David K Piano is bringing explicit software modeling to the web with his xstate library. He gives talks around the world about statecharts, and is cooking up a new SaaS service that will help developers model and understand their application using statecharts. In this conversation, David and I discuss the benefits of declarative languages, such as CSS, the principle of least power, musical notation, and Facebook Origami.

The Computer is a Feeling by Tim Hwang & Omar Rizwan
2:33:48

Let's Take Esoteric Programming Languages Seriously
1:53:45

As We May Think by Vannevar Bush
1:59:30