N.O.R.E. & DJ EFN are the Drink Champs. In this episode we chop it up with fashion icon, April Walker!
Through her brand βWalker Wearβ, April helped create a multi-billion industry, known today as streetwear.
April shares stories of working w/ 2Pac, Naughty By Nature, Run DMC and more!
Lots of great stories that you donβt want to miss!
Make some noise for April Walker!!!ππππππ
Listen and subscribe at http://www.drinkchamps.com
Follow Drink Champs:
http://www.instagram.com/drinkchamps
http://www.twitter.com/drinkchamps
http://www.facebook.com/drinkchamps
DJ EFN
http://www.instagram.com/whoscrazy
http://www.facebook.com/crazyhoodproductions
N.O.R.E.
http://www.instagram.com/therealnoreaga
http://www.twitter.com/noreaga
Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.com
Welcome to Drink Champs, the production of The Black Effect and I heart Radio and his Drink Chess motherfucking podcasts. A legendary queen's rapper, He's Segre. It is your boy in O R. He's a Miami hip hop pioneer, is d j e FN. Together they drink it up with some of the biggest players in the most professional, unprofessional podcast and yet number one sorts for drunk fast drinks. Motherfucking is New year' z that's time for drinking Champs. Drink up, motherfucking mother. What did Goold be hoping? This? This is your boy in O R? What up? Is d j e f N And this is Drink has motherfucking Happy Hour mass Up And one of the our guests today. One of our best things that I started to do if and was to do research right. And when I researched this strong woman, I really like, you've never seen the X Man and you've seen Storm because Storm was the strong woman of X Man that can turn into anything that she wanted to. And when I researched, I felt like I was researching Storm. Nobody else watched Red Common Books. Here it's said Storm, It's mystique. And when I tell you from her first store in Brooklyn to her conquering the world, there's a lot of people who cannot say I worked with Biggie and Tupa. There's a lot of people who cannot say I worked with one E MC and Jay Z. There's not a lot of people period in those categories. And when you google and when you understand the line that it meant to the culture, and do you understand that she stood back and said, you know what, I want the line to speak for herself. For years I said I'm gonna take the step back. And then now years later you see what it involved to what clothing means to hip hop, how artists actually gets signed and hires a stallus. If this woman that we have today wasn't here and didn't take the forefront of you know, we had the fooboos, we had the car canas, we never had a woman just running the forefront. And in case you don't know how proud we are of this history, In case y'all don't know, y'all need to stand up and make some noise for the honorable, the impeccable. A wow, thank you, thank you, thank you. I mean I'm just humbled by that. No, no, you know what what's crazy is obviously I had to do my research, so I went and what documentary you told me to watch Fresh Dressed? Fresh Dress? We watched watched Fresh Dress, but before I watched Fresh Dress, I watched the remix. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, it was basically you, Misa and that documentary. In my opinion, I did not realize because to me, as an outside of looking in as an insider, I just thought, you guys Gucci send you guys clothing, and you guys just cut it up. No listen, I was old, naive. I just thought that you guys had it made like I thought that if he was a designer, you basically got the fabric, you cut it up, um and just get to I had no idea of the struggles, the flights, and when I'm researching you, because I know when you come out saying Holy ship, I was ashamed of myself because here I am as a person that's in the culture, a part of the culture, but I had no idea of what you guys went through. I was just gonna say, like, that's why it's important for this show. Look, you're telling our stories and we can't count on other people to tell our stories. We have to tell our own stories. So that's one of the reasons I wanted to be here, Thank you God. A little problems, and I've been listening, like, not just this story. You tell so many important stories and unsung heroes that really have really done a lot for the culture, but people might not know. So the fact that you dig in like that, it's priceless. No, no, I love it. So you know what I want to go first? I want to go to your first store, um Fashion in the fall, right, yep, that was fashion and Effect. Ye Clinton hill Brooklyn. Okay, I just want you to understand because a lot of y'all didn't make noise when she said Clinton hill Brooklyn because you're probably thinking of Clinton hill Brooklyn now. But back in the days, Clinton hill Brooklyn was very rough. I'll pack that picture so right. I started in eighties seven. So when I first started, you gotta think Reaganomics crack error. You gotta think New York City was different, right, So the hustlers were hanging with the seals, The seals were hanging with you know, it was just like you go to Bentley's. You can see everything at the bar together. Okay, tell me just case y'all don't know. Bitley's was one of the gloves in New York City, by the way, she flost from us by you heap. So when you think about the eighties, right, we're talking about it was electric in New York. It was like the hustlers. No disrespect to artists and rappers and mcs. But a lot of that what you see in videos comes from that eighties period on the streets of what was happening, right, like you, that's very real. Yeah, that's so. So it was just like this period where you were hustling trying to figure it out. And then at the same time I was graduating. I graduated high school. I went to Lackland Bishop in Brooklyn Tech. Oh my god, no, no Bishop Lloyd. Okay. My other friend who sold cracks went to I went. I went to school with Mark Jackson, my Queen's basketball players. Okay. So then and Kenny Smith went to Malloyd because we were both here. You were right there, um, But that whole period was electric because that was to me, when a commercialization like it started, the spirit of entrepreneurship kicked in hard for hip hop you think about fresh Fest, you think about run DMC my Adidas, you think about like it's becoming a commercially viable business. Right, and then Public Enemy came out that that Oh my god, they shut it down and they were speaking to us. Right, it was everything we were feeling. So one night at the Apollo, after the Apollo, me and my girls went to Dapper Dance that nighttime, right after amateur night at the Apollo at night at there's a lot of stuff going on there. Right, we walk at Fabric everywhere, he's hustling, he's out there like he has lines here. His cheapest, the Lord sweatsuit at that time we're talking in the eighties was three hundred dollars. You know what that is now that's like three g's right, you know what I mean from the eighties, that's without anything on it. So automatically I just was seeing, Okay, hold on, when you say without anything on the logo, without logo s nothing three hundred, right, And then it went up from there, Like I remember Diane Dixon, right she ran track Olympics. Started shout out to Diane. We both were cool, but like I remember, and she bought that jacket she bought and he was making meat coats, reversible, Gucci everything. He was doing it better than they were at that time. So for me, the light bulb went off, like, we have nothing like this in Brooklyn for us, because y'all have to understand, Brooklyn was very different than harlemm was very different than Queen's. Burrows were everything, and Queen's we had the Coliseum are Harlem you had Dapper Dan. Brooklyn you had I'll be square More. Yeah, we have, We definitely had that. But that was the only known for girldfronts. No, I mean Conda. We we we used to go to Canal Street and we used if we went to Canal Street. Look, he's still got to Canal Street right now. You look at her. I think a lot of people that and also, um, the Diamond Exchange, you know. So it was a few options. But some cats went to let me ask you something, growing up in hip hop, what was the first hip hop brand that actually hit mm hmm was it fool? No? So for us it was it was For me, I'm an answer Walkerware, but I'm gonna say like we were so cross colors. So what happened was just the timeline. So I opened Fashion and Effect and Carl had Carl can I had a tailorship and Flatbush called um it was a tailor shop. And then it was him and a Z And then in another part of flat Bush there was Miguel Navaro, God blessed the Dead, and it was the three of us and we were making a lot of stuff. Now Carl came out to l A to try to to get out the production. I'm still at Fashion and Effect. And then during this storm growing course colors started bubbling Cross Colors and damage was they both black old? Cross Colors was damage. Damage was in black You're working on my childhood right now. Damage was not always stood. Damage was looking at you ross my mind. Yeahs doing it was damage to right. So damage was not black old. That's not to my knowledge, Holy molo. Okay, all right, they did a lot of damage in the everybody board, like you know, I just like everybody. Cross Colors was though. Cross Colors was they were if you remember, they were the first brand to be on Black Enterprise as the first one hundred million dollar brand it sales, So that was like the first one to like break through the who's created cross Colors? Carl Jones and TJ. Walker to to this. So now what they I mean? I was too young at that time to think about. I was. I was born in seventy seven, So I wore across colors, but I didn't know what the culture