Hey, fellow travelers. I'm Lari Gottlieb.

Hey, fellow travelers. I'm Lari Gottlieb.

I'm the author of Maybe You Should Talk to Someone, and I write the Dear Therapist column for the Atlantic.

I'm the author of Maybe You Should Talk to Someone, and I write the Dear Therapist column for the Atlantic.

And I'm Guy Wench. I wrote Emotional First Aid, and I write the Dear Guy column for Ted. And this is Deo Therapists.

And I'm Guy Wench. I wrote Emotional First Aid, and I write the Dear Guy column for Ted. And this is Deo Therapists.

This week, a man feels guilty that he isn't connecting enough with his mother in another country during COVID. Oh, and he's not just any fellow traveler. He's a special guest that you may already know.

This week, a man feels guilty that he isn't connecting enough with his mother in another country during COVID. Oh, and he's not just any fellow traveler. He's a special guest that you may already know.

The roles reverse as we get older. And one of the things that I've noticed in that role reversal is there can be a lot of feelings of guilt.

The roles reverse as we get older. And one of the things that I've noticed in that role reversal is there can be a lot of feelings of guilt.

Listen in and maybe learn something about yourself and the process.

Listen in and maybe learn something about yourself and the process.

Deo Therapist is for informational purposes only, does not constitute medical advice and is not a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of your physician, mental health professional, or other qualified he provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. By submitting a letter, you are agreeing to let iHeartMedia use it in Potter and Full and we may edit it for lengthen or clarity.

Deo Therapist is for informational purposes only, does not constitute medical advice and is not a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of your physician, mental health professional, or other qualified he provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. By submitting a letter, you are agreeing to let iHeartMedia use it in Potter and Full and we may edit it for lengthen or clarity.

Hey Guy, Hey Laurie.

Hey Guy, Hey Laurie.

So I'm really excited because today we're doing something a little bit different on Dear Therapists. We are still answering our listeners questions, but we have a very special guest who's going to join us to do an episode of speed Advice.

So I'm really excited because today we're doing something a little bit different on Dear Therapists. We are still answering our listeners questions, but we have a very special guest who's going to join us to do an episode of speed Advice.

Our guest is Jay Shetty.

Our guest is Jay Shetty.

He's a friend of ours and we asked him here specifically because, like us, his mission is to help people live better lives by becoming more aware of their emotional roadblocks. He has a new book out that we can't recommend highly enough.

He's a friend of ours and we asked him here specifically because, like us, his mission is to help people live better lives by becoming more aware of their emotional roadblocks. He has a new book out that we can't recommend highly enough.

It is called Think Like a Monk.

It is called Think Like a Monk.

Spoiler alert because he used to be a monk. Now Here he is sitting between two therapists. So Jay, welcome to the show.

Spoiler alert because he used to be a monk. Now Here he is sitting between two therapists. So Jay, welcome to the show.

He Guy, Laurie, thank you so much for that is it'll sounds like one of those jokes, what did two therapists and a monk do in a bar? It's awesome to give you, It's awesome to be with you both. Thank you for having me. I'm a huge fan of both of your work, so glad to be here with you. Thank you for having me.

He Guy, Laurie, thank you so much for that is it'll sounds like one of those jokes, what did two therapists and a monk do in a bar? It's awesome to give you, It's awesome to be with you both. Thank you for having me. I'm a huge fan of both of your work, so glad to be here with you. Thank you for having me.

Oh well, it's our pleasure.

Oh well, it's our pleasure.

We were talking about how in your book you help people with the same kinds of issues that we do, relationships, anxiety, self sabotage. So normally on our show, people get two therapists giving advice, but today people are going to get two therapists and a former monk, and I just want to let people know that think like a monk.

We were talking about how in your book you help people with the same kinds of issues that we do, relationships, anxiety, self sabotage. So normally on our show, people get two therapists giving advice, but today people are going to get two therapists and a former monk, and I just want to let people know that think like a monk.

It's such a game changer.

It's such a game changer.

It has been a huge bestseller because it is resonating so widely with people who really want to find a way forward, which is what we like to do on the show.

It has been a huge bestseller because it is resonating so widely with people who really want to find a way forward, which is what we like to do on the show.

And that's why we're so happy to have Jay here as our special guest in answering these questions.

And that's why we're so happy to have Jay here as our special guest in answering these questions.

And I have a question for you, j You are a college student, you are pursuing a degree in business, and then decided to become a monk, and that's an unusual career shift. So I'm very curous that people who knew close friends, how did they respond.

And I have a question for you, j You are a college student, you are pursuing a degree in business, and then decided to become a monk, and that's an unusual career shift. So I'm very curous that people who knew close friends, how did they respond.

Yeah, it's really interesting to go back and reflect on how people reacted to that decision, which was big, extreme, massively rebellious, completely against the grain, and my college friends were all shocked and surprised. I got everything from you know, you're never going to get a job again, through to family and friends saying things like, you realize you're wasting all your parents' efforts of getting you a good education. This is a complete waste of your life, and you're making the worst decision. And it's really interesting because the noise was really high. But a big part of thinking like a monk is being able to turn down the noise and tune in to your inner path and in a calling and in a voice. And I felt that that was really strong. Then the hardest thing was when I actually came back from living as a month three years later, they were like, we told you so. So that was almost harder because the noise that I came back to was, well, look, no one's going to give you a job now. You just wasted three years of your life. So actually coming back was somewhat harder than leaving.

Yeah, it's really interesting to go back and reflect on how people reacted to that decision, which was big, extreme, massively rebellious, completely against the grain, and my college friends were all shocked and surprised. I got everything from you know, you're never going to get a job again, through to family and friends saying things like, you realize you're wasting all your parents' efforts of getting you a good education. This is a complete waste of your life, and you're making the worst decision. And it's really interesting because the noise was really high. But a big part of thinking like a monk is being able to turn down the noise and tune in to your inner path and in a calling and in a voice. And I felt that that was really strong. Then the hardest thing was when I actually came back from living as a month three years later, they were like, we told you so. So that was almost harder because the noise that I came back to was, well, look, no one's going to give you a job now. You just wasted three years of your life. So actually coming back was somewhat harder than leaving.

So when you came back, you wanted to share with people what you had learned, because you felt like it wasn't about this person sitting on a mountaintop and being removed from the world. It was about how can we use all of this in very practical ways in our daily lives.

So when you came back, you wanted to share with people what you had learned, because you felt like it wasn't about this person sitting on a mountaintop and being removed from the world. It was about how can we use all of this in very practical ways in our daily lives.

You're this like young cool guy. You're not what we think of when we think of a monk.

You're this like young cool guy. You're not what we think of when we think of a monk.

So how did you think people would get your message or response to your message?

So how did you think people would get your message or response to your message?

To be honest, I've never even thought about it. I feel like when you've found something that's so valuable and so useful, you don't stop to ask yourself questions about whether someone's going to listen to you or not. If you come across something truly powerful, the last thing you're thinking about is am I the right person? Or is this the right messenger? You just want to share it.

