Michael Urie of Shrinking and Ugly Betty fame joined us and shared his storied career, from being booted from his Broadway debut to straight men discovering him in Shrinking. He laments the woes of auditioning and the awkwardness of announcing you went to Juliard. Plus, CaCee and Zach are watching Anatomy of a Lie and are enraptured by the national scandal. Zach and Donald debate how far is too far for Only Fans.
Hey guys, it's Zach Braf here. I just wanted to open the show and talk about merch because Donald and I always forget to talk about merch. And Christmas is coming up, and you know what your loved ones want, and you know what you want more than anything really is some good old fake doctors, real friends, merch. Most appropriately for Christmas, there's a Christmas ornament of me riding Donald Eagle style, not any other style, me riding Donald. It's a beautiful ornament. And I'm gonna tell you about everything else on here real quick. What you do is you go to Cottonbureau dot com and then just search for fake doctors cottonbureau dot com and then search for fake doctors. There's wrapping paper with our faces on it. There's a beach towel. There's a washcloth because you know, we like to talk about washcloths. There's three different T shirts. There's a pop socket for your phone of me eagling Donald.
Oh.
This is really cool. For those of you who have to wear a badge to work, particularly in the medical profession, there's a badge holder with our faces on it that has one of those pull out things for when you have to swipe your badge on things. I want one of those, and I don't even have a place to wear a badge. I see someone made a Queen Joel T shirt. I don't even know if that's through us or what, but ah this I see there's some like after marketing looking ones things, meaning we didn't make them. But anyway, there's cool stuff on you.
Oh.
Also, most importantly, there's a few of our legendary onesies left, but they're only small and medium. If you happen to be a smaller medium human being, you could get one of those limited edition onesies we made, which are pretty hilarious. That's it. Go check out the store. There's cool stuff for your Christmas, gift giving season, and Hanukah and Kwanza and any other holiday where you give presents. Okay, here's the show. I have a cold. Donald, I'm sorry.
Listen, I'm gonna tell you something. Guess what. I still love you even with your cold.
Let me tell you something you might let me tell you something. Let me tell you something. To be the worst time to be single ever is when you have a cold. Nobody's taking care of me. I got a leaf flower next door that I really want to go talk to mister leaf flower and say, bro, not today. I'm sick, I'm irritable, and your leaf flower, I believe the law is in LA you have to switch to electric.
It's time well electric. If you could smell it, it's a bad idea.
Smell it. It's so loud. Everyone's just blowing the leaves to each other's part.
Electric leaf flower is going to be really loud too.
No, they're not that bad.
I haven't. I know how loud that shit is listening. Okay, I can combat the motherfucking gardener next door. When they're blowing all the dust on me, I'm like, no, fuck you.
And that shit go outside.
I go outside and I see the neighbor's gardener is just blowing the leaf he's onto my property. And then the next day my guy comes and blows the leaves on his property.
I love it.
It's a what do they call Daniel cycle? A Sissaphian task.
Yeah, or or a borrow's a snake eating itself. But yeah, it could be fantastic. Was pulling on the rock up the hill, yeah, and that just.
It could just be a vicious cycle.
So when you get sick, does your level, like take care of you and make you soup and tell you she loves you and rub your back.
No, she's like, get the fuck away from me.
Oh that sounds not worth it. It's not.
Back and obey. When we were when we were first starting out, absolutely once the kids got there, was like, nah, you're not if it ain't if you're not sick, If you're not a sick child, I don't want to hear it.
So when you have a cold, you don't get any extra love and any any back rubs, any I got you babies.
No, I get that. Don't fucking touch me.
Wow, Okay, you're sick.
But she likes to get cuddled when she that's the only time. That's when I know she's sick. When she's like and she's trying to tries to cuddle up.
And that feels like me, are you sick?
Yeah, that's like me if I was at your house right now, that's what I'd be trying to do, trying to do, like what do you give me a little give me a little big spoon?
What are you sick of? Something?
You see that funny cartoon that guy drew us on Instagram?
What is it?
What you want do you want to meet in your head? Yeah, it's so funny. I want that on merch, except I don't like my nose. He really, he really did a number on my nose.
I like that as a picture in the house piece.
Yeah, I think I like that. If I could, if I could get him to reconsider my nose, I might like it on merch.
He should print it like thirty times and see how much he can get one for thirty two, for thirty three.
You know like that. He should do that.
Oh, I would argue, I would like him to talk. I would just like to give him some notes on my nose first before he does his limited edition prints.
Dude, it's a cartoon man. Look at the size of my forehead.
Come on, I know, but can you draw me with a big nose and not have it you that bad? So vain, I'm so vain that I'm like analyzing my nose on a caricature.
On one of the like on street art character too.
It's funny though, caricature caricature too. I finally got Casey to be texting me again because I found a good show for us to watch, A good watch, True Crime. There's my trick This is my trick with the faisons. I've given up on Donald's. He's not a good text friend.
I don't watch TV shots.
No, you also just like you don't reply, and.
Yeah I do, I reply haha or yeah.
This is what happens. I send Donald an he doesn't even write. He doesn't even it's a meme. He doesn't even write lol or heart it. He just reposts it on his ship like he found it right.
And all my memes are all of my memes that I post, like, if it's not stop motion animation, Zach probably sent it to me and look at it, but I look at it like you sent it to me, because you're like, I can't post this, but you can post.
No, they're not all like that, some of them. Well, first of all, you post more crazy shit than I post on my shit. I just send them to you to make you laugh. The reason only way I know that you laughed is that you repost them on your Instagram. Now you have a horrible text chat game. Well, Casey, the trick with her because she's got a lot going on with them kids and you is I get her into a good true crime show and then we text back and forth like, can you believe what she's doing.
Last night?
Eleven last night, like eleven thirty, she's texting me, Oh, I'm moving on to number episode two. I'm so mad at this bitch. Oh man, I'm like that sounds like my I'm gonna read I'm gonna read these texts in the morning.
So that's what you guys were watching. She didn't make it. Hold up, hold up, hold up, hold up.
Man, Zach what shows says? Oh, it's called it's so fucked up.
Hold on, I forget that we're on I forget that we're on TV. Now. She's not dressed, so never mind passed out. She didn't make it. She didn't make she didn't make uh, she didn't make it through five minutes into the second episode, I walked in there, She's like, ship, I fell asleep again.
Well, this is on television, so you gotta remember that. What's it called, well, titties is nice?
Are you making naked?
She's naked.
I have a shirt on, but I don't have a brawl on.
And you know I have gigantic tits and they're not gigantic.
But they are.
Well our viewers could use a little lie. Why are you framing yourself out. What is that?
I'm right here, I'm looking in that thing.
Well, give us a little something, okay.
Blurt bla.
What's the name of the show? I forgot it? It's called Lies? Anatomy of Lies?
What a crazy bitch?
It's I mean, Can I let me just say something, Zach, You and I watch so much stuff and nothing really surprises me or faces me. This I'm so pissed off. Yeah, every fifteen minutes of this.
Anatomy of Lies. It's on Peacock and it's a story of a Gray's Anatomy writer who turns out is has been lying about having cancer for over a decade, and she she does all these insane lies in her life and basically steals people's stories and then puts them in and make them, puts them into Gray's Anatomy episodes and says that they happen to her, and they get crazier and crazier and crazier, and then they finally catch her when this woman whose life I.
Haven't finished, I haven't finished.
It was an insane man into the second.
I know, but I don't like to I don't like to waste it.
All to him.
Okay, Jesus, it was this insane Vanity Fair article and then I guess Vanity Fair then turned it into a documentary. So it's it's it's it's only three episodes. Audience, you got to see this. It makes you scared to talk to humans. But you don't know.
First of all, not that I don't want to ruin it.
I don't spoil it for people.
Well, I got to say this one thing. How fucked up again? I've only got through one episode. How fucked up was it when that co writer confided in her and about her yeah story, Well.