actually accepting it seems like. So we had this, Yeah, we had this conversation on the plane. I flew in with Cliff. Cliff Love shout out to Cliff. He's saying what he actually danced with Houdini and then went on to do all this amazing product placement in the field. But we were talking about it, and the East Coast didn't really wear a cross colors too hard. It wasn't it wasn't like um a disk, but they were very colorful. And you gotta think early nineties, late eighties New York wasn't doing colors like that in a big way, you know what I mean. It was more the West Coast, but some people did wear it, and they wore the black red and girl of like sitcoms and stuff. Yeah, they had this product place where strong to me, cross color was lit. But I was like eight years old and it was cool. It's just different. So I wonder, because when we google your name, so many pictures come on, so many beautiful pictures of artists that we can never ever interview, We can never speak to them. So I would like to go to a couple of your pictures and ask you, this is the story that you remember from this. Obviously were gonna start with Tupac, the Tupac picture. When we google you, a Tupac picture comes up. There's a couple, isn't There's no there's more than one, but it's that one one with the with the jersey on. I wasn't there that day. How does this picture happen? Did he buy it? Did he call you? Did you send it to him? What does this? How does this happen? So ed lover mark sex. There was a crew Mark Sex was part of No Face. No Face was under the umbrella of deaf Jam. Deaf Jam. They had a label out of queens right, so like they were at lovers people like stretched right. So I knew all of them. So I started styling like they had b WP bitches with problems um and I was styling at this time too, right. I started styling from fashion and Effect. My first styling job was with Audio two. I don't care that crashed up Bends. That was us and shirt Kings. We did that together. So that was their first name's dropping to my signs. Let me just let me just for the for the for the listeners that don't know, I'm from Queens born and raised. At one point, if you didn't have a shirt from Shirt Kings, it wasn't flocked. You have to actually go there and get your shirt spray painted. Absolutely shot, what's your name on it? And you had to go back to the hood, like you had to go all the way the air and go back to the and have your shirt spray painting and be like, yeah, le's my name. So yeah, I just wanted we can continue shout out to Shirk for sure. They were one of the first two. When we talk about first, right, shirt King, you can't say not then we gotta say that, right. Yeah. I never looked at shirt King's merchandise. Yeah, but they were kind of like they just don't get that credit. You're right, they really did everywhere everywhere. But I'm saying people were copying that style of the right yeah, so um so yeah, so stretching um poc started hanging out and I don't remember which came first, but I remember seeing him on a set when I was styling b WP and then um another time. I think it might have been when I went to try out for Juice UM in the movie. I just really wanted At this time, I was still doing fashion and effects, so I wanted to get my clothes out there so anyway I could. I was tumbling, so I wore a customed to Lord sweatsuit that was crazy with the bucket hat, and I had my cards. I didn't matter matter. But I remember him stopping me like, yo, where you get that? And I was like, I made it and when you say him, yeah, gave the card and so um. And I don't know if that was the first or the second time, but we kept seeing each other to the point where, um, but your brand wasn't known yet when you meet, it wasn't. I was. I was still doing a lot of styling, and I was making suits. At this time. I was doing something called the rough and Rugged suit, which was like I got that in my notes. Okay, yeah, it was a heavy denim suit, rough and rugged suit. Cool, go ahead, Yeah, but this rough suit caught fire. So like crossover, you think about the video with E. P. M D. They went like all black with the lord like that was that suit. But then we started doing it and Denomen just a lot of people started wearing it, so that gave me the gumption to start walk away. But Pop, it was me seeing him styling a lot of different people because we started styling a lot of people as well from the store. From the store, so what happened was what had happened was we're at the store. This is still the eighties and we didn't have the internet, we didn't have anything, so word of mouth was the credible. So I remember Milking is coming in light and Swatch told Milk and he was doing in out and they were like, I want in em c light mild milk, Milking gazz and Milk is em like brother and then Shaggy shine Head right. This is old school but their classic and they are legends in Brooklyn. So Brooklyn was final in Brooklyn. And then one day a little round kid, Biggie Smalls, fifteen years old, he walked in. We had the airbrushing, we were doing airbrushing. We were doing a crilege fashion and effect. Now Bige was from my neighborhood, so I had always see him on the corner coming out the train. We'd always not but I didn't know him, but this air brush shirt stopped him. Came in the window, found out he was you know, his love was hip hop and he was still like trying to get some He wasn't, he was just wrapping and he was like talking to me and real cool. And that's that he started supporting us, and that's how we built those relationships. So from that, Milk came back. That's how I started finding out about Stilin. After we did that cover, he was like, can you guys style our video? And I was like, yeah, I didn't even know what Stalind was, but I was like, yeah, if we get paid for it too. So we styled the video and um, it wasn't that one um. But from that I saw, wow, that's another revenue stream branch and we needed them all. So I was like, we're gonna start styling, and uh, that's how we started Stalind. We did um Shock, we did um everybody's from Shock took like with his VIDEOSO nickings, UM like they a lot of walk away and that we said, Um, we did a lot. We did l Cool Jas Tour. We did like from one end of it to the that all naughty by nature. I stowed them for years, one dmc um and only walk Away. Yeah. I was very ambiguous on purpose because I remember having a conversation with my father when I was first decided I was gonna go for it with walk Away, and I was like, I don't know if they'll accept a woman making men's clothes, you know, And he was like, well, if you got a chance that, don't do it. Yeah. So I just was like, let the productly, just make dope product, put it out there, Let that be the star and let people rocket. Like we never had official ambassadors. It was just love at that time with hip hop, Like hip hop was energy feed energy, and we were all building and growing at that time. So it was just like I believe in you, you believe in me. Less rock, but you were officially styling them, right, I was styling some of them and then some wasn't. Style. Was the first first bird, first one giving the flowers right now, very first one that was famous or a couple of the first Okay, So I would say milk, I would say audio two, I would say Sean had and Shaggy damn Sean, and let's make And then right after that pop and just like all the you know, like the ground. I met him when he was a roadie and then he became that and then he kept going. Then when he did Above the Ram, he called and he was like, Yo, I'm doing this movie. I want you to do the clothes for the movie. So I remember him. I met him and we went to the trailer. I met the costume designer the costume war job, but Karen, and he was telling her I want her to do all all and she was like, she can't do everything. He was like, well, I want all black designers. M h. So yeah, I got to do um the camouflages outfit in that that's walk away and also that hooked vest that's seen with him in the grave with the pants and the shirt. I did that and then I was like, if you need more black designers, call five thousand and one Flavors. That's how they got in it to night Yoke. I'm not gonna lie like I said, Um, I always thought you had it. I don't want to say like a given. I thought you hadn't made. I thought if you was a black designer like you came, you came with l L like like you walk in well, just get a deal. Don't walk aware, Um, you just just had tupac and just walk and you guys just had a deal. I had no idea to struggle that you guys, I mean researching you like it was a better sweet because some of it. I cried and I was like, really, this is what black designers go through. And and when you hit Kanye going on the rant and you just like like, well, you don't know what's going on. And then and then you actually listen to the names that he was saying and you go back and research a little bit, You're like, he has a point. I had no I fucking did. It's been it's been a journey for sure, add putting a woman into that equation and then being Blexican black in Mexican and not being and I was black in Mexican or black and for the weekend, Oh she said Plexican. I've never heard that term that had put it in a drink champ. So wait a minute, wait a minute, hold on home, because I before we get into the woman far because we have to get into the world park, right, But I just want to people you to describe how hard it is for a designer this period yeah, first, and then I want to get it designed to end in being a woman. So just okay, because this is us from the outside looking at this is early before hip hop fashion is you got to realize if we see it on video music box, we think it's it Like, it