Full CircleIn this episode of Full Circle, Lexie and Mariah sit down with WNBA superstar Diamond DeShields. Lexie and Diamond throw it back to their AAU days, dive deep into Diamond’s decision to transfer from North Carolina to Tennessee, and her bold choice to go pro early. The three get real about the state of women’s college basketball today, the game-changing impact of NIL deals, and the whirlwind world of the transfer portal. Plus, Diamond shares insights about her new team, the Connecticut Sun, and excitement of being part of a rebuild. Tune in next week to hear more basketball — no filter, all facts.
Full Circle is an iheartwoman's sports production and partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment. You can find us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Hey, everybody, welcome back to another episode of the Full Circle Podcast.
I'm Lexi Brown here with my girl Mariah.
Rose, and we have a very special guest today. I say this about all our guests that they don't need an introduction and then proceed to list out their incredible resumes. So I'm just going to keep it short and sweet. We have the Natesmith Player of the Year, former National Freshman of the Year twenty eighteen, third overall pick twenty nineteen, All WBA Second Team player, and All Star twenty twenty one WNBA champ, and one of my best friends in the entire world since we've been little babies. I would love to welcome Dive into Shields to the podcast.
Clap it Up, Clap it up.
Yeah, Yeah, you gotta say that. You gotta say that a little bit louder because people like to forget, you sure do. People like to forget to forget.
That's why I had to include all of the things. Diamond, Oh my.
Gosh, Oh my gosh, look at us. I'm all right.
Are you feel like a third wheel already? Sorry?
Honestly, no, like I feel like i'm watching, I feel like I'm in the audience.
Diamond, welcome.
You know.
I just I just would like to acknowledge over fifteen years of friendship. You know, can't too many people stand on that like that. And I'm just really grateful to be here part of your podcasting career and journey, and you know, thanks for having me.
I'm so happy that you're here.
Before we get into all things Diamond, we got to talk about the games over the weekend. So, Diamond, what if your thoughts been about the tournament so far?
Yeah, I mean, I think the tournament has been dope. You know. I think that there have been some really really.
Good games, Whereas I think that like when we were in college, it was like a lot of blowouts, you know, probably until around the early eight So it's been good to see all the ladies out there competing, all the ladies out there really standing on business, like the platform is here and they have continued to deliver on having that platform. I've just really appreciated seeing such a good product be put out each and every night.
It's been cool.
Yeah, this weekend's games where I was on the edge of my seat.
Now Duke moment of silence.
So close.
But I told you all the score was going to be mad low, Like I told you that was gonna happen.
But I just may be locking up.
I mean that defense beyond point they just.
Like when you play all that defense and you don't want to go school like I just I'm just not understanding, like the life of capitalizing.
Off of all the stops that they get.
That's the only thing that's been frustrating to me about Duke since Caren got there.
I mean, she's been doing a great job, but like their.
Inability to like score the ball consistently has been like so frustrating for me. And I hope that they can fix that because they got this close. They got the ACC championship.
No they don't. They really who.
How many Let's talk about it, because how many teams really got snipers on there?
Like, let's let's think about it.
Girl carrying, Okay, she's carrying. In terms of I was gonna say, shame bro.
I feel like at the end there Duke was handing it away I felt like they were missing costly shots. I felt like the turnovers were crazy. I was getting upsid, like they will get the stop and then do nothing exactly. It was so frustrated.
Fel the same way.
And I just and that's not just a duke saying I've been locked into the tournament and these are the best teams in the country that make the tournament. And it's like the lack of of shot creating the lack of consistent outside shooting, and not even I shouldn't say the lack of consistent the lack of shooting period. Like Texas. I think they shot five threes last game. And I know everyone's been compleating, oh too many threes, too many threes, but it's like the.
Game is changing.
I mean, they made it this far, so you can't really say too much about it, but the fact that they're taking less than seven eight threes a game, it's so crazy because and it makes me sad because every when you get to the next level, shooting is so vital, it's so important, and it's going to keep you employed because every team needs a shooter. And I'm looking at college and I'm not seeing no shooters.
I just feel like it's not nobody that we're like after a timeout, you like make sure you got her they're fin a runner off a stagger, or you know she coming through an elevator.
It's like, so whatnot?
Please?
Do y'all feel like that?
Do y'all feel like it's because of a lack of shooting or it's because of high level of defense being played.
I think it's a combination.
Well, just you have good defense, the scores, they gonna find a way to score. They gonna find a way to get their shot off. And maybe we got too comfortable watching like the Caitlin Clarks and the Ariquez players. I mean, I didn't even shoot that many threes when I was in college. But I feel like the last like five ten years, there's always been like two or three players that gonna hit like a ton of threes in a game, or it'll go on like a burner for like a few games.
And we don't have that right now, And I don't like that.
It looks like a I don't know, the releases look slow. Releases just don't look they don't get as quick in order to like be deemed like a pure shooter, like a lot of players have this like gather or this the ball is not getting where it needs to go fast enough, so like by time they release it, it just you can tell when somebody's a shooter pretty much like even when they missing, you could just tell by how they mechanically are approaching their shot. And it's not a lot of players that I've seen in college right now that like really have that.
I would say the last like shooter like that I've seen in college was Taylor mike Azelle and she was in Sparks training camp this past year. She came and played in Athletes Unlimited. And that girl can shoot the ball. Oh my gosh, like brou think about.
I mean, okay, before we get into that.
I just want to say put out there, I'm heartbroken, Cho.
I'm heart too. And they but they were even before Ju got hurt.
