Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan. By no stretch of the imagination, I'm a historian. Actually, I think I'm kind of a frustrated historian. I'm somebody that kind of romanticized the idea about becoming one at some point in time, perhaps saw myself in a book filled office at a university somewhere. But then I realized those jobs are really hard to come by. The rigor that you have to go through in order to achieve doctoral status in the field, and the competition, Oh my gosh, it's difficult, to say the very least. And then I knew that I didn't know that I would even be able to keep the lights on in whatever home I was living in. But that doesn't mean that I'm not fascinated. And I have followed history my entire life. It's just something I do most people. And here's another little slice of life from me from behind the Kurts. People will say, hey, just Scott, what's your crime shows do you watch? And I smile a knowing smile and look at them and say, I don't you know what. I spend most of my time. Spend most of my time watching history videos on YouTube, a matter of fact, you could probably turn the television off in my house. I don't really watch it. But there are those pivotal moments in any country's history that kind of dictate the course of the way things are going to go. And I've got to say, we're going to talk about one such event today that altered the direction of the history of our nation in a way that I don't know that even now we can take the full measure of We will be able to someday, but this event, this event impacted us almost like a bullet being fired from a pistol. I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and this is body Backs Deve Mac. I want to say something to you right now. I've been around events, I think in the course of my life where you had one person that was kind of the focus of something going on in a large group and they didn't exactly behave or react in a way that they should have maybe respond, and they were accused afterwards of not being able to read quote unquote read the room. And in my opinion, if we had a King of the Hill, I think that it would probably be in our nation's history, probably be John Wilkes Booth. He failed to read the proverbial room, and it wound up culminating in a catastrophe for a country that was coming out of war, and for a region of the country, the South in particular, that knew that they were dependent upon some level of mercy and to have any hope of recovering after the Civil War, and those that was dashed. It was completely dashed by his actions that he took in Ford's Theater that April night so many years ago, when he killed President Lincoln.

Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan. By no stretch of the imagination, I'm a historian. Actually, I think I'm kind of a frustrated historian. I'm somebody that kind of romanticized the idea about becoming one at some point in time, perhaps saw myself in a book filled office at a university somewhere. But then I realized those jobs are really hard to come by. The rigor that you have to go through in order to achieve doctoral status in the field, and the competition, Oh my gosh, it's difficult, to say the very least. And then I knew that I didn't know that I would even be able to keep the lights on in whatever home I was living in. But that doesn't mean that I'm not fascinated. And I have followed history my entire life. It's just something I do most people. And here's another little slice of life from me from behind the Kurts. People will say, hey, just Scott, what's your crime shows do you watch? And I smile a knowing smile and look at them and say, I don't you know what. I spend most of my time. Spend most of my time watching history videos on YouTube, a matter of fact, you could probably turn the television off in my house. I don't really watch it. But there are those pivotal moments in any country's history that kind of dictate the course of the way things are going to go. And I've got to say, we're going to talk about one such event today that altered the direction of the history of our nation in a way that I don't know that even now we can take the full measure of We will be able to someday, but this event, this event impacted us almost like a bullet being fired from a pistol. I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and this is body Backs Deve Mac. I want to say something to you right now. I've been around events, I think in the course of my life where you had one person that was kind of the focus of something going on in a large group and they didn't exactly behave or react in a way that they should have maybe respond, and they were accused afterwards of not being able to read quote unquote read the room. And in my opinion, if we had a King of the Hill, I think that it would probably be in our nation's history, probably be John Wilkes Booth. He failed to read the proverbial room, and it wound up culminating in a catastrophe for a country that was coming out of war, and for a region of the country, the South in particular, that knew that they were dependent upon some level of mercy and to have any hope of recovering after the Civil War, and those that was dashed. It was completely dashed by his actions that he took in Ford's Theater that April night so many years ago, when he killed President Lincoln.

The amazing part, Joe, is that you nailed it right off the bat. He did not read the room right. He thought he'd be a hero. He absolutely thought by killing President Abraham Lincoln that all he had to do was get across the Potomac River, get back towards the South, and he would be They would build statues about this guy.

The amazing part, Joe, is that you nailed it right off the bat. He did not read the room right. He thought he'd be a hero. He absolutely thought by killing President Abraham Lincoln that all he had to do was get across the Potomac River, get back towards the South, and he would be They would build statues about this guy.

He really believed that he was.

He really believed that he was.

But he was twenty six years old and had been kind of jacked up in his thinking for a long time. He was a famous entertainer in terms of a stage actor at the time. He and his brother were both famous actors of their think his.

But he was twenty six years old and had been kind of jacked up in his thinking for a long time. He was a famous entertainer in terms of a stage actor at the time. He and his brother were both famous actors of their think his.

Dad even surpassed them. His dad was known as this incredible Shakespearean actor. Wow, they held a position of celebrity, Dave that you know, you can't necessarily compare that age with the current age. N But I don't know. I mean you're talking about serious actors here, and they were known, right, I mean known everywhere. I think they were even known in Europe at that point.

Dad even surpassed them. His dad was known as this incredible Shakespearean actor. Wow, they held a position of celebrity, Dave that you know, you can't necessarily compare that age with the current age. N But I don't know. I mean you're talking about serious actors here, and they were known, right, I mean known everywhere. I think they were even known in Europe at that point.

And interestingly, his brother Edwin Booth. Actually, if i'm and this could be one of those apocryphal stories, but I believed it to be true, is that Edwin Booth saved Tad Lincoln when he was getting one of the Lincoln children.

And interestingly, his brother Edwin Booth. Actually, if i'm and this could be one of those apocryphal stories, but I believed it to be true, is that Edwin Booth saved Tad Lincoln when he was getting one of the Lincoln children.

Robert, Yeah, Robert, it's not it's not apocryphal. Saved him, Yeah, saved him at a train station he was gonna you know, I don't know if he fell down into the well, you know that where the train track is or whatever. He saved him. What are the odds, you know? And there's all these little oddities. You know that people have done the comparison between Kennedy and Lincoln well all all of these years, you know, and talked about it, and some of them are very sketchy at best. You know, you're having to do the link the linkage here, and let's see what was what was the thing. Uh, hang on the one that uh, let's see. Uh, it was Kennedy's assassin. Allegedly, Lee Harvey Oss had shot the president from a warehouse and fled to a theater, and Booth wound up shooting President Lincoln in a theater and winds up fleeing to They want to call it a warehouse, it's not where.

Robert, Yeah, Robert, it's not it's not apocryphal. Saved him, Yeah, saved him at a train station he was gonna you know, I don't know if he fell down into the well, you know that where the train track is or whatever. He saved him. What are the odds, you know? And there's all these little oddities. You know that people have done the comparison between Kennedy and Lincoln well all all of these years, you know, and talked about it, and some of them are very sketchy at best. You know, you're having to do the link the linkage here, and let's see what was what was the thing. Uh, hang on the one that uh, let's see. Uh, it was Kennedy's assassin. Allegedly, Lee Harvey Oss had shot the president from a warehouse and fled to a theater, and Booth wound up shooting President Lincoln in a theater and winds up fleeing to They want to call it a warehouse, it's not where.

It's a barn bar.

It's a barn bar.

It's like a tobacco barn. You know. You can kind of dig into those sorts of numerology.

It's like a tobacco barn. You know. You can kind of dig into those sorts of numerology.

You can make it do anything.

You can make it do anything.

You can make it do anything. Yeah, and it's.

You can make it do anything. Yeah, and it's.

Fascinating to do and it's entertaining. But that's why I said, I don't even know if it's apocryphal or true. You know, but there are so many things surrounding the assassination of President Lincoln, what trans and what took place afterwards, and John Wilkes Booth and him misreading what was happening. So today we're going to get into it. And I did not even know this at all until you mentioned it to me. I didn't know they did an autopsy of John Wilkes Booth. I don't know what I was thinking. It just never occurred to me, certainly, you're going to do an autopsy on the president, as we covered that last year.

