Cool Zone Media.

Cool Zone Media.

Hello, and welcome to Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff rerun edition. That's right, it's the holidays, and that means that I am going to run reruns. And I thought, what's better to get us in the holiday spirit than that holiday band. I've decided their holiday band the history of everyone's favorite an arcopop band, Chumbawamba. It's probably not a Christmas band. In fact, they might be annoyed if I call them that. Well, it's too bad because it's my podcast and this is a history of Chumbawamba. We'll be back next week with a non rerun whatever you call it, a run, a regular run. Anyway, here it.

Hello, and welcome to Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff rerun edition. That's right, it's the holidays, and that means that I am going to run reruns. And I thought, what's better to get us in the holiday spirit than that holiday band. I've decided their holiday band the history of everyone's favorite an arcopop band, Chumbawamba. It's probably not a Christmas band. In fact, they might be annoyed if I call them that. Well, it's too bad because it's my podcast and this is a history of Chumbawamba. We'll be back next week with a non rerun whatever you call it, a run, a regular run. Anyway, here it.

Is Welcome to Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff with Margarete Kiljoy, a podcast that's about cool people who did cool stuff. Our guest today is Max Collins. Max, how are you doing? You want to well about yourself at all? What's going on?

Is Welcome to Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff with Margarete Kiljoy, a podcast that's about cool people who did cool stuff. Our guest today is Max Collins. Max, how are you doing? You want to well about yourself at all? What's going on?

I'm doing great.

I'm doing great.

Thank you, it's good to be here.

Thank you, it's good to be here.

I was going to say on this day. That is definitely a different day. I think everything this podcast knows that we record it and two takes or.

I was going to say on this day. That is definitely a different day. I think everything this podcast knows that we record it and two takes or.

Good.

Good.

Yeah, so so Max Collins our guest in the nineties, he actually did an anthropological field study on one hit wonders in the rock world.

Yeah, so so Max Collins our guest in the nineties, he actually did an anthropological field study on one hit wonders in the rock world.

That's right, everything Margaret, you're saying right now is absolutely, unequivocally, verifiably true.

That's right, everything Margaret, you're saying right now is absolutely, unequivocally, verifiably true.

Yeah, exactly, Yeah. Yeah. So today we're talking about one hit wonder Chumbawamba, And if you haven't listened to part one, what the fuck is wrong with you? Did something go wrong with your life? Why do you make the choices that you make? So go listen to that. Okay, So around the early nineties, life starts changing for Chumbawamba. It stays a galitarian, but it goes from this like loose chaotic thing into something more like a worker's cooperative. They start having tons of meetings. By one account, they spend more times in meetings than in practice. There's like eight or nine of them at this point, and most of them move out of the squat but stay in the band and stay activists, and they just want to do other things with their lives and more and more. They're also like having families and shit, right, and sometimes maybe obviously some of them are having kids in the squad, but I could imagine not being like this is where I want to raise my children. I don't know, whatever, and One of the cooler things about them is as they start doing this, they don't go off vh ones behind the music, like they keep not exploding. Some of them did drugs, some of them were sober. They date within the band, They get one of them dumps one of them to go date the other bandmate, and everyone stays good with each other more or less. Like I don't know, they I feel like they kind of like did hedonism right at least as its presented. And they're self mythologizing, right, yeah, parties and raves and shows and everything, but they're they're not doing the like trash the hotel room, draw penises, a sexually assault fans thing.

Yeah, exactly, Yeah. Yeah. So today we're talking about one hit wonder Chumbawamba, And if you haven't listened to part one, what the fuck is wrong with you? Did something go wrong with your life? Why do you make the choices that you make? So go listen to that. Okay, So around the early nineties, life starts changing for Chumbawamba. It stays a galitarian, but it goes from this like loose chaotic thing into something more like a worker's cooperative. They start having tons of meetings. By one account, they spend more times in meetings than in practice. There's like eight or nine of them at this point, and most of them move out of the squat but stay in the band and stay activists, and they just want to do other things with their lives and more and more. They're also like having families and shit, right, and sometimes maybe obviously some of them are having kids in the squad, but I could imagine not being like this is where I want to raise my children. I don't know, whatever, and One of the cooler things about them is as they start doing this, they don't go off vh ones behind the music, like they keep not exploding. Some of them did drugs, some of them were sober. They date within the band, They get one of them dumps one of them to go date the other bandmate, and everyone stays good with each other more or less. Like I don't know, they I feel like they kind of like did hedonism right at least as its presented. And they're self mythologizing, right, yeah, parties and raves and shows and everything, but they're they're not doing the like trash the hotel room, draw penises, a sexually assault fans thing.

Right and so.

Right and so.

And they're basically at this point trying to make it as no longer young musicians. They're trying to be like this is. So they sit down and they have a what the fuck are we doing meeting, like a conversation ten years into the band, and they're like, all right, let's fucking do this thing, like let's double or nothing, let's you know. They they quit their jobs to do it full time, which means that they needed to pay their employees, which was themselves and also other people were helping them out, and so commercial considerations start having to be balanced alongside musical and political considerations as they make this music. And in nineteen ninety four they release Anarchy as the name of an album and the cover of which features the photo of a child being born, which is from a book for children about where babies came from. But this is obviously like their whole point is like, you're all going to call this pornographic, aren't you, And it did. It's called pornographic. Stores refuse to sell it. They keep it in brown bags because you can see a vagina in it or whatever. It's my favorite of their albums, and it's the first time that they crack the very bottom of the mainstream charts, and it has the song if you haven't if you've never listened to a Chumbawamba song besides tumb pumping, or even if you haven't heard that, go listen to Homophobia by Chumbawombam. So they start getting to play larger and larger shows right as they start taking this band really seriously. Ten years in, they tour more of the world, and the press fucking hates them. They're like, you're washed up, bad musicians. You're all too old. You scream about politics, but you don't even believe any of it. You're or like they're all like you're too woke, you're ruining the music whatever. And the fans love them. They sell out shows left and right, and the press goes between ignoring them and hating them, which is like, this is just like literally how to succeed as a cult band, that really is. And in nineteen ninety six, they're not super famous yet, they're not tub thumping famous yet, but they're sharing a stage of Smashing Pumpkins in Germany at some big televised event, and Smashing Pumpkins is apparently being real assholes about it, at least as related in bof Whaley's book. And so they, like all the other bands, have to like hide in their dressing rooms with the doors closed and they can't be in the corridors when Billy Corgan comes through or something.

And they're basically at this point trying to make it as no longer young musicians. They're trying to be like this is. So they sit down and they have a what the fuck are we doing meeting, like a conversation ten years into the band, and they're like, all right, let's fucking do this thing, like let's double or nothing, let's you know. They they quit their jobs to do it full time, which means that they needed to pay their employees, which was themselves and also other people were helping them out, and so commercial considerations start having to be balanced alongside musical and political considerations as they make this music. And in nineteen ninety four they release Anarchy as the name of an album and the cover of which features the photo of a child being born, which is from a book for children about where babies came from. But this is obviously like their whole point is like, you're all going to call this pornographic, aren't you, And it did. It's called pornographic. Stores refuse to sell it. They keep it in brown bags because you can see a vagina in it or whatever. It's my favorite of their albums, and it's the first time that they crack the very bottom of the mainstream charts, and it has the song if you haven't if you've never listened to a Chumbawamba song besides tumb pumping, or even if you haven't heard that, go listen to Homophobia by Chumbawombam. So they start getting to play larger and larger shows right as they start taking this band really seriously. Ten years in, they tour more of the world, and the press fucking hates them. They're like, you're washed up, bad musicians. You're all too old. You scream about politics, but you don't even believe any of it. You're or like they're all like you're too woke, you're ruining the music whatever. And the fans love them. They sell out shows left and right, and the press goes between ignoring them and hating them, which is like, this is just like literally how to succeed as a cult band, that really is. And in nineteen ninety six, they're not super famous yet, they're not tub thumping famous yet, but they're sharing a stage of Smashing Pumpkins in Germany at some big televised event, and Smashing Pumpkins is apparently being real assholes about it, at least as related in bof Whaley's book. And so they, like all the other bands, have to like hide in their dressing rooms with the doors closed and they can't be in the corridors when Billy Corgan comes through or something.