They were not hyping this matchup up like I thought they would have, Like you would have thought that they was on the same team, like the way that they're being like aligned.
Together, which I love.
But this rivalry that everybody thinks is absent in women's basketball is right there. It was right there, and we decided to not. It wasn't the wasn't the right rivalry.
I guess.
Like I guess we talked about that, they still had the opportunity to market that the same way they marketed Caitlin Angel, bad Girl, good girl, whatever, whatever.
I guess looking at.
Both Page and Juju, both of them are so cool that it is kind of hard.
To pull like.
That. We said it last week. Why do we need a villain like that? Men's College don't got a villain right now?
They got Cooper Flag and everybody else.
Okay, I wouldn't compare it to that though, because I'm bored out of my mind with that, Like, I like, the game have been great. I was at I can we talk about men As far as the story, tournament is one seed, one seed, one seed, one seed.
I know.
Forever.
I think it's like only the second time ever, and I'm like, I mean, that's great. You do want the best teams to make it to the end, obviously, but like that's boring.
Cinderella's nothing. It boring.
It is boring, and they they thrive off of that because, as I always say, the women's tournament has the advantage of having.
Storylines of us seeing them play.
Each other for so long that we get hyped up and create these rivalries, whereas the Menu's tournament doesn't have that. So all they really have for us to become obsessed with the team is the Cinderella.
Stories, and there's been a lacking Cooper flag.
I always look forward to seeing like Florida Gulf Coast. Yeah, that does not happen anymore.
Like those days are over. Those days are over.
I'm seeing freaking transfer portal news already, people committing to new schools already.
I'm like, Dan, can the tournament end? Don't get me started on the truck.
We don't talk about that too. I think me and Diamond are both transfer kids. Okay, So if you guys didn't know, me and Diamond have been friends since the seventh grade and we met playing on an AAU team together. I was still living in Florida, she lived in Atlanta, and the team name was the Georgia Ice. So, Diamond, can you tell the people a little bit about that team? Because because we were iconic and we were only twelve.
So the Georgia Ice was a group of rowdy twelve year old girls who were going to come into your fifteen U tournament and win it. Every weekend and by the time people realized what was happening, it had already happened. And we were playing up about two age groups every weekend and we were killing people like calling.
I don't even know how to describe it. We had a team. We had five dads on the team who played professional sports. Guys.
We were the NEPO kids. We were of a So it was.
Me my dad.
My dad played for thirteen years in MB Lexi's dad played in the NBA.
Obviously.
We had Taran Griffey who was the daughter of King Griffy Junior. We had Kayla Davis who's the daughter of Antonio Davis Painting Witted. His dad played Pro Christina Kevin Witted Christina and Nelson her Did played in the NFL. So we was just like a big We were just big and like athletic and just like we had the flights shoes we had. We had players flying in on a private jet to practice once a week like and were coming in. They were coming in to practice on a PJ.
Guys.
I this was like because I've been waiting for years to have this platform with Diamond so we could talk about what the hell we was doing in middle school.
Listen, if we had ni L when we was in middle school, we'd be we'd be in.
A very all of us, all of us.
Yes, I mean, it was like we were one of those teams that gathered for tournaments. Like we were in practice, like we had a we practiced after every week and Karen got on a little private plane and flew to Atlanta for the day dog.
Like we were moving so different and we were kids.
Social media wasn't a thing yet, Like we didn't even realize what type of life we were living.
We played a tournament in Orlando one year and the whole team stayed at the Griffis that's how to make their house was And it was bowling alley in the basement. It was a go kart track around the house. It was like the craziest house I've ever been in. And we were just in there. You know, we couldn't make no tiktoks in there. We couldn't really show off what was going on. But like we all stayed in that house was comfortable.
To everyone if they wanted one, but you know us, we all slept on the sectional watching movies, scary moviess.
Man, it was so great.
Yeah, y'all know, y'all are gonna have to bring it back when you have kids one day.
Oh you're gonna have to daughters playing tennis.
Look, I'm just trying to survive in this economy right now. Like we were going to revisit the kids.
Real as amazing as our friendship was, we did have a little rough patch Diamond, and yeah we did. I want to tell everybody that me and Diamond were actually supposed to go to Maryland together and she went to North Carolina instead. So honestly, I've never really even asked you about what that thought process was like because we were kids. I've been committed to Maryland since tenth grade. So I've been spend in the last two years of my life trying to convince Diamond to come to.
Maryland with me. And I thought we had her.
We went on a visit together and everything, and I wake up one morning and she going to North Carolina. I said, oh girl, So I mean it was a great choice. I mean at the time, like it made sense. But I want to know, like, and you can tell our listeners, like what that decision was like, and like the hype around it, like it was just different back then like again, no social media nothing. So when you were like one of them girls, you was really one of them girls. And that was diamond when you got that ESPN alert. Yeah, committing to North Carolina. So like what was that like decision like and how did they convince you to go there?
All that kind of stuff.
Yeah, I mean it was you know Maryland, North Carolina, Duke Tennessee or Yukon.
Was my top five.
Moment.
That is tough.
And you know, so it wasn't an easy decision, right, Like there were so many Well I can't say that making that decision in this day and age would have been easier or harder, but you know, back then you had to really try and gauge what a career would look like at this you know, a four year career would look like at these universities. It wasn't oh, I'm gonna just go see if I like it and then like leave. So by the time I had made my decision, you know, obviously I had our AU coach at the time. Know, he was very influential in me making that decision, you know, laying out the cards of what it could look like if I went to the school to school to school to school, and so yeah, it was a pretty spontaneous decision. I mean, looking back on it, like I would have done things very very differently, Like I didn't even tell my parents that I was committing.
