Glen Chiacchieri has worked at the MIT Media Lab on Scratch, at Dynamicland with Bret Victor, and is now becoming a psychotherapist. He's known for his Legible Mathematics essay, his Flowsheets programming prototypes, and the Laser Socks game, among many other projects.

In this conversation, we discuss:
how he grounds his research in compassion,
the tradeoffs between working on the "model vs UI" of programming,
his software-company-in-the-making, based on Flowsheets,
our shared dream for the future of open-source READMEs,
and how Dynamicland does and does not point towards the future.

The notes for this conversation can be found at futureofcoding.org/episodes/26.

Glen Chiacchieri has worked at the MIT Media Lab on Scratch, at Dynamicland with Bret Victor, and is now becoming a psychotherapist. He's known for his Legible Mathematics essay, his Flowsheets programming prototypes, and the Laser Socks game, among many other projects.
In this conversation, we discuss:
<ul>
<li>how he grounds his research in compassion,</li>
<li>the tradeoffs between working on the "model vs UI" of programming,</li>
<li>his software-company-in-the-making, based on Flowsheets,</li>
<li>our shared dream for the future of open-source READMEs,</li>
<li>and how Dynamicland does and does not point towards the future.</li>
</ul>
The notes for this conversation can be found at <a href="futureofcoding.org/episodes/26">futureofcoding.org/episodes/26</a>.

A romp through the field of computer programming, grapling with our history and wondering what should come next. A mix of deeply technical talk, philosophy, art, dark lore, and good takes. Hosted by Ivan Reese, Jimmy Miller, and Lu Wilson.

A romp through the field of computer programming, grapling with our history and wondering what should come next. A mix of deeply technical talk, philosophy, art, dark lore, and good takes. Hosted by <a href="https://ivanish.ca/">Ivan Reese</a>, <a href="https://jimmyhmiller.github.io/">Jimmy Miller</a>, and <a href="https://todepond.com/">Lu Wilson</a>.

Future of Coding

An imaginative, ruminative romp through the land of poisoned sand. What even are computers, where did they come from, and how might we make them radically different. Hosted by Ivan Reese, Jimmy Miller, and Lu Wilson.

An imaginative, ruminative romp through the land of poisoned sand. What even are computers, where did they come from, and how might we make them radically different. Hosted by <a href="https://ivanish.ca/">Ivan Reese</a>, <a href="https://jimmyhmiller.github.io/">Jimmy Miller</a>, and <a href="https://todepond.com/">Lu Wilson</a>.

Compassion & Programming: Glen Chiacchieri

Alexander Repenning created AgentSheets, an environment to help kids develop computational thinking skills. It wrapped an unusual computational model with an even more unusual user interface. The result was divisive. It inspired so many other projects, whilst being rejected at every turn and failing to catch on the way Scratch later did. So in 2017, Repenning published this obit of a paper, Moving Beyond Syntax: Lessons from 20 Years of Blocks Programming in AgentSheets, which covers his findings over the years as AgentSheets evolved and transformed, and gives perspective on block-based programming, programming-by-example, agents / rule / rewrite systems, automata, and more.

This is probably the most "normal" episode we've done in a while — we stay close to the text and un-clam many a thought-tickling pearl. I'm saying that sincerely now to throw you off our scent the next time we get totally lost in the weeds. I hear a clock ticking.

Links

$ Do you want to move beyond syntax? Frustrated by a lack of syntactic, semantic, or pragmatic support? Join our Patreon! Choose the tier that best reflects your personal vision of the future of coding. Get (frequently unhinged) monthly bonus content. Most of all: let us know that you enjoy this thing we do, and help us keep doing it for years to come.
Argos, for our non-UK listeners. They were acquired by future TodePond sponsor, Sainsbury's.
Once again, I am asking for your Marcel Goethals makes a lot of cool weird stuff and is a choice follow.
Scratch isn't baby programming. Also, you should try this bizarre game Ivan programmed in 3 blocks of Scratch.
Sandspiel Studio is a delightful block-based sand programming simulator automata environment. Here's a video of Lu and Max introducing it.
Simple Made Easy, a seminal talk by Rich Hickey. Still hits, all these years later.
Someday we'll do an episode on speech acts.
Rewrite rules are one example of rewriting in computing.
Lu's talk —and I quote— "at Cellpond", was actually at SPLASH, about Cellpond, and it's a good talk, about —and I quote— "actually, what if they didn't give up on rewrite rules at this point in history and what if they went further?"
Oh yeah — Cellpond is cool. Here's a video showing you how it works. And here's a video studying how that video works. And here's a secret third thingthat bends into a half-dimension.
Here's Repenning's "rule-bending" paper: Bending the Rules: Steps Toward Semantically Enriched Graphical Rewrite Rules
I don't need to link to SimCity, right? You all know SimCity? Will Wright is, arguably, the #1 name in simulation games. Well, you might not have caught the fantastic article Model Metropolis that unpacks the (inadvertently?) libertarian ideology embodied within the design of its systems. I'd also be remiss not to link to Polygon's video (and the corresponding write-up), which lend a little more colour to the history.
Couldn't find a good link to Blox Pascal, which appears in the paper Towards "Second Generation" Interactive, Graphical Programming Environments by Ephraim P. Glinert, which I also couldn't find a good link to.
Projectional / Structural Editor. Here's a good one.
Baba is You
Vernacular Programmers
Filling Typed Holes with Live GUIs is, AFAIK, the most current canonical reference for livelits.
I'm not linking to Minecraft. But I will link to the Repeater
32 Checkboxes
Wiremod is a… you know what, just watch this.
Chomsky Hierarchy
The Witness
Ivan wrote a colorful Mastodon thread surveying the history of the Connection Machine.
Harder Drive is a must-watch video by the inimitable Tom7.
Also couldn't find a good link for TORTIS. :/
Programming by Example (PbE)
Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo
Alex Warth, one of the most lovely humans Ivan knows, is a real champion of "this, because that".
Ivan's magnetic field simulations — Magnets! How do they work?
Amit Patel's Red Blob Games, fantastic (fantastic!) explorable explanations that help you study various algorithms and techniques used in game development.
Collaborative diffusion — "This article has multiple issues."
Shaun Lebron, who you might know as the creator of Parinfer, made a game that interactively teaches you how the ghost AI works in Pac-Man. It's fun!
Maxwell's Equations — specifically Gauss's law, which states that magnetic fields are solenoidal, meaning they have zero divergence at all points.
University of Colorado Boulder has a collection of simulations called PhET. They're… mid, at least when compared to building your own simulation. For instance.