Fascinating to do and it's entertaining. But that's why I said, I don't even know if it's apocryphal or true. You know, but there are so many things surrounding the assassination of President Lincoln, what trans and what took place afterwards, and John Wilkes Booth and him misreading what was happening. So today we're going to get into it. And I did not even know this at all until you mentioned it to me. I didn't know they did an autopsy of John Wilkes Booth. I don't know what I was thinking. It just never occurred to me, certainly, you're going to do an autopsy on the president, as we covered that last year.

Yeah, And I got to tell you, Dave, I don't know if you're aware of this. Do you know that that wound up being one of our most popular episodes last year when we covered the well the assassination, but actually the autopsy of President Lincoln. And I thought that it was I thought that it was fitting. Yeah, you know that we that we go back and talk about Booth. You know who brought all this about, especially the history is fascinating.

Yeah, And I got to tell you, Dave, I don't know if you're aware of this. Do you know that that wound up being one of our most popular episodes last year when we covered the well the assassination, but actually the autopsy of President Lincoln. And I thought that it was I thought that it was fitting. Yeah, you know that we that we go back and talk about Booth. You know who brought all this about, especially the history is fascinating.

Well, that's what I was gonna say. Now that I've looked at it, I'm like, wow, I had no idea. So to give you the quick thumbnail, he did think he would be a hero and he wasn't. To the South you read it right, you know, because people were looking ahead of what can we expect what's going to take place now? And he really did just train wreck all of that. But after I have a question for you. Starting right out at the beginning, most of us know that John Wilkes Booth snuck into Lincoln's booth at Ford's Theater, shot him from behind, and then leapt to the stage about twelve feet down. Correct, Yes, that's correct. Did John Wilves break his leg when he jumped?

Well, that's what I was gonna say. Now that I've looked at it, I'm like, wow, I had no idea. So to give you the quick thumbnail, he did think he would be a hero and he wasn't. To the South you read it right, you know, because people were looking ahead of what can we expect what's going to take place now? And he really did just train wreck all of that. But after I have a question for you. Starting right out at the beginning, most of us know that John Wilkes Booth snuck into Lincoln's booth at Ford's Theater, shot him from behind, and then leapt to the stage about twelve feet down. Correct, Yes, that's correct. Did John Wilves break his leg when he jumped?

Yeah, And here's here's kind of the dynamic of it. And it's fascinating. When he leapt over the balcony where you know Major Rathbone and his fiancee and the President and of course Mary Lincoln were seated, he kind of pushed back, of course before he leapt, after he had and people lose sight of this when he when he shot President Lincoln he was using it was a fifty plus caliber I think it's like a fifty four caliber derringer. That means it's a muzzle loading, muzzle loading pistol. You got one shot and he buried that in Lincoln's skull. The other thing that they don't think about before Booth exits this balcony is that he pulled out a really big knife and he slashed Major wrath Bone, I mean, cut him up pretty good, you know, because Rathbone was trying to fort Booth and you can imagine, I mean, who's going to be sitting there and suddenly hear this report of this, of this weapon going off, and these things are loud of Actually.

Yeah, And here's here's kind of the dynamic of it. And it's fascinating. When he leapt over the balcony where you know Major Rathbone and his fiancee and the President and of course Mary Lincoln were seated, he kind of pushed back, of course before he leapt, after he had and people lose sight of this when he when he shot President Lincoln he was using it was a fifty plus caliber I think it's like a fifty four caliber derringer. That means it's a muzzle loading, muzzle loading pistol. You got one shot and he buried that in Lincoln's skull. The other thing that they don't think about before Booth exits this balcony is that he pulled out a really big knife and he slashed Major wrath Bone, I mean, cut him up pretty good, you know, because Rathbone was trying to fort Booth and you can imagine, I mean, who's going to be sitting there and suddenly hear this report of this, of this weapon going off, and these things are loud of Actually.

I was going to ask you because the muzzle loading it's different than the guns we think of as a pistol, and the sound and the smoke, it's a lot difficult.

I was going to ask you because the muzzle loading it's different than the guns we think of as a pistol, and the sound and the smoke, it's a lot difficult.

Yeah, and it's a black powder weapon, so you'll get this very generous cloud of smoke that comes along with it. And just to kind of just to kind of bring this into focus, these the weapons that the military was using the soldiers on both sides, These are black powdered weapons, and you know how you see them lined up, you know, in a line of battle facing one another, almost like Napoleon. They were using antiquated tactic with essentially modern weapons. They had rifled weapons at that point in time, but anyway, because of the powder, there are reports that were saying after the first one or two volleys that were fired, the battle feels almost like completely obscured by smoke. So you've got this tiny space, which I've actually been to there in Ford's Theater and it's it's not huge. Now, I'm not saying that you're the entirety of your field of view is going to be included by the smoke, but it's it's going to be. You've got the report and it's a concussive sound that reaches out you've got Mary Lincoln screamed, that's the first thing you hear, almost immediately after the weapon goes off. And then Rathbone, who is obviously a war veteran, he you know, he knows what gunfire sounds. Everybody back then, you didn't have to be a veteran. Everybody knew what gunfire sounded like. He responds, and he's probably stunned for a second, and it's just enough time for Booth to free up that weapon, that knife, and he slashed Wratham. But as he did that, he's trying to make his escape. President Lincoln security was either in a bar drunk or he was asleep, one of the two. And he turned out to be a total train wreck later on in life. He was caught drinking on the job and all sorts of things. Why in the world they would trust the life of the president in And you can't make the excuse and say, oh, well, it was different times. No people, there were assassins. There have been assassins for generations. You're just coming you're still in a war footing, and you're gonna let the president be in that. But anyway, when when Booth jumped over that balcony, they have the they have the the bunting, which is you know that that kind of curved uh curved decorative uh uh attachment that's on the front of the booth and it's you know, they've portrayed it as being kind of in white and blue. Well, this goes to premeditation, something we talked about, you know, in investigations all the time. Booth had had his horse waiting in the alley. A matter of fact, he had stable boy out there that was hanging on to this horse. It was saddled. He was ready to rock and roll, and.

Yeah, and it's a black powder weapon, so you'll get this very generous cloud of smoke that comes along with it. And just to kind of just to kind of bring this into focus, these the weapons that the military was using the soldiers on both sides, These are black powdered weapons, and you know how you see them lined up, you know, in a line of battle facing one another, almost like Napoleon. They were using antiquated tactic with essentially modern weapons. They had rifled weapons at that point in time, but anyway, because of the powder, there are reports that were saying after the first one or two volleys that were fired, the battle feels almost like completely obscured by smoke. So you've got this tiny space, which I've actually been to there in Ford's Theater and it's it's not huge. Now, I'm not saying that you're the entirety of your field of view is going to be included by the smoke, but it's it's going to be. You've got the report and it's a concussive sound that reaches out you've got Mary Lincoln screamed, that's the first thing you hear, almost immediately after the weapon goes off. And then Rathbone, who is obviously a war veteran, he you know, he knows what gunfire sounds. Everybody back then, you didn't have to be a veteran. Everybody knew what gunfire sounded like. He responds, and he's probably stunned for a second, and it's just enough time for Booth to free up that weapon, that knife, and he slashed Wratham. But as he did that, he's trying to make his escape. President Lincoln security was either in a bar drunk or he was asleep, one of the two. And he turned out to be a total train wreck later on in life. He was caught drinking on the job and all sorts of things. Why in the world they would trust the life of the president in And you can't make the excuse and say, oh, well, it was different times. No people, there were assassins. There have been assassins for generations. You're just coming you're still in a war footing, and you're gonna let the president be in that. But anyway, when when Booth jumped over that balcony, they have the they have the the bunting, which is you know that that kind of curved uh curved decorative uh uh attachment that's on the front of the booth and it's you know, they've portrayed it as being kind of in white and blue. Well, this goes to premeditation, something we talked about, you know, in investigations all the time. Booth had had his horse waiting in the alley. A matter of fact, he had stable boy out there that was hanging on to this horse. It was saddled. He was ready to rock and roll, and.

