Pushkin. Welcome back to Broken Record and part two of our interview with Questlove. I'm Malcolm Gladwow, Rick Rubin and I didn't expect to sit down with Questlove as long as we did, But after he told us in part one about how he wooed DiAngelo into collaborating with him, we just had to have him to sit at the drums and show us how he did it. And then the stories kept flowing, including the best Obama story ever. Here's part two of our interview with Questlove. Just a quick note here, you can listen to all of the music mentioned in this episode on our playlist, which you can find a link to in the show notes for licensing reasons. Each time a song is referenced in this episode, you'll hear this sound effect. All right, enjoyed the episode? You mentioned way back when that you played D'Angelo that little bit that lured him in. Can you can you play that? We have a drum set over there, you can you reproduce that? Sure, I'll give you an example. Okay, is there a drum though? Yes? There is? Okay. So, so the thing is is that by that point in nineteen ninety six, I was very guarded of my kind of strict discipline, quantized drumming because I didn't want anyone to think of the roots as lesser than a hip hop group. So for me, I had spent five years to that point being the most disciplined, lifeless drummer, you know, Like my version of drumming was just to play the most disciplined. No dynamics, no, none of those things. So the difference is in seeing DeAngelo and knowing what language he spoke. I wanted him to know I spoke that language too. Previously I was speaking the language of hip hop, which was just like kind of like my version of Thelonious Monks talking about atonal like the notes in between the notes, and it's like a broken drum machine. Yes, And the worst I played, the more excited he got. And that's the thing, like to do this, like you have to put your ego aside, because every drummer was about evil Knievel Like Gospel Chops. That's the thing with drummers. If you go to gospel chops dot com, you'll see some of the most amazing drum players that would put Neil Pert to shame, like that sort of thing. But playing with him There was a song on his first album called dream and Eyes of Mine and which the time I asked his producer, Bob Power, did you guys like break the drum machine or something, because the way that it was programmed, this is how that song sounded, which made me knew that he spoke that drunk language his programming was like. Which once Bob convinced me like, no, we did that on purpose, then I was like, okay, I think you're just saying that. But then once I heard Wu Tang Clan and which there is this sort of does that with this production, But I kind of feel like it's the accidental tourist, like, oh dog, that's hip hop, Like I just I programmed it offbeat, like you know that sort of thing. Once we got to that place in that level, then I just okay, this this is the new language. I'm gonna throw away everything that my mom and dad put me in school for and I'm just gonna drum like a five year old from now on. But really it's just being human. That's that's all I consider it. You know, were you when you were playing that way for D'Angelo? So you're he's any audience and you're watching him while you're doing this. He stood up and pointed. Either he pointed or gave me like the black power fists sign like yo. The sentence was, Yo, that's my drummer or that's my brother, Like I just I had to let him know I get you, I underestimated you. I'm sorry, I'm trying to be down. I speak the same language too, and he got it. He got it in that moment. Yeah, I love that so much. I think if you, if you didn't have the training that he had in the precision before, you couldn't do the drunk stylist as well as you do. You're right. I don't think I don't recommend people. And you know that's kind of crazy you say that, because even now, young drummers are on YouTube going to the top of Mount Fuji to learn the fancies thing, and I tell them all the time, like you gotta go to first grade first. You don't start off getting your doctorate. My dad was a notorious he loved that whole James Brown, I'm finding you five ten dollars for that role. You know, my dad's doing oldie stuff. So basically all this stuff is all the same, like like he will not My father did not hesitate ever to just he wouldn't even look at me. You just look at his right hand and if he flashed the five, five, ten, fifteen twenty, that's where I really got my disciplined chops from not wanting to have my salary at the end of the night. Thank God for your dad. Yeah. After the break, Questlove talks about his tenure at the Tonight Show and how it's improved The Roots as a band. We're back with more Questlove. I was talking about playing drums. Can you practice too much to know something? Here's the thing. I don't practice enough. When the Roots first got the Tonight Show, Like the first day where we had to sit in front of each other and rehearse, that was one of the hardest musical moments of my life. Like I actually stopped rehearsal after like three minutes and called my manager like, Yo, it's kind of weird, man, what do