To be honest, I've never even thought about it. I feel like when you've found something that's so valuable and so useful, you don't stop to ask yourself questions about whether someone's going to listen to you or not. If you come across something truly powerful, the last thing you're thinking about is am I the right person? Or is this the right messenger? You just want to share it.

Well, we are so excited to bring your wisdom to our listeners. So are you ready to take on some of their questions.

Well, we are so excited to bring your wisdom to our listeners. So are you ready to take on some of their questions.

I don't know if I'll answer them as well as you and guy, but I would definitely try my best.

I don't know if I'll answer them as well as you and guy, but I would definitely try my best.

All right, I'm going to read the first one. They usually start, your therapist. I'm going to skip that.

All right, I'm going to read the first one. They usually start, your therapist. I'm going to skip that.

Because now it's dear therapist and a former monk.

Because now it's dear therapist and a former monk.

I am almost forty years old, and I have a successful career as an accountant working for multiple large corporations. In my search for another position, I realized that I really genuinely don't want to do anything related to tacks or accounting. It really makes me feel sick just thinking about going back to that. I love interacting with people, talking about perspectives and emotions and talking about myself as well as to others about their stories and issues. The simple answer is to go back to school and get a degree in something else. However, that doesn't seem to be the answer for me, as it brings up more questions and anxiety than answers. Can you help me?

I am almost forty years old, and I have a successful career as an accountant working for multiple large corporations. In my search for another position, I realized that I really genuinely don't want to do anything related to tacks or accounting. It really makes me feel sick just thinking about going back to that. I love interacting with people, talking about perspectives and emotions and talking about myself as well as to others about their stories and issues. The simple answer is to go back to school and get a degree in something else. However, that doesn't seem to be the answer for me, as it brings up more questions and anxiety than answers. Can you help me?

Thank you so much for the detailed question. It's great to have some of those subtle insights into your particular journey. I think it's really brave of you to acknowledge that something that you've invested in and done until the age of forty is something that you're not comfortable with a lot of people never get to that stage because it's so hard to even admit to yourself that, hey, this thing that I've been investing in for maybe twenty years is not what I'm looking for. I think the key thing here is, first of all, to realize why doing tax still has value in your life. Often we look at things as binary. Either it has value or it doesn't have value. So at one point your current career had value and now you almost feel like it has zero value. The truth is it still has some value. It may pay the bills, it may put food on the table, it may take care of your family, So it still has some value. And allowing yourself to recognize that allows you to keep doing those things if that's still important to you. At the same time time is exploring and experimenting with your curiosity. And so what I would suggest is that continuing in the work that you're doing right now to provide a foundation unless you have the financial freedom to make a leap and take a risk and start exploring. And the second thing is looking into that curiosity. So when you start looking into your calling or your passion, it's important to recognize the difference between hobbies and your purpose or something that you're really meant to do. And so you may be missing hobbies or passions or interests that you may want to get back involved in. But the difference between that and another career path is what are you so passionate about that you're willing to invest in building your strengths, your skills, your expertise, and your abilities. And so that exploration starts with courses, It starts with going to shadow people that you maybe not have spent time with You may listen to podcasts and hear about people in those career paths. This is a great time to allow your mind the openness to explore this new path, but do it in a way that feels safe and comfortable as well. Allowing yourself to test courses. Shadowing people, hearing from people who are doing career paths that you're fascinated by is a great way of starting that initial research.

Thank you so much for the detailed question. It's great to have some of those subtle insights into your particular journey. I think it's really brave of you to acknowledge that something that you've invested in and done until the age of forty is something that you're not comfortable with a lot of people never get to that stage because it's so hard to even admit to yourself that, hey, this thing that I've been investing in for maybe twenty years is not what I'm looking for. I think the key thing here is, first of all, to realize why doing tax still has value in your life. Often we look at things as binary. Either it has value or it doesn't have value. So at one point your current career had value and now you almost feel like it has zero value. The truth is it still has some value. It may pay the bills, it may put food on the table, it may take care of your family, So it still has some value. And allowing yourself to recognize that allows you to keep doing those things if that's still important to you. At the same time time is exploring and experimenting with your curiosity. And so what I would suggest is that continuing in the work that you're doing right now to provide a foundation unless you have the financial freedom to make a leap and take a risk and start exploring. And the second thing is looking into that curiosity. So when you start looking into your calling or your passion, it's important to recognize the difference between hobbies and your purpose or something that you're really meant to do. And so you may be missing hobbies or passions or interests that you may want to get back involved in. But the difference between that and another career path is what are you so passionate about that you're willing to invest in building your strengths, your skills, your expertise, and your abilities. And so that exploration starts with courses, It starts with going to shadow people that you maybe not have spent time with You may listen to podcasts and hear about people in those career paths. This is a great time to allow your mind the openness to explore this new path, but do it in a way that feels safe and comfortable as well. Allowing yourself to test courses. Shadowing people, hearing from people who are doing career paths that you're fascinated by is a great way of starting that initial research.

I love what you said about things not being binary, because I think that so often what happens is people are doing something and they feel like there's something better out there, and the thing that they're doing becomes horrible. It makes it really hard to hold on to the fact that the other thing isn't one hundred percent great, and the thing that you're doing isn't one hundred percent bad. And so it gives you that perspective, and it also gives you more freedom to explore. So it's not like the desperation of I have to get out of this thing this second where you said it makes me sick to go back to this right. The reason this person gave for not wanting to go back to school or do something else was the uncertainty. And it wasn't like you have to jump into a graduate program because you don't know what you want to do yet. Exactly what you said, Jay, it's a time to explore and to be able to sit with the uncertainty, and certainty is an opportunity because it opens up all all of these possibilities.

I love what you said about things not being binary, because I think that so often what happens is people are doing something and they feel like there's something better out there, and the thing that they're doing becomes horrible. It makes it really hard to hold on to the fact that the other thing isn't one hundred percent great, and the thing that you're doing isn't one hundred percent bad. And so it gives you that perspective, and it also gives you more freedom to explore. So it's not like the desperation of I have to get out of this thing this second where you said it makes me sick to go back to this right. The reason this person gave for not wanting to go back to school or do something else was the uncertainty. And it wasn't like you have to jump into a graduate program because you don't know what you want to do yet. Exactly what you said, Jay, it's a time to explore and to be able to sit with the uncertainty, and certainty is an opportunity because it opens up all all of these possibilities.

I agree with both of you. We often make the mistake of thinking we actually have to replace instead of ad change this and switch it out, when maybe you just need to add a component to your life that would make everything else seem more worthwhile and working better. So figure out what it is you can add, and you might find in that exploration. Actually you'll find with going back to what you did, because the combination of the two is sufficient.