Don't tell everyone. Yeah, her co writer, her co writer confides in her something else, Her co writer at Gray's Anatomy confides in her this tragedy that happened to her, and then she basically takes the story and puts it into her own episode and acts like, well, not that exact story, but basically just acts like she came up with it. Well, and it was her coworker's private story. I don't know it cants crazier and crazy and crazier by the way, you think you've seen crazy, you've only seen episode one.
I know, and you want to know something, Zach not to make this not to sidetrack, but this shit.
People are like this. I'm not going to name any names, but I had a friend, co worker or whatever that took one of my childhood stories and turned around and told it on a talk show like it was her own childhood story.
Oh my god, I'm just scared of these people who like live for for just I guess she was lying for attention or something.
No, they create their own reality. It even goes back to when she wrote the play in high school. Her parents show up to watch this play and the mom's like crying her eyes out because she's like, what the hell, Yeah, could never happened.
Yeah, I know somebody else. I know someone else who was dating someone jokes, sorry, I know someone who was dating someone. And and you know you, I think you know this this story too. But the whole his whole fucking life was a lie. Everything he said was a lie. Everything, and and and she couldn't she she couldn't fathom that she had been living with this guy. And it's one of those things where all of a sudden she starts googling and then fucking this comes in, and this comes in, and this, that's that's what happens to the to the wife in this story is all of a sudden, she starts going down a rabbit hole on Google and Twitter and Facebook and starts like putting the pieces together, like like like that movie The Usual Suspects. Yeah, and all of a sudden, she's like everything she's ever said is a fucking lie. It's insane, so scary, it's scary. I was texting with Casey last night. She's like, I'm glad I'm married and not out there dating. I'm like, I'm just kidding.
Stay married forever.
Seriously, all right, put your.
Husband back on. We gotta get them on there, all right, we gotta get going.
Okay, okay, one of the crazies.
I am crazy for what? Crazy?
Amazing?
Yeah? You married? Well, dude, you're so lucky. You're so lucky.
Hey, this is on TV.
This Why did she show I didn't see it.
I'm glad she showed her nipples and everything. She shook her titties in the camera.
Audience, You're so lucky. We're not blurring that. I'll send you the video.
Yeah, this podcast, she said, we need to fall back off the podcast.
The fallback that she becomes fans.
I guess she's only fans.
Would you be okay? If money were tight, if Casey started only fansing what she's.
Showing everything, is it?
Well, you can be the you can be the man though.
But I know, but then everybody knows would know it's me.
No, we can blur out your peep.
You blur out my peep. What it's not only fans if my peep's.
Blurred, Okay, I don't know. I saw the face. I saw this woman on Instagram and she was dancing in a house and she's like, I can't believe men pay me ten dollars a month and now now I have this house.
Yeah, that's how it works.
Good for her.
It's what are you willing to do? You know what I mean? And what are?
And what is?
And what is and what is? How far is taboo for you? Is too far for you?
Well, I'm not going to show peep. My only fans would be like me just catching like, oh, you.
Ain't making no money? Then you want to see me?
Do you want to see me? Just catch be like oh I got I got fucking my sore throat and I got my tennis elbow. Everybody would be like this, I wouldn't make month I.
Paid money for this ship.
I can show me that dick if you go on only Fans and you're not showing nudity. I know people do, but like sort of misleading.
Right yeah, I mean it's what look only Fans was made so that you know what this Maybe this is how I raised money for my stop motion short. Maybe I just go and show my dick a couple of times, you know what I mean?
Maybe that's I don't know how much you'd make, but I would definitely i'd subscribe.
So does that How is that how it works?
You need to have subscribe for a month, and then there's special features you got to pay extra for. So if I subscribe, you might just be like doing like like a turnaround looking at me like Nautalie but home like no, no, no, no, no no no, that's just like this is just like baseline stuff. You're just like giving me some flirty smiles. You're not showing the shafts for just a subscription. Then then you come on and you're like, hey, want to see my balls twenty bucks And then I'm like, yeah, I want to see them balls, so I paid.
That's how it works, Yeah, listen, I'm not gonna show my balls until I get to two thousand dollars.
I don't think that's the way it works. I think you say, like, you know, for twenty bucks, i'll show one ball. For forty bucks, you'll see two balls. So but for one hundred bucks, I'll stick this fucking lightsaber.
In me, am in me.
Really well, people are going to want you to perform. You can't just do nothing, can I Wow? I could be This could be a decent way for you to fund motion movie.
Though. It could be a decent when your acting career and certainly would suck up our T mobile campaign.
Definitely. I think would lose both.
But but you'd have to choose. You can have both.
The money. I think about the money, Zach.
Yeah, I don't think you're gonna make that much. I think it's a niche mark you dude.
My ass is fucking beautiful, and I'm sure it's beautiful.
A lot of a lot of you don't know.
What the people. How do people feel about it.
I'm sure there's a lot of gay men that would be intrigued, and straight women. I don't know how many straight women want to see your balls for money? But maybe I can. Dannel, what are your thoughts?
Survey says money, women out there, survey. Let's do a survey, Carmen.
There's car people. I'm sure there's plenty of people who would want to see Donald's balls.
Yeah, he's saying there's no women that want to see I'm.
Sure some they'd be women.
Are people? I'm sure he is no, no, no, he said no women.
I'm sure they're saying there are women.
I'm sure he said, be like men would want to see balls.
I'm sure there are women as well. Yeah, but Daniel, do you think the biggest percentage of the of the pie chart would be would be gay men?
I think the biggest pichart would be a straight scrubs fans man.
That's true, That's probably true, and I'm one of them. Is Michael you're here? Yes he is.
I'm not sure.
We made about a bunch of said he's a stormy.
Yeah.
Yeah, well hell well, hello, Hi, you got my wife.
The first thing she said to me, make sure you tell Michael. I said hello, because I guess I was inebriated.
I don't know if you remember, but I guess we spoke a lot at Christmas birthday party. We had like deep commo maybe you two did, and I was just standing there like this.
I think I we did talk a little bit, and I definitely talk to your wife more, but I sort of irish goodbye right after that.
Michael Urie, I'm so excited you're here.
Thank you.
I I have to confess to you something I didn't watch Ugly Betty. I didn't know how fucking funny you were until I met you on the set of Shrinking, and I think you are so fucking hilarious and talented. That is your introduction to the show.
That means a lot. Thank you. I didn't expect you to watch Ugly Betty. You're a straight guy?
Really? Is that?
Betty was Ugly Betty for the ladies and the gays?
I guess I would get all the time when that show was on. I would get the only straight people that would come up to me would say, my wife loves you or my daughter loves you. Now, straight guys come up to me all the time because of Shrinking.
Straight guys love you now because you're like the dream gay best friend like I have with Donald. Wait, so what was Ugly better? Just take us back? What was uly ugly Betty was your big break? I take it right.
Oh yeah, let's go back before that.
Okay, Donald, go back, Let's start at the very We finally have someone who appreciate It's musicals as much as we do on the show. Donald, I'll get every reference you'll get, He'll get every reference.
Bring them.
Oh yeah, well what about this one?
What was that bringing the noise, bringing the funk?
Holy?
Holy?
Was that? Actually? Was that actually a piece of tap? From bringing the noise?
I was trying to imitate a piece of tap.
In my world, it was like actually accurate tap. And Michael was like, oh, yeah, that's in the second act.
Oh that's so I got arrested. I got arrested for smoking pot in the street once and uh, that's a long story, but the punchline was that my friend I got arrested with a friend who who was working at the Public Theater, and they ended up getting us out. The Public Theater ended up getting us out much faster than we would have. And when they went to thank George C. Wolf and everybody at the Public for getting us out, they said, yeah, we had Savion Glover here, so we're used to Oh my.
God, yo, dude, who listen, this isn't and this isn't this isn't news or anything like that. The audience, you could they were smoking so much in that theater, and this theater is like at the bottom of a hotel or a big ass building. They were smoking so much weed in the dressing room when they were doing Noise Funk that the audience could smell that shit in the fucking auditorium. That's how much weed they were smoking before the show. Like my mom.