I was her best friend. She didn't even tell me.
I didn't tell anybody.
Yeah, so you know, I'm not proud of that, but that's how it happened for me.
That's my story.
I'm curious when you made that decision to go to North Carolina. What was it about North Carolina that made you want to go there so much so that it was like, Okay, I'm making this decision.
I don't care what nobody else has to say about it.
I just felt like there was a big opportunity for me to kind of brand myself as like this female MJ type of character in women's basketball.
Obviously there was Maya Moore who you just you could never touch.
But I was like, you know, what if I go to North Carolina and I wear number twenty three, and I go there and do all the things that you know, I know I'm supposed to do. You know, everything was about setting yourself up to make money at the next level. And so at the time that felt like, you know, there wasn't a lot of games being televised on women's basketball. You know, like if you wanted to play on TV, you went to the five schools that I just that were in my top five. Everybody that could make decisions around those five schools was doing it, And yeah, it just it felt like the right kind of fit for the image.
And the archetype that I was trying to become.
Then not honestly, you did the right thing by making the decision and just doing it.
I had a little bit more context for y'all because Diamond didn't, like, look at North Carolina, it was like, oh no, I'm going They had the number one recruiting class that they like magically assembled in like record time, Like what was it, five of y'all?
Four y'all?
It was four of us?
Yeah, And after I committed, I called each and every one of them and it was like I just committed, you know what y'all trying to do?
And they all committed the same thing.
You assembled the Avengers.
Basically it was like, yeah, basically the little freshman avengerlus coming in and like you fast forward to like twenty twenty five and that happening, Like they gonna be on Slam, they gonna be doing interviews, they gonna be in commercials together. Like that's how big of a deal that decision was at the time because people was not teaming up like that going into college, Like people would maybe eventually team up via transfer portal things like that, but like doing it straight out of high school like that was something that I had never been done before. So yeah, I was pissed. But then I was like, I mean, I get it. And then you hear her explanation and as mad as I was, I was like whatever. We actually didn't speak all through college though.
How we didn't it was it was quiet, but all of the years from freshmen to.
Draft connected at the draft, Wow, it was like a real.
And even then like she was still a little tight at me, and then like COVID hit and it was like I went to the house, We had a glass of wine.
We realized we still loved each other.
Yeah, we had a right We had red table talk my mom.
Both our moms were like for years, We're like, y'all need to like no, like this.
Is not supposed to have.
Well, both of you had. I wasn't there for any of the situation.
But looking on it, this is something that people can relate to as far as recruiting goes. It's like, Diamond, you had a decision to make for yourself that you felt like, you saw it, You saw how you can market yourself.
You saw it was gonna work, and you I have to know that first TikTok.
But the moment but Lexi you at the same time were like.
But I had this literally rush, and.
So I see both sides of it that like, which is good that you came together.
You know, she had that amazing year, But you decided to transfer. So what went into that decision? And it's different now, Like you have to sit out a whole year, so you take it all that momentum and putting it literally on hold for an entire year. So I know, yeah, I mean I transferred to Like it's not easy. So when you decided to transfer, Like, what was that like for you?
Yeah, so it was it was a couple of things, like when I decided to transfer. And again this is something that people don't know. I had a stress fracture my senior year of high school. I had a stress fracture in my shin that I played through, you know, like every day in high school. My senior year, I had a walking boot on or I was in crutches, so I would literally crutch into the arena for games, put my shoes on, play, and crutch out. And so when I got to North Carolina, I was still dealing with that stress fracture, and it was the same situation. I had a walking boot off season pretty much, I was getting multiple PRP shots in my shin. I just my leg was like, y'all saw Kevin ware snap his leg, like that was gonna happen.
To me at any given moment.
So when I decided to transfer, it was kind of like I needed the rest for one because I had to get surgery, so to me kind of made sense in terms of my health. But then there was also just like the basketball of it, Like my freshman year, I never got to play for. Two of the coaches actually that I made my decision behind was Tricia Stafford Odom, who had recruited me at the time. She had came from Duke. She's the one who put that entire freshman class together, and when we all committed and signed, they fired her, And yeah, it broke all of our hearts. So even coming in I was already just like and they said, you know, you shouldn't make a decision because of the assistant or whatever. But man, the assistants are the ones who really be on the phone with you. They're really the ones who get to know your family and who take that time out. You can't always necessarily be on the phone with a head coach constantly.
They have so much to do. So that happened, and then even from just the moment I stepped on campus, it was just like, this is this is not what I came here for.
So they all left though, guys, the whole class, they all slid. So when you transferred, you get to Tennessee, you had your surgery into so like being hurt and sitting out, like mentally, I know where you were a baby at that time, Like what was that like for you? Recovering, sitting out, people questioning your decision every day pretty much like how was you?
How are you dealing with that?
Yeah, I mean, you know, it's just a different time, Like it was just like when you're one of those faces in women's basketball back then, everything just feels a lot heavier, you know, So it was it was the aftermath of my transferring via un C fans and the lums and all of that. Then there was also just the anticipation in Knoxville of like when she gonna play.
You know, we're so excited. Da da da.
So it was like, yeah, I was mourning my freshman year, my decision. I was like pretty sad about it all, but there was also just so much excitement that I had to look forward to for when I could finally play a year post making that decision, So like I was good, Like I wasn't really tripping, you know, I was in Knoxville. My mom went to UT so I spent time in Knoxville growing up, Like that was where I wanted to be at.
