On episode 13 of Club Shay Shay, Shannon welcomes in boxer, rapper, & actor: Roy Jones Jr.
Roy Jones Jr. speaks about his recent exhibition match against Mike Tyson, revisiting the fight from all angles. He also goes in-depth on the Nate Robinson vs. Jake Paul undercard, detailing the mistakes Nate made and how he can improve for the future.
The conversation touches on topics from across boxing history, highlighting Roy Jones Jr.’s legendary accomplishments within the sport. Roy talks Shannon through his Mount Rushmore of boxers, explains why the ‘70s heavyweight division was the golden era of boxing, breaks down what he’d do differently if he could revisit his career and defends himself as the greatest, most dominant boxer of the 90s.
This podcast is a must-listen for casual boxing fans and aficionados alike. Roy has tons of unfiltered stories from his decades-long career, which has been spent in and out of the ring alongside other legends.
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Hello, Welcome to another edition of Club Sha Shay. I am your host and also the proprietor of Club Shasha and the guy that stopped by the club today to have a drink in some conversation is a boxer, rapper actor. He's a four division champ in the middleweight, super middleweight, light heavyweight, and heavyweight division. Roy Jones you all my life, the grinding all my life, sacond fice, hustle back price, one slice got the bron dice swad all my life. I've been grinding all my life, all my life, the running all my life up, sacri fice, hustle back price, one slice got the ba dice to swathing all my life. I've been grinding all my life. R j what's going on? Brou I'm good. I better. How you feeling, man, I'm feeling good. I'm feeling good. So let's get right. Let's let's start forward and then go backwards. You fought you just coming off of fighting Mike Tyson on Saturday. What you hope to accomplish by taking on this exhibition? I don't know how you exhibition fight, but what did you hope to accomplish by taking this fight? And did you get out of this what you thought you would? Yeah. What I hope to accomplish was I just wanted to give the fans something to look forward, to give them some form of entertainment at a really downtime because the COVID has everybody in such a bad place wearing a mask and no, I mean you just can't appreciate people anymore. So the COVID has us in such a divided state that I feel like this fight or exhibition would help give people something to do the man people of the old times, bringing people back together, and also get some good entertainment out of it. Is this something that you would consider doing again? Not necessarily maybe fighting Mike, but would you consider fighting someone that fought in the super middle way to fought in the light heavyweight division with this something that you would consider again? I probably wouldn't consider much because I don't think many things could supersede the numbers we did for that one. And if you got that's gonna supersede those numbers, then it's not really worth doing. However, there's a kid out there. We're not a kid. There's a guy that by the name of Silver who's a mixed martial artist. As for a legend, who if you put two legends in the ring together, people do pay to see So it's very possible that he and I could get to get him do it, but everybody else but that people don't really care, because I mean, you gotta have two sides. What maybe me and Mike so good was that you got two legends on exercides. If you've got two legends or opposite sides, then it's great. But if you've got a legend and a guy that maybe I wish he was or wants to be a legend, it's not necessarily what you try to say, r J. What you try to say, if you for anybody elder than it ain't gonna be the same. And this is Anderson silver, but if they're Aeron silver because he's an MMA legend, they ain't gonna be the same. But he ain't got but he ain't got hands like Roy, That's what I'm saying. That's the part though. But because he's in a legend, they still would pay to see it. If everybodys two legends does that kissing gad that where he's going. But they're not really legend. So that's why people are really gonna pay to see that, So why don't ever waste my time doing that to give them an opportunity to have another shot at me for no reason when it's not gonna pay me enough to wan worth my while? So why do it? But you hear a lot of these other heavyweights calling out my Evan, the holy Field, Buff the Douglas. Do you think this is stuffing if Mike work. I don't know how serious Mike took this fight, but do you think if Mike were to train seriously, get serious, he and and Holy Feel or he and Buster Douglas could do this thing and it would be presentable. Yeah, it'd be presentable because Mike's still just as dames as he always was. People want to see any time it might get in the rain because they know how dangers he is. So yeah, it'd be presentable. But the problem with that is is that the other guys have more to gain than Mike. Do us right and send me Mike. Mike started a legend everybody. If you say, okay, we're want that Holy Feel I fight Buster Douglas. I mean for us as boxing people, it's a good situation, but for the for the fans, They were like, Okay, who cares? You know what I mean? So it's like you gotta be very careful because it's got to be something that the fans want to see. Not trying to say nobody's better than nobody now that, but it's got something the fans want to see. You feel me, I mean both of us that they both beat ties in his hat. You know, it's like I hadn't got to tell me the other day, Well, Tapa say want to fight you? And how can say you want to fight? Just strange because tarbas last fight he won with against me? How to last fight he wanted against me? So why don't people want to see them fight each other? Why they want? Why they both gotta call my name? You're Styf'm coming from what that takes you to come up here? The guy? You hear you hear me? So it's like, because you were the man of the day, they all want to use you has to come up when they don't realize what are you getting from this? And our prime y'all couldn't touch me. So it's like what am I getting from giving yall shots and free shots at me? And I'm gonta pay y'all. I got y'allant me to pay y'all, y'all as much as I get for putting on a show against me. When I'm uh uh, Mike said, are you surprised? Mike said he was hot during the fight. Do you think that was more because you know he didn't take the fight serious for it had to do something with calming him down. Mike just trying to stay calm. He don't want to bite my ear because nor my body's hear back. Mike just trying to be calm, do things the right way, right, get this to stay out of hand biting and kicking and scratching, because that can happen too, and he knows both of us can go that route. So he trys to come be political about it, get the people what they want to see, but leave it all on a positive note. And he did that. He left it all on a positive note. He thought about kicking once, but he didn't do it. So I thought about kicking it back if he would have kicked, but you know he because I could tell he didn't. First rate, we didn't do it. But because of smoking, it is probably why he didn't do it. Understanding because a riot would have broke out had he done. So it's like I think, God, he hit him together long enough for us to get that done and it was all good. What was your approach in taking this fight? I mean it seems like, yo, okay, I'm gonna hold. I'm gonna try to get a couple of shots off. So going into this, what was roy strategy in this fight? Tap Mike up, don't let him land not one single right upper cut. I don't care what do Revere say, Keep that right on. I'm tired Uphen you get close to him, not let him get your mama child with no right up and see me get stay up, stay not that Mike. Tyson hit your mama's child with no right upper cut. Roy, you believe in your prime when when Roy Jones was at his apex when nobody could see it, do you believe you could beat Tyson in his prime and anybody else they put in front of me? Oh on, Roy, I get it. Look what you've done. Only one other fighter has ever done. Bopit. Simmons. You talk about a middleweight that won a light heavyweight title, but he did a reverse order. He was a middleweight that won the heavyweight and then won the light heavyweight. So what you've done, No other boxer, only Bombing Simmons, has ever done to move up a middleweight super middle light heavy win the heavyweight title. But Roy in his prime, you thought, you think you could have taken could have taken Tyson and my prime? The question with the band camp Tyson deal with me. Hello, Roy, Look, look you know I'm ro. I love you, you you, you and my dog, royd you you my dog. And you had hand you had feed that was unbelievable. You was very unorthodox. A lot of people ain't throwing no lead hooks, ain't boxed in the stands that you were in. Tyson. You understand he was the most feared He might have been the most feared man in the history of the boxing in the boxing community. And Roy Jones at one hundred and six day one, So what way do you think you need to be at in the order to fight Tyson? When I asked on, I meant when I asked, I was two hundred pounds and I wanted him right the end when I was at the apex of my career because I still was reaching for things. Because you gotta remember, I wanted I'm the first guy and the only guy bout this. Simth didn't do this. I'm the only guy to turn professional as a junior middleweight, which is one hundred and fifty four pounds correct capture the heaitweight title. Boutisim didn't do. They turn for us middleweight. But with that being said, when I wanted hit for eight title, I still gonna go because I had to come back and recapture the light hitwey title. Or I didn't do about this Simth did see I did. I wanted middleweight super the weight which wasn't around with bout this. Simon was around light hitweight. Then I wanted hit weight. But then I went