On episode 34, Shannon welcomes in former NFL great: Adam “Pacman” Jones.
Calling in from his J24 athletic complex in Amelia, Ohio, Pacman talks about his transition from legendary NFL cornerback to competitive boxer. He discusses his thought process and training regimen heading into his fight against Bobby Laing, which took place on August 27, 2021.
Pacman also shares stories about his family history and upbringing in Atlanta, where he attended Westlake High School & won two state championships in basketball. He talks through his football career: playing with Steve McNair on the Titans, his suspension & release from Dallas, playing for Marvin Lewis in Cincinnati, and much more.
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Most of the games that bun Tess got in trouble on was what what game? Tell me? What what team? We was playing? Steelers and then the thirtiest team in the league. Come on, man, all my life, running all my life, sacrifice, hustle back pricing, one slice got the brown the dice, swatting all my life. I've been running in all my life, all my life, and running all my life, sacrifice, hustle, back prices, one slice got the dice, swatting all my life. I've been running in all my life. Hello, welcome to another edition of Club Shasha. I am your whole Shandon Sharp. I'm also the proprietor Club Sha Shay. And the guy that's stopping by today for a drink in conversation is a former NFL great. He's a pro bowler, first Team All Pro. You know him as pac Man, Mister Adam Jones. You want to be called Adam or do you prefer to be called pac Man? I'm Adam when I signed my checks. All my friends, oh my gosh, they all call me pack or pack Man. All right, so where are you and give us a little and tell us about what you got going on. I'm here in my facility at twelve fifty eight West Ohio Pike. Here in a million Ohio, I have six thousand square feet of indoor turf. Everything in here is state of the arts, no weights and in the Pack Pack Club. I don't like the Shade Shade Club, but we got everything. We got a nice little lounge in the back back here. Also got a couple of kids, and we just got through Trenty. I wanna say, what's up to the legend Mann? Shit? What is what's up? Guys? I watched this knock Show Like almost everyone, I'm I'm I'm pretty much the only indoor that's around in this area. So it's it's it's a great, great silly to giving a lot back to the kids over here. So I'm just trying to leave much stain over here. Pack. Are you training guys for football or you training guys for fighting? O? Both? I'm training guys for us. Uh nope, Well we have boxing here, but I'm not training for boxing here. I'm I'm training for anything athletics US skill and agility to baseball, football, track, soccer, swim, pretty much anything that you can name when it comes to any kind of sports. We have have itre. We know you're very athletic. You're you're an NFL cornerback. You have to be athletic because you basically are required to a back paddle as fast as most guys are running forward. And you did that at an elite level. What made you want the transition to get into the boxing side of it. I know it sounds crazy, but I had told him I watched this pro two thousand seventeen that I was gonna take of boxing after football. She's like, oh no, We're definitely not gonna go through that after football. I'm like, it's just something I want to do. She's like, you think we're gonna be able to sit there and watch you fight after We just don't went through fourteen fifteen years. I'm seeing you put your body on the line. And we just came to a mutual agreement. And I pretty much had her come to a couple of spam matches so she can see that I was pretty serious about it, and we made a decision to do to the celebrity boxing thing. Wise at all time high right now and pretty much everybody who know me know that I'm a very physical person when I need to be, and I don't mind get hit so and I'm really good though. Man, I've done I've been doing this training for probably about six months now, and I'm I think I'm pretty good. Will we'll see August twenty seven. You think you've been doing that for You've been taking up boxing, taking it serious for the last six months. The celebrity boxing genre is at an all time high. You're fighting a guy in West Virginia on Friday, Bobby Leange, five and old, three one minute rounds, no head gear. I know, it's a whole different ball game. You visualize something like, yeah, I can do this, and now, Pat, you're gonna actually get in the ring against someone that's actually trying to do damage to you like you're trying to do them. Yeah, that's no problem. This this part of the world that I grew up in. It's it's been like that my whole life. So at least we got rules and regulations. It's only for a minute. They're not jumping you for ten minutes. So I'm all up for it. And you know me, if I said I'm gonna do it, I'm gonna give it everything I got. But I'm eager to get in there and test the things that I've been working on, and it's just the beginning. You know, I'm gonna win this fight, period, point blank. But I'm getting them out of there here, bull man, you know, and almost I'm a boy, but I'm a smart boy. He only know one way, which is to come forward, and he leaving a lot of stuff over. So we'll just see how I go on August twenty seven. But all this talking and and all that about how tough he is, man, everybody is tough where I'm from. It's not nobody. I don't know too many kids that grew up in bank Head and both Rod that's not tough. And you might have one to two out of the projects. But even if they couldn't fight shit, they was tough. So everybody took the question is can he take this one? I'm gonna give him on August twenty seven. So you you're gonna walk in, you gonna since he coming straight ahead, you're hoping to walk him into something. Oh yeah, I'm gonna walk him into something. See See, they think I'm just going in here without a uh tactics or a strategy. That's the word I'm looking for. I'm a cornerback. So of course I'm watching film. I'm not gonna sit in front of a board the whole time and letting it and yeah, that's not gonna happen. But I'm gonna pick and choose my my spots. I got really good feat. It's gonna be real interesting. You say, you obviously a cornerback. You have to study your opponent. So I'm sure that