So I had just I was just like eyes forward the whole time.
And you finally were gonna get to play healthy Yeah exactly.
So it was yeah, like again, it was just a different time. You know, you had to consider that sit out year and you had to really say is it.
Gonna be worth it?
And so anybody who transferred during that time, like they knew that that's what they wanted to do. It was important for them to find a new home somewhere else. Who's on the team then Mercedes Russell, Jordan Reynolds, Jamie Nard, Andrea Carter, but Shard Graves Isabelle Harrison.
That's three WWA players on one team. These are not fringe w players. These are like key rotational pieces to WNVA teams. And I mean, I don't think people also realize that about how different women's college landscape is now, Like you're you're not seeing that really on teams anymore.
You're not seeing.
Three, four, sometimes five at Yukon because that's what it was. WNBA players are on the same team.
Yeah, And for me, like I feel like it's a good and about thing.
So I'm like interested to see how you feel about it, Like, yes, like the parody is good, but you also want to see like the best players playing with the best players.
Yeah. I mean, look, like I said, it was just a different time. We were all trying to be relevant in conversation and the only way you could do that was going to those one or two camps in the summer, playing in those three or four AU tournaments, and going to these eight to ten schools. Like it wasn't you had to go up against the best players to even be mentioned in those conversations. So I think there was a lot more joining of forces because of that, And I think that the money and the nil everything kind of just spread everything out.
So now it's really you just try to get paid.
Yeah, it seems I was gonna say, now, it's interesting to hear you talk about you being somebody who would have definitely capitalized so much off of nil even in high school. But hearing now, there's a benefit to being the girl on the team.
You know what I'm saying.
You don't want to join forces and risk not being the girl on the team, because then when there is time to pick somebody to be in the commercial, they're looking at her and they're not looking at you.
So it's like, I don't.
Know if I want to team up like that because that might hurt my bad.
Plus this little small school over here might pay me this.
Like the fact that these are the conversations we're having about college kids is nuts.
And I knew this was going to happen when the NC.
DOUBLEA was like here, damn no rules, no regulations, no nothing. And I just the world underestimate the power of like college athletics, of women athletes, Like I just feel like the NC DOUBLEA was like okay, like you're y'all gonna fall in y'all's face because y'all gonn't know what to do with it. And I think that it's been bigger and crazy than they probably was even imagining.
I would argue if they had anil back then in social media and TikTok and everything, because you look at the top five most followed athletes in March Madness right now, top four women, and the fifth is Cooper Flag and he's the most popular player in the men's tournament. So I feel like we honestly probably would be in a different space if women were getting marketed the same back then, because as you can see, when we are getting marketed, which we've gotten to taken our own hands because of social media, it works when you look at the way that they do their nil deals or the way that they do their ads, or the way that they make their tiktoks, like y'all's tiktoks at the sleepover when you were twelve would have been way more interesting than college basketball player going to canes and.
Yeah, I got you, I love Kanes. That's literally how they here's my canes.
And it's just like we were very marketable, you know. So it's like, to y'all's point, like a lot of the deals getting done, it's like take an athlete and just give them a script and then have them stand in front of the sign, and it's just like, where's the character, where's the personality, where's the desire to want to, you know, make this a lasting partnership. I feel like for a lot of these kids, it's just coming in so easily. They're just like, you know, come by this, we'll do you know. But there are those other athletes right like Flage. I mean she making music, she doing the song, the acting, her own podcast. Yeah, yeah, she she maximizing. So shout out Flawjack Lexi.
You talk about all the time you were doing the social media thing.
In college and the internet, and I was like, no, I won't.
How about this. We weren't even allowed to be on the internet in college. You couldn't be on social media.
And on the road trips they taking that phone, Yeah, that phone get took after the game.
Don't lose, don't lose on the road.
They was hating out the gate. They ain't want y'all to be nothing other than this.
Across the front.
We couldn't even post pictures in the uniform unless we were at like media stuff.
Wait, I'm shocked by this. That is I know it was bad girl, and I say it.
I say it all the time and people are like, let's see, shut up. No, it affected everybody, and not everybody is as vocal about it, obviously, but it didn't just affect me.
I just kept doing it. It was clocking my shit.
Twenty four to seven, I got pulled in the office to like take pictures down, like, oh my.
God, like they was on that yeah, and it's are you tweeting? At midnight?
I had a compliance meeting for my senior pictures. It was like, are you modeling? Are you getting paid?
Y'all? Those are my.
Clients, bro.
They were like enemy number one, like just clocking you, Like I don't think you guys understand. Like when we talk at this NIO stuff, not only could we not get money for things, we couldn't even get things period. Like if a brand wanted to send us some clothes or something, no violation.
You could be starving. You couldn't even get a damn hot dog at the tail tracks.
You're right, we couldn't even take food at the tailgates.
We'll be at the tailgate, the boosters be wanting to feed us, y'all.
The food be looking so good. Barbecue benefit.
It's a benefit. You can't take it. It was strict.
It was strict, and everyone's like, y'all just hating because they know we're not hating. We are so happy for y'all because college used to be prison. I'm so I'm so happy, but like now it's like a free for all, Like you don't even have to.
Your team doesn't have to be good anymore.
You don't even have to anymore.
Let's start there, because we're talking about flag As, you know, one of the college girls who's doing all of the right things. I do also want to out of Dejah Kelly, who I feel like is another one that is capitalized more than anybody. And she has her own podcast called nilas Sophie. I want to say, so she talks like nile stuff, So that's fire.
