From Mahart.

From Mahart.

We're Innovation, Money and Power Collie in Silicon Valley, NBN.

We're Innovation, Money and Power Collie in Silicon Valley, NBN.

This is Bloomberg Technology with Caroline Hyde and Ed Ludlow.

This is Bloomberg Technology with Caroline Hyde and Ed Ludlow.

I'm Caroline Heiner Bloomberg's World headquarters in New York, and I'm Ed Ludlow in San Francisco.

I'm Caroline Heiner Bloomberg's World headquarters in New York, and I'm Ed Ludlow in San Francisco.

This is Bloomberg Technology coming up.

This is Bloomberg Technology coming up.

Of course, full coverage of Open Ai ahead, as investors seek to reinstate Oltman as CEO while the company tries to prevent an employee exodus.

Of course, full coverage of Open Ai ahead, as investors seek to reinstate Oltman as CEO while the company tries to prevent an employee exodus.

More ahead, and we'll preview what to expect from chip giant Nvidia, with AI accelerators expected to drive a sales surge for the company. We have all the details.

More ahead, and we'll preview what to expect from chip giant Nvidia, with AI accelerators expected to drive a sales surge for the company. We have all the details.

Plus Elomsqu's x IT sues Media Matters in a lawsuit of maliciously trying to drive away advertisers from the social media platform. I want to discuss that and so much more throughout this hour. Let's get right to it. The situation. It just continues to unfold, and it's chaotic, certainly has been for the last few days of boardroom coup investors pushing for Altman's return, Microsoft hiring Alman and to lead a new AI research team, and in a show supporting nearly all of open AI's employees, threatening to quit enjoying Microsoft unless Altman is reinstated and the board resigns look. An open Ai memo viewed by Bloomberg says that the company is in quote intense discussions to unify once again. Look whatever the outcome ends up being, Microsoft CEO Saturn Nadella emphasized the company fully backs Sam Alman and former open ai chair Greg Bockman. Just take a listen.

Plus Elomsqu's x IT sues Media Matters in a lawsuit of maliciously trying to drive away advertisers from the social media platform. I want to discuss that and so much more throughout this hour. Let's get right to it. The situation. It just continues to unfold, and it's chaotic, certainly has been for the last few days of boardroom coup investors pushing for Altman's return, Microsoft hiring Alman and to lead a new AI research team, and in a show supporting nearly all of open AI's employees, threatening to quit enjoying Microsoft unless Altman is reinstated and the board resigns look. An open Ai memo viewed by Bloomberg says that the company is in quote intense discussions to unify once again. Look whatever the outcome ends up being, Microsoft CEO Saturn Nadella emphasized the company fully backs Sam Alman and former open ai chair Greg Bockman. Just take a listen.

We are leading in this next generation of AI technology.

We are leading in this next generation of AI technology.

We continue to be committed to open ai, and we continue to be committed to Sam and Greg and the team irrespect your where they.

We continue to be committed to open ai, and we continue to be committed to Sam and Greg and the team irrespect your where they.

Are joining us now to break it all down, Bloomberg's Sharon Gafari and Sharon, you had up to the moment reporting on what's happening internally at those left at open ai, and really it feels as though we could even see a reinstatement or reunification.

Are joining us now to break it all down, Bloomberg's Sharon Gafari and Sharon, you had up to the moment reporting on what's happening internally at those left at open ai, and really it feels as though we could even see a reinstatement or reunification.

That's right.

That's right.

So there is still hope.

So there is still hope.

With buyo employees and management at the company that they will be able to reach some kind of agreement with management. But at around eight thirty last night, management sense a memo to staff saying that you know they're going to call it a night and in the morning, you today Tuesday, when people have a little more sleep, they'll pick back up for sure and.

With buyo employees and management at the company that they will be able to reach some kind of agreement with management. But at around eight thirty last night, management sense a memo to staff saying that you know they're going to call it a night and in the morning, you today Tuesday, when people have a little more sleep, they'll pick back up for sure and.

Grab aable supper water, because I know it was a late night for you just as much as it was for me. This memos come from Anna MacAndrew, who's basically this was, as I understood it, the global affairs chief. I think what the audience doesn't have a sense of is who is inside open AI actually doing any of this negotiating, at least on the open AI side.

Grab aable supper water, because I know it was a late night for you just as much as it was for me. This memos come from Anna MacAndrew, who's basically this was, as I understood it, the global affairs chief. I think what the audience doesn't have a sense of is who is inside open AI actually doing any of this negotiating, at least on the open AI side.

Yeah, so there's kind of a you know, a core management team. It's it's kind of like almost you know, government in exile, you could call it, right, It's sort of a group of people who are trying to act as a bridge right between this new board and the old guard, and of course their goal is to try to get Sam Altman, Greg Brockman, the old leaders of open AI back in place.

Yeah, so there's kind of a you know, a core management team. It's it's kind of like almost you know, government in exile, you could call it, right, It's sort of a group of people who are trying to act as a bridge right between this new board and the old guard, and of course their goal is to try to get Sam Altman, Greg Brockman, the old leaders of open AI back in place.

There's a difference between the reporting that we've done, which is basically Satya Nadela is behind the scenes being the peace broker bringing the investors to the table. The board wasn't talking for a while, are they now talking? And then there's what he said on camera, which is we back Sam either way. Do we have a real sense of what Sam's position is in all of this.

There's a difference between the reporting that we've done, which is basically Satya Nadela is behind the scenes being the peace broker bringing the investors to the table. The board wasn't talking for a while, are they now talking? And then there's what he said on camera, which is we back Sam either way. Do we have a real sense of what Sam's position is in all of this.