you've sat down, you watched him fight, Watch how he likes to fight. You say, he's a guy who likes the bull, likes to come straight ahead, So obviously you've been trained. I'm just I'm interested in pack. What made you decide to say? You know what, I would have tried this boxing thing. I think it could be good at it. I've been doing it on the off season since two thousand and fourteen. Okay, as far as hidden mixed and you know what I mean, I probably only sparred once or twice. But I actually had a Mick guy start training all of the dbs in Cincinnati because it's all hot hand eye coordination when you're flying first boom boom, stuff like that. So we would do this every Tuesday. I did this for probably the last ten years of my career, you know, besides on the off season too, but this was this was my way of keeping my hands and eyes quick, you know what I mean. When I'm when I'm working on my press drives or swiping the ball like little things that people don't realize that it go a long way with football also. But here's the thing. Pack the difference in between corner and boxing is that corner you always try to stay straight, and in boxing you only try to get a man of half. You don't want to have a big target, so you want to try to be at an angle. So how do you how do you transform that? Go from like I need to be straight so I can get du deff as opposed to being here so I can do this that. So now I'm just building, you know, you know how you press, you know what I mean. So instead of outside press built, I'm inside presson building, you know what i mean. Shooting a hand, I'm getting out of that the same way. It's a lot of footwork. That's that's pretty similar. That's got me a lot comfortable, a lot quicker than than most people. I'm always using this up here more than people think I would have made it in years without being a little bit smart, because you know, the athletic only gets you so far that all the ups and downs, I had I command myself with taking the time and breaking down all of the details to be prepared on Sunday, which led me to playing on me. You know, no way all to play as long as I played with all the I went through without being not just a class A athlete, but a class A student also in the in the room, you know pack. The thing is that I tell people when they try to branch over and play another sport. Be at a football player tried to play basketball, basketball player tried to play football. Regardless of the sport, you gotta respect the sport. And if you remember n Nate Robinson got in there, I don't think he was expected the sport. I think he started was like a street fight. You just going there and you got a bull, but you gotta be calm because if you run in, you're gonna run in the punch like he ran into. Yeah, I don't, I don't. I don't know too much about Nate Robinson, but from what I've seen, I don't know if he did any training right. If you ever been into a fight, I don't know if you ever had put on gloves before then, but it showed him. Look like you know what I'm saying. But I'm not Robson. I can promise you that I'm not near as the caliber of a person attitude skills wise, mentality wise, and hand wise. So regardless of what go on, I'm not Nate Robson, it ain't gonna be that type of show. How promise you there. But even if he had never been, even if he had never put the myths on the first thing that you taught it, anybody to keep your hands up, how you gonna run it there with? How you gonna run that hands down? Cheering out what you're telling? That hit me right here, right, and that's our whole thing. But like I said, I don't think they've been into many fights, and I don't I don't think he knew what he was signing up for it. You know I know what I'm signing up for, right. I watched damn there every show that they've had. I'm very into it and I'm ready. You know, if I if I tell you I'm ready, I'm ready, and I promise you that I'm ready come Friday night. I'm gonna let the lights click on and I'm gonna take my time and I'm gonna break his head all the way down. You said you like you like this, You've been thinking about boxing, and you talk to your wifing and letting you do this, and back in twenty seventeen, is this a one time bench or is this something like you like to move forward and take on more celebrities, maybe a Jake Paul, maybe you, You and your former teammate you and Ojo uh Win lose a draw. I'm this is gonna be my last one because this is something that I say. If I you know me, I'm from the West side of the Linda. I like, really enjoyed doing this man like. And I'm not just saying that I'm not hurting for no money. I'm cool, like, but this is something the same thing I said with the rest before I did the wrestling. They wanted nobody doing wrestling, right I said, it said trance for wresting, then everybody wanted to wrestle. So actually I had the car I was. I was the car to fight chat right on the Mayweather car. You get what I'm saying. And it's only so much I could say, because I signed a non disclosure for me not to talk about that. But Chad, my boy, he made a good decision with who he taking. I'm happy he did too, because I wasn't ready at that time when I when I was saying I was gonna take that fight, I was gonna take the fight just because of I believe that myself. I had been in the gym for three to four months, and who else get a chance to flight on floor Mayweather car It was the once in a lifetime chance, and I thought that would have be, you know, a stepping stone or something that I could put in the book. But I'm happy that it didn't work out because I'm like, like day from there to today. Obviously you're boxing a big boxing fan. Who are some of the guys that you like? Obviously you Mayweather Tyson, But who are some of the other fighters that you watched that you like? Saying? You know what I like the way moving the ring right now? Are you saying just oh you like if you like guys right now? Like I like? I liked Vante Davis. Okay, he reminds me of a kid from the inn of city, like the same place I came from. Right, he's always against the art. I've been to a couple of training camps. He works hard too. You know, he's not one of those guys that just wait for the last twenty days or training camp to get here and then go and bust his ass. I've gotten a chance to see him really, like, tune in and