Shout out to her. And I saw a clip of her with Raven.
Johnson from South Carolina and she was on there talking about yeah, you know, they just they're bringing me deals and deals and deals, like I don't have time to like do anything because we're at shoots for like three to four hours a day and all this kind of stuff, And that's always been my thing.
I'm like, when do y'all have time to like get better for real?
Mike?
And I think maybe that's why we've seen the stagnation in the players.
They do not matter.
I'm just like cause I know me and I know you.
I was in the practice facility hours before practice, after practice, at night time.
I lived in our practice facility.
Yes, I want a big proponment twenty four hours in a day, but I don't know how them girls are doing it.
I really don't.
Fashion Week, the Matt Gala, Nike commercial, Get Right, commercial afflat commercials. I mean, you can't help but be so happy for all of them.
But it's just like, all right, like at what? At what costs? Now?
Like I feel like as many pros are there is, the cons are starting to pile up a bit, and I mean, yeah, money.
I think Sadonah said it, Sadana Princeman TC who actually spearheaded.
I'm gonna you know, I know people have their opinions on Sadona right now. I know they do but you got to give her credit for like she jumpstarted all this shit with her little weight with her with her weight to TikTok. So whatever, feel how y'all feel about her, whatever, But the fact is, if Sadona doesn't post that video, we're not here right now. I don't care what nobody says, It's not happening. She made this thing jumpstart. But even her saying, you gotta like think long term sometimes sometimes that little hunter k like it might look pretty right now, but like long term, like you gotta you gotta weigh your options. She said that this whole thing gave her the ability to play basketball probably longer than she might have in the past with injuries, transferring off court stuff. But her NIO stuff has like kept her relevant despite all the off court stuff. So even you look at Haley van Litz covid NIO, the way she was able to get that.
Additional year, it's changed her career.
This put her career back on track that fast.
I would have spoke y'all about being transfer kids, because there's been a lot of talk in the media about the transfer portal, and I know I get asked by my audience all the time about the transfer portal. But I feel like no better two people to speak on it than y'all and Diamond you speaking on I had to really decide where I wanted to call home because I was gonna have.
To say, man, bring that set out, bring bring that set out. Rule, what do you guys think the solution.
Is, bring it back, bring it back.
You still get to leave.
I don't think they should put any hindrance on NIO deals. Nothing but stitch your ass down or go back to the one you get one time to leave, We get it. One time, J Bellis went on TV and he said that they need to start signing kids to contracts like multi year.
Did I think so too? That's that incentivize them to stay.
It's like you wouldn't have this platform or this opportunity to be this version of yourself if you weren't coming to this university. And so there should be some sort of obligation, binding obligation to players, because if not, then you get what you have right now. And you can see how it's been hurting the men's side right The women's side hasn't got to that point yet.
It's about to.
But the proof is right in front of you. You know this, if this continues, you know, you might run into the same issues on the women's side. So you know, I think contracts would be good. I think the one year set out would be good as well, because players need to really think about why they want to leave a place and if it's worth leaving.
You could transfer every single year if you want it.
And make more and more and more and more.
And yes, that's amazing, great, But like Diamond said, there's no like incentives. So yeah, the players who are getting their endorsement stuff off outside of basketball, Like, that's not going to change whether you make them sit whatever, that's not going to change the money that people are getting from the universities. I think that's the only place they can regulate in any capacity. Is that money, the outside money that has nothing to do with the school, Like whether they're at this school, a toad school, that school. If the companies and brands are attracted to this particular player, they're going to follow them, so like, let's not even think about that stuff.
Well, and I'm thinking for the school themselves.
There's also that added incentive of well number one, like Diamond mentioned, it should be a thought before you leave a place where you want to go next. You should really have to think about that. But also you commit. You should just be committing anywhere because oh, they're offering me this amount of money, and I could stay for a year, and I could leave if I really want to and make more. And then on top of that, it benefits the schools to have some structure in place for them to have to stay for a certain amount of time, because if lage is at a different school every year in the Google comprice doesn't make sense.
What does that do for the schools. It's confusing.
And at this revenue share in, schools are about to be paying even more to their student athletes, so it's gonna be even more money. I mean, you see the girl Oklahoma, she just signed for like one point three.
I'm telling you all the top players are going to the SEC in the next three years. Every top player is going to be that money. Yeah, there's no there. The other conferences simply can't compete because they got the TV money, they got the football money. Their boosters are clearly just super wealthy and they love their universe. I will say people of these who go to SEC schools have a lot of pride whether their athletes or not. So I know that's all right, yeah yeah, So it's like that much is coming in from everywhere. So like I foresee the SEC running the table. I mean they're running it right now. Look key, they're on the way and they're doing it for men already. So football, women's basketball, men's basketball is all gonna live in the SEC. And like, I don't know what that's gonna look like for the rest of the schools, Like what are they what are these what are these other schools gonna do? Like they're they're gonna be Power five schools with one two star recruits because everybody's going to the big everyone's going to the same conference now, so like you're gonna have well what.
If they privatize that conference.
And like something, something dramatic is gonna happen. Something dramatic is gonna happen.
Oh my god, what about the other sports? Exactly? What about the other sports?
Like let's start with that, Like we are so hyper focused on basketball and football, but like, yes, like what about the other freaking sports. Your team, your men's basketball team and women's basketball teams, the football teams suck. Those other programs are gonna get cut.
It's so sad.
I was talking, you know, one of my friends who was telling me about the SMU coaching staff getting fired because SMU look like a JV high school team in the ACC. That I was like, oh, so, now the whole staff you lose your jobs because y'all made a selfish decision to move a team that has no business being in the ACC playing in the ACC. And now you have a lot of unhappyness going on because why are y'all in that conference?