I agree with both of you. We often make the mistake of thinking we actually have to replace instead of ad change this and switch it out, when maybe you just need to add a component to your life that would make everything else seem more worthwhile and working better. So figure out what it is you can add, and you might find in that exploration. Actually you'll find with going back to what you did, because the combination of the two is sufficient.

Let's move on to our next letter, and this one is about an affair and letting go, and it goes like this. When I was in college, I had an affair with a professor twelve years my senior that lasted for four years. He wasn't married, but he had a steady girlfriend with whom he lived. It's the typical story where I fell deeply in love and I believed with all my heart that he was going to leave her, but he always found an excuse not to. When I realized that I was caught in a cliche that hardly ever ends well, I found the courage to break up with him. But when I did, he uttered the words you meant nothing to me. It was the last time we spoke, and here I am seven years later. Even though I don't have any romantic feelings for him anymore, I still can't get over those words. They still hurt for me. Those four years meant so much. There was a lot of emotional intimacy. We talked daily. He was often the first person I would hear from every morning, and for hours he would confide in me, making me feel special, encouraging and advising me.

Let's move on to our next letter, and this one is about an affair and letting go, and it goes like this. When I was in college, I had an affair with a professor twelve years my senior that lasted for four years. He wasn't married, but he had a steady girlfriend with whom he lived. It's the typical story where I fell deeply in love and I believed with all my heart that he was going to leave her, but he always found an excuse not to. When I realized that I was caught in a cliche that hardly ever ends well, I found the courage to break up with him. But when I did, he uttered the words you meant nothing to me. It was the last time we spoke, and here I am seven years later. Even though I don't have any romantic feelings for him anymore, I still can't get over those words. They still hurt for me. Those four years meant so much. There was a lot of emotional intimacy. We talked daily. He was often the first person I would hear from every morning, and for hours he would confide in me, making me feel special, encouraging and advising me.

But now, because of those.

But now, because of those.

Words, every time I think of my college years, I feel sad and naive. And even though I really would like to know if he meant them or not, the last thing I want to do is contact him and ask him. I guess what I really want to know is if a person can fake so much care and attention and for so many years just to sleep with me.

Words, every time I think of my college years, I feel sad and naive. And even though I really would like to know if he meant them or not, the last thing I want to do is contact him and ask him. I guess what I really want to know is if a person can fake so much care and attention and for so many years just to sleep with me.

So, Jay, what do you think about that one?

So, Jay, what do you think about that one?

Yeah? Thank you for your courage on sharing that with us. A lot of the time we look to gain closure from other people. We look to gain answers and reason for something from the other person, but often the other person is not physically accessible or emotionally mature enough to have that conversation. It's really important that we provide that closure and the answers and the reasons to ourself through our own reflection of what we've experienced and what we've been through. When you look at the scenario that you've painted there and the person saying those words, those words are probably shared in pain and spite from their side, and not a reflection of you or what you gave to the relationship or what you committed, but more of a reflection of the state of mind they were in. You stood up for what was right for you. You stood up for what you thought was the best way forward. And if that's something that someone couldn't understand or someone couldn't respect or respond to in a positive way, then you can be pretty sure that you made the right decision to move on. But I would suggest that you allow yourself to reflect on the situation and find the closure, recognize that final state men had very little to do with you, and more to do with how that person fell at the time.

Yeah? Thank you for your courage on sharing that with us. A lot of the time we look to gain closure from other people. We look to gain answers and reason for something from the other person, but often the other person is not physically accessible or emotionally mature enough to have that conversation. It's really important that we provide that closure and the answers and the reasons to ourself through our own reflection of what we've experienced and what we've been through. When you look at the scenario that you've painted there and the person saying those words, those words are probably shared in pain and spite from their side, and not a reflection of you or what you gave to the relationship or what you committed, but more of a reflection of the state of mind they were in. You stood up for what was right for you. You stood up for what you thought was the best way forward. And if that's something that someone couldn't understand or someone couldn't respect or respond to in a positive way, then you can be pretty sure that you made the right decision to move on. But I would suggest that you allow yourself to reflect on the situation and find the closure, recognize that final state men had very little to do with you, and more to do with how that person fell at the time.

It's interesting, Jay, because what's confusing her is that he was twelve years her senior. He was the professor, he was the one she expected was the adult, and so if he said it, he must have meant it. But he actually wasn't responding as an adult. He was responding as a child. He was lashing out because his feelings were hurt, which kind of implies that he actually did care. People can be in a relationship in a big age difference, and sometimes it's the younger one that's the more mature, and so they keep taking, you know, what the older person is saying too much to heart.

It's interesting, Jay, because what's confusing her is that he was twelve years her senior. He was the professor, he was the one she expected was the adult, and so if he said it, he must have meant it. But he actually wasn't responding as an adult. He was responding as a child. He was lashing out because his feelings were hurt, which kind of implies that he actually did care. People can be in a relationship in a big age difference, and sometimes it's the younger one that's the more mature, and so they keep taking, you know, what the older person is saying too much to heart.

And I think it's so true that when people are hurt, they say hurtful things, and we sometimes forget that, we personalize what they say, we take it at face value when they're just responding from this place of deep woundedness. This is a person who clearly cared about her, because if he didn't care about her, he wouldn't have been so wounded. And I think that we have to go back to what you said, Jay, and what you're saying Guy too, about you know, we all have this place of knowing inside of us, and she knew at the time this is not right. This is not healthy for me. This is not a reciprocal relationship, and she knows that now.

And I think it's so true that when people are hurt, they say hurtful things, and we sometimes forget that, we personalize what they say, we take it at face value when they're just responding from this place of deep woundedness. This is a person who clearly cared about her, because if he didn't care about her, he wouldn't have been so wounded. And I think that we have to go back to what you said, Jay, and what you're saying Guy too, about you know, we all have this place of knowing inside of us, and she knew at the time this is not right. This is not healthy for me. This is not a reciprocal relationship, and she knows that now.

But the problem is that.

But the problem is that.

Those words are just imprinted in her mind and she's not going to that place of knowing that I knew this wasn't right for me. I knew he didn't have my interest in mind. I think that's going to be really important for her hold on too that I know what's right for me. I know what's healthy for me, and this even ruminating about this is not healthy for me. You're listening to Dear Therapists from my Heart Radio. We'll be back after a quick break.

Those words are just imprinted in her mind and she's not going to that place of knowing that I knew this wasn't right for me. I knew he didn't have my interest in mind. I think that's going to be really important for her hold on too that I know what's right for me. I know what's healthy for me, and this even ruminating about this is not healthy for me. You're listening to Dear Therapists from my Heart Radio. We'll be back after a quick break.

I'm Lori Gottlieb and I'm Guy Winch, and this is Deo Therapists. Our next one is about boundaries. I have a mother who has severe depression. Although I don't live with her, she calls me often being negative, down and crying. I try to help her in the past by talking to her, listening, suggesting things she can do, and every time she would find an excuse not to help herself. I'm at the point that I struggle myself with my anxiety, which results in not wanting to speak to her as I don't want to feel more down. She thinks, I'm selfish. How can I deal with my mother without feeling guilty?

