Minimalist Living In An RV To Pay Off $56K Of Debt | Jill's Debt Free Journey

Published Jun 17, 2022, 7:00 AM

Living in an RV may seem like a dream for travelers and minimalists but itโ€™s not always as easy and fancy as it seems. In this episode, Jill breaks down her minimalist RV lifestyle and non-traditional methods such as house sitting, renovating an RV and trailer to sell, and more, together with her supportive husband Eric in order to pay their debt. 

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Episode two seventeen, Minimalist living in an RV to pay off fifty six thousand dollars of debt. Welcome to the Frugal Friends podcast, where you'll learn to save money, embrace simplicity, rice and liver with your life. Here your host Jen and Jill. Welcome to the Frugal Friends podcast. My name is Jen, my name is Jill, and today we have another special episode. If you were with us last week, you will be familiar with this format. But there are no articles today, no guests, just me and Jill staring at each other too. Yes, for those of you long time listeners, you know that we often do not record in person, despite the fact that we only live fifteen minutes from each other. It's just easier. It is hawwardly resistance is what we take. But today we are in person, and so it really feels like a real interview. I don't even need my computer in front of me. I've got a mic. It's not even plugged into power, so maybe it'll die. My shoes are off, I might sit cross legged. Perfect. Well, it's your debt free stores, so I shouldn't mess it up. Yeah, I just have to answer questions. Perfect, But first, before we get into that, this episode is brought to you by free tickets. Events are always better when the tickets are free, and the best when you get to go backstage and hang out with the band and take pictures and pretend you're cool. And if you're legitimately cool, you marry the drummer. And while we don't have any spare drummers for you, we do have free tickets. So our two thousand twenty two. I don't know why I said it like that. Frugal Living Summit is coming to a computer or phone near you June. The theme for this year is the Spending Symposium, and we will be sharing twenty never before heard interviews with experts diving deep in to why we spend impulsively, how to stop, how to spend our money better. Registration is now open and it's completely free, and with your free ticket you'll get exclusive discounts for the Spending Mastery Bundle, which includes all of the recordings and a bunch of workbooks, e books courses from our speakers. It's lovely. Head to Frugal Living Summit dot com to get your free ticket and check out everything we'll be doing June. Yeah, it's gonna be so fun. I'm seriously so excited for this. It feels like summer camp for Jen and I and the opportunity to hang out with all of you. I mean, do it get your ticket pleasing out with us? Yes. So if you love debt payoff stories, definitely check out last week's It is episode two sixteen and it is my debt free story. But you can also check out a few peripheral episodes. Episode one one we talk about minimalist budgeting. We'll talk a little bit about that today. And then episode one seventy two decorating your home on a budget because Jill's RV is was probably the cutest thing ever. You're both of your trailer in your RV. So those are some peripheral episodes. We have a lot of debt payoff stories. Just take a browse through the app that you're on. But let's get into this really special time together in the hot seat. All right, So, Jill, first question for you, how much debt did you pay off? What was it from? And what were you making roughly while you paid off? Because it did take you quite some time and I know your your income change throughout it. Yeah, sure, So just to give a little bit of an overview. We began paying off debt in two thousand thirteen, and we made our final payment on our debt in February to any twenty, just before the pandemic. I mean what at our house. Yes, we were parked in our trailer in your backyard and made our final debt payoff and we celebrated, which was so great. So for those of you who aren't doing math in your head right now, that's seven years to pay off debt. And it was a combination of a few different types of debt. And I will say this, we collected debt throughout our debt payoff. That was intentional and it has led to a lot of the things that we can now enjoy. We don't want to continue collecting debt, but it was necessary for our journey. So I just want to make that kind of distinction. It wasn't as if we had this experience where suddenly I realized my finances and I'm going to get everything in order. I was very aware, but trying to be creative with how do I get at my financial goals in a way that feels good to me and will create as much freedom as possible in the least amount of time as possible. So one of the debts was a thirty two thousand dollar a student loan debt, and then the other debts were mostly private loans for our motor home at one point, our trailer at another point, and a vehicle for Eric's business at another point, so essentially vehicles, but those were also houses for us to those three vehicles were also homes, so that was the combination of that fifty six thousand dollars of debt. When Eric and I got married, I was actually still in college. I was wrapping up my undergrad degree. So we got married very very low income. He was working for himself, he had his own electrical business, lived off of that income. Then when I graduated, I of course graduated with debt, thank you the university system higher education, and went right into social work field, making twenty six thousand dollars