back and recapture the light wi tild because I feel like that's what Bob Fi Simon did. So that being said, when I wanted to hear for each other, I still was on the up clack trying to grab things because I wanted to do exactly what he did, but ask something to it. So had I thought Mike Tyson in two thousand and three, after I wanted hit title, I don't see no where in the the world he would have bet you couldn't even hit me back there. My still good I had lost the twenty five pounds muscle, yet my body hadn't started deteriorating on me. Yet you couldn't test me, you thought, Ruis, I think you way, what one ninety three, one ninety five, yep, and one ninety three. So do you think that was the beginning of Roy starting to not be Roy Jones? Because you went up to one ninety five and then you had to come back down and you started had to shedding that weight and I had to cut the muscle. That's when it began. That's when the demand has begin because I cut muscle. I cut twenty five pounds of muscle offs not just reag a weight muscle. My body never did that, did nothing like that before. Ideally, all the money fights were probably at what one sixty eight? There was Tarburd and Hopkins. There was really no money. There's really never been any money in the light heavyweight division unless you're talking about now. So you basically you had to go back down to get the pay days because the only heavyweight you wanted to fight was Tyson, only him. I wanted to fight with Mike Tyson, and like I said, I was under the person that bobbing someone on the middleweight, light heavyweight, heavyweight and recapture the light heavyweight title. So if I wanted all that, I had to go back and recapture that light hit with title or I didn't do a bop thin sim sad right, then that's what my prison was not about. What am about the big winning fights. The big Monny fight was why I would have fought Mike Tyson, I said, I only hit with our fight is Mike Tyson wha because it's a big money fight and it require me to stay here longer. Meanwhile, if that don't happen, I gotta go back to ship to wait and go reclaim the light heavywey title, or I can't say I did what Bobby Simmons did. On the undercard, Nate Robinson fought Jake Paul What what did you What was Nate's mistake? And if you were advising him, if you were training Nate, how would you prepare him? And says okay, if he wants to rematch, how would you prepare the Nate to take that fight and to win. First of all, is not a fight that makes should even take because Nate is about five nine five ten one hundred and eighty one pounds. Basically, Silking with Jay Paul was a pour down one hundred eighty nine pounds. I mean they came from two ten to one and nine. You know what I'm saying. Man, So one guy knows how to pull away and how to play the weight game. The other guy has no clue of it. So you're already smaller than him. Then he's a pull down. It's like people said. People say, they looked at me, and Mike said, oh, y'all by the same size. No we're not. You see Mike's head. Mike escape from took way moway than I ever could think about two Mike, and care way more way than I have a good dream of car. You feel me, Mike say, lost one hundred pounds. That means he was three twenty something and he got a tooth one or something. He's a much bigger figure than I at same with Nay Paul, with Jay Paul, and they they is way too small to being a box ring with a pour down. Jake Paul has just it just didn't. When I saw him at the way end, I said, oh gosh, I told my wife, and this is not gonna be pretty. She said, why I say he too small. It just ain't fair. He's too small. You don't know what he here up against, but he's too small, and plus you have to look at it. Also, r J, is that that one eighty one that's a bumped up one eighty one? Nate probably walked He walking around it probably one seventy, that's my point. And he's finally guy pulled down two tens one net. This is just you just put yourself out. You just took yourself out the game. So, in other words, besides fighting a man much too big for him, he didn't have the proper tools, Peace explained to a lay person, Roy explain the mistakes that Nate made inside the ring. Forget the fact that he shouldn't have been in there to begin with, but what was some of the mistakes that he made that caused him to get You don't get hit and get angry and take off ring the rest of the guy's throne punches, because that guy's already set knowing that you're coming because you're angry, and he's gonna wait and tell you. And that's kind of what happened. So he made a few boxing mistakes that because he's an experience of boxing that a normal boxer would make. But gotta hit you and hurts you. Yeah, you take a cap. Jo't run back in around for a little while, get your head back together or correct you box smart and make him think you okay when you know you're not. But you'd be smartest away from contact for a little while. You get all the way back together, then you engage and get contact again. He engaged right away, and you can't do that. See for me, Nate treated this like a street fight. Like you said, he tried to rush in. And maybe in a street fight he can beat Jake because you can scoopy, but in a boxing match you can only throw these things here and so now he's rushing in and with his hands down. That's the first rule street fight, no matter the fight, keep your hands up. That's the last thing that the referee tell you. Keep your hands up. Protect yourself at all times, all time up. He didn't do that. He got he lost it. He kind of got got emotional in that. Kenny Atlas was upset at the California Boxing Commission said they should not even sancted this fight, sanctioned this fight. Do you think if they did sanction that you think they should have had a head gear. Well, no, that would not make a difference. So you think, Nation, just get this up. Let let this boxing ain't thing. No, no, they don't have to give it up. What you gotta do is you gotta get in the gym and get some real training. First of all, okay, you gotta start fighting in your weight class, because that's why they have weight classes. You must get into your own weight class. You can't be fighting guys ten twenty pounds and heavy heavy than you, especially when they have also more experience than you can. You imagine me fighting a guy that's ten pounds lighter than me and don't have the experience to box. That's it's just wrong. So it's like you fought the guy that was not only really more than tenpos here, you're on scaling tenpoles here and you on the scale Michael tenpoles hire than me. But if you look at it, I pushed my back to the corner like the coach told me do my people are like the third and just set me down in the same corner. I'm like, whoa understanding because he's ten pounds hitting me on the scale. But you used to carry much more weight than I am. Right, so his ten pounds is more like thirty pounds, right. I know you remember that, you remember two tall Jones who the great defensive linement for the Dallas Cowboys. Thought he could but this guy was five eight and this dude carried two tall Jones. And I tried to explain to people, I say, the mistakes some great athletes make is that they think because they're great in one sport, they can just pick up and do another sport. It's not that simple, Roy, not at all. Brother. People don't understand. It's different muscle memory, it's different technique, it's different, everything is different. I mean, we all great athletes and we can do the other spot, but you can't compete at an elite level in every other sport like that. Right on. One or two people could do that, you know what I'm saying. I mean one or two, and that's far far in few between one or two people. One or two people could be here to do that like that. But here's the thing to Roy, you've been fighting. How were you started when you when your dad gave you gay you gloves? And you how old were you? Eight? Nine? Ten? You were ten years of age. Okay, so from ten, you're building up those reflexes, you're building up those instincts. You know how to pivot, you know how to turn, you know how to block punch you you know how to make punches miss, you know how to walk guys in the punches. What makes somebody think they're in their mid thirties they can just pick us up and saying, oh, y'all can go do that at a at a competitive I understand hitting the miss in the gym because the hair our people who don't understand every they reality of boxing at people who think all you gotta do get in shape and a lot of punch and you can fight. That's not true. There's a lot more that goes into boxing than most people realizing. The problem with the Channel and probably with the brother is that there's a lot of people that actually box that don't understand boxing. So you know, most people that that don't have them to do a boxing that are gonna get it confused. And see the thing else, You watch somebody and they're hitting the miss, and they're throwing the miss into your hands and they swear, they swear, old boy got hands, Oh boy got hands Like that see you know who comes. That's that's that Floyd made. Was a syndrome. They see Floyd and his uncle with his dad was all those myths and he dug it and he doing all that behind his back and people like, oh yeah, I can do that. No you can't. And it's as it looks. So the fight game. Now, give me some of the fighters that you enjoy watching. I joy watching a lot of man. I love boxing, and I enjoy watching anybody that goes out, takes it serious and works hard to prepare himself to come to a point where they can fight. So you got Javonte Davis, you know you got. I like Little Machinko, tipping my lotw pezz my guys, Mike, Mike Williams, Kevin Noan, Christian Bank Junior, I mean gran, I got so many of my guys I like to watch because I like them, see them go out and do things that I teach them to do. But heavyweight wise, I love types of fury always. I like watching after at the Joshua man, it's like a Canelo Spence crossfoot. I mean, man, the