And this is still pretty tough something. Yeah.

And this is still pretty tough something. Yeah.

Yeah, So they're like not seeing as Smashing Pumpkins as peer yet, but they're big enough to be at this televised event. And so Dan one of the people in Tumble one, but he likes being naked, like constantly. He's stripping on stage for the fuck of it, and the band is like, Ock, what are we going to do to prank these assholes? That's like what we got to do. That's our thing, you know, I know, Dan, take off all your clothes. So Dan gets naked. They write that word punk and huge letters across his chest. He strolls out on stage just as Smashing Pumpkins's their big finale. You know, he walks up to Billy and he salutes the crowd naked, and then he walks off and yes, the band has to physically rescue him from bouncers and that they fled the scene as like they're being chased, and the promoter is like, you'll never appear on German television again, which probably didn't turn out to be true.

Yeah, So they're like not seeing as Smashing Pumpkins as peer yet, but they're big enough to be at this televised event. And so Dan one of the people in Tumble one, but he likes being naked, like constantly. He's stripping on stage for the fuck of it, and the band is like, Ock, what are we going to do to prank these assholes? That's like what we got to do. That's our thing, you know, I know, Dan, take off all your clothes. So Dan gets naked. They write that word punk and huge letters across his chest. He strolls out on stage just as Smashing Pumpkins's their big finale. You know, he walks up to Billy and he salutes the crowd naked, and then he walks off and yes, the band has to physically rescue him from bouncers and that they fled the scene as like they're being chased, and the promoter is like, you'll never appear on German television again, which probably didn't turn out to be true.

Incredible, and yeah, I know, I love it.

Incredible, and yeah, I know, I love it.

I love it. Also, in nineteen ninety six, they turn in an album called tub Thumping into their label, which is a label called One Little Indian, which was not a great name for a label, and just to be clear, the label realized that and in twenty twenty they changed their name to One Little Independent. In nineteen ninety six, Chumbawamba turns in this album to them, and the label's like, no, this sucks, go home and write better songs. No good onward. And then EMI Germany, a major label, was like, well, we'll give you one hundred thousand fake europe money for it, maybe pounds, maybe euros, I don't know, one of the fake moneys that they have over there. And at first they laugh it off, right, They're like, no way, well we do that obviously, and then they kind of sit on it and they're like, we're so fucking broke, and that is enough money that even if the album doesn't sell at all, we can still pay everyone involved a decent wage, you know. They To be clear, Chumbawamba had put a song out on an anti EMI compilation about ten years earlier. The compilations called fuck EMI. At the time, I was deep in the nuclear arms industry. EMI had since divested from that. But still it wasn't It clearly wasn't good optics, and they weren't sure, but they I think what happened is that they they were sure it wasn't good optics to the punk scene. What they were trying to figure out was whether or not it was good ethics, and they wanted to make their decision based on that. So they talk it over as a collective like they do everything. They don't vote about major decisions. They work for consensus, and they talk it over for weeks. They are like, look, symbolism is bad, but change for change's sake is sometimes good. They were stagnating, and they were like, fuck stagnating, that's what we don't want to do. It's more of a chance to reach more people. Saying fuck you to a scene that was getting way too essentially conservative from their point of view, seemed fun to them. Being able to pay themselves enough to not worry for a while. Like they're all working class folks, right, and they're prosing middle aged without much of a safety net because they all were squad or punks, and and they're like bands like Fugazi can get away with being fiercely independent because they're just big enough and sell enough records, right, Chumbawamba wasn't selling that kind of those kinds of numbers. And but fear of what people would think was a big part of it. A few years earlier, in Poland, some American punk had taken it upon himself to like slash their tour van tires because he was mad about how much the band was charging for the show. Punks can be sort of myopic, Yeah, yeah, and one of the one of the things that they thought about a lot, you know. The most convincing argument to some of them, and I actually think maybe the most convincing argument to me is they're like, look, our independent labels are also just all about the money. They are also fucking us over. They're also greedy, we might as well get paid well. Alice Nutter puts it in an interview with a punk magazine later. My reasoning for doing it isn't how we're going to get our message across to more people. It's nothing to do with that. It's because my experiences with one little Indian in the music industry have me convinced that they're all the fucking same. They're small businessmen and big businessmen, and they have a different agenda to us. There's no good or bad capitalism is kind of what they hit upon. Yeah, they do it, and which brings us to probably the only song by them that most of the people listening to this podcast have actually heard. It'sub thumping about falling down and standing up and about drinking. I literally don't know. I didn't actually ask Sophie what I'm allowed to do in terms of quoting song lyrics, so that's why keep tee speaking about it very vaguely. Sophie says, yes, I can claim that I wrote the song and that it is legally my property. That is what Sophie is nod in and saying yes right now. So I wrote the song tub Thumping, and when I did? Okay, so, but I'm going to quote both whiley about this song. Tub Thumping, from his very outset as an idea, was definitely populist and based on working class experience. That's working class, not just as a mythic Trotskyist vision, but as a cultural and historic whole, which includes family and sport and community and war and love and entertainment, not just the cliched, clenched fist getting up, but the getting knocked down as well. Tub Thumping became known to some purely as a drinking song, which is fair enough because of nothing else. It didn't belong to an elite group of musicians. It belonged to people. People at football matches, people singing along to the radio as they drove, people at parties, drinking too much whiskey and tripping over the kitchen chairs people like me, and because it helped beggar the notion that Chumbo Wamba were boring zealots from planet Anarchy, And that's not what I realized when I heard it when I was in the nineties and like driving around and like, but.