doesn't matter if it's a headband, if it's if it's if it's a pouch. If we see it on video music box, we're saying, these people made it. So starting your brand, first of all, we had the store. The store was to keep people fresh. Then you started styling. How much courage did it take to say, you know what, I don't want to be I don't want to be competing because I think you said you had a fashion show and Jimmy Jazz you invited. I don't. They invited. But that's a lot of courage. So how do you develop that hervish to say, you know what I'm going from? Stalin took this is this is me and I want to invite these people. So I think that honestly, I had a as I was naive to fear, and I think my parents and I now had a good support system. When I say that, I mean I grew up my father was in the music industry. So my father I grew up as a jazz baby. He managed a lot of jazz grades, like we called Tyner Gary Bart's, and then by the time I was a teenager, he started managing d Train, Jazz jay Z, all these people my pops was working with. So I grew up watching him literally danced to his own beat, Like, Okay, I think what you just said just went over my head. Did you say jazz jazz z like jazz? Oh do my jazz music? Okay, alright, cool? Yeah, he just so my pops. Right, we were in Brooklyn and I used to hanging Marcy and I heard about these kids that could wrap their ass off and and um yeah, I gave my father his demo and then they started and we were all cool, you know, because you also got jay z and so walk away. That's how that all happened, you know what I mean. It was just like a family affair. And then um guru Ye moved in and was my next door neighbor right there when he first came to Brooklyn from huh, And so that's how we got cool premier all of us, you know. Yeah, he was Keith Okay, he was Keith and yeah and so and then context wise, Keith lived, um easy mobile living next door to me in the next building. So when Park was doing that because I'm giving this, I'm giving you Hill like Rosie Perez lived on next block and she still does, you know, still black Knock. So like the neighborhood was very creative and we were all like on this, like Voltron is this is what do? The right thing was based out of that the area because Spike was right there too. Crazy This is crazy a documentary about that neighborhood. In that neighborhood, Wesley lived over there. Like I love how everywhere it was a special time, right yeah, Like I wasn't trying to name drop seriously, I was trying to give you context of like what was happening that energy. But getting back to what you said, I think that, um yeah, it just was that time and um it was special. So just this just this commercial, right, this is where I think hip hop took a turn in fashion. L does his commercial for Gap I've been leaving this but again and Gap blue shirt on or was it a football has? Yeah? So me as an outside of looking in, did that help the fashion industry? What kind of message was that when he did that, because obviously you know, especially now now you see Gap doing business with Kanye West, but this was actually the first time we've seen Gay do business with people that look like us. But then the business that did it look like us. He sent a message to us, whether it was the shirt that we still for us by us, what kind of message did it send into the fashion industry? And we had damon and yeah, I'm gonna answer that first, and then I want to double back to how hard it was as a designer, because I don't think I gave that due justice an answer if that's cool, man. The message was so strong, it was everything. That commercial was everything. I remember the first time I saw it, I was like, yes for the win for us, because you talk about how hard it was. We had to figure out ways to make something out of nothing every time because we didn't have the same dollars marketing dollars as Ralph Lauren as Tommy Hill figure, so we had to fit in the culture however we could get it, You're gonna get it, you know what I mean. So that was brilliant to me, and it was so clever because they let it happen and they were so clueless to the culture that they didn't but they didn't know whoever whoever did that add I'm sure that commercial they probably got fired after, but it was it was brilliant for Foobil and it was just like such a message to the culture like we're here, went on apologetic and the best, you know what I mean. It was so dope to me because that was like the first time that we actually I felt like because now people started to research food, you will see us. That was regardless, you're gonna get this work and a gap ad or not, you know right. So so a lot of people started to realize at that very moment that rappers are not just brand ambassador's just people that is promoting the product, but rappers are actually a part of the brand absolute and if we if we if we have to talk about that, we cannot say that, um we can't say fool without because he was to meet the foundation, I still have their first act with them in front of the house, you know what I mean, Like yeah, like l L got them to the point when the world knew about them. That gap Ad was a big part of it, you know what I mean. But like he pushed and it's almost like a nod to the culture. Right, So it was it was besides them having dope product, That's what it was. You said that first Adam, you said you got to still at the first football ad and what is that old in front of like, um, I don't know if it's Damon's or one of the queen's house. And they got the hanging out the car and it's quite too was there? Man? You gotta stop downplaying rappers influence this man. So wait, you asked me about the designer. Let me just answer that real quiz. It's hard as hell for a design them. And it's really hard because it's hard because the word it's noise of mind. Brooklyn. This is it's just Brooklyn to worry about it. She's good, she's good. It's just very it's so competitive now it's way more competitive than than when I started. When I started, there wasn't a street where there wasn't urban fashion. There was nothing. It was like going into the wild wah West, like it wasn't there. So we were literally creating it right by trusting our instincts. I started, I reversed engineered into the business because I didn't have a blueprint. I was literally feeling hip hop and like listening to how we felt and expressing that. And that's how my team was expressing it, and that's what translated into the clothing. Right. But we couldn't go in the store and buy anything that looked like us, that felt like us at that moment. It wasn't there yet. And the popping stores was A and s at that time, right, may you know about that? Okay? And that's that's was like Macy's like that, you know, So it was and that's what's the first it was. It was and that's the all Mans. I don't know if you remember the all that was on thirty fourth Street. That was like, um, that was that was like a Macy's too. But yeah, so so it was really hard. And in the beginning for us, it was really hard because nobody believed in hip hop. So the bias were like, it's a fat it's gonna go away, it's not gonna last. Why should we boy this while you have the Lord Sweats was as expensive as Felis. Who are you? You know? Like, so we had to constantly tell him, no, it's gonna last. We had to do tricks like I can remember, UM, to get in the doors. We were like one of the first all canal cross colors, UM, Triple five, Soul, P and B. There are a few of us, you know what I mean. Um, But we had to kick in those doors to open them up so that they became accepted in mainstream. And one of the tricks we did I can't remember. They were black Dead Dead. They have to black and brown, black and brown, UM and an Asian and a black shoutout to share and brew anyway. They they we had to really fight for that space. We had to because it wasn't accepted, Like the music was making money, but they thought it was gonna go away. They weren't believing in it yet. So I remember going to death Jam walking in one of the room's funny story and it was a room full of interns. I was working with Deaf Jahm at this time, doing a lot of styling and stuff, and I came in the room. It was all interms calling asking for a record to he played in these record stores, like the records stores. They wanted to break these records. And a light bulb went off and so I went back to the office, like find the top ten stores in the top ten cities in every hood, every hood start find out where they shop right now, like the viny styles of the world, like that, you know exactly. So we found out right with the ten cities we wanted to be in, the ten cities we needed to be in. Detroit was one of them at that time. Yeah, Detroit was one of them. Chicago was one of them. No, not then, not yet. But we we called them for like six months and then we showed up with our little sweatsuits and they're like, will you being everybody's been calling, we couldn't find you and stuff the ones that didn't accept us that. When that didn't work, we say, let's put it in the window for Look, we're gonna leave six suits with you. Just put them, give us real estate, put them one in the window, put them in the front, don't put us at the back, don't don't pay. This is what I like you to your punk up slignment. We're gonna come back in a week. If they don't sell, no harm done. And then we would saying six of our friends in that week to buy them. So just blow out, right. So between those two tricks we built our market. Because once they sell, they believe in it and they started selling it for you. But they gotta believe in it. So you know, that's some of the stuff we had to do. But we just had to create create that magic, just