list goes out. Any anybody that's at the top, at the top, echelon. I like to watch box because I like to see the thing that they do well, the things they need improvement on. And I just like to analyze because it keeps you short. How does Deonte Wilder bet Tyson Fury? Because I look at it because Tyson Fury is a boxer and what they call him as a puncher, and I don't know if he has the skill set because he's trying to set up one shot. Why Tyson Fury's boxing circles around him. Problem with that is that people don't understand that you cannot be one dimensional and dominate for a long time. You have to have other dimensions to your game. What people didn't understand about Mike Tyson or that Mike Tyson's a puncher, but Mike Tyson also a puncher who knows how to set you up for his punchers. That's why I told you the referee can talk all you want to. He not hear my mama childing right up, go don't care what we yet he's not hitting my mother's child when right up, I don't care what this was. So because my mama child knows that my mother's child knows how to watch for all the chaps all the things he does to set you up for that right up. So he's not like Wilder. He not just trying to hit you one right hand. He got a lot of other stuff that he just set you up and hit you with until he can sneak that might up cut on you, understand me. So it's like you have to know how to sit, how to pay your games like chest. You gotta know how to leave people into where you want them to go so that you're gonna until you're gonna ambush. And Tyson knows how to do that. Why they don't really do that there will And you know what you're saying something very interesting because when people look at Mike Tyson because he had that knock one punch in most heavyweights to have one punch knock out power, and they seem to over the that just decapitate people. But Mike is a very technical body a boxer. Because he he did something that I watched him, and I went back and watched some of his fights how he banged you twice with that hook to the body and then throw the upper cut on the same hand. Yep. And I already know that if his hair is free, if I feel it right there, I take off running. I ain't stand up if he hits you out here to take our running. Nobody kept a hand like that as I could. If you feel that take off run, they look so hent go. Ain't think about it that whatever hand he hits you when you're taking out running the other way, you better believe it because you know the upcut coming. So if he too the right hooked him bout it if needed to go out of the way because the upcut is on the way. But like I said, he had various different ways of setting up his knock out punches. He didn't squad and just throw him knocking you out with him. Knocked you out with him. He set him up. Why, I don't really have a lot of set up. He just waiting for you to make a mistake, one mistake. If you get you to make the right mistake, he can land it. If you don't make that mistake, he has a hard time landing. And Ferry knew how to not make that mistake. Because you gotta remember, Furry also heluded the greatest one of all of him to us, the Chris Cooke brother hit him of all the right hand punches like that he eluded Chris Cole straight right man, he took it away from him, and that's why Kisco couldn't be there. Then he would did the same thing while he took his right hand away from him. Say, he's a master at taking away to one punch if that's all you get, right, because he goes he keeps sticking that jabbing, and Wilder didn't. Wilder didn't have a counter. So in order in order to be elite, like you said, you can win the heavyweight title, but to have sustainability, you got to have more than one punch. You gotta have more than one one one one one one tricking in your room. Dicks, you gotta have a lot of You gotta have more in your arsenal. And to me, Tyson Fear, that's what I've told Tyson Fear about four or five years ago. If you go get yourself together, you can beat all of them because Tyson has a bigger repertoire to most of the Hivway's heads. He has more skills than most of them got. He don't have the most power, but he got more skills than most of them have. And people that don't understand boxing won't understand it. I didn't realize how big he was, but that is a giant of a man, six nine, with that kind of read, with that kind with But but like you said, he got skills. That's the other aspect of that hype. Also, you gotta remember, why do youse to punch people straight out in front of him or punch him down on It's harder to punch up than it's to punch straight out or punch down. You gotta punch up to hear furious. That's what through Chris Goff, that's what through wild Off. Let's talk about Floyd Mayweather, because before your reign, before after your reign, he kind of tipped the mantle. You were fight of the decade. You did what you did, and then he came along. He started out to think as a lightweight and moved up to the junior middleweight one fifty four. Because I think he took day La Joyer's belt at one fifty four, but he wiped out everything from one forty one, forty seven, one fifty four, one thirty one, one thirty six. I think if the weight class thirty five thirty five, okay, one thirty five, I think started by one. I think he started by one thirty. Now he might start up. I believe you're right. Talk to me about Mayweather. One made him so great. He won the best defensive fighters you've ever seen, and he's smart. He don't take on stupid risk. He calls out, he fights, and he fights to get the debut. He made the debut become very relevant because he always fought to keep that debut. So when you start fight and keep that debut made it become even more smarter. And now he used that because he was very smart businessman. He used at de w t make people want to see him. Who's that debut? So he was able to be smart to pick a choo what he want to do because everybody wanted to see that WI go away and he knew that, so he played on it. But he's a very good fight of very chalented athlete, a very smart guy, and a very smart fighter. People said, well he didn't have well, he can't punch, he don't got power. And my response to him, I say, well, why don't people just run in on it? If he ain't got no powers, ain't nobody trying to run in on it? That's not true. He saw he did the Rickor had and he showed you got power not on one hand. He got power in both hands. He just don't choose to fight that way, right, he got gott it. I mean when you look at the people that he got out of there before, like you said, before, the w became the end all be all. If you look at what he did at one forty and one forty seven and one thirty five, he was carrying the lightweight He carried that lightweight division. He carried the one forty Artoro got it. The guys he bought to knock out and he took him out. So he did definitely have power in both hands. So he would say he can't punch, that's not true. Now he's a defensive fighter. Didn't use a lot of punches and then throw a throw a lot of punches. Okay, I understand you're saying that, But to say you can't punch you, you're wrong. You can't punch in both hands. Defensive fighters, you like Mayweather or you like sweet Pea, because I don't think Sweetpea gets the credit that he deserves for being his defense, for being a defensive fighter's great. He was a great fighter, but his defense was impeccable. Also the bad part of fighters. His defense was better than Floyd's, but Flowyd's offensive power is better than sweet Peas. So Floydi is harder, but sweep he has the best defense. Okay, I'm gonna put you on the spot here. This is eighty. Give me your mount rush more boxers. It doesn't have to be all heavy weights, it doesn't have to be middle weights. This is that. Give me your mount rush more. You get four boxes rowing, you get four four I'm pulling me out of it, Okay, And I'll say myself because okay, to of me, I'll bet the top of my response. I'm gonna take me out of there. Okay. But day at the top, Okay, I'm gonna put I'd probably put Shy Robinson the second. Okay, I'm probably put seven or sanchis third, Okay, and the proper will stop there because after that I can take Lena Duran, Shy Bears, Hagler, I go into kind of after that, but them top three, that's my top three. I take in after that, but them my top three. What would you say is the golden era of boxing? The seventies? Why and the seventies read ourselves to go to the Arab boxing because everybody in the headweight division, if they were still around, you probably take the top ten in the seventies and insert them, each one of them in today's time, and each one would be headwoy chap right now that they still because that's how doable, that's how rugged, that's how well gifted in boxing. Most of those guys was everybody in the top ten back in that time was headweight champion, quality or character type of fight. So you're looking at our league, Ken Norton, George Foreman, h Larry Holmes, George Pray. Look, pick which you want to pick? Pick? I mean one of the great fighters of all times that people need to go look at. And I said to it, I watched a few fights that I will watch old look like. I watched Herns them all the time. I watched Linda Man a lot. I watch a Hagger, Hearns. I watched Hagger Lena but one of the best, some of the best fight because that's something. But the list goes on on. But to really get a good appreciation of boxing, I appreciation of boxing, you always have to go back and watch George Foreman versus run Lyle one of the best heavyweight fights ever then one of the heavway fights that also touched me a lot as an older kid as I was growing up in boxing. I became a Larry Holmes fan after watching Larry Holmes fight Keen North because I know how hard at the time kid Norton gave Alie every time you've seen it, every time for Larry Holmes, come, for Larry Holmes to come and deal with that same thing and overcome, it was really exceptional to me. And they need to become a Layer Holmes fan. Layer Home was shooting that job. Layer Home