I'm Lori Gottlieb and I'm Guy Winch, and this is Deo Therapists. Our next one is about boundaries. I have a mother who has severe depression. Although I don't live with her, she calls me often being negative, down and crying. I try to help her in the past by talking to her, listening, suggesting things she can do, and every time she would find an excuse not to help herself. I'm at the point that I struggle myself with my anxiety, which results in not wanting to speak to her as I don't want to feel more down. She thinks, I'm selfish. How can I deal with my mother without feeling guilty?

Yeah, I like our parents. There are superheroes and they make everything happen. And then often the roles reverse as we get older and they start looking to us for inspiration or motivations or guidance or resources or whatever it may be. And one of the things that I've noticed in that role reversal is there can be a lot of feelings of guilt and a lot of feelings of not being able to reciprocate or respond with the love or the support you may have received growing up up. And that can be a really tough situation to be in. And what I've seen has helped many people is recognizing that sometimes it's not us that our parents need. It's introducing them to different insights, teachers, books, resources that can help them, and providing them with a community, a group of friends, encouraging other people to partake in their life, encouraging them to connect with other people in their lives. It's not the easy way out. It's actually the sustainable way for them to also move forward is by not making them fully dependent on you. And sometimes we can feel that someone's fully dependent on us because we're allowing them to only depend on us for that joy or their happiness or whatever it may be. So allowing that person to find a community, helping them find that community, helping them find that next step for them. It's a patient process.

Yeah, I like our parents. There are superheroes and they make everything happen. And then often the roles reverse as we get older and they start looking to us for inspiration or motivations or guidance or resources or whatever it may be. And one of the things that I've noticed in that role reversal is there can be a lot of feelings of guilt and a lot of feelings of not being able to reciprocate or respond with the love or the support you may have received growing up up. And that can be a really tough situation to be in. And what I've seen has helped many people is recognizing that sometimes it's not us that our parents need. It's introducing them to different insights, teachers, books, resources that can help them, and providing them with a community, a group of friends, encouraging other people to partake in their life, encouraging them to connect with other people in their lives. It's not the easy way out. It's actually the sustainable way for them to also move forward is by not making them fully dependent on you. And sometimes we can feel that someone's fully dependent on us because we're allowing them to only depend on us for that joy or their happiness or whatever it may be. So allowing that person to find a community, helping them find that community, helping them find that next step for them. It's a patient process.

I think so many people are caught in what you're talking about, Jay, where they feel like I know how I can help my parent, meaning I can refer them to a therapist, I can give them this book because they're grieving. What happens is we aren't able to have a boundary. We feel like that somehow it's selfish to set a boundary. And the problem is that negativity is so contagious, and you talk about this in your book, Jay, where the most contagious thing in a household is anxiety negativity, And if somebody doesn't have that under control, it affects everybody around them.

I think so many people are caught in what you're talking about, Jay, where they feel like I know how I can help my parent, meaning I can refer them to a therapist, I can give them this book because they're grieving. What happens is we aren't able to have a boundary. We feel like that somehow it's selfish to set a boundary. And the problem is that negativity is so contagious, and you talk about this in your book, Jay, where the most contagious thing in a household is anxiety negativity, And if somebody doesn't have that under control, it affects everybody around them.

And so it's not.

And so it's not.

Being selfish to be able to say to your parent, I love you so much and I don't want to see you struggle so much. I am not the person who can help you through this in the most effective way, but I'll help you find a therapist, or I'll send you some books on this or whatever it is, that there are other ways that you could be there and be helpful that are actually more helpful than you're having these conversations all the time that go nowhere.

Being selfish to be able to say to your parent, I love you so much and I don't want to see you struggle so much. I am not the person who can help you through this in the most effective way, but I'll help you find a therapist, or I'll send you some books on this or whatever it is, that there are other ways that you could be there and be helpful that are actually more helpful than you're having these conversations all the time that go nowhere.

I think it's when you have a parent who's really depressed and you have to do this lifting from afar to say to them, Look, I understand you're depressed, and I understand it's very difficult. I want to be there for you, but I can't be there to the point that I start feel like I'm drowning as well. So I want us to talk about how we can make our conversations a little more balanced. I'm happy to listen at the beginning to what's going on, and at that point she should be providing emotional validation rather than advice necessarily. But then to pivot and say, and now I want to tell you a little bit about me, and let's see if I can brighten your day by talking about me a little bit. So there's a little bit of a balance there between the positivity and the negativity. And to come to a contract with him, I'm to an agreement that that's what we're going to do. We're going to have elements of both.

I think it's when you have a parent who's really depressed and you have to do this lifting from afar to say to them, Look, I understand you're depressed, and I understand it's very difficult. I want to be there for you, but I can't be there to the point that I start feel like I'm drowning as well. So I want us to talk about how we can make our conversations a little more balanced. I'm happy to listen at the beginning to what's going on, and at that point she should be providing emotional validation rather than advice necessarily. But then to pivot and say, and now I want to tell you a little bit about me, and let's see if I can brighten your day by talking about me a little bit. So there's a little bit of a balance there between the positivity and the negativity. And to come to a contract with him, I'm to an agreement that that's what we're going to do. We're going to have elements of both.

I'm learning so much. I love hearing you birth. This is fantastic.

I'm learning so much. I love hearing you birth. This is fantastic.

It's so interesting to hear the overlap between how we is therapist approach something and how you approach something with the teachings from your work.

It's so interesting to hear the overlap between how we is therapist approach something and how you approach something with the teachings from your work.

And this is why I think your book is so time because over the past ten twenty years there's been a real influx of Eastern thinking into Western psychotherapy in a way that makes us all richer for it.

And this is why I think your book is so time because over the past ten twenty years there's been a real influx of Eastern thinking into Western psychotherapy in a way that makes us all richer for it.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I agree.

I agree.

Our next letter, in fact, I think is something you talk about too in your book. It's about this idea of revenge and why that's not helpful for us. And here's how the letter goes. Dear Therapist and a Monk. It has been a year. I was engaged and he wanted to marry. After one visit from his daughter, he sent me a WhatsApp message saying he could not leave his old life and start a new life. He put a photo of him and his daughter hugging each other. I was mad, broke the contact immediately and now I want revenge.

Our next letter, in fact, I think is something you talk about too in your book. It's about this idea of revenge and why that's not helpful for us. And here's how the letter goes. Dear Therapist and a Monk. It has been a year. I was engaged and he wanted to marry. After one visit from his daughter, he sent me a WhatsApp message saying he could not leave his old life and start a new life. He put a photo of him and his daughter hugging each other. I was mad, broke the contact immediately and now I want revenge.

Is that a good thing to do? And we think this is a very quick letter. We know that the answer is no, but we give we want to give a quick explanation as to why.

Is that a good thing to do? And we think this is a very quick letter. We know that the answer is no, but we give we want to give a quick explanation as to why.