like hip hop. Let me. We had grand Master kaz he right, and he was talking about the commonality between punk rock and hip hop coming in in the fashion side. I'm thinking it looks like the like the skateboarding world was doing urban fashion as well. Was there ever any Yes, it was an intersection. I think that people missed that part of it in the early nineties the late eighties, like skate surf and hip hop all like think about I don't know if you remember, oppificly, yeah, we all about so you know about it. Alexander Queens que in them all, the guy lives out Here Now started specifically got to start and I think his sons and artist now but whatever. That was one of those brands that like exactly, it was a lot of them. And then it was the show called the a SR Right. A SR Show was like the Magic Show. Magic Show. Yeah, it's like a huge show that comes to everybody from around the world comes to shop that has a story in Vegas in Vegas, still in Vegas, and literally the ASR Show was like the Skate Search Show. But then hip hop was like we need to be there too, so because literally you could have on an opie shirt and then you can have more your denim overside shorts, and then you have on your kicks. So it was just like mixing it all together and everybody was vibing together. That's how the Lower east Side vibes were or you know, um Frisco Oakland like those it was. It was that was the vibe. Let me ask you a fashion tip and they're gonna go to the QuickTime with Slime. You're coming back to the Magic Show and then Vegas, Um can you We're NIKEE? What Adidas? Or is that a stuff for I feel like I don't feel right. It's all school. See I'm old school, so that doesn't feel right for me. Like it's like you gotta rocket all together. Yeah, that looks wrong. I'm just saying I've been seeing a lot of my fashion novels. But it's it's there's no limits anymore. Like that's the thing the other day, sitting there with easy everything on in a Nike sock that just bother Yeah, that's serious. Yeah, that's serious. I don't even go to the gym like that. I'll be looking because I'm like, someone's gonna take a picture at me with with just sucking pull a sock on. It feels like you're set tripping or some ship. Amen, listen, that's fashion tripping. That sing for sight tripping. So you cannot do that. Let's just tell us to the young boys. Yeah, if you never want a knife. If that coming from from my era, it was a no no, because they're wilding out here. It depends on what you repping, like if you get money or you're getting a check from the datas or you're getting check from Mike keeping insistent. Okay, now let me let me just ask you this that's on the lower end brand. Can you wear Louis what go? Y'all? You can mix it up? Is that not racist? That sounds like a new second. I'm not asking for me, asking me, asking for somebody. I got to think about you can think about that, because this is true. I see people rock up duty Louis hat, Fendi hat. I might have did it with me, but I've seen what I've seen people repeat offenders. I'm one. I made one felony. You never said like people because my my Instagram they're very negative people. So when I post it, they're like, you're going on the Gucci belt. But I see people get away when it's designer. But if I do Adidas, I don't yes, and I put on a Jordan's hat, they're talking about my mother you what are you doing? I think that might be more men like tipping on that. Yeah, it's probably people I know, like why are you doing this? But if they were offended hat, what a Gucci belt, they could get away with it. Well. So I was also gonna say it depends, isn't like logo logo logo because you can have one of a Gucci shirt and nobody knows it's Gucci and then have a belt on that just you know what I mean, And people are like this one part it's understated. Another part is overstay you know what I mean? You could do that like less, it's more sometimes I think you can mix it up with it's not all in your face, Lets get away with ship. Because I also heard you say that you thought that that was the person that brought out the logos, like when the logos actually came so you can't really have a real friendly and then Nike pants on with the same type of logos that just bothers you. Right, it doesn't sit right with me. But can you tell the people that did it wrong? He persisted, go hard? Right? Can you go hid? No hard? I think that, Um, so it's hard to do that. That's like what I should say to you, is it's like censorship, me saying that, Okay, we'll walk away headphones, go with T shirt. I didn't had on and didn't had on No, but the shoes wouldn't matter at that point. Then he had on car hard shorts, the car start yeah, get away. Yeah, I sunked up. I think I sunked up my analogy. It wouldn't meant to be so now the Magic Show, yep, the Magic Show was legendary. Now let me actually talking to going kind of mad, kind of connected to the Magic Show, but asking about how things evolved for you guys. I had a story. That's how we met. I opened up a store with my my partner he gives called Crazy Goods here in Miami because it was hard to get these brands. Um and even then, it was hard to get the brands down here so and we got we had where in each ye uh was some of the other brands that Echo was at that time when they couldn't with the tapes, Mecca Esco. Yeah, so we was trying to get all that stuff. But this is the problem we ran into that retail wasn't really my passion. I was doing this to create a hub for hip hop locally. But then I quickly found out I really don't like retail because the only way they were selling to us was in packs like Costco. You had to buy Impacts pre packs because we were young men with no credit in retail credit and they were and they were and they were forcing us to buy these packs in order to carry these brands, and they were pre packed, and then they were sending us all the stuff they couldn't sell that was usually sweaters and pants that were forty five ways or for whatever, forty eight ways. That and I was catering to high school kids at the time, and eventually it wasn't it wasn't even worse, you know, And then we lasted till about thousand until finally the department stores locally started buying. And then that made it even worse because then they brought down the price and we had to hike up the price because of the packs. You know. So did you guys know that that was happening and was it because it almost felt to us like, man, do these brands not know that we're all the culture here, let's let's win. So basically, what you're saying in in in a smaller fail is walk Away was priced at one price in New York City, but when it came to the South. No, no, no, that's not what I'm saying. It made it hard for a small boutique hip hop clothing store to eat, to have to be in business, is what I'm saying. This is good. Yeah, yeah, reading people, Yeah, so yeah, did you guys, like what was your thinking knowing that that was going on? So let me explain it back into that because I definitely feel your pain for us being young designers. Um being a designer period. We needed to pay our bills, right, So black and brown designers, here's another challenge we have. There's something called minimums when you produce in fashion at the factories, and the minimums then weren't low. Just like when you go to buy a house, sometimes black and brown have to pay more and then so the same thing, like if you want to be in this business, we need twelve units per color in your order. We have to sell into that. And when you are ordering like I want one small, I want three mediums, I want it's very hard for us to do business with the factories that way. So we have to buy and bolt, and then we have to do our homework in the map. We got to look at the averages around the country and say mediums and largest are selling, the most smalls are selling, the least double x is are selling. This was the business, not just us, it's everybody, right, So you put you put together your side scale and say this is how I think my hood is gonna buy my customer um and then you say, I need to get dollars in a minimum order if you want to play, because if it's not that, because here's what was happening on our end. Like I'll give you an example I had. I had a distribution almost zeal a few times. One was with Threats for Life with Crods Colors. Mom was with um Usa Classics which they had Ever Last Dance, Scanned, Fat Farm, all these people, but when you deal with them, they want big numbers it's just like the record and you know, distributions. They want you to sell. Now I'm want to dance because it's not independent totally anymore. Right, i gotta make them happy. But at the same time, I'm not wharring my brand. I don't want to intense stores on every block. So I'm gonna make sure that if I'm gonna build with you in your store, I'm treating you right. But you're gonna be exclusive in your hood. But now you gotta buy into my business and you gotta build with me invest um, and that's the only way it's gonna be sustainable. Now I have to have a conversation with the retailer because he doesn't want to sell you. He wants to sell the guy down the block that can do bigger numbers, because that's all they care about. And I have to be like, nah, he's official, We're gonna go with this guy. So we had to have minimums to pay bills. And then on the other side, often my business was percentage, so I took a loss a certain percentage. No one I was gonna take a lord because dudes were buying off their credit cards or doing C O D at that time, and a lot of people was just luck, you know, like I'm investing in the hood, like they're investing in me. I pray they pay their bills. But sometimes a lot of the times that