahawks twenty eight twenty four with Malcolm Butler's huge interception there at the end his rookie year, undrafted free agent, and H Brady would set the record for most.

He went right to Malcolm Butler, he skipped you My bad, My bad, that's all good.

That was a fucking historic play. I know, it was unbelievable play. It changed, Uh, it changed lives change, I mean speaking of it. That was the start of like the second part of the dynasty.

Took the words right out of my mouth. Jewels yep, kicked off dynasty two point zero.

Now what you what were your thoughts going in after after we won that first one? Do you think we had the legs to keep doing it? I mean, you never know, You never know. That's hard to say.

I mean I knew that certainly, haven't Tommy. You always had a chance, Yeah, you know, and I knew that our you know, a decent chunk of our core guys were back, so we were excited to have a shot.

But you never know. I mean I always tell everyone, I think the best team that I was on was that fifteen team. That was a good team. You know we were, but it wasn't how we were blowing teams out there right aft the beginning of the year. Then he tore his knee, Soldier tears his arm, I'd break the foot. But like we were, if we would have stated that's what That's what the lead people don't realize is you have to have that. You have to have your health, the health, the health bug on your side, you do, you know, going.

Into two years of the same.

It's so hard. That's why this is really impressive. What you know the Chiefs are doing. Yeah, you watch this and you know it's hard to bet against him this year. Like I honestly believe, and I know they've had relatively a healthy They've had a healthy two years if you think of like their cornerstone players. Yeah, and anytime that we we didn't do it is because we had a cornerstone player go down or something along those lines. And they're in that function way of like where we were, where if we're playing our best game, you know, it doesn't matter what it looks like in September. We're just at the point where we're still learning our team because we've lost a bunch of guys or a bunch of coaches. Kind of use that and then you develop your team in the middle chunk of the season. Then you start sharpening the knives when you get into that, you know, fifteen sixteen, seventeenth week, and then by then it's hard to bet against us or them. You know, that's where they're at in their career because of you know, the quarterback they have and their program. Their program.

They have a good program. It's been you know, ten plus years in the making, and they know.

What they're doing. They know what they're doing.

The stability of the organizations you know that that can get to that point is really a huge advantage for them.

It is now what's more impressive this double comeback or Super Bowl comeback.

I think Baltimore's defense, in my opinion, was like I thought Matt Ryan was playing an exceptional level. The Falcons were a really good team. I don't think their defense if you put those two defenses on paper, you would say that that defense was better than the Baltimore one.

It was not so doing it against the Ravens in.

That group, with that group of players that they had.

That was probably the tougher group.

We had to have so many things go right for us, or so many things we had to do without having anything go wrong.

In the Falcons game, we just couldn't. We were up against it.

It was like, if we make any mistakes here, we're dead done, you know what I mean. And so the fact that we were able to do that, you know, I think it was probably more unrealistic. You know, I don't know if it was a better one against a better defense, if you know what I'm saying.

I mean, it's still some great, great problems to talk about. Which which you come back was better? Those are great things. Which one? Did you think it was? Falcons? For sure? I mean it was it.

It was more because you know, it was certainly more improbable, so improbable. I never felt like we were out of the Buffalo the Baltimore one.

Really no, but we were up again. Definitely felt like we were out at one point after I dropped that third down come out halftime, Like, fuck me, I'm the raw rock guy getting everyone rowdy. I can't make a goddamn third down catch over the you know what I mean, It's gonna be a hell of a store. It's gonna be a hell of a story. I mean, that's your trademark. It was a hell of a Now you're saying there's a caveat to that.

Nah, it's gonna be a hell of a story.

And if I believe.

That, you can't believe. Gotta believe.

Maybe you can't say that.