Yeah, I think we all agree that it doesn't matter what the question is. Revenge is not the answer. I was just thinking about it out loud of just like yeah, I was trying to think when would I agree that revenge is the answer, and I can't seem to find a reason, And so I think it's important to explain why revenge is never the answer because revenge places the control and validation of your joy, happiness, and success into someone else's hands. So if you now want to take revenge, the only way your revenge will be satisfied is if that person feels pain. Chances are they may actually feel absolutely fine. And so now you've gone on this whole journey to get a response from this individual that may not give you the response you want. And so revenge as a concept in and of itself is flawed because it has no guarantee and it doesn't make you feel a sense of safety or security or improve your self worth. The key thing here is to reflect on what you feel about you was lost or affected in this situation that happened? What was it about this situation that makes you want to take revenge where was your ego hurt and then creating a plan of action. There's some part of you that doesn't feel as positive about you anymore, and that means that putting some light on it and working on it and helping yourself develop that self confidence, that self esteem, whatever it may be that may have been lost you to this scenario is really where your focus should go, and that's going to make you more attractive internally and externally to anyone in the future, as opposed to trying to get that person's validation from the past.

Yeah, I think we all agree that it doesn't matter what the question is. Revenge is not the answer. I was just thinking about it out loud of just like yeah, I was trying to think when would I agree that revenge is the answer, and I can't seem to find a reason, And so I think it's important to explain why revenge is never the answer because revenge places the control and validation of your joy, happiness, and success into someone else's hands. So if you now want to take revenge, the only way your revenge will be satisfied is if that person feels pain. Chances are they may actually feel absolutely fine. And so now you've gone on this whole journey to get a response from this individual that may not give you the response you want. And so revenge as a concept in and of itself is flawed because it has no guarantee and it doesn't make you feel a sense of safety or security or improve your self worth. The key thing here is to reflect on what you feel about you was lost or affected in this situation that happened? What was it about this situation that makes you want to take revenge where was your ego hurt and then creating a plan of action. There's some part of you that doesn't feel as positive about you anymore, and that means that putting some light on it and working on it and helping yourself develop that self confidence, that self esteem, whatever it may be that may have been lost you to this scenario is really where your focus should go, and that's going to make you more attractive internally and externally to anyone in the future, as opposed to trying to get that person's validation from the past.

Yeah, I'll add one thing that, giving the suddenness of this, you might this person might do some work on looking back and seeing what they might have missed. This is a big abrupt about face. They're probably signs there, and it may be worthwhile to start looking at those and seeing what other indications of this their world, Whether you swept them onto the rug, compromise too much, miss them, what have you. There's a lot of learning that can be done here, and there's no learning that you get from revenge none.

Yeah, I'll add one thing that, giving the suddenness of this, you might this person might do some work on looking back and seeing what they might have missed. This is a big abrupt about face. They're probably signs there, and it may be worthwhile to start looking at those and seeing what other indications of this their world, Whether you swept them onto the rug, compromise too much, miss them, what have you. There's a lot of learning that can be done here, and there's no learning that you get from revenge none.

Yeah, this reminds me a little bit of that letter we talked about earlier, where the actions of somebody else are sitting with you, but the other person isn't feeling it. The other person looms so large in your mind, but they're in a different place. And so just to even be able to have a better perspective on wait a minute, this person broke up with me on WhatsApp right with no conversation, no respect of a face to face conversation, no warning, no indication, or maybe there were some indications that this person missed, But the fact is this person treated her with a complete lack of regard. And it's funny when people treat us with a complete lack of regard. Sometimes people say, oh, but I love this person, I want to be with this person, and I want to say to them, do you really want to be with someone who treat you like that? And so I think the better use of her time and her emotional real estate is to say, wait a minute, I need to be clear on the kind of person I want to be with. This is a wake up call for me because clearly this is not the kind of person that I want to be with. I don't want to spend my time thinking about how I can get back at him, because it's not going to help me in any way I want to think about helping myself move forward.

Yeah, this reminds me a little bit of that letter we talked about earlier, where the actions of somebody else are sitting with you, but the other person isn't feeling it. The other person looms so large in your mind, but they're in a different place. And so just to even be able to have a better perspective on wait a minute, this person broke up with me on WhatsApp right with no conversation, no respect of a face to face conversation, no warning, no indication, or maybe there were some indications that this person missed, But the fact is this person treated her with a complete lack of regard. And it's funny when people treat us with a complete lack of regard. Sometimes people say, oh, but I love this person, I want to be with this person, and I want to say to them, do you really want to be with someone who treat you like that? And so I think the better use of her time and her emotional real estate is to say, wait a minute, I need to be clear on the kind of person I want to be with. This is a wake up call for me because clearly this is not the kind of person that I want to be with. I don't want to spend my time thinking about how I can get back at him, because it's not going to help me in any way I want to think about helping myself move forward.

Lari and Guy, I think this is an interesting topic that I'd love to pick your brains on. We've heard two examples now of relationships that started with a bit of baggage or when things weren't necessarily transparent or clear to some degree. So we had this scenario of dating someone who has a long term girlfriend and being aware or maybe we're still married or maybe not. But the point I'm making is if a relationship starts with a lack of transparency, what does studies and research show about relationships like that and how they usually pan out? You know, if you get honesty from someone three months in, or you know about someone but you think they're going to change and we're hoping that they're going to leave their partner, how does that factor into our decision making when we actually get into a relationship. Are we setting ourselves up to fail?

Lari and Guy, I think this is an interesting topic that I'd love to pick your brains on. We've heard two examples now of relationships that started with a bit of baggage or when things weren't necessarily transparent or clear to some degree. So we had this scenario of dating someone who has a long term girlfriend and being aware or maybe we're still married or maybe not. But the point I'm making is if a relationship starts with a lack of transparency, what does studies and research show about relationships like that and how they usually pan out? You know, if you get honesty from someone three months in, or you know about someone but you think they're going to change and we're hoping that they're going to leave their partner, how does that factor into our decision making when we actually get into a relationship. Are we setting ourselves up to fail?

So that's a really important question, And the way I think about it is that relationship dynamics are like cement. When the cement is wet. At the beginning, you can mold it, you can make changes, you can shift things around, shape it. But the minute it hardens. It's very difficult to mold. Now you have to take a hammer and a chisel to it, and it hardens really quickly. There's an unspoken contract we enter when we're starting to date someone in which we're communicating nonverbally that if I'm not calling you on something, it must be okay with me. If I'm not bringing up something or trying to change something, I'm agreeing to it tacitly. So we have to pay incredible attention in the early stages, and I mean early as in first ten fifteen dates. Because everything you're accepting then, and you're accepting it. If you're not voicing that you're not, you are kind of signing on for in the long term. So to say, oh, nola'llah address that later is a mistake. The cement will be dry, it'll be much much harder. You have to pay a lot of attention very early.