I mean, look, we know that Sam has said he's going to go to Microsoft right with his old colleague Greg Brockman and start an AI leader AI department there. However, at the end of the day, we also know that Sam's goal is ultimately you know, Opening is a company that he built, right, So if he's being offered an executive position to go lead again back there, it's hard to imagine him not taking that. And that's definitely what inmployees rallying for him right now.

I mean, look, we know that Sam has said he's going to go to Microsoft right with his old colleague Greg Brockman and start an AI leader AI department there. However, at the end of the day, we also know that Sam's goal is ultimately you know, Opening is a company that he built, right, So if he's being offered an executive position to go lead again back there, it's hard to imagine him not taking that. And that's definitely what inmployees rallying for him right now.

We're pushing for all.

We're pushing for all.

Right, bloom Mosteringforry, late night for you, late night for the team. Once again, Let's keep a conversation going on the story though, and we're excited to say. Josh Wolfe, co founder and managing partner of Lux Capital, joins us on the program. Josh, just as a scene setter, you are not an investor in open Ai, as I understand it, there's this tender that was due to happen in the background. Start by asking you would you invest in open ai right now if you could through a tender mechanism or otherwise.

Right, bloom Mosteringforry, late night for you, late night for the team. Once again, Let's keep a conversation going on the story though, and we're excited to say. Josh Wolfe, co founder and managing partner of Lux Capital, joins us on the program. Josh, just as a scene setter, you are not an investor in open Ai, as I understand it, there's this tender that was due to happen in the background. Start by asking you would you invest in open ai right now if you could through a tender mechanism or otherwise.

Right now, I would not just because of the instability. You could see that as an opportunity. I will say, I actually think that they should, once they get this as sorted out, immediately file to go public. I think that the demand and the outpouring and interest that you've seen and the support for SAM is just absolutely unprecedent in the tech company. It's almost like an unintended pre IPO roadshow to shill the overwhelming demand. So while we're not an investor in Opening Eye, I do think that if them and I was the ultimate board, which I think has to be a restructured, real governance board, I would file for IPO.

Right now, I would not just because of the instability. You could see that as an opportunity. I will say, I actually think that they should, once they get this as sorted out, immediately file to go public. I think that the demand and the outpouring and interest that you've seen and the support for SAM is just absolutely unprecedent in the tech company. It's almost like an unintended pre IPO roadshow to shill the overwhelming demand. So while we're not an investor in Opening Eye, I do think that if them and I was the ultimate board, which I think has to be a restructured, real governance board, I would file for IPO.

I'm digging in there, Josh, because that is a contrarian view. When ultimately it looks like the entire company is destroying itself. What would the governance have to look like if a company was to go public.

I'm digging in there, Josh, because that is a contrarian view. When ultimately it looks like the entire company is destroying itself. What would the governance have to look like if a company was to go public.

I think it's the kind of traditional governance that you want to see. You want to have checks and balances. There's a big difference between giving founders control, which has actually worked we know in tech from Google and Meta and many others, and then just having basic governance checks and balances that you can avoid these sort of capricious whims of just a handful of individuals around a table. You want the judgment to avoid, As you said, this sort of making devastating mistakes that can be very hard to recover from. And the really important thing here we're seeing is this wasn't because of absence of GPUs, This wasn't because of absence of compute, This wasn't because of algorithms. You know, the great irony is people are so worried about AI destroying all this stuff. It was human nature. It was a bunch of people in a room and the emotions that drove the sort of whimsical and capricious decision to say we're going to oust this beloved leader in tech.

I think it's the kind of traditional governance that you want to see. You want to have checks and balances. There's a big difference between giving founders control, which has actually worked we know in tech from Google and Meta and many others, and then just having basic governance checks and balances that you can avoid these sort of capricious whims of just a handful of individuals around a table. You want the judgment to avoid, As you said, this sort of making devastating mistakes that can be very hard to recover from. And the really important thing here we're seeing is this wasn't because of absence of GPUs, This wasn't because of absence of compute, This wasn't because of algorithms. You know, the great irony is people are so worried about AI destroying all this stuff. It was human nature. It was a bunch of people in a room and the emotions that drove the sort of whimsical and capricious decision to say we're going to oust this beloved leader in tech.

We just showed a graphic with some of your portfolio companies. You guys are investing in AI, either AI native IAI adjacent companies. What does this do for the competitive landscape? Right there are dozens of companies building large language models. We all recognize that open AI was the sort of technological leader and in some sense the commercial leader. What opportunity does this present to those you're backing.

We just showed a graphic with some of your portfolio companies. You guys are investing in AI, either AI native IAI adjacent companies. What does this do for the competitive landscape? Right there are dozens of companies building large language models. We all recognize that open AI was the sort of technological leader and in some sense the commercial leader. What opportunity does this present to those you're backing.

Well, start generally and just remember that the one thing that open ai had was this pole position, and I believe that they can recover it. But they had predictability, they had stability, they had reliability, and all of that gives confidence, and confidence gives trust, and trust is the ultimate currency. The reason that I watch Bloomberg, the reason that people watch you every day is because they trust you. People partner with a company because they trusted and this weekend trust blew up. So it could take ten years to build a reputation, ten to build trust, and ten seconds to lose it. So a week prior, you had all of these startups that basically with the open Aide demo day thought all right, they just killed our latest product or our latest feature. Now they have a second chance. Because any company that's working with a hospital system, or a government group or a major corporation, all those entities, all those customers want to know that they're working with someone who is reliable and predictable and stable. Now you look at some of our companies hugging face on the open source. We are huge believers in open source. We think that this is probably like exhibit A of why you want open source systems as opposed to closed siloed concentrated systems. If you care truly about humanity, if you care about AI really getting out into the far reaches of the industry, you want open systems. So, whether it's hugging face together, doing distributed compute Mosaic mL, which we sold to Data Bricks, Runway mL, they're all the fastest growing and well positioned companies in these spaces because they are very heavily geared towards open.