a year. To me, that was I knew it was low, but it was something I was so accustomed to not having money. I mean, I'm coming out of college, didn't have a lot of money, so I was pleased to have a regular paycheck, But twenty six thousand dollars even ten years ago that was below poverty line, that was not that was not enough to even cover the basics. So frugality was necessary for me just because of my circumstances. And Eric had variable income. He was still just starting out his business, so I would say our take home pay combined was low thirties. So to have thirty two thousand dollars of school loan debt felt like so much. I know, in some ways it's peanuts compared to what students are graduating with these days, but at the time that was above my annual salary, so that it really did feel like a lot, and I knew I wanted it gone. But of course, like we said, we had other debts that we had, so we went from making about within that. That's said, those seven years a combined thirty thousand two. There were years when we probably saw a combined sixty thousand, but pretty low income through those seven years of debt payoff as far as a combined income goes. Yeah, how did Eric feel like about the debt because he didn't have any student loans or anything, and at that point, like you hadn't acquired an r V or trailer or anything, so like, what was his kind of response or I can't totally speak for him, but I'll try. I'll do it. I'll try. I think he this is gonna sound so conceded. I think he was just so on board for like the whole package, the package being me. I don't know. I think I'm sure he would have preferred that I didn't have debt, but I think it was peripheral to the life that we wanted to have together, and he was on board with, yeah, I want to help you pay this off. I think his he was angry at the college system and yeah, why is this a thing? But forever and always, and this will probably come out as we go through this story, we've both been so supportive of each other's endeavors, and I think that is some of the reason behind our unusual journey throughout debt, freedom and some of our non traditional housing situations. So much of us choosing that was to support one another in our endeavors, but in a way that created space and freedom for us as a couple. So he was on board for paying it off, equally didn't like it, didn't blame me for it, was glad that I was able to pursue the degree that I wanted was able to put that degree into action and care for the populations that were important to me. And thankfully he didn't have any he didn't have any debt, he didn't go to undergrad so it was just that that we had to pay off. So he was on board. Yeah, and you also cash flowed your master's degree during the seven years. Yes, that was not a debt that we acquired, And that was one of my parameters. I said to myself and others if I were to go back to get my masters, because it was lingering for me within the field of social work. It's a good idea, it's I think it's always a good idea to expand your skill set and experience and understanding, and certainly within this field it's helpful. So it was always on my radar. But I said to myself and others, I will not get my masters if it means me going into debt for it. It just was something I hate it. I I abhorred the feeling of owing tens of thousands of dollars and thankfully we were able to make that happen, so that that happened in two thousand eighteen, that we cash flowed my master's degree, and we were able to do that because we were living in a motor home at the time. Okay, yeah, so let's talk about the motor home and the trail. Let's talk about all of the non traditional methods you used to not only pay off your debt but also cash flow a master's degree. Yeah, so this the idea first began. And it's neat because Eric and I just celebrated ten years of marriage and we went away on a really beautiful vacation and we were able to process. We kind of wanted to look at big picture of our lives over the last ten years. And I even talked with him about this. So what is fresh in my mind? How did we decide to do that? How it makes sense now just looking back. Oh yeah, we did motor homes, But how in the world that that even become a thing. And it really was for low cost living. A lot of people when we say we lived in a trail tailor or a mobile home, they think, oh, you must have traveled the world you did all not the world, you do all the nation, you did all these things, and that wasn't the reason for it. I recall Eric and I were living in an apartment at the time, and he we went on a vacation with his family and we were at a lake and rented a pontoon boat, and he and his dad were looking at Facebook marketplace for other boats, and within his Facebook marketplace boat search, like, oh, could we ever buy a boat and fix it up and have something fun to do as a family, he came across a motor home and was scrolling through and kind of thinking, Oh, that would be like a fun vacation and a fun way to camp, and then kept looking at it and saying, this has everything you need. We could actually live in one of these. And I had I had already been floating the idea of a master's degree, wanting a master's degree, but looking at our finances and saying I couldn't do that. I couldn't get my master's degree, and not in a further debt. There is just no money for us. And not to mention, if I get my master's degree, I'm going to have to really scale back with work. I'm not going to have much time to even be earning income while I'm spending money. And so that's when the idea just kind of set in of let's see if we could do that. And for Eric and I we do move quickly when we say something