we do Because literally we've had a relationship as a group for eighteen years where it's just like sound check, three hour show. We never rehearsed, so to be facing each other and trying to figure out how to be creative was so hard for Like the first two weeks and then we got over that quickly, and then notice like, oh, we're really good songwriters together because previously we were doing the white album thing like Okay, here's my song and let me hear your song. Yeah, I got a bridge for that when you hear my song. So now like we're writing songs together, but then it's also being in those close quarters enabled us to actually be friends again. One of the weirdest things I saw we opened up for the Chili Peppers in Italy at a soccer stadium for the ninety thousand people, and there was a part after the third song on the show, those four got a magic circle, like Chack came from behind a drum set and they all came in a magic circle. And I was like, Okay, the audience is cheering and it's like three minutes and then go back. By the fourth night, I was like, why don't they just have a set list? So I went to Flea and I was like, Yo, what do y'all talk about when y'all get in that circle. He's like, oh, man, we're just like grateful. Man. I was like, what do you mean. It's like, dog, we're just a la Ben. You know, in front of a soccer stadium of one hundred thousand people. Man, I said, oh, you're not talking about the show or anything. He says, Nah, Man, we're talking about like dinner that night, and remember that riff we did in rehearsal, Like we just take three minutes out to be grateful for this moment. So then I went back to my manager. I was like, Yo, they're not even talking about anything deep. They're just talking about that and he's like, oh, that makes sense. I was like, that's not silly to you. He's like, well, yeah, they like each other. You guys don't like each other, And that hurt me so bad. I'm like, we like each other. It's like, dude, you have a slither in a griffin door bus. You guys traveled separately. You don't talk to each other. Da da dah. You got to be friends in order to get that sort of magic back. And then seeing them do that, then that really retooled our relationship with each other. And then the third part was that just personal rehearsal time. Like now that we have a steady job and I almost feel like I've robbed our fan base for eighteen years because I've learned so much in these past ten years of doing the show that I didn't know. I got educated on how to make music, how to be a band, how to be a better musician in these past ten years that I didn't know between nineteen ninety two and two thousand and eight, which is weird, amazing, it's amazing. I'm not giving back refunds either. It's funny. It's funny when you say that about the Chili Peppers in the circle. It's like you you said they weren't talking about anything important. They were actually talking about the only thing that was important. Had they only been talking about the show, it wouldn't have mattered, you know, they were interested in something higher. Let's yeah, I didn't realize it at the tiple. I get it now, but I didn't realize that talking about the show. Who comes to mind of a musical artist who's been on the show, who completely blew you away, and you were it really caught you by surprise, unexpected, hands mind blowing, hands down. I did not know how powerful Bruce Springs was at the time. I believe you celebrate me the anniversary. It wasn't the River, it wasn't Nebraska because the night Belongs to Us incredible. Maybe it was Darkness on the Edge of Town. It was one of the albums that he was celebrating, like the thirty fifth anniversary release of He had asked the Roots to kind of amalgamate themselves into the EA Street Band, so he had the supergroup. I mean, we could have just first off in to orbit the energy. I've never seen anything like that in my life. And then that night he played the Apollo Theater, he literally climbed the scoffolds like the wall like Spider Man. He climbed up the wall of the Apollo Theater to the top tier level. I only seen Fishbone do that like climb. I was just like, I have no energy this. I've never seen energy like this in my life. And then watched him at Madison Square Garden two days later, like I was an honorary East Reader for like two weeks, and I was flabbergasted that all that greatness I'd known about and really didn't investigate and really regreted. But playing with him was amazing. But I mean, every act that's ever been in existence, it is such a bucket list moment for us. But you what did you guys play do you remember we did because the night belongs to us. And then the second time he came back to the show, we did the while the Innocent of the East Shuffle, which he invited all four hundred members of the audience to rush the stage because why not it was the NBC Security was like no, but you know, it's the greatest job in the world. And people always ask like you tired of yet? You tired of yet? I mean not every day is the fourth of July. But there's a takeaway. There's there's something exciting, and it doesn't even have to