What will it take to bring real change to our world and our nation? Pastor Crawford Loritts joins Chris Brooks to answer that question, from history, from the Bible, and from his own experience. If you want to be God’s man or woman for such a time as this, don't miss this crucial conversation!
Chris Brooks here, reminding you that today's program is pre-recorded. While we won't be taking calls, we do want to connect with you on social media. Hey there friends, welcome to another exciting edition of equip with Chris Brooks. I'm so grateful that you've joined us today. Do me a favor, strap on your seatbelt. We're going to navigate through the contours of culture, as always, with the lens of the biblical worldview on. But before we do that, let me remind you this is the day that the Lord has made. He has given it as a gift so that you and I can rejoice and be glad in it. So let's do just that. Let's follow the words of the Apostle Paul. Let's rejoice in the Lord always. And again I say, rejoice. I want to welcome you to this special pre-recorded edition of Equip. Today we get a chance to honor the life and legacy of one of the great Christian leaders that this country has produced. By God's grace, you know, Doctor Martin Luther King Junior, some of you know him as a civil rights leader, and he certainly was that someone who fought for the equality and dignity of those who were considered as outcasts or second class citizens in this country. He fought for rights and privileges for those who, because of simply being born a particular race or ethnicity or gender, were boxed out of those things. God used him in pretty incredible ways. Now, while no man is perfect, no woman is perfect. Certainly, there's so much to appreciate and admire about those who dedicated their lives to serving others. There's something to be said for that. In a world that is so often selfish and self-centered. But while many will know Doctor Martin Luther King Jr, who would have been in his 90s had he lived today, many know him as a civil rights leader. We should know him as a minister of the gospel. we should know him as a Christ follower. The motivation and the grounding for his mission and ministry was his Savior, Jesus Christ. And so today, as we reflect on his life and legacy, I want to commend to you, Jesus, that the grounds for treating people with dignity and respect is the imago dei. It's the fact that they've been made in the image of God. We find that in Scripture Genesis one 2627. And so we would be remiss if we celebrated the man without celebrating the the Lord who saved and used and called Martin Luther King Junior to serve him. Today I got a very special guest. Before I get to that guest, though, I do want to remind you that all month long we're featuring this wonderful resource by Mark Batterson. I think it's appropriate, especially on a day like today, because some will say, hey, the gulf that exists between political parties or ethnic groups or genders is so big. The hurts, the wounds, the misunderstandings that it can't be healed. I'm grateful for those who, like Doctor Martin Luther King Junior, believe that even severe wounds can still be healed. And if they're going to be healed, I think it starts with us changing the way we talk. Please. Sorry. Thanks. Three words that change everything. You can find out more at our website. Org. It's equip radio.org. Go there now and support the program. Today I want to talk to one of the men in my life that I respect the most, Doctor Crawford Lorenz. Many of you love and appreciate Doctor Lorenz. He's a nationally known Bible teacher. He's also founder and president of Beyond Our Generation. He's committed to encouraging and shaping the next generation of leaders. He's had a huge impact on my life and on the life of many, many leaders that are kind of taking the baton and trying our best to model gospel faithfulness in the days to come. He's author of several books, including including Unshaken and Your Marriage Today and Tomorrow, which he co-authored with his awesome wife, Karen. He is the father of four adult children and have 11 almost perfect grandchildren. He lives in Georgia. He's joining me now. Hey, how are you, sir?
I am fine, Chris. Almost perfect grandchildren. You have it right, my brother.
Isn't it amazing? Isn't it amazing that the fall skips over a generation? It rests fully upon children. But grandchildren? I don't know if that's the theologically correct, but it feels right. It feels.
Right. No, I told I told our kids. I said, you know, your only reason for existence these days is for Transportation for my grandkids.