came back, they bounced them and stuff like that. So that court that's costs of business, you know. So I had to write that off, but just keep trusting the hood and then fight with the dudes that were the distributors. So all that stuff was happening. That that's the business. So as I watching the documentary, right, I seen Mesa talk about times where she styled a person and then they took the style from her and I didn't call her back and didn't when it came time for so I have to ask you the same thing. It wasn't the time you styled the artists, and the artists blew up, and then it came time for them to like show love back and say, you know what, I'm doing the shoot in Paris and I can have you, but I'm gonna hire pepper lip pew. Yeah, I'm sure they were. I'm because you're not drinking. So usually this is an easy question. So um, no I care say, like per se, because I did have a lot of love when it came to the tribe. But I walked away at the height of what was perceived success. For the next question, yeah, so I didn't really have that problem per se. I think that, Um, it was more problems like honestly being a woman in a man's world. Sometimes not getting paid, like trying not to pay me um, And I had to put that ugly head down to make sure I got paid, you know what I mean. No one actually front I never got fronted on in that way because we leaned out of the styling and really focused on the business of walk Away after a while and did more of that than anything. Nobody gave walk Away too, and then they blew up afterwards and they didn't want to wear walk Away anymore. Oh, I'm sure that happened. I mean, because this time around it's a lot harder than it was last time. So when you asked before about designers in and designers now, there are a lot more designers and we're living in the age of technology, and so it's a d D and a lot of times the last thing you see is what you love. It's not like um, loyalty anymore. You know where I came up in loyalty in a different time of like brands meaning something of substance. I think you got fashion over, you got all this disposable clothing. Um, you know, like to me that for us by us was real. It's a different time now, Like in terms of the thought process of like I wanna I'll see you, I'm gonna wrap my people. You know, I don't see that so much anymore. You know. I think we were trending last year, but I think it's going back to business as usual, So you know, I see it. You know, Um, last year was our best year. Yet we had to kill a year and walk away, you know. But I just think that, Um, I want to see how sustainable that is for us US, you know what I mean. Like in terms of black and brown designers. Now, you you had like to what we like to call to Dave Chappelle dro meaning you walked away at your height. A lot of people don't understand that. Like, like I was hanging with Dave Chappelle the other day and I'll never ask him this, and he'll just just voluntarily say, man, I just wanted to leave, And I just mean I was looking at him because I was such a fan what he was doing. I don't want to act like why the funk would you walk away? Or why do you do that? But I got you here so so um, because that was the rumor, like why would she walk away? The company is doing great clothing and selling you know, why did you walk away? When you walked away? From walking away? M hmm. I think that I came up. I started in this business right when it was. I was twenty one when I started with Fashion and Effect, so I was still junior in college and I literally, you still look twenty one, by the way. I'll take that, all right, I'll take that, thank you, thank you, thank you. Um. But I started at twenty one and and it was just me falling in love with hip hop literally and and no one. I didn't want to work for someone else, right, and then I found something I was like, I can definitely I was a hustler, so I knew how to elongate in this. But I want you to answer this question. But was there any other women inspirations that owned that company at the time? Yeah, it wasn't, okay, So so now fast forward. I watched it become this multibillion dollar business, and I watched a lot of designers get screwed over that. I've met with a lot the designers. I would always say, hold your trademarks. Those are your master's right. But a lot of people didn't understand it. I got sometimes, if you are in love with something and you get to see the inside navigations of it, you can fall out of love, you know. And the fashion business mirrored the music business. So to give you context, in the nineties, all the black music label divisions started closing closing up. You remember that, Yeah, And shortly after that they started saying urban fashion was going to be dead, the decline of urban fashion. I saw the writing on the wall. I started telling everybody. I had something called Alliance of Minority Designer where I brought us all together, like I'm buying ten thousand yards, you're buying ten thousand yards. Let's buying together. Let's build like yeah for like dinnim or whatever, just the power together. Like if we do this together, we will be the industry because we will all getting men. But I think early twenties, no one it was a d D without the internet. You know what they are at the bar, like let's live you know, so fast forward. This is after Mike wlling my stuff in the ring like it was at the height of Mike Tyson. Mike Tyson views a little crazy, okasticking regular microphone Psten talk about it was all these moments that led up to this space. But I felt very heavy. It was all about the business I was watching. Was it was a lot. It was a lot. It was related everything. I related everything like it was. Everyone was congratulating me, and you you can't even understand this, but literally it's gonna sound crazy, but the seasons were changing and I wasn't even seeing that because I was so focused and so like stressed on what was ahead that I wasn't seeing. I wasn't even I could see you and not see you. But it wasn't me being flaky or stuck up. It was just that my mind and somewhere else, you know what I mean. And I had to catch myself, like everyone's congratulating me, but I feel like sho. I had a New York showroom in l A and a Vegas show room and I'm I'm traveling all the time. Everything's it was all over the place, and I I wasn't being creative. Number One, I went to magic it looked like a ship show. It was just like a circus, everybody trying to get free product. It was just who could have a bigger booth. No disrespect to everybody, but it just became this big marketing vehicle of like who had the biggest guns. But we weren't doing business anymore. And I saw the decline coming because I had already seen what was happening in black music. It was just a ripple effect because fashion and music are the two biggest forms of inspiration and for us it's our culture. So I knew what was coming. Like I just was like, I'm out, you know what I mean, Like, I just I chose me. That's literally what happened. Because I was almost afraid to walk away at that point because I was so attached at that moment to walk away. It's like when I feel like, it's like that sound of walk away. So let me ask you bouncing around someone coming by the brand? No, I owned it. I owned all the equity that I just shelved it to take my USA. And the way that you describe magic is the way that the music conferences started to turn into how hard so magic? You buy booth um, It's it's an approval process. You buy a booth um like the Grammys. Almost it's it's your Grammys, you know what I mean, and you come and I remember the first time we did it, we didn't even have a They didn't put us on the floor because it was no street where anything. It was just like, we don't know where to put you. So it was myself, it was Karl can I and it was Cross Colors, and they gave us a conference room right outside of it, and we we made a booth. We made a booth that was a jail cell, and we sent out invite and said come serve your sentence, and we invited all the buyers and they all came. We stood like two million at that show, and then we were on the floor after that. That was like when it first started. So let me actually, was there other black designers on the floor that wasn't you all but black designers that wasn't hip hop? I had no idea. I can't even confirm that. Okay, okay, that's that's cool. I'm just trying to picture. But what I can't confirm is it felt like you can hear a pin dropt at Magic At that point, it was stepped through. It was like no disrespect used car salesman, a table, quiet his hiss a shirt, here's a jacket. You know. It was quiet. It was very wonder bread and was fooboo bigger at that time. Fool wasn't out yet, it wasn't even there yet. Holy. I remember when they first was started and they came that like I met with them. Yea, wow, it was coming to you before they started. Puffy bad Boy, Like a lot of people came and talk when they were starting, when they started their coming. Okay, how about rocket with rocker wear? Damn. A matter of fact, I told yeah, damn and me talked a lot. And when he tried to do it himself. I remember when they want. I was at John Street. They were downtown. Um, they had an office downtown, and he decided he wasn't gonna do it his his own, but he bought like seven machines and he called me like, yo, you want these seven machines, Like I'm not gonna do it myself. I came and got him and yeah, hold on, he took the machines off his hand. Yeah, I took him like he was. He was like, I can't do this myself, you know, like I guess he tried. Wait wait a minute, kids, that is clueless, clueless that wants to start fashion. Hold on, hold on, hold on. Are you saying you guys could