He knew he's going to have to get out in a hurry.

He knew he's going to have to get out in a hurry.

He did. He had his he had his spurs on right, and so what happened was was that when he jumped leapt his his spur got caught on that bunting and it it fractured. It fractured his leg and uh it was a very nasty fracture. And you know some have said that, you know, you could you could bear witness to the idea that he's kind of limping, limping off off of off of the stage. It was actually his left leg and foot and so it's a it's a fracture it was a fracture. You have too long, these parallel long bones in your low or leg. You've got the tib fib Well, it was his fibula that was actually fractured. Can imagine how painful this was fractured right above the foot and it snapped it. So he's I know, it makes it makes my teeth hurt. Uh. So he's dragging his foot, you know, dragging his leg behind him, and some people say, you know, they they're not really sure what he said. One one is kind of the Virginia motto that's in Latin deathbit I think death be it always to tyrants or something like that I'm paraphrasing. Or the South is avenged no one. And there was total total chaos in the event. And of course people aren't watching booth at this point, where are they watching. They're actually looking up at the balcony where the president had had been. And here here's the thing, Mary Lincoln. As you can imagine, it's his wife. She's screaming. And people knew he was up there in the audience because did you know the play, Yeah, he got there late, and they stopped the play. Dave the band or the orchestra that's in literally had an orchestra pit in front of the stage. They started playing Hell to the Chief, Oh wow, And the actors that were on stage turned immediately and faced the balcony as they're entering, and even the actors on stage are applauding, So there's an awareness that the president and his wife and their entourage has arrived.

He did. He had his he had his spurs on right, and so what happened was was that when he jumped leapt his his spur got caught on that bunting and it it fractured. It fractured his leg and uh it was a very nasty fracture. And you know some have said that, you know, you could you could bear witness to the idea that he's kind of limping, limping off off of off of the stage. It was actually his left leg and foot and so it's a it's a fracture it was a fracture. You have too long, these parallel long bones in your low or leg. You've got the tib fib Well, it was his fibula that was actually fractured. Can imagine how painful this was fractured right above the foot and it snapped it. So he's I know, it makes it makes my teeth hurt. Uh. So he's dragging his foot, you know, dragging his leg behind him, and some people say, you know, they they're not really sure what he said. One one is kind of the Virginia motto that's in Latin deathbit I think death be it always to tyrants or something like that I'm paraphrasing. Or the South is avenged no one. And there was total total chaos in the event. And of course people aren't watching booth at this point, where are they watching. They're actually looking up at the balcony where the president had had been. And here here's the thing, Mary Lincoln. As you can imagine, it's his wife. She's screaming. And people knew he was up there in the audience because did you know the play, Yeah, he got there late, and they stopped the play. Dave the band or the orchestra that's in literally had an orchestra pit in front of the stage. They started playing Hell to the Chief, Oh wow, And the actors that were on stage turned immediately and faced the balcony as they're entering, and even the actors on stage are applauding, So there's an awareness that the president and his wife and their entourage has arrived.

I've never heard that.

I've never heard that.

Here's the thing, Dave, You know how we mentioned that John Wilkes Booth was illuminary in theater back then. Even though he makes this grand statement on stage and eyes are then turned to the president and his wife screaming out the crowd, and those in the crowd, the theater crowd had seen Booth perform before they knew him. They could recognize him by face. He was a very for those days, a very handsome dude, and they knew right at that moment, Tom that one of the most famous actors in the world had just murdered our president. Dave, I got to ask you, brother, you know, I can't imagine us being in this position. What if you know that all hell is about to rain down on you? Can you imagine you know? You know, I don't know if you know it's all it's all real, uh. I guess in his mind, very romanticized. He's an actor. You know that he's going to draw these people into him. They're going to follow him and you know, essentially canonize him in South when the reality, the sting of that broken leg is hitting home and he's having to drag that thing behind him out of that theater and try to get it just to just to get up on that horse, put your foot in a stirrup and throw your leg over it. You imagine where his mind is at this point. I wonder if he had that that sudden recollection or that sudden epiphantal moment where he said, you know what, maybe this wasn't the best idea.

Here's the thing, Dave, You know how we mentioned that John Wilkes Booth was illuminary in theater back then. Even though he makes this grand statement on stage and eyes are then turned to the president and his wife screaming out the crowd, and those in the crowd, the theater crowd had seen Booth perform before they knew him. They could recognize him by face. He was a very for those days, a very handsome dude, and they knew right at that moment, Tom that one of the most famous actors in the world had just murdered our president. Dave, I got to ask you, brother, you know, I can't imagine us being in this position. What if you know that all hell is about to rain down on you? Can you imagine you know? You know, I don't know if you know it's all it's all real, uh. I guess in his mind, very romanticized. He's an actor. You know that he's going to draw these people into him. They're going to follow him and you know, essentially canonize him in South when the reality, the sting of that broken leg is hitting home and he's having to drag that thing behind him out of that theater and try to get it just to just to get up on that horse, put your foot in a stirrup and throw your leg over it. You imagine where his mind is at this point. I wonder if he had that that sudden recollection or that sudden epiphantal moment where he said, you know what, maybe this wasn't the best idea.

I'm I'm wondering because of what all was happening. He's in in the booth. I just I picture him screaming, hey, y'all watch this. That's what I picture him doing before. But he jumped and breaks his leg and as you mentioned, a gruesome injury. Now he stands up, he holds the dagger above his head from the stage and blood is dripping from it because he he stuck it in you know, Rathbond and so there's can you imagine the.

I'm I'm wondering because of what all was happening. He's in in the booth. I just I picture him screaming, hey, y'all watch this. That's what I picture him doing before. But he jumped and breaks his leg and as you mentioned, a gruesome injury. Now he stands up, he holds the dagger above his head from the stage and blood is dripping from it because he he stuck it in you know, Rathbond and so there's can you imagine the.

Horror of that?

Horror of that?

They already you got the shot, you got the smoke, the president's down, there's chaos raining, and you got this actor world famous. He's standing on the stage in Triumph holding the dagger over his head. They see blood dripping, and then he takes off.

They already you got the shot, you got the smoke, the president's down, there's chaos raining, and you got this actor world famous. He's standing on the stage in Triumph holding the dagger over his head. They see blood dripping, and then he takes off.

Now, well, let me pause you right there and go back to one theater reference here that I think is fascinating. It's one of the reasons I mentioned his father and his brother as well. I think his brother was like, really really, you know, very well known that that image of him standing on the stage holding the dagger in his hand, that literally goes back to another case that you and I have covered, because these guys are Shakespearean actors. They had both I think the brother had gained great renown in playing Brutus, or maybe it was willl because I can't remember which one, but they had played. They were both in Shakespeare's played Julius Caesar, and so that theatrical move of holding the knife in their hand, and you painted this picture, and I had thought about that of blood perhaps, you know, kind of seeping down that blade and dripping onto the stage, and maybe no one could appreciate it. But what's important here is that Booth appreciated it from the sense that this is the ultimate in theater. And I think, little did he know this is the last time he's going to appear on stage. Pure right.

Now, well, let me pause you right there and go back to one theater reference here that I think is fascinating. It's one of the reasons I mentioned his father and his brother as well. I think his brother was like, really really, you know, very well known that that image of him standing on the stage holding the dagger in his hand, that literally goes back to another case that you and I have covered, because these guys are Shakespearean actors. They had both I think the brother had gained great renown in playing Brutus, or maybe it was willl because I can't remember which one, but they had played. They were both in Shakespeare's played Julius Caesar, and so that theatrical move of holding the knife in their hand, and you painted this picture, and I had thought about that of blood perhaps, you know, kind of seeping down that blade and dripping onto the stage, and maybe no one could appreciate it. But what's important here is that Booth appreciated it from the sense that this is the ultimate in theater. And I think, little did he know this is the last time he's going to appear on stage. Pure right.