Well, start generally and just remember that the one thing that open ai had was this pole position, and I believe that they can recover it. But they had predictability, they had stability, they had reliability, and all of that gives confidence, and confidence gives trust, and trust is the ultimate currency. The reason that I watch Bloomberg, the reason that people watch you every day is because they trust you. People partner with a company because they trusted and this weekend trust blew up. So it could take ten years to build a reputation, ten to build trust, and ten seconds to lose it. So a week prior, you had all of these startups that basically with the open Aide demo day thought all right, they just killed our latest product or our latest feature. Now they have a second chance. Because any company that's working with a hospital system, or a government group or a major corporation, all those entities, all those customers want to know that they're working with someone who is reliable and predictable and stable. Now you look at some of our companies hugging face on the open source. We are huge believers in open source. We think that this is probably like exhibit A of why you want open source systems as opposed to closed siloed concentrated systems. If you care truly about humanity, if you care about AI really getting out into the far reaches of the industry, you want open systems. So, whether it's hugging face together, doing distributed compute Mosaic mL, which we sold to Data Bricks, Runway mL, they're all the fastest growing and well positioned companies in these spaces because they are very heavily geared towards open.

Source, marked to being safe, and to ultimately ensuring that in some way that aligns if not. In open AI's case, came first above profitability, and I'm interested in that tension that we continue to see around artificial intelligence and ultimately whether or not we can see absolutely monumental valuations and profitability at the same time as well ethical use and deployment.

Source, marked to being safe, and to ultimately ensuring that in some way that aligns if not. In open AI's case, came first above profitability, and I'm interested in that tension that we continue to see around artificial intelligence and ultimately whether or not we can see absolutely monumental valuations and profitability at the same time as well ethical use and deployment.

I do think so.

I do think so.

I think that the ethics and the safety are just basic good judgment. You know what we saw here in this board coup and all this craziness was just bad judgment. Now you just want good people making good decisions. And whenever I hear anybody say, oh, I'm just trying to do this to save the world, that actually really gets my spidey sense going I actually find it quite cynical.

I think that the ethics and the safety are just basic good judgment. You know what we saw here in this board coup and all this craziness was just bad judgment. Now you just want good people making good decisions. And whenever I hear anybody say, oh, I'm just trying to do this to save the world, that actually really gets my spidey sense going I actually find it quite cynical.

I don't trust that.

I don't trust that.

But when you have somebody that's.

But when you have somebody that's.

Just like I want to build this thing. I want to solve problems. I want to get every student a teacher in a tutor. I want to help reduce hospital bills and get people better differential diagnoses. I want to help discover new drugs. Those are the things that you really want to be backing. Most of those people are thinking what could go wrong. I always say that failure from a failure to imagine failure, and if you are adequately thinking about the downsides, what can go wrong?

Just like I want to build this thing. I want to solve problems. I want to get every student a teacher in a tutor. I want to help reduce hospital bills and get people better differential diagnoses. I want to help discover new drugs. Those are the things that you really want to be backing. Most of those people are thinking what could go wrong. I always say that failure from a failure to imagine failure, and if you are adequately thinking about the downsides, what can go wrong?

Without just a pure.

Without just a pure.

Techno optimist view, we're going full speed of had without looking to the sides and looking through this year rear view mirrors. You don't have to have regulation, you don't have to have intense scrutiny. It should just be self reflection and good leadership to anticipate the failure points so as to avoid them. What happened this weekend with open AI and what's still happening was a failure of imagination. People did not imagine that this was possible, that so much risk could be concentrated in just a handful of people's hands. To make a decision on what the future would be. There's one big winter here. There's one big winter gear, which, as you noted just in the prior comms, is Microsoft. Microsoft.

Techno optimist view, we're going full speed of had without looking to the sides and looking through this year rear view mirrors. You don't have to have regulation, you don't have to have intense scrutiny. It should just be self reflection and good leadership to anticipate the failure points so as to avoid them. What happened this weekend with open AI and what's still happening was a failure of imagination. People did not imagine that this was possible, that so much risk could be concentrated in just a handful of people's hands. To make a decision on what the future would be. There's one big winter here. There's one big winter gear, which, as you noted just in the prior comms, is Microsoft. Microsoft.

I mean people are forgetting this ten.

I mean people are forgetting this ten.

Really, Josh really, because ultimately they now have regulatory exposure, they now have a cost exposure. They also don't have that arm's length protection of seeing hallucination built on their own brand type.

Really, Josh really, because ultimately they now have regulatory exposure, they now have a cost exposure. They also don't have that arm's length protection of seeing hallucination built on their own brand type.

I will trade that if I was a Microsoft shareholder or a board member or employee there, I would trade that every time they put ten billion dollars of committed capital, how much actually has gone in whatnot? And what did they get in marketcap value? A trillion dollars. That is one of the best trades in technology history. Ten billion dollars to create a trillion dollars of market value. So I think that they can afford, whether it's one hundred million dollars of regulatory costs, whether it's Bradsmith going and trying to get regulatory capture, which I don't approve of. I think it's wrong for this industry. I think that it's really disingenuous in its attempt. But Microsoft has won ten billion dollars to yield. The trillion dollars of market value is a coup of epic proportions.