Oh, man, that is that is way too true. My mom sees me in. The first question is where are the grandkids at? So I'm feeling I'm feeling it. Hey, thank you for joining me. You know, the part of the conversation I wanted to have with you is that, uh, February is Black History Month. And when I think about many of the leaders from MLK on that have really lived for Christ, impacted the community, so much of their life was dedicated to community impact and healing. What divides us. And so today, what I wanted to talk about focus on is what does it mean or what will it take to be a change agent? I know you've thought deeply about that. And, you know, I was thinking about a quote from MLK and I always jokingly say MLK might be the most tweetable leader that America has ever produced. You know, because he he often had a way of, um, saying things that, um, needed to be said in a memorable way. He said this once, though. Change does not roll in on the wheels of inevitability, but comes through continuous struggle. And so I want to talk about how we impact. But before I get to our world, how we impact our world church. Before we get to that or even our family. It seems to me, Doctor Lorenz, that it has to start in us personally. And to me, that's been my greatest battle to see change happen in me. What do you say to folks who desperately want to see change happen in their lives, but continue to feel like they're on a hamster wheel?
Well, you know, I Chris, you have, uh, you have raised a number of issues. I think part of our struggle is that, um, you know, we we see ourselves as being isolated, uh, as Christianity, just relating to me now. Wholesome Christianity means that it's it's my change, not just in terms of between me and the Lord, but my change is to affect my environment. It's to affect the people that I come in contact with that, um, my sanctification, my walk with God. Uh, it has a compelling, um, what am I trying to say? Uh, is to be is to be viewed as a pathway by and through which Jesus becomes attractive in the hearts and lives of other people. Wow. So it's not just my individual walk with God. The motivation for me to walk with my Savior is because not only do I want to be right with him, but I want my life to tell the truth about God in every context that I'm in.
That's good.
And it is that comprehensive relationship that we need to have.
You know, when I think about personal change, I often think about the things that have been shaped in me by the fall, if you will, often are reinforced in me. Satan takes advantage to reinforce these things through hurt and woundedness. And so as I think about how divided our culture is, so often it's because of church hurt or maybe hurt that people have experienced. Yes. From from the opposite gender, or hurts that they've experienced from another ethnic or racial group to speak in those terms. How have you processed those things where Crawford can remain in a place of being able to love his neighbor, in spite of the hurts you've experienced?
Yeah. Well, you know, um, that Is that? That that we could be here all afternoon talking about that one. But, you know, Chris, I think, uh, the problem is, is that we don't distinguish between, uh, woundedness and brokenness. And let me explain here. We're now living in a in an era in which it is it is almost evangelically chic to talk about, uh, our woundedness and the pain that we've been through and what other people have done to us. And don't get me wrong, I'm not denying the reality of that. But, you know, God wants us to be redemptively broken and not just to celebrate our woundedness. You can be wounded without having been broken, but you can't be broken without having been wounded. What do you.
Mean by that? Okay, yeah.
Let me tell you the difference. Uh, a wounded person has a tendency to celebrate. They don't mean this, but to celebrate the pain that they have been through. Well, the problem with that is that the pain becomes the destination. Um, whereas the broken person who has been wounded, however, they've taken their wounds to Jesus and they celebrate how Jesus has Redemptively walked into their pain and they celebrate how Jesus is moving them toward wholeness. Wow. And so what? What we want to communicate. Obviously, we've all had pain. We've all had wounds. There are things that we learn about it, but God does not want us to stay at a place of permanent woundedness. He wants us to move toward Jesus. He wants our lives to be dominated by by the miraculous intervention of our Savior. And he wants us to be trophies of the victorious Christ. And and again, I'm not saying that that we I'm not talking about some type of silly, idiotic denial. Yes, but what I am talking about is getting to that place where we say, as Paul said, that his grace is sufficient. Where the grace of God was greater than his thorn in the flesh, and it drove him to that place. And we have a tendency to sanctify the thorns and not really celebrate the deliverance of the Savior.