It's so weird that he thought in his mind of mind that you know, they thought they were over there in the government. He also didn't know that the conspiracy to overthrow the government was him, that everybody else had failed at their duty that night pretty much, and the conspiracy that, you know, they were not just after killing the president. It was a plan to take out the working aspects of the United States government. And as he gets out there, to his horror, and you mentioned that he had a guy holding the horse, how how does he get on that? I mean, it's not easy to get on a horse with both legs working properly, regardless of adrenaline. He's now outside and you mentioned the pain. It's got to be horrible, and I'm just wondering he has to get out. But every time he's riding that horse, now the.

It's so weird that he thought in his mind of mind that you know, they thought they were over there in the government. He also didn't know that the conspiracy to overthrow the government was him, that everybody else had failed at their duty that night pretty much, and the conspiracy that, you know, they were not just after killing the president. It was a plan to take out the working aspects of the United States government. And as he gets out there, to his horror, and you mentioned that he had a guy holding the horse, how how does he get on that? I mean, it's not easy to get on a horse with both legs working properly, regardless of adrenaline. He's now outside and you mentioned the pain. It's got to be horrible, and I'm just wondering he has to get out. But every time he's riding that horse, now the.

Pain's humping down. Yeah, he's got his spurs on, so you know, he's ready to roll, and he's for those For those of y'all that have never ridden horse, you know, if you're saddled up your your feet, are they fit into the stirrups that hang down? You know a lot of people understand this, but let's just try to get an idea of the biomechanics that are going on here, because you can make it excellent, excellent. Yeah, it's like it's like it is like a shock absorber. But let's just let's just pretend that that shock absorber, uh, the leg is now kind of that piston that's inside of the shock ups orb, and that thing is fractured. It's not going anywhere. Well if it does. Every time you know, you hit that horse takes a step there, and trust me, he's not trotting. He's got this thing. You know, he's going you know, uh, you know, he's put the spurs to it as they as they say, hell bent for leather, you know, and he's riding and every time that horse bounces along the way, that pain is shooting up the leg. Now, yeah, he's he's going to have a huge burst of adrenaline. But those broken and fractured bones within his leg are first off, there's a high probability they didn't have an X ray to do this with back then. This is merely my you know, projection. Here. There's a high probability that this bone has ripped through the adjacent muscle structure in his lateral aspects of his leg. I don't know about the calf, but it probably fragmented as well, and so you've got little fragments of bone in there that are bouncing around. And every time that horse, you know, jostle's about, he's gonna feel it and it's gonna be excruciating, and you talk about a cold cup of coffee. All of a sudden, he has an awareness now that he ain't you know, he's he's no longer you know with his play pretties up on the stage. This is reality. You know, he's he's into it. Now, he's into it, and I'm sure he's probably having second thoughts and his conspirator is waiting with him. And you know, there was a whole gang of these people that you know, that he was involved with, that he had come together and you know, most of these people are they're real adults to begin with, you know, they're not. They're not the brightest among us, and just on like a little aside. You know, one of these I think had gone to Secretary Seward's house at the same time Booth was in Ford's theater, slashed him about and he had had a neck injury and he had a neck brace around his next the only thing that kept him from having his throat cutting. When the guy run out into the street, he starts crying murder, murder, murder. He's like out of his mind at this point time. You've got a couple of guys that are one at least that turned into a real coward and couldn't couldn't go forward because they had planned to kill everybody there. There was actually a plan that General Grant right, he was supposed to be there with Lincoln, and because Grant's wife allegedly couldn't stand Mary Lincoln, they were like, I think we'll go. He made his excuses and and and left. But you know, here you have here you have Booth riding off into the night, Dave and to parts unknown, maybe maybe to us, but I think he had an idea where he was headed.

Pain's humping down. Yeah, he's got his spurs on, so you know, he's ready to roll, and he's for those For those of y'all that have never ridden horse, you know, if you're saddled up your your feet, are they fit into the stirrups that hang down? You know a lot of people understand this, but let's just try to get an idea of the biomechanics that are going on here, because you can make it excellent, excellent. Yeah, it's like it's like it is like a shock absorber. But let's just let's just pretend that that shock absorber, uh, the leg is now kind of that piston that's inside of the shock ups orb, and that thing is fractured. It's not going anywhere. Well if it does. Every time you know, you hit that horse takes a step there, and trust me, he's not trotting. He's got this thing. You know, he's going you know, uh, you know, he's put the spurs to it as they as they say, hell bent for leather, you know, and he's riding and every time that horse bounces along the way, that pain is shooting up the leg. Now, yeah, he's he's going to have a huge burst of adrenaline. But those broken and fractured bones within his leg are first off, there's a high probability they didn't have an X ray to do this with back then. This is merely my you know, projection. Here. There's a high probability that this bone has ripped through the adjacent muscle structure in his lateral aspects of his leg. I don't know about the calf, but it probably fragmented as well, and so you've got little fragments of bone in there that are bouncing around. And every time that horse, you know, jostle's about, he's gonna feel it and it's gonna be excruciating, and you talk about a cold cup of coffee. All of a sudden, he has an awareness now that he ain't you know, he's he's no longer you know with his play pretties up on the stage. This is reality. You know, he's he's into it. Now, he's into it, and I'm sure he's probably having second thoughts and his conspirator is waiting with him. And you know, there was a whole gang of these people that you know, that he was involved with, that he had come together and you know, most of these people are they're real adults to begin with, you know, they're not. They're not the brightest among us, and just on like a little aside. You know, one of these I think had gone to Secretary Seward's house at the same time Booth was in Ford's theater, slashed him about and he had had a neck injury and he had a neck brace around his next the only thing that kept him from having his throat cutting. When the guy run out into the street, he starts crying murder, murder, murder. He's like out of his mind at this point time. You've got a couple of guys that are one at least that turned into a real coward and couldn't couldn't go forward because they had planned to kill everybody there. There was actually a plan that General Grant right, he was supposed to be there with Lincoln, and because Grant's wife allegedly couldn't stand Mary Lincoln, they were like, I think we'll go. He made his excuses and and and left. But you know, here you have here you have Booth riding off into the night, Dave and to parts unknown, maybe maybe to us, but I think he had an idea where he was headed.

He was trying. You know, they did have a plan, and it was to get to the naval bridge. They got to get to the Navy shipyard and that's where David Harold is waiting.

He was trying. You know, they did have a plan, and it was to get to the naval bridge. They got to get to the Navy shipyard and that's where David Harold is waiting.

But as he.

But as he.

Gets there, this is this the little things you didn't plan on, you know. It wasn't like it is today where communication happens, you know, right away. And so as John Willikes Booth is making his escape, he gets to a bridge that has been closed for the night, done, not going anywhere, and it's the Navy yard bridge and John Willkes Booth, now we're going back to the famous actor thing. The guys guarding the bridge haven't heard about the assassination that just took place, and John Willkes Booth needs to cross the bridge, and they stop him, and he talks his way into it because famous actor, Hey just got to get through here, guys, and they're like, oh okay. So he is able to cross the bridge and that's where he meets up with David Harold. And now those two are going to be married at the hip for the next few days until death to us part almost and that's where their journey begins. Now, Booth thought, all we have to do get across the Potomac River. And once we're there, we're we're in God's country. We're at Dixie we're home free. There'll be parades waiting for us.