Music featured in this episode:
snot bubbles

! Send us email, share your ideas in the Slack, and catch us at these normal places:
Ivan: Mastodon • Website
Jimmy: Mastodon • Website
Lu: Login • Website

See you in the future!

https://futureofcoding.org/episodes/073

<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Repenning">Alexander Repenning</a> created <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AgentSheets">AgentSheets</a>, an environment to help kids develop computational thinking skills. It wrapped an unusual computational model with an even more unusual user interface. The result was divisive. It inspired so many other projects, whilst being rejected at every turn and failing to catch on the way Scratch later did. So in 2017, Repenning published this obit of a paper, <a href="https://agentsheets.com/img/educators/20YearsofBlockProgramingLessonsLearned_published.pdf">Moving Beyond Syntax: Lessons from 20 Years of Blocks Programming in AgentSheets</a>, which covers his findings over the years as AgentSheets evolved and transformed, and gives perspective on block-based programming, programming-by-example, agents / rule / rewrite systems, automata, and more.
This is probably the most "normal" episode we've done in a while — we stay close to the text and un-clam many a thought-tickling pearl. I'm saying that sincerely now to throw you off our scent the next time we get totally lost in the weeds. I hear a clock ticking.
Links
$ Do you want to move beyond syntax? Frustrated by a lack of syntactic, semantic, or pragmatic support? <a href="https://www.patreon.com/futureofcoding">Join our Patreon</a>! Choose the tier that best reflects your personal vision of the future of coding. Get (frequently unhinged) monthly bonus content. Most of all: let us know that you enjoy this thing we do, and help us keep doing it for years to come.
<ul>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argos_(retailer)">Argos</a>, for our non-UK listeners. They were acquired by future TodePond sponsor, <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sainsbury%27s">Sainsbury's</a>.</li>
<li>Once again, I am asking for your <a href="https://mastodon.social/@wolkenmachine">Marcel Goethals</a> makes a lot of cool weird stuff and is a choice follow.</li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scratch_(programming_language)">Scratch</a> isn't baby programming. Also, you should try <a href="https://github.com/ivanreese/2222">this bizarre game</a> Ivan programmed in 3 blocks of Scratch.</li>
<li><a href="https://studio.sandspiel.club/">Sandspiel Studio</a> is a delightful block-based sand programming simulator automata environment. <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ecCVor7mJ6o">Here's a video</a> of Lu and Max introducing it.</li>
<li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SxdOUGdseq4">Simple Made Easy</a>, a seminal talk by <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rich_Hickey">Rich Hickey</a>. Still hits, all these years later.</li>
<li>Someday we'll do an episode on <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speech_act">speech acts</a>.</li>
<li>Rewrite rules are one example of <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rewriting">rewriting</a> in computing.</li>
<li>Lu's talk —and I quote— "at Cellpond", was actually at SPLASH, about Cellpond, and <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQgxFuw8f1U">it's a good talk</a>, about —and I quote— "actually, what if they didn't give up on rewrite rules at this point in history and what if they went further?"</li>
<li>Oh yeah — <a href="https://cellpond.cool/">Cellpond</a> is cool. Here's <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xvlsJ3FqNYU">a video</a> showing you how it works. And here's <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2jX84iTXKg8">a video</a> studying how that video works. And here's <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hlsDbXSZ2ko">a secret third thing</a>that bends into a half-dimension.</li>
<li>Here's Repenning's "rule-bending" paper: <a href="https://home.cs.colorado.edu/~ralex/papers/PDF/VL95-RuleBending.pdf">Bending the Rules: Steps Toward Semantically Enriched Graphical Rewrite Rules</a></li>
<li>I don't need to link to <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SimCity">SimCity</a>, right? You all know SimCity? <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Will_Wright_(game_designer)">Will Wright</a> is, arguably, the #1 name in simulation games. Well, you might not have caught the fantastic article <a href="https://logicmag.io/play/model-metropolis/">Model Metropolis</a> that unpacks the (inadvertently?) libertarian ideology embodied within the design of its systems. I'd also be remiss not to link to <a href="https://www.polygon.com/videos/2021/4/1/22352583/simcity-hidden-politics-ideology-urban-dynamics">Polygon's video</a> (and the corresponding write-up), which lend a little more colour to the history.</li>
<li>Couldn't find a good link to Blox Pascal, which appears in the paper Towards "Second Generation" Interactive, Graphical Programming Environments by <a href="https://www.cs.rpi.edu/~glinert/vita-pubs.html">Ephraim P. Glinert</a>, which I also couldn't find a good link to.</li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Structure_editor">Projectional / Structural Editor</a>. Here's <a href="https://hazel.org/">a good one</a>.</li>