I love what you're saying, because if I'm hearing you right, what you're saying is that pain doesn't have to be my destination. It does not even have to be what defines me. But I just want to give you the opposite side of the coin and let you comment on this as well. There is obviously a major theme in some segments of the Body of Christ that promotes what I would call a denialism, like, don't talk about your pain. To bring it up at all is considered to be a sin, if you will. So what's the balance there? And you've kind of alluded to it, but maybe unpacking a little bit more. What's the healthy balance between not living in denialism but not letting pain be my destination?
Yeah, it's it's to understand that faith in the Bible does not mean denial, does not mean denial does not mean, you know, don't claim this sickness. Don't don't claim this deal. Don't claim that. And I we've all seen the silliness of all of that. You'll never read anywhere in Scripture from Genesis to Revelation where faith is denial. But faith in the Bible is defiance. It doesn't deny the reality. In fact, it shows the reality of the pain. But it does not elevate the the struggle to the place of, of of worship. It defies it. It always sees God as greater than the struggle. God is greater than the challenge. It sees through the challenge to a God that is there, and that if he can raise a dead Jesus, there's no issue that he cannot step into. But but you can celebrate, not celebrate. You can talk about your pain as a pathway of of getting to the Savior. And we should talk about our pain. We should talk, but we don't talk about it in a terminal way. And we don't deny it. But we talk about a deliverer, someone who's made us desperate for him because of the struggles that we've been through. And ultimately, we celebrate that God is greater than any struggle that I face.
I love this. It says in Second Corinthians five chapter 20. Therefore we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us. We implore you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God. And ultimately, I believe that what we need to strive for, if I'm hearing you correctly, is to see Christ in the In the midst of our pain in the and to be able to put on display how God took what the enemy meant for evil and used it for our good, for his glory, and to be able to point people to Christ. Maybe you are listening to this conversation and you say, Chris, doctor, I need prayer because I'm a man who knows in my heart I need to change. So much of what Crawford has done over the years of his ministry is to pour into men, to pour into the next generation. Maybe you're listening today and you say, my family is being impacted. My church is being impacted. My community is being impacted. See, we can't talk about changing those other areas until we get to the place of change. Me? Maybe you're a woman that's listening to us, and you just sense the Holy Spirit saying that to you. Now is the time for change. Give us a call In five, four, eight, 36, 75. That's eight. Seven seven. Live. Six. Seven. Five. Also want to say thanks to those who are supporting the program. Sybil in Chicago. Janet in Elmhurst, Illinois. And Vance in Akron, Ohio. Thank you so much for supporting the program. We've been a blessing to you. Why don't you stand with us today? Go to equip radio.org. We'll be right back. At equipped is our goal to strengthen your faith. And we're always excited as we hear stories of people coming to faith as a result of our program. But we couldn't possibly accomplish this mission alone. That's why we're looking for equippers and people just like you, who will give a monthly gift to help us keep this program on the air. Would you consider partnering with us? Become an Equipper today and receive special insider benefits, such as a bi weekly email that contains pastoral messages prepared just for you? Call 888644 4144 or go online to equip radio. Org. Please enjoy this encore edition of equip with Chris Brooks. Welcome back to equip with Chris Brooks phone number 8775675. That's 877548 3675. Today, talking about how to become a change agent, how to experience change in your personal life that spills over into your family, that touches your church, that impacts your community. And we're talking to Doctor Crawford Loritts, who has been a change agent literally around the world. How many countries have you ministered in? Have you lost track or do you remember?
Uh, I sort of lost track. I mean, I have friends of mine who can tell you exactly that they've been to 75 in the third countries or whatever.
That's right.
That's right. I've lost track, Chris. I suppose I could sit down and figure it out, but.
Yeah. Yeah. Well, you know, I know, and many may know that you spent years working with Cru, formerly Campus Crusade for Christ. Yeah. And, uh, and then the past 15 years serving as senior pastor of Fellowship Bible Church in Roswell, Georgia. But obviously, God, God has used you, uh, in, um, reaching the nations with the gospel. It's a privilege to have you. I want to kind of shift our conversation, if we could, from the personal process of change which requires sacrifice to family change. I've. Yeah, I have long said. I know you agree with this conviction from your writings, from your preaching and and and that is so goes the family, so goes the church. We're not going to.