watch him for sixty seventy days to get ready because my boy in Texas. Man, that's probably my favorite right now, Earl Spence. Right, I'm a big Earl Spence fan. He's a humble kid. He works hard, and he's the he's the real deal, man. If you just watch him and see how he breaks down opponents and he takes his time. He's never rushed rushing into things. And that's my guy right now. Earl Spence is my Mike Tyson of this time between him and the young boy. But I'm more of an Earl Spence guy. So, which is harder training for a boxing match or training for an NFL training camp? The sixth the sixty days and it's boxing training way harder than well, I don't know you're saying, it's the whole training camp. Yeah, oh, I mean just getting I mean getting ready to getting ready for training camp because you know you we can't your shot at camp. Well it's different, it's different shape like self. For instance, you know we used to run in sprints hundreds and yeah, forty suicides. Well now you running, you wake up your first thing stretch and you run seven miles, you know what I mean? And that's just the warm up of the day. Right, And we was doing when we was in training camp. We was doing three four hundred and sit ups today, which is not much compared to what we did in football. But football is more. We live more weights, I would say, we do more weights and our things. It's it's more short short short yards. Yeah, can you only working in football? You do five sets, you do five basically three five seconds. The plays over, you go back to the hoddle. They go back to the hoddle, get the defense, I get the offensic call, we come back to the line of scrimmage. But in this it's continuous. It's continuous, like we do this thing called PlayStation. Right. Okay, so you you said it's four treadmills and four bags, so you never stopped though everything is two minutes. So this runs one treadmill you run at ten miles part our for two minutes. You get off that one, you go straight into backpeling jab why the why the trap mell is like two point nine you get off that walking up hill at four point out, you get off that. On his body shots, you get off that on this one, two you get off the next one. It's combo. So we do that for forty minutes, like literally non stop, like rest is walking to the next exercide. So I got this boxing in shape is it's way different. I have so much respect for the guys that go through this and put their body through all this work and have to cut weight and this hard. Man. This is not for everybody, and I'll tell you that. And when I first started doing this, I was like if I signed myself up to and I was I was eager to just push myself to get over that part, you know, like because I don't, I don't, I don't, I don't. I can't even tell you time in football way I jawed three miles. We've done as we can go all out and it's different, man, But it's it's a lot different, I'll tell you that. And I got a lot of respect for these guys. That's doing this boxing thing. And that's that's doing it the right way. You know. Some of the guys that be coming in twenty days before the fight don't have to cut weight, you know, and don't perform like the way. And you could tell like the guys who put in work, that's why they perform like that Manu Pack, y'all lost. But at forty years old, you can do that because he get up every morning, he runs ten twelve miles doing a thousand sit ups, you know what I mean, doing fifteen thirty rounds a day. So it's a different shape. Not saying that I have no uh love lost for all of us. That's all my brothers, that's in the brotherhood with us. But that boxing ships it's a different shape. But I will say that, yeah, because and you're doing all that, you gotta keep your hands up because normally when you get your hands come down that y'all get lacked. In five more minutes, mommy, let me ask you this back night, let me ask you this, haven't played as long as you played in the NFL blind getting blindsided, getting run over by say Derek Henry or Eddie George, or taking or taking a shot you didn't see, which hurts more. I would take a shot that I don't see as long as I don't get hit by James Harrison the way I got hit by him. What is the name of that statement? This b h man mother, Jane Harrison almost broke my whole body. Oh my god. So as long as James Harrison not hitting me, I'll take Boby Lane hitting me not seeing me or whoever else? What James Ketch you on a part return? Yeah, I muffed it too. I had C three c FO Nick Surgeon that Nick two weeks. Oh my, you know I was young. Then I went back in the game. Man, I'll never forget this. I went back in the game and dropped the pig like two plays later from Big ben In and my boy Karen Fox. He went to high school with me and west Lake. He's like, pack, we gonna kill your ass out here. I was like the next player. I caught a plan. I think I had like sixty five yards. I'm running down the sideline. I'm like, well, I'm ready to die. I'm ready to die. The next the next week, I'm out for the rest of the year. I was out for the rest of the year after that, after I had the Mr end Up went back and played a decent game. We end up losing by the three. End up finishing the game and figure out I needed a nixt surcu so. But yeah, I rather get hit by somebody in the face then getting blind side by James Harris Pack. Let's let's go back to where it started from. You grew up, as you mentioned, bank Head, West side of Atlanta. How did that impact the man, the guy that we saw play those twelve fourteen years in the National Football League. How did your upbring and shape who you are today? Man? My grandma should have a award. You know. I stayed with my grandma. She raised be my cousin Lewis and James, and she taught us morals in respect. You know. She got us out of the projects, made us go and play up the street at a park as Santown, which I used to should tell Grandma, you know, if you take me up the street, I gotta come back and play against the boys in the projects. And I don't think she really understand understood, I mean understand me at the time, but I understood what she was trying to do. Like, look, bro, it's something bigger than what we're in right now. Just because we are over here don't mean that we gotta be in here every day. So I would give. I would say my grandma and my granddaddy. I would