So that's a really important question, And the way I think about it is that relationship dynamics are like cement. When the cement is wet. At the beginning, you can mold it, you can make changes, you can shift things around, shape it. But the minute it hardens. It's very difficult to mold. Now you have to take a hammer and a chisel to it, and it hardens really quickly. There's an unspoken contract we enter when we're starting to date someone in which we're communicating nonverbally that if I'm not calling you on something, it must be okay with me. If I'm not bringing up something or trying to change something, I'm agreeing to it tacitly. So we have to pay incredible attention in the early stages, and I mean early as in first ten fifteen dates. Because everything you're accepting then, and you're accepting it. If you're not voicing that you're not, you are kind of signing on for in the long term. So to say, oh, nola'llah address that later is a mistake. The cement will be dry, it'll be much much harder. You have to pay a lot of attention very early.

Yeah, And I.

Yeah, And I.

Also feel like at the very beginning trust is being established. People think, well, I don't want to tell my new partner about this thing because they probably won't like it. So I'm going to wait until they already are into.

Also feel like at the very beginning trust is being established. People think, well, I don't want to tell my new partner about this thing because they probably won't like it. So I'm going to wait until they already are into.

Me, and then I'll reveal this.

Me, and then I'll reveal this.

And that is so dangerous because what happens is the person is now into you, and now you're going to tell them something that they were not expecting, and then all of a sudden, there is this damage done to the trust. So you want to start building trust from the very beginning. If the person is going to want to be with you, you want to tell them those things early on because they will appreciate that if it's going to work out, it's going to work out, and if it's not going to work out, it's not going to be any better when you tell them three months or three years down the line, it's actually going to be far worse.

And that is so dangerous because what happens is the person is now into you, and now you're going to tell them something that they were not expecting, and then all of a sudden, there is this damage done to the trust. So you want to start building trust from the very beginning. If the person is going to want to be with you, you want to tell them those things early on because they will appreciate that if it's going to work out, it's going to work out, and if it's not going to work out, it's not going to be any better when you tell them three months or three years down the line, it's actually going to be far worse.

That's great advice.

That's great advice.

So it sounds like.

So it sounds like.

This person yet kids, and he was very torn between what was going on with the kids and whether he can be in a relationship or get married again, and he wasn't telling her about that, and then it comes out and it seems like this thing out of the blue, But for him, it might not have been out of the blue at all. For him, he might have been thinking about this from the very beginning, but he felt like, oh, I'll just work it out myself in my head.

This person yet kids, and he was very torn between what was going on with the kids and whether he can be in a relationship or get married again, and he wasn't telling her about that, and then it comes out and it seems like this thing out of the blue, But for him, it might not have been out of the blue at all. For him, he might have been thinking about this from the very beginning, but he felt like, oh, I'll just work it out myself in my head.

Not good.

Not good.

I want to suggest this to our listeners. I'm going to read the next letter, but I want you, when i'm done, to pause and think of how you would respond to it given what we just said, because it's a similar scenario. So let's see what you got from that and how you might apply it to the following. I mean, you can cheeven just listen to what we see, but I'm suggesting it might be fun to maybe see what you would say to this letter. All right here it is. I've been dating my boyfriend for close to three years and the relationship is very healthy. We have talked about marriage and are both divorced with children. Last month, during a heated discussion, it came out that he does not want to remarry, doesn't know if he can live with someone else. He has been divorced thirteen years, me three, and plans to buy a beach house by himself and for himself in the near future. This was news to me, as we have looked at rings and talked about a future together often. My quandary is that we are very happy together and he's a wonderful partner. Do I hang in knowing the relationship may never lead to marriage, or walk away and pursue the unknown.

I want to suggest this to our listeners. I'm going to read the next letter, but I want you, when i'm done, to pause and think of how you would respond to it given what we just said, because it's a similar scenario. So let's see what you got from that and how you might apply it to the following. I mean, you can cheeven just listen to what we see, but I'm suggesting it might be fun to maybe see what you would say to this letter. All right here it is. I've been dating my boyfriend for close to three years and the relationship is very healthy. We have talked about marriage and are both divorced with children. Last month, during a heated discussion, it came out that he does not want to remarry, doesn't know if he can live with someone else. He has been divorced thirteen years, me three, and plans to buy a beach house by himself and for himself in the near future. This was news to me, as we have looked at rings and talked about a future together often. My quandary is that we are very happy together and he's a wonderful partner. Do I hang in knowing the relationship may never lead to marriage, or walk away and pursue the unknown.

Thank you for sharing that. I'm sorry to hear that. It's never great when expectations change, especially as it sounds like to me that they were set or at least spoken about openly for three years and then for someone to change how they feel about something is definitely not pleasant to be on the receiving end of, especially if you're sure of it. For me, if you feel that the relationship is good, and that's what I'm hearing, I think it's really important to not have a heated but have a cool discussion about why that person has changed the way they feel. If you've looked at rings, if you've talked about marriage, what's happened in that person's life in their mind that they haven't shared with you. Because if you say the relationship's healthy, then a sign of a healthy relationship is that person being able to tell you why their decision has changed, what they feel is their new priority, and how they still feel about you. The next step, based on their answer will be where you can decide whether this is an investment in a relationship that you still want to continue to do, or whether it's a relationship that you don't want to invest in anymore because you're seeing that you have misaligned gold. And the third and final thing you want to question for yourself too, is what did marriage mean to you? I think it's really import ordered to define what marriage is, what the role of a husband is, a wife is a partner is, because I think often we also aren't fully aware of why we want to get married, and we've not really expressed that to the other person either. So I think defining why marriage is important or why living together is important and what it means to you will help you actually have the discussion. That will be a very clarifying conversation.

Thank you for sharing that. I'm sorry to hear that. It's never great when expectations change, especially as it sounds like to me that they were set or at least spoken about openly for three years and then for someone to change how they feel about something is definitely not pleasant to be on the receiving end of, especially if you're sure of it. For me, if you feel that the relationship is good, and that's what I'm hearing, I think it's really important to not have a heated but have a cool discussion about why that person has changed the way they feel. If you've looked at rings, if you've talked about marriage, what's happened in that person's life in their mind that they haven't shared with you. Because if you say the relationship's healthy, then a sign of a healthy relationship is that person being able to tell you why their decision has changed, what they feel is their new priority, and how they still feel about you. The next step, based on their answer will be where you can decide whether this is an investment in a relationship that you still want to continue to do, or whether it's a relationship that you don't want to invest in anymore because you're seeing that you have misaligned gold. And the third and final thing you want to question for yourself too, is what did marriage mean to you? I think it's really import ordered to define what marriage is, what the role of a husband is, a wife is a partner is, because I think often we also aren't fully aware of why we want to get married, and we've not really expressed that to the other person either. So I think defining why marriage is important or why living together is important and what it means to you will help you actually have the discussion. That will be a very clarifying conversation.