Have.
Strong churches built on the backs of weak families. So let's just talk about this. What is, in your opinion, the role of the family in seeing societal change on a national level? Uh, even around the world. What's the role of the family?
Well, you know, we could go down a number of paths on this, uh, Chris, from sociological and all of this stuff. But, you know, I think that the key to understanding the role of the family in culture and society is found in the law of first mention. Right? Uh, going back to the book of Genesis, when family was established, when God said, let us plural pronoun make man in our image. I mean it, stop. Stop there for a second. Um, that that the creation of man. And then over in the next chapter, the creation of husband and wife and family, was to model the love of the Trinity and the community of the Trinity, and the establishment of of of family in human history is to be a portrait of the destination at which the culture needs to arise. Now just stop and think about that. Every every every relationship, every every every every group, government, the church, the family was to be key to modeling what those relationships looked like. And so when you understand that, when you understand that the purpose of family is not just that your kids grow up and they don't get they don't get in too much trouble and they don't do this and they don't do that, and they go to nice churches and, you know, they quote Bible verses and get a nice education and all this kind of stuff. I mean, that's that that vision is so pitifully low. Yeah. But that the real purpose of family. As I said in the first the first segment, the real purpose of family is to tell the truth about God. It is God's visible representation of his plan and purposes from one generation to the next. Yes. And so that's what it's really all about. And so I think once you understand that, then you can become incredibly intentional about how you build your family on those kinds of gospel transactional truths and realities.
877 live. 675 is the number. Again, if you want to join the conversation. Or maybe you are praying, Lord, use me. And yet you see so many obstacles to that happening in your family and you just need prayer. We love to come alongside. Be a prayer partner with you today. (877) 548-3675. We'll go to the phone lines in a moment. But, Doctor Lorenz, as I listen to you, I think of two types of individuals. So let me just pose this question in two different ways. I'll start with this. What if it's my mistakes that have really caused woundedness in my family and and I'm repentant. I recognize that I've blown it and made mistakes, but yet the people in my family struggle to see me as a different person, and they still see me through the lens of my failures. What do you say to that person?
Well, you know, what I say to them is this you ultimately cannot make people see you for what you have become. You can't make that happen. And but at the same time, you've got to release yourself from that burden. In other words, if God has forgiven you and he has, you've turned to him. You've him. You've repented of that. Uh, and now you're doing whatever you can to make those things right. You have to trust the sovereign God to take care over time, uh, to take care of those people. Seeing you in a different light. Now, see here, here's here's the deal, though. You know, uh, it takes a split second. It takes a split second to violate trust. But it takes it takes a it takes a long time to regain it. And so what I would say to you is, uh, don't retaliate. Um, but let your life model what you have become and be consistent about that and what the Lord does with that. He's going to do with that. But I would not beat yourself up over things that you have repented of. You've sought to make. Right? I would I would make sure that I've done everything that I can, and if I've hurt people in my family, I've made I've I made terrible mistakes. I've maybe destroyed a marriage or maybe neglected my kids or whatever it may have been. Do everything that you possibly can to make sure that that they've heard that you're sorry for that. And not only that you're sorry for that, but that your behavior, your behavior and what you're willing to do, uh, demonstrates that you've turned, uh, but you place that in the Lord's hand, and you just have to trust him for it and get, get, get, get in a get in the community of people, I would say to that can help you stay objective about this. And, uh, you know, that can help you to grow and fill in those gaps. But that's that's what I would share.
Yeah. I mean, hey, amen to everything you just said. And the gold and everything you just said to me is how easy it is to lose trust, how long it takes to regain it. I mean, you're right. It takes a second to lose it, but it takes time to regain it. So part of what I hear you encouraging us to do as well is be patient.
That's exactly right.