I remember, my mom said, I went and saw Noise Funk last night, and let me tell you something.
It was in there, I meaning.
The weed, Like that's what happens that month upon a mattress too.
Yeah, Michael, did you used to go see what was your introduction to so Theater in Broadway? Did you used to go see the shows as a kid.
Well, I'm from Texas, so I would see the tours in Dallas. I didn't come to New York until I was I guess I was seventeen. Right after I graduated high school. I came on a school trip like with my soon to be community college. But we would go to the big, big music hall at fair Fair Park in Dallas. Which is the big State Fair and and it was. It was the tour like so we'd see like the tour of Phantom and Cats and Le Miz. But occasionallyy would send in like some big some stars like Jerry Lewis came through and Dann Yankees and Tommy Toon came through in a show called Busker Rally that ended up not coming to Broadway, but it was so exciting to see Tommy Tooon. And then they brought in Ralph Maccio and had to succeed in business without really trying.
That's awesome and it was so good.
He was playing the Matthew Broaderick part, and and uh and Roger Bart, who is now a big Broadway start. He's in Back to the Future now and he's been in a million things. He was playing the villain Bud Frump. And I remember seeing that show and being completely blown away and thinking that I want that part. I want Bud Frump because he was Roger Bart was so good and it was and I'm not not really a singer, and I could I could sing that, I could do that, and I ended up getting to do that. Was the first Broadway show I ever did. Was how to succeed in playing that role. So I sort of like like, chase that all the way amazing?
So wait when you got it?
You know how that is when you get it, doesn't it feel like it's gratifying to finally get to that point because like you got there. But then afterwards, when after you were done, was it like all right, now what do I do?
What's next? What's gonna be what's going to be next? For me?
It is weird when you have like a dream like that and it comes true, like like, how do you I was just thinking about this, about this idea of like dream roles or or like you know, having these because because we do, what we do is something we like and like our work is also our love like and so it's this this sort of trap where you fall in love with something and saying, oh, I want that, I want to do that, I want to be I want to be in that, or I want to play that part, and if it doesn't come doesn't come to you, it doesn't happen. It's so sad, so much sadder than if it's a role that you don't really care about or a job that you don't really care about. And I was so lucky to have that. But I also when I got So this is a crazy story. Actually I ended up getting to do that show on Broadway, and it was my Broadway debut. But I was supposed to open it. It was a revival with Daniel Radcliffe playing the lead, and I was supposed to be in it from the beginning. And uh, for like six months I had this part. I'd done the workshop and I chased it and I got it, and and for six months I had this part. And then all of a sudden, they said one of the rights holders wasn't there that day, and you have to come and re audition.
Oh my god.
So it's like some so like so somebody's somebody's you know son who wrote the show. You know that their parents wrote the show. They suddenly decided they needed to weigh in, and I lost the job.
No what Yeah, And.
I the director and all the producers and everybody wants you, and you've done the workshop and you're yeah, and you're set to go. And then one of the children of the rights holders says note about you.
Yeah, said no to me, And so I lost the job. And it was devastating. I found out I was getting on a plane to go to the UK and do this a little movie and like the Fringe Festival. I had this whole cool like UK summer planned, and then I was going to get back and go into rehearsal for my Broadway debut. And suddenly it was like it was taken from me. But guess who it was. It's so so the guy who wrote the people who wrote How to Succeed a Business are Frank Lesser and Abe Burrows, and Frank Lesser's widow, Joe Lesser, had approved me. But a Burrow's son is James.
Burrows, the famous sitcom director.
The famous sick the guy who Burrows Jimmy Burrows, the guy who directed Cheers as Friends, all Friends and Will and Grace and Fraser and all the great stuff, all the greats.
Wow, he's the guy.
He Yeah, So that must have been a mind fuck for you. It wasn't it Like, it wasn't just like somebody's kid. It was a famous director.
It was like a yeah, like a name I had seen over and over and over again my entire life, and somebody I had aspired to work for. And it was really really hard and really devastating.
How did you get over that. I mean, we must be hurtling. Yeah, that's hurting my heart as a fellow actor right now.
It was really hard. In fact, there's a there's a shoe sign shoe shine stand in JFK that I sat in and cried when I found out because I was on my way to the UK, and I sat in the shoeshine stand and cried. And I still see it from time to time when I met JFK and I think, oh my gosh, that's where so yeah, where it is again, dude.
Began I drive by the Ralphs where I would buy the foot long sandwiches for lunch and dinner, and I go, I remember you, Ralphs.
I bet you that foot long don't hit like it used to. Though, bro, I.
Don't eat them rous foot longs anymore.
Donald, like they don't hit like they used to.
Jimmy Burrows wishes you could hire Michael Uri now.
Donald, Jimmy Burrows is like Jimmy Burrows is like this motherfucker went from like, hold up, you got a story. So I'm gonna let you say, well, well, I ended up working with Jimmy.
I got a job that Jimmy was doing I got a series that Jimmy directed, and and I didn't bring it up. I never brought it up. He knew I was in the show because I so. Anyway, later later, and how did you venture the show? The show ran for a year, this this great guy named Christopher Hankey, and it wasn't like it was between us. It was I was mine to lose, and I lost it. And then they went back and found this great actor, Christopher Hanky, and he did it with Daniel Radcliffe. They did it for a year and then they decided to keep it going with some new actors. Nick Jonas and bow Bridges came in and they said, you're You're, You're, You're, You're in. And I was like, what about what about Jimmy Burrows And they're like, we don't care, We're not even asking him this time. And I got to do it and it was my Broadway debut and it was an amazing experience. It was it was fabulous.
And while I was.
Doing it, I got a pilot for Max Muchnik and David Cohen and it was directed by Jimmy Burrows. And I got the audition and I was like, guys, why I can't audition for this. Jimmy Burrows hates me. I can prove it. He hates me. And I lost this job and they said no, no, no, just go, just go just audition, and I got it and I was too scared to mention it to him. I never mentioned it to him, but he knew I was in the show and he asked me about it. So we talked about the show, and he talked about like the history of the show, but he never brought up that awkward.
I mean, I understand I wouldn't have brought it up either.
Yeah, yeah, I mean, yeah, what are you going to say? Yeah, you fired me, bro.
I say, you made me cry in a JFK sh shinebox.
Yeah, I'll show you next time we're there.
Hey, Jimmy, go get you shinebox.
Yeah.
But I love Jimmy. I mean I loved him so much. I had I had the best time.
I don't love Jimmy. Jimmy came to visit the Scrub set. Do you remember that Donald?
Oh no, I don't remember.
He is his kids, and I assume he loved it, and uh, And they came and had a tour one day and we were all like, oh my god, it's Jimmy Burrows.
You know, the only time I've ever gotten fired from something was Will and Grace and freaking he was directed, my god, and that's the one time I ever got fired. I didn't even make I got to the table read and then to the first day of rehearsal, and by the end the first day of rehearsal, I was out of there.
I was doing what were you doing? You did they tell you what they didn't like about you? What you're doing?
No, they didn't say anything. I just got fired.
I didn't even I was supposed to be the love interest with Deborah Messing and she was never even on set with me, so I never even had to We've never even had the opportunity to create any type of chemistry or anything.
And when you saw Doulay Hill do it, how did you feel that?
Well, you know it was Donald Glover who got No. Was it to lay Hill? I don't know. At that point. At that point, I was like, oh, well, fuck Will and Grace, then don't I'll never watch this show ever again.
Dude, we have we have a gay guest. Please don't say you can't say Willing Grace around me.
I'm sorry, let's take a break.
We'll be right back after these fine words. Michael, you went to Juilliard. Correct, that's real, Like, that's not that's not a typo. You went to Juilliard?
No, okay, now let me ask you a question.