You gotta believe. But I'm doubting if we can do it or not. Hey, we all have See that's that's for everyone listening. Even when you believe, you have a little doubt. So when you're doubt, you have that little doubt, it's okay, you can still believe. Speak right there. You see that right frame. I mean it's it's already that's a T shirt. Oh my god, it's gonna be a caveat. I mean, who dropping caveat on this podcast? I like it such a caviare word. Let's grade the game. We'll be right back after this quick break. Name of the game, the double pass, The pass game, The double comeback. Which one do you want to call it double pass? The double pass game? Is this the greatest game of all time? Let's score it stakes zero to ten of this game decimal is okay, you have to grade it of the game. Yeah. We've done super Bowls, We've done World Cup events, We've done World Series events, done surfing the biggest waves of all time.

I mean okay, So I'm gonna say it's a divisional game against nine nine solid.

So we had done this game before with with Gronk. So Jewels sorry, Jewels scored a seven point one. I Jack did an eight point zero, I did an eight point two, and did a ten seven point one.

You know, Jos, when you first Super Bowl, you forget them, you forget them. This is seven right here, star power, Josh, star power. That was okay, okay, so reads out, raise out.

McPhee, don't forget about you know, you're the legend of you know, we're just coming up. Yeah, you're your legend hasn't really started to grow yet. Just you know, you're kind of you're hoping to get a podcast someday, hope.

You know, Gronk's pretty much Gronk by now. Tommy's got a lot of star power. I'll go uh eight.

Jewels did a seven point nine and jacket an eight point five. I did an eight point three.

Dole did a six?

Whoa Dole?

Hard greater man? Not after a ten on the stakes? Yeah? That what are we doing? Game played? Zero to ten? Josh? What does this mean? How the game went? I mean, I mean excitement for the viewer? This is a ten. This is hard to top this one? Amen? What I say? Hard to top this one?

Jewels with an eight point one, Jack with a ten, Me with a nine.

You are the name of the game. Zero to ten, one decimals, Okay, you mean the double pass, the double pass rating the name that you ranked, the name eight point five?

Very solid.

Jules had a seven point nine, jacket an eight point six. I had a nine point two, and Dola had an eight point zero. What is a total up to Let's see the news score is an eight point four four?

Where does it go on the charts of games?

That ties us with with Becky?

Two belts? You big wrestling fan? My kids, we grew up that way, Yeah I do. There was a big There was a big.

There's a big window where I was completely out of the loop, you know, like after college, just making it till I had and then like I have some friends that do it.

I enjoy it. It's fun, fun to go to. It's a good show.

It's fun. Overall.

Tied for thirteenth overall. Hold on, go back to that.

So the number one was super Blood wolf Moon.

That was a twenty eighteen AFC Championship game.

Remember the moon thing that happened? Yeah? I do. Uh, where's the Seahawks?

That's number three?

Three?

I was gonna say that definitely statue Lefty game. Remember that I had those three as my top three.

Yes, someone in COVID asked me that, and I said, those were my top.

Three, but not in that order.

What's your order?

Three? One? Two?

So Butler game twenty eight to three or game Superbud Wolfman game than twenty three?

That was my top. That was my top and then I think this game was four.

Hey, yeah, do you remember that statue of Liberty game?

What is he state?

Oklahoma?

I do?

Oh yeah, oh that's my favorite.

Speaking of great, great great play calls.

That was awesome.

How many gadges can you have, Josh, we visiting thing?

No, this is awesome. You want to plug anything. You're gonna plug plug anything, you know. This is just this is awesome. Well, we appreciate you coming on man, it's been awesome.

It was so fun.

This was funny memory Lane. Yep, and thank you again, Bro, appreciate you be guy man. That was That was a fun episode. Brought me down memory Lane. Would you guys think about old Josh love Josh our first we were just talking our first head coach, first head coach. We didn't really talk about it though, No, because it's a little raw, it's still a little fresh. I think a fresh wound.

I'll have a bit of a hand up moment on this episode.

I'm pretty anti redoing games that we've already done, because you're so there's literally thousands of thousands of games out there that we haven't done yet. So when he came back organically with doing this game, I was skeptical. I was like, Okay, well we've already done it with Dola whatever, whatever, whatever. But I think his perspective on it was awesome. It was cool getting the coaches perspective on it. So hand up, I was wrong.