<li><a href="https://www.patreon.com/posts/baba-is-you-104986179">Baba is You</a></li>
<li><a href="https://futureofcoding.org/episodes/069">Vernacular Programmers</a></li>
<li><a href="https://hazel.org/papers/livelits-paper.pdf">Filling Typed Holes with Live GUIs</a> is, AFAIK, the most current canonical reference for livelits.</li>
<li>I'm not linking to Minecraft. But I will link to the <a href="https://minecraft.fandom.com/wiki/Redstone_Repeater">Repeater</a></li>
<li><a href="https://www.patreon.com/posts/32-checkboxes-103278355">32 Checkboxes</a></li>
<li><a href="https://wiremod.com/">Wiremod</a> is a… you know what, <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wEkNT2McKo">just watch this</a>.</li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chomsky_hierarchy">Chomsky Hierarchy</a></li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Witness_(song)">The Witness</a></li>
<li>Ivan wrote a <a href="https://mastodon.social/@spiralganglion/112578884737169457">colorful Mastodon thread</a> surveying the history of the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connection_Machine">Connection Machine</a>.</li>
<li><a href="http://tom7.org/harder/">Harder Drive</a> is a must-watch video by the inimitable <a href="http://tom7.org/">Tom7</a>.</li>
<li>Also couldn't find a good link for TORTIS. :/</li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Programming_by_example">Programming by Example (PbE)</a></li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buffalo_buffalo_Buffalo_buffalo_buffalo_buffalo_Buffalo_buffalo">Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo</a></li>
<li><a href="https://alexwarth.github.io/">Alex Warth</a>, one of the most lovely humans Ivan knows, is a real champion of "this, because that".</li>
<li>Ivan's <a href="https://ivanish.ca/magnetic-fields/">magnetic field simulations</a> — <a href="https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/miracles-fucking-magnets-how-do-they-work">Magnets! How do they work?</a></li>
<li>Amit Patel's <a href="https://www.redblobgames.com/">Red Blob Games</a>, fantastic (fantastic!) explorable explanations that help you study various algorithms and techniques used in game development.</li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collaborative_diffusion">Collaborative diffusion</a> — "This article has multiple issues."</li>
<li><a href="https://shaunlebron.github.io/">Shaun Lebron</a>, who you might know as the creator of <a href="https://shaunlebron.github.io/parinfer/">Parinfer</a>, made <a href="http://shaunlebron.github.io/gh4st/">a game that interactively teaches you how the ghost AI works in Pac-Man</a>. It's fun!</li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell%27s_equations">Maxwell's Equations</a> — specifically <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell%27s_equations#Gauss's_law">Gauss's law</a>, which states that magnetic fields are <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solenoidal_vector_field">solenoidal</a>, meaning they have zero divergence at all points.</li>
<li>University of Colorado Boulder has a collection of simulations called <a href="https://phet.colorado.edu/">PhET</a>. They're… mid, at least when compared to building your own simulation. <a href="https://phet.colorado.edu/sims/html/faradays-law/latest/faradays-law_all.html">For instance.</a></li>
</ul>
Music featured in this episode:
<ul>
<li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gSJeHDlhYls">snot bubbles</a></li>
</ul>
! Send us <a href="mailto:admin@futureofcoding.org?subject=Email%20from%20a%20listener">email</a>, share your ideas in the <a href="https://futureofcoding.org/community">Slack</a>, and catch us at these normal places:
<ul>
<li>Ivan: <a href="https://mastodon.social/@spiralganglion">Mastodon</a> • <a href="https://ivanish.ca/">Website</a></li>
<li>Jimmy: <a href="https://hachyderm.io/@jimmyhmiller">Mastodon</a> • <a href="https://jimmyhmiller.github.io/">Website</a></li>
<li>Lu: <a href="http://todepond.com/lab/login">Login</a> • <a href="https://www.todepond.com/">Website</a></li>
</ul>
See you in the future!
<a href="https://futureofcoding.org/episodes/073">https://futureofcoding.org/episodes/073</a>

Moving Beyond Syntax: Lessons from 20 Years of Blocks Programming in AgentSheets by Alexander Repenning

If you're anything like Ivan (oof, sorry), you've heard of Pygmalion but never caught more than the gist. Some sort of project from the early 70s, similar to Sketchpad or Smalltalk or something, yet another promising prototype from the early history of our field that failed to take the world by storm. Our stock-in-trade on this show.

But you've probably heard of Programming by Demonstration. And you've certainly heard of icons — you know, those little pictures that have become indelibly part of computing as we know it. Pygmalion is the originator of these concepts… and more!

The best introduction to Pygmalion is Mariano Guerra's No-code History: Pygmalion, which includes a clearly articulated summary of the big ideas, motivation, and design, with a video demonstration of the programming interface, key terminology, and links.