and we kind of get the idea in our head then like we jump. So I probably within two weeks of that Facebook marketplace motor home, we had a motor home and we were beginning to renovate it and making moves to moving into it and so again for the low cost of living, and it really did provide that for us. And I will say what actually allowed for us to cash flow the Masters was the eventual sale of that motor home. So living in it provided us as a place to live without high rent or utilities or really any of the other like expenses of time and resources, which was amazing, just the simple life. But then we renovated it and we were able to sell it at a profit, which is really what allowed us to be able to do that, and we were able to sell it. And another unusual living experience that we had was we house sat in a log cabin for a couple who was near retirement but they wanted to keep their home, but there was an opportunity within his work to be able to go to Ireland and they didn't want the hassle of tenants but they wanted someone to care for their homes. So we were able to live there, sell our motor home and not have living expenses, and pay for my master's degree. So the stars aligned in a lot of ways. But we also were moving and Shaken were running our own businesses in the background of me getting my masters and really putting ourselves out there for does anyone have things that we can do in a non traditional kind of creative way. So it is attainable, I think for people, but you do have to be a specific type of person to be able to live in someone else's home for a year and all that can come with that. Yeah, you do have to put yourself in a certain position in order to like some of I think the house sitting one was kind of like a lucky break. You just like right place at right time, but you have to put yourself in that right place at that right time in order to get lucky. And so there are so many unique stories out there that are only stories because the people put themselves in a position to to be able to take advantage of an opportunity that came up. And so maybe how sinning isn't an opportunity that comes up for you if you're listening to this. But the more you put yourself in non traditional situations, the more non traditional opportunities come up for you to take advantage of. And thankfully the Internet does provide a lot of those types of opportunities. Like, yes, this was this was an opportunity within our network, but there are also all sorts of people looking for house sitters for various degrees of amounts of time that they're away for, So this could also be searched out. You don't have to wait for it to follow your lab Yeah, what were some of the logistics to living in the r V and then the trailer? So like where did you park? How much did it cost? Like what was the cost of the r V compared to what you sold it for? Stuff like that. Sure, parking r vs is one of the most challenging aspects of living in a motor home or a trailer, and so whenever someone asks us about this and they're tossing around the idea, my recommendation is nowhere you're going to park at first, before you sink thousands or tens of thousands of dollars into this, have a place to put it. Thankfully, we were able to find that. But I'm not going to say that that was easy or that we didn't have to move around a bit to make that possible for ourselves. I think people are becoming more and more open to having r vs parked on their property. But National Lampoon's Christmas vacation did not give a great look for our V years, and I think a lot of people have that image in their head and you're going to do what and you're gonna live in it and you're not just gonna camp? And where does your waste go? And I don't think I want it. But thankfully we had enough other non traditional thinking friends and even people on the Internet who were willing to let us park on their property. So we did a variety. We had our trailer or RV parked at friends houses at some points for short terms of time. We had it parked in your backyard for a short period of time. There are some RV parks that would allow year round rent, like lots rental spots that you can have. That's not always the most cost effective, and especially if you're like us who lived in the North, usually you can only find a space for six to eight months out of the year. You got to go someplace else for the winter. So those are some of the barriers. But one of the best situations that we ended up finding when we were living in our trailer was we rented out an office space which was a previous barn that was renovated to be an office on someone's property in the farmland of the suburbs of Philadelphia, and they just happened to be open enough with us to bowl. I don't know they were. They chose to allow us to park on their property, which was amazing. So we both rented out the office space because both Eric and I worked remotely, and then we were also able to park our trailer on their property so we could live there and work there and very unusual. I think it was great that they were open to that. But things like that we've been able to find, and I would say Ace Book Marketplace was helpful for us in identifying places that we could park the motor home and be able to meet with people and chat with them and explain to them what we're doing, why we're doing it, the type of people that we are. We're not gonna be partying, We're not going to be up late at night, We're gonna be doing weird stuff on your property. Like we promise we're professional adults, but this is what we're doing. And would you be willing to let us have your hose in your backyard? Yes? So what would you say the monthly cost was for