How come I can't fucking finish my question because I was a question. Let me tell you how I do my interviewing a statement and he acknowledges it, and then I go in for a question.
Okay, for your question. I thought that was your question because I was starting in the paragraph I was. You said that you went to Juilliard, and then he said, yeah, I went to Juilliard.
I'm going to say something now I don't know. Go ahead, dickhead, Michael, you went to Julie was the What was that like? And did you enjoy your experience? Do you feel it's contributed to you being so successful as you are?
Well, I had a really good experience. Not everyone does, but I had a really, really good It was really right for me. The age that I was, I was a sponge and just wanted all the information and all the to learn every thing. And I was I was encouraged to audition by somebody. I was going to this community college. And I was perfectly happy that I had shitty grades in school and and I didn't think I had what it takes to be an actor. So I was in this community college, still trying to figure it out, and somebody said you should audition for Julliard and I was like really, and they were serious. They were like, no, you really should. That place is for you. And so I did. I That's the only school I auditioned for for, you know, like Conservative training, Conservatory training, Conservative Training, That's where I learned how to be a conservative. No Conservatory Training. I didn't go audition anywhere else. And I got in. I mean I auditioned and I got in. And then suddenly I had to move to New York and and get a bunch of student loans and figure out how to be a New Yorker. And but the second I stepped foot in New York, I felt like I was at home. It was like this is this is where I belong and and and and the school was is exactly what I wanted. It was very rigorous. You're you're in class all day and night, and you I lived at the dorm the first year, and I lived nearby the other years. And you become like a family.
Your your your.
Classmates, and you become like a family, and you do everything together. You eat and and and study and rehearse and take class together, and uh, it was great.
Was it very competitive? Did you when you were there, did you feel like, oh my god, some of these people are fucking brilliant and I'm and I'm and I I aspire to be that good or did you feel like, wow, I think i'm I respect my peers, but I think I might be pretty good. What was your what was your heads?
Interesting? That's an interesting question because it's it's not actually competitive when you're there, and because you don't audition once you're there. Once you're there, they give you the parts and and and you just get placed and things, so that it's pretty well, it's pretty even. Everybody kind of has a lot to do. And then at the end, in the fourth year, it starts to like when agents start to come and you know, people get jobs and stuff, it starts to get a little bit weird. But I definitely there were I definitely thought I didn't think I was among the best, but I but I thought I I thought I got why I was there. I was like oh, I see, I see why I'm part of this group because it's not it's not necessarily how do I say this delicately, It's not like the best actors in the world. It's the actors that fit the Juilliard training and that that could be good theater actors and could be viable theater actors. So like occasionally a movie star somebody with move Like when I was there, Jessica ches Dain was in my class, and she was like pretty clearly a movie star, like we could tell she was also amazing at theater. She's good at everything. But then there are other actors that are like, oh, totally theater actors there. They're meant the theater, they'll build, they could be in any Shakespeare play and they could do all that. And while I was there, Oscar Isaac he was two years behind, two or three years behind me, And that was when he came. That's when I was like, oh, that is a movie star. He's like he's got that star quality. But that's not really what they're about necessarily. Sometimes they get in, sometimes those kinds of people get in, but it's really about like making you like a chameleon in the theater and being able to be able to do all kinds of different theater.
Check off.
It's more theater based than sort of screen acting.
Yeah, we do very little that they do it more now.
I think when I was there with very little.
You guys are a lot of television. There's a lot of you guys in television too.
Yeah. Yeah, they've gotten There used to be a thing when you got out of Juilliard where everyone in the business poo pooed you. They said, you're gonna need three years to get rid of the Juilliard thing before you're a real actor, and it is, and I think now it's a little bit different. I think they're better about giving you classes. In fact, you know, at the end of school there's like a showcase where you do you do scenes for agents and managers and stuff, And up until my class, they only did them in New York. And then Jessica Chastain lobbied the school to have us do our showcase in LA and we were the first class to do that.
Wow.
And so we all got LA agents too, and met LA casting directors and ever since then they all do that. So I think the school has evolved some. But when I was there, it was really like about about doing theater, about going you know, like trying to be in regional theater, doing Shakespeare, doing Chekhov, things like that.
So that's why all Juilliard graduates when you ask them, yo, so what school did you go to? And they go Juilliard, the response is so hesitant. It's always the hesitant. What kind of person you're going to be an ad about this? Are you're gonna be or you're gonna be cool about it?
Wait, what do you mean? Because you think donald, because you think what do you mean?
I understand, well, Julliard is such a prestigious school for actors, you know what I mean. And so when you meet someone that went to Juilliard, it's like, oh shit, you were able to get first of all, all of us auditioned for Juilliard. If you really fucking let's keep it one hundred. I didn't really Well, most people I know that were into acting, they auditioned for Juilliard and didn't get in and then didn't say anything to anybody else about it. For that shit, I didn't get in, I'll keep it to myself. It's like motherfucker's audition for the Mickey Mouse Club didn't get in and didn't tell anybody I auditioned for the Mickey Mouse Club too. You know what I'm saying.
But when you meet when you meet people that went like when I meet somebody that went to Juilliard, the first thing I think of is do you think you're better.
Than me because you went to Juilliard? Or are you fucking an actor who's out here trying to make it happen like everybody else. That's the first thing, right.
The second thing I think is, is my response gonna turn you off so much that you're you're now freaking you you have your guard up against me because you're afraid of how I'm going to respond to the prestigious school that you went to.
And so you know what I mean.
That's kind of the way that ladder. The ladder is kind of how I always feel. I always feel a little bit embarrassed to say that I went to Juilliard because it's it's like you know, it is, it is prestigious. It was amazing. It did set me up for so much. But like a lot of the people that I went to school with left the business, like a lot of people don't don't make it even at Juilliard and and you know or or like. The tricky thing about Jilliard is like, because it's Juilliard, people don't People often don't pivot. And I think, you know, I think there's so many ways you can be in this business besides being on screen or on stage. And I think that if I hadn't made it as an actor, I would have pivoted. I would have done something else. I would have become a you know, like you know, a producer.
Or That's what I was saying about my experience is that I I just wanted to work in film and TV and theater, and if I didn't didn't if I couldn't find a way to make a living as an actor, I was going to do some other job in production, on set, backstage something. I just like being in the space of it all.
Yeah, you know what I mean. Yeah, I think I think some people from Juliard they think, gosh, I should be an actor because I went to Julliard, and I can't do anything else.
You can, mind you, it could totally mind fuck you because of that, because of the press, stage behind it and stuff.
Do you remember your audition, Donald, I did some bullshit. Yeah, like I wouldn't do.
Your dance from bringing the noise bringing No, I didn't.
I did so, Look I did. I did so.
When I was a kid, my parents were in this uh play at the National Black Data called The Ritual or something like that, and it was based on pretty much Earth and the people of Earth, right, And there was a small paragraph in the in the play.
And I would go around and I did it everywhere.
I did it from junior high school all the way to like I didn't go to college, but for every audition I went out for, for high school and for college, I did this audition. It didn't I didn't get much of it, but it was what if we did not come from Africa.
But to Africa? Think about that? What if we did not come from Africa but to Africa? What if a million years ago? Shit, I forgot it.
We weren't we weren't going to ask you to perform the model anyway.
It's literally it's there's only like, there's literally only two more lines to it. What if a million years ago?
That was the whole audition?
Pretty much?
And you should have had me coach you. I mean, I don't think that's.
It didn't get me into anything.
But Michael Urry's going in there like to be or not to be, and you're like, what if we come from earth?
Exactly? Exactly exactly.
It's a brain teaser, right exactly.
And so it worked on some things.
It worked for certain auditions, but they were looking for substance and stuff.
They were like, motherfucker, come on, be like good.
I bet it worked on this. I bet it worked on this.
Line.
That's Donald and a Folders commercial.
Michael, it didn't work on that one either.
But did you just do that or did you have a no?
That was it?
Like?
That was?
That was pretty much it like it's that.
