Broken Record with Rick Rubin, Malcolm Gladwell, Bruce Headlam and Justin RichmondAt just 8 years-old, Lainey Wilson announced to her family that she was destined to become a country music star. There were no other musicians in her family to speak of—for five generations her people had been farmers in a tiny Northern Louisiana town with the population of 180.
After graduating high school, Lainey drove North to Nashville in a camper trailer that she lived in alone for three years. Success did not come easy. In those first three years, Lainey wrote over 300 songs, and it wasn’t until year eight that she finally signed a record deal. All of her hard work finally paid off in 2021, when her debut single “Things A Man Oughta Know” raced up the country music charts. Several radio hits followed, and last year Lainey swept the award season, winning a ton of trophies including the Grammy for "Best Country Album" and “Entertainer Of The Year” at the Country Music Awards.
In August, Lainey scored her first crossover hit with the release of her latest album, “Whirlwind,” which debuted at number three on Billboard, and became the highest-selling album of her career.
On today’s episode, Leah Rose talks to Lainey Wilson about how grit and determination became one of the central pillars of her success. Lainey also opens up about being physically objectified online, and the reality of playing alongside some of her musical heroes like The Rolling Stones and Dolly Parton. Check out the full video of this interview and other recent episodes at youtube.com/brokenrecordpodcast.
You can hear a playlist of some of our favorite Lainey Wilson songs HERE.
Pushkin. At just eight years old, Landy Wilson announced to her family that she was destined to become a country music star. There were northern musicians in her family to speak of. For five generations, her people had been farmers in a tiny northern Louisiana town with a population of only one hundred and eighty. But after graduating in high school, Laney stayed true to her promise and drove north to Nashville in a camper trailer that she lived in alone for three years. Success didn't come easy. In those first three years, Lanny wrote over three hundred songs, and it wasn't until her eighth year that she finally signed a record deal. All that hard work paid off in twenty twenty one, when her debut single Things a Man Out of No raced up the country music charts. Several radio hits followed, and last year Lanny swept the award season, winning a ton of trophies, including the Grammy for Best Country Album and Entertainer of the Year at the Country Music Awards. In August, Laney scored her first crossover hit with the release of her latest album, Wharwind, which debuted at number three on the Billboard two hundred chart and became her highest selling album yet. On today's episode, Lea Rose talks to Laney Wilson about how her grit and determination developed into central pillars of her career. Laney also opens up about being physically objectified online and the reality of playing alongside some of her musical heroes like the Rolling Stones and Dolly Parton. This is Broken Record liner notes for the digital Age, I'm justin Ritchman. Here's Lea Rose's conversation with Laney Wilson. They recorded over zoom and to see the full video, you can visit YouTube dot com slash Broken Record Podcast.
You're on tour right now, right like you're about to be out in California.
I am smack dab in the middle of it.
But I feel like we've been touring. We've been touring solid for for three years. I feel like the longest break of touring I had was I mean, it was during the pandemic, but other than that, I've really been touring since eighth grade.
Oh my god.
Yeah.
So, so is it a thing where if you actually get a day at home, you're like, what do I do with myself? Or do you have plenty that you can do well.
Today it felt so nice, first of all, just to wake up like at my house with my dogs, drink my coffee, and I had my hairdresser come over here and dye my hair. So thankfully I have found people to like to make my life a lot easier, you know what I'm saying, Like just little things like that. If it just gives me even two extra hours at my house, I take it.
Can you just give us like a sample of like two days, Like what have the last two days in your life been? Like? What time are you waking up? What are you doing? What is your schedule?
Like this past weekend. I'll just tell you this.
I have to kind of like go back a little ways to tell you, Yeah, we had a show in Salt Lake City. From there, I went to Boise, Idaho, and then I went to Missoula, Montana. I flew back to Nashville through the night. I got back to Nashville at about four thirty in the morning, slept into I guess about like nine thirty so I could enjoy the day, hung out with my dogs, and.
Actually I cooked supper.
I will tell you that's not my it's not my thing, but I give it my best shot.
What did you make?
I made It's like an Asian stirfry. So I did just like rice and chicken and peppers and onions, and I made something that I have not made in probably like fifteen years.
I used to make it when I was in college. But it's called ooey gooey buttercake. I was like, I'm gonna come home. I'm gonna feel good, I'm gonna eat healthy. And I was like, I'm gonna have some mooie butter cake.
And do you have friends over? Are you? Just like I am so sick of being around other people. I just want to be alone with my dogs.
My boyfriend was here last night to eat supper around the kitchen table, so that was good.
But I will tell you, like, for me personally, I think I won't be a like a introverted extrovert because I love people. I love like being around people, and I think that I do get like a lot of my energy from other people. But I also know that like when I need to really like refill my cup, I had to be by myself. I just need to like be sitting on my couch or sitting in my front yard with my feet in the grass, feel in the sun and wind on my face, and then I feel like I can go back.
Out and do it again. But I'm realizing, like the deeper I get.
Into this job, how important it truly is to make sure that not even feeling your cup halfway, I mean, you got to feel it to the so you can go out and just keep born out, poorn out, porn out. Because I love my job, but I always want to make sure that I'm the very best version of myself that I can possibly because.
I don't want I don't want folks to get the shit version.
You know, I appreciate that about you, Like I feel like you really get it. Like especially when I was preparing for this interview, I sat down one day and I watched six hours straight of interviews with you, and I'm like, this woman is such a hustler. And some of the interviews and they're not like red carpet interviews, they're like, sit down, deep, hour plus long interviews, and I'm like, this poor woman, Like sometimes you're wearing the same outfit, yeah she is, but you show up in every interview and you you really get it. And I appreciate that from you know, from my point of view, Thankee, How do you I know that I heard you say that you really soak up people's energy, like you're an EmPATH. What have you learned to like put up some sort of wall to protect yourself.