Gets there, this is this the little things you didn't plan on, you know. It wasn't like it is today where communication happens, you know, right away. And so as John Willikes Booth is making his escape, he gets to a bridge that has been closed for the night, done, not going anywhere, and it's the Navy yard bridge and John Willkes Booth, now we're going back to the famous actor thing. The guys guarding the bridge haven't heard about the assassination that just took place, and John Willkes Booth needs to cross the bridge, and they stop him, and he talks his way into it because famous actor, Hey just got to get through here, guys, and they're like, oh okay. So he is able to cross the bridge and that's where he meets up with David Harold. And now those two are going to be married at the hip for the next few days until death to us part almost and that's where their journey begins. Now, Booth thought, all we have to do get across the Potomac River. And once we're there, we're we're in God's country. We're at Dixie we're home free. There'll be parades waiting for us.

You know. Didn't happen that way.

You know. Didn't happen that way.

No, no, it didn't. And you know the thing about it is, I think a lot of people when many people think, you know, they'll think of my home state of Louisiana when you think swamp. Let me tell you something. Oh, Virginia, Virginia, and down in North Carolina, and and of course South Carolina too, that whole area right there. You're in that tidle basin, and let me tell you something. There's a lot of rough terrain in there. A matter of fact, I think the one area there in Virginia, I think they call it, and here's the name, the dismal Swamp. Can you imagine. I think that's a place I would want to avoid. But you know, that's the terrain that Booth and Harold found themselves trying to negotiate. And not only are they trying to negotiate it, they're trying to negotiate it with a busted leg, essentially at night, with a leg that is just ripping in pain. It's torn, it's torn through through the musculator in his leg, and it's horrible. And you can imagine how excruciating this was just to try to just any movement. There's a reason why even if your leg is not set, if you are if you have a fractured limb, they tell you need to rest, stay off of it, or in case of an arm, don't use it. And you talk about the antithesis of that boy is he using it or what? Because and this is uneven terrain. When you get off into the swamps, you're not going to be on the back of a horse. You have to negotiate this area and find somebody that can help you through it. And I think, if I'm not mistaken, it was actually a former slave that, not knowing what was going on, he had to act as a guide to get them through the swamp.

No, no, it didn't. And you know the thing about it is, I think a lot of people when many people think, you know, they'll think of my home state of Louisiana when you think swamp. Let me tell you something. Oh, Virginia, Virginia, and down in North Carolina, and and of course South Carolina too, that whole area right there. You're in that tidle basin, and let me tell you something. There's a lot of rough terrain in there. A matter of fact, I think the one area there in Virginia, I think they call it, and here's the name, the dismal Swamp. Can you imagine. I think that's a place I would want to avoid. But you know, that's the terrain that Booth and Harold found themselves trying to negotiate. And not only are they trying to negotiate it, they're trying to negotiate it with a busted leg, essentially at night, with a leg that is just ripping in pain. It's torn, it's torn through through the musculator in his leg, and it's horrible. And you can imagine how excruciating this was just to try to just any movement. There's a reason why even if your leg is not set, if you are if you have a fractured limb, they tell you need to rest, stay off of it, or in case of an arm, don't use it. And you talk about the antithesis of that boy is he using it or what? Because and this is uneven terrain. When you get off into the swamps, you're not going to be on the back of a horse. You have to negotiate this area and find somebody that can help you through it. And I think, if I'm not mistaken, it was actually a former slave that, not knowing what was going on, he had to act as a guide to get them through the swamp.

It's funny because I was going to ask you about the leg break, Joe, I'm funny strange. Is it pap for a leg breaking a broken leg to be fatal?

It's funny because I was going to ask you about the leg break, Joe, I'm funny strange. Is it pap for a leg breaking a broken leg to be fatal?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, oh yeah. And there's a couple of ways it could be. First off, if that leg fractures and you clip a major vessel in there, or a couple of vessels, you can bleed out. That is possible with these fractures. What happens is you can have this infection that sets in and it necrotizes. Essentially, it means it dies. You know. It's where we get termed, you know, necros we're talking about death and the tissues begin to die and rot in that area. So the longer you go and this thing remains untreated, dependent upon how much damage is done, you can and it would take quite a bit of time, but you're going to see like an onset of fever. You're going to see a kind of a delirious state, and then the leg will literally start to turn black and it would eventually have to be ampy. That is, if you cannot get to a doctor and have this thing set and wrapped. And David, I got to tell you, interestingly enough, another interesting intersection with history. The physician involved in the saying is actually an ancestor of somebody that you and I grew up listening to we were kids.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, oh yeah. And there's a couple of ways it could be. First off, if that leg fractures and you clip a major vessel in there, or a couple of vessels, you can bleed out. That is possible with these fractures. What happens is you can have this infection that sets in and it necrotizes. Essentially, it means it dies. You know. It's where we get termed, you know, necros we're talking about death and the tissues begin to die and rot in that area. So the longer you go and this thing remains untreated, dependent upon how much damage is done, you can and it would take quite a bit of time, but you're going to see like an onset of fever. You're going to see a kind of a delirious state, and then the leg will literally start to turn black and it would eventually have to be ampy. That is, if you cannot get to a doctor and have this thing set and wrapped. And David, I got to tell you, interestingly enough, another interesting intersection with history. The physician involved in the saying is actually an ancestor of somebody that you and I grew up listening to we were kids.

How weird. It's so weird, it really is.

How weird. It's so weird, it really is.

Oftentimes he gets listed in the group of conspirators, and we're talking about Samuel Mudd in this particular case, John Wilkes Booth with the broken leg him, David Harold, they're now on their way trying to escape together, and they go to a bar.

Oftentimes he gets listed in the group of conspirators, and we're talking about Samuel Mudd in this particular case, John Wilkes Booth with the broken leg him, David Harold, they're now on their way trying to escape together, and they go to a bar.

Sir Rottville. There's a Surt tavern.

Sir Rottville. There's a Surt tavern.

They've changed the name of that now, but I always think of Mary Sarat, you know, yeah, yeah, being hung as part of the conspiracy, because that's where they actually created it. But anyway, so they're at the tavern and John Wilkes Booth brags to the bartender that he just killed Abraham Lincoln. Now you're trying to escape. I don't think telling people this is a good thing.

They've changed the name of that now, but I always think of Mary Sarat, you know, yeah, yeah, being hung as part of the conspiracy, because that's where they actually created it. But anyway, so they're at the tavern and John Wilkes Booth brags to the bartender that he just killed Abraham Lincoln. Now you're trying to escape. I don't think telling people this is a good thing.

But it's Jol's booth.

But it's Jol's booth.

Yeah yeah.

Yeah yeah.

But he and David Harold leave there because they know they've got to get the leg treated. He knows that Samuel Mudd, doctor Mud, is in the area, and he goes to doctor Mudd's house and gets him to set the leg. There is a lot of different stories told about whether or not Mud was involved in a conspiracy, if he was on the side of Booth or whatever. The one thing that has been said is that Mud, doctor Samuel Mudd, did know John Willis Booth from a conspiracy. They had to kidnap the president a year before. I don't even know if that's true. It's just part of our.

But he and David Harold leave there because they know they've got to get the leg treated. He knows that Samuel Mudd, doctor Mud, is in the area, and he goes to doctor Mudd's house and gets him to set the leg. There is a lot of different stories told about whether or not Mud was involved in a conspiracy, if he was on the side of Booth or whatever. The one thing that has been said is that Mud, doctor Samuel Mudd, did know John Willis Booth from a conspiracy. They had to kidnap the president a year before. I don't even know if that's true. It's just part of our.

Lord it's hard. It's really hard to validate that. And I know what's you know, and what I was mentioning is that Samuel Mudd was the great grandfather of Roger Mudd. And when you and I were kids, Roger Mudd was on the nightly news every night. You know, you're sitting there and yeah, I mean, how many times as kids did we watch him.