In that process, I think the worst thing we can do is to say, hey, I've lived right for three months now, and you folks keep keep treating me like I'm the old guy.
But if I can tell this quick story, Chris, uh, some years ago, Karen, I was speaking at one of these weekend, three members of Family Life. Great weekend. And this man at the end of the conference came up to me and said, my wife won't trust me, and you need to talk to her. She won't trust me. And I said, why won't she trust you? She said, well, I had I had an affair. I said, how long ago did you how long was the affair? And he told me, and I said, when did you get things, when did you turn this around? And he said, well, probably about six weeks, eight weeks ago. I said, well, help me understand something.
Oh my goodness. You had an affair for over a year. Yes.
You violated your wedding vows.
Yeah.
And I said your wife shouldn't trust you.
Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
Because you've got.
To demonstrate over time.
That you're not trustworthy.
Doesn't mean there's not hope, but you got to demonstrate it. Let me ask another quick question before we go to break in about a minute. You've talked about the impact of your father on you. And I've heard from Brian about the impact of you in the home. And what do you say to the young man who's on the front end of this journey of family who comes from a background of brokenness, adultery, affairs, addiction, divorce? How do you change the trajectory?
Well, don't get involved in a group. Think and don't think because of the pain that you've experienced in your past that you are. You are destined to repeat that. I think we need to stop that. And but you have to realize, okay, let me embrace that reality. But understand that your starting point is Calvary. And so I would encourage you to do that. And I would also encourage you to get some older mentors in your life that can speak, hope and help to reparent you, perhaps in some areas. Reach out and get what you need. But but you don't have to repeat those things. You don't have to repeat them.
Friends, your tomorrows don't have to be a repeat of your yesterdays. We're going to take your calls on the other side of this break. We'll be right back. Today's program has been pre-recorded, so our phone lines are not open. Hey there friends, welcome back to equip with Chris Brooks. So grateful for those of you who listen in, who share the program with other friends family members. It is our goal every day to take on the tough topics of culture and to give you wisdom from God's Word on how to navigate through culture with both compassion and competency. If the ministry has been a blessing to you, if our guests and our resources have added to your walk with Jesus, could you consider supporting us today? Your gift of $50 or $100 or more? Whatever God lays on your heart makes all the difference. It allows us to continue to air in your community and to make sure the Gospel of Jesus Christ is being declared to see lives change, for his glory is our prayer. And so if you have been impacted and you want to see the program continue on, please call today 8886 44 4144. That's 8886 44 4144. Thanks to Sylvia from Naperville, Illinois for standing with us today as well. You are awesome and we appreciate it. 888644 4144. Today, as I thought deeply about the implications of Black History Month, one of the reasons why I celebrate it is because it gives me the opportunity to celebrate God's glorious work in the midst of various groups of people. And it seems like that's consistent with the New Testament. We see it all throughout as each letter represents God's work among the Romans, the Ephesians, the Galatians, all of these wonderful people groups. We get a chance to continue on celebrating God's manifold work until revelation seven and nine is experience where people from every tribe, every nation, every tongue are together before the throne of God worshiping his name. But while we're here on earth, we have to be agents of change for Christ. And so I'm talking today to Doctor Crawford, Loritts, about how we experience that in our personal life. We've talked about that in that in our family. But now I want to move to the church and this is a hot button issue. You've heard about the deconstruction. You've heard about the leave loud movement. You've heard about those who are opting out of church. So I guess my basic question to start, Doctor Lorenz, is why church in a generation where in particular post pandemic, where many are just choosing, uh, you know, DIY Christianity, Christianity or spirituality? Why church?
Well.
The reason why the short answer to that is that it's God's only solution. I mean, that sounds so, so bottom line here, but, uh.
Um.