like living in an RV. That's really gonna depend, but I'll give a generalization. So we paid anywhere from a hundred to a thousand dollars to park our trailer monthly. The higher end of that spectrum was, of course, when we were at the office space where we were both renting an office and we had our motor home park there. So for us that was great because we were again running our own businesses, so a lot of that rental could be a business right off. And so we kind of more so factored that our lot rent was maybe more so around three hundred dollars, so let's say three hundred dollars. Utilities were never more than a hundred if you're talking water and electric that kind of thing, and then of course whatever you're going to spend on food and the rest of your life. But I would say, all in all, you're talking under five hundred dollars a month to be able to live in a tiny home like that, just because it is smaller what you have to heat and cool and utilize as much less. That said, the amount of time that it took to up keep a tiny home, and especially a motor home in the winter where you actually have to be concerned about pipes freezing, it did take more time and energy and know how and problem solving than I think the average person realized. Is it's not for the faint of heart. I wouldn't recommend just anybody do it, And to be honest, I don't know that I would have done it on my own if it weren't for Eric. He had a lot of that know how, ability to fix things in the middle of the night, to problem solved what might be going wrong with the A C unit or this or that. So there are things to consider with it. At the end of the day, I'm so pleased for the experience, glad we had it. But that is more so the cost, I would say, is the cost of time and in repairs and problem solving than necessarily the finances. So someone's up for that challenge. Then it was a fantastic experience. Yeah, and the cost of the actual trailer in RV were offset by the profit you made because you did renovate the r V and the trailer. They were beautiful and from where they were too, like where they ended up like, you were able to sell for a profit because of the cost effective thing that you put into it. So that really did offset and that was the nice thing. Even though it's a vehicle, which is usually a depreciating asset, not only were we able to make a profit on it, but obviously recoup what we had initially paid and all the money that we put into it for renovation. So it almost in some ways for both of the times that we did it, in the RV and the trailer, it almost felt like a little savings account for us, knowing that we're gonna get this all of this money back and then some when we sell it. And so on the first RV that we had, I want to say that we made a profit of about eight thousand dollars, and on the trailer we made a profit of a little over ten thousand dollars. And that's not to mention, I mean that's the profit. So we also recouped all of the money that we had put into it. And so when we sold the RV that paid for my master's degree, and when we sold the trailer, that was our down payment on our home here in St. Petersburg. Yeah, okay, so we could talk about this all day, but we do have a few episodes on Jill's experience r ving and helping people figure out if it's right for them. So that's episode one thirty, how to live in an r VR motor home, and then episode seventy eight, which is how to save money by living in an RV. So definitely check those out if you want to know more. But I want to know, do you have any like tips for listeners who may be considering, like other forms of tiny living to save money or alternative housing. I would say do your research, so whether that's reading books, listening to podcasts, watching vloggers. That was really helpful for Eric and I. We chose the vlogging route. I like visuals, so following people who are already doing what you're doing, and hopefully finding the people who are going to be honest with you about it. Thankfully, a lot of social media can be quite transparent these days, so seeing if the ins and outs of what you think is going to be good still appeals to you, and even if you can talk with people who are already doing it. Thankfully, a lot of people have taken advantage of Eric and I in that way, like, hey, we're thinking about doing X, Y Z, and we have opinions on it. People can make their own choices, certainly, but I will be very forthright with you about the pros and the cons of tiny living and so again just knowing what that lifestyle is like, what it's going to require of you, the true costs. I think sometimes we can glamorize whatever our next step is going to be, but really sitting down and pricing it out and making sure that you're going to experience the savings that you desire to see that you've got the skill set to be able to do that, or at least the willingness time energy to learn how to do that thing. I would not recommend tiny living in the north with exposed pipes if you're not willing to be up at three in the morning heat like heat wrapping it, or you know, have an alternative place to stay if your pipes to freeze that kind of thing, and then if there's a way to be able to practice it. We have heard a lot of stories of people who think that this is a lifestyle for them. They change their entire life circumstances, sell everything, move into an RV and last for a month, and then they've got to go refigure out life again. So if you know our V life is specifically what you're considering, rent one, live in one or borrow of friends and and see if you can stay in it, pay them a saying it for a couple of weeks and really get a feel for if it's a lifestyle you're actually