be music. I'm doing stuff with Steve Martin and doing sketches with Martin Scorsese. There's always something that's entertaining, like I realize now, and it's weird, Like from the age of two when my parents kind of be into the music business, every aspect of it, until I became their band leader at twelve, I didn't realize that this is the job I've been training for. Like in my mind, I'm like, Okay, I'm gonna start a band and then we're gonna win Grammys, play this place in that place, and sell out this arena in that and that's not even half of it. All the knowledge and the wisdom that I have of music gets utilized in the show. So I love it. We'll be back with more quest Love after this break. We're back with more from Questlove. How is your taste in music changed from the time you were a little kid? It's you're wide open. Lately, I've been exploring the stuff I shouldn't have not shouldn't have been listening to. But it's like, Okay, I'm a member of a Columbia house record club. Why did I get Debbie Gibson's Out of the Blue album? What I've been the critic of me now, Like once I discovered Rolling Stone, then suddenly I became like a rock snap critic, and I know, buying those record guys and whatnot. But I'm like, yeah, Christine sixteen was the first Kiss forty five ever brought. I love Kiss Meets the Phantom and then only reading on it later that oh that that was their jumped the Shark moment or that sort of thing. And I mean, I know all opinions are subjective critically about action and whatnot, but as far as like how I listen to it, it's weird now, Like I wish I could. I mean the way that I'm describing getting an orgasm from music, that excitement. It doesn't happen so much now because you know, I believe that songs that you consider good songs that you consider bad. But then there are songs that you know are effective and not effective, And especially as a DJ, that world always conflicts with me. So songs that I wouldn't normally listen to in my spare time, I know are crucial and work for me well at DJ gigs. And then there will be songs that I'll play at a DJ gig in which I know I'm gonna lose the audience by more than half, and I'm still committing to it because I feel that what's a good example of something new one I'll never play a root song. And the first time we ever went to North Carolina, like the DJ like, oh we got the Roots in the house, there was like one clap and then and then he put the song on and the dance floor absolutely cleared, and you know, rightfully so like there's no establishing other one. You can't have any type of funk music or any soul without the establishing other one. Like we were playing everywhere, but the one. It's like, now, I'm interested in telling stories when im DJ, so I plan these meticulous, scientifically proven it's like a beautiful mind. Like I'm doing these math graphics of the songs in this key and okay, this is a flat and the Beatles modul eight two D, and then I could put Human League after that and da da da da. So that's how I craft my DJ gigs. Now. To give me an example, I did the gig of my life, a six hour DJ gig in Central Park for the Hamilton after party for the Tonys from eleven PM till five in the morning. I was god. Every song was perfectly segued, was in the right key. It told a story. People write me letters. Oh my god. There was the most life changing display of music. You went from Current the Frog to dinner and I did everything anything with music from Benny Goodman on down to Drake from nineteen thirty. I covered it and they ate it up like nerds. I did the same shit at the White House two days later for Obama's Last Night in the White House. Oh that's that famous party fail. Oh yeah, it was so Two hours into it, he tasted me on the shoulder, say you know you're doing good job. I love the Donna summer and the old school hip hop and the jazz, and but look at them. They want to have fun too. And he's pointing to his kids. They're having a sit in. They're having a sit in, and they're just like looking at me and like, nah, none of this shit works. And a man. So then I became the DJ I hated. I'm like googling, all right, let me go to Spotify, see what kids are listening to, like that sort of thing. So I became that guy, the guy I hate the most. And then suddenly that night became animal house like. It was the most, the botchers the most. I mean, I could describe the smells like teen Spirit video to give you an but it was like that crazy. They consider it the best night they ever had in their lives, and I'm having There's some I heard some story, possibly apocryphal, that involves us sure getting into a getting into it on the dance floor with who with Barack Obama like they're they're they're they're dancing like he's coming up to me like a player. Do you have French Montana? And I was like, sir, uh, I don't have the clean versions of that. He's looking like we're all adult to go go play it. I was like, sir, I'm not gonna play pop that pussy, but what you're working with, you know, literally like I'm you listen to Grant. All these presidents are like looking at me in the Hall of Presidents, shaking their head