Josh was so cool man and so gracious. Was this guy so smart? Remember it and he did the Peyton manning. He went back to the notes, he watched the tape, he came ready has still had his game plans. Oh that was awesome.

I wish oh when we started getting into the craft of play calling and he was like, oh, I wanted to do it out the first down and I want to do it here and after hear oh, man, we could have had an hour conversation.

I'm just that because that was just I wanted to know more and more and more about that.

But I don't even to help me with my college football twenty five play on. I know, I wonder what playbook he uses.

I wonder because I used to use.

And like when I go and played Madden, I would use like our playbook even if he was using a different team, because I knew our offense. And sometimes there's a couple of years I was like, oh, this kind of yeah, it's kind of kind of what we do. And then there's someone like, what the fuck I played recently? I was like, I didn't know the offense.

I gotta say, nothing good has ever come from me being in the pistol formation in college football twenty five.

I hate the pistol not a pistol. Guy supposed to be better for the run.

I know, but I just can't.

Every time I can makes it more even. I could see that makes it more even for the offensive line, for like shades, because the guy behind him all the offset on one side, you can eliminate certain things.

That's a good way to look at I didn't even know anything.

Well, that's why people try the pistol. That's why people like the pistol, because they you know, it's a deception of a side that is true. So then you could cheat over those gaps over not cheat, but you can you can gap them differently and just have this guy catch you edge on for the pitch.

Isn't it just the old eye formation that that's why shot?

But that's what No, the pistols shotgun with the guy behind you. But it is like eye formation for like where you're getting, you get the even box for both sides.

God forbid a college quarter be under centered these days. God forbid what they're never under center in college dangered species, That's what I'm saying, Army.

And that's that's dude.

This is a two hour episode already's.

In honor of Josh and his patented, patent patented.

He's known for wearing advisors for.

Known for wearing visors. We're gonna go and we're gonna build the ideal football coach look from head to tippity toe.

Just a little context of this new post guest segment. We're basically gonna assemble the We're gonna We're gonna use inspiration from some of the most notable coaching attire pieces, pieces of their wardrobe to kind of compile one super fit. So think Pete Carroll's Monarchs. Think Kyle Shanahan with the the flat brim custom Giants hat.

That no one else wears, but he has Niners with a small small letters with the small letters. Sorry, I'm thinking so just go Bill Belichick with the cutoff hoodie. Maybe Kanye low key made a collection after this. Oh damn back, I'm telling you no, he cut like he cut it. A lot of that ship looked like Bill's ship. I've been in there after Kanye dropped. It was like sixteen or something. It's tight.

Yeah, I mean Billy.

Kanye and Bill kind of addressed like on the on the sideline.

If you I heard recently that maybe some of Kanye's fashion sense was coming from Adam Sandler.

I think I saw a clip of that.

I just love seeing Adam Sandler on social media, playing randomly in parks in the in the Adam Sandler outfits, specials out probably when this comes out. Yeah, yeah, new special everyone go go check it out. But let's get back to our bill coach. All right, let's build a.

Coach, baby.

I like the that that naming of it perfect.

Well's I mean, we all know creative player in Madden. This is creative coach created looks.

So we're starting at the dome, baby, head where what are we rocking on the head? Are we going?

We going hat?

We go on Advisor, We're going nothing, We're going Beanie headset. I mean you gotta have the headset. This Dora Fedora full on old school yeah.

Eddie Munster, Widow's peak, just beautiful hair like uh situation.

Yeah full Ben, I can do?

Or what ebra flues right now, bro, coach? Ebra flues? Get got a city cut, moved to Chicago, White made him cut his hair. You got a city cut and a little beard.

Action Chicago looks good?

Oh my, yes, I mean I got a whole paper. They look good. Yeah, but everyone looks good on paper. That's why you play the games.

Are we going full ebra flues and getting a city cutting with the you.

Gotta go, you gotta go A hat?

Yeah, I like, I like, I like freaking Shanahan's hats because it's our new age cool coach, A new age cool coach. Dora is like thirty two. That's cool for like on the going to the plane.