I will trade that if I was a Microsoft shareholder or a board member or employee there, I would trade that every time they put ten billion dollars of committed capital, how much actually has gone in whatnot? And what did they get in marketcap value? A trillion dollars. That is one of the best trades in technology history. Ten billion dollars to create a trillion dollars of market value. So I think that they can afford, whether it's one hundred million dollars of regulatory costs, whether it's Bradsmith going and trying to get regulatory capture, which I don't approve of. I think it's wrong for this industry. I think that it's really disingenuous in its attempt. But Microsoft has won ten billion dollars to yield. The trillion dollars of market value is a coup of epic proportions.

Boy, are we going to talk about that a little bit more perfect? Start to the show, Josh Warfe, We thank you so much, co found a managing partner of Lux Capital, and of course an investor in hugging face. Just to warn you a little bit later, of course, you have Margaret Mitchell joining us on the show. She's hugging face, chief ethics scientist, so a little bit more there on the ethics side of the equation. Meanwhile, they're coming up. We push ahead to the big earnings after the bell calls. We're talking AI. Of course, we're talking in videos results as a bloom make technology.

Boy, are we going to talk about that a little bit more perfect? Start to the show, Josh Warfe, We thank you so much, co found a managing partner of Lux Capital, and of course an investor in hugging face. Just to warn you a little bit later, of course, you have Margaret Mitchell joining us on the show. She's hugging face, chief ethics scientist, so a little bit more there on the ethics side of the equation. Meanwhile, they're coming up. We push ahead to the big earnings after the bell calls. We're talking AI. Of course, we're talking in videos results as a bloom make technology.

In Video's earnings are the big one coming after the bell. Here's what to watch for. Analyst expects sales to jump one and seventy one percent from a year ago, driven by demand for its AI accelerators. Profit also expected to jump. Wall Street also sees a leap in profit three dollars thirty six cents of earnings per share, and Video already leads the market with its h one hundred GPU used to train artificial intelligence models. Investors will want an update on the GH two hundred or Great Shopper super chip, the next gen accelerator that started shipping last quarter. An improved version with HMB three E memory supposed to go out in the second quarter of next year. Those are the numbers. Let's get the analysis with Bloomberg Intelligence and this Kunjan Sabani high bar going into earnings, what do you look for.

In Video's earnings are the big one coming after the bell. Here's what to watch for. Analyst expects sales to jump one and seventy one percent from a year ago, driven by demand for its AI accelerators. Profit also expected to jump. Wall Street also sees a leap in profit three dollars thirty six cents of earnings per share, and Video already leads the market with its h one hundred GPU used to train artificial intelligence models. Investors will want an update on the GH two hundred or Great Shopper super chip, the next gen accelerator that started shipping last quarter. An improved version with HMB three E memory supposed to go out in the second quarter of next year. Those are the numbers. Let's get the analysis with Bloomberg Intelligence and this Kunjan Sabani high bar going into earnings, what do you look for.

A significantly higher beaten Race. I mean, look, the expectations have been climbing up and up. Everyone expect them to beaten race. But it's going to come down to how much more can they keep repeating the performance that is in the last two quarters.

A significantly higher beaten Race. I mean, look, the expectations have been climbing up and up. Everyone expect them to beaten race. But it's going to come down to how much more can they keep repeating the performance that is in the last two quarters.

A part of the repeat performance is that their supply constraint, right, So wherever you look those demand for AI accelerators, how does that factor into your model.

A part of the repeat performance is that their supply constraint, right, So wherever you look those demand for AI accelerators, how does that factor into your model.

I think they're going to definitely ship a lot more H one hundreds. Based on our estimates, the first half H one hundred contribution would be thirty to forty percent of the total GPU volumes server GPU volumes. We expect that to significantly increase in the second half because with each H one hundred they get a lot more ASP fascinating Counji.

I think they're going to definitely ship a lot more H one hundreds. Based on our estimates, the first half H one hundred contribution would be thirty to forty percent of the total GPU volumes server GPU volumes. We expect that to significantly increase in the second half because with each H one hundred they get a lot more ASP fascinating Counji.

We thank you so much you'll be glued to the screens after the bell Conjensibani bluemeg Intelligence. We appreciate it joining us now to think more broadly about AI and indeed where we're currently trading across the board for the nasdac Heni fishes with us senior research analyst of Technology software at Clearbridge and really do deep dive insights into certain names out there that have been powered and benefiting from artificial intelligence. Have we seen valuations exceed ultimately the growth trajectory the monetization options here?

We thank you so much you'll be glued to the screens after the bell Conjensibani bluemeg Intelligence. We appreciate it joining us now to think more broadly about AI and indeed where we're currently trading across the board for the nasdac Heni fishes with us senior research analyst of Technology software at Clearbridge and really do deep dive insights into certain names out there that have been powered and benefiting from artificial intelligence. Have we seen valuations exceed ultimately the growth trajectory the monetization options here?

It's good to be here. Thank you care lyon think you had no, I don't think so. I think we've been playing a little bit of push and pull between valuations and fundamentals coming through. But fundamentals are only just starting to come through. AI monetization is just in the earliest stages. We're just on the cusp of seeing what these companies will garner from their GENAI offerings.

It's good to be here. Thank you care lyon think you had no, I don't think so. I think we've been playing a little bit of push and pull between valuations and fundamentals coming through. But fundamentals are only just starting to come through. AI monetization is just in the earliest stages. We're just on the cusp of seeing what these companies will garner from their GENAI offerings.