Oh my gosh, it's so funny that we're talking about this because I just had this conversation with a few of my best friends. They came out on the road this past weekend and we wrote music together, and for me, that's just therapy. It's that's not work to me, you know, as a songwriter before as an artist. So I was telling them, I was just like, it is so endearing. You know, when people even come through my meet and greet line, they feel like they can tell me anything. And I appreciate that, Like it's it's very cool to be able to like to be that person and have them, you know, feel like that they have connected with my music so much that they know me, and truthfully, when I meet them, I.
Feel like I know them too. It's like a it's an energy exchange. It's what it is, yep. But it's it's strange because I.
Mean, in a meet and greet, it'll be like very short increments of like one person will be getting engaged in front of.
Me, and I've been like the happiest moment of their life. And then the.
Next person that comes through might be telling me a really tragic story and telling me how their music stopped them from doing something or like you know, help them kind of pull themselves back up by the bootstraps.
And but I will tell you after moments like that because I can't help but feel it.
I'm just that person, like yeah, like you said, it's just I am a very empathetic person. And I think because of that, it's made me a better storyteller, yes, like a better songwriter and really just a better person.
I feel like I'm able to kind of put myself into a.
Lot of other people's shoes and write the kind of music that I'm supposed to connect with my audience. But when I get out of those meet and greets, there's been times where I have to literally physically like wash my hands, like it all me and be like, Okay, you know what, thank you Lord for like for giving me the opportunity to like take on some of these people's burdens. But I gotta lay it right here. I can't carry this into the show. I can't carry it into my day tomorrow. I gotta get up and I got to do my job again and be the very best version of myself that I can be.
Have you talked to other artists, like I know you and Miranda Lambert are close friends. Does she have that same experience? Do you think that's an experience that's just sort of like singular for you or do your other artist friends have that same thing where people are just like pouring their heart out to you and telling you these like really emotional experiences.
All of my brands in the business, I feel like go through the same thing to like something some like extent. If I'm remembering correctly, it might be Miranda that told me she does meet and greets after her show. So if something does kind of like to take her out of you know, get her mind out of the game or something like that, I think that was her.
Oh so you do years before the show.
I do mine before the show.
That seems tough.
I do, And then and then I take a minute just to like go back on the bus, do a vocal warm up, getting his own and really it's just about remembering that this ain't got nothing to do with me. It's a lot bigger than that, And I don't know. I guess like maybe that thought a long time ago felt like scary and maybe kind of made me feel a little bit like out of control or whatever. But there's a lot of freedom that comes along with that thought. It's just like all I gotta do is get up here and tell these stories and recognize and realize that it's just for like a bigger purpose.
Do you feel like you're like a vessel? I've heard you say you feel like you have a calling?
Yep, I do.
But do you feel like you're a vessel for a message? How does that work in your mind? Where does it come from?
Yeah? I really do feel like I am. I feel like.
It's so strange the stories that I tell, and like even the collaborations that I've done with other artists, like I got to do a song with Harty called Waiting the Truck, and it's talking about something that a lot of people don't want to talk about about domestic abuse, and that kind of stuff happens behind closed doors a lot more than we'd like to admit.
But that specific situation has never happened to me.
But I still feel like, I'm very blessed to be able to speak for the people that maybe feel like they've never been spoken for.
And I don't take that lightly.
I'll tell you that, Yeah, how is your relationship to spirituality, religion, or God changed? Since you're in a position now where you've had a lot of success and this was sort of something that you always knew you were destined and for has your perception or your relationship with a higher power changed.
It's definitely grown. I will tell you that. I mean, I grew up we want a church. Me and my parents, we went to basking Baptist Church in my hometown.
I'm from a town of one hundred and eighty people, and so pretty much I think one hundred and fifty people went to that church. It was like that the town just met up every Sunday. That's pretty much, you know. Wow. And so I've always been a believer, always like had a relationship, I guess you could say. But it's so interesting because I feel like and maybe it's just you know, comes with like maturing.
But I feel like, especially over the past couple of years.
Like the places that I have gotten to go and the people that I have gotten to meet, and the experiences that I've been able to have, I've realized that we're all actually a lot more like than you think, and that gives me a lot of peace. But it also gives me like a different view of life in the world. And I know for a fact that, like when I was a little girl, you know, I knew I wanted to do this. I knew that, Like I had a weird sense of peace about knowing that this is what I was supposed to do, and that feeling has never gone away, that feeling of like I really do think that I was created to do this, but not just do this like I was created to be my sister sister, you know, I was like, like, I feel like I have a lot of different purposes and I feel like all of those things, I guess just like remind me that it's just it's.
Just bigger than all of us. It is. But that's what I'm learning.
And my relationship continues to grow and change, and I think for a while, maybe I feel like I needed to put more like pressure on it than it needed to be. But for me, where I can go and just turn it off for a minute.
You know, growing up, would you say that your parents were surprised that you were so driven at such a young age, Like, did they also have a feeling about you that you were destined to be an entertainer, a songwriter, a performer, a singer. Did they see that in you as well, or was that just solely coming from you?
I said when I was about nine years old, and it was actually the first time my parents told me to Nashville.
We were driving back home to lose Inna.
We had been to Gatlinburg and Pigeon Forge and been to Dollywood, and I just had the time of my life.
And what do you remember about Dollywood?
Oh my gosh, Like I loved Dolly before, but when I left there, I was like, I don't think I can love this woman anymore. I mean, it was just the happiest place on earth, you know. And it's really crazy how much that woman has taught me before I ever even knew her, Like knowing her now and getting to call her a friend and a mentor. It's crazy how much wisdom that she just has like pouring out of her all the time. But I remember driving through Nashville and I told my parents we were on I forty and I remember exactly where I was when I told them, I said, this is home, and I knew that I was supposed to be in Nashville even at that age, And thankfully my parents listened to me.