On the or so baby, the meat the meat of your fit.

Here we go, in, we go in old school wind breaker, we going verbel cut off windbreaker with the long sleeve t underneath the show off the guns.

I like the bill dog.

I like the bill. I like the bill cut hood, I love it. I love it.

About a Jim Tressel sweater.

Hate it, hate it, hate it, hate it.

It's too clean cut, absolutely Nottenheimer starter jacket.

I like that. I like the starter coach by everyone, Yes or cool. But that's for a cold game. We're talking about a spring game. Okay, very much game.

What about a nice, like fashionable, like up to date wind breaker. I'll up Pete Carroll. It's almost like a golfing situation.

Ah like accus like a quarter zip like it's a little too ubiquitous. I'm I like, look at the Belichick like as much as we can all make fun of it, like that's that's like timeless. That's like from the because he used to do that. Ship at the Giants oversize because those old sweat suits, the old baggy ones, when you used to cut them off, like that was like your only that was your way of differentiating yourself because we all wore the same one. Amen, So like that was like your he kind of did.

That early drip. Plus plus your your hands are free, you're not messing with your lease.

And then pocket and you also go to hood just in case you want to go hood over hat because look, even Shanahan does hood. See Shanahan does hoodie with jacket over open open jacket, which is cool.

I like having a hood little versatility there.

Bill looks like you should be in the weight room. Bro Okay, we're going. Well, my coach looked like you should be in the weight room. We're going Bill, We're going Bill.

I'm going Bill.

We also missed the bum Phillips cowboy hat in the Headworth section. We should pick we were right with the Phillips or the Shanahan flat Bill, but cowboy.

Hat is a vibe.

You gotta you gotta be coaching in the state of Texas. Okay, pants, this is only one answer, only Texas pants. See, I would say I don't like khakis.

I would say, if they're going to be khakis, I want some big old pleats there. I need those boys pleated. I'm talking Charlie Weis's Pete Carroll circa Notre Dame usc Bush push game pleats. But with the bill Hoodie, I don't like it. No, I don't like it. I want some some wind pants.

Or we do we have to be like a nice look top the bottom, or we picked the best thing forehead.

For we're building a look we're building. Yeah, so it all has to go together.

I think it needs to. It needs to.

Going with like a baggie windbreaker rain gear machine. Yeah, all day, all day they have that. I want some bottom, so a bust of sag. I got, I got, I got area where I can keep my my flag. I don't have a small ass little because if I'm gonna keep it myself, I don't. I don't need a tapered assing where I can't get my hand under my ship because my calf is so big. I want some baggy you gotta hide your flag, I got packed pockets.

What about this take just I'd love to hear your opinion.

Here's a team that we was our a bit of a rival in high school ConA, but all their coaches would have matching short cargo shorts with calf high black socks the whole season, even if it was snowing. The whole coaching staff, I'm not sure black socks.

They deserve to be fired as an entire staff, the whole staff, the whole it's a bro staff. What that is insane?

The whole, the whole coaching staff.

Something I want to add to my to my hoodie, the baggy hoodie. I want to add. I want to put my belt on over my hoodie so it looks like I got a tool belt. But it's my, it's my, it's my pack. Trying to talk my radio.

We didn't talk about color gray. I mean, there's red, there's blue.

The whole hoodie. I'm not opposed to mixing it up, but we will say as mendment that keep track of Bill's fits from his coaching staff. Gray or blue is the best red bad thing I like.

I personally like the the like three year old faded blue. Yes, like dog shit blue that has been maybe dried six hundred times. That something and where you get like that. You know sometimes you pull out of your pocket, You'll pull out the lint thing or the refreshing sheet. You know you put in your damn thing? Oh should I that's that means it's gonna be a good day.

You find an extra twenty in the pocket. You're good, bro, You're good.

I want I want a thousand. That thing needs to be dried a thousand times, and it's got to be two sizes too big. Blue.

Would you ever cut a hole in your hoodie pocket for headphones like in high school?

No, I in the pocket a whole headphones.