literally have your own machines and make your own clothes yourself. That's right, Get the funk out of here. I never really kind of. I always thought, you guys will make a T shirt or something, sitting everything else to China. Well, you can do that too. But when we started, literally we started out of our I started out of my house before I had this store, and literally I made my own cutting table um. I was not sewing, but I was designing. And then our success leaves clues. So I had borrowed some adapts, tailors and some other people that I knew. Bell had people uptown in Harlem and people that were doing it, doing what we loved, and I was like, that's the formula right there, So come over here, this is how I want to design. This is what I want to do. Can you make it? So we we bought the fabric. We were the creative directors and the designers, and then we we set up the tables. We bought the machines we could see what everybody had from jukies, two singers, and we got busy. She's a success. Leaves clues when hip hop we thought we made our own music and sold our own tapes. This is the that's the real fucking ship. You can cut your own ship. Go take them six floor sues cause signment, make them make it real. Okay, First for that, what were the five hottest spots in New York City at that time when you wanted to get your clothes just to find it doesn't have to be the five boroughs, the five Simmons was one Simmons. Simmons was one for us. Simons was on Belmont in Brownsville. Okay, I definitely okay, Simmons was one Brownsville back then. Dr Jay's back in the day Dr Jameson was a spot. Um, I would say, um before that even a j Lester's uptown that um it was what else would be shopping Saunda, Yeah, No, that wasn't even out yet though. Dr Jay's, Like, there weren't a lot of hot spots in in Brooklyn to me, like we would have New York City period. You were going to Macy's, you were going to Ans, you said, a lot of them like Shirt k Oh, you mean stories like anywhere. Yeah, it was. I would say Miguel. I would say Miguel Navarro. Shout out to Miguel. He was super dope. So hey, Suss can do my son. He made clothes for all of them, like they were in Brooklyn bok of mixtapes. Um, you know, but they were legends in New York City. And and when you think about them, Peter Schoe, you know all those guys, We made clothes for all of them. And then um and and Miguel was one I made clothes. Um, I would say call his shop was a dope spot um Shirt King's definitely there was bell up Town. Shout out to bell Um. And then it was rapp and then of course goddamn, goddamn, let's make some noise for that. It's a part of our show where we play a games called quick Time with slim Um. You are not drinking, so you can pick someone out of the crowd and you can pick them and they'll drink for you. So we're gonna give you multiple choice. Let's pick the person. Listen, even though these two guys right there, which which one you feel? You know what? You can alternate shot. You could be like I feel like I feel like wrestlers deserves it, Like where's the shot glasses? We're gonna take the shots with all right, because she's not taking the shots, but we're gonna take. We're gonna we're gonna take. And you could be totally completely cook. You could say both. When you say both, that means that they drink. One of them drink both both or either. You can look and say you say both of them drink. You could say just him drink because you could not like them. It's okay, it's okay. So you asked me to ask you the question, and then you can uh do whatever you gotta do. Okay, are ready to answer? Just answer the question. If you ask them both, did they drink? Okay, you say did they drink? Okay? Come on camera, yeah, come okay, come on, you're a part of the show. Yeah, YouTube, Barris, come on, I know the first one that you should make them both drink. I'm just being honesty, but I don't want to. We gotta drink too. I forgot, forgot because actually was my sur somethe cool lata some alright, alright, cool, but I'm pretty sure you're gonna make them both drink and drink for this shot. Shot. But I could be wrong. Everybody, how are you gay? Comet nas or jay z h oh? They all right? Dolly got wrong, motherfucker, April Walker, goddad. I knew she's gonna play the game. Even though I knew she was gonna be She's gonna play the game, Okay, the correct way. Respect or loyalty. M hmm, I say respect, because with respect you get loyalty. DMX or Tupac. I love. That's a hot one. Man. You ain't even got ain't even gonna do it even have both these bozo dudes take a shot. We're taking a shot to me, we'll have four if you want. Okay, so I love both. I'm gonna have to go with pop Okay, Okay, alright, Miami or l a m hmm, okay, this go god damn there, you're gonna got damn. I'm in cheers, cheers, cheers. Oh man, take a shot, boys, man, that's my Majuanna is not tasting, it's hitting that mal wanma huh okay, shut up, Mamajuanna. Okay, you're ready. You have to get your shot. Yeah, oh, I didn't take minds. I'm sorry. I'm playing the game for real. Nineties are two thousand hip hop. I expect that Farella Kanye West to take a shot because how confident she was. I respect that. I respected that. I don't even want to know why. Okay, this is a new question. They added this Kanye sneakers or for real sneakers. It is a twist. It is a twist. It could be here. Yeah. Yeah, but we got a dream we need she said, neither. Holy shit, this is a fashion not on. This is y'all ship ship. I'm all school, I got all stasmus. That's right, Okay, all right, okay, you guys are assholes. Okay, eighties clothing, first nineties clothing. That's kind of hard. Both well, I mean my shot is already, bart Yo, come on, Boris, Boris, borest man, come on yo. This whole time you have shot, you're doing. You take a shot. You're not drinking, you're not drinking. Words or he's gotta drive forgot studdy. That means you gotta take double You did you didn't drive right? Or did you? Alright? Cool, I We'll take your shot. I got damn take your shot. I'm taking it to a little I'm taking the toothy took an uberman relaxed. Okay, I don't know where you're gonna go with this this one. I'm very very curious. One because you're a hip hop fishionado, and two because you're a woman. We asked this to a lot of men, Cardi b or Nicki Minaje, Cardy, you said that very fast and very tough. I'm gonna have to ask why on this one because I'm looking at the whole, the whole vibe, and I think that Cardi, we look at like what she's accomplished, like as a businesswoman who fierce. Okay, this one, I don't know where you're going puff Daddy or Dr Dre mhm mm hmm. Shot were in if you want to go shot. No, it's whatever you've been picking never it is in your mind either way. Uh. I would have to say from a music standpoint, a standpoint, I'm gonna go with Dre. From a business standpoint both, I saynds like a shot to me, she picks alright, cool, I'll have one, lady. Okay podcast or radio podcast. I think I'm taking the shot of that as well. Your problem if you go on, we didn't live together, let's do it so look. Oh that that one was a little harsh. You get to be so much. Um. Yeah, yeah, you really get to know people, Okay, major or independent? Mm hmm. Independent. He just smiles every time someone says it independent. Even if he doesn't smile, just look at his face. He's smiling. He's just he just he just feels like this because I just think, if you can survive independently and own everything. But I tell him, there's nothing against anything major. But if you own and you can survive independently, then you can take advantage. If you go to a major, but you can still maintain ownership or something go first, then you lose ownership. I don't disagree with him. What I what I do believe is still own your brand, but use that major market. But if you can usually both both. The nice part about ownership it's legacy, and that legacy you could pass on to your kids, your grandkids, and that's a nuity growth And well, god damnit, listen, I'm I'm for sure. I don't know what you're gonna say on this one. I thought I was for sure, but I don't. Queen LATIFU or MC light. M hm oh, I'm for sure. I knew she was gonna see. I was for sure, but I didn't want to say that because I didn't want to look stupid. But I was for sure. I got damnit, I'm gonna be loosing Carbones the Knight. Get dam ready he could take a shot? One shot? Letim take one shot? Got damn? How was like one of her first videos, like it's a rock paper then, because what you're telling to me is just paper the classes we need the vote on here man light and man Yeah, that would be dope. Get them on. Yeah, Okay, I'm gonna let you get away with this. What if Mesa calls me, I'm calling you because Googy loop or Mesa wrong or that one. I'm gonna go with vote the reason why. I'm gonna let you get away with that. But I feel like Mesa talk ruby, Am I inaccurate with that? I'm not sure a long time. I'm so sorry, Google, Please don't text me. He's don't text me in the game a long time, but he's definitely, you know, taking note for the grades, but he's been in Googy did one of my first campaigns like way back back. Yeah, you've been in the game. We're talking. Mmm, that might have been in like ninety two. Okay, my bad movie. I did not know that. I'm taking a shot for not knowing time anyway, So I'm taking the shop for that holy ship, all right. Ain't that was a good one though. Ah, that's that summer watermelon by the way, I listen. I just want both of these people to know that we love them both. We just always asked this question because I feel like they both a little mad at me. We keep asking this question for Foxy a little Kim. Yeah, that's for me. It would be I'm a I'm a say