Lord it's hard. It's really hard to validate that. And I know what's you know, and what I was mentioning is that Samuel Mudd was the great grandfather of Roger Mudd. And when you and I were kids, Roger Mudd was on the nightly news every night. You know, you're sitting there and yeah, I mean, how many times as kids did we watch him.

The one thing that comes to mind with him for me politics, because he was a political reporter, you know, for years, and it was Roger Mudd.

The one thing that comes to mind with him for me politics, because he was a political reporter, you know, for years, and it was Roger Mudd.

Think about it.

Think about it.

We were talking about the different connections between the Kennedy assassination and the Lincoln assassination. And in this particular case where Samuel Mudd fixed the leg of John Wilkes booth during his escape, Roger Mudd is talking to John to Teddy Kennedy right before in nineteen seventy nine. It happened on November fourth, nineteen seventy nine, they have this interview on national television. They're hoping ted Kennedy will announce that he is running for the Democratic nomination for president, even though Jimmy Carter is a Democrat and he's the incumbent, and at that time polling showed that Kennedy. Ted Kennedy was favored two to one over Jimmy Carter.

We were talking about the different connections between the Kennedy assassination and the Lincoln assassination. And in this particular case where Samuel Mudd fixed the leg of John Wilkes booth during his escape, Roger Mudd is talking to John to Teddy Kennedy right before in nineteen seventy nine. It happened on November fourth, nineteen seventy nine, they have this interview on national television. They're hoping ted Kennedy will announce that he is running for the Democratic nomination for president, even though Jimmy Carter is a Democrat and he's the incumbent, and at that time polling showed that Kennedy. Ted Kennedy was favored two to one over Jimmy Carter.

And the in his party.

And the in his party.

So this is they were hoping he would announce it on Nash Television with Roger Mudd. He didn't and asked it a couple of days later. But there was a question that Roger Mudd asked that night in front of a nationwide audience. He asks Ted Kennedy, why do you want to be president? Ted Kennedy couldn't answer it. His campaign ended that night before it ever began. He never regained his footing. He did not win the nomination. Carter got the nomination and lost in a landslide to Reagan, but his campaign ended with that one question from Roger Mudd.

So this is they were hoping he would announce it on Nash Television with Roger Mudd. He didn't and asked it a couple of days later. But there was a question that Roger Mudd asked that night in front of a nationwide audience. He asks Ted Kennedy, why do you want to be president? Ted Kennedy couldn't answer it. His campaign ended that night before it ever began. He never regained his footing. He did not win the nomination. Carter got the nomination and lost in a landslide to Reagan, but his campaign ended with that one question from Roger Mudd.

Isn't that amazing the way history kind of entangles itself like this? It's fascinating to look back and look, I want to give doctor Mudd his due real quick, and it's important to remember this, and I'm trying not to bury the lead here, but doctor Samuel Mudd was eventually arrested. He was charged, I think as a conspirator, probably relative to treason. He was actually sent to If you can imagine how hillacious this would have been actually sent to an army prison in Florida. You imagine how hot that was. Well, what'd they have? They had a fever outbreak that occurred down there, and you know, he distinguished himself while he was there, and he begins to treat everybody guards, he treats family members, he treats prisoners and tries to pull them back from the edge. And you know, whether or not Mud himself was actually involved, and I'm talking about doctor Samuel Mudd as part of conspiracy, I don't know, But again it goes back to this idea that things aren't always as they've seen. So the powers that be, primarily Stanton back in Washington, Stanton was the Secretary of War. I believe that's correct. They're frustrated because they haven't found Booth and there, as they say, they're curry combing the uh, the landscape out there trying to find him, and they've got they've actually got military detachments, these soldiers that are assigned to these these troopers. It's not like they're seasoned veterans. These guys have stared down war. They've been through just hell, you know, over low these many years since you know, since the war broke out, and they had Calvary units that were out searching, searching and looking for Booth and anybody else that could could have been, you know, linked to him. And but this is what they wanted, Dave. They they didn't want to have they didn't want to have a hide that they could tack to the wall. They wanted this guy alive. Yes, they wanted him alive because they wanted to try to understand what had happened. They wanted him, I think, to stand up before court and have to stand and deliver, say what he did, you know actually, and maybe point to anybody else in needs the peripherals. But you know, they unfortunately the country was not going to get that satisfaction.

Isn't that amazing the way history kind of entangles itself like this? It's fascinating to look back and look, I want to give doctor Mudd his due real quick, and it's important to remember this, and I'm trying not to bury the lead here, but doctor Samuel Mudd was eventually arrested. He was charged, I think as a conspirator, probably relative to treason. He was actually sent to If you can imagine how hillacious this would have been actually sent to an army prison in Florida. You imagine how hot that was. Well, what'd they have? They had a fever outbreak that occurred down there, and you know, he distinguished himself while he was there, and he begins to treat everybody guards, he treats family members, he treats prisoners and tries to pull them back from the edge. And you know, whether or not Mud himself was actually involved, and I'm talking about doctor Samuel Mudd as part of conspiracy, I don't know, But again it goes back to this idea that things aren't always as they've seen. So the powers that be, primarily Stanton back in Washington, Stanton was the Secretary of War. I believe that's correct. They're frustrated because they haven't found Booth and there, as they say, they're curry combing the uh, the landscape out there trying to find him, and they've got they've actually got military detachments, these soldiers that are assigned to these these troopers. It's not like they're seasoned veterans. These guys have stared down war. They've been through just hell, you know, over low these many years since you know, since the war broke out, and they had Calvary units that were out searching, searching and looking for Booth and anybody else that could could have been, you know, linked to him. And but this is what they wanted, Dave. They they didn't want to have they didn't want to have a hide that they could tack to the wall. They wanted this guy alive. Yes, they wanted him alive because they wanted to try to understand what had happened. They wanted him, I think, to stand up before court and have to stand and deliver, say what he did, you know actually, and maybe point to anybody else in needs the peripherals. But you know, they unfortunately the country was not going to get that satisfaction.

You know, it's interesting Joe that the John Wills Booth kills Lincoln and then as he's on his run, he and David Harold they get the leg set at doctor Mudd's house. Doctor Mudd kicks them out. They're trying to find another Confederate guy and it's at night. They're having trouble finding him, and they stumble upon the house of Oswald Swan, who is a free black man. He's got a cabin and so he doesn't know what's happening with Lincoln. He doesn't know. He just got two guys. They need help, and so he really wasn't given a lot of opportunity to say no. But he did lead them to the home of the Confederate that they were looking for. The guy's names escaping me. It was a coxplantation that they were trying to find. They pay the man they paid no, John Wilkes Booth, David Harrold's Booth kills the President, kills Lincoln, and then paying a black man twelve dollars to lead them to their Confederate.

You know, it's interesting Joe that the John Wills Booth kills Lincoln and then as he's on his run, he and David Harold they get the leg set at doctor Mudd's house. Doctor Mudd kicks them out. They're trying to find another Confederate guy and it's at night. They're having trouble finding him, and they stumble upon the house of Oswald Swan, who is a free black man. He's got a cabin and so he doesn't know what's happening with Lincoln. He doesn't know. He just got two guys. They need help, and so he really wasn't given a lot of opportunity to say no. But he did lead them to the home of the Confederate that they were looking for. The guy's names escaping me. It was a coxplantation that they were trying to find. They pay the man they paid no, John Wilkes Booth, David Harrold's Booth kills the President, kills Lincoln, and then paying a black man twelve dollars to lead them to their Confederate.

They end up.

They end up.

This happens another time too with the Lucas family. During this time they're on the run, nobody will help him. John Wolkes Booth is getting mad every step along the way. Where he expected to be treated like a hero. They had all these Confederates, you know, people that were spread out throughout the area that you know, had they all talked about helping, We'll be there for you, you know, whatever you need. But then when he needs their help, all they're doing is giving him food and saying go, not giving him money, not giving him just here's some food.