I like to listen to my brain. Think when I was lifting.

Facts, you guys never listened to headphones. I never, even though I liked to.

I didn't run with headphones on when I was younger. And then in the weight room you got fucking weight room.

Radio tunes blasting I'm self motivated and any and when I used to do my drills motivated.

I've seen you watch highlight reels of yourself working out. Yeah, I guess that.

That is self motivated, self, self motivate.

Yeah, alright, full inception, Bro, full inception.

He incepted me. I'm gonna do it now tonight. I need to motivate myself.

Some clips of the podcast.

Oh my goodness, all right, we get we're building. This fit is coming together very nicely. I hate it, Bro, I'm going monarchs, man. I kind of think Carol Carol with the with the vaults there fire.

You could go Ernie taped up nikes, taped up nikes because he likes the rebucks where he's a man.

We're going with the Ernie specials. Let's go with the Ernie Nikes because we like box more. Yeah, there you go, taped up rebox Rebok men on this podcast. Baby.

And then just to throw a little flair in here, you know, a little bit of personality to it. We've already done that with our hoodie, shown that with uh, you know, some other elements of our fit. But any accessories we talk in pencil behind the ear Allah, Matty p. We chewing on anything. We got gum going beat Carrol Carroll, Gum do we have I got a full tin?

I got I gotta I got a fanny pack with ten tens in the back of it, and that's where I might keep my challenge flag. And I'm just gonna have a I'm gonna have like you know, you have a guy that keeps you, the holy back guy, the holy back guy. Yep, he's I'm gonna have a homey back guy. And then I'm gonna have a dip guy.

Can I Can I pitch for him to the team about a Mike McDaniel vape?

What do you mean gripping vapes on the sideline?

Get that out of here.

No place for that in the NFL, Baby, No place, bro, no place for that, none between lines three other accessories.

A big play sheet?

Yeah you want to? You want to waffle house menu play sheet? Or are we talking Bill Belichick folded up you know a little piece of paper?

Or do we just fucking note time?

Yeah? Straight towar Agami status.

Coach is dipping on the sideline. Oh yeah, there's signs it's illegal to do that. I got so by the way. I go to a Dodgers game and you gotta go through metal detectors. Cool, awesome, love it, like safeties over everything, pull out my tin, my wallet and uh walk through. They're like you can't have the tin. Oh that was right. That was the other week. Yeah, yeah, I was there with you can't have a tin at the I'm like, I'm at a baseball game. What do you mean I can't have a tin? They're like, it's banned in the stadium, you can't have any tobacco products. I go, we're at a We're at a baseball game. I mean, it's isn't this America? Like? No, I go, are you what?

So?

They made me throw my hip away. So as he was going to throw it, I took one dip, I put it in, and I walked through, seeing guy, I thought this used to be America's past.

Just walk up to the dugout and be like, yo, anyone got intense.

I think it's illegal in there too.

I think it's illegal.

You're telling me these guys are playing one hundred and sixty two games and it's not a single guy with a fat lip in.

I don't know, man.

I think it's it's big sunflower seed and big in big bubble gum industry is has pushed him out.

I think, no, So what's our accessory?

It's all I get a dip hey and put a parlay in for me. But bro, that game was great. That was a great games.

Accessories here challenge flag and so we'll have we'll have intercom belt around the hoodie. Ye can see around the builder. I can see my my side pack, tool belt, tool belt. They have a couple of things on there. We got a dip guy. We got a whole back guy. Only back guy, dip guy.

We're not going full waffle House play sheet, are we?

Oh? Definitely we are, okaya because if I'm head, how.

Is it fixed?

Is one of those? It's definitely connected to me. It's belt, oh man, connected the tool belt just in case I want to use my hands as the motherfucker ref Yes, you drop it. It's connected to your tool belt. So then I can just what the fuck are you doing? Can you see? Can you see? What'd you get your eyes checked? Blood?

What about how you feel about the Microsoft surface?

Oh shit? Yeah? All right, Jane, I'll look at play thirty nine. She got it right there? Yeah, right there, open that thing up, Play thirty nine. All right, wall, that's.