What has been so disruptive, largely to sleep of journalists and those working in open AI, but also just the ecosystem more broadly, has been this sort of self destruction path that open air has been on. More generally now this is a private company, not one that you'll be doing deep dive research on too much. But what they have done has created fierce competition and exuberance ever since the launch of originally CHATCHYPT back in November of last year. Is it more competitive now the space? Do you think the.

What has been so disruptive, largely to sleep of journalists and those working in open AI, but also just the ecosystem more broadly, has been this sort of self destruction path that open air has been on. More generally now this is a private company, not one that you'll be doing deep dive research on too much. But what they have done has created fierce competition and exuberance ever since the launch of originally CHATCHYPT back in November of last year. Is it more competitive now the space? Do you think the.

Space is more competitive? And it will become increasingly competitive. But the opportunity set continues to rise with each week, each month, meaning companies are figuring out more and more ways to utilize AI. Vendors are figuring out more and more applications to which to apply it. And I think we're we're just in the infancy of all that. So yes, it will become more competitive.

Space is more competitive? And it will become increasingly competitive. But the opportunity set continues to rise with each week, each month, meaning companies are figuring out more and more ways to utilize AI. Vendors are figuring out more and more applications to which to apply it. And I think we're we're just in the infancy of all that. So yes, it will become more competitive.

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

Has it been a worry for you for the companies that you do monitor or those that more broadly that your company holds, that are based upon the large language models of open ai?

Has it been a worry for you for the companies that you do monitor or those that more broadly that your company holds, that are based upon the large language models of open ai?

Do you think I'm sorry with your painting?

Do you think I'm sorry with your painting?

Well, ultimately, many companies have been building around the architecture that open ai has built. Oh yeah, and now everyone suddenly is worrying about that architecture, about its resiliency.

Well, ultimately, many companies have been building around the architecture that open ai has built. Oh yeah, and now everyone suddenly is worrying about that architecture, about its resiliency.

Sure, is that a concern? Well, none of the situation at open ai has introduced some level of near trum uncertainty. But Microsoft just gave every open Ai employee big bear hug. Sam Altman has apparently joined Microsoft in a research fashion. I think it's too soon to call this a major issue. I think Microsoft has had exclusive access to the technology, So I think what Microsoft needs to do is actually just to draw this situation to some form of conclusion. Either they can help stabilize open Ai. They could encourage sam Altman to go back to a I to open AI, or they could actually take on the majority of the employee base of open Ai or the employees which they like, which they certainly can do. So I think I think we're going to see conclusion before not too long, and then we can look forward. Other companies are certainly competing. I'm not sure that this gives them a major leg up, yet there seems to be some loyalty on the part of that team. They would like to stay together if they can. Microsoft just clearly gave signals that they're making that possible.

Sure, is that a concern? Well, none of the situation at open ai has introduced some level of near trum uncertainty. But Microsoft just gave every open Ai employee big bear hug. Sam Altman has apparently joined Microsoft in a research fashion. I think it's too soon to call this a major issue. I think Microsoft has had exclusive access to the technology, So I think what Microsoft needs to do is actually just to draw this situation to some form of conclusion. Either they can help stabilize open Ai. They could encourage sam Altman to go back to a I to open AI, or they could actually take on the majority of the employee base of open Ai or the employees which they like, which they certainly can do. So I think I think we're going to see conclusion before not too long, and then we can look forward. Other companies are certainly competing. I'm not sure that this gives them a major leg up, yet there seems to be some loyalty on the part of that team. They would like to stay together if they can. Microsoft just clearly gave signals that they're making that possible.

We always have having you on because you like stocks like Microsoft, Hype Scalers, CRM, Snow, and Oracle, to name, but a few really appreciate you coming on this holiday shorten week, It's called Hillary Fish of Clearbridge time now for talking tech. First up crypto exchange platform Craken is in some hot water with the USSCC, the Securities in Exchange Commission. Now, the SEC is saying Cracken com mingled client assets with its own, even going as far as to pay expenses from bank accounts that held customer cat. Craghan said it disagreed with the SEC cleans and planned to vigorously defend its position. Meanwhile, President Biden and Vice President Kamala Harris are officially on threads. White House officials also open accounts for the First Lady and second and Gentlemen, and the move, of course, comes just days after the White House condemned enol Musk's endorsement of anti Semitic posts on x Fulling known as Twitter plus. The US Senate Judiciary Committee is calling a number of social media executors to testify at a Decembiner sixth hearing regarding online child sexual exploitation. Those subpoenad include Jason Citron of Discord Snaps, Evan Spiegel, an X CEO, Ninda Yakarina at more on X.

We always have having you on because you like stocks like Microsoft, Hype Scalers, CRM, Snow, and Oracle, to name, but a few really appreciate you coming on this holiday shorten week, It's called Hillary Fish of Clearbridge time now for talking tech. First up crypto exchange platform Craken is in some hot water with the USSCC, the Securities in Exchange Commission. Now, the SEC is saying Cracken com mingled client assets with its own, even going as far as to pay expenses from bank accounts that held customer cat. Craghan said it disagreed with the SEC cleans and planned to vigorously defend its position. Meanwhile, President Biden and Vice President Kamala Harris are officially on threads. White House officials also open accounts for the First Lady and second and Gentlemen, and the move, of course, comes just days after the White House condemned enol Musk's endorsement of anti Semitic posts on x Fulling known as Twitter plus. The US Senate Judiciary Committee is calling a number of social media executors to testify at a Decembiner sixth hearing regarding online child sexual exploitation. Those subpoenad include Jason Citron of Discord Snaps, Evan Spiegel, an X CEO, Ninda Yakarina at more on X.