bo Okay, April, I love Kim though, I'm gonna say I love Kim. Kim from my neighborhood, and so is Foxy, and so what they represent to the culture is priceless, and they both could spit by it. So I can't do this. That is the greatest choice, and they can't be mad at the did you drink your everybody? I try to cheat this one, big, your big punt, big. I respect that. Here is where I don't know where you're gonna go. Okay, I think we should do a drop roll Carcanal or fool. I have to go with car because what I'll call it wouldn't be Foo. I knew that as yeah, Cross Colors or Mecca. I gotta go with Mecca because Tony Shellman was my first sales god that started Mecca and he started with me, and Tony helped me get them salves out there in a huge way. Guys are doing a great Yallas fashionable. Listen. I would I want to put Cross Colors against Damnage. I know this is because we still quick time with side. But was Poco good? Poco? I like your girl, your whole girl face. Still see your faces. Floco had some fly stuff though they had some fly stuff. But I want damage too. You know, Used definitely was out there too. It was so many your friend your friends just hurt my whole childhood. I didn't own it, but I didn't like it all right. Where we got there, oh Virgin Dan, because without then there would be nothing else. I respect that they went. They went a little crazy with this one for Rapsody or Bahama dea mm hmm. That's hard shot getting ready, it's getting ready, shot ready, good, they're both fired. Alright, cool, We're taking the shot too, right, We're not just just holding it that. You guess that's how a little shot out. We don't see the shot. Okay. Last one, mob deep or m o PM. I thought she was gonna go Brooklyn with it. Yeah, but I'm just mob deep, like one of my anthems. What is that? What is it? Well? I love sick ones, sugar ones. You know what's the project stole from cooking crack? Yeah, that that is it. That is the sugar ones being that is from cooking cracks. He told us that makes a noise, crack tells a fair cracks trackward, I don't know he told us that. Listen, I know he told the man. We gotta ask. You know, we do all due diligence, just like every other guess. We have to go. We have to understand. And one thing that kept popping up was the first thing I did not know. I did not understand. And as I dug in further, I didn't want to dig because I said, you know what, we got the queen here. Let me not do uh, you know, internet gossip ship. Let me ask her the rerecord. Okay, what is the discrepancy between you and Virgin? If there is any the discrepancy is a Varsity jacket that he put out that has two WS on it. Big he's selling it. It's selling a lot and he sold a lot of them. And I actually saw it first to Carlos Classic Material, which is my dog, and he sent me car okay, So Carlos, damn me, like yo, what is this? And it is a sack at And in the sacks side it's a Varsity with the two W. But the two ws looked just mirror reflection of this w W athletic um mark that I've used since ninety three. Like that's the one, I said Mike Tyson warning ring Um, we just did a run. We dropped it for Christmas and um in Christmas, I think we sold out in like two days and it was like a moment in time, like we deleted drops when we'll talk about So we talked about Mike Tyson. Remember at the end of the last year of Mike Tyson did that fight. So we sold out at that same time. So we've been selling it um continually and after it happened, it went kind of viral. This was Women's History Month and Black History Month and people were talking about it. UM. So I know. Well, let's say allegedly, I believe through different people in the culture that was saying like nothing. So finally I had to talk to some lawyers that reached out to try to settle this amicably, because because I don't want to I never would want to even do that, you know, but I have to protect our trademarks are masters. And remember remember remember the point because I remember this one year that Pucci came out with the with the puff there was that something. Did you feel like that when you saw yep, I would that. Then when everybody I believe that did Louis Vuittonucci actually did and he got no credit. So but that's how you got it, zeal because black Twitter came for them, you know. And so I will say I also believe the only thing worse than racism in this country is sexism. And I say that because I didn't I didn't have after that rally with that support, you know. And it's just things you noticed as a woman, you know, no disrespect because wrong is wrong. I'm so happy that got that and um and that and for me, you just heard it. I'm an indeed, So I'm not doing this to get a collapse. It's about protecting what's yours and what you've built up over the last three decades, you know. So for me, it's not okay. Um, when you think about Starbucks, when you think about when you think about different brands that are iconic, they're iconic for a reason. We're an iconic brand. To think because you put stripes here, it's gonna make it different if my customers are confused and congratulating me and saying dope collab or a lot of my customers were getting confused and try. So that's clearly the arrogance of another brand saying we can do that and people won't notice, you know, and how dare you win? We're not. We're an established brand, just like a lot of the other iconic brands, you know. So I just really wanted to also stand up and protect black and brown creatives because, like you said, it's not a first. It happened to Dapper Dan, It's happened to a lot. Tyler Perez just this happened to him. It happened to so many instances down there, like you you heard in the remix when they were kidding about Mesa and Findy, and you know, it keeps happening and we can't. We just can't. Let it's happened more now with technology, where do you see these drive bys take place with independent designers and they just take make, regurgitate, and sell our magic back to us, and we just allow it. So I think a lot of disignors. I think they'll be out gunne because they know they can't stand up in legal proceedings. You know they can't. It's too expensive. So they're banking on that, you know that they can get away with it. So I just I'm hoping that this case is taking a stand for all of us, not just me. So let me actually, did you know Virgil prior to this? No, you never met him? Never met him, never met him? Because it seems like something that's like so easy to agree. I agree, and I was hoping that we could. You know, my lawyers reached out, but um, they reached out to them, They reach out to Sacks, and from my understanding, they don't want to stop selling it. And this was the offright of this. Louis ar Okay, Yeah, we need to put the pictures. We need, we need, we need, we need to put the pictures. And I think that just from the standpoint, like when you're confusion, that's where the problem is and you're saying, this is not the roblem you wanted to go. Yeah, I mean I would have never liked to get it to this point. But at the same time, I'm not just gonna lay down here. You should make a noise for you about that. But black and brown creators, let me just say this, like, that's the trajectory of my work, like for us UM in terms of paying it forward. You literally black and brown yea literally too. So there you go. So no, that's what we do. Like so so, like I do a lot of educational work. I mentor and reverse mentorship ship. I'm big into mentorship and reverse mentorship. I surround myself by a lot of younger designers UM, and they're looking at me, They're looking at UM. I want them not to be a right to do what's right, you know. And at the same time, this is how we grow right and and and that. Like vid sick, I'm working with VIDs sick. I don't know if you've heard of VIDs. What's that. It's a it's a new platform where you can connect one on one and searchers on there search say he actually introduced me he's working with them, but I'm working with them. That's one of the platforms. What's funny about search? Search hits you and be like, yo, this is search. Like you're locked in, buddy. He still introduces itself, but like this is like you can't you know back in the days, like yeah, he's like, yo, yo, this is search. Like wait a minute, you not know if you have something called contact lock. We know who you are, sir, Relax, I'm sorry, I'm sorry hit me today and he introduced himself again. I said, no, that's the old school ship. You come on, let's do that. Let me ask you something. Has anybody who ever rocked your clothes? And the way where you said this, dude is a buffolio because because because it's about how you rocket, now you give you give us for the same clothes, it's gonna be about two of us rocket the wrong way. So have you ever had somebody rocket where you was like, rocket, don't stop it? No? I never had that because, to be honest, we worked with artists that they got stopped, that that had style or that had so I think that brands, if you're lucky enough, you choose to work with artists that are in alignment with your value system. It's like pop the et, Naughty by Nature, EPMD, all those guys were in alignment what we stood for, you know. Um there were times when we had to turn down artists like who Rump was still skinning and the niggas needed some clothes, and you said, actually we did the album covered, so no, they weren't. One was playing around the group around definitely, I was playing around. Okay, what was the group? I'm blinking out with their name. I promise you describe it one maybe it was true. But the two guys, one of them, they were so dope, but they were pop artists. No. Um KOs had a fight with UM oh don't. Oh my god, he got