I love it. Also, in nineteen ninety six, they turn in an album called tub Thumping into their label, which is a label called One Little Indian, which was not a great name for a label, and just to be clear, the label realized that and in twenty twenty they changed their name to One Little Independent. In nineteen ninety six, Chumbawamba turns in this album to them, and the label's like, no, this sucks, go home and write better songs. No good onward. And then EMI Germany, a major label, was like, well, we'll give you one hundred thousand fake europe money for it, maybe pounds, maybe euros, I don't know, one of the fake moneys that they have over there. And at first they laugh it off, right, They're like, no way, well we do that obviously, and then they kind of sit on it and they're like, we're so fucking broke, and that is enough money that even if the album doesn't sell at all, we can still pay everyone involved a decent wage, you know. They To be clear, Chumbawamba had put a song out on an anti EMI compilation about ten years earlier. The compilations called fuck EMI. At the time, I was deep in the nuclear arms industry. EMI had since divested from that. But still it wasn't It clearly wasn't good optics, and they weren't sure, but they I think what happened is that they they were sure it wasn't good optics to the punk scene. What they were trying to figure out was whether or not it was good ethics, and they wanted to make their decision based on that. So they talk it over as a collective like they do everything. They don't vote about major decisions. They work for consensus, and they talk it over for weeks. They are like, look, symbolism is bad, but change for change's sake is sometimes good. They were stagnating, and they were like, fuck stagnating, that's what we don't want to do. It's more of a chance to reach more people. Saying fuck you to a scene that was getting way too essentially conservative from their point of view, seemed fun to them. Being able to pay themselves enough to not worry for a while. Like they're all working class folks, right, and they're prosing middle aged without much of a safety net because they all were squad or punks, and and they're like bands like Fugazi can get away with being fiercely independent because they're just big enough and sell enough records, right, Chumbawamba wasn't selling that kind of those kinds of numbers. And but fear of what people would think was a big part of it. A few years earlier, in Poland, some American punk had taken it upon himself to like slash their tour van tires because he was mad about how much the band was charging for the show. Punks can be sort of myopic, Yeah, yeah, and one of the one of the things that they thought about a lot, you know. The most convincing argument to some of them, and I actually think maybe the most convincing argument to me is they're like, look, our independent labels are also just all about the money. They are also fucking us over. They're also greedy, we might as well get paid well. Alice Nutter puts it in an interview with a punk magazine later. My reasoning for doing it isn't how we're going to get our message across to more people. It's nothing to do with that. It's because my experiences with one little Indian in the music industry have me convinced that they're all the fucking same. They're small businessmen and big businessmen, and they have a different agenda to us. There's no good or bad capitalism is kind of what they hit upon. Yeah, they do it, and which brings us to probably the only song by them that most of the people listening to this podcast have actually heard. It'sub thumping about falling down and standing up and about drinking. I literally don't know. I didn't actually ask Sophie what I'm allowed to do in terms of quoting song lyrics, so that's why keep tee speaking about it very vaguely. Sophie says, yes, I can claim that I wrote the song and that it is legally my property. That is what Sophie is nod in and saying yes right now. So I wrote the song tub Thumping, and when I did? Okay, so, but I'm going to quote both whiley about this song. Tub Thumping, from his very outset as an idea, was definitely populist and based on working class experience. That's working class, not just as a mythic Trotskyist vision, but as a cultural and historic whole, which includes family and sport and community and war and love and entertainment, not just the cliched, clenched fist getting up, but the getting knocked down as well. Tub Thumping became known to some purely as a drinking song, which is fair enough because of nothing else. It didn't belong to an elite group of musicians. It belonged to people. People at football matches, people singing along to the radio as they drove, people at parties, drinking too much whiskey and tripping over the kitchen chairs people like me, and because it helped beggar the notion that Chumbo Wamba were boring zealots from planet Anarchy, And that's not what I realized when I heard it when I was in the nineties and like driving around and like, but.

I think it's cool to They don't try to shew that interpretation, because yeah, it is a drinking song, you know, it's but it works on a couple different levels. But it is a drinking song insofar as like you know, you're drinking with your mates, and there's community there, and there's solidarity there, and and there's you know, commiseration for the getting knocked down, you know, parts of life.

I think it's cool to They don't try to shew that interpretation, because yeah, it is a drinking song, you know, it's but it works on a couple different levels. But it is a drinking song insofar as like you know, you're drinking with your mates, and there's community there, and there's solidarity there, and and there's you know, commiseration for the getting knocked down, you know, parts of life.

There, which is punk as fuck. It is punk as fucked, like put your arms around all your friends and drunkenly sing songs like whatever. The song you know, like yeah, like yeah.

There, which is punk as fuck. It is punk as fucked, like put your arms around all your friends and drunkenly sing songs like whatever. The song you know, like yeah, like yeah.

It's collective, it's it's yeah, it's kind of a spiritual experience, you.

It's collective, it's it's yeah, it's kind of a spiritual experience, you.

Know, yeah, totally, and it's one that we have like increasingly stripped away from us by by modern life. And apparently one of the main inspirations of the song was watching a drunk Irish guy stumbling home from a bar singing Danny Boy and being told to shut up by a neighbor. So and the song goes fucking huge. And again, if you were live in the nineties, you probably remember this. It's number two in the UK, it's number six in the US, It's in the charts everywhere in the world. It gets ranked on lists of like the twenty most annoying songs of all time.

Know, yeah, totally, and it's one that we have like increasingly stripped away from us by by modern life. And apparently one of the main inspirations of the song was watching a drunk Irish guy stumbling home from a bar singing Danny Boy and being told to shut up by a neighbor. So and the song goes fucking huge. And again, if you were live in the nineties, you probably remember this. It's number two in the UK, it's number six in the US, It's in the charts everywhere in the world. It gets ranked on lists of like the twenty most annoying songs of all time.

Yeah, I mean there's a distinction to be made there between between like a hit song and like a global smash.

Yeah, I mean there's a distinction to be made there between between like a hit song and like a global smash.

Like that song was.

Like that song was.

Like, you know, number one on alternative rock radio or whatever, but also pop radio and also not just in the US, but like, yeah, you know everywhere. It was just one of those, you know, hyper ubiquitous songs that you could not escape no matter where you were, no matter what your where, your tastes, what genres your tastes went to, or whatever.

Like, you know, number one on alternative rock radio or whatever, but also pop radio and also not just in the US, but like, yeah, you know everywhere. It was just one of those, you know, hyper ubiquitous songs that you could not escape no matter where you were, no matter what your where, your tastes, what genres your tastes went to, or whatever.

Yeah, because it's also kind of a genre list song, Like on its face, you know, it has like I think electronic drums and just this catchy singalong chorus and like it's just and it's like, yeah, it's almost like like a collective delusion, you know, this thing that just like absorbed everyone for a moment, you know, and yeah, I don't know, it's fucking interesting.

Yeah, because it's also kind of a genre list song, Like on its face, you know, it has like I think electronic drums and just this catchy singalong chorus and like it's just and it's like, yeah, it's almost like like a collective delusion, you know, this thing that just like absorbed everyone for a moment, you know, and yeah, I don't know, it's fucking interesting.

It's like, in a way, it's like it it was. It was a troll sort of, but it also wasn't a cynical one. They were Yeah, they weren't looking down on the people enjoying it. Yeah, for whatever surface reasons. There was no contempt there. Yeah, but it was this thing that functioned on a couple different levels.

It's like, in a way, it's like it it was. It was a troll sort of, but it also wasn't a cynical one. They were Yeah, they weren't looking down on the people enjoying it. Yeah, for whatever surface reasons. There was no contempt there. Yeah, but it was this thing that functioned on a couple different levels.

Yeah. Yeah, it's so fucking like, it's just brilliant. It's such a it's yeah, it's a prank, but it's not a prank, you know. It's this earnest thing they did that got injected into pop culture and don't it's fucking and a lot of their old fans write them letters calling them sellouts. But the people who really led the charge of calling them hypocrites were the same music journalists who had always hated them because they're like, ah see, we told you their politics didn't mean anything, which was their way of basically excusing themselves for never having had decent politics in the first Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, it's so fucking like, it's just brilliant. It's such a it's yeah, it's a prank, but it's not a prank, you know. It's this earnest thing they did that got injected into pop culture and don't it's fucking and a lot of their old fans write them letters calling them sellouts. But the people who really led the charge of calling them hypocrites were the same music journalists who had always hated them because they're like, ah see, we told you their politics didn't mean anything, which was their way of basically excusing themselves for never having had decent politics in the first Yeah.

Which is a really dubious way to sort of yeah, you know, truffle Hunt for what seems like hypocrisy, but if you scratch the surface at all, you realize really isn't. It's a collective who wants to be able to take care of their own and, as we'll find soon enough in the story, take care of others as well, and do that by siphoning corporate bunny and yeah, like you know, doing Robin hood shit.

Which is a really dubious way to sort of yeah, you know, truffle Hunt for what seems like hypocrisy, but if you scratch the surface at all, you realize really isn't. It's a collective who wants to be able to take care of their own and, as we'll find soon enough in the story, take care of others as well, and do that by siphoning corporate bunny and yeah, like you know, doing Robin hood shit.

Really yeah, totally totally. And it's funny is to look at like if I had been I, you know, I was a a salty subcultural but not like a punk yet right at the time of all of this, if I had been, like if it had happened in two thousand and three, I probably would have been one of the people being like, h you fucking sellouts, right, But I'm glad that I don't, you know, like twenty one year old me is not who I look back to about what decisions were best to make for my life. You know. No, I'm stuck with some of the tattoos. But that's okay too.