Yeah, so often people want to react and just make a decision. Well, if he's going to do this, then there are two things that can happen. We can break up or we can stay together and I'll be resentful, right, And that's sort of how it's positioned. Whereas I love your advice, which is very much how guy and I think about things, which is what's the why under this?

Yeah, so often people want to react and just make a decision. Well, if he's going to do this, then there are two things that can happen. We can break up or we can stay together and I'll be resentful, right, And that's sort of how it's positioned. Whereas I love your advice, which is very much how guy and I think about things, which is what's the why under this?

What happened?

What happened?

You know?

You know?

Sometimes we say we're in a healthy relationship, but we're not that curious about our partner's inner life. We feel so wounded, we feel so hurt that we don't make the space to say, I wonder what's going on with him. I want to understand him better, and I also want him to understand my inner world, and so can we have that kind of conversation. She says, he's going to buy a beach house and live by himself, So what's going on there with him?

Sometimes we say we're in a healthy relationship, but we're not that curious about our partner's inner life. We feel so wounded, we feel so hurt that we don't make the space to say, I wonder what's going on with him. I want to understand him better, and I also want him to understand my inner world, and so can we have that kind of conversation. She says, he's going to buy a beach house and live by himself, So what's going on there with him?

What does that mean?

What does that mean?

And I can see how this conversation can go very badly if she's angry and says, what do.

And I can see how this conversation can go very badly if she's angry and says, what do.

You mean you're doing that? Don't you love me?

You mean you're doing that? Don't you love me?

As opposed to I'm really confused about this. We were ring shopping, but you're also saying, now you don't want to get married and you want to live by yourself.

As opposed to I'm really confused about this. We were ring shopping, but you're also saying, now you don't want to get married and you want to live by yourself.

Help me understand what's.

Help me understand what's.

Going on with you, and that will help me to make choices about my life too.

Going on with you, and that will help me to make choices about my life too.

But I don't think she can make a good choice.

But I don't think she can make a good choice.

Until she understands what is going on with him, he understands what's going on with her, and then they can both have this sort of come to Jesus moment with themselves respectively about what do we want from each other.

Until she understands what is going on with him, he understands what's going on with her, and then they can both have this sort of come to Jesus moment with themselves respectively about what do we want from each other.

I think you both right on, and I think the one concent I would have for this person is that she seems to be a little bit reluctant to look under the bed at the monsters. In other words, when she's opening by saying, we have a really healthy relationship. This and this and this happened, but we are really happy together. He's a wonderful partner.

I think you both right on, and I think the one concent I would have for this person is that she seems to be a little bit reluctant to look under the bed at the monsters. In other words, when she's opening by saying, we have a really healthy relationship. This and this and this happened, but we are really happy together. He's a wonderful partner.

Hey, you're not.

Hey, you're not.

Really happy together, because if he were, then he wouldn't be planning to get a beach house without you or telling me he doesn't want to get married. And same goes to the health of the relationship. He's making unilateral moves as he's making partnering moves with you. She's getting a ring, but he's buying the beach house and telling you that. So there's a little bit of denial there about perhaps their issues here, and maybe she's not asking because she doesn't want to find out, but she needs to find out clearly at this point she needs to really be brave and say, let's talk about how you see.

Really happy together, because if he were, then he wouldn't be planning to get a beach house without you or telling me he doesn't want to get married. And same goes to the health of the relationship. He's making unilateral moves as he's making partnering moves with you. She's getting a ring, but he's buying the beach house and telling you that. So there's a little bit of denial there about perhaps their issues here, and maybe she's not asking because she doesn't want to find out, but she needs to find out clearly at this point she needs to really be brave and say, let's talk about how you see.

Things moving forward.

Things moving forward.

I think that those last two letters were very similar in that way about the denial part, what were you missing?

I think that those last two letters were very similar in that way about the denial part, what were you missing?

What were you not looking at?

What were you not looking at?

And we do that to protect ourselves, but as we can see, it doesn't really protect us.

And we do that to protect ourselves, but as we can see, it doesn't really protect us.

Ultimately.

Ultimately.

It's almost a form of self sabotage when you think about it. And our next letter is directly about self sabotage, and lots of people deal with these self sabotaging patterns in relationships, and that's what this letter is about.

It's almost a form of self sabotage when you think about it. And our next letter is directly about self sabotage, and lots of people deal with these self sabotaging patterns in relationships, and that's what this letter is about.

It goes like this.

It goes like this.

Over the years, I have become pretty familiar and well aware of my own relational patterns and picked up some insight as to why I do the things that I do, and most notably, the kinds of people I pursue when it comes to relationships. Even so, I still find myself falling into the same self sabotaging patterns. Most recently, I am ashamed to say I found myself getting involved for the second time with a man who is in a committed relationship with another woman. This was a person I had worked really hard to distance myself from and had successfully been out of contact with for over a year. I know how harmful my actions are for all parties involved, but somehow I find myself creating creative ways to rationalize my behavior. I often find myself wondering what it will take for me to translate all of this insight I have developed into actually doing something different. What needs to happen to translate insight into action.

Over the years, I have become pretty familiar and well aware of my own relational patterns and picked up some insight as to why I do the things that I do, and most notably, the kinds of people I pursue when it comes to relationships. Even so, I still find myself falling into the same self sabotaging patterns. Most recently, I am ashamed to say I found myself getting involved for the second time with a man who is in a committed relationship with another woman. This was a person I had worked really hard to distance myself from and had successfully been out of contact with for over a year. I know how harmful my actions are for all parties involved, but somehow I find myself creating creative ways to rationalize my behavior. I often find myself wondering what it will take for me to translate all of this insight I have developed into actually doing something different. What needs to happen to translate insight into action.

Yeah, it sounds like there's a lot of awareness here of that mistake that you're getting involved in this situation and repeating a pattern that you don't think is healthy for you. The second step to turn that insight into action, I would really write down and become aware when you're at your lowest point in these scenarios, I would voice note to yourself or record or write down how you feel, because what ends up happening is that our minds end up forgetting all of these challenges and pains in the pattern that comes with these bad mistakes that we make. And so I think it's really important that you allow yourself to truly face how complicated, confusing, and challenging the situation is. When you get involved with someone who's already in a relationship and it sounds like you've experienced that before, allow yourself to really process how challenge it was in the past, how challenging it was now, because that's going to be your first step in turning insight into action. The second thing is look at who and where you meet people, because you're going to find patterns in that as well. It's not only patterns in the people that you choose to be with, the patterns in the way you come across people and find people. And maybe there's even some parts of your circle or parts of your habits that you need to change in order to change this part of your life. It may be where you socialize, who you socialize with, who you spend time with. All of that is going to introduce you to a new kind of human, a new kind of person that actually may be healthier and better for you. And the third and final thing is allow yourself to set yourself a rule and a boundary that you stand by of noticing the red flags when you start seeing yourself go down that way. So when you start seeing yourself go down that lane, have a list of three red flags that you remember that you don't want to take again. That's how you would start turning insight into action.