didn't use that job as arranged fight. He was using the duke and that right. So there there's a lot of fighters. I mean, there's really no American fighters. And people ask for where the American heavyweights. They're playing defensive end or they're playing basketball in the NBA, that's where they are. But if you look at the lot of division, you look at Bud Crawford, you look at Earl Spence Junior, you got some young fighters. You want to see the Earl. You obviously Spence fights Garcia, but do you want to see the Earl Spence, Bud Crawford fight. I've been begging for the fight, begging for it. And the problem, like I said, I understand with the two promoters and how that goes, but it's like, you know, for me, man, it's like the difference was I don't everybody's is entitled to run it the way they want to run. There. I learned from Ali and the other old timers the way you played the game was you played king of the hill. He can hit me to the top, and you fight whatever come up to hell. You gotta defend against anything that come up to hell because you are the king of the hell when you get up to the hell. That's what I was saying. Now I'm ana fight that I fight. That's really not king of to hell no more. But I understand so different people did different things for different reasons. I didn't fight the money. I fought for greatness and for a legacy because I wanted to be king of the hell. You know what I'm saying. I mean, so I took it differently that some other people may take it. Other people fought for different business reasons, so they didn't do it well. I think it because they were looking for ways to maximize their cash, But so everybody, but everybody got the right to do what how they want to do it. So you can't get mad at them for doing the way they're gonna do it when they time to come, they're supposed to do it their way my time, though, I only knew from what the old times they taught me, and I thought I was supposed to pay king of the hell. That's what I did, and that's what the problem is. Now they can sit there and have two guys that everybody thinks are the best in their division. But they can still play the left side the right side. Once stay over there and once stay over there. No, no, no, no, that's I that gold we need to see. They don't stop at the AFC Championship, in NFC championsips. Okay, we gotta oh no, no, no no, we got a super Bowl. We gotta go to the super on the bell one of these champions is the best, right right, So do you do you believe they got two many bells? Now, No, that't about two many bells. You can have all that, you can have all that. You can have two many bells. It don't matter longer. When the time come and it come up top gaber here and a top guy here. They must come have a super Bowl. We must see the super Bowl. We can't just stay there with an AFC champion NFC champ every year. That's two many chap We gotta bring all that to the middle at some point. But here's the thing, though, Roy, if I can okay, yeah, I might can fight you and make twenty million, But if I can just stay over here and make keen million and fight people I know that I can, know I can beat, why would I risk it. That's what the problem is about, sus And that makes it if you're hit it for the money. But see, I can't see that night noticed another team over the undefeated, and I ain't with see him. I can't. That's just why I'm I can't see that. I need to go see you. Understand me, If you're that bad, I need to see you. Got to show you that the I can't sneak I don't care about I can't sneak knowing that there's an equal but opposite. I gotta see him. I'm gonna ask you to construct the boxer, and I'm gonna give you some characteristics, and you tell me the boxer you want to pull this from hand speed, Sugarte, Lennar knock out power, timing, has athleticism, Roy john stream quickness, Gary Russell, streaming, reflexes, Mammad Ali, size, Mammad Ali boxing, Iq Sanchez, m defense, well for bed Tis, discipline, Marvin Haber, actressy in which you landed his punches? Who else? He's a Chadbis Wow. Roy, you grew up in Pensacola. And I don't know if a whole lot of people know this, but there are a lot of great athletes that came out of Pensacola. Very good friend of yours and mine, Derek brooks In, Mitt Smith's from Pensacola. H you went to school. If I'm not mistaken with an ex teammate of mine, friend of mine, Reggie Johnson. What is it about Pensacola? The water? The water is something in the water or y'all swimming in y'all swimming in the water. It's got to be something in the water. I mean, you got that about it. You got Arthur won the greatest boxes of all time. You got NFL leading Russia, you got my best linebackers of ball team, you got this one of the fastest runners in the world, justin Gatton. I mean, come on, bruh, be just everywhere. I mean, fastest hands, fastest speak, I mean what I mean, what else could it be? From the time your daddy gave you those gloves when you were ten years old, is that the only thing that you ever wanted to be? Did you ever want to play? Say? I want to be and I want to be a football player, I want to be a basketball player. Well, I'm gonna tell you a story. I did play basketball, and I didn't like basketball. I didn't want to be a fastball player as well, but boxing was my heart. I'mna tell you why boxing was my heart. I played football first, right right, and I got to I played quarterback, and I played quarterback. We had three players because we had a small team when they had a lot of players. So we had three players, three players with three real plays that were gonna work. The rest of plays, everybody wasn't gonna really do it right, and people were afraid we really run the ball. Quarterback rollout left, quarterback rullout right, and quarterback sneak and I would quarterback. And you asked you, that's too much hitting me exactly. But what were happening to those guys get a good lick on me. And then they had big enough teams that they didn't have to pay both sides. I'll team so small, we play both sides with the offense and defense. So some of these guys pay offense and pay defense, but they wouldn't play offense. So I would get pissed off because you play defense, you hit with a good lick. Well, my tap defense, you order them to side out of the college. I'm like, no, go put him back all what are you doing? I want to get my getting back to help me. I need that bet you're feeling. So I realized that, you know what, as you get older, you're not gonna get your get back in football. So I din't need somebody get get back here right now. So boxing became very pitty to me. So you grow up through the you go up through the ranks, and you go to the eighty eight Olympics, and I remember it, and Soul I was in college. As a matter of fact, I was a junior in college, and I remember it. It seems like yesterday, and you're doing your thing. You outland the guy in punches almost three to Basically, it was us three to one, out landed three to one, and you're standing in the ring and you just know, you just know you won this fight. Like I'm about to be the gold medal, I'm about to be Sugar Ray Leonard, I'm about to be Muhammad Ali. I'm about to be all these grades. I'm gonna be an American hero. And when you hear them call his name, what was the first thing to go through your mind? I was sick. I said, this may not be a sport for me, because any time you can run a race and finish first and you still get second, something wrong with that sport. And I'm saying, so I immediately like, you know what, maybe box name for me? Did you have a conversation with the with the guy that you you beat? They ended up because it wasn't it wasn't Korean, he was Korean? Did you I have a conversation that told her the Trevor? I said, ma'am, give me one faire? She said yeah. I said, ask him does he think he want? And she didn't know it, but he would have said, yeah. I was the girl in a head again, right She asked him and said, no, I know I didn't win. He asked me, said, no, I know I didn't win, and he shook my hand. So after that I couldn't do that because I read it with really Guiden's head. But he said, no, what was I to do? It ain't his fault. He didn't judge the fight, and now he tell me he know he didn't win. I can't get mad at the man because he told the truth. But had he not told the truth, it was gonna be some teeth missing. So you fire the protest with the with the protest, did you think, like, you know what, they're gonna go back and look at these score cards. They're gonna look at all these points I accumulated. They're gonna look at what he didn't do. Oh, they're gonna they're gonna make this right. They'll make it right. And I'm gonna be okay. Even though I didn't get my arm raised in the ring at the time, I'm still gonna be able to hear the anthem play, and I'm still gonna be a champ like Sugaraye Ali Frazier. If some mark Breeli of some of the other grades, No, I never thought that one of the Annaci's decision that was it. I was done for me. So after that I went and I think the United States or never committed by a petition, but I never did anything because I took it what it was and that was there, and I felt like first, I feel like it was miserable for me. I should quit boxing and just let it go. But then when I got home, I realized that it could have been a blessing in disguise, because what was funny was that when at the airport, nobody was looking for the guys that want the cold medal, They look for the guy that got cheated and got the silver medal, and that blew my mind. So it showed me right away how quickly God can take your worst nightmare and turned into the biggest blessing of all time for you. Because in my worst time, when I thought I was at the lowest part of my life, I would say, afice nine years and got robbed of a gold medal, and I thought that was it for me. I was more famous than anybody else, showing that Olympert team even the guys want the gold medal, and I was guy showing me that you stick with God, keep faith in God. He can take the worst and turn