Well what about the travel? Yeah, the travel is a mess right now?
Yeah, I can't make sense of it. I can't make sense.
I mean when in USC and Cal and Stanford, even Stanford, Like I don't I didn't watch Stanford play that much this year, but like Stanford has never They've always been good, like no matter what, like whatever they have a superstar and not a superstar whatever, They've always been solid. I've never seen a Stanford team look like the one that they had this year. And I'm gonna say that the travel was probably insane. You're in the ACC, right, They're in the ACC.
Now.
I went to watch their their back volleyball team play Georgia Tech, and I'm sitting are thinking, these girls are in college, they got class tomorrow Atlanta playing a volleyball game.
What the hell?
Like that we already know, like that trip, that trip after the game.
You getting in at three am? You got an eight am class.
First of all, you have to have the early class as a student athlete because you got practice in the afternoon. So you got them eight ams, you got the ten ams. So if you get in at two, three, four am, guess.
What gets up. There's just no rhyme and reason behind it.
And yeah, I think we all got so caught up in like, yes, athletes are making money like fuck n Cuba, but like no, it's the shit show now.
Well, people are quiet about the actually making money from the school park And that's why I think a lot of people have less reservations about it because not as many people. Obviously, we're in sports circles, so we're aware of dang you made how much to transfer toware But the average fan, the media is not gassing that up like they're gassing up.
Oh they were in a Google commercial. Yeah, like that doesn't have anything to do with the SMA.
Majority of the players are making their money from the university there is only a handful who have TV deals and who have big brand deals, Like that's like the nth percentile. Yeah, you know, like most every college athlete is getting paid from the.
Collective and it's not that much.
Well, then turn to the revenue share, which is like I don't know how many millions of dollars distributed amongst what men's men's basketball, women's basketball, and football. I believe it's like twenty five million.
Dollars and then the rest of the sports get the crumbs. But it's crazy because even I just read an article about South Carolina women's basketball team and that they lost money. They lose money every year, right, So the business of college sports and the business of professional sports, it's so different. You lose five four to five million dollars a year. You're not paying anybody because you can't. So in college it's so different. It's like it's just as backwards to me because as amazing as the South Carolina program is and they're selling out arenas and they're winning championships, they have still lost money every year.
And that's not a dig at the program. It's numbers.
Well, but then you also have the boosters, like I was just joking with my friends when we were at the Elite A the other day. I was like, man, if Georgia basketball don't get it together, I'm gonna have to make me some money so I can start paying them.
And I'm nil money myself.
Like I have a friend who was like, if I have money, I would give it to the nil collective want to? I want them to get money too. I'm like, people really feel that way about the athletes.
I'm like, I'd be going out to recruit myself if I had just like throw away money, if I were one of these big billionaires that went to a school man, Oh my god.
So it's like, okay, so now you look at the business of sports now, because now that's what we're turning.
That's what college is.
It's not just fun shits and gigs anymore in college, Like this is now real money is being made and distributed to the athletes or whatever. What does that look like for sports programs that don't make money because now they're implementing this revenue share thing. I feel like it's not gonna be good for the majority.
How do you stay competitive? It's not you're losing six million dollars a year.
Schools are like hiring general managers now, you know, like I'm telling y'all, like it's becoming.
They are this close to becoming pro It's.
About to be like that pipeline, you know, like in Europe where you could play like second division, third division.
It's going to kind of be like that.
I feel like it's gonna be like a pro league. But certain teams of certain universities are going to exist separate of the university and they're going to exist in like a league.
It's insane. Then what a school come in mar You know, they don't care about school.
They haven't cared about school for a way before nil, trust me, but now they definitely don't. And now what does that mean for the actual pro leagues that exists, Like, are we going to have to start having like WNBA, NCAA, like separate things like you have. These are the twelve players I finna get drafted, so we're gonna put them in an academy.
I just think there's so much change still yet to come.
Yeah, I mean, and that's just the basketball nerd and business of basketball nerd and me. These are these things keep me up at night, guys, They really do because I want to be a general manager. But like, and I'm like, shit, do I want to be a college general manager? Because there's a hell of money in that. So now we're gonna pivot since you mentioned like the European style, you know, since Juju got hurt, there's been a lot of conversation about, you know, how she's gonna make her return.
Is she gonna stay for her all of her eligibility years, blah blah blah blah blah. They need to change the rule.
Players need to be able to leave after one season, all this kind of stuff. If y'all didn't know, Diamond had one year of eligibility left at Tennessee and she decided to go pro.
So this has happened before. Players have not.
Done all their years of eligibility, they've left. Diamond's done it. I think Juweloyd did it. I think Jackie Young might have came out early. So for for y'all, like early means you have to be twenty two in the draft year. So whether you turn twenty two before the drafts or after drafts, it just has to be in that year. So nobody is stopping anybody from leaving early.
But diamond.
Can you like talk about like how you made that decision? And I remember when you did make that decision, it did not go over well, So can you like watch.
I mean, like you said, there are certain parameters that have to be met before you can even just make that decision to turn pro on the female side, which a lot of people don't know about. So you have to either be twenty two years of age or you know, have graduated college, which again is why players in the w are just so smart and intelligent, because we all have degrees. But yeah, I mean when I made my decision, obviously, like there was no money being made in college and the draft had already passed, so the only thing that I could do was go play in Europe. And when I saw that contract and I saw that dollar amount, it was pretty much a no brainer for me that I was gonna leave. So I went and played in Turkey, had a blast, and then got drafted the following year.