I don't know, I think you know.
Probably a lot of parents they might hear their kids say I want to be an astronaut or I don't want to be president or whatever, but like, my parents took me for real. They were like, Okay, well, let's figure out what.
We can do to help her do that.
You know, nobody in my area had dreams of doing stuff like this except for this one guy named Jerry Kupett back in the seventies. He's from basking and he was kind of like family to us, but not really, but like he was married to some at one point.
That we were kin to. And that's some Louisyanna stuff right there.
But he had a dream of moving to Nashville and being a producer, songwriter. And my grandfather, so my daddy's daddy just loved music, loved supporting music, was not musical himself, but had just like this, this feeling that he needed to help Jerry cupid. So he gave him a little bit of money to help him move to Nashville and get started, and as a favor in return, Jerry Cupid let me live in his studio parking lot in my camper trailer for the first three years that I was in Nashville. And so I think it goes back even before my parents. Yeah, it's just like my grandfather. He died when I was eleven years old. But oh wow, so he hadn't even been around to see any of this. But it's so crazy, like what you do in this lifetime can affect your people generations from now.
And it isn't that crazy.
I see that.
Were you the type of kid who was constantly singing and performing and getting up in front of the family.
And I'm not proud of it.
Yeah, and I was probably breaking out in song and dance when it wasn't even appropriate. But yeah, my parents in the middle of Walmart, they'd be like, Laney, sing them that song that you wrote last week, and I was singing about the Quelan cigarettes and like it was.
It became a part of me. It was like they said, hey, mon dance and I do it because I wanted to and they knew that. Like I loved it.
I loved it so much and my parents' day even as a little girl, if they found out about a talent show that was happening or anything like that. Of course, they never forced me to do anything. I was knocking on the door saying I want to do this and that, and my mama would sign me up and my daddy would figure out how to get us there.
Would you win?
Like?
Were you good?
Every time?
Every time I'm talking about homey Cook, Talent Search, Country, Colgate Showdown, you name it.
If I was in it, I was gonna win it.
Wow, what were you singing? Were you singing original stuff? Or you were doing covers?
Sometimes it was it was originals.
But I remember trying to sing a lot of like Martina McBride songs and hit those high notes and it was just kind of like a challenge for me. And huh, the truth is, like I did not have any business singing a Martina McBride song. But and too, like I say that I won these competitions, I think it was just because it wasn't that I was the best singer.
It wasn't that like that I was the most seasoned.
Because I was doing these competitions with people who were twice my age and everything like that.
But I think they probably saw how bad I wanted.
It, saw the drive early on.
They didn't where do you get.
That drive from? Is that also something that you can see in your family life or is that feel like it's just kind of your thing?
It's in my family. It can be a blessing and a curse.
I'll tell you that it uh, but at least I'm aware of that, you know, at least I'm here of that. Like it comes from both sides of my family. But my daddy has always had like four or five jobs farmer, brinker, horsetrader, He had a dirt haul and business like buying equipment, selling it, like anything that he could possibly do, just to give us something that his family couldn't give him m hm. And he would always just remind us, like, it's so funny because it kind of goes back to like playing a show like this.
Has nothing to do with me. It has something to do with them and everything to do with them. He would remind us of that. He's like, this ain't got nothing to do with me.
This has got to do with like your kids and their kids and their kids. And he just plant those seeds, and and my mama.
Is a go getter.
She gives one hundred and ninety percent with everything she does, like it don't matter what it was like even if we were having a rummage sell, she would just go all out and like and just give it her best shot.
So I got a double whammy of that.
How many generations back to your family, how many generations lived in Louisiana.
I believe it was five Basking, I think was five generations.
Wow, like farming.
So they know the Wilsons. The Wilson's like a big name in Baskin.
Yeah, I mean there's not many names in Baskin, but but they definitely know the Wilsons. They definitely know the Wilsons. And we're proud of We're proud of where we come from for sure.
And Duck Dynasty was filmed like the town over right.
Yeah, so Duck Dynasty was filmed in pretty much the town. I went to college in so West Monroe, Monroe, and my sister lives in that area right now.
So it's not many people leave.
Not many people leave Basketing. Like if you're from Basking, you'll stay in Basking. It's kind of random that, like even my sister went thirty miles down the road.
Why do you think so many people stay?
I think it's family. I think people really are a creature of habits. My daddy for sure.
My mama, I think she kind of has more of that like gypsy spirit, Like she seems like I mean, she's just she loves people and she loves like going and experiencing things. But I'm telling you, my daddy could get up every single day and go to the same convenience store and eat the same.
Biscuit and do the same thing and be happy as could be.
That's so nice.
I know, I'm like lovely nice.
I like that.
It's just like he's content.
Yeah, I didn't get that. I didn't get that from him.
Yeah. Now that you've been out in the world and you've done so much explore and you've been international, does it make you want to go back home and pull people out and be like you need to see more of the world.
Yeah? It does.
And first of all, I think you were killing this because you were asking questions that a lot of.
People don't ask. Me. Thank you, and it kind of feels like therapy right now. I feel like I should know you after this or something.
But it's funny because I was even facetiming my little cousin and she's in college right now, back home in Louisiana, and I was just reminding her.
I was like, just so, you know, like there's so many different.
Types of people everywhere, Like there's a lot of ISSI to see, Like, I want you to realize how special you are and how much love you got to give, and like, don't feel like this is your only option.
Mm hmmm, because I think maybe some people do feel like that.
Well, it's scary. I mean what you did leaving home, going to Nashville by yourself, that's not something that people normally do. Yeah, you know, that's really scary. And you were with the mister cupid cherry keep it. Yes, so you had him, but still it's I mean, that's a really really big deal, especially if you come from a small town where everybody is just staying put.