get him all the credit because they taught me like never give up. You know. I couldn't even man, I couldn't read. I was in the fourth grade. I finally learning hooked on fundness, make ten fifty on sat you know what I mean. She always told me, she's like, you got everything. You know, when you learn the little things, you're gonna be real special. So I give all the praises, you know. And and the environment that I grew up in. We grew up in a tough environment, and we pushed each other, you know. It was it was a lot of pushing each other, looking up to the all the guys trying to figure out this and that, you know what I mean, and why to do this and why don't do that? But I would say, it takes a village to raise a child. So I would I would give everybody from from from from Kempington Road to Marlin Luther King to Hollowell to west Lake, the Creek, uh Camp Creek to Woodland Middle School, to entry. You know, Kcade. It was a lot of pieces of the part that you know what I mean, that got me where I'm at today. You know, it was in the city. It was fast like, but it's good that we were still here. We're able to talk about it. We're able to teach our kids something different. You know, I love it. You know, my kids of customer babies, and I'd be telling them every day. You wanted me to drop you off down there for about two to three days. Now, now, pack you talked about your grandmother and how she did a great job of raising you and your cousins. But they're a situation that you saw something traumatic happening with your own father and your mother's situation. Well, my dad got killed in front of me when I was eight. My mom went to jail like two years after that. For like four years, it was rough, bro Like from third grade, was second grade, third grade, fourth grade, probably a way up to fifth I would fight every day, just mentally because I was so hurt in the instside. And during that time, you know, we ain't have no damn counselors and we don't have all the resource yet. You know what I'm saying, expert that you could go to and talk to. And since this is what's going on, I ain't have nobody I can talk to you about. Hey, by Polo, do you know if you're buy polo? What's bipolar? Hey? You look like you mad at head? Hey? What's going on here? So now you know I have the resources to not only financially, but you know, when you when you get all these you figure out a couple of things. You figure it out about your your bloodline, you figure out about your other parents and stuff, and you learned a lot more about your history. So it took me a little while. And now that I'm thirty seven years old, I don't have no shame on my game. I'm open about my story because I want my kids to know I am by polar. I haven't. I didn't find out. I find out until two thousand, sixteen seventeen. And when I found out why, I actually found out twenty and fifteen. And I was kind of late in my career and I ain't want to take the medicine because I ain't wanted to me right on the field wise, right, you get what I'm saying. So I battle with what do I take the medicine, do or not take the medicine or taking on the off season. And I'm finally at the place now where you know what I mean, I'm in a content place and I'm doing pretty good. But Pack, you know, in our community talking about mental illness and taking medicine, that's a sign of weakness. That ain't nothing wrong. We ain't nothing wrong with you. And if I knew what I knew now, I probably couldn't say so many people in my hood because I know I know him a little off the wall, but I haven't seen some jobles that off the wall that was so talented. Man he was he was he was grabbing quarters off the back board. How did this dude not make it right right? And that that we we've all seen that Pack Like, I wasn't the most talented guy, but I was the guy that had the most level head. I had a great I had a grandmother that pointed me in the right direction to say, well, you're going this school, you gonna do this and do that. With some of the other guys that they didn't want to go to school, they're like, Okay, you ain't got to go to school. If they had just had someone in their corner like I had in my corner. There's no question in my mind because they had the physical abilities right. And that's why I get my grandma all the credit. She set me in the house and you know how it is in project all you wanna do is go out and play football and basketball. Yep, my my my six or seventh Verde year, I can't think which one. It was. Sixth grade year. I sat in the house and get hooked on funnies for the whole year. I always been good with numbers and everything, Catholic divide and everything, and she made me. I missed the whole a u H season and you know we was pretty good, like I got my full five national championships. I was like, I better learn how to read book. At this sitting in the house with grandma. Not the move you up? You say you fought every day. What was it about that made you? Something with it? Something that they said because I would get up sat You know, look, I didn't have any money and I was wearing hand me downs my brothers three years older. So when he out grew something that was gonna mean they was gonna be the perfect size for me. And sometimes the knee my grandmother was so patches over the knee because they don't head him, been on his knees and wore a hole in them. And I got holy, so I've gotten hand me down. So somebody to make fun of me? You know, a bro? Why are you making fun? So I'm gonna want to fight? What was it? Was it something they said? Was it something they did? Or was it just you was an angry kid because of the trauma that you had experienced at a younger age, well younger, I would say, when I was younger, it was it was It was a mixture of both, you know what I mean, with the trauma and the anger issues. And you know what I mean, and plus where I was at, like you follow every day in boat rocket banking. If you if you try to kill each other, but if you lose the basketball game, you're ready to fight. You know what I mean? Hard file, You get hard file. You gotta fight. Oh yeah, you found me two times if we played touch for about utasky, I got to get you. Oh yeah yeah. And that's just how we grew up man. And and I did did have anger issues, shit still do sometimes today. If I ain't going back and checking checking all