This happens another time too with the Lucas family. During this time they're on the run, nobody will help him. John Wolkes Booth is getting mad every step along the way. Where he expected to be treated like a hero. They had all these Confederates, you know, people that were spread out throughout the area that you know, had they all talked about helping, We'll be there for you, you know, whatever you need. But then when he needs their help, all they're doing is giving him food and saying go, not giving him money, not giving him just here's some food.

Leave.

Leave.

Yeah, But you can imagine what these people had seen. Yeah, they've seen the troopers on horses hell bent for leather, and they're yelling and they're screaming, and they're showing up at barns and homes and you know that this I'm not sure, but I think that it was still in place. You know, Lincoln had suspended habeas corpus, right, and so what that means is, dude, you ain't gonna rights if we're looking for somebody, we're coming in your house. And people are terrified, and they understand that they're in a defeated state. Now the Confederacy, whether or not you were aligned with the Confederacy in this region or not, and you were just living your life as as would be. You know, they knew that well, first off, the Union's blood was boiling. There were people back in d C. They did, in fact want bloody. They wanted Booth's head on a pike and news. I know that they didn't live in the world that we live in with the quick turnaround on news. Trust me, the word had gone out at this point in time, and word would travel fast between these farms. I can only imagine. Oh yeah, and they knew that if they're caught with this guy, it was going to be curtains.

Yeah, But you can imagine what these people had seen. Yeah, they've seen the troopers on horses hell bent for leather, and they're yelling and they're screaming, and they're showing up at barns and homes and you know that this I'm not sure, but I think that it was still in place. You know, Lincoln had suspended habeas corpus, right, and so what that means is, dude, you ain't gonna rights if we're looking for somebody, we're coming in your house. And people are terrified, and they understand that they're in a defeated state. Now the Confederacy, whether or not you were aligned with the Confederacy in this region or not, and you were just living your life as as would be. You know, they knew that well, first off, the Union's blood was boiling. There were people back in d C. They did, in fact want bloody. They wanted Booth's head on a pike and news. I know that they didn't live in the world that we live in with the quick turnaround on news. Trust me, the word had gone out at this point in time, and word would travel fast between these farms. I can only imagine. Oh yeah, and they knew that if they're caught with this guy, it was going to be curtains.

For And so that's where these people who had been sympathizer all along now are saying, here's some food.

For And so that's where these people who had been sympathizer all along now are saying, here's some food.

Leave.

Leave.

They were making him get off my property. You cannot stay here. And so he ends up at the home of a black family, the Lucas family, and uh and Booth was mad because all these people he thought were going to provide help, nobody's helping.

They were making him get off my property. You cannot stay here. And so he ends up at the home of a black family, the Lucas family, and uh and Booth was mad because all these people he thought were going to provide help, nobody's helping.

And he's at the end of the day.

And he's at the end of the day.

He's got no place to sleep, he's got he's hungry, and he ends up at the home of William Lucas, who is a freed slave. He's a black man. He got his family there in his own cabin and well and Booth showing his he's so grateful. He grabs a knife, threatens mister Lucas and his family and kicks him out of their own house and sleeps in their house that night. And anyway, so for the next that that pretty much winds up the running of John Wilkes Booth. You know, as we know, he ends up in a barn, and this is where they were told, we want him alive. Do not shoot this man, do not kill this man, we need to take him alive. And when it comes right down to it, Joe, He's hiding out in a tobacco barn with David Harrell.

He's got no place to sleep, he's got he's hungry, and he ends up at the home of William Lucas, who is a freed slave. He's a black man. He got his family there in his own cabin and well and Booth showing his he's so grateful. He grabs a knife, threatens mister Lucas and his family and kicks him out of their own house and sleeps in their house that night. And anyway, so for the next that that pretty much winds up the running of John Wilkes Booth. You know, as we know, he ends up in a barn, and this is where they were told, we want him alive. Do not shoot this man, do not kill this man, we need to take him alive. And when it comes right down to it, Joe, He's hiding out in a tobacco barn with David Harrell.

They're surrounded by.

They're surrounded by.

Guns, weapons, military police, everybody that you know wanted to get John Wilkes Booth was there and he won't come out, and so they decide to light the cabin on fire light or at the barn, the tobacco barn. They go to light the tobacco barn on fire. David Harrel runs out. All the while John Wilkes Booth is calling him a coward. But what happens next is exactly what they didn't want to have happened. John Wilkes Booth gets shot.

Guns, weapons, military police, everybody that you know wanted to get John Wilkes Booth was there and he won't come out, and so they decide to light the cabin on fire light or at the barn, the tobacco barn. They go to light the tobacco barn on fire. David Harrel runs out. All the while John Wilkes Booth is calling him a coward. But what happens next is exactly what they didn't want to have happened. John Wilkes Booth gets shot.

One shot, one shot, and that's all it took and it was actually fired. Well, first off, interesting things. First Off, let's talk about the guys shot him. Yeah, you talk about you know how they talk about the stars are converging in the heavens, Well, you got two nut jobs that are essentially converging on one spot. Okay, Boston Corbett was the name of the trooper that shot him, and they were you know, these troops were under direct orders, you know, under penalty of court martial to not shoot John Wills booth. Now they had fired what they call fire the barn they had the thing had gotten set on fire and they were gonna try to flush him out. He was refusing to come out. And if you've ever you know, I love our area of the country. And if you particularly as you start to head up through the Piedmont, you know, heading northeast, and you're going through North Carolina and Virginia, and you see these old tobacco barns, the really old ones, I'm not talking about modern ones. And you can see those those beautiful pieces of wood that are seasoned on the outside and there's gaps in between the slats, and this would have been the case up there in Virginia as well. You can see what's going on inside that barn. And so Boston Corbett had positioned himself with what's referred to as a Colts dragoon, and it is a Colts dragoon, and dragoons were up. The name dragoon actually had to do with calvalry mounts. And these pistols were so big that you wouldn't you could wear it in your belt, but many of these guys kept these in holsters on their saddle, and someone would carry two and they're big, really big, and it's a muzzle. It's essentially it's like a muzzle loading. You can take the you can actually take the cylinder out and load it individually. And so Corbett has the opportunity to sit there and watch Booth. Okay, he's got this great shooting position that he's in and he pops off one round and it clips eclips Booth in his cervical spine. Of course, they have to evacuate him out. But back to Corbett, what makes him start on fire? Barns on fire? Yeah, and he knows it. And you know, I think Corbett, going back he is to say that he is a religious zealot is probably an insult to religious zelos. He at early he was born in London, and to think about it, is he from an early early on in his life he was exposed to mercury. Mercury fumes probably around you know, and that's that's where the term mad hatter comes from. Yeah, you know, because mercury was used, and so he had displayed all kinds of psychoses, you know, throughout his life. So much so, Dave, are you ready for this, Are you ready for this? As if this story couldn't get any more bizarre, Boston Corbett. Boston Corbett self castrated himself. He had taken his testicles off so that he could remain focused on God and God's work, and in his world, God's work was abolition, and that that was his primary focus in life. And so this, you know, interestingly enough, he struck a blow. I think, probably at least in his own mind, that this was going to be a great, big, fat, giant red exclamation point on everything, you know, and he had that one and he'd I don't think that he if he cared if he was going to swing from a sour apple tree or not. You know, they were going to tie a rope around his neck, and of course I think that some people probably viewed him as as a hero, and that's that's what he wanted. But yeah, you know, when when they dragged Booth out, he's still alive, and he lives, Dave, I think, I think for two to three hours, and the troopers are all gathered around him, and his last request before he dies is he asked to see his hands, and they hold his hands up to him because you know, we're talking about an insult that's like C four, C five, C six. First off, he's it's hard to believe that he survived that long with that kind of injury, because he's got a ball that's passing through there. Lead ball that's passing through there eclips the spinal cord. And you know, as you know, the closer you get to the brain with damage to the spinal cord, there's there's a less likelihood that you're going to survive this because you know, you're starting to get into all these functions that require these neurons be firing all of the time. But he survived for that, and I think like his last words were something along the line of useless, useless, and then he dies. But the question then becomes, how do we how do we validate this? And back then they didn't have DNA. Heck, they didn't even have fingerprints, Dave, I mean we you know, the ancient Chinese. Yeah, I mean, we leave, we were leaving fingerprints back then, but they were not being used for identification. Okay, yeah, that's not that's something that would not come along until I don't know, sir Henry developed it, you know in India, where it had the Henry system, and so it was not something that was recognized. So you had to have people visually, you know, identify and you're talking about a body that's unpreserved. And why is it important, Well, out of all the cases day from a medical legal perspective, and a homicide like this, you if you're in a political position, you have to assure the public that this is in fact John Wilkes Booth. He's dead. He is dead. We have we can validate that. And and so what winds up happening is that they wrap his body up and you know, throw him on the back of a horse. You know, we've seen you know, you've seen Western movies, you know where the bounty hunter will go out and you know, bring bring a body in, you know, to and I don't know there were probably other mediums of transportation for them at that point in time, but along the way. But initially they rode off with his body wrapped up in an army blanket and they had to get him somewhere, you know, under they were being directed by Stanton at this point in time, and people, I don't think that people really understand how powerful Stanton was. He was for these people. He was Lord Almighty on Earth. He controlled the military. He was the Secretary of War as they called it back then, and he, you know, he he laid down the law and that's what they wanted, and that's what was going to have to happen. So they wind up taking Booth's body to of all things, a gunboat, a gunboat that was you know, anchored out in the river, and took him out there. And they actually did an autopsy on John Wilkes Boo's body on the deck of this gunboat. And before they did that, they had several people that they knew that new boot, and they brought them on board and showed the face.