The most introduction to Pygmalion — or Pig Million, The Millionth Pig, as it'll surely come to be known — is the subject of today's episode: the original paper by David Canfield Smith.

Links

$ We don't run ads on this show anymore. Sometimes Ivan makes a fake ad for a nonsense product like CarrotGrid or Hest, but those don't pay for the dirt & vapor we grow them in. But what if they could?


Gonna just get this one out of the way: Quotation — and I quote, "A crucial semantic distinction between direct and indirect speech is that direct speech purports to report the exact words that were said or written EXACTLY AS THEY WERE SAID OR WRITTEN, LU, whereas indirect speech is a representation of speech in one's own words WHICH IS ALSO TOTALLY FINE, BUT JUST BE COOL ABOUT IT HEY?"


@TodePond@mas.to: but wouldn't it be funny... if i quoted those statements on a podcast... and the podcast editor thought... "that doesn't sound right, bret can't have said that"... (he can do no wrong after all)... and so they thought i was just paraphrasing him wrong... and they didn't mark them as quotes like all the other quotes in the show... wouldn't that be funny


DrawDeadFish.com


Shout out to Brian Hempel who sent us (among other treats) this concise summary of Pig Million from the seminal book Watch What I Do: Programming by Demonstration.


Recent FoC Patreon bonus episodes were about the game Baba is You and, on our first ever video episode, the design of a visual representation for machine code.


Leda and the Swan.


Lenna, a sexist test image that was and to some extent still is widely used in computer graphics.


Living Computation


Lu: Biscuit


Jimmy: Biscuit


Ivan: Limp Bizkit


Fine, I might as well link to Frege and analogy.


Aaron Sloman's INTERACTIONS BETWEEN PHILOSOPHY AND ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE: The Role of Intuition and Non-Logical Reasoning in Intelligence


Ivan: Platonism


Jimmy: Neoplatonism


Lu: Neuplatonism


I would never Derrida


Nosey words


History of the alphabet


TodeTode


Lu: Conlang


Ivan: Conlon Nancarrow, beloved (by Ivan, at least) composer of music for the Player Piano. Here's a baby-faced Adam Neely with the scoop if you're new to Nancarrow. Welcome.


Jimmy: Conway Twitty


Autological words


Heterological words


School for Poetic Computation


Programming by Demonstration


Player vs Environment


For the video demonstrating the programming model, check Mariano's post


Open Canvas Working Group


Lu's project CellPond, and their SPLASH talk


StageCast Creator


Marcel Goethals makes a lot of cool weird stuff and is a choice follow.

Why does it say "Put all the metal back in the ground" at the bottom of the show notes?

Music featured in this episode:
Various old stuff by Ivan. The music for StageCast Creator is called Between Two Tigers.
Conlon Nancarrow's Study No. 47
Wagner, the new Witness haunting every episode.

! Send us email, share your ideas in the Slack, and catch us at these normal places:
Ivan: Mastodon • Website
Jimmy: Mastodon • Website
Lu: Mastodon • Website

See you in the future!