the stuff, you know what I mean. That's why I try to visit the past, but don't stay in the past. But yeah, I mean, of course I've had that. I've been through a lot, you know, But the environment I grew up and everybody like we went to other projects to fight other kids. We we I like the college they got now we had them back in two thousand, I mean, nineteen ninety five. How has kids change? Adam Jones? Because I think the thing is that we become different people once we have kids, because not only are we trying to I tell people what I try to do. I try. Yeah, I want to make sure I give my kids from a financial thing, but I also want to give them knowledge that my grandparents and my mom didn't didn't know that I can give them, not just give them tangible things, but give them knowledge. Because if I buy them a car, if I buy them clothes or something, that's gonna as soon they're gonna think, you know, they're gonna get tired of that. But if I partake this knowledge, knowledge that my grandmother and grandfather, my my you know, my mom, they couldn't give me. But if I could give them that, you know, my whole thing, man, my kids. You gotta realized my my youngest May, my second daughter, was born at twenty two weeks right, Okay, we call the priests like two times. But she really changed my whole autge. When you see them in there and you can't do nothing to help them, that that's that will change how you think, how you treat people. Everything. But my point is, you know, I've been through so much. My kids old enough that well they can read everything now and they always say that nothing like that. Like I probably if yelling in the house, it's gotta be an issue. Like I can be yelling in the house. You get what I'm saying. So I just try to love them, man, and show them some of the things that we ain't have, you know, as far as caring and besides Grandma, you know, it was it was it was everything was hard. I mean, you know, my mom loved me to death, but my mom was in she was dibbling in, dabbling and doing what she was doing. But my mom always showed me love and care for me. But my whole thing with my kids is, hey, look, I want y'all to enjoy everything, all these fruits of the label. But at the end of the day. I don't want to see none of y'all go through it. I've been through and I want y'all I want, I want. I want y'all to be able to go to the stand first, you know what I mean. It ain't all about just sports, which I can't say that because all my kids are talented. But I'm big on school and I'm big on praying. Like it's nothing that we don't do in our house and pray. And I don't know if you know, but I adopted Chris Henry kids too, so they up here with me. Bubbling man. Man, they are freaks of nature when they come to sports and everything. But it's just it's a love thing over here in our household. No, I didn't know. We love each other hard. We cry together, we pray together, you know what I mean. We do everything together over there. What what led you to do that? Pack? Everybody know me and Chris was best friends in college. I'm still close with this whole entire family. I'm still close with Lane, which is which is the boys mom. We're we're inseparable, and we was just talking. I was like, Lane, you gotta I gotta get get the boys, So I can take what we've done so far and like maximize it, you know what I mean. So we sat down, we've been we've been working on this for uh three four years, and we finally got it done a couple like six seven months ago. And it's just for me. It's it's heart warming because I know my man up there just sitting up there smiling like, Man, I really appreciate you. But the people that don't know you're talking about your phone get too tilled up about some much stuff. But like I don't know, like that was my man, Like you get what I'm saying. Like, man, Slim was like like this, We was the real poster boys when they first started talking about post the Boys, so talking about not only was he a teammate of yours in Cincinnati, he was a teammate of yours, Chris can't read the wide receiver, a teammate of yours at West Virginia that's where you first met. Yeah, you guys were so close. You adopted it. I think he has two boys, right, yeah, yeah, and you adopted them briefently. Man. That's that's big pack, that's huge. Yeah. Yeah, So that's what we're doing, man, they unbelievable athletes and we all family of it. So in my house, I got five keys seeks tick well my sets my oldest one in Atlanta it was Lake, right. I got thirteen twelve, that's bubbing man man. Then I got Trent, who just turned eleven, and I got a little junior who three you about to go on bow? You mentioned west Lake, You went to west Lake. Most people also know Cam Newton went to west Lake. And what people don't know is that you won two state championships in west Lake. But you're known as a football player. So with sport did you love more when you were in high school? Football of basketball? So let me tell you this story. I had. I had pretty much every school that offered me in football, but sih Alabama, I mean not Alabama, LSU, Auburn, and Clemson. It was probably the three schools that didn't offer okay, and I had like Georgia Tech, West Virginia, NC State, LSU in basketball. Right. So I told my coach, I was like, look, man, think about signed this basketball scholarship at Georgia Tech. He looked at me, he said, hey, food, you five nine, it's only one. This is only one Ablan Arson, you got all these officers, you're gonna take a chance to go play basketball. You shot my whole dreams down. So I was like, man, you know what. So I end up going to West Virginia because I was supposed to play both sports, and then the coaching staff changed and they wanted me to cut my hair. At that time, I wouldn't come my hair. So I end up playing football and it all worked out for the best. Drafted number six over all to the Tennessee Titans. They put certain clauses in your contract because you had a couple of incident incidents at West Virginia. They put these clauses in your contract. You were upset about that. So it seems like going in you and the Tennessee Titans had a kind of a tense relationship, a continual relationship from the jump. But really you know what, you know, well, I'm older now and I look back, it wasn't really no tension relationship. And I want to say my