It was the late Chuck Colson who famously said, you can't have God as your father without having the church as your mother. Meaning? Meaning that, uh, once we come to know Jesus Christ as Savior and Lord were placed into the body of Christ. Now I know some argue. Well, yeah, I can be. You know, there's a universal church and there's a local church. I got problems with the local church. Well, you know, in the New Testament there's that distinction is not made that clear. I mean, yes, there is a universal church, but we're we're to do life together with one another.
Yes.
And and that we're all imperfect. None of us are the fourth members of the Trinity. Um, uh, we all are dependent upon God. And so we celebrate life together, and we grow together. Uh, Jesus said in Matthew 16, upon this rock I will build my church. What is that? The the statement that Peter made that I'm the Christ, the son of the living God. And, uh, then on the day of Pentecost, the church was inaugurated in human history. Our problem with the church is that, uh, um, many times we've gotten sidetracked as a local congregations of local believers. We've we've added things to the gospel, we've ingested the vitriol of the culture, or we've wanted to brand the church with other movements, or we become selective in our denunciation of sin, or the church should represent the platform of a political party. It's that contamination that has caused confusion and then the encroaching legalism, uh, where you've got, you know, duplicitous Christians who who, uh, are saying one thing and living another and holding on to views that cannot be supported from the scriptures, but they act as if, you know, this is vital Christianity. And as a result, a lot of people have been hurt. They've been hurt. Uh, a lot of the stuff has nothing to do with the gospel. And so but at the same time, you know, there are many, many, many God honoring churches, many God honoring groups of people. And so we've got to be careful of not typecasting the hold simply because we've run into some dysfunctional believers.
8775675 is the number (877) 548-3675. This whole thing is you just laid out is worth. Again, each one of these topics hours and hours of discussion, because there are a number of people who are willing to share their story of why they've left. And and I'm sure dysfunctional believers would kind of rank at the top. But I want to refer to another report that I came across. I talked about this last week on my program, doctor Rich. It was from LifeWay research. And the headline gripped me when I saw it. It simply said this, that public trust for pastors has fallen to historic low. Only 34% of men and women in this country, which is a low point in this country, say that they trust pastors morally, ethically. So if you had a room full of pastors, if we could arrange that and and you've done this many times before, but if you had a room full of pastors and you had the opportunity to talk to us about what we need to do to mend that, what we need to do to restore that, the type of leaders we need to be for the future of the church. What would you say?
Well, I would start at a very basic level, Chris, and that is that over time, your ministry is not going to be any greater than your personal surrender to the Lordship of Jesus. That as a as a as a shepherd, I've got to be the portrait of vital spirituality. I've got to be a portrait of New Testament spirituality. So it's the life that preaches. So the very first thing I would say is that we need to pay attention to ourselves. We need to pay attention to our own morality and on all these issues in life. And so we need to be we need to be spirit filled, humble servants of God. Then secondly, we really need to live and preach under the canopy of God's Word and make sure make sure that we're not we're not allowing the culture to hijack our ministries or political agendas. Um, that that we maintain prophetic integrity. And by that what I mean, what I mean that we're not owned by the left and we're not owned by the right. We don't carry the water for anybody except for God. And we speak under we speak under that banner. And then thirdly, that our ministries are clearly typified and driven by what's on the heart of God and what's most meaningful in the New Testament. And that is the fulfillment of the Great Commission and life transformation. And we've got to we've got to strip ourselves of the power mongering in this kind of thing. The problem is, is that when you get a few nickels together and a lot of people start coming to your church, you got to be careful of your power. Motivations. Sometimes the seeds of failure are sown during seasons of of success. Meaning that because people are responding to me, then I can make the dastardly assumption that somehow or another, I'm. I'm as good as the way God is using me. And that's not necessarily so. And so you get you've got to be careful that you don't get seduced into an artificial power. And that's when you start saying crazy stuff. That's when you start, you know, letting people use your name for various causes and things like that. That doesn't line up with the scriptures.
Or.