When people talk about like the college holding holding players back and the WNBA needs to change the rule, I'm like, y'all want us to change an entire rule for like two.
It really amazes me how mediocre people think the W is talent wise.
That is a hill I've been dying on for months. Diamond literally crucified.
How common the thought is that there are multiple pros in college right now in the draft class rather that can go to a training camp and make a team. I'm like, you guys don't pay attention. You don't really understand the depths of these rosters and how some most teams don't even have a spot to take or make, you know, So stay in school is pretty wise, especially considering the amount of money that.
Can be made.
Yeah, but I'm saying like, because I don't even know, like with our CBA stuff, diamonds in these these meetings too. For the CBA, like I've always like thrown around the idea of possibly guaranteeing rookie contracts at least like their first two years, because when people are like, oh, yeah, they can come out early and dah da da da those it's not like the NBA those. If you're a first rounder, you can get cut in training camp the year you get drafted, like and we've seen it happen. So now I'm like, you're asking you want nineteen twenty twenty one year old women to leave school degreeless and then just be out in the wild, like that's what y'all want, because y'all think two players in the last ten years have been pro ready early, which again going back to the thinking the league is mediocre, We've seen plenty of pro ready players early in their career.
Diamond actually was one of them as well.
So I just think that conversation is done. But like talking to someone like you, Diamond that left early, did you think that helped you or hurt you? Like, do you wish you stayed, you know, money aside. In hindsight, are you still like happy that you forewent your scene?
I mean, in hindsight, I was happy with my decision because, you know, again the landscape was so different. I was finally able to get paid for doing a job that I'd been doing for free for so long. You know, I was coming out of the leg surgery. You only get to play basketball for so long, and so at that time, you know, staying in college for four years was just like it was a major sacrifice on like prime playing years for a female basketball player. However, economically, you know, it made sense for you to stay in school and get your degree because an event that you leave and you get cut from a team. Now you don't have no job, and you don't have a degree, and you don't have no money. So again, when I was making my decision, I had already graduated college, so that was the big make or breaker for me. I had the degree, so I would have been staying to do a grad year where I wouldn't have been in no classes. I would have been a professional athlete for free, and that just didn't make sense. So yeah, the degree was the big you know, make or breaker for me.
After I got that, it was time to go, said, I'm out, Like.
You said, a lot of people underestimate how hard it actually is to maintain a spot in the w let alone separate yourself enough to have a long withstanding career and be a star to make the kind of money they might be making in college. And I think that it feels like I hate when this conversation comes up because maybe just as a fan, it feels so simple to me.
But why would you not choose.
To get your degree for free because you're on scholarship and then now you're also getting paid, So that's like a whole other thing.
A lot paid amounts of money that there's no salary cap, there's no rules, you're getting paid whatever.
And then number three, you're still getting to do the commercials and the endorsement deals and get sent.
Stuff and do all that stuff. Exactly what's the benefit.
And then also on top of that, when you were speaking about Diamond earlier, the idea of getting to make a name for yourself at this university because of the fandoms that the university already has, the history that these universities already have. Like you're getting to establish yourself, make a name for yourself, get a degree for free, and get paid.
Why would you why would you want to rush that process at time?
It makes sense as if you're a guy and you're walking.
Because your windows where you're making twenty million or however much.
The name like it's.
Perfect right now to be a female athlete in college.
It's the most no brainer is thought process of stay your ass in school for.
As long as as as.
Long as you can.
You see the dude at Florida's pro day, he's like twenty seven, and he's like, I'm like, yeah, do that.
If you can do that inside, stay forever.
It makes it's just what makes the most sense.
But also I feel like it's good for new fans of the W because coming in when you've seen Juju all four years or whatever at USC and you starget hurt and she comes back, she's a crazy year blah blah blah blah, all this stuff and then carries that momentum with her. Like, as a fan, that's I'd rather see that story see her leave prematurely and not Juju specifically, because she's obviously incredible, but see people leave prematurely and then get cut and I'm like or.
Buried on the bench.
And that's what used to happen, is like you have these all Americans getting drafted and out of the first round, maybe two or three get real minutes their rookie season.
We and Lexie talk about that all the time, rookies getting benched. That's another thing that I feel like, as the media starts talking more about women's basketball without actually watching it, that's the thing I hear a lot of, Well, you should just play them because we know that we know who they are and we've been hearing about them.
But there's a balance. But what do you guys think about?
Because I hear them in the sense where it's like, okay, marketing whatever, but you can't sacrifice the level of basketball being played for that.
Well, we saw that happen probably in like the last third of the season.
I feel like a lot of.
Teams were like, okay, go, rookies, go, and then that playoff push come in and they're like.
All right, y'all need to chill out, sit.
Down, and we're gonna put the vets on the floor to go win a championship.
But I mean, I like.
It's evident what wins and what has success, and the franchises and the organizations who keep that at the forefront in terms of people who work hard, people who are professionals, people who play hard and who are consistent, they're the ones who have success. You know, you can play that game with the media and you know, lose players out there too, but you're gonna lose, and you know you're going to continue to enhance this idea that that's what it means to be, you know, a star player in this league when that idea only just started to exist. You know, we've had stars in this league for decades who didn't get no credit, none of the props and attention that they deserve.
That they should have had.
I think that we would be doing the League of disservice if we continued or started to kind of.
Do that pander.