condoleans go out too. Floyd Reese family. I know he just passed away. He changed my life, you know. Him and Gary Shark as far as back then, which was my agent back then. Gary Shark Floyd changed my life. He's been nothing but good to me. At that time, bro, I was just moving too fast. I didn't understand that I can do what I wanted to do, but I couldn't do with my ass out of the street. So you know, you living, you learn, and you take the punches, and it builds you up, you know, and to tie you down. But it can't do that but help you, you know. So I learned from that situation. But I love I loved everybody in Tennessee. It's not one person in that in that office or in the stadium that can say they had a problem with me, like I've never had a problem with the upstairs. Yeah I was. I was doing too much at the time. They had to protect their investment. Hey brother, you don't want to do we gotta tell you. We gotta ship you on up out there. And if you want to get shipped up out of here the other two million dollars that we owe you, we gotta sign it up. If not, we're gonna keep you right here. So you know, you're living, You learn, and and things happen. But I have no no ill feeling. I think Bud Adams and the old Adams family. It was great to me. Now you were in the two thousand five draft class, Aaron Rodgers still playing, Frank Gore, Ryan Fitzpatrick, Richard Incognito. I was a Frank killing the team. But Ryan Fitzpatrick and Richard Incognito, Aaron Rodgers, I was still playing. Do you think you're like, you know what if I had been taken better care of myself on the front end, done things the right way on the front end, No, then what I know now? Do you think you could have still been playing? Well? I was the last I was the last defensive player playing in my in my draft plass. I got to pack myself on the back pretty good. It was. It was a lot of us out there right now. The quarterbacks. I don't know if I could have outplayed the quarterback. They get all the protection. You can't hit them hard, you can't. They don't get hit. They don't tell nothing, you know what I mean. So it's kind of hard to out play the quarterback. But far as everybody else, I'll play they ass except Frank Gordon. That's my number. Respect to Frank Bor that's like one of my close friends. He worked hard. He take care of everybody, you know what I mean. He he had a great career, but far as the rest of him go down the least I'll played all of them and lasted long, longer than U. All the dvs. I don't even know it was if it was a DD in my last four or five years, your rookie year, you got an opportunity to play with Steve McNair I know, I know, Matt, what what type of what type of person? What type of player? With Steve McNair man. Steve was everything man, He'll get you the shirt off his back, you know what I mean. Don't even know if I compare nobody Steve Man like that was my dude. I actually was with him two weeks before he passed away when he was out shooting Joe's versus Provos, right, yep, yep. But he was unbelievable man like Steve was Steve Man. He was up up, up, up tempo, guy, cool, chilled down to itself, cracked jokes. He loved everybody. Man Steve, Steve, Steve was one of a kind. In two thousand and seven, you were suspending for the entire season. They took all your money. You don't get no money. When you get suspending, you don't get no money. Do you take him? Do you believe did the commissioner Goodell? Did he handle that properly? Uh? Is there's something that that you knew that they didn't know that could have maybe steal from it, maybe not get up entire you or maybe get six games? What what trade? I got the entire I got the entire year just because of who I was. And the night before I went and met him, he has somebody following me and I went to the Script Club in New York. Pack came on, Pat, you know that I'm being honest. I'm being honest. That's why I got suspitted. They ain't tell him the people that people don't know that. I don't really think that it was about what had happened. The point was, I think he was like, damn, you ain't realizing what the matter is at hand. Right here, right now, I'm going, I'm you're coming to me, commissioner, and you take over here talking about you going to eat some wings at the Script Club. You know, at at twenty years old, twenty one, I wouldn't have never thought that was a problem. I'm from Elm the Script Club to eat wings. People don't believe it. Yes, really, magic fit got the wing. They five? They five for real though, Man Cheetah got a steak that's better than any steakhouse I've ever been to. What he to put it out like that? What man cheata? Oh my god. So but at the time, you know what I mean, I ain't gonna say I was being rebellion because I wasn't being rebellion. It was more of young and dumb being a product of the environment, you know what I mean. I ain't I didn't have nobody that be like, hey, pack, don't do that shit. You're going to meet the commission, you know what I mean? And at that time I probably wouldn't want to listen. Nobody can want Nobody helped me out before that. That was my whole point, Like what is it when I was broke time I got all this money? Is hey, what youren't supposed to do this? Hey, why you don't supposed to do that? And I've been suffering twenty one years, right, I ain't got a pair of shoes to go to school, cards and good luck came all the way home from college when my grandma passed away. Didn't even want to go back to school. If you wanted for coach coming to get me, I'd probably still be in Atlanta right now. I ain't even have a family member, a friend or that A man. Get your ass up. Man, you're way too You're way too good to be trying to sit here at home right So it was it was more of a learning point for me, Shay, and I really think God do things for a reason, and that was that. That was my story. You know, He did that for a reason for me to learn and be an example for some of these other kids. And pump your brakes, man, pump your brakes sometimes and trying to see what the bigger picture is. You know, you leave Tennessee, you go to Dallas. Deon is your mentor because he's in Dallas. He's been with the Cowboys. He knows what it's like to be a Cowboy player. In Dallas, it's a whole different ball game. Everybody, all NFL teams can't say what it's like. It's nothing. It's nothing