Yeah. I don't think like my mama, I don't think she had like even driven on the interstate until she was married with kids, you know, and we're twenty minutes from an interstate and a lot of like the other parents would be like, aren't y'all scared to let Lane go do that, and like aren't.
Y'all ye like let her drive eight hours and live in a camper trailer when the weather's bad and like.
And of course, like they would call me in and they would get concerned at times, but like they knew that I was going to do this no matter what. So yeah, I think that's another thing. They were just like, Okay, let us know. I mean, they helped me.
Buy my camper, they helped me haul it to Nashville.
And I think it too, was a way for for them to see like just how bad did I really want this?
Do you think they were expecting you to turn around and come home?
No, I don't.
I think well, especially after the first year that I was there. Yeah, I think they realized, like, Okay, she's living in a camper trailer, eating Ramen noodles every night and hitting up the Little Caesars when she's got some extra cash, Like, she's not coming home.
We have to take a quick break and then we'll come back with more from Laney Wilson and Leah Rose. We're back with more from Laney Wilson.
Did you have anything kind of like any creepy meatwish type moments happened when you were first out there, before you really had like a network of people.
You know.
What's really cool is, no, I don't know how I dodged that bullet, because there's that kind of stuff just happening all around. Yeah, but I will tell you, like in in co writes and in meetings and in anything that I was involved with like that, I definitely was aware of, like, okay, like what kind of like don't miss on me attitude?
Yep.
I knew that it existed so much that it definitely had to be something in the back of my mind of like these people need to know that you ain't playing yep. I'm not saying that that's why things happen to other people, but I think that is why I have gotten pretty lucky at times.
Well, it's such a vulnerable position to be in because you're there trying to get some sort of foothold, and if there is somebody who could possibly I mean, you don't know what anyone can do for you, but if there is somebody who could possibly have an opportunity for you, I mean, it can just happen so easily.
I know, and it's easy to not even recognize at first. Yeah, and then it's just like what just happened?
Right? Because you want it bad?
And then it's just you know, you think somebody genuinely wants to help you.
Yes, well, that's good. I'm glad to hear that. I was wondering that.
Yep.
So when you got to Nashville, what was your plan? Like what were you trying to do? Did you have steps that you wanted to follow? Like how did you even know what to do or where to go?
I knew that I needed to get better at my songwriting, and I knew that, and I was like, really, the only way for me to do that is like start.
Getting tips from other people.
And I always said, like, I want to be the worst writer in the room. For several years, I would walk from my campor trailer into the studio into Jerry keep it studio and we'd write music. So we wrote three hundred plus songs together, and wow, he really taught me how to write a song. And even when I was little, like he would stop by my house when I was nine years old write music and be like like, let me hear that song you wrote, and I'd sing it and he'd be like, okay, but like if you're if you're singing about a truck, like why'd you put this line here?
And like let's talk about it. He's like, you know, well what color is the truck?
You know, like coaching me through it, and he's like, well, how does that truck make you feel?
And and really just like asked me a.
Lot of questions that I started asking myself when I sat down to write a song. So I will say for the first few years, I was pretty much just writing with him, because the thing is like you move somewhere and you think you have it kind of like slightly figured out, and the truth is you just have no damn clue.
Yeah.
I just didn't know what to do.
I didn't know where to start, and so that felt safe to me. That felt comfortable. And then once he passed away, I will never forget like he walked down the stairs one day and I just kind of had this feeling. I was like, he's not gonna make it. He was only fifty nine years old, and wow, he was like my second daddy. I mean, when you write three hundred songs to somebody, you get.
To know them totally. They get to know you.
Yeah.
I just remember him coming down and he was like, if something happens to me, basically, don't let this stop you, Like I need you to keep going, and like I need you to like kind of carry on carry on what I've taught you pretty much. And the business had.
Changed a lot, a lot a lot from the time, like he had a lot of success in the nineties, by the time I got there twenty eleven, the business had already started changing, meaning like you know, he wasn't really aware that like me actually being out and about was a good thing, you know, like me going and doing writers nights and writers' rounds and like going places and meeting people, because I think in the nineties it was more of like a you're right and you like record a record and then you just kind of like come out of nowhere kind of thing. Oh wow. And so at that point, once he passed away, I thought, Okay, well, you know, my security blanket or whatever you want to call that is gone, and I got to figure it out. So there's been a lot of moments for me where I've had to like switch gears, and I just remember thinking, Okay, well, I know that the strongest thing about what I do is my songwriting. I thought, Okay, well, how how can I just write with as many people as I possibly can? How can I become friends with everybody? And so it wasn't like I was like faking being friends with people. I just knew that, like I realized quick that relationships in this town matter, and I knew that they might not remember the song I wrote or the show that I played, but they.
Might remember the way that I made him feel. And so I just led with that.
I was like, I knew that my time would come and just like fashion goes in and out, and I knew that like what I do would maybe be cool again, you know, Yeah, And I think timon is everything.
While you were working with Jerry, was the goal to write songs and then pick the best out of the three hundred and put together a demo and shop that around.
And we did.
We actually we went into the studio because he had like a studio, like a super cool setup, and we would get in there and we made this record and we shopped it. We shopped it around to quite a few major labels. I know that I definitely met with Sony, I met with Warner, and I remember sitting there and just thinking, like I kind of knew in my gut that these folks are not gonna sign me.
Why do you think that I just knew?
Like I just knew. I was like I wanted to believe it, you know.
I wanted to believe that when I got here at nineteen and I could just write to.
Music and be on the route.
But yep, it's like the more that I got to know the business and the more that I got to know really how this machine works, and it's a crazy one that that's not how my journey was gonna be. And I kind of just like swallowed that pill, and I was like, Okay, well here's the thing.