Really yeah, totally totally. And it's funny is to look at like if I had been I, you know, I was a a salty subcultural but not like a punk yet right at the time of all of this, if I had been, like if it had happened in two thousand and three, I probably would have been one of the people being like, h you fucking sellouts, right, But I'm glad that I don't, you know, like twenty one year old me is not who I look back to about what decisions were best to make for my life. You know. No, I'm stuck with some of the tattoos. But that's okay too.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So they spend two years, the next two years in this whirlwind of fame. It doesn't stop them from being themselves. And first and foremost, they give away just a fuck ton of money, since since all the money gets split equally. They didn't like fuss about who deserves what amount and stuff like that. You know, there were the people who are the lead singers of the songs whatever, but they're like, we're just split it in and evenly. We'll work from there. And they peer pressure each other out of like running out and buying Jaguars. Boff notes that Dan went out and bought a really fancy vacuum cleaner, which I must be what middle age anarchists do. And they suddenly have a lot of money. You know, nice vacuum cleaner. It's a very nice thing. And they I get the impression that they hold onto enough money to not have to worry about being poor. But they donate money to artists, women's groups, prisoner defense campaigns, kids football teams, radical media projects, venues, solidarity groups, individual organizers, community groups, magazines, direct action groups, and social centers. At one point in two thousand and two, GM wanted a song for a commercial. Yeah, Jumble Womba said yes, and they take it. Took one hundred thousand dollars or different accounts give different amounts, but a large number of money, high money number one hundred thousand will go with that, and they just turn around and they give half of it to indie Media, which is this big decentralized ub the media network, and they give which is unfortunately kind of probably what prefigured Twitter and to rest of the nightmare we live now, but it was a good idea at the time. And they give the other half to a project called corp Watch that is specifically tracking GM, like exposing their crimes. And so they just turn around and give fifty thousand dollars to people who are like specifically attacking GM. Yeah, and so if the two main arguments that they have in favor of selling out are reach a wider audience and get fuck tons of money, they do both. But I actually I think Alice Nutter was right in some ways. The fuck tons of money, which seems less the radical goal, is actually in some ways the more radical thing they did because the wider audience didn't necessarily like get it right. They talk about anarchism on news shows, they mostly get made fun of. They sell their music to a ton of places, but they turned down other places too. They turned down Nike, who offered them a million and a half bucks. Their rules were really simple and strict. They wouldn't sell their music to anyone involved in sweatshop labor or the arms industry. And when I first started researching this episode, I thought it was going to be mostly about their high jinks during the fame period, because they did really good hijinks. But in the end, I you know the reason. The first half is more about the working clas punks in a squat breaking laws is like what I kind of lingered on. But let's talk about the hijinks one time. In nineteen ninety seven, in the Top Thumping era, Dan gets arrested in Italy literally for just walking down the street wearing a skirt, and he's held in his cell. He has a show that night. He gets held in a cell with no one speaking to him in English, and finally he scrawls I'm in a pop group called Chumbo Wumba on a piece of paper and helds it up to the glass of the cell and they release him and he gets in time to go to the sound check. The next day, he appears on Italian TV in the Skirt and says Italy has some problems with homophobic, macho cop culture. Alice Nutter steps up as being the kind of unofficial spokesperson for the band. I think mostly because she enjoyed talking the most and had the most to say. She was also maybe the most firebrand of them. In nineteen ninety seven, she told the UK Press, nothing can change the fact that we like it when cops get killed. Emi is like, oh my god, please apologize. What the fuck? Oh my god? She didn't apologize and such. She clarified her statement. If you're working class, they won't protect you. When you hear about them, it's in the context of them abusing people, you know, miscarriages of justice. We don't have a party when cops die, you know, we don't. But before we hear about more of Alice Nutter's anti capitalist hijinks. Ooh, we have some capitalist hijinks for you in the form of products and services. Okay, and we are back in January nineteen ninety eight, Alice Nutter, she goes on the talk show Politically Incorrect, and she says, basically, yeah, if you can't afford our music, just go to the nearest big, evil, giant chain store like Virgin and steal it. And Virgin didn't like this. Chumbawamba at the time is Universal's number one selling band, and here's the band saying, just steal it. Who fucking cares? As long as you steal it from a large corporation. Virgin threatens to remove the album from their stores, and it depends on what account you read. They either stopped carrying it entirely or hit it behind the counter.

So they spend two years, the next two years in this whirlwind of fame. It doesn't stop them from being themselves. And first and foremost, they give away just a fuck ton of money, since since all the money gets split equally. They didn't like fuss about who deserves what amount and stuff like that. You know, there were the people who are the lead singers of the songs whatever, but they're like, we're just split it in and evenly. We'll work from there. And they peer pressure each other out of like running out and buying Jaguars. Boff notes that Dan went out and bought a really fancy vacuum cleaner, which I must be what middle age anarchists do. And they suddenly have a lot of money. You know, nice vacuum cleaner. It's a very nice thing. And they I get the impression that they hold onto enough money to not have to worry about being poor. But they donate money to artists, women's groups, prisoner defense campaigns, kids football teams, radical media projects, venues, solidarity groups, individual organizers, community groups, magazines, direct action groups, and social centers. At one point in two thousand and two, GM wanted a song for a commercial. Yeah, Jumble Womba said yes, and they take it. Took one hundred thousand dollars or different accounts give different amounts, but a large number of money, high money number one hundred thousand will go with that, and they just turn around and they give half of it to indie Media, which is this big decentralized ub the media network, and they give which is unfortunately kind of probably what prefigured Twitter and to rest of the nightmare we live now, but it was a good idea at the time. And they give the other half to a project called corp Watch that is specifically tracking GM, like exposing their crimes. And so they just turn around and give fifty thousand dollars to people who are like specifically attacking GM. Yeah, and so if the two main arguments that they have in favor of selling out are reach a wider audience and get fuck tons of money, they do both. But I actually I think Alice Nutter was right in some ways. The fuck tons of money, which seems less the radical goal, is actually in some ways the more radical thing they did because the wider audience didn't necessarily like get it right. They talk about anarchism on news shows, they mostly get made fun of. They sell their music to a ton of places, but they turned down other places too. They turned down Nike, who offered them a million and a half bucks. Their rules were really simple and strict. They wouldn't sell their music to anyone involved in sweatshop labor or the arms industry. And when I first started researching this episode, I thought it was going to be mostly about their high jinks during the fame period, because they did really good hijinks. But in the end, I you know the reason. The first half is more about the working clas punks in a squat breaking laws is like what I kind of lingered on. But let's talk about the hijinks one time. In nineteen ninety seven, in the Top Thumping era, Dan gets arrested in Italy literally for just walking down the street wearing a skirt, and he's held in his cell. He has a show that night. He gets held in a cell with no one speaking to him in English, and finally he scrawls I'm in a pop group called Chumbo Wumba on a piece of paper and helds it up to the glass of the cell and they release him and he gets in time to go to the sound check. The next day, he appears on Italian TV in the Skirt and says Italy has some problems with homophobic, macho cop culture. Alice Nutter steps up as being the kind of unofficial spokesperson for the band. I think mostly because she enjoyed talking the most and had the most to say. She was also maybe the most firebrand of them. In nineteen ninety seven, she told the UK Press, nothing can change the fact that we like it when cops get killed. Emi is like, oh my god, please apologize. What the fuck? Oh my god? She didn't apologize and such. She clarified her statement. If you're working class, they won't protect you. When you hear about them, it's in the context of them abusing people, you know, miscarriages of justice. We don't have a party when cops die, you know, we don't. But before we hear about more of Alice Nutter's anti capitalist hijinks. Ooh, we have some capitalist hijinks for you in the form of products and services. Okay, and we are back in January nineteen ninety eight, Alice Nutter, she goes on the talk show Politically Incorrect, and she says, basically, yeah, if you can't afford our music, just go to the nearest big, evil, giant chain store like Virgin and steal it. And Virgin didn't like this. Chumbawamba at the time is Universal's number one selling band, and here's the band saying, just steal it. Who fucking cares? As long as you steal it from a large corporation. Virgin threatens to remove the album from their stores, and it depends on what account you read. They either stopped carrying it entirely or hit it behind the counter.