I didn't know. I didn't know any better. It's like coming out to Los Angeles. If you're not.
Prepared, you you could freaking fall apart here. Like so you know, Michael, you got on the line, your publicist was on the line to protect you and stuff like that. That's a fucking you were prepared for this, for this podcast today. When I came out to LA I wasn't prepared. I wasn't prepared for any other ship. Came out here on a whim. I made some money, Let's fucking.
Go, you know what I mean? I didn't. I didn't know the business. I didn't know any of that.
So that's how.
It's hard to learn that the business part of acting is way easier than the business.
That's well said.
I agree, well done, well done.
Yeah, it's a hard thing to figure out, this billness.
It's still I still don't understand it.
Yeah, but now we have changing But now we have people that are in our lives to support us and stuff like that, and you can always tell oh, you're not really and and we now have the power in the autonomy to say to motherfucker shoe, you're not really for me. You can go I'm gonna find somebody else, you know what I mean. When you first get out here, you don't have that type of power.
You don't have that type of control of your career like that where you can say you know what, fuck you man, you don't see my vision and then be like, you know what, You're right, I don't see your vision.
I'm gonna move on to something else. You get kicked out of the business for shit like that.
Yeah, I agree with you, Michael, that acting is when you finally get a job and you get to acts of the easiest part. It's navigating all the other Michigans and uh and bullshit and uh and and and trying to keep the thing going. That's the hard part.
Yeah, And like auditioning and wanting you know what, Zach, there is a line reading in Garden State when you say to George C. Wolf, wait, is it to George? He's your boss?
And George Wolf, for those who don't know, is a very very famous theater director. He used to run the public theater and he's now a film director. And he gave me the very first part in Macbeth out after Northwestern at the public show he was directing. And so when I when I made Garden State, I said, will you do a cameo as as the as the manager of the restaurant where I work.
He's so good at that too.
He's the one for those of you're listening and recall, he's the one who's holding up the headshots of the people that are going to get my job if I'm late, And I'm like, what were you going to say?
Though, Well, there's a it's not it's not him, it's somebody else, asks you what you're up to. I forget who it is. Maybe it's maybe it's Jackie Hoffman. Somebody, somebody in your life is like, so, what's going on?
What are you up to?
And you say, you know, auditioning something like that. And it was the truest thing I had ever seen. I remember, because I was probably doing that when I saw the movie. I was probably like, you know, saying that exact thing to people when they said what are you up to? And I remember thinking that that is the most authentic line read and actress ever given.
That was my truth. I was. It was method acting.
Yeah.
But so Michael, when you get out to LA, how long were you out here before you got Ugly Betty? How did that come out?
Well? I got Ugly Betty in New York. Actually I was so I got out of Juilliard and three and I stayed and I tried to get and I thought, I thought, oh, I'll be in every I'll be in every Shakespeare play, and you know that's what I'll do. I'll go be in regional theaters and do and I and I was getting it. I got a little bit of that, but it was like I was doing like basement stuff and good work, really cool work, but I was working in I wasn't getting you know, the Shakespeare parts I thought I was going to get. I wasn't getting you know, regional theater. I wasn't even getting appointments for.
Stuff like that.
And and I would get a commercial here and there. And then I was doing a play in a basement, this really cool Jacobean tragedy called the Revenger's Tragedy, and I was playing a character that was the version we were doing. I was playing this very like kind of evil David Bowie, looking kind of a guy. And this the great casting director, Will Cantler came and saw me, and I knew him. He did he I think he'd cast me in a commercial. And he stopped me in the lobby afterwards and and said you were great. And I was like great, okay, and I put you know, I filed that away. And I was getting the breakdowns illegally back then, you know, you could like get on a list or whatever and get the breakdowns. And I saw that Will Candler was casting this pilot and there was a one line description for this character, bitchy gay assistant.
And I was like, I can do this.
I can do that. And I told my people, my you know, my agent, my manager at the time, I was like, will Candler likes me and I and I think he just want me to do something kind of like this, and I bet I could get this appointment. At that time, I was, I bet I could get an audition. And and at the time they were they were like, we don't want you to do this because it was a co star, you know, like not a guest star, not a series regular. It was a co star. And they didn't want me to do it. And what is the different, Well, co stars like no money and no, no, you know, it's like a guest star.
You were a co star meeting, you'd be in every episode, but you weren't gonna get you weren't going to get paid like a Reich series regular.
No not not, no guarante of every episode, just like in fact, the idea was that my so I was Vanessa Williams assistant, and the idea was that she was such a tyrannical boss. She had a new assistant every episode. And I was fine, was like, whatever, I just want this job. I think this is a job I can get. I need the money. I need a job. And and and they wanted they wanted to aim higher. They were like, you should try to be a series regular. You should try to be at least a guest star. This is this is a terrible money. We won't make any commission. Blah blah blah blah.
And I was like, while, You're like, I need the fucking money, and they're like, no, We're going to hold out for you to get a lead. It's like, bro, I need money.
And I was like, I could get this. This is a job I could get. I feel like this is a this is And so they finally got me the appointment. And I had a couple of auditions and then and then I got it, and and I showed up on set and Vanessa Williams was completely awesome, and she I had this idea that my character was obsessed with her, So I was always blocked right behind her, and I would just kind of like be here. I would do I would do anything she did. So she would turn and I would turn and and and and she didn't know I was doing it. And somebody, like some somebody a makeup artist or a costume designer or some costume person said they took her aside and they were like, you know what that queen's doing behind you? She's like what said. She's he's like doing you. He's like, he's like mocking you. Behind you.
Oh no.
And she came over to me and she's like, I hear you're doing me behind me. And I was like, I'm fired. Fuck, I'm fired. And I said, yeah, I am, and she goes.
That's great. What else can I do that you can do?
And so then suddenly I'm pitching her physical physical moves. She said, I can and and and then she's like, stand closer, you'll be in the shot. She like knew what the sho I didn't know where the shots were. She was like, if you stand closer, you'll be in the shot. And by the end of the pilot shoot, they brought me in to be in the cast photo. So and then they decided not to have her have a new assistant every week, and I was and I was in every episode.
That's amazing. I know a lot about her character.
Yeah. That and she's very very smart.
She can recognize the talent and say all right, look, well let's run with Let's run with what you got, because if.
You have someone was trying to someone was trying to make her threatened by where she was like, no, that's a good bit, let's lean in.
Go, let's go.
Yeah, you think about you know, actors who would be too insecure to do something like that, or think like, no, that's not the story is about me, not about.
Or be judged, or or just take the gossip as gospel and just go, oh, he's working with you, Like that's what he's doing at all right right now for finding an angle though, because you got to find an angle always.
That Yeah, well, thank you, Yeah, that was I was. I was just going for it. I was like, whatever, whatever I can do, I'm gonna I'm gonna make a million choices. I'm going to you know, try to try to try to make it make a mark.
And how long did the show go.
We did four years, four seasons. It was. It was a really amazing experience and and a lot of us on that show were brand new. We had you know, had there was several of us who'd not done anything. And then we had a few people like Vanessa Williams and Tony Plana who played Betty's dad, and Judith Light who were these vets that were incredible and and there were no two of us that were the same. Like it was one of those shows like shrinking, where there's nobody alike on the show, so there's no competition at all. Ever, we were always we were always like totally a family, and it was right away a hit. It was like a really popular show right away, like kind of tapped into something that people wanted to see at the time. And America won all the awards. And because we had Judith and Tony and Vanessa who had all been through so many shows, you know, they'd all done shows and had lots of experience in Hollywood and doing showbiz. They they made sure we knew how special it was, and none of us ever took it for granted. And it was really happy, a really happy set, and we were doing We're doing cool work, you know. I mean, I had this amazing episode where I came out to my mom. Patty Lapone played my mom, and I had been in the closet to her and I came out to her and she didn't accept me and she turned her back on me, and it was really powerful and it made a big deal. I mean, I just got I got a tweet just the other day from someone saying, ugly Betty helped me come out of the closet and it went well, and like people are still like it's still doing it.