Yeah More on X, the platform formerly known as Twitter is suing watchdog group Media Matters, claiming it quote maliciously drove advertisers away from the social media platform. Let's bring in Bloomberg's ashaccounts. Who's been all across this. Musk has been very vocal on X. Yakarino has been quite vocal on X. What is it that they're accusing Media Matters of.

Yeah More on X, the platform formerly known as Twitter is suing watchdog group Media Matters, claiming it quote maliciously drove advertisers away from the social media platform. Let's bring in Bloomberg's ashaccounts. Who's been all across this. Musk has been very vocal on X. Yakarino has been quite vocal on X. What is it that they're accusing Media Matters of.

Well, they're essentially saying that Media Matters mischaracterize some of the content on the platform.

Well, they're essentially saying that Media Matters mischaracterize some of the content on the platform.

Right, This is in a report a week ago exactly, a Matters report.

Right, This is in a report a week ago exactly, a Matters report.

Yes, the Media Matters report came out and basically said they found ads from huge advertisers like IBM and Apple next to pro nazi content. And so what Yakarino and Musk and the Right Association X are arguing is that that's not the case. It was only a small number of people that saw it that Media Matters sort of manipulated their feed to do that. So they have all these sorts of arguments against why they don't think that's exactly accurate.

Yes, the Media Matters report came out and basically said they found ads from huge advertisers like IBM and Apple next to pro nazi content. And so what Yakarino and Musk and the Right Association X are arguing is that that's not the case. It was only a small number of people that saw it that Media Matters sort of manipulated their feed to do that. So they have all these sorts of arguments against why they don't think that's exactly accurate.

Meanwhile, Media Matters says they stand by their reporting and ultimately think that this is well a mistrodden path for them to be being sued right now.

Meanwhile, Media Matters says they stand by their reporting and ultimately think that this is well a mistrodden path for them to be being sued right now.

Yeah, Medium Matters is saying that, look, we see the ads. We looked at them, we saw the ads next to pronati content. And unfortunately this is not something that is new, right. Advertisers have seen this over the past year. This has been an ongoing saga of advertisers finding their ads next to content that they don't like, and so media managers saying, look, we've done the research, we saw the ads, here's examples of it, and so they stand by what they put.

Yeah, Medium Matters is saying that, look, we see the ads. We looked at them, we saw the ads next to pronati content. And unfortunately this is not something that is new, right. Advertisers have seen this over the past year. This has been an ongoing saga of advertisers finding their ads next to content that they don't like, and so media managers saying, look, we've done the research, we saw the ads, here's examples of it, and so they stand by what they put.

At the heart of this is the pervasiveness of fake content on the platform and the exposure of the advertisers. You and I reported that Yakarino has acknowledged broadly advertiser flight. What has she said about addressing the issue at heart, which is the pervasiveness of content on that platform.

At the heart of this is the pervasiveness of fake content on the platform and the exposure of the advertisers. You and I reported that Yakarino has acknowledged broadly advertiser flight. What has she said about addressing the issue at heart, which is the pervasiveness of content on that platform.

I mean, again, they sort of continue to go back to their part. They said they've taken a number of steps to combat anti submitic content on the platform. They stand by some of the policies that they have, but it's just hard because they continue to say that, but then advertisers are continuing to see their ads next to this content, and agency executives at this point are pretty fed up with a lot of the stuff that they're seeing, and so they've consistently pointed to their policies into the actions that they're taking. But from the advertiser perspective, it doesn't seem to be making a difference, which is why we're seeing Apple and IBM and Comcast and all these companies pull their ads off the platform or at least suspend temporarily.

I mean, again, they sort of continue to go back to their part. They said they've taken a number of steps to combat anti submitic content on the platform. They stand by some of the policies that they have, but it's just hard because they continue to say that, but then advertisers are continuing to see their ads next to this content, and agency executives at this point are pretty fed up with a lot of the stuff that they're seeing, and so they've consistently pointed to their policies into the actions that they're taking. But from the advertiser perspective, it doesn't seem to be making a difference, which is why we're seeing Apple and IBM and Comcast and all these companies pull their ads off the platform or at least suspend temporarily.

And she counts busier is always We thank you so much for the date dive, the.

And she counts busier is always We thank you so much for the date dive, the.

Welcome back to Bloomberg Technology. I'm Ed Loveler in San Francisco.

Welcome back to Bloomberg Technology. I'm Ed Loveler in San Francisco.

I'm Caroline Heid in New York. We had some breaking news earlier this hour, the Wall Street Journal reporting that the CEO of Binance and it is founder Ceazy, has a step down and plead guilty to violating US anti money laundering requirements. Now, the cryptocurrency exchange will also pay some four point three billion dollars in fines, but no mention Oni bus I is here with the breakdown. This is in of course, the DOJ's investigation, not the SEC. But what caught your attention from this line from the Wall Street Channel.

I'm Caroline Heid in New York. We had some breaking news earlier this hour, the Wall Street Journal reporting that the CEO of Binance and it is founder Ceazy, has a step down and plead guilty to violating US anti money laundering requirements. Now, the cryptocurrency exchange will also pay some four point three billion dollars in fines, but no mention Oni bus I is here with the breakdown. This is in of course, the DOJ's investigation, not the SEC. But what caught your attention from this line from the Wall Street Channel.