https://futureofcoding.org/episodes/072

If you're anything like Ivan (oof, sorry), you've heard of <a href="https://worrydream.com/refs/Smith_DC_1975_-_Pygmalion.pdf">Pygmalion</a> but never caught more than the gist. Some sort of project from the early 70s, similar to Sketchpad or Smalltalk or something, yet another promising prototype from the early history of our field that failed to take the world by storm. Our stock-in-trade on this show.
But you've probably heard of Programming by Demonstration. And you've certainly heard of icons — you know, those little pictures that have become indelibly part of computing as we know it. Pygmalion is the originator of these concepts… and more!
The best introduction to Pygmalion is Mariano Guerra's <a href="https://instadeq.com/blog/posts/no-code-history-pygmalion-1975/">No-code History: Pygmalion</a>, which includes a clearly articulated summary of the big ideas, motivation, and design, with a video demonstration of the programming interface, key terminology, and links.
The most introduction to Pygmalion — or Pig Million, The Millionth Pig, as it'll surely come to be known — is the subject of today's episode: the original paper by <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Canfield_Smith">David Canfield Smith</a>.
Links
$ We don't run ads on this show anymore. Sometimes Ivan makes a fake ad for a nonsense product like CarrotGrid or Hest, but those don't pay for the dirt &amp; vapor we grow them in. <a href="https://www.patreon.com/futureofcoding">But what if they could?</a>
<ul>
<li>
Gonna just get this one out of the way: <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quotation">Quotation</a> — and I quote, "A crucial semantic distinction between direct and indirect speech is that direct speech purports to report the exact words that were said or written EXACTLY AS THEY WERE SAID OR WRITTEN, LU, whereas indirect speech is a representation of speech in one's own words WHICH IS ALSO TOTALLY FINE, BUT JUST BE COOL ABOUT IT HEY?"
</li>
<li>
<a href="https://mas.to/@TodePond/112319116050265379">@TodePond@mas.to: but wouldn't it be funny... if i quoted those statements on a podcast... and the podcast editor thought... "that doesn't sound right, bret can't have said that"... (he can do no wrong after all)... and so they thought i was just paraphrasing him wrong... and they didn't mark them as quotes like all the other quotes in the show... wouldn't that be funny</a>
</li>
<li>
<a href="file:///Applications/iA%20Writer.app/Contents/Resources/Templates/Sans.iatemplate/Contents/Resources/drawdeadfish.com">DrawDeadFish.com</a>
</li>
<li>
Shout out to <a href="http://brianhempel.com/">Brian Hempel</a> who sent us (among other <a href="https://maniposynth.org/">treats</a>) this <a href="http://acypher.com/wwid/Chapters/01Pygmalion.html">concise summary of Pig Million</a> from the seminal book <a href="http://acypher.com/wwid/">Watch What I Do: Programming by Demonstration</a>.
</li>
<li>
Recent FoC Patreon bonus episodes were about the game <a href="https://www.patreon.com/posts/baba-is-you-104986179">Baba is You</a> and, on our first ever video episode, the design of a <a href="https://www.patreon.com/posts/32-checkboxes-103278355">visual representation for machine code</a>.
</li>
<li>
<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leda_and_the_Swan">Leda and the Swan</a>.
</li>
<li>
<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lenna">Lenna</a>, a sexist test image that was and to some extent still is widely used in computer graphics.
</li>
<li>
<a href="https://www.livingcomputation.org/">Living Computation</a>
</li>
<li>
Lu: <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biscuit">Biscuit</a>
</li>
<li>
Jimmy: <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biscuit_(bread)">Biscuit</a>
</li>
<li>
Ivan: <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limp_Bizkit">Limp Bizkit</a>
</li>
<li>
Fine, I might as well link to <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gottlob_Frege">Frege</a> and <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analogy">analogy</a>.
</li>
<li>
Aaron Sloman's <a href="https://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/research/projects/cogaff/sloman-analogical-1971.pdf">INTERACTIONS BETWEEN PHILOSOPHY AND ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE: The Role of Intuition and Non-Logical Reasoning in Intelligence</a>
</li>
<li>
Ivan: <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Platonism">Platonism</a>
</li>
<li>
Jimmy: <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoplatonism">Neoplatonism</a>
</li>
<li>
Lu: <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ">Neuplatonism</a>
</li>
<li>
I would never <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_Derrida">Derrida</a>
</li>
<li>
<a href="https://www.grammarphobia.com/blog/2007/03/a-nosy-question.html">Nosey words</a>
</li>
<li>
<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_alphabet">History of the alphabet</a>
</li>
<li>
<a href="https://github.com/TodePond/TodeTode">TodeTode</a>
</li>
<li>
Lu: <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constructed_language">Conlang</a>
</li>
<li>
Ivan: <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conlon_Nancarrow">Conlon Nancarrow</a>, beloved (by Ivan, at least) composer of music for the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Player_piano">Player Piano</a>. Here's a baby-faced Adam Neely with <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2reuQyLoZM">the scoop</a> if you're new to Nancarrow. Welcome.
</li>
<li>
Jimmy: <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conway_Twitty">Conway Twitty</a>
</li>
<li>
<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autological_word">Autological words</a>
</li>
<li>
<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grelling%E2%80%93Nelson_paradox">Heterological words</a>
</li>
<li>
<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_for_Poetic_Computation">School for Poetic Computation</a>
</li>
<li>
<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Programming_by_demonstration">Programming by Demonstration</a>
</li>
<li>
<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Player_versus_environment">Player vs Environment</a>
</li>
<li>
For the video demonstrating the programming model, check <a href="https://instadeq.com/blog/posts/no-code-history-pygmalion-1975/">Mariano's post</a>
</li>
<li>
<a href="https://www.canvasprotocol.org/">Open Canvas Working Group</a>
</li>
<li>
Lu's project <a href="https://cellpond.cool/">CellPond</a>, and their <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQgxFuw8f1U">SPLASH talk</a>
</li>
<li>
<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stagecast_Creator">StageCast Creator</a>
</li>
<li>
<a href="https://mastodon.social/@wolkenmachine">Marcel Goethals</a> makes a lot of cool weird stuff and is a choice follow.
</li>
</ul>
Why does it say "Put all the metal back in the ground" at the bottom of the show notes?
Music featured in this episode:
<ul>
<li>Various old stuff by Ivan. The music for StageCast Creator is called <a href="https://ivanish.ca/lost/">Between Two Tigers</a>.</li>
<li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?UerzkjrLju8?t=280">Conlon Nancarrow's Study No. 47</a></li>
<li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wE1NyYT31Tw">Wagner</a>, the new <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Witness_(2016_video_game)">Witness</a> haunting every episode.</li>
</ul>
! Send us <a href="mailto:admin@futureofcoding.org?subject=Email%20from%20a%20listener">email</a>, share your ideas in the <a href="https://futureofcoding.org/community">Slack</a>, and catch us at these normal places:
<ul>
<li>Ivan: <a href="https://mastodon.social/@spiralganglion">Mastodon</a> • <a href="https://ivanish.ca/">Website</a></li>
<li>Jimmy: <a href="https://hachyderm.io/@jimmyhmiller">Mastodon</a> • <a href="https://jimmyhmiller.github.io/">Website</a></li>
<li>Lu: <a href="https://mas.to/@TodePond">Mastodon</a> • <a href="https://www.todepond.com/">Website</a></li>
</ul>
See you in the future!
<a href="https://futureofcoding.org/episodes/072">https://futureofcoding.org/episodes/072</a>

Pygmalion by David C. Smith

Inventing on Principle
Stop Drawing Dead Fish
The Future of Programming

Yes, all three of them in one episode. Phew!