You feel like you can just say almost anything. So we've got to remember what our spiritual address is. Who are we called to be? We're called to shepherd the flock of God. We're called to help people come in contact with Jesus, to look like him, and not to be branded by some little C-minus issue that we've we've placed at a higher place. And one of the salvos, Chris, is that I think what has happened to many of my colleagues is that we've put too much primary passion into secondary issues, and we've made secondary issues, primary issues.
Yeah.
And, you know, and it's and it's messed us up. Yeah. So now we get we get painted into a corner right. We get painted in a corner. Now we got to justify that nonsense. And so I think we just have to constantly keep searching our hearts, submitting to the truth of the Scripture. Remember that pride wears many disguises, including false spirituality. And keep checking ourselves.
Folks, you just got a pastor's conference in a three minute response. I'm telling you everything you just said. I wish that pastors all over this country could hear and could digest, because it is so on point and in line with the message of Scripture. That is, if you don't mind, let's go to the phone lines. Cindy is listening in New Hampshire. Hey, Cindy, thank you so much for calling. How can we pray for you today?
Um.
Yeah. Well, I just feel like I had a divine appointment with Saint Louis. I've been having a lot of extremely tough family situation, um, among some of us, Christian and some of us not. Um, and it led to, um, my not being able to see my grandchildren for a couple of months. And, um, there's slowly been some restoration, but, um, we currently are looking for a Christian family therapist and seeing if, um, you know, a couple of them will meet. We haven't got the answer yet about that, but so it's been just one of the worst experiences of my life, to be honest with you.
Yeah.
Um, yeah. And, you know, let me let me say this. If I could. Cindy. Um, we want to pray for you. And I'm going to ask Doctor Lorenz if he could just give you some wisdom and pray. But, um, you're not alone in this. I have heard from so many families that these generational divides. Grandparents separated from grandchildren. Uh, this is one of the areas that the enemy is really attacking in, and it takes wisdom to navigate. Doctor Lorenz, what would you say to Cindy?
Well, Cindy, I just think your instincts are so, so right. I'm just delighted that you said you're going to try to reach out to a Christian counselor. Sometimes you need a third party to get objectivity in these things, And you know, you know, I would just encourage you to continue to do what is right. Um, if there's anything that you own that's part of this, the mistakes that you've made, um, you know, humility is, is, is the best approach. And, and it takes courage to own up to that. But just continue to pray and, and press into this. And I am going to pray that they will be open to coming together with a Christian counselor. I think that would be a wonderful thing.
Go right ahead.
Okay. Let's pray. Father, thank you for Cindy, and thank you for the courage that it took to call. And just by virtue of the fact that she called Lord, I could tell that she really wants your heart and your solution in all of this. Father, I pray in the name of your son that you'll bring sweet unity, that you will melt and drive down and tear down the barriers of, of of offense. And and that there will be a sweetness that will come out of all of all of this. Lord, work in a great way. We pray. Grant her wisdom. Lead them to that right person that can be an objective contributor and offer a pathway forward. Thank you for what you will do. In Jesus name, Amen.