Off looking like you're reading the app side of the menu. Oh my god, full cheesecake factory.

Cheesecake factory menu.

Oh my gosh.

Yeah, surfaces, we're breaking about three of those a game.

Oh guy, Microsoft Stock, we got ashing those bad boys. I'm gonna I'm gonna staying on the table here real quick.

Yeah.

As we're as we're wrapping up this fire fit and say, I absolutely hate anyone post Lombardi era that wears a suit or a tie or any version of that on the sidelines. I hate it.

Who's done that? Like Al Golden at Miami was doing it like literally not that long ago.

Mike Nolan for the forty nine ers, Jack, I love it because that's fucking football when you wear the coat and the breath and you got the fedora.

These guys wearing like windbreakers and ship.

I want my coaching bands.

Yeah, I mean, I just I can't do it anymore. It was a time and place. Let's leave it there.

Hard disagree, all right.

You gotta be Mike Dicka to be able to wear a sweater vest high and he was a badass football player. He could be some dude that just you know, like you know, to Josh's point, D three, dude loves the game of foot. You can't be going in there trying to set a trend on how to fucking dress.

No, no, come on, But if.

You're Mike Dicka and you want to wear a tie, I mean when you got it like that, I think he's eating glass before facts he can do it. I think I saw it on on YouTube video.

If you got your own steak at glass look it up.

One more thing where we're landing on sunglasses. Glasses, no glasses.

I'm not a sunglass guy. Dude, Like he'll never war shades, not on the You gotta be able to see now if I had crazy, like if I'm in Miami and it's I don't know, maybe that like if you get sun in your eyes when they're putting you on that visitors sideline. Actually, I think I'm gonna go with Google Glass. I'm gonna go Google glass so I could maybe get like yardage stuff in my thing. So when I'm looking at the sideline, I can see where the first down where the drive started. It's like marked in my fucking goggles Google glass down in distance. I want a VR thing I want so then I can get a better look I wanted. I want to I want a camera on the ball, so then if I'm the coach, I can see where the quarterback is s thirling with with like in the pile. I want that first hitd coach right vr hdset.

All right, let's wrap this up, give us the give us the rundown.

This full fit coming to a sideline near you. Shanahan, flat bill, Bill Belichick, cut off hoodie. We got our rain gear, windbreaker pants not tapered, loose at the bottom, a little bit bag to him. Ernie taped up rebox on the feet. We got tins around our belt. We got a dip guy. We got to hold me back guy. We have our play sheet that is cheesecake factory, large fully laminated. It's got multiple foldouts attached to the belt, affixed so that when we are letting the refs have it, it is not falling to the ground. And no shades.

That's it.

I think.

Air monarch.

And we got the Ernie taped up rebox.

Oh yeah, yeah, good, good good good. No, no taped every box.

Yeah, I mean, just an all time fit.

Dude, I'm dialing up some crazy players.

And we're weird to be our headset.

Sorry, that's an implant, and we gotta what is it the thing that elon cyber chip? What is it cyber chip. No, what's it called neural link? I put the neural link in. Remember, I basically put brain. I put Ernie's brain in a neurallink, and I just put it. I'm gonna put it in the back of my.

Neck, right in the cerebellum.

Right. Serotonin.

We'll be having tons of that after we after we score touchdowns, and after we do this live show.

This week.

Let's live show was finished by the time, I hope you got an awesome time and everything levels are I'll be wearing.

That merge hell e merge. Well, that was a hell of a game. That was a hell of an episode. Thanks again to Josh. That's been another episode of Games with Names. Subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you listen to your podcasts. Come in a game you want us to do and remember, rate and review. Remember to follow Games with Names on YouTube, Instagram, x TikTok, and snapchat. Leave a message on the hotline. It's been super fun. Four two four two nine one two two nine zero. See you guys next week later. Games and Names of production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app. Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts

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Games with Names

Hosted by Super Bowl MVP Julian Edelman, Games with Names is a sports history podcast on the search … 
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