going to enjoy. Sometimes are idealized self is not the same as our actual self, So try it on size. So wise, I love that, yes, um, and I want to touch on a few more non traditional things you did to pay off that you had very non traditional side hustles that I've never heard of any other people doing. Like my favorite one was that you were bartenders at weddings and DJs. What are some of the other side hustles you've done over the years to just bring in extra cash. So Eric and I were DJs first and did that together. He would do the music, I would m C. Then we had a renovations business together, so he not only did he have his own electrical business in the past, but he is skilled at all of the trades, so he did a lot of I knew how to do a lot of different construction work types of things, or mary capable, and I'm very capable. And you can make money with able, get the best of both worlds if you can. And I realized that I really enjoy working with my hands as well. I'm not as much of a skilled laborer as Eric is, but I can do a lot of the finish work, the painting, the cocking, the nail filling, the design, although he's good at that too, so and we enjoy working together. So we did that for a time and that was actually the side hustle wall I was in my master's program full time. That allowed me the flexibility but still being able to make some money. And then we were bartenders. We built our own portable bar and created cocktails around different people's weddings and brought our portable portable bar and served up drinks and had a blast with that too. And then Frugal Friends, I mean honestly, Frugal Friends has been a side hustle bigger than what a typical side hustle would be. But these are some of the things, and I think they sound like they span the gamut, but really it has. Oh there was also a time that I sold plants. It was a short, a short, little season, but I'm like his mom had a ton of plants in her property and she was constantly looking to give them away. And I enjoyed plants, and so there was a season where I repotted plants and put them on a trailer in a front yard alongside the road. I just like whatever I could see as low hanging fruit to bring in money. And so despite the fact that it's maybe a lot of variety, it really had to do with what do we see in our tool belt, what's already in our hands, what's the low hanging fruit. And so for the djaying, Eric already had music equipment because he's a musician, and so this is an easy thing to do. We have weekends available, and yet it still allows us to be together because that we enjoy being together, and our work lives took us apart from each other a lot, but yet we needed increased income. So that was a really nice blend for us to have fun, party, play music, make money, be together and have a side hustle and then you know with the renovations that that's a skill set we have, and the bartending it's a skill set. Yeah. We we basically just like to party and how can we make money doing that? So I think as far as if there's a tip somewhere in there, it's so we don't have to reinvent the wheel. It doesn't have to be let me, just what is someone else doing? How can I do that same thing? Just what's in what's in your hand already? What do you what are you good at, what do you enjoy doing? What feels life giving? What is something you don't mind doing? Might even spur you on in your day to day nine to five job provides an outlet that is completely separate from what you do. It doesn't always have to be ruined to what your nine to five is. It could provide a different look at your personhood. And that's what those things were completely separate from social work and trauma. It was completely separate. Absolutely. That I think that's so wise is to look to be paying attention enough to see what's already in front of you. And you did that with your living situations, with your expenses. You did it with your income you were just always aware of how can I get creative with what's available? And you were so successful because of it. Yeah, so knowing that if you had to do it all over again, would you change anything. It's been such a journey, and thankfully I don't live with regret. I'm I'm pleased and grateful for that that there's nothing that I would look back on and say I wish I wouldn't have done that, all right. I think every experience that I've had has lended itself to the next, and I have gained an incredible skill set and variety of experiences in my life and it feels full and rich, and so I'm grateful for that. That said, if there were anything that I might change or maybe would have said to myself in the past, again, not a regret, but a message to my to my younger self and maybe anybody else who's listening. I do wish that I had gotten ahold of the permission earlier on that I had to make changes in the work that I set my hands to, or what might be available to me, the freedom and permission to think outside the box in what I'm currently doing. I think very specifically to that first job that I had out of college. It was actually the internship that I had that they just hired me on and I kept going with it, and that felt simple to me, and it was. It was very, very difficult, for lack of a better word, and I'm grateful for that experience. I do think it formed me in a lot of ways. But I also think I could have stepped out sooner if I had known the freedom permission that was available to me. I felt stuck, I felt trapped. I felt like I couldn't do anything different, and this is what my finances are going to look like for the rest of my life, Like I don't how could I possibly leave. I worked at a residential facility for adolescence, and so what