Thank you, Cindy, for giving us a call for all of you who are calling and listening as well. The phone number (877) 548-3675. If I could, I want to connect the last two segments. We've talked about family in the church, and I would just simply say pastors, if we're going to be what our culture needs us to be, if we're going to minister the grace of Christ, may our churches be places of healing for families that are hurting. Cindy represents so many families that are hurting, that need shepherding, that need counsel the gospel. And I pray that pastors that our ministry to families wouldn't be secondary or just another add on ministry, but it'd be core and central to all that we do for Christ and His kingdom. We'll be right back right after this. Our complex world often leaves us searching for ways to strengthen our connection and achieve our dreams. Nothing opens doors like please. Nothing builds bridges like things. Nothing mends fences like sorry and please sorry. Thanks. Mark Batterson offers a compelling look at how these powerful words can transform relationships and careers. You can get your copy today by going to equip radio.org or calling 888644 4144. Today's program has been pre-recorded. Welcome back to equip with Chris Brooke. So grateful for you who are listening. And I want to say a special thanks to Anthony from Gurnee, Illinois. Thank you for supporting the program, brother. It really makes a difference. As a matter of fact, your gift helped to catapult us over the 50% mark for our need for this month. So thank you for that, brother. Uh, for the rest that are listening, maybe you've been listening and you've never been able to support before, but it's been your heart, your desire to do so. Listen, I recognize we're in a busy world. Life gets in the way from time to time. But can I appeal to you today to stop where you are? And if you can think back on a program that really spoke to your heart, a prayer that encouraged you, a wisdom from a guest that gave you guidance for what steps you need to take. Or maybe you've just seen Christ at work in your life through this ministry. I would love for you to stand with us today. Can you give us a call 888644 4144. That's 888644 4144. And if you find yourself in a position where you say, Chris, as much as I'd like to, I just am not in a place financially where I can do that. Can I just ask that you would add us to your prayer list? I mean that because ministry doesn't happen apart from the power of God. And as you pray for me, my family, for our team. Listen, this is a battleground. We have a real adversary, and we need your prayers. And so as you pray for our guest, even today, Doctor Crawford Loritts as you pray, it makes a huge difference. So please stand with us today prayerfully and financially. 888644 4144. I want to land on community and man, I wish there was like four hours that we could talk about this, but it seems the heart of again, I've referred to Doctor King. I've referred to so many who just had a heart for community impact. Here's the question. I guess that that would help us to maybe get there. What's the right balance in community impact and change? There are those who would falsely seek See community impact as the gospel itself and community change as salvation, if you will. Then there are those who are totally oblivious to the community and world around them. It's almost like, let's just preach and get them ready for heaven, as if there's not something here on earth that we must do. What's the balance and what's the best pathway for us to make an impact as a church on the communities that we're in?
Well, I think one of the things and I've wrestled with this for years. Right, Chris? I think all of us have. I know you have.
And yes, you know.
Uh, so what what I, what I think the problem is, is that we try to, we try to, to surgically distinguish things. Um, I, I am never not Christian.
Yeah.
You you are never not Christian. Okay. And and and I don't I don't try to dissect the context that I'm in wherever I am. The hope of the gospel and the hope of Christ should shine forth. And you know, and part of who I am is, is, is that I, I need to affirm the dignity of every human being because they bear the image of God on their souls. And the truth of the gospel is that God so loved the world. And so I need to. I need to love. I need to love people. My ultimate passion is for them to come into a saving relationship with the with the Savior. And so, you know, and I think we've made justice too much of a complex issue. Um, if I'm a follower of Jesus, and if I'm in this world, then I am going to seek for justice. But justice in the Bible that flows from these three big tributaries, and that is number one that they concede must live. The living must be cared for, and the poor and the defenseless must be defended. Now, that's not political. That's not that's that's not, uh, you know, uh, signing up with some party or this kind of thing. That's what the Bible teaches. And so to be reconciled to God means that I'm an emissary, an ambassador for Christ, and that I represent hope, and I represent change, and I represent the goodness of God and the context of human history. And so I can say in the name of Jesus, all sin is wrong. Lying is wrong, stealing is wrong. Racism is sinful and wrong because it's the sin of partiality with pigmentation structures that, that, that, that have, uh, sanctified, if I might use that expression. Sin.
That's wrong.
And so so you know, I don't we don't separate these things.
We live that in an integrated Christian life.
That's exactly right. That's exactly right. And it's it's a whole thing.
Yeah.
And so I can I can denounce adultery from my pulpit as well as denouncing police officers beating to death a young man in Memphis.
Yeah, yeah. Such profound wisdom, Doctor Lorenz. And, you know, this is why I love having you on. Because you have lived this life. You've walked it out and have the fruit to show for it. I'm so grateful for you joining me. Thank you, as always, for carving out time. Friends, I want to encourage you. Find out more at our website. Org and until we're together again next time. As always, remember equip with Chris Brooks is a production of Moody Radio, a ministry of Moody Bible Institute.