What you gonna do? Like, if it don't happen when you want it to, does that mean going home?
Will know?
You know? Does that mean that you're gonna stop doing what you love? We'll know.
I just figure out how to make ends meet. I was still traveling, playing shows. Like I said, I've been touring since eighth grade because I had impersonated to Hannah, Montana for five years, and then after that I was in a band in Louisiana, and then once I moved to Nashville. I would every single weekend, I would travel wherever would let me come play four hours anywhere and say yourself by myself, by myself and just me and a guitar, singing a bunch of covers, and every now huh, I would throw in original just to see if people liked it or not.
They did not care. We definitely glowed up. I'll tell you that we glowed up. We did. But it's been a.
Journey and it's still a journey. Yeah, it's constantly changing. I mean there for a long time. Like I was in town for seven years before I got a publishing deal, and it was year eight I got a record deal. But I knew then that like, okay, just because you got a record deal, I don't mean shit that means.
So how did you know that though? Because I feel like everyone thinks once you get the record deal, you're good.
Because I saw.
I would like to sit back and just watch what was happening with other people, and I saw that the people would sign, because people would move to.
Town and be here a month and just pass me right on up.
Sign a published a deal, sign a record deal, and then a year or two would go by and I'm like, okay, well I hadn't heard anything, you know, like what's going on or are these are they putting these folks on a shelf or is it something that they're not doing on there? Like it was just a lot of thoughts, and I think it really is probably a combination of both of those things.
But I just knew.
I was like, Okay, these years that I put under my belt, and they definitely started before I even moved to Nashville. That was me just kind of like preparing the grip. Yeah, and then like signing my record deal is when I really just kind of like entered the race. And then I knew that even years after I signed a record deal, like there was going to be some work that I had to do, meaning like I knew especially during that time it was well, like I said, I signed my record deal in twenty eighteen, I had noticed that a lot of people knew the songs that were on the radio, but they didn't know the artist and they didn't know who sang it.
That you could start singing I know a few things and then ought to know and you'd be like, who's sang that? And they're like, I don't. I don't know, but I know the song.
And that's what happened after our first hit, and I will tell you I was shocked. It just reminded me that that was actually a thing in this business that like the songs are the are the like are the popular things.
But I have seen a transition.
I think after like the pandemic, I started seeing people really start like connecting to the artist and wanting to know more about more about the artist and their story, and like being invested in the artistry rather than just a song.
Who are some artists that you think that first started to happen with.
I definitely think it was like Luke Holmb's uh huh. I think that's where the shift started happening. And he and I have been friends since twenty fourteen. He used to come over to my camper and we'd write music together. But you know, he's like a good old boy and he and hewheared Wilumbia shirts and he drinks out of woke up and like, I think a lot of people felt like, well, he's simple, just like me.
You know. It's just the way that they can connect to the person to.
So did you know back then when you were you guys were writing music in twenty fourteen. Did you recognize that, like, maybe his story could be part of his appeal?
I knew it. I knew it.
There was something about him, and that's why I walked up to him the very first night I met him at a place called Tin Roof on Demumbrian It's called ten Roof Revival, and they had a church pew and people would get up there and tell their stories and sing their songs. And he had not made like a writing trip to Nashville just yet, but I remember like walking up to him and tapping while.
He was sitting on the pew and being like, I want to write with you, and he's like, who is you know? Who are you? Or whatever?
And so the next time he made a trip to Nashville, he came over my camper and we wrote and I kind.
Of just felt like like I knew him.
And Yeah, there's something really special about that when you can sit down with somebody and you don't even have to like sit there and like really get to know him, you just feel like you just kind of do.
I think that's what makes him so special with his fans.
At what point did you realize that you have an incredible story and that your story could be part of your like part of the full package. Was that something you knew on your own or was that when you got with your manager or with the label.
So my manager and I have been working together about nine years and she's my best friend, and it's a funny story because neither one of us had anything going on. She was working for an entertainment lawyer, and she kind of felt sorry for me because she's like, like, I think she's.
Kind of good, but like, why is nobody wanting to write music with her? And why is like, you know, why are these things happening for other people but not for her? Like she was kind of just like she felt bad for me. And so she would get songwriters' email addresses from this company that she was working for.
You would send them my music and a lot of times nobody, nobody would even respond. I mean, she's like, hey, would you like to write with this girl? Blah blah blah blah blah.
But if anything, it just started kind of like my name started circulating around town a little bit more, and then I think eventually people were like, why do I keep hearing this name? And it was because of those friendships that I had made, and I had never really asked anybody for anything. There were a lot of songwriters that I had relationships with that we had never written, but I never wanted to abuse.
Our friendship and our relationship.
I felt like they had been here longer than I had, and like they had a few you know, songs under their belt and stuff like that, and we were gonna write when we were supposed to. I realized once Mandolin and I my manager really just like that down and started brainstorming.
Uh, during the pandemic is when I realized, Okay, this don't have to be just about the songs.
You know.
We knew that our story basically just showed a lot of like determination and yeap in grit, and I noticed that a lot of like even when I went on radio tour, a lot of the radio pds, they were like wanting to hear about my story, and they were wanting to know if I, you know, if I basically meant everything I said in that song mm hmm. And I think that's probably where I realized that this is gonna get fun.
How important is it in country music that the stories that you telling your songs are true. How important is authenticity in country music?
Our first single, the first verse says, I can change the tire on the side of the road.
And I wasn't even thinking twice about writing that line.
But then if everybody didn't want to talk about it, and I want to want to know if I could really do that?
Yeah, right, it's fun.