mainly kept me there was my heart for these kids. I was very angry at the system, but the kids kept me there, and so there's there's a tension in that certainly. But I think I wish I would have realized earlier on that I don't have to care for others at the sacrifice of myself. That I can still matter in the work and there are other ways that I can care for people where I'm not stepping over myself. Exhausting myself, sacrificing myself, unnecessarily burning myself out. I wish I would have made a move sooner. Yeah, And there's such a culture in any any work like social work, any human facing work in that context that says you should come second and you should make like very little money. And I think you can transfer that to a lot of other like professions and maybe even families where they say, this is what you know, this is what mom made, so this is what I'm going to make, or this is just what we do and and stuff, and this is how the profession is. So not even knowing that there's more beyond, but once you find out, giving yourself permission to take action on what you know. And there's something to be said for gaining experience. I don't think that I could have stepped into from just graduating college into the role that I now hold, Like it does take experience and a growth of skill set and knowledge and understanding to be able to step into higher paying roles. But even still at that point, the organization didn't rely on me spending sixty hours a week making twenty six thousand dollars a year like that's ludicrous, And I was being taken advantage of. But I couldn't see out from under that that just water that I felt what I was underneath and drowning in. And once I realized, I think I kept waiting for something to change, but nothing was changing, and I felt this like deep heart cry, like I just want out of the situation. This feels suffocating. And it was also in that very moment that I realized, I can leave. I can choose to leave, I can I can do anything else creative. I don't have to wait for some thing else to come into place. And I get it that the best time to look for a job is when you have a job. But there were a few things that I was able to kind of line up to give me more security in stepping out, But other things can shift and change around. It's not worth us killing ourselves to be in a job if it is really sucking the life out of us. And that is in a lot of ways, the non traditional living that we chose. We did that so that there could be freedom for Eric to choose what he wanted to do, for me to choose what I wanted to do, even when we weren't making a lot of money. To make space for each other in that way. Yeah, something else that we choose to make space for every week is the bill of a week. That's right, it's time for the best minute of your time. A week. Maybe a baby was born and his name is Williams. Maybe you've paid off your mortgage, maybe your car died, and you're happy to not have to pay that bill anymore. Duck bills, Buffalo bills, Bill Clinton. This is the bill of the week. So this week we will play one of our listeners bills this week. But also, Jill, we would like you to share your bill for the week. Okay, Well, I'll just go with a bill that I don't mind paying. And that's my bill for gum. I don't get, not what I was expecting, but I'm not surprised. I don't get a monthly bill for gum, although I do get gum monthly, so it feels that I've got like my own personal subscription. I love gum. You can't talk me out of it. I eat, I eat a lot of gum. Might go to these days, and for a while now has been extra peppermint. I want to say it's not Spearman's not enduring pack um. No no, no, we're not. We would gladly accepted if you want to take a deep dive, that's what I spend my like dollar fifty on. Yes, well yeah, I'm not surprised, but also yeah, good for you. Okay, let's let's hear one from our listener. Hi, Jim and Jill. My name is Dianna and this is my first time calling for the bill of My husband and I are excited. We have been planning a trip to Disney World for our kids next year. After listening to one of your episodes, I decided to look into the Disney World credit card and found that they were doing zero percent interest for six months and if I paid for our trip using the credit card, I would get three off. So I did that and it has been officially six months later and our trip is completely paid for without any additional and are stoning the card. Another feature of the card was we got free door dash delivery, so my husband I have been using that one to two times a month as a date night in and once the kids go to bed, and that has been a great feature of the card. UM. I really appreciate all of your podcasts, um the fun that you have during the show makes me smile, and I love hearing all of your tips being frugal and what the entails for you know, a happy life, keep it going, and I can't wait to hear more. Thank you. Oh yeah, I love that these Bills of the week are also turning into just like many encouragement sessions, just like kind words that people are saying to us. I'll take that. So heartwarming. But also the way that you've hacked this opportunity with a Disney credit card. We're not endorsed by Disney, they make it, but again, i'll take your mom at me. And that's the thing. I think credit cards really can be used in our favor if we can be wise about it, if we know how to take advantage of the perks and not allow them to take advantage of Yes, So the way that you're utilizing this opportunity sounds so amazing. That you were able to have a really wonderful trip with your family and then regular dates with your husband indoors, not indoors at home, I mean maybe outdoors