A big difference for a lot of people who who were looking up to that character.
I think, yeah, I think it was really good writing and and a character that he was. He was like mean on the show. But then like when they let me have, you know, a personal life, you saw that there was something underneath that, and I think that sort of disarmed people. They thought, oh, this is a funny, you know, bitchy, mean guy, and then like, oh, actually that's that's cover for what you know, what what what has been hurting him all these years?
And it really is a really blessing. It really is a blessing. Man, When you really look at it, it's like you just wanted to audition because you know.
I think I could do that. Shit, I think I could do that. But then it turns into oh, this is setting.
You up for a nice fucking career man a night, This is setting you up for the experience that you were looking for. This is making you making your dream come true. And all you were really trying to do is I just want to get into a pilot. To be honest with you, yeah, you.
Know, absolutely I've been I would have been happy if if that was it, I didn't expect it to get picked up. I didn't expect them to could keep me. And I just was like, great, i may make my three thousand dollars and then I'll go, you know, back to my life and haven't have a new credit on my resume. And then it changed my whole life, totally changed my life.
Let's take a break.
We'll be right back after these fine words. Let's talk about shrinking, because I know.
You guys, you guys kind of got to talk about it.
Well.
I want to talk about shrinking because this will air. I don't know when this will air, but the episodes of season two that I've directed are are came out both this week and the next one, and episode four comes out next week. And I just I know I'm biased because I work on the show, but I love the show. I'm such a genuine fan of the show. And Michael, I have to say, working with you, it's just so much fun. You make me laugh so much. I love watching you, you know, vacillate between being extremely hilarious and and and and silly to the serious dramatic stuff you get to do in in episode four, in particular, but I never asked you how it came about, how you got the part and what was the experience like.
Well, first of all, thank you, and I did. I just want I'm watching them in order this year. I haven't. I've only seen the first three. I'm watching them as they air because I don't know why. That's just what my partner and I decided to do.
But I I just watched three.
It's so good, Zach, thank you.
It's such my god.
Those two back to back scenes where Luke and Lukeita both lose their tempers was very upsetting. It's so moving, and it was a really good episode.
Yeah, and four is Uh is a banger? Four is Uh? Four is one of those special ones Bill Bill. Bill always gives me really good stuff because he trusts me, and we have we have a history from me directing scrubs where he would always give me sort of the big ones. And I love that when I come on drinking. But you know, eight, Season one, episode eight was a really sort of special episode and and so I love that I get to get to do it. But tell me, tell everyone your your sort of origin shrinking, because it was a very I'm sure everyone wanted, uh this part with this cast Harrison Ford and Jason Siegel and and everyone.
Well, when I auditioned, and I didn't know, I knew Jason was doing it, I didn't know Harrison was doing it. So I only knew that, you know, Bill, Jason, and Brett, those three names, and that was very exciting to me. I was I was watched, I had watched or was watching Ted Lasso, and of course knew Jason's work, and and I had met Jason one time and he was very you know, like at a weird big you know, TV, CBS something or other, and he was very nice to me, and I remember thinking, oh, well, he seems like a really good guy. And they sent me the pilot script or the first episode. I guess it wasn't a pilot. They sent me the first episode script, which my character's not really in. You see him across the street.
But he's not really you're in the pilot. I forgot that.
Yeah, So I so that script was so good, and then I get my sides were basically all of my scenes from the second episode. But I didn't get the second episode, so I see what this show is going to be like, which is funny and sad and so good. And then I see this character that's going to show up later somewhere later, and it's you know, all these I had it hilarious scene, this scene where I burst into his office and I chew him out, this scene where I'm pretending to be a real lawyer or we're pretending to be a criminal lawyer. And then the great moving scene where we were playing pickleball and we get into the fight and we say love, I love you and all that stuff. So I was like, oh my gosh, this guy's have all of these things. And I knew I could tell based on the script. I was like, he's his motto is everything goes my way. He seems to be this plucky, happy, you know, happy happy dude, but there's going to be something else. The other shoe will eventually drop. I can tell that they're not going to just have some surface character in here. And I didn't know anybody involved. I had met Jason that one time, but you know, he wouldn't remember and didn't didn't had never, had never met anybody, and so it was just like this audition that came my way, and I made a tape in my room with Ryan, my partner read red opposite me and sent it off and and I've gotten pretty good at forgetting about it, you know, you like make it.
You said it a long time because this is after COVID, that's right, holy shit, So this is also the new wave of auditioning too, right right there.
It was it a long time because I always find it's frustrating when you do something and it's a you're proud of the tape you put in, and then it's one thing to be like, you're not right, they're going to go with so and so, or they're they're talking about it they like. But then sometimes you just don't hear and you're like, I didn't even hear negative or positive. It's been fucking a.
Month, right, Yeah, it was that. It was that I didn't hear anything for a while, and I and I did kind of. I was busy. I was doing a play, so it was like I was keeping busy, and you know, it was also such a good job that I it's sort of like it was easier to let like.
When did shrinking come back? When did shrinking started?
I mean start?
Yeah, I forgot that was probably twenty two, I guess it was like spring of twenty two, maybe maybe winter into the spring of twenty twenty two. It was when I auditioned.
Were you doing plays before COVID happened? Also? Was that?
Yeah, So I was doing a lot of plays after Ugly Betty. I came back to New York and did a ton of plays, and I was, you know, I was able to get a lot into a lot better rooms and do some like serious cool work because had success because I was on TV. Yeah, and and so this play, this is a really cool play about William Shakespeare. My friend Talene Monahan wrote this hilarious play for my partner and me. We read it during the pandemic. We did like on zoom. We would read it and it was the idea was and this is based on a true thing. William Shakespeare wrote king Lear in Quarantine during the Black Plague. So she wrote a play about it, a comedy about it. That he was like stuck in quarantine with an idiot apprentice from his theater company and he wrote king Lear. And so that's what the play is, and it's so funny. So we were doing that play and that's why I have a beard and shrinking actually is because I had a beard as William Shakespeare. That's then when I got it. Yeah, so I was kind of preoccupied doing this play and the job seemed such a good job that I was like, all right, that's that's a if that happened, that would be more than amazing. So I'm just gonna pretend like it, pretend like it's it's not happening, and and and and and forget about it. And quite a while.
I feel like it was like a month.
That went by and and my agents were like, let's set up a call. We have an update about that show. It was called Pinch then, or that was the code name. We have an update about Pinch. And I was like, okay, great, oh yeah, what's that about? Yeah right, that show? Okay cool, And we got on the phone. I got on the phone with my reps and they were like, well, there's They were like, there's interest in Pinch.
We'll get back to you. And I was like, oh okay.
And then they got on the phone they were like, well, we really thought this was going to go to a test deal. And I was like, oh gosh, what happened And they're like, well, they just offered it to you.
What kind of agency are you with? And so suddenly like I got that's awesome.
Man.
It was such a And I never met anybody. I didn't have to, and I thought I would have to read.
Never even FaceTime with Bill.
No, I met Bill.
He knew, he knew, he just knew.
Yeah, I remember I got to the table right.
I would never cast somebody without talking to them. I mean, even if your audition was amazing, I would just wanted to see your personality and shoot the ship with you. Bill was like, no, him.
I wonder you know later I later I did find out, because at the time I didn't know. I didn't think I knew anybody involved. And then and then up until basically the first day, I thought I knew nobody on the show. But then it turned out Brian Gallavan, who you know, Zach.
Is one of our one of the writers on the show.
I had done a pilot for him a few years earlier, so I imagined that he vouched for me as like you know, like and.
And but well everyone does recon.
You've been in business, Yeah, I say, you've been in the business long enough. You have a reputation. Everybody knows what's your reputation. Yeah, I'm sure they did.