Links

$ patreon.com/futureofcoding — Lu and Jimmy recorded an episode about Hest without telling me, and by total coincidence released it on my birthday. Those jerks… make me so happy.
Lu's talk at SPLASH 2023: Cellpond: Spatial Programming Without Escape
Gary Bernhardt's talk Wat
Inventing on Principle by Bret Victor ("""Clean""" Audio)
Braid, the good video game from the creator of The Witness
David Hellman is the visual artist behind Braid, A Lesson Is Learned but the Damage Is Irreversible, Dynamicland, and… the Braid section of Inventing on Principle.
Light Table by Chris Granger
Learnable Programming by Bret Victor
When Lu says "It's The Line", they're referring to this thing they're working on called Seet (or "see it"), and you can sneak a peek at seet right heet.
Paris Fashion Week absolutely struts, and so can you!
The Canadian Tuxedo. As the representative of Canada, I can confirm that I own both a denim jacket and denim pants. If you see me at a conference wearing this combo, I will give you a hug.
Jimmy runs a personal Lichess data lake.
Hot Module Replacement is a good thing.
Pygmalion has a lot of juicy silly bits, 'parently.
Cuttle is awesome! It's a worthy successor to Apparatus. Toby Schachman, Forrest Oliphant, I think maybe a few other folks too? Crushing it. Oh, and don't miss Toby's episode of this very podcast!
Recursive Drawing, another Toby Schachman joint.
Screens in Screens in Screens, another Lu Wilson joint.
Larry Tesler. Not a fan of modes.
Lu writes about No Ideas on their blog, which is actually just a wiki, but it's actually a blog, but it's actually just a garden.
When we mention Rich Hickey, we're referring to the talk Simple Made Easy
Jacob Collier, ugh.
Suffragettes, women advocating for their right to vote, absolutely had a principle. Not sure that we should be directly likening their struggle to what we do in tech. On the other hand, it's good to foster positive movements, to resist incel and other hateful ones.
Instead of linking to e/ anything, I'm just gonna link to BLTC for reasons that only make sense to longtime listeners.
Stop Writing Dead Programs by Jack Rusher. Jack Rusher? Jack Rusher!
It's the fish one, the one with the fish. …Sorry, these aren't actually fish, or something, because they're just drawings.
René Magritte is the creator behind La Trahison des Images, origin of "Ceci n'est pas une pipe". Or maybe it was Margit the Fell Omen?
Magritte's Words and Images are lovely. Here's an English translation, though its worth taking a look at the original in context.
Acousmatic Music
Lu has made art with behaviour — various sands, and CellPond, say.
Barnaby Dixon? Barnaby Dixon. Barnaby Dixon! Barnaby Dixon!!
You can listen to part of Ivan's """Metronome""", if you want. Or you can listen to an early version of the song he's using this metronome to write. Or you can hear snippets of it in the Torn Leaf Zero video (especially the ending). But, like, you could also go make yourself lunch. I recommend mixing up a spicy peanut sauce for your roasted carrots. Shred a bit of cheese, tomato. Toast the bread. Pull the sausages right when the oil starts to spit. Put them straight into the compost. Look at the bottom of the compost bucket. What's down there? It's shiny. Why are you reading this? Why am I writing this? Why do we make thispodcast?
Wintergatan — Marble Machine exists
Oh, I forgot to add a link to Arroost earlier. You can also watch a pretty good video that is basically an Arroost tutorial, not much to it. There are also some nice examples of things people have made with Arroost.
The Rain Room looks pretty cool. It's the exact inverse of how rain works in many video games. YOU MUST PLAY RAIN WORLD.
Here's a beautiful demo of a microtonal guitar, and speaking of using complex machines to make music that would be "easier" to make with a computer, here's a microtonal guitar with mechanized frets that can change the tuning dynamically. This entire YT channel is gold.
Shane Crowley wrote a lovely blog post about creating music with Arroost.
blank.page is a fun experiment in writing with various frictions.
Super Meat Boy (the successor to Meat Boy, a Flash game) and Celeste are great examples of communicating tacit knowledge through the design of a simulation.
Newgrounds and eBaum's World and Homestar Runner were early examples of (arguably) computer-native media.
Hey, here's this episode's requisite link to the T2 Tile Project and Robust-First Computing. I should probably just create a hard-coded section of the episode page template linking to T2, The Witness, and Jack Rusher.
The pun-proof Ivan Sutherland made Sketchpad. Planner exists.
The PlayStation 3 Cell processor was this weirdly parallel CPU that was a pain in the butt to program.
The SpaceMouse

Put all metal back into the ground.

Music featured in this episode:
Fingers from This Score is Butt Ugly
The Sailor's Chorus from Wagner's The Flying Dutchman.