like I will say that. At one point, like I was really depressed because I have planned to make my grand stay. They were going to declare a national holiday after me because I'm I'm the function way DJT Like I knew I was going to get a MacArthur Genie's scrant for this shit. And uh. At one point again, I'm like looking on the internet songs kids like, and Springsteen walks in and I'm telling you it's you can't imagine a wilder like think of the Eagles backstage stories, think of Freddie Mercury's Queen Jazz released album, party Tales, think of Animal House, think of like think of everything. That's how wild that party was. And Springsteen walks in and instantly Patty's like, we're going to party. He pulls and he looks at me. He gives me that look and shakes his head a little bit like I know, you know better than that, and I just I felt a shame, like, yeah, I'm sorry, I sold out. Why does the what is the World's Greatest set list? Not work? At the White House? What went wrong? So here were his words. I was on the verge of teers because I built this up to be like, this is gonna be my grand statement. I've been waiting for eight years to have this moment. And whenever you build something up in your head and it doesn't go out in your favor, okay, you're gonna have a panic attack. And I knew I was going to have a panic attack. So I was like trying to exit stage left and get out of there. No no come back, and you know they're all like play more and I gotta go and okay, thanks, thanks, thanks. So afterwards i'm walking, He's like, so you have a good time. I was like, yeah, it is no did you have a good time? I was like, oh, it was cool. Because then I didn't want to make it about me. This is his last night, his night to get loose and everything. They're all everyone's crazy, drunken, all this stuff. This was his night. So I was just like, yeah, it was cool, and he's like, what's wrong. I was like, you don't want to hear it? I'm cool, tell me and he's all right, let me guess you're you're liking an artist and you you planned your your grand artistic vision of how you thought the night should go and didn't work out, and you're overthinking it and you're thinking that you know, I sucked And I was like, well yeah, yeah, he said. So he tells me a story. He says he talks about Charleston in the Dylan Roof situation with the massacre. He said he knew that thirty seconds after the shooting happened that he was going to have to speak at that funeral, so he had crafted He had instantly knew. It's like, okay, I got to craft the speech of my career. This is going to be my profiles and courage, you know, ask not what your country can do. So he says he has the speech of his life, like ready to go. He's been working on it, perfecting it, and he goes down to Charleston, South Carolina, and he knew three minutes into that speech it wasn't going to work. And so he's like going in and say. He's like, I'm not I'm not reaching the people. And he's like looking at his people trying to warn him in some sort of baseball signal that I'm gonna go rogue and freestyle, and they're getting them set. They're like, oh, you're the worst when you go on your own without us approving the script. And he said, some just told me. Barry starts singing amazing Grace. Then he starts singing amazing grace. Incredible moment, right and everything turned around. He says, you know what I did? He said, I served the people. I served the people. I saw that something was wrong. I figured, how can I fix this. I took a moment, I breathed, collected myself, and I served the people. He said, And what you did tonight you saw someone was a little off and you served the people. There's honoring that you did the right thing. We at the time of our lives. You served the people. So you should be proud of yourself. Now, do you feel better? No? I don't. I cannot so as as the way, No, I mean, it really messed me up. A majority of twenty sixteen I rejected, like eighty percent of the gigs. Was I was depressed. I was just like, if you fail at records, what good is your life? And then that's when I started my thing, like, well, I'm gonna stop DJing at nightclubs and just do it for the kids. And hopefully when these parents bring their three year old kids here, they'll see me the same way that I was doing on the block party, and oh, I want to do that. That was my mission. But no, his wife asked me to curate her book, Becoming, and again they asked me to just put like thirty songs together, and I wound up putting one thousand, four hundred, fourteen hundred songs. They were like a mirror. We didn't ask for the story of my life, but we'll take it anyway. So you know, I had to redeem myself. Thanks to Questlove for kicking off our second season, you can go to Broken Record podcast dot com to hear the songs discussed in this episode and in Part one. Broken Record is produced by Justin Richmond and Jason Gambrell, with help from Mielobel, Jacob Smith, Julia Barton, Jacob Weisberg, and of course Rick Rubin and Bruce Headlam. Our Broken Record theme song is by the great Kenny Beats. This show is brought to you by Pushkin Industries. I'm Malcolm Gladwell.