it to the best for you, Roy, You wont you won the Golden Gloves in nineteen eighty six and one hundred and eighty eight one hundred and thirty eight pounds, and then the next year you win at one hundred and fifty six. How do you put on eighteen pounds almost a little year. Well, I wanted one through the nain. When I wanted one through the nine, I probably should have been fighting one forty seven because I was coming from one fifty two make one thirty nine. Okay, So when I found out, moved up and I since it stopping one for the seventh. I'm already coming from one fifty six making a thirty nine, So I'm gonna go and fight at one fifty six. Don't stop at one for the seventh man. At the same time I got it one third. Naw, I got loose six less pounds. But it's the same thing. Now this power whatever wasn't see it was than now eight less pound. I want to do eight miss pound, but I stick got loose almost forty pounds. So when not going out with one forty six, so I went out back at the one forty six. So that was so that was your natural So at that point in time, you just basically walking around, you just training, and the ain't gotta drop no way, got cut, no water, gotta do nothing. Now that that's you, I still had to cut with and make that. So what would you say at that point in time? What would you say? You're walking around? Way was one sixty eight one seventy one, probably one sixty eight, one seventy Yes, So when you fought at one sixty eight at super middleweight, what were you walking around then? One ninety one, eighty five, one eighty one any waiting? My daddy made me go down to one f seven for the east up the trials and eighty eight right right. I fought the first night. I made one for the seven and fought the first night. I went after the fight after the fight and got him scared gets for our weight one on fifty seven, one sixty five. What you re man got me all way back and I got all the way back down one fot in a half the next morning. Wow, So you was like, you know what I happen to be cutting? I'm not. I've been to be cutting twenty five thirty pounds and gonna work comes. I do this every night. I said, I won't have no energy to fighting on limpits with. So I can't do this. This is too I can't make it. Because if you went from one forty seven to one sixty five after you fault, I mean I was one for I was one sixty eight when I fought right, so you basically you you rehydrated and put on twenty pounds. Of course. Wow, what was it like sparring with sugar a man that was gonna the greatest times in my life, on the great mess of my life. And it was like, you know, you're coming up and fighting against your idol or he sparing with your idol, and you want to see what he got. Which want to see what you got too. So I was doing pretty good and he got he got uh, he got tired me kind of doing my fast work, and he set me vera goodhood playing. I said, okay, that's a good shot. But that's how he was ever really stepping up with most of the the time I pretty much in control. So I was. I was happy because I feel like through it all he was able to setting up one good shot. Most of the time I was there in the better shot. So I felt really good about myself so and I always did you know me? Did you know you know what? Hell long, I'm faring with Sugar Ray. I'm getting my legs, I'm getting my I'm getting my shots off. He caught me with one, but I feel I'm getting the better. This is that when you knew you was gonna be a world champ. Now I know what already before that, but at that point it's kind of that kind of solidified it your boxing career. What would you have done differently? I thought I have done different with my boxing career is after I want to hear weight title. I would have came down when I be taught the first time. I would have stopped for Lisa a year or two to let my body recuperate and get myself back together, because that was the understand I made by not staying out of boxing, because I was always a guy that my own self came back to hunt me because if you want to fight, I'm gonna fight. That's just who I always would. I don't die nothing. People say, well you do, I don't care. That don't mean nothing, mean nothing scared me. I fight everybody any time. I never cared, so that that's what came out to hurt me though, because I didn't realize the effect that that twenty five pounds of muscles gonna happen my body. And that's the one pound is it differently? Because if you look at it up until that point, Up until that point, Roy, it wasn't even close. The one loss you had was it was a disqualification on Montell Griffin, and then you came back and just carried it. They couldn't they couldn't touch me. I came back and demolished him. You did, you did one month? First round, ficked around that. It didn't goes on first round. We fought the last round and sold that for the prescus. I said, all I'm about to do this guy. We fight, We fight around now, and that's quite did. So you the refight you one ninety three and you're gonna go back and you're gonna go back down to one sixth day. So you gotta lose your twenty pounds because you look solid. I mean, your body looked like you were like you're naturally one hundred and ninety five twohundred pound man. So you look like you like I'm like day. Roy. I carried that like he'd been that so you looked like a two hundred. You look like an old school heavyweight because they weren't like these super heavyweights that came to be the Clitch Gold and the Lennox Lewiss and all those guys. The heavyweights in that time was one ninety five to two h five. Ali, I think way two o five, Joe Lewis those those guys with your side what you fought ruis at. So I'm saying, Damn Roy looked like an old school heavyweight. Yeah, problem wasn't the first time I've lifted weights in my whole life. And I put weight, I put muscle off from lifting. Yeah, I had never done that before my whole life. So when I took weight off, I had to take that muscle down lifted to put on. That was true muscle I had to take off. And that's what deal to me. Is that why boxers really don't because boxes don't really lift weights, do they? They should make it where it makes you slow watching from bos down. Contraction muscles cost a little bit more bulkanness, and boxing needs to be at the reach. You need a long reach to be a box of Most boxers want to hit out on the end, so that they don't have to put their face in harm's way. So you want to do it with your arm length, to use your arm range to get the most. You don't want have to have them like unless you Tyson type. Tyson type, you can lift for it. Because everything he does as looping. He throws up because I got told her I'm coming to come about the hooks about it cause all these looping punches. So most his best punch of throne like this is with the borders on. So lift what it's gonna hurt. Come got as tall anything everything exactly. He doesn't extend. But most people that are long range guys, they need to be an extent, and weight lifting doesn't give you that same advantage. So if you take a year off or two a year and a half, let's say you take sixteen eighteen months off to go back down to one and sixty eight an easy way. You think Tarba beat you? Hell no, tarbing nobody else at seventy five? No, hell no. I peat him when they hand on energy. I be when I was getting a dead there walking, I beat him. Come on, bright, I mean, imagine I beat this man. I lost twenty five pounds. I ain't got energy to eat. And I beat you and you think you're whip me if I was in my regular feeling, No, come on, bro, No, but you know it's what it is. I don't. But no, they couldn't tell. I listen the difference in me and flowed back then when people said about how great we wear our our prime and our errors. I didn't lose rounds. I lose round where I wanted. I want a whole fight. No, I ain't probably lose a round. I fought money toil different the first time. Yeah, and that because I told, Because I knew he was a cad of punching. Knew he was a cad ofpunchet, and I was a cand ofpunche. So I just said I was waiting at the waiting. Didn't get tired, get him a few rounds had so we keep working the web down. The song I came out to till on the first fight was patience is the virtue? Why, because we're two kind of punchers. We're looking in the mirror of one another. So you just gotta let him wear it self down. Once he wears himself down, then you take him out. And that's what it was thought to out. But since they just qualified and I said, you know what, I'm gonna do the way I can do it, then I just walked through a get. And that's why I did second time, but the first time because I wasn't the guy I want to go do that. I was the technician. My thing was working, working, working, You go, you're gonna lose three round because you gotta makehim work. So I'm gonna lose the three round for a change. Why because I'm finding another counterpuncher. Counterpunchers and counterpunchers don't make for good fights, right because issues, So I had to push the issue. Was gonna give him a round too, because he's gonna counter. I do what I put. When I be the gressive and i'ma wear it down, I'll take in the deep water. Then I'm gonna drying it. That's why he took the knee, which I didn't know he wanted to be taking me. Will you doing? Cause refuge didn't say stop. But that's why he took the knee. It wasn't because I hit him in the hard. He was drying it for that pressure he was in that deep water. I knew that, you understand me. I knew that. So but the refuge is saying now. So I tapped the refusenders, like, let me get it. They feel like he was I said, O care, if y'll want to play, let me show you what it looked like if I hate him for real, so stuck times, show look like I hat him real, letting against him. He didn't supposed do. But it's like all the reason I was the only time I even know that I probably lost because I'm finding another counterpuncher who was a great canipu. He's a great calipuncher. Then he got two wins over James Tony. Not many people got wins over James Tony. You got