One shot, one shot, and that's all it took and it was actually fired. Well, first off, interesting things. First Off, let's talk about the guys shot him. Yeah, you talk about you know how they talk about the stars are converging in the heavens, Well, you got two nut jobs that are essentially converging on one spot. Okay, Boston Corbett was the name of the trooper that shot him, and they were you know, these troops were under direct orders, you know, under penalty of court martial to not shoot John Wills booth. Now they had fired what they call fire the barn they had the thing had gotten set on fire and they were gonna try to flush him out. He was refusing to come out. And if you've ever you know, I love our area of the country. And if you particularly as you start to head up through the Piedmont, you know, heading northeast, and you're going through North Carolina and Virginia, and you see these old tobacco barns, the really old ones, I'm not talking about modern ones. And you can see those those beautiful pieces of wood that are seasoned on the outside and there's gaps in between the slats, and this would have been the case up there in Virginia as well. You can see what's going on inside that barn. And so Boston Corbett had positioned himself with what's referred to as a Colts dragoon, and it is a Colts dragoon, and dragoons were up. The name dragoon actually had to do with calvalry mounts. And these pistols were so big that you wouldn't you could wear it in your belt, but many of these guys kept these in holsters on their saddle, and someone would carry two and they're big, really big, and it's a muzzle. It's essentially it's like a muzzle loading. You can take the you can actually take the cylinder out and load it individually. And so Corbett has the opportunity to sit there and watch Booth. Okay, he's got this great shooting position that he's in and he pops off one round and it clips eclips Booth in his cervical spine. Of course, they have to evacuate him out. But back to Corbett, what makes him start on fire? Barns on fire? Yeah, and he knows it. And you know, I think Corbett, going back he is to say that he is a religious zealot is probably an insult to religious zelos. He at early he was born in London, and to think about it, is he from an early early on in his life he was exposed to mercury. Mercury fumes probably around you know, and that's that's where the term mad hatter comes from. Yeah, you know, because mercury was used, and so he had displayed all kinds of psychoses, you know, throughout his life. So much so, Dave, are you ready for this, Are you ready for this? As if this story couldn't get any more bizarre, Boston Corbett. Boston Corbett self castrated himself. He had taken his testicles off so that he could remain focused on God and God's work, and in his world, God's work was abolition, and that that was his primary focus in life. And so this, you know, interestingly enough, he struck a blow. I think, probably at least in his own mind, that this was going to be a great, big, fat, giant red exclamation point on everything, you know, and he had that one and he'd I don't think that he if he cared if he was going to swing from a sour apple tree or not. You know, they were going to tie a rope around his neck, and of course I think that some people probably viewed him as as a hero, and that's that's what he wanted. But yeah, you know, when when they dragged Booth out, he's still alive, and he lives, Dave, I think, I think for two to three hours, and the troopers are all gathered around him, and his last request before he dies is he asked to see his hands, and they hold his hands up to him because you know, we're talking about an insult that's like C four, C five, C six. First off, he's it's hard to believe that he survived that long with that kind of injury, because he's got a ball that's passing through there. Lead ball that's passing through there eclips the spinal cord. And you know, as you know, the closer you get to the brain with damage to the spinal cord, there's there's a less likelihood that you're going to survive this because you know, you're starting to get into all these functions that require these neurons be firing all of the time. But he survived for that, and I think like his last words were something along the line of useless, useless, and then he dies. But the question then becomes, how do we how do we validate this? And back then they didn't have DNA. Heck, they didn't even have fingerprints, Dave, I mean we you know, the ancient Chinese. Yeah, I mean, we leave, we were leaving fingerprints back then, but they were not being used for identification. Okay, yeah, that's not that's something that would not come along until I don't know, sir Henry developed it, you know in India, where it had the Henry system, and so it was not something that was recognized. So you had to have people visually, you know, identify and you're talking about a body that's unpreserved. And why is it important, Well, out of all the cases day from a medical legal perspective, and a homicide like this, you if you're in a political position, you have to assure the public that this is in fact John Wilkes Booth. He's dead. He is dead. We have we can validate that. And and so what winds up happening is that they wrap his body up and you know, throw him on the back of a horse. You know, we've seen you know, you've seen Western movies, you know where the bounty hunter will go out and you know, bring bring a body in, you know, to and I don't know there were probably other mediums of transportation for them at that point in time, but along the way. But initially they rode off with his body wrapped up in an army blanket and they had to get him somewhere, you know, under they were being directed by Stanton at this point in time, and people, I don't think that people really understand how powerful Stanton was. He was for these people. He was Lord Almighty on Earth. He controlled the military. He was the Secretary of War as they called it back then, and he, you know, he he laid down the law and that's what they wanted, and that's what was going to have to happen. So they wind up taking Booth's body to of all things, a gunboat, a gunboat that was you know, anchored out in the river, and took him out there. And they actually did an autopsy on John Wilkes Boo's body on the deck of this gunboat. And before they did that, they had several people that they knew that new boot, and they brought them on board and showed the face.

They had to get that visual ide, didn't I mean.

They had to get that visual ide, didn't I mean.

They had to because it was essential. You had to have it because there would always be questions. I mean, think about all the you know, all of the kind of uh these comments that are made now about people tenfold hats all this, Yeah, it's a flat earth, those sorts of things, and so, you know, you had they understood this, I think they may have understood it better than we did, uh, you know. And and what was kind of interesting was that Booth for this particular time, they he actually had a. He actually had a tattoo which I found fascinating, and it was his initials. It was JB. You know. And of course they were able to identify his his body visa VI that. But you know, these surgeons are out there. Uh. And I've I've actually assisted with autopsies in an outdoor situation where we had multiple deaths. Uh. It's hot, you're dealing with flies, and most of the time you're gonna have a number of people standing around you while you're under these miserable conditions. I've actually done an autopsy in a barn before, believe it or not. And yeah, uh and again it was adjacent to a plane crash and we had to do these in space that we had available to us.