I don't know.

I don't know.

And this only makes sales go up, which doesn't fucking surprise me, right, Like I could have told them that, like, yeah, more will get stolen. But if people steal the CDs, people are going to listen to it and talk about it, and more people are going to go out and fucking buy it, right.

And this only makes sales go up, which doesn't fucking surprise me, right, Like I could have told them that, like, yeah, more will get stolen. But if people steal the CDs, people are going to listen to it and talk about it, and more people are going to go out and fucking buy it, right.

And and if you're taking it off the shelves or hiding it, you're literally manufacturing scarcity for the thing, and by making it more valuable.

And and if you're taking it off the shelves or hiding it, you're literally manufacturing scarcity for the thing, and by making it more valuable.

Yeah, yeah, so everyone wants to go out and find it and get it. Yeah. So anyway, they're contact at Universal called the band and was like, well, you all just laugh at me if I tell you that Universal wants to ask you to apologize for saying all that, Like they're rep knows it's a like fool's errand that he's been tasked to call them and ask them to apologize. He's like, y'all aren't going to do this, are you? And they're like ha ha Nope. And later Alice Nutters in a recollection says, why should I apologize? I wasn't sorry, which is exactly how you should or shouldn't apologize when you make decisions about apologies. So and on the The David Letterman Show, they changed the lyrics of tub thumping to include from free Mumiya bou Jamal and Mamiya bu Jamal for anyone who's not aware. As a black political prisoner who was probably framed up on the murder of a cop in Philly and at the very least definitely had an unfair trial, he spent a couple decades on death row, which was reduced to Life without Pearl in two thousand and one. So Chumbawamba goes on Letterman and sings free Mumiya bou Jamal, and it was pre recorded, so Letterman let it happen. In the end, basically they like sat down, Like The Letterman Show, people were like, fuck, are we gonna let this fucking happen? And finally the network is like, all right, fuck it. They run it and they talk about anarchism with Barbara Walters. They basically leave a trail of chaos that the record labels are running around trying to clean up for them. But instead of trash hotel rooms, it was just weird shit, you know. And the peak of all this was the nineteen ninety eight brit Awards, which I think are the Grammys for people stuck on a tiny island without sunshine. My theory is that they actually named the country after the award show. It was called brit Land, but then with the accent, sound like Britain, and so that's what's stuck.

Yeah, yeah, so everyone wants to go out and find it and get it. Yeah. So anyway, they're contact at Universal called the band and was like, well, you all just laugh at me if I tell you that Universal wants to ask you to apologize for saying all that, Like they're rep knows it's a like fool's errand that he's been tasked to call them and ask them to apologize. He's like, y'all aren't going to do this, are you? And they're like ha ha Nope. And later Alice Nutters in a recollection says, why should I apologize? I wasn't sorry, which is exactly how you should or shouldn't apologize when you make decisions about apologies. So and on the The David Letterman Show, they changed the lyrics of tub thumping to include from free Mumiya bou Jamal and Mamiya bu Jamal for anyone who's not aware. As a black political prisoner who was probably framed up on the murder of a cop in Philly and at the very least definitely had an unfair trial, he spent a couple decades on death row, which was reduced to Life without Pearl in two thousand and one. So Chumbawamba goes on Letterman and sings free Mumiya bou Jamal, and it was pre recorded, so Letterman let it happen. In the end, basically they like sat down, Like The Letterman Show, people were like, fuck, are we gonna let this fucking happen? And finally the network is like, all right, fuck it. They run it and they talk about anarchism with Barbara Walters. They basically leave a trail of chaos that the record labels are running around trying to clean up for them. But instead of trash hotel rooms, it was just weird shit, you know. And the peak of all this was the nineteen ninety eight brit Awards, which I think are the Grammys for people stuck on a tiny island without sunshine. My theory is that they actually named the country after the award show. It was called brit Land, but then with the accent, sound like Britain, and so that's what's stuck.

That's my thavorite sounds true to me.

That's my thavorite sounds true to me.

Yeah, So I wonder how long I'm gonna get away with this bit so Jumbawamba. They get invited to the nineteen ninety eight brit Awards. They're even up for an award themselves Best Single, and they're going to perform. At first, they weren't going to perform, but the director he knows their fucking number, and he's like, all right, you don't want to perform, We'll let you have a video behind you. And they're like, yeah, okay, we're in. We can show propaganda. We are in. And the day of the director of the wards. He goes up to chumble One personally with a plea and he's like, hey, could you could you not physically attack any of the other artists, And that's his big request to them. Tumbawamba is like, all right, fine, whatever, we won't attack any of the other artists physically, and they even technically stuck with that. They they're not super stoked about it, though, and everyone else is pissing them off with all being off pop star and shit. And I have a feeling that every like band that's played at this level kind of like vaguely enjoys talking about bands. But you know, they point out this in the book that like half of Fleetwood Mac refuses to use their dressing room because of inadequate carpeting. And I don't know shit about Fleetwood Mac, and I'm taking both Whaley's word for it. Maybe inadequate carpeting was like maybe like the whole thing was like this like sewage swamp. I don't fucking know, you.

Yeah, So I wonder how long I'm gonna get away with this bit so Jumbawamba. They get invited to the nineteen ninety eight brit Awards. They're even up for an award themselves Best Single, and they're going to perform. At first, they weren't going to perform, but the director he knows their fucking number, and he's like, all right, you don't want to perform, We'll let you have a video behind you. And they're like, yeah, okay, we're in. We can show propaganda. We are in. And the day of the director of the wards. He goes up to chumble One personally with a plea and he's like, hey, could you could you not physically attack any of the other artists, And that's his big request to them. Tumbawamba is like, all right, fine, whatever, we won't attack any of the other artists physically, and they even technically stuck with that. They they're not super stoked about it, though, and everyone else is pissing them off with all being off pop star and shit. And I have a feeling that every like band that's played at this level kind of like vaguely enjoys talking about bands. But you know, they point out this in the book that like half of Fleetwood Mac refuses to use their dressing room because of inadequate carpeting. And I don't know shit about Fleetwood Mac, and I'm taking both Whaley's word for it. Maybe inadequate carpeting was like maybe like the whole thing was like this like sewage swamp. I don't fucking know, you.

Know, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Know, yeah, yeah, yeah.

But it's easier to imagine, like, ah, those damn rock stars, said the one rock star to that. Anyway, whatever, it's more fun to imagine too, Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So they go up and play and they're all wearing sweatshirts that say things like sold out or whatever, and they put on a film behind them and it's full of people rioting and protesting, and there's act up banners and there's the stages streaming with red and black banners, and it's like, it's exactly what I would do if I was up for one of these aworts. And it's not even not necessarily in an original way, but just it's it's like you kind of have to if you're that band, you know.