James, You you beat James Tony. I'm the master calepuncher. I said he was a good counterpuncher. I said, I'm the master counperme. You fought Bernard Hopkins in nineteen ninety three before the win to win the middleweight title, and at the time Hot beat Hot with twenty two and one. What do you remember about that fight? They were too slow, so you knew he couldn't beat you. I told him. I told him, I told about the press coups. I said, listen, I've seen you. I know you could. I'm gonna watching on the problem you're gonna hair. It's on two faces. It's only the problem you're gonna hair. So you've never seen nobody with speed again, you can keep up with the speed that guy. You got a chance, but I don't think you can do it. I told him that the press cup. Nobody heard him because I said that all to him with the two big out to go out there, I said to them three, I said, y'all right, wait, but y'all can't be with him. He got a problem because he can't deal with my speak. That's what it was. And then you fought James Tony and ninety four, which turned out to be the fight of the year, and James Tony was he was crushing fee. People look at James Tony now and they like they laugh at everything. But James Tony could fight James Tony. You the career, come in shape to be to be ready to fight best fight I ever fought. To this day, as far as boxing skills, that fault best Tyson as the strongest I was fault. But to this day James on the best skill to skill box out fulk and you you beat him unanimously twelve rounds. I mean you just basically carried the whole fight. I mean when you go up and when you look back at your career, not only were you win and fight, you were dominating some of the greatest fighters. Bernard Hopkins was is arguably the greatest middleweight and you can't carried him. James Tony was a two if I'm not mistaking, the two division champ, and you carried him. Montell Griffin, you cat was pound tunnel with pound pound of bad man on the scene at the time, inside and outside the ring. What was your strategy and fighting Tony? She had the boxing because he fought behind the shoulder. Make him keep turning and keep fighting behind his shoulders, to make him to keep turning. Because I know he was good. If you stayed right in front of him and had a good right hand. He knocked people around one. He knock cart around twelve because he had a really good right hand. But that's if you stay right there in front of him, if you get around on that shoulder. It was nothing he really could do. And that's what I did all night. So the shot that people remember with the James Tony is when you did the cock fighting move. You put your hands behind your back and you were squatting and you was almost like trying to walk him into a punch. Yeah. I put him to the side like the chicken, hold the fellers out like this, and he top it. So I did it again. Called me your copy. Now I call him the hook off of him. I mean that's the thing. Or I mean when people look at your fights and they talk about it, they's like what he did, probably no other boxer can do because it was so unorthodox. But I studied animals like the like the fighting roosters. I studied things that God put it in the naturally. God put it in fighting rooster to fight naturally. So you studied those things, you gotta be good because that came directly from Gods. Those animals. Nobody developed in animals, Nobody talked those animals. How do that they developed? Got? They got that directed from God? So what better to learn from than something that got it directed from our creator? You know what I'm saying me. So I would watch them always because I wanted to learn different things that they did, learn techniques, learn moves. And what had happened was I was at a point in a James tunning fight where everything I had tried he had neutralized, nobody had really taken over. So the point in the fact where somebody now had to take over. So I said, you know what, let me use my rooster move and see what did it help. So I did it, and he did it. I said, oh, I got it. Now I did it again, and he did it. I caught him, and that shifted the momentum to my favor, and I kept at all like so that gave you the confidence once you once you caught him with that move, that gave you the confidence to like move in and like assert yourself even more. Now I had the confidence already, I just went at That was a point where momentum. Somebody had to take the momentum. I have football games have momentum swings, yea. At that point somebody had to take the momentum. That gave me the momentum to continue doing what I did, but to do it on a high level. Night in the nineteen ninety five, you became the first boxer in Company box history to go around and not have a fighter land a single punch on you. Then it passed the other, yes, reputable fighter who may go down in the Hall of Fame self one day, right right right, John, to you the first fighter in company box history to go a complete ground without getting a punch landing on him. Fighting got very well known. A punt it and y'all who the best defensive fight is? Again? Don't talk about it? Did? Boxing at that point in time seemed easy to you? Boxing was easy to me because I was in shape, I was always reading, I had on knee ailments, I hadn't hadn't lost that kind of weight yet. It was like walking around, this is what I do, and I was simply the best. That's why I did when the whole first person that was going a whole round, when I getting hit and they say, oh, he wasn't good at people's about Well, how do they hear you go a whole three minutes where I getting tupt And you're not a good defensive fighter? Where what you are when they called pound for pound of best because your office is impeccable, your defensive is impeccable, your speed is impecable, your powers impectable, your footwork, everything is impecable. That's what makes you pound pound of best. That's in your prime. You were fighter of a decade, and there was some you know, not a whole lot of fighters can saying they were the fighter of a decade. Okay, you can be Fight of the year, you can have Fight of the year. But over ten years fans, Roy Jones Junior in the ninety was was voted the best fighter of the decade of the nineties, and they're right, they got it right. Roy. You alo, how you gonna fight. You gotta fight at night and then you go play a pick up you gonna play basketball, but buckets, that's what we do. You know what I mean? I mean what I do is every day before training, or you can after training. I played basketball in the way, so I'm like, you know what, Deon Ever, Barry played football and baseball the same day, So who would ever expect a boxer to go do another sport the same day. They tell you that we really want you to walk around much the day before you fight, that law gonna spend in the Japan basketball? Are you serious? And me because I did it on a daily basis, I said, you know what, I can do it and I didn't do it against somebody that was just a nobody. The guy did against went on to capture the WBC Superman Way title and hit it for three years after that. So when like I did that against a bomb, I did that's against a top, high class world champions type athlete. So another word, what you're trying to tell me, what you're trying to tell my listeners, Roy, is that you made great fighters look average. That's what you're trying to tell me. The saung saying, And it got Nerve to say, I ain't fighting nobody, I just make him look like nobody. Y'all must have forgotten. So the nineties, you dominate, you take on all commerce. You're sitting pretty and I don't know if people realize this, Roy, your first fifty fights, you didn't get beat. You got the cued. Had you been fifty and old, would you have stopped. I though I wanted to have read tighter and went back down and beat taught it that first time. I would have stopped right there. But it was in my DNA, it was in my inevitability to I had to go fight for the hitty champions of the world. When God take you to go do something, you have to go do it. So even at fifty dollars, after I fought and went to Headway title. I went back and recaptured light head with title. Then because I was undefeated. Yes, I would stop at that point because I was undefeated and a reason I not gonna get my boy the two years risk or maybe three years really because I was undefeated when I got to worry about But when they disqualify you the kid that that ar to stay in the feat and was hurt. What hurt me worse was that I know in the same state. Then they passed us and hit down the Roads Black two times after the beer, and he even hit the referee after the referee trying to stop the probably get between him. He hit the referee and he hit to do and he didn't get He didn't. No, really, both hit Jesse Pergison two times after the beer in that same state, and they turned the lights off after. But he didn't get dis qualified. And you can look at all this same thing. He didn't get this qualified. I tempted you. Whendn't referee just say he stopped. Ref you don't say stopped. I turned again, he looked up there always come to him go out. He laid out like he's out, and they disqualified me. Really, I'd have got Robert gold Miner like I was qualified me two. My life is just you know, I don't know. My life is just good around turmoil like chance. You know, that's just who I am. But you know you have to embrace it and keep it moving. So I embrace it and I keep it moving. But I gotta said, you gotta look at it high goal. I mean, some people get to go fight exhibition and they get to fight a guy. Wait out. I wouldn't probably exhibition against what I gotta fight in ninety nine? You you you you fight. I must go ahead? What happened? Go ahead? What are you gonna say about typon? No, No, I was gonna ask you about the ninety nine fight, the light heavyweight fight against Reggie Johnson, and you're winning that fight and becoming the first guy since uh if I'm not mistaken Michael spaks to unify the light heavyweight. Yeah, that was a big fight for me, and