Well, we've already reported that the fines could be more than four billion dollars. We now know that it will be four point three billion dollars, and it does close a matter that has been going on for many, many years. This investigation from the Justice Department, with involvement also from the Treasury Department and the Commodity's Futures Training Commission, the CFTC. So this does close that page for Finance and Chong Panjao. He's not only stepping down to CEO. You have to remember also, according to the Wall Street Journal, he can retain his majority ownership of Finance, and the settlement would allow them to keep operating. Remember this is the world's largest crypto exchange we're talking about, so to kind of save the company is a big deal. In light of this probe and settlement, he is expected, according to the Journal, to appear in a federal court on Tuesday afternoon and enter his guilty plead. I think what's interesting here too is the Journal does draw parallel to a prior case to bitmex and in that instance, Arthur Hayes had plied guilty to violating anti money laundering laws and was sentenced to two years of probation and avoided jail time. So the sentencing of course will come later, but he is expected to plead guilty today in court.

Well, we've already reported that the fines could be more than four billion dollars. We now know that it will be four point three billion dollars, and it does close a matter that has been going on for many, many years. This investigation from the Justice Department, with involvement also from the Treasury Department and the Commodity's Futures Training Commission, the CFTC. So this does close that page for Finance and Chong Panjao. He's not only stepping down to CEO. You have to remember also, according to the Wall Street Journal, he can retain his majority ownership of Finance, and the settlement would allow them to keep operating. Remember this is the world's largest crypto exchange we're talking about, so to kind of save the company is a big deal. In light of this probe and settlement, he is expected, according to the Journal, to appear in a federal court on Tuesday afternoon and enter his guilty plead. I think what's interesting here too is the Journal does draw parallel to a prior case to bitmex and in that instance, Arthur Hayes had plied guilty to violating anti money laundering laws and was sentenced to two years of probation and avoided jail time. So the sentencing of course will come later, but he is expected to plead guilty today in court.

So notably, as you say, Hayes didn't have any jail time. And we wonder what, indeed what would happen in terms of the guilty plea coming from cz But is this enough to then appease the SEC as well? What would be the potential offering to them to be able to settle the ongoing investigation.

So notably, as you say, Hayes didn't have any jail time. And we wonder what, indeed what would happen in terms of the guilty plea coming from cz But is this enough to then appease the SEC as well? What would be the potential offering to them to be able to settle the ongoing investigation.

These are interesting questions because we know that the SEC, among all regulatory bodies, the DJ has come down quite hard on the industry, but the SEC, the sheer scale of how they've been approaching the industry has been massive, and you just saw recently their approach to Kraken, for example, And they're concerned with many crypto exchanges and their ability to list tokens or what the SEC believes are secure. And so for Binance to keep operating, it draws a lot of questions not only just about the SEC's approach to Binance itself, but also remember what is fixed here?

These are interesting questions because we know that the SEC, among all regulatory bodies, the DJ has come down quite hard on the industry, but the SEC, the sheer scale of how they've been approaching the industry has been massive, and you just saw recently their approach to Kraken, for example, And they're concerned with many crypto exchanges and their ability to list tokens or what the SEC believes are secure. And so for Binance to keep operating, it draws a lot of questions not only just about the SEC's approach to Binance itself, but also remember what is fixed here?

If he's pled guilty to.

If he's pled guilty to.

Violating anti money laundering laws in the United States, what is being fixed at a place like Binance to be able to ensure that this doesn't happen in the future, I think is another critical question as we think about the future of these crypto exchanges.

Violating anti money laundering laws in the United States, what is being fixed at a place like Binance to be able to ensure that this doesn't happen in the future, I think is another critical question as we think about the future of these crypto exchanges.

And indeed the future of retaining talent at that company, which quite a few executives have been departing of late Chanali Bassec always all across these breaking news headlines. You can catch Nali along with Calee lines coming up on Bloomberg Crypto one pm New York time. They'll be speaking with the SEC Commissioner has to piss. Perfect time for that conversation ed right.

And indeed the future of retaining talent at that company, which quite a few executives have been departing of late Chanali Bassec always all across these breaking news headlines. You can catch Nali along with Calee lines coming up on Bloomberg Crypto one pm New York time. They'll be speaking with the SEC Commissioner has to piss. Perfect time for that conversation ed right.

The other top story that we're trying to keep on top of, open ai investors are still trying to return co founder Sam Outman to a leadership role at the company. At the same time, open ai staff are threatening mass mutiny, saying they'll follow Outman to Microsoft unless the board resigns. Microsoft c Satianadella spoke with bloombergs Emily Chang last night. He says he would not suppose Altman's return to open Ai. Take a listen.

The other top story that we're trying to keep on top of, open ai investors are still trying to return co founder Sam Outman to a leadership role at the company. At the same time, open ai staff are threatening mass mutiny, saying they'll follow Outman to Microsoft unless the board resigns. Microsoft c Satianadella spoke with bloombergs Emily Chang last night. He says he would not suppose Altman's return to open Ai. Take a listen.

We are leading in this next generation of AI technology.

We are leading in this next generation of AI technology.

We continue to be committed to open ai, and we continue to be committed to Sam and Greg and the team in respect to where they are and you know, I think about Sam has chosen multiple times now to work with us, and that's fantastic to see. And I think the real thing is that the capability that Microsoft has across the tech stack is what attracts great people like Sam, you know, and people like Sam and you know, innovators like Sam when it comes to ai to come to us, and we are thrilled about it.