at home. I know how sacred the time is between when a child goes to bed and you go to bed, like that is sacred, So that's so awesome, Dianna. Yeah, we love travel hacking. I love taking money from specifically Chase Bank because I know that's where the Disney card is partnered. I just love taking money from them and not giving them anything in return. That's like one of my favorite things to do. So if you have a bill where you have taken something from a big bank and given them nothing thing in return, or just know a person that you met on vacation named Bill who knows you can leave us a bill at Frugal Friends podcast dot com slash Bill. And now it's time for righting round. So today are lightning round that Jill and I will both answer. Is one habit or practice you did not take with you after paying off your debt? So what's something you did while paying off debt that you no longer do? This isn't a habit or a practice. But the first thing that comes to my mind is stress, Like I didn't take stress with me post at least that's concerning finances. You have to have another answer to I, Well, but I okay, so I'll I could like that more tangible then I think some of the tenacity towards that debt payoff and what that required of us, So we don't feel the need to go as hard at side hustles as we did before. I'm not constantly thinking up how can I make money off of this, or how can someone pay me for this, or how can I spend the least amount of money on this thing even if I need it, And that has been that's been a really almost just a beautiful consequence of this and earning more income. So for me, my debt payoff is very interconnected with earning higher levels of income. So sometimes I don't quite know is what I'm experiencing because I'm debt free, or is what I'm experiencing because we've been intentional about earning more and making more and maybe it's a combination, but I have not I've not felt the need to tally up everything that I'm purchasing at the grocery store or do bare minimum with every single decision that I make. Uh. And some of that is just like moving out of scarcity mindset, moving out of literally financially being in poverty, which I'm so grateful for. So there's just yeah, in some ways, and it's a habit, it's a thought process. The way that I approach purchases how I think about them has shifted a lot. Yeah, that's a good one. That's a good answer, Thank you. Something else that you did not take is living in your living in a trailer. Yeah, I don't live in a vehicle a yes. Yes. However, we did live in our trailer for a bit of time post debt freedom, but yeah, that didn't last very long. We quickly sold it and used that money to buy a house, and that was It was never the intention for that to be a long term lifestyle. And I am definitely a proponent of non traditional living circumstances for a specified goal that we don't have to do these things. And I think a lot of people looked at us like, oh, you're the tiny home livers, Like that's what you did. You dwell in tiny homes and that's it. And we did for a time. It was a big part of our lives and what defined us. But we never intended for that to be this is what we're doing. Because all of our ideology and outlook is intertwined with this. It helped us a lot in that regard. But anyhow, freedom and that too, that you could do something for a time just to get at another goal. Yeah, definitely. So for me, and this is gonna be a little controversial. It's not the same for jail, but for me, it's um Budgeting is a practice that I don't really do often anymore. And some people are going to be really offended by this. But I spent years figuring out how to lower my expenses, control my impulse purchases, raise my income, and I am still constantly aware of those things, constantly of where aware of impulse buying efficient ways to increase my income, not like short sighted ways. And so I am constantly aware of those things, and I do check my accounts monthly to make sure that nobody has hacked me. But I don't really budget anymore, and so there's pros and cons to that. I've never been much of a budget or even so when we did it when we were paying off debt, we did it very strictly every month because we needed to know to the penny. Our income was also lower and a lot more of our money was going towards a short term goal. And now that it is not, we are doing like renovations on our home, but we have kind of set up our lives and our lifestyles in a way that we can just live on one income and not care about the rest. I mean care about it, but like either invest or save the rest. So we just really focus on just spending and spending what we have because what we have is only half of what we make. So yeah, that is a thing that I did not take with me after And one of the cons is that sometimes I can get a little anxious about money because I do also love control, and I don't have control over every single penny. But I think the uh, it's not that serious, Like I have enough other things that I can control and have power in that. This is one of those things that I know, I'm confident in these skills I have created that I really just check to see if anybody has hacked my bank stuff. And we we travel act too, so we're always switching up cards and closing your locking cards, so like that kind of helps with the hacking too. You're not alone in what you're describing. I'm hearing more and more people say I don't budget, And I also think there's a spectrum to that. Just like people talk about retiring early, it's not for most people. It's not really retiring early and so whatever they define that to be. And so I think you're defining the way that you manage money. And