But I will tell you the songs that I end up recording and the ones that I put on my record are definitely who I am, and they tell like my story to the core, and that has seemed to like work the best for me. But like I said, you know, songs like I did, like with Hardy about the domestic abuse. Like I said, I didn't go through that, But I think back to like nineties country music, and I think about like that storytelling aspect of it, and so sometimes I don't think it has to be your story. I think you're just telling a story for somebody and like stepping into the shoes of another character. And those are some of my favorite songs to write.
What are some of your favorite nineties storytelling songs?
Oh my gosh, like thunder Rolls and Goodbye Earl and Whiskey Lullabye.
And there's so many songs like that that I didn't even know what I was singing about when I was that, you know what I'm saying, Like I was over here playing the murder ballads.
It's so funny.
What did you grow up listening to?
So?
I grew up listening to mostly hip hop, R and B reggae, but then I had like a big grateful Dead era grunge of course, like Nirvana. Yeah, and I would I would just embarrassing to tell you, but I would tell people like be like, oh, what kind of music you into? And it'd be like, everything but country.
I get it.
I get it, though, because there's a time during country that like even my mama felt that way.
Really yeah, my mama was like, I'm not a real fan of.
Like that Debbie Downer stuff, you know, like won't won't won't.
So I get it.
Really, did you ever listen to anything else but country?
I listened to rock and roll, like that's what you know. When the sun went down and the drinks came out, yep.
Everybody wanted to hear something with a loud guitar and extra thomp, like whether it was Rolling Stones or Leonard Skinnyerd or Bob Seeger, and I think all those folks have influenced country.
After another quick break, we'll be back with more from Laney Wilson. Here's the rest of Leo Rose's conversation with Laney Wilson.
Is there anything with this new album with Whirlwind? Is there anything now that it's been out for about a month? Is there anything that you're just really surprised people are missing or aren't asking you about.
That's a really great question.
It seems like they're asking all the questions that I assumed they would, or like they're paying attention to the things that, like I was paying attention to when I was writing it.
I think my fans are smart. You can't get much vibe, you know what I'm saying.
Yeah, Like when you think you do, somebody's still going to be like, I see what you did there, or I see why you did it.
It seems like now that your relationship has gone public, people maybe are trying to dig and get more information about what's really going on or what you're thinking or what.
It is so funny, It really is so funny, And that's kind of been fun too. Like my daddy used to always say, if you tell all your business, you ain't got none, and so to a certain extent, you know, I want to make sure that I keep our relationship like as closed off and like sacred as I possibly can, because like you involve social media and everything like.
That and you can open a can of worms. Oh definitely, and we I mean we've been dating.
Almost four years and people even know I had a boyfriend until about a year ago.
Was that part of the plan, like to be Is it more attractive for you to be single? Do you think there is.
A time definitely where it sucks to say, but like as a female.
In the business, not even like that I needed to be like single, but I just needed to prove a point that like like I'm here, I'm here to show up and do business. Like I don't have anything like sidetracking me or anything, and I never have.
I mean, he's been nothing but my biggest supporter and cheerleader.
But like it is weird how people you know the thing, Oh she's all bowed up. Now next next thing, you know, she's gonna have a baby and get married, and like she's all washed, and that right there has got to change. I have some of the most talented friends who are gonna do so well and they have kids and ain't like, guess what us ladies, we can do it all.
Hell, yeah we can.
It seems like when your first single things a man ought to Know? Like when that did that become a number one song on country radio? Okay? And that was kind of a rare thing for a female artist in country radio at the time, right.
Oh, yeah, it had been a minute for sure.
I feel a shift that was Was it twenty one, Yeah, twenty one when I had my first hit, And it's so crazy to think that it's really only been three years.
Yeah, I was just gonna say, it's like, not that long ago, not.
That long ago. And we had a lot of a lot of like radio hits since then.
And I'm starting to see more females pop up, and it's good for me to see, like I have so many of the women who came before me to think and like, I know, the only reason I'm where I'm at, and the only reason that I'm on the radio and winning awards and all these other things is because of the work that they put in.
And well it's not the only reason, it's not the only reason.
Don't give them that much it's not that because of you.
I busted my ass.
For sure, and you're you're really good at it.
Too, thank you, But like I know that. I mean, like you think about think about Dolly Parton, and you think about like every trail that she's had to go down and just like black over and over again, and then like here comes Reba and then she has to continue like blazing trails, and then the ladies of the nineties and then like Miranda Lambert and Carry Underwood and.
Like those girls. There's there's not been a lot of girls in the mix, and.
I think even now, like I'm gonna have to continue doing that? Are the ones coming up? They're I don't have to continue doing that for each other too.
So you signed your record deal, you met your manager before the first single came out. When did your whole package kind of solidify and all come together with like the bell bottoms, the look, your story, the songs, Like when did everything kind of fit together? Was there a moment where you're like, all right, we have it, it's complete and it's ready to yeap push out there.
So I started wearing bell bottoms twenty fifteen, so about nine years now, and even my old skinny jeans. My granny sewed fabric into the side and made them in the billbottoms.
Why did you decide to do the bell bottoms? Because it was good with like because I look up on like Pinterest and stuff for like how to dress my body shape, and a lot of times it'll be yea like tell me to do the bell bottoms.
Yeah, if you got a bell bottom, you might want to wear beil bottoms. Totally, I'm telling you.
I realized really quick that like I couldn't just be a decent singer songwriter mm hmm, like if I wanted to really cut through in this business and have people remember me, and even if it kind of made them like raise their eyebrows a little bit and be like, what in the world is she wearing? I remember thinking back to like, Okay, what can I do that makes me like stand out? But that is also like real to me? And I thought back to this pair of bell bottoms I got one same year wrote my first song the same year I went to Nashville for the first time, nine years old, and I remember how those bell bottoms made me feel, and I felt like I dance around the house and those things and sing, and my sister had this this spotlight and we turned all the lights out in the house and she followed me every step of the way, like, you know, pretend I was doing a show, and that's what it was. I just came down to like that memory and that feeling, and I thought, Okay, I'm gonna try this, and I just tried it and tried.