like Dallas, no period, nothing. So why what happened in Dallas? Because it seemed like it was going well and then all of a sudden you got released. It was it was going great, and I went out one night and Jerry had me on these the securities guard guards with me, and you know how we we, you know how we play in the locker room. So I go to the bathroom. This honest guard's true story. I go to the bathroom my security guard, he repeating. So I pushed him, like on his butt, like little lap type. He pissed all of his ship. He gets get like, it's so mad. I had a nervous one from me come on my security. So that was a whole other situation and I whooped it. Jerry was like, God, damn, how are you gonna beat up the security that I got you. I'm like, bro, I was just playing with him. He got mad because I pushed him and he pissed on him self and I wasn't really trying to do and he just swung So hold on, So I see that was not the story. No, yeah, yeah, for real, this is for real, Nusha. You're getting the wrong. Oh. I know, I know you're telling me the truth. But you know, the story that they had out is that the security guard tried to wake you up from from a hangover and y'all fail. No, So the real real, wake me up, no one hang over. So the real is you were joking around. He peered on his peed on his head and got upset at you, and you beat up the security guards. Yeah, well you need to new security guards called the undertake the un the truth. First of all, anybody that can can beat up their security, they need new security because the guy to be the guy to being protected shouldn't be able to beat up security guard pact man. That's first and foremostat Jesus Christ. Okay, you get released from Dallas and you go to Cincinnati, right, yep, Cincinnati seems like a perfect place for you. You're former teammates there, Ocho Sinko, Marvin. I love Marvin marviaret with me in Denver. I love Marvin Lewis. There's nothing not to like about Marvin. Marvin just wants you to go Martina, take look, do the right thing. I want you to play hard. Cincinnati's a really tough place to play because Mike brown is cheap. Mike Browne gonna spend no money. You practice it right on the overpath people park watch you practice partner cart right down there in the state. Watch you practice so you know I high school it is like high school. It seemed to me that you enjoyed playing in Cincinnati more than than you enjoy playing in any other place. I did, I would. I'm not I ain't gonna say that, because I enjoyed playing in Tennessee too, But I enjoyed playing for Coach Lewis. Yeah. He slowed everything down for me and really like, look back, this is your last chance, bro, if you got to come stay with me. I wanted this to work for you. And he was probably one of the only coaches besides Coach Fisher that I had at that point that I really knew, like he meant what he was saying, and he really cared about and I just tried to do whatever I can do and take it and run with it, you know. And it started off kind of shaky with the injuries and picked that thing up, man, and start playing some of the best football that I ever played. Part. You gotta say it once they said that you would pick your friends over the NFL. You still feel that fame? Who the hell said that? You said that? Yeah? How old was I? When I said, I'm pretty sure you in your twitties? Man? Them they all gone, Now what I happened, now anybody else, she got quiet and I got him Yo. But but you know, but Pack real talk. You know, look, there are people that you come up with that you feel have your best interests, But when you look back on it, they had their best interest in mind, and their best interest was with you. And they didn't tell you what you needed to know. They told you what you wanted to hear. Because that they tell you the truth, Pack, you will stop the bus and make the ass get off. So I gotta tell Pack everything that he wanted to hear it. Yeah, Pack, you right, Pack, Let's go on over there. Man forget in the NFL woa, whoa whoa whoa brou And now that you look back on it, you much older. You're like, Man, I had to I let them joke lead me down the path that I should have never been on. I might have had two of my boys to come to a brouh. You just you need a chail bro you need leaving annabroh. Maybe two. But at the end of the day, I don't blame nobody because all of the decision came from me making him. I've always been an Alfa maker. I've always said, what's gonna happen. I've always led, led by example. I've always been the leader of whatever I've been in, you know what I mean, or whoever I've been around, because I've always led and lead by example. So if if I had to blame anybody, I would just look in the mirror and blame myself, like I did, you know what I mean, And all the outside I know it sound cool, but in this world, that can make me do something that I don't want to do. Right. So, like I said, my story it ain't like everybody a story, you know what I mean. God did my story different? Because really I supposed to be probably dead or in jail, right, but he said, me through these things and build me up and knock me down and build me back up so I can help some of these kids out, and help my own kids out, help my nieces and nephews, you know what I mean, the little hims. Because at the end of the day, like he took it all the way but and built it right back up for me. Like how I can't be no more, no more thankful than that, Like all right, you can't do them, but listen, at this point, right now, we're gonna have you're gonna have a heac up, whatever stuff gonna happen. But at the end of the day, I don't, I don't hang with don't. I'm normally either me or two more other dudes, or however I am. But like I'm cautious away I go. I try to eliminate certain situations, you know what I mean. So at this point, man, I'm trying to be a model for my boys. Man, it's way bigger than it's way bigger than me, you know what I mean. I don't have my fun to do whatever I wanted to do for the last twenty well on thirty one years, right, you know what I mean. Now it's tying to be a parent and enjoy, enjoy, enjoy something, you know what I mean. Pat, let me ask you a question. How was it on the same defense you and Volunteer's birth. I loved it. I loved it. Man. You know that man was doing some dirty play. During dirty play, pack man, all this