disrecord against me right now. It was a joke PM don the PM on this left and it was kind of ill disrecord to you. I gotta stay out. It didn't hear ye. Hype Hype at that time was doing a video and I was cool with hyping and you didn't want to do people. So I think they did the video in my apartment, like the main single that whatever the video was that, but it just wasn't congruent with the brand. You know what I mean. I thought they were dope, but you got them right. And then at the time I had Pock, I had Biggie I. I didn't want a chance the not just what the brand value system is. They're dope, but it was a different lay to me and I exactly that's exactly what I was saying. So now for we spoke. We spoke about Magic Magic Conference. Magic Conference, which was ill to me because I used to go out there and get free closed. I did not realize that I had holes in the free clothes that I was getting because they was sampled. I didn't really realize that to us in the hood floors. And he was like, you know, you got a holy ship. I said, holy movie. I said, okay, let's move off from that. Yeah, we had to cut them off fashion Week something that I personally because me, I'm not like a fashion god, just like fly Ship. But I don't like to invest into the fly ship. But I'm invested into the flysh Ship, but fashion Week, I don't invest there. I don't care about these models that come to the town. And now I was trafficking on fifty seventh Street. When I go to fifty seven Street, all the time and it's okay, So I don't care about these models named Sasho. What what's the point? Bro? But I'm not in fashion for fashion person fashion week? What does this mean? It is this, y'all super Bowl? Because to me, it's like soccer, Like, you know how the world loves soccer, but we don't give a funk about soccer. Let's just throw it out. Let's just throw it out there. The soccer fan is gonna let's give me the fans soccer trash ship, keep kidding the ball and everybody swam and it's only three points. Good. So that's how I feel about fashion. But wait, wait, I want to kind of add on to it. I'm gonna say it's it's going into fashion. Do you feel that? Okay? What's the best way to describe hip hop fashion? It's I always feel like urban fashion was kind of like a weird way to say it. Is it? I say, um, it's lifestyle. It's really lifestyle. It's just wearing it. Right, So, in terms of putting labels on, I think we're the only category that has like had eight different names, right, So, for lack of better words, we could say hip hop fashion, though, right, do you feel that we've that it's evolved to the point where it's mainstream fashion and that's why now it's going into fashion Week. It's one of the biggest industries, made the most money. And come on, so come on, man, I got you just gotta spray cree. You gotta make sure the devil is not larking. You know what I'm saying that the okay, cool cool, So I don't know if he does. So, um, yeah, I just want to get you just a fashion week. Well that's my whole goal right now. So fashion week week. Yeah, I've never been a fashion week like contender. Like I've never depended on fashion week to dictate my success or validate my dopeness as a brand. Um, if you look at the color of people that walk the run with, it's very different a lot of times for the designers that are allowed into fashion. So it's it's problematic in a lot of ways. I think the world just changed. It is just not fast enough. I'm not waiting for it to change. So, um, your tribe is your trial. You don't need a fashion week to tell you. So I feel like you're saying you got heat fu. Fashion Week I'm saying that it worked for some people and for some people it doesn't. It's not for everybody fashion weebody. It's not for everybody fashion week like like like it's fun. It's it's like, it's not something like let me get it out of you. That's one Listen. Listen, listen. That's one thing that Drake and car you could agree on right now because they're going out at each other. Listen, y'all. I want you'll both to realize fashion Week for both y'all. Fashion week, right, I don't get this because the guy named Pierre, he's giving up Vivi Cligo. He's just walking around. I'm an indie, so you know it's not like as an empty it's not the important. They only invite me anyway. So like I'm in town, Yeah, not been mad, just go to fashion show recently. Yeah, come on and disclaimed out in all fairness, it was swim Week, same assholes and be any rating white fashion For the disclaimer. I have to say, I'm getting ready to do a collapse with another brand and you might see it at fashion Week through their brand, and you'll be right there because you already went. So I like the free drinks I got. I gotta throw that out. I didn't like it. They tees stick too. I like, obviously want to say fashion week that day. I actually was there sober that day. No, that was fast. Have a swim week. Oh so that's okay. I live in Miami. Swim were a little different. Shark. You gotta go with your wife and just act like you like this ship. Oh yeah, yeah, okay, you gotta you know, you want to stay married. You know what I'm saying, like, alright, god, yeah yeah, because I'm just you know, I was mad. But they showed me my smoking sections. I have seen a smoking section. I said, hey, hey, that's all you got. That's the cheat to this ship. Have a smoking section with non stinking cheese. Because the cheese they had there that it smelled like the thunder from down under. Holy moley. It was not good. April Walker. We love you, Thank you? What what's what's so? What's next? Up? Before we get about it? It um just I'm doing a book that the audio is dropping. I have a book called Walker Gyms. Get your Ass off the Couch. I brought me for you walking Jim's Get your Ass off the Couch. It's all about the passion for two UM and the audio is dropping. The audio has it was produced by Milk d. It has rot progress on it. UM, It's gonna be go. And then I do a lot of educational work. So I'm doing a class with Clide Davids Music Institute this at n y U. This is full UM and it's called the Sound of Fashion. I'm excited about that music in fashion. UM. Work with the kids. Shout out to Global Finance, teach them B y O B be your own brand, build your own brand, vizig vit sick, all about vit sick. You want to find me? Find me for fashion Friday Fridays for new up and coming designers. I'm doing monthly collaborations. I'm consulting. This is the one on one you want, so you me there if we recommoried that I'm taking a shot for her because you know what our show was about giving people flowers. And you know, as I researched your story, I really thought your story was out there. I really thought. But then when as I as I started the research, I started to say, I don't know it, so how many more is me? And I kid? You know, I know I said it earlier, and I know I said it in a playing way, but I always thought designers had it the easy way. I did not know. Yeah, I did not know that. Y'all. I got the same hurdles as us, maybe if not worse than us. So I want to give your flowers right now. I want to tell you how much you appreciate it. Want to tell you how much that we love what you did, how much you paved the way, um ic, how iconic you are, because like I said, like I really thought when I asked you, when I we searched you, and I really thought you had someone that you said, you know, I could base this off of, you know, Elizabeth Taylor, or so I thought you was gonna say that when you said I had nobody, that ship touched me just now, like I mean, like I knew your story, but just now you me, you say like I had no boy, I just like you know what, I want to compete with what's going on, and that to me has to be saluted, That to me has to be respected, That to me has to be honest. And I don't want anything that happened to you. We want to tell you that to your face. And this is your platform, this is your home. You want to perform. If you want to promote your new slipper line, you can perform it. I mean promote. I meant to say promote. If you want to promote your motherfucking new Eyeline online, you want to promote pink toe nails, that's just for a little toe, just for the little tough ye just letting a fashion week, especially fashion week is in Miami because we out here. This is your home. This is for hip hop, and you are hip hop. You are not a visitor person of what you are hip hop. When I've researched you, I have very fun researching you. I like and I love that. I love when I go and researching and it's fun because it's like, oh, ship, and you don't talk much, you don't talk much, very to yourself. But I love the fact that you was open with us. I love the fact that you and we want to tell you to your face, we love you, We appreciate you. You are a hip hop icon. You are a hip You are a person who shape the mold of how we dress, how we feel, and how we operate. And we love that and we really appreciate you. Here drink Champs makes it more so We're gonna take a picture and you do a drop. Again how important this show is. Thank you so much because you're telling our stories, yes, and you're doing it fearlessly. You're not diluting, and you're empowering. So thank you, Thank you right thanks for joining us for another episode of Drink Champs hosted by Yours truly, d J e f N and n O r E. Please make sure to follow us on all our socials. Let's at drink Champs across all platforms at the Real Noriegon, I g at Noriega on Twitter, mine is at Who's Crazy on I g at d J e f N on Twitter, and most importantly, stay up to date with the latest releases, news and merch by going to drink Champs dot com For more. Podcast from my Heart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.