It and tried it. I've always loved like Stevie Nick's fashion and.
You know Bill Bottom, Arrow, Dolly and Janis Joplin and like, I don't know, like the outfits that just kind of told a story. And I saw all I've ever really wanted to do is just tell a story. So I did that straight for nine years now. But it all just kind of started making sense. I think once I got into the studio and I did my first record with Jay Joyce, yep, that's when it really started making sense.
And I feel like he's somehow well.
He got to know me, and he got to know my personality, my style and everything before I ever even played him any music. I hung out with him three or four times and we just got to know each other and each other's background, and.
He somehow made my music sound the way that I look so cool, and I think that as a talent, I always said, I wanted it to be like fresh but also kind of familiar.
It's rocking too. So you sought him out, right, Jay Joyce, you wanted to work with him? What was it about his sound that you loved?
So I remember just like listening to the radio, and I really at that time was not when I first got to Nashville, I wasn't really paying attention to producers.
You know.
I always thought Jerry was gonna be the one that produced my stuff, and yeah.
And that was it.
But I started listening to like Eric Church, and I'm like, man, there's something about his stuff that just cuts through and it's different, but it still sounds country, but it's got this like rocking edge and.
Got like little bells and whistles. It almost seems like a little.
Fairy dust was sprinkled on it, and it just sounds different. Like I noticed that, like the tone of the instruments, it just was like interesting and a little left footed. And that's what I love about Jay is that like he's not trying to be perfect. He'll walk up to a guitar while we're playing it and untune it a little bit. And I think that's what makes us work so well together because I'm not trying to be perfect either, and we're not scared to like color outside of the.
Lines a little bit.
Now if it goes too far, we can reel it back in, but rather color outside of the lines and then have to you know, real it back in instead of just never go in there. So I noticed like Eric Church's music I loved, and then Brothers Osbourne there was something out There's stuff too, and and then Ashley McBride, and then there was a record that Miranda did that I thought, man, this this record just some magic in it, Like I just felt it. And then it was like all of these songs and all of these artists that I'm kind of like obsessed.
With, work with this one dude.
And then it's so crazy because I kind of thought, well, I was like, I don't have a record deal, so there's no way that I can even probably be friends.
With this man, you know, right. And I was writing with a friend of mine, Frank.
Romano, who has played on a lot of different things, incredible guitar player, but he lived like a a couple of blocks away from Jay and they were friends, and he said, I've been randomly.
I didn't even tell him how much I liked Jay Joyce. He just said, I've.
Been mentioning your name, but Jay and he said eventually he just said, who is this girl?
And why do he keep talking about her?
He said, so, if you'd like to like, I'll I'll set you up and you can just go over to a studio and meet him.
And I did.
I went and got him coffee, and when I walked in, he has this old, like renovated church, like stained glass windows, but he's got like these interesting like coun creep figures on that kind of looks like a gravestone. So it was like a little dark, and I was like, what am I getting help into? And then he opens the door and he's like smoking a cigarette inside of the church, and I thought, these are my kind of people.
I did.
I was like, I fit in here like this, this is where I fit in, like just unapologetically hisself.
Yeah. How high profile of a producer or was he in Nashville at the time?
He was high profile.
There were tons of folks that wanted to work with him. I had just signed a record deal, right when I met him and my label would ask me to like, who do you.
Want to do your first project? And I said, well, Jay Joyce and they're.
Like really, they said, Jay Joyce don't just like work with anybody. And then, like I said, Mirank hooked us up. And the next time I had a conversation about who I wanted to produce my stuff with a label, I told him I said, well, I've already talked to him and he wants to do my record, so we got to figure out how to come up with the money and do it.
And you just started gofund me whatever I.
Eliminate stand I'm not playing.
So once you once things started to finally take off and you you know, your name was known around town and first album is out, You're getting a bunch of opportunities. How is it different than what you thought it would be? Because if you wanted this your whole life, since you're in fourth grade, now you're actually in it, was it anything like you thought it would be?
That's that's an interesting question because at times I feel like it's better than I thought it would be, but also just different than I thought it would be, meaning I feel like my life has changed a lot, like my day to day life is is a lot different, even like just having to like having an assistant and you know, like things like that because I just can't get it done unless I have help, and that part, right there has been an adjustment, even like having to have security and and things like that.
And good, I'm glad you have security.
Yeah, and we got security probably about like a year and a half ago. And yeah, I mean it's not easy to like get used to somebody like following you around kind of in your shadow or whatever, but which you get used to it. And so I guess those are the things right there that I just you don't expect, like the things that come along with it, certain feelings that I've had, meaning like the incredible feelings that I've had, like you just don't even you can't wrap your head around it until it happens, but also the bad feelings I've had.
You have high highs and low lows, and I know that I heard so many people say that for years.
Yes, and it makes no sense.
Yeah, and you're just like yeah, yeah, yeah, you know how high is low lows? And but I get it.
Can you explain it to me? Because I don't get it, Like I feel like if you had money, Yeah, it's the money piece for me.
Like money makes better, I'll tell you that. Yeah, like for me because I feel everything to my core. It's like the social media thing. It's like it's like people talking about every little thing about you, meaning like your body, and that can get weird. I'm like, whether I gain twenty pounds or lose twenty pounds, that ain't gotten nothing to do.
With my music.
And I feel like in the beginning, like when that kind of stuff started happening, I thought, well, at least they're talking about me. But when I was really with myself, some of these things are just hurtful and words are powerful. That's why I became a songwriter, because I think words are powerful and people do not realize that. I mean, I learned my lesson about reading the comment, so I don't do that anymore. But no matter what, it's still it pings your heart and for a split second you might believe it about yourself, and then it's like you have to call your mama and FaceTime your nephews and do those things that reminds you that you're not just laying the artist, like you have a lot of other jobs.