! Send us email, share your ideas in the Slack, and catch us at these normal places:
Ivan: Mastodon • Website
Jimmy: Mastodon • Website
Lu: Mastodon • Website

See you in the future!

https://futureofcoding.org/episodes/71

<a href="https://vimeo.com/906418692">Inventing on Principle</a> <a href="https://vimeo.com/64895205">Stop Drawing Dead Fish</a> <a href="https://vimeo.com/71278954">The Future of Programming</a>
Yes, all three of them in one episode. Phew!
Links
$ <a href="https://www.patreon.com/futureofcoding">patreon.com/futureofcoding</a> — Lu and Jimmy recorded an episode about Hest without telling me, and by total coincidence released it on my birthday. Those jerks… make me so happy.
<ul>
<li>Lu's talk at SPLASH 2023: <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQgxFuw8f1U">Cellpond: Spatial Programming Without Escape</a></li>
<li>Gary Bernhardt's talk <a href="https://www.destroyallsoftware.com/talks/wat">Wat</a></li>
<li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NGYGl_xxfXA">Inventing on Principle by Bret Victor ("""Clean""" Audio)</a></li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Braid_(video_game)">Braid</a>, the good video game from the creator of <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZokQov_aH0">The Witness</a></li>
<li><a href="file:///Applications/iA%20Writer.app/Contents/Resources/Templates/Sans.iatemplate/Contents/Resources/davidhellman.net">David Hellman</a> is the visual artist behind <a href="http://braid-game.com/">Braid</a>, <a href="http://www.alessonislearned.com/">A Lesson Is Learned but the Damage Is Irreversible</a>, <a href="https://dynamicland.org/">Dynamicland</a>, and… the Braid section of Inventing on Principle.</li>
<li><a href="https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/ibdknox/light-table">Light Table</a> by <a href="https://chris-granger.com/resume/">Chris Granger</a></li>
<li><a href="https://worrydream.com/LearnableProgramming/">Learnable Programming</a> by Bret Victor</li>
<li>When Lu says "It's The Line", they're referring to this thing they're working on called Seet (or "see it"), and you can <a href="https://github.com/TodePond/TodePondDotCom/blob/main/lab/readme.md">sneak</a> a peek at seet right <a href="https://www.todepond.com/wikiblogarden/see-it/prior-art/">heet</a>.</li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_Fashion_Week">Paris Fashion Week</a> absolutely struts, and so can you!</li>
<li>The <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_jacket#Canadian_tuxedo">Canadian Tuxedo</a>. As the representative of Canada, I can confirm that I own both a denim jacket and denim pants. If you see me at a conference wearing this combo, I will give you a hug.</li>
<li>Jimmy runs a personal <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lichess">Lichess</a> data lake.</li>
<li><a href="https://stackoverflow.com/questions/24581873/what-exactly-is-hot-module-replacement-in-webpack">Hot Module Replacement</a> is a good thing.</li>
<li><a href="https://instadeq.com/blog/posts/no-code-history-pygmalion-1975/">Pygmalion</a> has a lot of juicy silly bits, 'parently.</li>
<li><a href="http://cuttle.xyz/">Cuttle</a> is awesome! It's a worthy successor to <a href="http://aprt.us/">Apparatus</a>. <a href="http://tobyschachman.com/">Toby Schachman</a>, <a href="https://www.forresto.com/">Forrest Oliphant</a>, I think maybe a few other folks too? Crushing it. Oh, and don't miss <a href="https://futureofcoding.org/episodes/051">Toby's episode</a> of this very podcast!</li>
<li><a href="http://recursivedrawing.com/">Recursive Drawing</a>, another Toby Schachman joint.</li>
<li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4OIcwt8vcE">Screens in Screens in Screens</a>, another Lu Wilson joint.</li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Larry_Tesler">Larry Tesler</a>. Not a fan of modes.</li>
<li>Lu writes about <a href="https://www.todepond.com/wikiblogarden/my-wikiblogarden/no-more-ideas/">No Ideas</a> on their <a href="https://www.todepond.com/wikiblogarden/">blog</a>, which is actually just a <a href="https://www.todepond.com/wikiblogarden/">wiki</a>, but it's actually a <a href="https://www.todepond.com/wikiblogarden/">blog</a>, but it's actually just a <a href="https://www.todepond.com/wikiblogarden/">garden</a>.</li>
<li>When we mention <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rich_Hickey">Rich Hickey</a>, we're referring to the talk <a href="https://www.infoq.com/presentations/Simple-Made-Easy/">Simple Made Easy</a></li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacob_Collier">Jacob Collier</a>, ugh.</li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suffragette">Suffragettes</a>, women advocating for their <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women%27s_suffrage">right to vote</a>, absolutely had a principle. Not sure that we should be directly likening their struggle to what we do in tech. On the other hand, it's good to foster positive movements, to resist <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incel">incel</a> and other hateful ones.</li>
<li>Instead of linking to e/ anything, I'm just gonna link to <a href="https://www.bltc.com/">BLTC</a> for reasons that only make sense to longtime listeners.</li>
<li><a href="https://jackrusher.com/strange-loop-2022/">Stop Writing Dead Programs</a> by <a href="https://jackrusher.com/">Jack Rusher</a>. <a href="https://futureofcoding.org/episodes/041">Jack Rusher</a>? <a href="https://futureofcoding.org/episodes/069">Jack Rusher</a>!</li>
<li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMklf0vUl18">It's the fish one, the one with the fish. …Sorry, these aren't actually fish, or something, because they're just drawings.</a></li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ren%C3%A9_Magritte">René Magritte</a> is the creator behind <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Treachery_of_Images">La Trahison des Images</a>, origin of "Ceci n'est pas une pipe". Or maybe it was <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9MQe7tR5xQ">Margit the Fell Omen</a>?</li>