I call that pandering, and I'm tired of it. Yes, I'm sick of it. And I hope that this season, I hope everyone learned when they looked at who was in the finals what pandering does for you. It gets you sent home, because we saw two very veteran heavy teams in the finals and gave us an amazing product.
So with stars, with stars actually, like with czars.
I don't but the media controls who the stars are. That's a whole other conversation for a whole their day. But who we're talking about and who we're pushing are going to be the stars well or not. And so you if you put these people that are just magnets for being talked about out in the forefront on the basketball court up against people who've been in the league for years and years and years that are like, please, you're only you're doing them into service too, because then they look bad.
But you know, it's crazy, it's crazy that you said that, because you know, we were talking about how in college and everybody's like spreading out and the W it's like it's going opposite. Everyone's trying to team up. Now it's like completely it's like opposite now. Like now in the W, it's like you're more powerful as a collective, you know, if you've got a group of us that are outgoing have good brand can hoop, Like you're better off if there's more of y'all doing that. And in college, you're kind of better off if you're all kind of spread out a little bit more. So, it's like very interesting, how like the dynamic has like completely flip flopped between college and Yeah, I think.
The course of events by which marketing has been incorporated into women's sports, it definitely has peaked in college before it has met the pros. So you know, it makes sense in college because you know, it's just such a big thing in college right now. But you know, for those of us who've been professional, it's like, you know a lot of us still trying to get brand deals, still trying to get paid outside of just your basketball salaries, whereas it's just a bit more common in college, it seems, and lucrative, no for sure.
Well, another thing with the whole it being spread out in college to make money, whereas like in the league, it seems to be doing the opposite. I feel like, listen, I'm not the WBI, so you can y'all can tell me if I'm wrong. But I feel like that's also because you get judged when you're in the pros based off of winning performance, winning championships.
So if we team.
Up, win and maybe we got to see if you're gonna still be here in a few years, because how many players do we see come out and by.
The second year, you'd be like, damn where they go?
You know, you can't as a brand, You're not about to, you know, create a multi year partnership with somebody where you don't even know if they're gonna be on a team.
On the team anymore. I mean, you said, I'm dealing with that right now. They're like, damn, we thought she's for b LA for a minute. Now the opportunities shift a little bit, they change, like.
Well, LEXI, you're about to benefit from what I was just talking about winning coaching.
Okay, before we get out of here.
Diamond, if y'all didn't know, Diamond is now on the Connecticut Sun and the organization has been a bit under attack as of late.
So Diamond, I want you to.
Provide some hopefully positivity and some light on what y'all got going on in Connecticut. I'm very excited for you, by the way, to be there and be able to get back to hooping the way you hoop. So if you can let our listeners know what the vibes are in Connectic.
You were just up there. You did a broadcast for the Celtics, which was fire. That's right. Give the listeners a little insight on what was going on.
Well, the vibes in Connecticut are great. Actually, you know, whole front office, everybody is really looking forward to this season. You know, obviously a lot of departures in the off season, big departures.
But I've been a part of a rebuild before.
I've successfully rebuilt before in an organization in Chicago where you know, it was kind of a mess when I got there, and you know, then we won a championship. So you know, this is not foreign territory for me. Like I'm excited about the opportunity to be a part of a franchise that honestly has winning pedigree, has that DNA still exists, and just continuing to build on it. Like, you know, you can say what you want about the team and the decisions that have been made, but you know, Lexi, on any given night, anything could happen, any team could win. We have a talented team, We have a good group. I'm really excited about playing for Rashid and the rest of the coaching staff. One of the big things for me is just like no narratives, you know, we get to go there and just like.
Hoop, just play, Yeah, just play.
Which people underestimate and undervalue. You know.
It's really nice to be in a space where basketball is the focal point. So yeah, there's a lot to look forward to in Connecticut, you know what I'm saying. And you know, for those who maybe feel differently, it's kind of just something that you just have to wait and see, you know. And again, all eyes we appreciate. So even if you're watching.
To see if it's a ship, shall yeah, like you.
Know, we're still here, Hey watch you're here, so.
Still watching, y'all still watching.
So I'm you know, I'm excited, and I'm really grateful and fortunate for the opportunity. Man, Like, having a job in this league is a blessing. You never take it for granted, no matter where it is. So I'm really happy good.
I'm glad see y'all. It's not horrible up there. It's not as bad as y'all think.
Because people was going in on the Connecticut Son, I was like, all right, y'all, I mean it was a little there was question marks, but again, we're all professionals here, and y'all have y'all don't have a y'all's team is not trash by any mean y'all gonna be all right.
Next to you know, like you already know, Bro, everything ain't always what it seems. Unless you're there on the day to day, you can't really speak on it, right, that's the truth.
Y'all heard that.
Say it again, Diamond, Is you there on the day to day, bro, shut out, speak on it, shut your mouth.
Okay, Lord got a good place to end because I felt like that was a nice little call out to people who got too much things to stay with very limited information. But Diamond, I'm so happy we've made this happen. I hope you guys enjoyed this conversation and I will see y'all next week on the Full Circle Podcast.
Bye.
Y'all, thanks for listening to Full Circle.
We'll be back next week with more basketball for the Girls, by the girls.
We want to hear from you.
Leave us a review on Apple Podcasts, and tell us what you want us to talk about. Full Circle is hosted by Lexi Brown and Mariah Rose. Our executive producer is Jesse Katz. Our supervising producer is Grace Fuse. Our producer is Zoe dang Lap. Listen to Full Circle on America's number one podcast network, iHeart, open your free iHeart app and search full Circle with Lexi Brown and Mariah Rose and start listening