Pushkin. Welcome back to Broken Record and part two of our interview with Questlove. I'm Malcolm Gladwow, Rick Rubin and I didn't expect to sit down with Questlove as long as we did, But after he told us in part one about how he wooed DiAngelo into collaborating with him, we just had to have him to sit at the drums and show us how he did it. And then the stories kept flowing, including the best Obama story ever. Here's part two of our interview with Questlove. Just a quick note here, you can listen to all of the music mentioned in this episode on our playlist, which you can find a link to in the show notes for licensing reasons. Each time a song is referenced in this episode, you'll hear this sound effect. All right, enjoyed the episode? You mentioned way back when that you played D'Angelo that little bit that lured him in. Can you can you play that? We have a drum set over there, you can you reproduce that? Sure, I'll give you an example. Okay, is there a drum though? Yes? There is? Okay. So, so the thing is is that by that point in nineteen ninety six, I was very guarded of my kind of strict discipline, quantized drumming because I didn't want anyone to think of the roots as lesser than a hip hop group. So for me, I had spent five years to that point being the most disciplined, lifeless drummer, you know, Like my version of drumming was just to play the most disciplined. No dynamics, no, none of those things. So the difference is in seeing DeAngelo and knowing what language he spoke. I wanted him to know I spoke that language too. Previously I was speaking the language of hip hop, which was just like kind of like my version of Thelonious Monks talking about atonal like the notes in between the notes, and it's like a broken drum machine. Yes, And the worst I played, the more excited he got. And that's the thing, like to do this, like you have to put your ego aside, because every drummer was about evil Knievel Like Gospel Chops. That's the thing with drummers. If you go to gospel chops dot com, you'll see some of the most amazing drum players that would put Neil Pert to shame, like that sort of thing. But playing with him There was a song on his first album called dream and Eyes of Mine and which the time I asked his producer, Bob Power, did you guys like break the drum machine or something, because the way that it was programmed, this is how that song sounded, which made me knew that he spoke that drunk language his programming was like. Which once Bob convinced me like, no, we did that on purpose, then I was like, okay, I think you're just saying that. But then once I heard Wu Tang Clan and which there is this sort of does that with this production, But I kind of feel like it's the accidental tourist, like, oh dog, that's hip hop, Like I just I programmed it offbeat, like you know that sort of thing. Once we got to that place in that level, then I just okay, this this is the new language. I'm gonna throw away everything that my mom and dad put me in school for and I'm just gonna drum like a five year old from now on. But really it's just being human. That's that's all I consider it. You know, were you when you were playing that way for D'Angelo? So you're he's any audience and you're watching him while you're doing this. He stood up and pointed. Either he pointed or gave me like the black power fists sign like yo. The sentence was, Yo, that's my drummer or that's my brother, Like I just I had to let him know I get you, I underestimated you. I'm sorry, I'm trying to be down. I speak the same language too, and he got it. He got it in that moment. Yeah, I love that so much. I think if you, if you didn't have the training that he had in the precision before, you couldn't do the drunk stylist as well as you do. You're right. I don't think I don't recommend people. And you know that's kind of crazy you say that, because even now, young drummers are on YouTube going to the top of Mount Fuji to learn the fancies thing, and I tell them all the time, like you gotta go to first grade first. You don't start off getting your doctorate. My dad was a notorious he loved that whole James Brown, I'm finding you five ten dollars for that role. You know, my dad's doing oldie stuff. So basically all this stuff is all the same, like like he will not My father did not hesitate ever to just he wouldn't even look at me. You just look at his right hand and if he flashed the five, five, ten, fifteen twenty, that's where I really got my disciplined chops from not wanting to have my salary at the end of the night. Thank God for your dad. Yeah. After the break, Questlove talks about his tenure at the Tonight Show and how it's improved The Roots as a band. We're back with more Questlove. I was talking about playing drums. Can you practice too much to know something? Here's the thing. I don't practice enough. When the Roots first got the Tonight Show, Like the first day where we had to sit in front of each other and rehearse, that was one of the hardest musical moments of my life. Like I actually stopped rehearsal after like three minutes and called my manager like, Yo, it's kind of weird, man, what