dirty man, I cannot let you see him. Look come on, but some of it with nine percent of it, hold on ninety percent of the outside. Not if you go back and look at the place. Yeah, he has some dirty place. I ain't saying he didn't have no dirty place, but like, come on, man, come on, like some of it though, but Pat, you know at the beginning, at the beginning, at the beginning, I will admit okay, because I said, look, just the thirty seven year old Pack. Tell let me tell you what I thought. I said, look, man, eight games, I know how much money you can pay. They not getting you this money back to you. Gotta figure out it. He like, Man, I can't do it. I like, bro, you gotta figure out of the way. And I will say, bro, he tried, Bro, he tried. I don't care what nobody to say. He tried. He tried. Like the end of hit Bright came on, like the end of hit was you've seen the end of here. I think that was the last one. Yeah, was that a bad hit? It was? It says, no, no, no, I'm just saying it. Once you get you Pack, you know how it is. Once you're getting that reputation, Once you're getting that reputation, your reputation procede you. So it doesn't matter that he went to another team. Everybody still remember what he was doing when he was in sensity in Sensey, So it didn't matter. But he was good enough player pack the games. Most of the games that Bunted got in trouble on was what what game? Tell me what what team? We was playing? Steelers? And then is the thirtiest team in the league? Come on? Man? Pouncey was the other sinner name in Tartnito. No you But see here is the thing. But here's the thing. They hit on Ab. You don't think they hit on Ab with dirty man. That man Ab winked at us many crazy and then my boy Aby winked a US Man sweater. God, man, God strike me down. You know, I'm a god fear man. I prayer that God strike me down. If he did not wink us, he got you, I swear to gud on the ground. I cannot make this up. Man. The man winked at us. And you know I'm gonna tell you know. Yeah, I'm gonna tell you the Undergod you whether they like it or not, Yeah, tell oh he comes up your block off. Yeah yeah, we we we got it down to like where at least should have been way manageable. Then every time he hit somebody it was fifteen yards bruh. But but here's the thing. Sometimes guys are not talented enough and they do things outside of the scope of the game. He was talented enough. You know. That was the only reason he didn't get drafted, because he was doing that boy job. Tas was talented. He could play. He didn't have to do any of that stuff a pack and you know it. You're right, You're right. He played with the seat He played without a seatbelt. You know, that's all I'm gonna say. Them linebackers difference, You know that. Oh yeah, yeah, you were playing what they get to do to you. But it's a different game now. But you know when I came up in the early night and everything went what they they were really knocking. They were really knocking your block off. You go over the middle and dare you to come back? Dare you to come back? Friday Charleston, West Virginia three one minute? So when when? So what? What if the headline is gonna read Saturday more? Adam Pacman Jones first career fight is how is the new uh rough and rowdy chimp? Adam Pacman Jones, how gonna right hold again? So you're gonna win the bell and retire? Hell no, I'm not retiring. I told you now. This, this, this, this won't be my my only fight, regardless of how this go. When I whip him up, how bad I beat him. So I got a couple more things I'm working on. So you know, I really want to fight. Oh you want to fight Pat? I want to fight the boy over there who fighting Sunday. If he can get down to one hundred and eighty two pounds. Oh, Jake, Jake, Paul, Yeah you Hey, I'm not Nate. I promise you that. I don't know if he's gonna be. I don't know if he's gonna get He probably walking around. He probably walking around. They say you can get down to one eighty what he wad one ninety three this fight? Yeah, it kind of fat thought, yeah, and so he probably dehydrated just to make that. But he going to the ring. He probably walking in the ring at two two o five. All right, how about this? Then after I handle my business this Friday, you you you come up with me a hit list? Okay, you want you want somebody on the celebrity circuit that you would go ahead? I don't know, but I mean that would be I'll be I'll watched that fight. I play to watch that fight. If you fight Jake Paul at one at one eighty, how about you wearing not past ye right now one seventy, Well, fight wads one seventy five, So I'm right there at it on seventy six. Yeah for you. He need to come down to one eighty. Yeah, and then he could be fup over night because because Nate Wade one fifty eight one eighty, he walked in the ring and Nate, I mean he only got that he was one ninety eight, so he probably walked the ring at ten. That's too much, that's too that's too big for Nate. Yeah, way too being for Nate. Man. I don't even know who, who who who gave Nate the idea to go sign himself up for a dummy league? All money with lated he got an age, not anymore. All money ain't good money. Nope, you gotta tell him Sney just not good money. And you can't make me. No mean, I'm gonna tell you. He gotta get down for me to fight him. I'm not fighting him at two hundred pounds. No, no, no, should you No? But don't make business sense for me. But if he here's the thing, Nate let his ego get involved, and you know when you're fighting, you can't let your ego get involved. Man, I'm a business business man. Dare you go pack? Good luck? You know I used to see you around the A. I'm out in the La nine, so I hadn't seen you in a while. But we're gonna link back up when I get back down today. I know you dined there every so after we're gonna grab a bye to eat. I beat your the barbershop, Peter screet. You know we get h cut up and you know what in the other option hook baby Hey, good luck pas preculationship and glad to see you're doing well. Bro, Thank you brother. All my life, then running all my life, sacrifice, hustle baby price, One slice got the Bronner dice to swath all my life. I've been grinding all my life, up all my life and running all my life. Sacrifice hustle baby price, one slice got the brother, dice to swath all my life. I've been grinding all my life