Everybody, everybody who's been doing this a little while does recon because they're like, all right, he's a good actor. What's his vibe? Like, yeah, what's ruin my set with this diva attitude?
And the first thing Bill said to me, well to all of us, was well it was for the table We've got there for the table read, and I met everybody for the first time. Hello, nice to meet you, Harrison Ford, Nice to meet you, Krista Miller, Nice to meet you, Jason Siegel, and Chris Has said, my husband thinks you're very funny. And I was like, oh, that's really good. And then uh, and then we were at the door, we about to go in for the table read, and Bill came out. And that was the first time I met Bill, and he said, all right, nobody gets fired off my shows after table reads, just so you know, go in there and have a good time. And we did.
It's not who got fired, who got fired. Nobody's control.
If people get fired, even though he's the all powerful Bill Lawrence, if the networks like, nope, you get fired, it does happen. The best advice, the best advice we can give you is.
Michael got the part on a tape audition? Bro like that.
I'm we have advised young actors on this podcast before that when you make it to the table, read don't still got to go in, don't make you think, don't think auditionings over.
No, that's that that that that is the final audition right then and there.
No, not even then right.
Comes on television?
Made it listen Bill, Bill's fired people that fucking shot three episodes and like it's not working. Replace the character.
So you know, yeah, I mean yeah, I've been in sitcom run throughs where people got fired or you know, like that thing where they're like, oykay, the network is going to discuss everybody sequester yourselves in your dressing room and you have to like wait in there and find out.
If you're ask Eric, it's about back to the future.
In the future, asked Charlie. She about two and a half men.
That motherfucker did eight seasons and they're like, you know what, too much?
That was eating.
You can't take it anymore?
That was that was that was eating.
They made it eight seasons. They made eight seasons out of it.
Though, who was the star of Apocalypse now got replaced Danel and you must know that who.
By Martin Sheen, the guy who was playing.
She replaced him. I forgot who was the lead George C.
Scott, George Wolf, George George.
George Wolf was the lead in who was that? It was Harvey Kayitel Harvey k.
Wow. Imagine walking around with that for a while.
They shot a bunch of the movie and Francis Ford Coppola was like, this isn't right and replaced him.
Same thing happened. Eric steltzwe back to the future.
There's some movie that Robert de Niro got fired from. This is recently, like in the last ten years, and that he didn't he like didn't know his lines or something. And the director had a long shot like a pan or a push, like a long push that he and he needed he needed it to happen in one and Denier didn't know his lines. And at the end of the day the producer was like, all right, you can, we can fire him. I'll do it. I'll fire him, and the director was like, no, I'm going.
To do it. Oh my god. Do you know what movie it was?
I don't know, I don't remember, but I want to say, oh, that great actor replaced him. It wasn't a big it wasn't a big movie, but it was that cool actor.
Anyway.
It was Yeah, so.
Shrinking is is so good and you have such great chemistry with with everyone, and you really have good chemistry with the guy. I'm sorry, I forgot his name? Who plays your lover?
Oh?
Yeah, Devinka Oka's He's He's wonderful and we we go back. We actually knew each other. I didn't. They came to me and they were like, this is the guy we're thinking of casting. I think just to make sure I didn't hate him, and I was like, I know.
Him, I love him.
We we we have a bunch of friends in common, and so I knew him and we even during the pandemic. We were part of a Zoom game of Mafia.
Does Maia work on.
We? We would like it would like chat. You would like like we have private chats?
Uh?
Like I think on Zoom you can do like like group chats and private chats. And so it was like that, and there was one person was the host, and it was fun. It was fun for a while, and then after a while I was like, we can't really lie to each other. Anymore we've gotten too close.
Well, the cast is really great. Everyone should check out Shrinking. And now you're doing Once Upon a Mattress on Broadway with the legendary Sutton Foster. You know I have a connection to the show two ways. I did the show in camp. I played Dauntless, which is your car stage at the stage stage Man. That's how I've been able to sing to you some of your I went to see the show.
And of course have you heard of stage door manor Michael Yes from Zach Actually remember you telling me about it?
Hey, you heard of stage or matter before me?
I must have heard of it. But like the year of my real that's how I really learned.
Oh, I just thought being in New York and Broadway, someone would have brought it up to you before.
He got there when he was seventeen young.
But just it's in those guys to people are talking about things. Anyway. I did a play with Sutton Foster as well with Bobby Kinavali and Eric Rainer, and she was a dominatrix and I really love her, and she was always so kind to my father. My father, my late father was very very into Broadway and Sutton for those who don't know Sutton Foster. She is one of the most beloved Broadway stars there is, and she was always so loving and kind and able to receive my father's adoration. And I just I had a wonderful time coming to see your show when I come back. When I came backstage to see you, it was not great to see you, but also Sutton was so nice and mentioned my father, and it made me feel nice.
She is really really good person, Like, yeah, she's amazing on stage, I mean amazing, but like she makes you feel like you're the most important person in the room, which is and I think she means that, Like she really really is engaged and caring and filled with love and energy. But as you know, being on stage with her is it's like it's like it's like beyond living, like there's something super nova. She's like, she's like it's it's like an electricity.
That that that.
I remember, you know, when I was a kid going to see Tommy Tuone at the fair Park Music Hall, being way up in the balcony, I could see his face even though I was three blocks away. I think Sutton has that quality. There's a reason why she's a Broadway star, and that she's in musical after musical, and and it's that that wattage. It's just bigger than than she.
Does it all. I mean, she can. She's very funny.
She's been one.
She was on television for a really long time. She had five seasons on a show on TV Land. Like she's got she's got skills.
She's not. You know, it ain't she ain't on broad but she hasn't. It's not she doesn't get these Broadway roles. Uh, by luck. It's for a reason. Did she got the talent?
Yeah?
And this show is filled with Broadway legends. We've got Broke, who I know you worked to and I love him. And Daniel Breaker, who plays the Jester. He was two years ahead of me at Juilliard and he is like my hero. And he is an incredible stage actor. Think he's an incredible actor. He starts the show, he opens the show with this wonderful like lullaby and the audience he has the audience in the palm of his hand, and a lot of what he does in the show, a lot of what he says, he's sort of made up himself. He's sort of like come up with and it's just completely unique. No one's ever done it like that before.
The show is bizarre, but very funny. It's such a weird show.
It's a weird show. I think that's because of the way that it was created. It was made at a camp, like an adult camp. In the camp for adults where adults would go used to go in the in the fifties, and it was a place where singles could go and meet people. But the camp would hire performers to entertain the campgoers, and they they would hire a cast, and they would hire creatives to put on shows, reviews or whatever. And they brought Mary Rogers and the other writers of this show one year and somebody said, let's do the Princess and the Peak, and they had and they wrote the show around the actors they had. So there was an actor who couldn't sing and and really couldn't dance, and so they were like, well, let's let's let's write him this a mute character and everything he does can be And then there was somebody else's like, well, she's not a great singer, but she's great at talking, so let's write her a bunch of a bunch of words. And then somebody was really limber and could belt, and they were like, well, she can play, she can be our star.
Yeah, it is just a wacky show. But if you're bringing it to l A, right, that's this is a unique situation where the actual cast is going to do it in LA. The whole Broadway cast, everybody or everybody who's going to Sutton who's coming.
Sudden and on a Gastre who plays the Queen my mom and a star is very good, and and Daniel Breaker and David Patrick Kelly who plays my dad. Uh and then some of the other people can't go. Brooks is doing Smash.
I saw. I just texted Brooks because I said, two of my favorite gay things in the world are Brooks, Sash Manskis and Smash. And the fact that are.
They doing They're doing Smash the TV show, I mean the.
Musicals that the musical that they made in the show Smash.
Shut the fuck up, no way. I texted yes because his Stormy was made a knight so cold the door, turn out the lights and listen.
Donald and I were the only people watching Smash. I got to do when I finally got in a Broadway musical, When I finally got into Broadway musical. I walked in. I was like, you guys love Smash as much as I do. And they're like, you're watching Smash. I loved Smash. I texted Brooks, I'm like, are you McFee.