do we do Because literally we've had a relationship as a group for eighteen years where it's just like sound check, three hour show. We never rehearsed, so to be facing each other and trying to figure out how to be creative was so hard for Like the first two weeks and then we got over that quickly, and then notice like, oh, we're really good songwriters together because previously we were doing the white album thing like Okay, here's my song and let me hear your song. Yeah, I got a bridge for that when you hear my song. So now like we're writing songs together, but then it's also being in those close quarters enabled us to actually be friends again. One of the weirdest things I saw we opened up for the Chili Peppers in Italy at a soccer stadium for the ninety thousand people, and there was a part after the third song on the show, those four got a magic circle, like Chack came from behind a drum set and they all came in a magic circle. And I was like, Okay, the audience is cheering and it's like three minutes and then go back. By the fourth night, I was like, why don't they just have a set list? So I went to Flea and I was like, Yo, what do y'all talk about when y'all get in that circle. He's like, oh, man, we're just like grateful. Man. I was like, what do you mean. It's like, dog, we're just a la Ben. You know, in front of a soccer stadium of one hundred thousand people. Man, I said, oh, you're not talking about the show or anything. He says, Nah, Man, we're talking about like dinner that night, and remember that riff we did in rehearsal, Like we just take three minutes out to be grateful for this moment. So then I went back to my manager. I was like, Yo, they're not even talking about anything deep. They're just talking about that and he's like, oh, that makes sense. I was like, that's not silly to you. He's like, well, yeah, they like each other. You guys don't like each other, And that hurt me so bad. I'm like, we like each other. It's like, dude, you have a slither in a griffin door bus. You guys traveled separately. You don't talk to each other. Da da dah. You got to be friends in order to get that sort of magic back. And then seeing them do that, then that really retooled our relationship with each other. And then the third part was that just personal rehearsal time. Like now that we have a steady job and I almost feel like I've robbed our fan base for eighteen years because I've learned so much in these past ten years of doing the show that I didn't know. I got educated on how to make music, how to be a band, how to be a better musician in these past ten years that I didn't know between nineteen ninety two and two thousand and eight, which is weird, amazing, it's amazing. I'm not giving back refunds either. It's funny. It's funny when you say that about the Chili Peppers in the circle. It's like you you said they weren't talking about anything important. They were actually talking about the only thing that was important. Had they only been talking about the show, it wouldn't have mattered, you know, they were interested in something higher. Let's yeah, I didn't realize it at the tiple. I get it now, but I didn't realize that talking about the show. Who comes to mind of a musical artist who's been on the show, who completely blew you away, and you were it really caught you by surprise, unexpected, hands mind blowing, hands down. I did not know how powerful Bruce Springs was at the time. I believe you celebrate me the anniversary. It wasn't the River, it wasn't Nebraska because the night Belongs to Us incredible. Maybe it was Darkness on the Edge of Town. It was one of the albums that he was celebrating, like the thirty fifth anniversary release of He had asked the Roots to kind of amalgamate themselves into the EA Street Band, so he had the supergroup. I mean, we could have just first off in to orbit the energy. I've never seen anything like that in my life. And then that night he played the Apollo Theater, he literally climbed the scoffolds like the wall like Spider Man. He climbed up the wall of the Apollo Theater to the top tier level. I only seen Fishbone do that like climb. I was just like, I have no energy this. I've never seen energy like this in my life. And then watched him at Madison Square Garden two days later, like I was an honorary East Reader for like two weeks, and I was flabbergasted that all that greatness I'd known about and really didn't investigate and really regreted. But playing with him was amazing. But I mean, every act that's ever been in existence, it is such a bucket list moment for us. But you what did you guys play do you remember we did because the night belongs to us. And then the second time he came back to the show, we did the while the Innocent of the East Shuffle, which he invited all four hundred members of the audience to rush the stage because why not it was the NBC Security was like no, but you know, it's the greatest job in the world. And people always ask like you tired of yet? You tired of yet? I mean not every day is the fourth of July. But there's a takeaway. There's there's something exciting, and it doesn't even have to