Yeah, it sounds like there's a lot of awareness here of that mistake that you're getting involved in this situation and repeating a pattern that you don't think is healthy for you. The second step to turn that insight into action, I would really write down and become aware when you're at your lowest point in these scenarios, I would voice note to yourself or record or write down how you feel, because what ends up happening is that our minds end up forgetting all of these challenges and pains in the pattern that comes with these bad mistakes that we make. And so I think it's really important that you allow yourself to truly face how complicated, confusing, and challenging the situation is. When you get involved with someone who's already in a relationship and it sounds like you've experienced that before, allow yourself to really process how challenge it was in the past, how challenging it was now, because that's going to be your first step in turning insight into action. The second thing is look at who and where you meet people, because you're going to find patterns in that as well. It's not only patterns in the people that you choose to be with, the patterns in the way you come across people and find people. And maybe there's even some parts of your circle or parts of your habits that you need to change in order to change this part of your life. It may be where you socialize, who you socialize with, who you spend time with. All of that is going to introduce you to a new kind of human, a new kind of person that actually may be healthier and better for you. And the third and final thing is allow yourself to set yourself a rule and a boundary that you stand by of noticing the red flags when you start seeing yourself go down that way. So when you start seeing yourself go down that lane, have a list of three red flags that you remember that you don't want to take again. That's how you would start turning insight into action.

I always say that insight is the booby price of therapy. But you can have all the insight in the world. You can come to therapy every week and say, now I understand my pattern. I go after these kinds of people. This is what I do. But if you don't make changes, if you don't take action, the insight is useless and I think that what's great about this letter is this person realizes it's not just my awareness, it's.

I always say that insight is the booby price of therapy. But you can have all the insight in the world. You can come to therapy every week and say, now I understand my pattern. I go after these kinds of people. This is what I do. But if you don't make changes, if you don't take action, the insight is useless and I think that what's great about this letter is this person realizes it's not just my awareness, it's.

That I need to do something different.

That I need to do something different.

And I love your suggestions about something concrete that this person can do. So when people come to therapy and they they'll say, you know, now I understand why. It got into that argument again with my partner and I'll say, well, did you do something different? And they'll say, well, no, but I understand why. But they get into that same argument every weekend. Why are you not doing something different? What is keeping you from doing so? How does it serve you? And I think that what she needs to ask herself, which is what I ask therapy patients all the time, is if you're not taking action, how does it serve you not to take action? And so, how is it serving you right now to go after these things that are not satisfying for you? Is it because you don't truly believe that you can have something that would be more satisfying to you?

And I love your suggestions about something concrete that this person can do. So when people come to therapy and they they'll say, you know, now I understand why. It got into that argument again with my partner and I'll say, well, did you do something different? And they'll say, well, no, but I understand why. But they get into that same argument every weekend. Why are you not doing something different? What is keeping you from doing so? How does it serve you? And I think that what she needs to ask herself, which is what I ask therapy patients all the time, is if you're not taking action, how does it serve you not to take action? And so, how is it serving you right now to go after these things that are not satisfying for you? Is it because you don't truly believe that you can have something that would be more satisfying to you?

Is it because it feels safer to you?

Is it because it feels safer to you?

Is it because it feels more comforting and familiar to you even though you're miserable in it?

Is it because it feels more comforting and familiar to you even though you're miserable in it?

What is it about that?

What is it about that?

And once you can figure out what that roadblock is you can start to do something differently. I really wish this person luck, and I think they're almost there in terms of saying I need to employ these strategies so that I can do something differently.

And once you can figure out what that roadblock is you can start to do something differently. I really wish this person luck, and I think they're almost there in terms of saying I need to employ these strategies so that I can do something differently.

You're listening to Deotherapists from iHeartRadio. We'll be back after a quick break.

You're listening to Deotherapists from iHeartRadio. We'll be back after a quick break.

So a guy, we have one final letter, and it goes like this. I have not been able to see my mom for nearly a year now because of the pandemic. She's eight hours ahead in time zone, so it's tough to talk to her a lot, as she's asleep by the time I have some free time. I call her as much as I can, but I don't know how to make sure she feels loved and cared for without seeing her. I want her to know how much she means to me. I also worry about her safety, etc.

So a guy, we have one final letter, and it goes like this. I have not been able to see my mom for nearly a year now because of the pandemic. She's eight hours ahead in time zone, so it's tough to talk to her a lot, as she's asleep by the time I have some free time. I call her as much as I can, but I don't know how to make sure she feels loved and cared for without seeing her. I want her to know how much she means to me. I also worry about her safety, etc.

I think you and I should tackle that one first. Let's go first, and then we can give it to Jay. Okay.

I think you and I should tackle that one first. Let's go first, and then we can give it to Jay. Okay.

Great.

Great.

So there's so many people in this situation who have not seen parents for a long long time, and they're worried about them, and they think about them, and they talk on the phone and they keep up but they used to seeing their parents much more frequently, and so I think it's so difficult. And the letter writer is concerned that the mother doesn't know how much she means to him and how much he thinks of her, And I think that might be her concern, but it's his guilt, it's his worry, and I think that's what's generating some of this. So I think there needs to be a way where he can remind both parties about how much he thinks of her, how much she loves her.

So there's so many people in this situation who have not seen parents for a long long time, and they're worried about them, and they think about them, and they talk on the phone and they keep up but they used to seeing their parents much more frequently, and so I think it's so difficult. And the letter writer is concerned that the mother doesn't know how much she means to him and how much he thinks of her, And I think that might be her concern, but it's his guilt, it's his worry, and I think that's what's generating some of this. So I think there needs to be a way where he can remind both parties about how much he thinks of her, how much she loves her.

Yeah, what I'm not hearing in the letter is that the mother is the person who is making the person feel guilty. What I'm hearing is that this person just has so much love for his mother. That's what came across to me was how much love he has, and how sometimes we love somebody so much, but often think of all of our relationships, do we really show it? And are we sure that we're really showing it? And what can we be doing to make sure that we're getting that across? And so I think this is really less a letter about him not being a good son.

Yeah, what I'm not hearing in the letter is that the mother is the person who is making the person feel guilty. What I'm hearing is that this person just has so much love for his mother. That's what came across to me was how much love he has, and how sometimes we love somebody so much, but often think of all of our relationships, do we really show it? And are we sure that we're really showing it? And what can we be doing to make sure that we're getting that across? And so I think this is really less a letter about him not being a good son.

Because I think he probably is a good son.

Because I think he probably is a good son.

I think it's more about is he communicating how he feels to someone that he cares so much about, And so we actually have some advice for this person that we want him to try because he is right here. This is actually a letter from Jay Shetty to us. So, Jay, we want to give you a little bit of advice to take home with you as I need it, like yeah, and you're going to test it out like everybody does on our show, and then you'll let us know how it went. So, guy, do you want to go ahead and give him some.