Too, And like I know who I am. The Lord knows who I am.
My people know who I am, and that's really the only thing that matters.
Because you put yourself out there, you put yourself on a platform.
Yeah, and people are gonna love you, and people are gonna hate you. And sometimes people just hate you because other people love you. Yeah, that's hard for me to understand, like how people can just like say mean hurtful things.
I'm like, who raised you? You know, I'm like, I don't get it.
But also I've learned how to just like let it go in one air and out the other and just remember who I am, you know, like I am not who they say I am.
Yeah, it's hard. It's like an and it's not something that all of a sudden is a problem that you like figure out and it's fixed and then you're fine, you move on to something else. It's an ongoing thing.
It's an ongoing thing.
And I'll tell you what, I don't even think I have it as bad as some of my other friends in a business. Like when it comes to the amount of like hate or whatever you want to say, it's called I get some, but my heart goes out to a lot of my buddies. I'm just like, I hope I'm not raising this, you know.
Especially as you get older too, And it seems like to me that you're someone who's in this for the long haul, Like this is just like you know, something that you're trying out for a little while, but it seems like you're gonna be one of these artists like you know, I know you've collaborated with the Rolling Stones. You opened up for the Stones, and they're still out there doing it and they're in their eighties. Yeah, you've been up on stage with Dolly Pardon, Like, do you see yourself in an advanced age still doing this on stage?
I do, I one hundred percent, dude. I will tell you I'm not always gonna be as busy as I've been. Like I've been busy, busy, busy, busy main and there are big moments in my life when when I'll get married and have kids and like because when that happens, like that's that's gonna be my focus. And I mean I almost stop doing job because I need to always write music. But I'm gonna be around.
I can't imagine my life without it, and then then watching folks like Mick Jagger and Dolly do their thing, it's just like you can do it, you know, But I got to take care of myself on the front end so I will have longevity like that.
How has it been for you meeting these people? Like I know you've performed in front of like Springsteen and Paul McCartney and is the fan in you? Is it somehow disappointing meeting the people or do they seem like normal people to you at this point or what's that?
Like? I think in my head I had it built up of what I thought it was gonna be like, and truthfully, after getting to know them, it's even better.
Wow.
Yeah, Like you just realize that they're just real people. They put their breeches on the same way as I do, like one leg at a time, and I love it.
A lot of people say, don't meet your heroes, but so far with my heroes that I've met, but they have not let me down. And even like becoming really close with why not a Judd? She is salt of the earth I'm talking about weekly will send me devotionals and say a prayer over me and just be like, how are you where you at And that's really cool for me to see.
And they're sitting an example that, Yeah, that's.
What I want to be. You can be that to somebody else. Yeap. What was it like singing with Dolly on stage? You sing well, the clip that I saw you sang, I Will Always Love You with Dolly, that's a hard song to sing.
That's a hard song to sing. Nobody, nobody has any business doing a Dolly Parton song, and especially that one. But when Dolly Parton asked you to do it, you figure it out.
So the thought of it was terrifying until like I got down there and we like rehearsed it, and she just makes you feel so comfortable, and she's like, well, come on, Lennie, getna do this like you do that part, and I'll take this, and like you just seem like like you just knew her your whole life and she's even better than you could have imagine.
So she made me feel comfortable. I'm telling you right now, like that and the Rolling Stones, I'm done. I'm done. It's crazy.
What are you writing now? What are you writing about?
This past weekend? I wrote five or six songs. I'm like, when can we put a record out again, They're like, hold.
Up a minute, I am writing about about my life lately, I really do feel like I have to like live it to write it in two. Like even the songs that we wrote this weekend, I don't feel like all of them are for me. I want to help other people tell their stories too, Yeah, and too.
I mean there's times when I'm like I'm talking. I'm tired of talking about me?
Yeah, are you tired of telling your story? And like you do so many interviews and I think it's awesome, Thank you, cause it takes a lot of energy to sit here for so long.
I remember a time when nobody wanted to talk to me, and I think that's probably where it comes from. Of just like, you know, I've got these opportunities now, and I feel like the interviews are starting to change though, Like for instance, this one today, I don't feel like I'm not having to sit here and sell myself. I'm not having to sit here and tell you like I'm Laney Wilson from Basking Losing Anna.
My daddy farms corn wheats, we beans and notes.
You know, It's like we're able to kind of like go there a little bit more, which I enjoy the time that has definitely felt robotic. You know, yes, when they're asking you the same questions. There's only so many different ways you can say it no.
But you're a hustler and I love it. I love that you're getting recognized for it too.
Thank you for that.
Thank you for doing this. Good luck with everything. I hope you have a good time on the tour. I hope you stay healthy.
Thank you, sister. I appreciate that. Thank you so much for this.
Thanks to Lennie Wilson for sharing her incredible story persevering with us. You can hear a new album, Whirlwind, along with our other favorite Landy tracks, on a playlist at broken record podcast dot com. You can also watch the full video of this interview and some of our newer episodes at YouTube dot com slash broken Record Podcast. Also be sure to follow us on Instagram at the Broken Record Pod. Broken Record is produced by Leah Rose, with marketing and help from Erik Sandler and Jordan Kmillan. Ben Tolliday is our engineer. Broken Record is a production of Pushkin Industries. If you love this show and others from Pushkin, consider subscribing to pushkin Plus pushedim plus is a podcast subscription that offers bonus content and adfree listening for four ninety nine a month. Look for Pushkin Plus on Apple Podcasts subscriptions, and if you like the show, please remember to share, rate, review us on your podcast app, and share us with friends. Our theme music's by Kenny Beats. I'm justin Richmond.