He's the director. Well, you know, director direct.
They must have changed that guy because he was a sort of.
European momanizer. Yeah, so it's different now. Now it's like, it's like Brooks and I think it's a funnier role. But uh, it's so it's like, it's not the same story, but it's it's still them making a musical about Marilyn Monroe.
And oh so the musical will still be it won't be the musical. It will still be a musical about making the music.
That's right.
Yeah, I'm intriguing. I will be seated. I will be seated.
Donald's really good too. I like the fact that you guys are all coming out to l a though. Man, you're talking about that back in the day and how shows came through your town and everything like that. I wish it was like that still.
I wish that, you know, once you I think a lot of people would enjoy this experience. You do the Broadway run and then you take it on the road with the same casts.
Not necessarily the road, because if you're a big Broadway star, you don't really want to go nowhere.
People want to see that. People, people look. It's like theater. It's like movie theaters or theater all over again. Man, you go fucking go see the Buster Keaton jump off.
You go see the fuck you know what I mean, especially if they're coming to your town.
Small tool stars would do that, Carol Channing, Mary Martin, Tommy Tooon, like the old school stars things, you.
Know, if you have a family, and it can be tricky for people to do a tour, but I think I think as a as a half measure at least, it's very cool for the og leads to say, okay, and we're going to do it for a month or two in LA That's cool.
Yeah, I love it.
I'm really excited to do.
That any one of the dates that your wait, So tell audience members when how long is you run? Until in New York until.
You can catch us on Broadway until November thirty, and then we play the Almendson Theater in Los Angeles December tenth through January the fifth.
Okay, great, so people in La go see them at the Alminson. I was with my mom. She's so cute. She I saw her at my brother's birthday party and she brought out a little a little pamphlet and been sent her in the mail from the Ammend Center. And she opened it up and she goes, look, Sutton's coming to town. And I said, Mom, I know. And then that's Michael Uri. He's on the show Shrinking. She goes, I know, I'm going to go to this one. My mom will be seated for Michael Yurry and Sutton Foster.
It'll be cool there. It'll be really, It'll be really and it's a really for us. It's a nice way to spend the holidays, you know, doing a family because it's for everybody. Everybody can come see the show. You can bring your kids, you can.
Bring your grandma. It's one of those shows that has some sexual innuendo that will just go over your kids' heads. Yeah, and a lot of that was pulled back because the show used to be way more naudience and they needed a little more PG.
Yeah, we kind of got rid of There was some like edible stuff between my mother and me.
That we kind of got ready because she was in love with you. Yeah, there was some of that.
They cut that, and then there was the King was like kind of grabby, but that's we didn't that. But but but the it works like a Looney Tunes cartoon, where like there is stuff that's for the adults that the kids are like, why is that funny? And then there's the stuff that the kids love and the and the parents the adults love. There's nothing like the sound of kids laughing. I mean, it's it's just like it's awesome. And and there's a lot of stuff that happens in the show where just the kids laugh. And when that happens, when we when we get to those moments and we hear how many kids are out there, it's so fun for everybody. The whole audience loves hearing those those kids laughs.
I think l a last question, Michael, This is something that came up before we brought to you on the air, but just added curiosity if Donald were again and only fans and and one of the offers was to sha before we did this.
I remember, I remember, I remember the monologue what if a million years ago a flash and energy.
We don't want to hear it coming to you.
Who knows where landed there, coming from the desert to space to this grain of sand known as Earth. What if we did not come from Africa but to Africa? Now, after seeing that on Only Fans.
No, okay, let's say that's the flea thing, that's the that's the thing you get for free on only Fans.
Naked and I'm holding and I'm no, no, no, no, ball not cupping.
Let me give Michael the pitch please, okay, go ahead. He's clothed and looking over his shoulders, sort of flirtatiously, and he does his little Africa monolog and then you can pay twenty bucks just to see him hold his balls. We'd out of curiosity. Would you pay the twenty bucks?
And that's not the question about the question is That's not the question. Hold up, that's not the question, Mike, Michael, that's not the question. The question is He said that.
Only gay men would freaking look at me, and I was like, no, I'm universal, baby, I think straight women, gay men, I think freaking trans I think and nybody.
Daniel said that he thinks the biggest piece of the pie chart would be straight scrubs men.
I mean, I mean, I think the curiosity would probably get them.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely absolutely.
And you know, like like mid forties women who love clueless probably.
Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you.
I don't know about gay man. I'm not sure. If I don't know, what are.
You talking about? All men?
You wouldn't want to see donald?
If you no, fuck you? We're staying thirty bucks? Now? Are you telling me negotiate?
Are you telling me just your balls? Maybe we throw a we get twenty five bucks.
Yeah, I mean, see you.
There would be a freaking huge part of the gay community that would be interested in seeing my balls and shafts.
I wish there was a survey we could do on this.
Let's do one, let's do one.
We probably can. I don't think we should. It might hurt his ego. Fuck you, fuck you. I think listen, I would you would get my You.
Know what if you listen, If you're not into this, if you don't, you don't deserve it anyway, then how about that. If y'all ain't into this, then you don't deserve it. That's universal. That's for everybody out there.
I'll tell the case.
Michael Michael Doug Life Michael knows actual homosexuals and can and can tell them to tell everyone.
Yeah, I have a I have a thread going.
So there's a group. They're all in the same group. Chats Michael. I love you. You're so talented. Thank you for coming on our podcast.
I love you too. I love you both, and I love your friends. Chet I told you this act but many years ago, when I was first out in La shooting Ugly Betty, I was in I was at Baja Fresh and I saw you guys sitting on a curb in the parking lot eating together, and I thought it was so sweet and so cute. You are, you know, famous? Then they were on scrubs and everything, and I was like, look at those two guys. They're really friends and they're eating tacos together on a curb in the parking lot. And I've always you guys. Are you guys are really cool and sweet and and thank you very much. Always admired it.
Thank you, Michael. Congrats on all your success and people look forward to seeing you in La La land uh in Once upon a Mattress.
Wait, are they going to do a La La Land too? Is that what you're saying?
No, although Michael would probably be in La La Land.
I bet you he would be great in La La Land to La La Land too.
Is going to Broadway, probably probably.
I'm sure they're trying to make that go to Broadway. Greatest Showman's going to Broadway.
He could be the This is getting even better.
Listen, two great things that just happened. Greatest Showman's going to Broadway. Smash, Yeah, we'll be back. And I have a reason I'm gonna.
Break out your hands.
I had I did too, because, motherfucker, I know, are you kidding me?
You know that you and I are the only two people who watch Smash. I know, but that's like's parents.
Yeah, yeah, okay, bye, Michael.
We love you.
I love you guys. Thank you so much.
What a great show. And we've learned something. You know what I learned that you guys do not think me attractive at all.
You don't think the game community finds me attracted.
I think women find me attractive, and you don't think straight men find me attractive because the only reason why they would tune into my only fans is just.
Curry out of curiosity.
Hear the monologue from Juilliard. No, No, I think that. It's a big ask to say you're not going to see you engaging in sexual activities, You're just going to tune in to see your scroll them. Yeah, I think it's a big ask. I don't think for me or Daniel they would tune in.
So you're telling me me standing butt naked in front of a camera, shaking my ship up and down, bouncing it like it's an elephant trunk. When that's different.
That's different. We weren't saying that. That's a lot of you could you could probably put on a wing to your house with that only fansy.
No, that's not what you're saying.
You said balancing it like an elephant trunk. Yes, I think that would garner a lot of views. Please don't do it because I I don't want to. I don't want our careers to take that turn. Michael Urry is such a nice guy. Cast and everybody check out shrinking he's so talented and uh and check out once upon an attress.
Donald, I'm gonna take cold.
I love you, I love you.
To five seven stories about the show we made about.
A bunch of docs and nurses.
Said he's a story nets So yet here yea here but we