But it's easier to imagine, like, ah, those damn rock stars, said the one rock star to that. Anyway, whatever, it's more fun to imagine too, Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So they go up and play and they're all wearing sweatshirts that say things like sold out or whatever, and they put on a film behind them and it's full of people rioting and protesting, and there's act up banners and there's the stages streaming with red and black banners, and it's like, it's exactly what I would do if I was up for one of these aworts. And it's not even not necessarily in an original way, but just it's it's like you kind of have to if you're that band, you know.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And at the time, dockers in Liverpool had been on strike and it was one of the longest labor disputes in British history, and the dockers had mostly lost. They had been forced into a settlement package and they all lost their jobs. And the Labor Party was currently branding itself as New Labor and they were culpable for a lot of that. So Chumbawamba changed the course of tub Thump to include new Labors sold out the dockers, just like they'll sell out the rest of us. And they even brought some dockers with them to the ceremony. With the plan that if they win, the doctors would go up and accept on their behalf and give a speech about what was going on. But Chaumbowama didn't win, so they didn't get to do the Doctors accept thing. But after they get off stage, they're like, oh shit, that's John Prescott and he's the Deputy Prime Minister, which is roughly the equivalent of vice president, and he's from the working class. He used to be a member of the same union as the Dockers, but he basically sold them out. He was blocking tuition bills, he was fucking over the unemployed. He was just doing all kinds of shit, right, And so they're sitting around and they're like, what the fuck are we going to do. There's the vice president of Britain, which definitely has a vice president, and they they look at the bin that had been full of all the ice for the champagne and all of that, and they're like, Dan, Alice, you got this and Dan and Alice are like, yes, we do indeed have it. So they go up to Prescott. Dan jumps on the table says this is for the Liverpool Dockers and dumps a bucket of ice water on John Prescott's head. Not to be outdone, Nutter is right there behind him with I think an extra bucket of water and also just soaks him with that as well, and this is like on okay, So so Dan gets arrested and Prescott has to be a good sport about it because he's like trying to look cool with the kids he's here at the brit Awards or whatever. It's really hard to imagine a US politician being this cool about especially a vice president. I'm like, I'm struggling to imagine the punk band that can dump ice water on the vice president of the United States and survive, you know.

And at the time, dockers in Liverpool had been on strike and it was one of the longest labor disputes in British history, and the dockers had mostly lost. They had been forced into a settlement package and they all lost their jobs. And the Labor Party was currently branding itself as New Labor and they were culpable for a lot of that. So Chumbawamba changed the course of tub Thump to include new Labors sold out the dockers, just like they'll sell out the rest of us. And they even brought some dockers with them to the ceremony. With the plan that if they win, the doctors would go up and accept on their behalf and give a speech about what was going on. But Chaumbowama didn't win, so they didn't get to do the Doctors accept thing. But after they get off stage, they're like, oh shit, that's John Prescott and he's the Deputy Prime Minister, which is roughly the equivalent of vice president, and he's from the working class. He used to be a member of the same union as the Dockers, but he basically sold them out. He was blocking tuition bills, he was fucking over the unemployed. He was just doing all kinds of shit, right, And so they're sitting around and they're like, what the fuck are we going to do. There's the vice president of Britain, which definitely has a vice president, and they they look at the bin that had been full of all the ice for the champagne and all of that, and they're like, Dan, Alice, you got this and Dan and Alice are like, yes, we do indeed have it. So they go up to Prescott. Dan jumps on the table says this is for the Liverpool Dockers and dumps a bucket of ice water on John Prescott's head. Not to be outdone, Nutter is right there behind him with I think an extra bucket of water and also just soaks him with that as well, and this is like on okay, So so Dan gets arrested and Prescott has to be a good sport about it because he's like trying to look cool with the kids he's here at the brit Awards or whatever. It's really hard to imagine a US politician being this cool about especially a vice president. I'm like, I'm struggling to imagine the punk band that can dump ice water on the vice president of the United States and survive, you know.

Yeah, yeah, I mean we saw the way was it Giuliani? Who there was that video of a guy who kind of like lightly like oh yeah, pat on the back and then talks some shit yeah, and he acted like it was a saul and.

Yeah, yeah, I mean we saw the way was it Giuliani? Who there was that video of a guy who kind of like lightly like oh yeah, pat on the back and then talks some shit yeah, and he acted like it was a saul and.

Yeah yeah yeah. But however, they managed to dump ice water on the fucking deputy prime minister's head, and the deputy Prime Minister of Prescott is like, all right, I'm not pressing charges, and so they get let go and the tabloids eat the whole thing up, and of course the usual snotty critics get mad and oh and then Ginger Spice from The Spice Girls goes up to Prescott to make sure he's okay. They made sure to include that part in the in their biography or that's really funny, and Alice Nutter later, I think it's talking about the entire like arc of Chumbawamba, and it's like it was all worth it just to be able to get at John Prescott, just to get at these people who think they're untouchable. And that's the thing that's kind of interesting to me about like like people used to pie politicians more often, it feels like, and it seems like the point of that is just to say, like, hey, remember you're a person. Yeah, you know, like this have been worse, is what you're saying when you dump ice water on someone's head. You know.

Yeah yeah yeah. But however, they managed to dump ice water on the fucking deputy prime minister's head, and the deputy Prime Minister of Prescott is like, all right, I'm not pressing charges, and so they get let go and the tabloids eat the whole thing up, and of course the usual snotty critics get mad and oh and then Ginger Spice from The Spice Girls goes up to Prescott to make sure he's okay. They made sure to include that part in the in their biography or that's really funny, and Alice Nutter later, I think it's talking about the entire like arc of Chumbawamba, and it's like it was all worth it just to be able to get at John Prescott, just to get at these people who think they're untouchable. And that's the thing that's kind of interesting to me about like like people used to pie politicians more often, it feels like, and it seems like the point of that is just to say, like, hey, remember you're a person. Yeah, you know, like this have been worse, is what you're saying when you dump ice water on someone's head. You know.

Yeah, you're a person who's supposed to be accountable to us.

Yeah, you're a person who's supposed to be accountable to us.

Yeah, and you clearly aren't. And you enjoy this sort of like protected celebrity status, you know.

Yeah, and you clearly aren't. And you enjoy this sort of like protected celebrity status, you know.

Yeah totally And so okay. So they spent about two years on the road doing the celebrity thing, and then they take a break and they resume other parts of their lives, figuring out their next move, and then they put out a second album with EMI, which is a bit confusing because then they're mythologizing. I've read some of their accounts that are like, em I wanted to put out another album, but we said no. But I think they did put out another album with EMI. Either way, either em I dumps them or they dump EMI and or.

Yeah totally And so okay. So they spent about two years on the road doing the celebrity thing, and then they take a break and they resume other parts of their lives, figuring out their next move, and then they put out a second album with EMI, which is a bit confusing because then they're mythologizing. I've read some of their accounts that are like, em I wanted to put out another album, but we said no. But I think they did put out another album with EMI. Either way, either em I dumps them or they dump EMI and or.

Yeah, EMI could have done something where if they were under contract for another record or something but didn't want to deliver it where they either. I mean, we had our record label do that with us, where they put out I don't know if it was like live stuff for you know.

Yeah, EMI could have done something where if they were under contract for another record or something but didn't want to deliver it where they either. I mean, we had our record label do that with us, where they put out I don't know if it was like live stuff for you know.

Oh interesting because you owed them an album but they didn't like the way they turned in.

Oh interesting because you owed them an album but they didn't like the way they turned in.

Yeah, yeah, that kind of thing for us. I don't remember exactly what the circumstances were, but I could see it being something like that where they basically manufactured some kind of release out of B sides or whatever.

Yeah, yeah, that kind of thing for us. I don't remember exactly what the circumstances were, but I could see it being something like that where they basically manufactured some kind of release out of B sides or whatever.

You know. Yeah, are you still they technically owned? I think you're not still with a major label. Is that correct?

You know. Yeah, are you still they technically owned? I think you're not still with a major label. Is that correct?

That's correct?

That's correct?