I think in some ways that is what budgeting is. And because you have so much practice with it, this makes sense for you. I would imagine that you have a very good estimate of your bills and you're spending because like I know you say I don't budget, but I'm sure if I asked you, what are utilities monthly? What's your mortgage, what's your discretionary spending? What about groceries? What do you typically spend on take out? Like you would probably be able to rattle that off within a five dollar range of act your that's very Um, I don't know if I can get five dollars. I definitely do know what our bills are and and all of that. And like, I don't think you should trust me if I'm on here with this podcast not being able to say that. I just like, but just to clarify for people, because I think I love the freedom that's being talked about both in your circle, your experiences and the choices you made as well as mine, but also the journey to get there that yes, credit cards can be awesome, but don't use them if their downfall for you. Yes, living tiny is awesome, but don't do it if you've got ten kids or like you live in Alaska at least in r V tiny homes are fine. Yeah, you don't have to budget, but as long as you've got a really good handle on your finances and you have budgeted in the past, you know what that means and you know where your money is going now. So there's there's freedom, but there's also a skill set and experience to be built it all as well. Absolutely well, everyone, thank you so much for listening. I hope there's something in my story that can encourage you and provide freedom to you and reach out if you've got more specific questions. If this is getting your own wheels, turning on some creative living, debt payoff for your just living on a low income, I feel for you. In celebration of our summit June, we want to share some of the comments you guys made about our event, like this one from Emily S. I found out this about this awesome summit from Sarah Wilson, so shout out to her. I'm also interested in real estate investing and home payment hacking. Found it really helpful hearing about how Sarah goes about getting tenants. Thank you for that interview. Yeah, thanks so much, Emily. We have so many great interviews lined up this year. That and it's all about spending, so we really honed in on that impulse spending, emotional spending, habitual spending, like all of these spending psychology topics, So we really want to help you gain insight and tools in this one area, so you feel like you've taken something out of the week that you will use moving forward. So thanks so much for listening. If you want your free ticket f R E E ticket to this year's summit, June had to Frugal Living Summit dot com and don't forget to check out the Spending Mastery bundle after you register. See you next week. Frugal Friends is produced by Eric Sirianni. Would you let me park my dwelling in your backyard again? If it ever came to that abolutely Like I think some people might hear, like, oh, don't you're just going to mooch off of your friends and family if you live in a tiny home, But I think we really viewed it as an opportunity for community and connection. It's you don't always get to living in a city or even a suburb. You don't get that kind of intimate connection with friends as soon as you, you know, hit your thirties. And for us, it was a time where we could really be an intentional community for six weeks, sharing meals together, working side by side, but still having our own separate dwellings. And so for us it was a gift. And like, yes, you did pay us a little bit of like rent money for the land, but we you know, we also would have you know, given it for free because for us, and we're just that type of people to like, we rented at our guest room on Airbnb for two years because we liked meeting new people and having them in our home. Like that's just like a or value of mine is community in that sort of way. Shocker, right, So like for me, it was a gift. And I think if you can find other people in your life who have a core value of community, like you could be giving them a gift as much as they are giving you a gift. Yeah, likewise, it was awesome for us just because it was coming from the north in the winter, so that was a gift and being able to park on your property. And I know we've talked about this before, but I'll say it again. The pandemic happened while we were parked there. We came down February not knowing what was about to hit us, and then the pandemic happened, and the North was experiencing it more into a heightened degree than the South was in the very beginning, and so hearing stories of our friends talking about what it was like outside Philadelphia versus our experience in St. Petersburg, so we just stayed for a little bit longer, which was so nice, and still keeping distance from people, but because we had already been together when we had like this built in bubble and the sharing meals was even better, Like we still were able to have friends and hang out and grilled together. So honestly, the beginning of the pandemic hold some fond memories in that regard. It was really awful. A lot of other We went to Disney the week before it shut down, like unknown that was to come. Yeah, in a heartbeat, I would absolutely do it again. Um, But I also think it's just because you and Eric are like the best people's well, we practically did move into your backyard by moving down to St. Petersburg in the house fifteen minutes from you, guys. So it worked. You really convinced us, and we're here now and and that you know, and I'm forever thankful for that

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