that was a big fighter call. Earlier back in like nineteen nine and one. I think he came about him. My daddy started training him, and my daddy wanted me to s probably Hi one day, so I spot one round with him and I beat him. That one round and I got out. My dad started fussing and customed me to m me get back up, and I said him that spotled no more. He said why, I said, because if he get a belt, I'm taking that. I said, I don't need him to learn how to deal with me, because if he become world champion, I don't care if you win him or not. I'm getting that belt. Michael has become middleweight champion of the world. If he get him midway title before me, I want help. So I'm no, I'm not spoted with him. No spot one round. I'm through with it. I see that I can whip him if he gets the title. I'm coming to get that. Guess what happened. Seven years later he got a title. Guess what happened after that? I come out there. Why are you the one the man to have no belt? Bro? He can have a belt. But what I'm saying is my daddy, who was training with me, want to train him to it. I don't know him like that. I wouldn't raise. Uphill said, I'm not like these new dude. I don't have friends. My friends the one that roll raised up in the jail with me. I don't grow up and they get new friends. No, oh, I don't know you like that. I don't know him. So you bring him to my gym and said, oh you spared which wanted to teach me how to beat me? No, no, no, no, that's not gonna happen. You want to teach me how to beat me? You gonna take him on your own time and teach you how to beat me over there, cause if he get a title, I'm coming to see you at him. So so you didn't, I'm not gonna let you need to teach beat me. So you wouldn't want your trainer training other fighters that could potentially you have to face. Duh, I mean that man ain't gonna make money, Roy, I mean you're gonna pay hold On, hold On, you're gonna pay for you gotta make money. He do that make money, but it won't be against me, Roy. Hold On, So if I'm selling cars, how you gonna get up? Said? If I sell cars to somebody else? When you you when you gotta buy a party cars? You got to buy a fall my time. I ain't training you twenty far out of the roy. Let me make some money. You can make some money. What I'm saying, if you want to make that money, take him over there. You train them over that way from me. Don't fame, don't I'm gonna help you training. Don't think I'm gonna help you set them a car. That's not my job. You're gonna see a car with me. You're gonna give me. I will deal when you said in my car, I'm not gonna help you see him. No gonna cock you. How that go? I get it because that's your dad. You're like, damn holder you you must be at your bady. You gonna trade hill Nah nah, Dad, that ain't cool. Okay, I didn't said listen, let's don't tell. I didn't say that ain't cool. I said you can train it. But you're not gonna immediately help you train him because I got a whooping you getting your ready. You don't know that one day you and him man fall out. Give it. You're gonna be expected or you gotta go beat me if you don't taught him how to give. When I see him, I'm gonna see him on my own terms. So, so is that how you? Is that how you think? If you thinking like? Okay, So if anybody that was in your gym. You really never fought anybody that was in your gym. Well, I let my hand down. Once I take that back, I let lo there bad commence spart me for a few times because I never thought I'd end up fighting him. He end up when I winning a world championship and end up fight me. And he was the first guy to mack me down. But it was the same reason why don't spart with guys down in a fight, because they'll learned how to deal with you. And so he learned from all the spart on how to deal with me, so he was able to knock me down. I got him, just kept beating hut and umber. Still he would knocked me down because of all the roses he's been spoiled me. He learned how he learned if they made him better, he didn't make me better. I made him better because I was better than when we started. So I would knew that about rich Jelson. But Rich Jehson ran to hit of me already, you understand me, something like no, I'm not gonna teach him how to deal with me, and he got to rhead of me. No, the genre ruis fight. What made you so convinced that you could move up from a light heavyweight to a heavyweight and win a title. Well, when God seeing on the mission, I gotta go on a mission, I don't care what there is. So when I had a to me, it was like I had a premonition that I should go fight for the heavyweight champions for the world. I felt like that was God talking to me. So I immediately got the next day call step with me with uh event Horder feeling his Lloyd Jim Thomas, I feel to Nanna and asked him to fight me hard to feel said no, I got too much to gain, too much to lose, and not enough to gain to fight you, So I'm not gonna do it. I said, if you feel like that, all right, I left him, flew back to my training camp. Well him behold. His next fight he lost to Jean Ruis. To this day, I don't know how jeannal Reis knew that I wanted to fight for the world title. But after he won, he said, hey, and guess what I'll fight Roy John's dreaming you're doing? You fight me? Oh, let's go. So so basically, you wanted to fight holly Field. Holly Field lose to Johan Ruiz Jehan Ruis called you out. You had up, so, in other words, you wanted to fight Holly Field. You didn't want to fight John Ruis until he called you out. Now, I wanted to fight to the hit Way Chapman kid who it was at the time I had when I thought about making it happen, holy Field, I had the title, so I want to ask him. He said no, But Jean Reis beat him and he took the type. Then he said, oh yeah, I'll fight Roy John Dreaming. I said yes, old on. So why were you so convinced that you could beat you could be the heavyweight champion once again? In my prime before losing the weight, I was convinced I could be anybody put on the planet like you just add a boy that I think I could have beat Michael my prime. What if they put him in firt of me. It was going down. I don't know how, but it was going down. I had it the way I thought the boxing was. I had enough to take any car on the lot apart are what kind of car, how big, what size engine? You put it in my shop? I'm gonna take the part. And that ring was my shot. So in all the divisions that you fought in, what would you say was the toughest division that you fought in? It's hard to say, because what a way it would have been a lot of opponents there super me. In a way it was a few, but not a part of light heavyweight was toughest, devising from me because I had more opponents, more named opponents in the light herway division. Mike McCallum knew there by Regis John and I became a disputed champ in the light headway division. But the thing about me was was that when I became a champion's heavyweight, you know, I was trying to find every possible title in that weight division that I could get. I got. Only one I didn't get was the day Bill because Davis Mickelchespi was German and he well he ain't Germany, I think something U but he lived in Germany and he wouldn't come from Germany to fight me. If you're offered them five me to come on here and fight me from my title. I had seven belts, he had one, and he wouldn't do it. They taught me, want me to come to German. Now I've got robbed, you know, liquers and soul career in nineteen eighty eight, Why if I'm the man who beat James twenty two, who was the man at the time, to become the man. Now I got seven belts in one division. I had one more out there you got in Germany. I'm gonna take my seven belts and go back overseas knowing what happened to me in the soul career are written and give you an opportunity to last twelve fives with me. They would give you all seven of my belts, and you're one. Now you keep that one number still up hills. Anytime you get me to pay that one over head on Traffick seven. You had to come. You're welcome to come over, but I'm not breaking my seventh. And you gonna have on old school anything to frame my seventh over there to you, and you ain't got one. So if I put, if I put, I'm gonna have a boxing jamboree, and I'm gonna take Roy Jones Junior. I'm gonna take Marvin Hagler, I'm gonna take Tommy Hearns. I'm gonna take Bernard Hopkins. I'm gonna take Jermaine Taylor. I'm gonna take Kelly Pavlick. I'm gonna take uh, Roberto Duran and Julio Saja said sho bed and I'm gonna say, Okay, who's gonna have the belts? One belt? Uh rod a rod that's a gardlet, Roy, that's a gardlet. That's about Hey. He probably gonna fight Marvin to get him all, but he's gonna have but he gonna have malls. So you believe rest of him too slow? Why Why doesn't Marvin Hagler get more credit? Because I, uh it called Marvel was going because I had this converation with with Mayweather. Also shop asked and Duran both were a little too small for me. Marma was one that was close to my size. But also Margaret had an impeccable chin, and Marma stayed the same every day, every minute, every round everything. He always was the same, dependable, reliable Margaret all the way down to his outfit. He go with the same Bregman white outfit every single time. He was always the same Marvin every night. That's why he was a problem. You know what I can't I can't understand why Jermaine Taylor didn't dominate that division longer than he did after what I saw him do to to to Bernard Hopkins and to have Kelly Pavlick basically out on his feet and then could never beat him. How does that? How do How does that work? Roy? A lot of that stuff not only doesn't happen outside the general outside the ring, A lot of that has to do his everyday life. If your everyday life is not one hundred percent the voters to boxing. You can have all the talent in the world, you will not accomplish the thing, or you will not reach the level that you should reach with your ability because I'm built till alone won't get you there because you because you think Jermaine Taylor could have