Yeah, we got dropped from RCA and like two thousand and three, and we put records out now with an indie label.

Yeah, we got dropped from RCA and like two thousand and three, and we put records out now with an indie label.

Called Velocity okay, which always seemed like kind of a cool like after this, and I'll get to it in a moment, like Chumbawamba kind of like goes from major label back to indie. They go from indy to major to indie, right, and they're like all right, And it's kind of interesting to me to see that as a well, you just do what's best in the situation, rather than like, oh no, you're a failure because the major label dropped you, or oh no, you're a sellout because you know you went to a major label at all.

Called Velocity okay, which always seemed like kind of a cool like after this, and I'll get to it in a moment, like Chumbawamba kind of like goes from major label back to indie. They go from indy to major to indie, right, and they're like all right, And it's kind of interesting to me to see that as a well, you just do what's best in the situation, rather than like, oh no, you're a failure because the major label dropped you, or oh no, you're a sellout because you know you went to a major label at all.

I don't know, yeah, yeah, I mean sort of like.

I don't know, yeah, yeah, I mean sort of like.

Judging or making the metric of like what is worthwhile about making rock by what type of record label you're on or whatever, ain't really.

Judging or making the metric of like what is worthwhile about making rock by what type of record label you're on or whatever, ain't really.

Where it's at.

Where it's at.

I can also see how, you know, perception is created by like by that kind of story, Like you know, it did feel embarrassing to get dropped from a major label for all of those reasons, but then you sort of realize.

I can also see how, you know, perception is created by like by that kind of story, Like you know, it did feel embarrassing to get dropped from a major label for all of those reasons, but then you sort of realize.

Like why why do you feel that way?

Like why why do you feel that way?

Right?

Right?

And you know this, the reasons for it are pretty dubious once you examine them a little bit, like what what do you what are you making stuff for? Anyway, is it too, you know, appease, you know, the bean counters or whatever because you like like to like to make rock because it makes you feel free or whatever.

And you know this, the reasons for it are pretty dubious once you examine them a little bit, like what what do you what are you making stuff for? Anyway, is it too, you know, appease, you know, the bean counters or whatever because you like like to like to make rock because it makes you feel free or whatever.

Yeah, and like connecting to people like you connect with people different ways depending on what means by which you access them, and doesn't make it better or worse, like yep, no, it's interesting. Yeah, it must have been. You have not been in that position, but it must have been like, oh, we've we've hit our crest and now we are coming down from it, as compared to like, well, no, you got this like boost of attention and now you're able to do things with that, you know.

Yeah, and like connecting to people like you connect with people different ways depending on what means by which you access them, and doesn't make it better or worse, like yep, no, it's interesting. Yeah, it must have been. You have not been in that position, but it must have been like, oh, we've we've hit our crest and now we are coming down from it, as compared to like, well, no, you got this like boost of attention and now you're able to do things with that, you know.

Yeah, totally.

Yeah, totally.

It's all in how you sort of frame your perspective toward it. Yeah, Like I mean, in our case, we did need to like break up for a host of reasons, and we did for a few years, and only recently, in the last couple of years have we started doing this new iteration of the band that, like I said, is sort of in practice a side project, but we just still call it Eve six. But yeah, you know, we're doing it for for the right reasons. And I think a band like Trumbawamba was always doing it for the right reasons.

It's all in how you sort of frame your perspective toward it. Yeah, Like I mean, in our case, we did need to like break up for a host of reasons, and we did for a few years, and only recently, in the last couple of years have we started doing this new iteration of the band that, like I said, is sort of in practice a side project, but we just still call it Eve six. But yeah, you know, we're doing it for for the right reasons. And I think a band like Trumbawamba was always doing it for the right reasons.

You know, yeah, yeah, And you know who else is doing it for the right reasons. It's it's it's the Advertiser. We're actually sponsored by this new this new act on our ca clup Eve seven new band. It's very original.

You know, yeah, yeah, And you know who else is doing it for the right reasons. It's it's it's the Advertiser. We're actually sponsored by this new this new act on our ca clup Eve seven new band. It's very original.

Okay, this is interesting. I hadn't I hadn't heard of this, hadn't heard of this group.

Okay, this is interesting. I hadn't I hadn't heard of this, hadn't heard of this group.

But my first reaction is, I don't know if this town is big enough for two of us.

But my first reaction is, I don't know if this town is big enough for two of us.

Well, they've got this hit, and you know it's the first Advertisers is going to be this hit. It's called what.

Well, they've got this hit, and you know it's the first Advertisers is going to be this hit. It's called what.

Kind of prepositions are they working with?

Kind of prepositions are they working with?

You? Put a blender in my heart? I believe?

You? Put a blender in my heart? I believe?

Is that?

Is that?

Oh?

Oh?

Okay, it's funny because five Seconds of Summer apparently just released a song called Blender or like emotional Blender or something like that.

Okay, it's funny because five Seconds of Summer apparently just released a song called Blender or like emotional Blender or something like that.

I haven't listened to it yet, but.

I haven't listened to it yet, but.

Yeah, town's only big enough for one blender song.

Yeah, town's only big enough for one blender song.

That's right? Yeah, stay away from our kitchen appliance.

That's right? Yeah, stay away from our kitchen appliance.

That is the official motto of cool Zone Media.

That is the official motto of cool Zone Media.

Is that?

Is that?

Is that correct? Sophie is nodding?

Is that correct? Sophie is nodding?

Okay?

Okay?

Sometimes I just say Sophie's nodding when Sophie's actually holding up a sign that says stop doing this, you're going to get us in trouble. But Sophie's not in this case. She was nodding, yeah, yeah, totally. And here's some other products and services including Eve six, I mean sorry, seven, eight, and nine, and we are back. Okay, so up, and we were talking about the the at this point, you know, Chumbawamba is in there. Uh, they've taken a break from the celebrity thing. Then they then they come back at making music and they keep at it for another fifteen years. Tom Pumping is right in the middle of the career of Chumbawamba as a band. They start their own label, they work with a bunch of different indies, and they put out a ton of music and they continue to accidentally show up at the craziest riots in history. Wow, what a weird coincidence. And I actually this part actually caught me by surprise because I had kind of assumed that, like they're in their forties, I think at this point, and like they're doing all right, and they're still just like, oh, there's this riot. I mean, actually it's an accident. There's just accidentally in all these things. And I really I really appreciate about that they're bad timing where they keep showing it for these things and so, and they also fund a bunch of direct actions, which I think there's still I don't want to conjecture too hard about the things that they fund. And a bunch of them leave the band and in two thousand and four, And I spent a while trying to be like, what did they leave the band about? Right? But then I realized that none of them were trying to talk about it. There was a little bit of like personal and political differences, and they leave it at that, right, And.

Sometimes I just say Sophie's nodding when Sophie's actually holding up a sign that says stop doing this, you're going to get us in trouble. But Sophie's not in this case. She was nodding, yeah, yeah, totally. And here's some other products and services including Eve six, I mean sorry, seven, eight, and nine, and we are back. Okay, so up, and we were talking about the the at this point, you know, Chumbawamba is in there. Uh, they've taken a break from the celebrity thing. Then they then they come back at making music and they keep at it for another fifteen years. Tom Pumping is right in the middle of the career of Chumbawamba as a band. They start their own label, they work with a bunch of different indies, and they put out a ton of music and they continue to accidentally show up at the craziest riots in history. Wow, what a weird coincidence. And I actually this part actually caught me by surprise because I had kind of assumed that, like they're in their forties, I think at this point, and like they're doing all right, and they're still just like, oh, there's this riot. I mean, actually it's an accident. There's just accidentally in all these things. And I really I really appreciate about that they're bad timing where they keep showing it for these things and so, and they also fund a bunch of direct actions, which I think there's still I don't want to conjecture too hard about the things that they fund. And a bunch of them leave the band and in two thousand and four, And I spent a while trying to be like, what did they leave the band about? Right? But then I realized that none of them were trying to talk about it. There was a little bit of like personal and political differences, and they leave it at that, right, And.