be music. I'm doing stuff with Steve Martin and doing sketches with Martin Scorsese. There's always something that's entertaining, like I realize now, and it's weird, Like from the age of two when my parents kind of be into the music business, every aspect of it, until I became their band leader at twelve, I didn't realize that this is the job I've been training for. Like in my mind, I'm like, Okay, I'm gonna start a band and then we're gonna win Grammys, play this place in that place, and sell out this arena in that and that's not even half of it. All the knowledge and the wisdom that I have of music gets utilized in the show. So I love it. We'll be back with more quest Love after this break. We're back with more from Questlove. How is your taste in music changed from the time you were a little kid? It's you're wide open. Lately, I've been exploring the stuff I shouldn't have not shouldn't have been listening to. But it's like, Okay, I'm a member of a Columbia house record club. Why did I get Debbie Gibson's Out of the Blue album? What I've been the critic of me now, Like once I discovered Rolling Stone, then suddenly I became like a rock snap critic, and I know, buying those record guys and whatnot. But I'm like, yeah, Christine sixteen was the first Kiss forty five ever brought. I love Kiss Meets the Phantom and then only reading on it later that oh that that was their jumped the Shark moment or that sort of thing. And I mean, I know all opinions are subjective critically about action and whatnot, but as far as like how I listen to it, it's weird now, Like I wish I could. I mean the way that I'm describing getting an orgasm from music, that excitement. It doesn't happen so much now because you know, I believe that songs that you consider good songs that you consider bad. But then there are songs that you know are effective and not effective, And especially as a DJ, that world always conflicts with me. So songs that I wouldn't normally listen to in my spare time, I know are crucial and work for me well at DJ gigs. And then there will be songs that I'll play at a DJ gig in which I know I'm gonna lose the audience by more than half, and I'm still committing to it because I feel that what's a good example of something new one I'll never play a root song. And the first time we ever went to North Carolina, like the DJ like, oh we got the Roots in the house, there was like one clap and then and then he put the song on and the dance floor absolutely cleared, and you know, rightfully so like there's no establishing other one. You can't have any type of funk music or any soul without the establishing other one. Like we were playing everywhere, but the one. It's like, now, I'm interested in telling stories when im DJ, so I plan these meticulous, scientifically proven it's like a beautiful mind. Like I'm doing these math graphics of the songs in this key and okay, this is a flat and the Beatles modul eight two D, and then I could put Human League after that and da da da da. So that's how I craft my DJ gigs. Now. To give me an example, I did the gig of my life, a six hour DJ gig in Central Park for the Hamilton after party for the Tonys from eleven PM till five in the morning. I was god. Every song was perfectly segued, was in the right key. It told a story. People write me letters. Oh my god. There was the most life changing display of music. You went from Current the Frog to dinner and I did everything anything with music from Benny Goodman on down to Drake from nineteen thirty. I covered it and they ate it up like nerds. I did the same shit at the White House two days later for Obama's Last Night in the White House. Oh that's that famous party fail. Oh yeah, it was so Two hours into it, he tasted me on the shoulder, say you know you're doing good job. I love the Donna summer and the old school hip hop and the jazz, and but look at them. They want to have fun too. And he's pointing to his kids. They're having a sit in. They're having a sit in, and they're just like looking at me and like, nah, none of this shit works. And a man. So then I became the DJ I hated. I'm like googling, all right, let me go to Spotify, see what kids are listening to, like that sort of thing. So I became that guy, the guy I hate the most. And then suddenly that night became animal house like. It was the most, the botchers the most. I mean, I could describe the smells like teen Spirit video to give you an but it was like that crazy. They consider it the best night they ever had in their lives, and I'm having There's some I heard some story, possibly apocryphal, that involves us sure getting into a getting into it on the dance floor with who with Barack Obama like they're they're they're they're dancing like he's coming up to me like a player. Do you have French Montana? And I was like, sir, uh, I don't have the clean versions of that. He's looking like we're all adult to go go play it. I was like, sir, I'm not gonna play pop that pussy, but what you're working with, you know, literally like I'm you listen to Grant. All these presidents are like looking at me in the Hall of Presidents, shaking their head