been at all time great too, don't you? Of course, you could have stayed focused on just boxing. You know what I want to I mean, your very first time getting knocked out, what goes through your mind? Tell me? Tell me when when Tarbo took took the title? What was going through your mind? Just you be pissed off because you feel like you let people down. You be more pissed off or letting people down most of the thing itself. You know what I mean? So it's like we really pissed off an upset because you feel like you let people down. You know, it's like it's not that's not characteristic of you. And like I said, I know we out the weight goss. That's never would have happened to me, but you just feel it's very characteristic. But for me at the same time, where I chumped it up as is that when you make big sacrifices to do big things and you gotta have repercussions. You went from junior middleweight all the way upon one a heavyweight title, then you took that twenty five pounsand Moss and just snatched it right off and came back and recapture light heavyweight title. Then you're gonna keep going, No, Son, you gotta stop. At some point, you can't keep going. You gotta let your body regroup. And you didn't do that, and it's like you don't see it till later, and you see it, but you don't want to believe it because you used to be a Superman. But even Superman gotta stop at some point. Crypton Light, make Superman week that twenty five pounds and crypping light and then Tarfa came back up Paul Hopkins at the game that week for that movie, and then he lost weight and can call hoppers and he got me pretty. He didn't get knocked out because knock hockcause Hopper not gonna really knockout punching, but he lost almost every round and he understood then what that way he also does to you. But it's worse for me because I had real live weight lifting muscle on me. You understand me, so it's different. But being knocked out make you want to give up and make you feel bad. But for me, I can never give up because it's not who I happened. So just because I was knocked out, it didn't mean I wasn't coming back. That meant I had to come back. Do you remember? Do you remember the punch that he caught you with? And do you know the mistake that you made? Of course I remember, I know everything about it. Over and battles, you regroup, you take some time off. I hear. I believe it to be true that once you get knocked out, you're most susceptible to being knocked out again. Is that true? That a question without a question, And that's what happened again and again because once you get it, your body knowe it lives, or it's a little easy to make it happen. Now Frost before you won't believe it happened to you. Once it happened to you, Now it's not impossible for it happens to Your mind plays tricks with you because now you mind over guess what it can happen. So it's little easy for it happen, for it to happen again. And if you think about a perfect example is Timer hearn is one of the hardest punching dudes you would never meet, or Sugar Ray because he never got knocked out completely took time of quntion. Now tim and knocked him down, but it never knocked him out. Timer Harness knocked out with bert to ring cold. Don't know abouty knock with Bernd ring out. Tim Me knock him cold, I cold. You hit Ray little with the same right hand over and over and over again. But because Ray didn't believe he can go from it, why didn't go? So it's not about the league you feel it. But with the twenty five pounds muscle, my body failed. You know what I'm saying. I mean, So it's like and lost in the twenty five pounds muscle lost. Your body fail you. So now it's to be easy because now you know your mind that can't happen, because my body tell me one. Until your body tell you, you don't believe it. And like I said, it's like Shela. He took turning right here and better anybody because he didn't bleeve what except happening. But he didn't bleed him to knocked him up. So after the Tarboro fault, the fight, the second fight, do you believe you should have stopped being and said, you know what, this rap I've done everything. I've gotten belts. I had seven belts at one time. I went from junior middleway all the way up to a heavyweight, and I cleaned out every division. I'm good. Did you think about it, say you know what, I'm good, I'm done. I did, But after being knocked out, you just can't Get's like riding a motorcycle and getting knocked out that motorcycle. You gotta get back up and get back on it, or as you'll never ride a motorcycle again. And I don't like sitting her. I being afraid of now, so I had to go back. But that's okay though, Roy, you know that's what they got calls for. Yeah, you ain't gotta get back on the motorcycle, got a car you gotta call off? Yeah, but I had to give it them because that's where I do it some Nor if I ain't to be afraid to go back to the way I've made my name at no way. Are you done competitively fighting? You've done competitive fighting now? Yes, So now you're just gonna sit back and be a country boy, raise your chickens, and that's to laugh at these guys that they ask for me and keep it moving. Have you thought about have you thought about training? Have you thought about becoming a trainer? I already am a trainer for a time. Well, okay, so you know you you're in the same boat like Buddy McGirt. I mean, some of the best, some of the great boxer became trainers. But what I don't know if anybody has ever been as great as you become a trainer. Why is it so hard for boxing? Because great players, that's hard for them become great coaches. Normally it's the it's the fringe players. Yeah, why is it so hard? Times? It's hard? It is hard. For people that are great to understand where their greatness came from or how they got great or what made them great. And it's like some people are so high at a level that they can't accept anything less than great, so they can't teach it because everybody can't be great. It's right with other people are great and don't really even understand what made them great, so they can't teach it because they don't understand. It's just what just to be great. So it's those two things that usually what one or the other that used to stop people from being great trenders if you can't explain what you did, or it's so high your mind that you want to expect that, and everybody can't do that. And that's why people try to say, Roy, everybody can't fight like you. But I don't try to make people fight like me. I learned a lot of stuff. I know. I got a real real thinking cyclop cyclopedia here on boxing right there in my brain. It's really a lot between these two years, and people don't understand that I have a doctor. One tell me Roy. He said those that can do, those that can't teach, And basically what he was saying, the ones that can really do it. They do it, and they do it at a high level. Those that can't do it at that level, they become teachers. They become the trainers, they become the coaches, they become the managers. And it says it's so. And I was talking to Magic Johnson. Magic says, it's hard for great players to become coaches. Is because you want them to do things that became so easy to you. And you're like, man, just do that. But everybody, Magic john And so what you're telling me is that you don't expect anybody else to be Roy Jones Junior. I'm trying to get you to become the best fighter you can become and whatever that is that is. Don't worry about being Roy Jones Junior. Not at all, Not at all. I think about that. Your rap career, you argue, you know, it's hard to say that you're not the greatest, the greatest boxing rapper all times. What would you where would you what would you put your rap skills? I mean you have some, you have some beats. I think the best athlete rapper ball tests all are the best all times you got barbed hold on? What about Dame look too? But he he before me. He ain't sold the register. I sold ye dames good. Dame was really good. He ain't sold the rucors I sold yea. So it's like the one thing to be good. There's nothing to being to make songs that people are here and want to hear again. Shot, A lot of people can rap. I know some guys right now. I know some guys got right that can wrap all day long. But can they make songs that you want to hear over and over and over again? I got my song can't be touched. It's still but hey, what I want to get hyped into jail? Ray? What I want to get hyped? I? So wait about to move if I when you you you cutting that on in the jail right now? Rowing, So wait about to get moved now. Yeah, That's why I say I think I was one of the best because I had a song that was able to outlive this time. That song still hot in any kind of workout or a pre fight or pre game right now to day you put on people ready to go again. Must have forgot, y'all, must have forgot. People still say that what about your acting career? You want to you want to you want to get more involved in that. Are you good now? I'm good act I did enough of it. They have changed the rules and stuff so much now that I think it's better. I still have to wear of it. But I did enjoy it when I did it. Roy, I appreciate it, Bro. Congratulations on your career. I followed your career. Uh, talk to Brooks. I talked to Brooks all the time, and you always talk about you know, talked about you. Talk to em and our good friends. We came into the league together. So congratulations on your career, well deserved. Bro. Enjoy enjoy, enjoy this time all. Thank you. And I also watched your career and I enjoyed your career as well. So thank you, my brother, God bless you say, strong kid, doing what you're doing. Love what you're doing too. Now, thank you, Bro. I appreciate it. Bro. Now we'll go with all my life, grinding all my life, sack fights, price one slice, got the brother all my life. I've been grinding all my life, Yuh, all my life, been running all my life, sacrifice, hustle, bade the prices, want a slice, got the broiler, dice to swap All my life, I've been running all my life,