And that's cool.

And that's cool.

It's cool that I don't know because they're just like, their whole thing seems to be like, how do we come close to this environment that could have made us douchebag rock stars without And so they're just like they just worked through it, at least somewhat privately, right.

It's cool that I don't know because they're just like, their whole thing seems to be like, how do we come close to this environment that could have made us douchebag rock stars without And so they're just like they just worked through it, at least somewhat privately, right.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It sounds like they have loyalty to one another and like, yeah, actual friendship.

It sounds like they have loyalty to one another and like, yeah, actual friendship.

Yeah yeah. And it's almost like they, you know, repaired a house together for ten years before they went on any of this crazy shit, you know. And and even the people who left in two thousand and four came back for their twenty twelve Fuck It Were Done Tour. I don't think that was the actual name of it, but it might as well have been their fuck it, We're Done tour, because they basically were like, fuck it, We're done, and then they had a tour. And they still contribute to each other's art to this day. They like a bunch of them make movies and theater and music, and you know, Baff writes books about running, Alice writes for TV. Bruce is working on a documentary about Chumbawamba that's currently on the the circuit where you're not allowed to watch it unless you have a.

Yeah yeah. And it's almost like they, you know, repaired a house together for ten years before they went on any of this crazy shit, you know. And and even the people who left in two thousand and four came back for their twenty twelve Fuck It Were Done Tour. I don't think that was the actual name of it, but it might as well have been their fuck it, We're Done tour, because they basically were like, fuck it, We're done, and then they had a tour. And they still contribute to each other's art to this day. They like a bunch of them make movies and theater and music, and you know, Baff writes books about running, Alice writes for TV. Bruce is working on a documentary about Chumbawamba that's currently on the the circuit where you're not allowed to watch it unless you have a.

Yeah, that's it.

Yeah, that's it.

Right when they broke up, they put out a statement. I'm a quote from it because I think they do a good, pretty good job of summing up what they were doing. Chumbowomba was our vehicle for pointing at the naked emperors, for telling our version of the truth. It gave us more than the joy and love of playing live, writing songs and singing together. It gave us a chance to be part of a broad coalition of activists and hectors, optimists and questioners. But eventually the rest of our lives got in the way and we couldn't commit the time and enthusiasm that the band demanded, couldn't keep up with whatever responsibilities came with a band like this. If there were ever a Chumbawamba manifesto, it would and the inconsistent, contradictory language of the dataists part strident belligerence and part foolishness. This ending is no different. It comes almost as much of a surprise to us as it may do to you. Always more clown than politician, the band trips over its outsized feet and performs its final tumble. There have been squabbles and arguments along the way, a deal of griping, frustration, moaning, exasperation, but always alongside a huge amount of good will and generosity, good humor and love. What a riot it's been, frankly, and now it's time to clear up the mess and move on. And Dan, I'm gonna read one more quote about from one of them about this, Dan in an interview with band Camp in twenty twenty two. This year, I guess I can just say this year, if I'm talking about the year I'm in, I'm very proud of what we did. The whole way through. We tried to push the envelope. We weren't always successful, but we always tried, and that's probably a defining characteristic of Chumba Womba. Whatever era or genre we tried, it always had a working class basis, which is a whole other story. When we signed with the major labels in the mainstream, it didn't destroy us. You could accuse us of selling out, but we weren't bought up, and I think that's a testament to the way we had each other's backs. The mainstream usually swallows people and spits them out. I mean it did split us out, but we took it as a compliment.

Right when they broke up, they put out a statement. I'm a quote from it because I think they do a good, pretty good job of summing up what they were doing. Chumbowomba was our vehicle for pointing at the naked emperors, for telling our version of the truth. It gave us more than the joy and love of playing live, writing songs and singing together. It gave us a chance to be part of a broad coalition of activists and hectors, optimists and questioners. But eventually the rest of our lives got in the way and we couldn't commit the time and enthusiasm that the band demanded, couldn't keep up with whatever responsibilities came with a band like this. If there were ever a Chumbawamba manifesto, it would and the inconsistent, contradictory language of the dataists part strident belligerence and part foolishness. This ending is no different. It comes almost as much of a surprise to us as it may do to you. Always more clown than politician, the band trips over its outsized feet and performs its final tumble. There have been squabbles and arguments along the way, a deal of griping, frustration, moaning, exasperation, but always alongside a huge amount of good will and generosity, good humor and love. What a riot it's been, frankly, and now it's time to clear up the mess and move on. And Dan, I'm gonna read one more quote about from one of them about this, Dan in an interview with band Camp in twenty twenty two. This year, I guess I can just say this year, if I'm talking about the year I'm in, I'm very proud of what we did. The whole way through. We tried to push the envelope. We weren't always successful, but we always tried, and that's probably a defining characteristic of Chumba Womba. Whatever era or genre we tried, it always had a working class basis, which is a whole other story. When we signed with the major labels in the mainstream, it didn't destroy us. You could accuse us of selling out, but we weren't bought up, and I think that's a testament to the way we had each other's backs. The mainstream usually swallows people and spits them out. I mean it did split us out, but we took it as a compliment.

Really there you go.

Really there you go.

Yeah, it's like what you were saying about, Like it is just how you fucking look at it, you know.

Yeah, it's like what you were saying about, Like it is just how you fucking look at it, you know.

Yep, they're like prose or you know, I don't know if that last quotation was what you know, said to a reporter or something like that.

Yep, they're like prose or you know, I don't know if that last quotation was what you know, said to a reporter or something like that.

But it's so beautiful and it's like better than their lyrics, I know, their own sort of like yeah, assessment of their story is is really deep and just like so on point and includes.

But it's so beautiful and it's like better than their lyrics, I know, their own sort of like yeah, assessment of their story is is really deep and just like so on point and includes.

All of the admittedly seemingly contradictory things that made made up Shambawamba, this thing that was you know, on one level, just like a vessel for entertainment and diversion, and on another, you know, straight up you know activism.

All of the admittedly seemingly contradictory things that made made up Shambawamba, this thing that was you know, on one level, just like a vessel for entertainment and diversion, and on another, you know, straight up you know activism.

Yeah. Yeah, And it's interesting because I was thinking about this as I was writing this out. I was like, you know, I'm not really talking about their music, right, and like their songs, and I'm not talking about like their instrumentation and like and all that stuff really matters, And it clearly mattered to them because the whole time they're always like, oh yeah, we don't have to play our instruments. They are like musically really talented to the point where it's like sort of almost annoying. Like their a cappella album, I'm like, you all wrote these amazing like multiple harmonies and like all this crazy shit, you know, and it's about all of these things at once. It's one of the things I've had.

Yeah. Yeah, And it's interesting because I was thinking about this as I was writing this out. I was like, you know, I'm not really talking about their music, right, and like their songs, and I'm not talking about like their instrumentation and like and all that stuff really matters, And it clearly mattered to them because the whole time they're always like, oh yeah, we don't have to play our instruments. They are like musically really talented to the point where it's like sort of almost annoying. Like their a cappella album, I'm like, you all wrote these amazing like multiple harmonies and like all this crazy shit, you know, and it's about all of these things at once. It's one of the things I've had.

Yeah, the music is an aspect of this thing that as a whole is like yeah activist performance art. Yeah, yeah, is really inspiring.

Yeah, the music is an aspect of this thing that as a whole is like yeah activist performance art. Yeah, yeah, is really inspiring.

You know.

You know.

I mean, they they they they they did buck the system, as as he put like, yeah, maybe they they sold.