like I will say that. At one point, like I was really depressed because I have planned to make my grand stay. They were going to declare a national holiday after me because I'm I'm the function way DJT Like I knew I was going to get a MacArthur Genie's scrant for this shit. And uh. At one point again, I'm like looking on the internet songs kids like, and Springsteen walks in and I'm telling you it's you can't imagine a wilder like think of the Eagles backstage stories, think of Freddie Mercury's Queen Jazz released album, party Tales, think of Animal House, think of like think of everything. That's how wild that party was. And Springsteen walks in and instantly Patty's like, we're going to party. He pulls and he looks at me. He gives me that look and shakes his head a little bit like I know, you know better than that, and I just I felt a shame, like, yeah, I'm sorry, I sold out. Why does the what is the World's Greatest set list? Not work? At the White House? What went wrong? So here were his words. I was on the verge of teers because I built this up to be like, this is gonna be my grand statement. I've been waiting for eight years to have this moment. And whenever you build something up in your head and it doesn't go out in your favor, okay, you're gonna have a panic attack. And I knew I was going to have a panic attack. So I was like trying to exit stage left and get out of there. No no come back, and you know they're all like play more and I gotta go and okay, thanks, thanks, thanks. So afterwards i'm walking, He's like, so you have a good time. I was like, yeah, it is no did you have a good time? I was like, oh, it was cool. Because then I didn't want to make it about me. This is his last night, his night to get loose and everything. They're all everyone's crazy, drunken, all this stuff. This was his night. So I was just like, yeah, it was cool, and he's like, what's wrong. I was like, you don't want to hear it? I'm cool, tell me and he's all right, let me guess you're you're liking an artist and you you planned your your grand artistic vision of how you thought the night should go and didn't work out, and you're overthinking it and you're thinking that you know, I sucked And I was like, well yeah, yeah, he said. So he tells me a story. He says he talks about Charleston in the Dylan Roof situation with the massacre. He said he knew that thirty seconds after the shooting happened that he was going to have to speak at that funeral, so he had crafted He had instantly knew. It's like, okay, I got to craft the speech of my career. This is going to be my profiles and courage, you know, ask not what your country can do. So he says he has the speech of his life, like ready to go. He's been working on it, perfecting it, and he goes down to Charleston, South Carolina, and he knew three minutes into that speech it wasn't going to work. And so he's like going in and say. He's like, I'm not I'm not reaching the people. And he's like looking at his people trying to warn him in some sort of baseball signal that I'm gonna go rogue and freestyle, and they're getting them set. They're like, oh, you're the worst when you go on your own without us approving the script. And he said, some just told me. Barry starts singing amazing Grace. Then he starts singing amazing grace. Incredible moment, right and everything turned around. He says, you know what I did? He said, I served the people. I served the people. I saw that something was wrong. I figured, how can I fix this. I took a moment, I breathed, collected myself, and I served the people. He said, And what you did tonight you saw someone was a little off and you served the people. There's honoring that you did the right thing. We at the time of our lives. You served the people. So you should be proud of yourself. Now, do you feel better? No? I don't. I cannot so as as the way, No, I mean, it really messed me up. A majority of twenty sixteen I rejected, like eighty percent of the gigs. Was I was depressed. I was just like, if you fail at records, what good is your life? And then that's when I started my thing, like, well, I'm gonna stop DJing at nightclubs and just do it for the kids. And hopefully when these parents bring their three year old kids here, they'll see me the same way that I was doing on the block party, and oh, I want to do that. That was my mission. But no, his wife asked me to curate her book, Becoming, and again they asked me to just put like thirty songs together, and I wound up putting one thousand, four hundred, fourteen hundred songs. They were like a mirror. We didn't ask for the story of my life, but we'll take it anyway. So you know, I had to redeem myself. Thanks to Questlove for kicking off our second season, you can go to Broken Record podcast dot com to hear the songs discussed in this episode and in Part one. Broken Record is produced by Justin Richmond and Jason Gambrell, with help from Mielobel, Jacob Smith, Julia Barton, Jacob Weisberg, and of course Rick Rubin and Bruce Headlam. Our Broken Record theme song is by the great Kenny Beats. This show is brought to you by Pushkin Industries. I'm Malcolm Gladwell.