<li>Magritte's <a href="https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k58451673/f38.item.r=les">Words and Images</a> are lovely. Here's an <a href="http://www.philosophical-investigations.org/2017/12/representing-reality-magritte-on-words.html">English translation</a>, though its worth taking a look at the original in context.</li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acousmatic_music">Acousmatic Music</a></li>
<li>Lu has made art with behaviour — various <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BDyvjkAs5-Y">sands</a>, and <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xvlsJ3FqNYU">CellPond</a>, say.</li>
<li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/user/barnabydixon">Barnaby Dixon? Barnaby Dixon. Barnaby Dixon! Barnaby Dixon!!</a></li>
<li>You can listen to part of Ivan's <a href="https://raised-sixth.surge.sh/">"""Metronome"""</a>, if you want. Or you can listen to an <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoP1bg1GQTM">early version</a> of the song he's using this metronome to write. Or you can hear snippets of it in the <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FgAHiI3ZNY">Torn Leaf Zero video</a> (especially the ending). But, like, you could also go make yourself lunch. I recommend mixing up a spicy peanut sauce for your roasted carrots. Shred a bit of cheese, tomato. Toast the bread. Pull the sausages right when the oil starts to spit. Put them straight into the compost. Look at the bottom of the compost bucket. What's down there? It's shiny. Why are you reading this? Why am I writing this? Why do we make thispodcast?</li>
<li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvUU8joBb1Q">Wintergatan — Marble Machine</a> exists</li>
<li>Oh, I forgot to add a link to <a href="https://arroost.com/">Arroost</a> earlier. You can also watch a pretty good video that is basically an <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNBKdU6XrLY">Arroost tutorial</a>, not much to it. There are also some nice examples of <a href="https://www.todepond.com/wikiblogarden/arroost/examples/">things people have made with Arroost</a>.</li>
<li>The <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rain_Room">Rain Room</a> looks <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EkvazIZx-F0">pretty cool</a>. It's the exact inverse of <a href="https://www.polygon.com/23890979/starfield-rain-effects-how-its-made">how rain works in many video games</a>. YOU MUST PLAY <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0L-JzJhZbM">RAIN WORLD</a>.</li>
<li>Here's a <a href="https://youtu.be/iRsSjh5TTqI?feature=shared&amp;t=188">beautiful demo of a microtonal guitar</a>, and speaking of using complex machines to make music that would be "easier" to make with a computer, here's a <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbbyikFthEc">microtonal guitar with mechanized frets that can change the tuning dynamically</a>. This entire YT channel is gold.</li>
<li>Shane Crowley wrote <a href="https://edibotopic.com/blog/doing/leisure-sick/">a lovely blog post</a> about creating music with Arroost.</li>
<li><a href="https://blank.page/">blank.page</a> is a fun experiment in writing with various frictions.</li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Meat_Boy">Super Meat Boy</a> (the successor to Meat Boy, a Flash game) and <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celeste_(video_game)">Celeste</a> are great examples of communicating tacit knowledge through the design of a simulation.</li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newgrounds">Newgrounds</a> and <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EBaum%27s_World">eBaum's World</a> and <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homestar_Runner">Homestar Runner</a> were early examples of (arguably) computer-native media.</li>
<li>Hey, here's this episode's requisite link to the <a href="https://www.youtube.com/@T2TileProject">T2 Tile Project</a> and <a href="https://www.andrewwalpole.com/blog/an-introduction-to-robust-first-computation/">Robust-First Computing</a>. I should probably just create a hard-coded section of the episode page template linking to T2, The Witness, and Jack Rusher.</li>
<li>The pun-proof <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivan_Sutherland">Ivan Sutherland</a> made <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sketchpad">Sketchpad</a>. <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planner_(programming_language)">Planner</a> exists.</li>
<li>The <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_3#Technical_specifications">PlayStation 3 Cell processor</a> was this weirdly parallel CPU that was a pain in the butt to program.</li>
<li>The <a href="https://3dconnexion.com/ca/spacemouse/">SpaceMouse</a></li>
</ul>
Put all metal back into the ground.
Music featured in this episode:
<ul>
<li>Fingers from <a href="https://ivanish.ca/this-score-is-butt-ugly/">This Score is Butt Ugly</a></li>
<li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wE1NyYT31Tw">The Sailor's Chorus</a> from Wagner's The Flying Dutchman.</li>
</ul>
! Send us <a href="mailto:admin@futureofcoding.org?subject=Email%20from%20a%20listener">email</a>, share your ideas in the <a href="https://futureofcoding.org/community">Slack</a>, and catch us at these normal places:
<ul>
<li>Ivan: <a href="https://mastodon.social/@spiralganglion">Mastodon</a> • <a href="https://ivanish.ca/">Website</a></li>
<li>Jimmy: <a href="https://hachyderm.io/@jimmyhmiller">Mastodon</a> • <a href="https://jimmyhmiller.github.io/">Website</a></li>
<li>Lu: <a href="https://mas.to/@TodePond">Mastodon</a> • <a href="https://www.todepond.com/">Website</a></li>
</ul>
See you in the future!
<a href="https://futureofcoding.org/episodes/71">https://futureofcoding.org/episodes/71</a>

Compassion & Programming: Glen Chiacchieri

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