We continue to be committed to open ai, and we continue to be committed to Sam and Greg and the team in respect to where they are and you know, I think about Sam has chosen multiple times now to work with us, and that's fantastic to see. And I think the real thing is that the capability that Microsoft has across the tech stack is what attracts great people like Sam, you know, and people like Sam and you know, innovators like Sam when it comes to ai to come to us, and we are thrilled about it.

You incredibly quickly hired Sam as well as Greg. We are hearing that Sam wants to return. Investors want him to return to open ai. How would you feel about that?

You incredibly quickly hired Sam as well as Greg. We are hearing that Sam wants to return. Investors want him to return to open ai. How would you feel about that?

Yeah, as I said, we really want to partner with open ai, and we want to partner with Sam. And so in respect to where Sam is, he's working with Microsoft and that is the case on Friday, and that will be. That's the case today and we will I absolutely believe that will be the case tomorrow.

Yeah, as I said, we really want to partner with open ai, and we want to partner with Sam. And so in respect to where Sam is, he's working with Microsoft and that is the case on Friday, and that will be. That's the case today and we will I absolutely believe that will be the case tomorrow.

Now we understand that to support a return of Sam mom and two open Ai, Microsoft wants some changes to the board to governance to its overall contract with open Ai, so something like this never happens again. What specifically are you looking for, for example, would you want to board see and if not, what else?

Now we understand that to support a return of Sam mom and two open Ai, Microsoft wants some changes to the board to governance to its overall contract with open Ai, so something like this never happens again. What specifically are you looking for, for example, would you want to board see and if not, what else?

Yeah?

Yeah?

I mean I think we definitely will want some governance changes, so you know, you know, surprises are bad and we just want to make sure that things are.

I mean I think we definitely will want some governance changes, so you know, you know, surprises are bad and we just want to make sure that things are.

Done in a way that will allow us to continue to partner. Well, that's about it, right.

Done in a way that will allow us to continue to partner. Well, that's about it, right.

You know, this idea that somehow, you know, suddenly changes happen without being you know, in the loop is not good, and we will definitely ensure that some of the changes that are needed to happen and we continue to be able to go along the partnership with open Ai.

You know, this idea that somehow, you know, suddenly changes happen without being you know, in the loop is not good, and we will definitely ensure that some of the changes that are needed to happen and we continue to be able to go along the partnership with open Ai.

Microsoft CEO Sati under the Nadella there along with our own Emily chang Us keep digging on how all of this impacts Microsoft and indeed well broadly AI in general. But Austin Carr has a really interesting take our own Brimberg reporter. Austin the initial read was Satio wins lemonade out of lemons. He manages to do this deal very quickly and turn around the situation. But you're digging perhaps shows that longer term, this is not the best case scenario to have Microsoft bringing open Ai in house.

Microsoft CEO Sati under the Nadella there along with our own Emily chang Us keep digging on how all of this impacts Microsoft and indeed well broadly AI in general. But Austin Carr has a really interesting take our own Brimberg reporter. Austin the initial read was Satio wins lemonade out of lemons. He manages to do this deal very quickly and turn around the situation. But you're digging perhaps shows that longer term, this is not the best case scenario to have Microsoft bringing open Ai in house.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I think right at the beginning there was that sort of the idea that Microsoft was the big winner and all of that and I think the reality is a bit more complicated. They've invested ten to thirteen billion dollars in open Ai. If that suddenly falls apart, that doesn't look good for Microsoft. It doesn't look good that they invested so much money given so much governance hurdles that the startup clearly had. The second thing is just hiring Sam Oltman. You heard how many times Satya said Sam and that inner you maybe about a dozen, if not more. This was a lot about damage control. How can we keep Sam Altman within the Microsoft family? And that was the first thing that they did. Hire Sam to read this new advanced research group. But that doesn't come without complications. It's going to be tremendously expensive if you have these one hundreds of employees exiting open Ai to try to rebuild something similar from scratch. Inside Microsoft, you have IP issues, and then you all have a lot of bureaucratic issues within Microsoft, which has its own AI and research teams that are working on other things. So I think it's really too early to say that Microsoft is the clear winner in all this. Sachi, I think doing a really excellent job at damage control in these last seventy two hours, all Right, bloom.

I think right at the beginning there was that sort of the idea that Microsoft was the big winner and all of that and I think the reality is a bit more complicated. They've invested ten to thirteen billion dollars in open Ai. If that suddenly falls apart, that doesn't look good for Microsoft. It doesn't look good that they invested so much money given so much governance hurdles that the startup clearly had. The second thing is just hiring Sam Oltman. You heard how many times Satya said Sam and that inner you maybe about a dozen, if not more. This was a lot about damage control. How can we keep Sam Altman within the Microsoft family? And that was the first thing that they did. Hire Sam to read this new advanced research group. But that doesn't come without complications. It's going to be tremendously expensive if you have these one hundreds of employees exiting open Ai to try to rebuild something similar from scratch. Inside Microsoft, you have IP issues, and then you all have a lot of bureaucratic issues within Microsoft, which has its own AI and research teams that are working on other things. So I think it's really too early to say that Microsoft is the clear winner in all this. Sachi, I think doing a really excellent job at damage control in these last seventy two hours, all Right, bloom.

Bezos Sinkhar who's been writing in The Tech Daily. You should subscribe to the Tech Daily. It's a fantastic summary and smart take on the news of the day in the news of the hour. Let's send to another actual player in the field of artsficial intelligence. Hugging Face dive more into the implications for the AI industry at large with Delcense, to be joined by Hugging Faces chief ethics scientists Margaret Mitchell and Margaret I know that you have relationships with many that work at open AI. They are your industry peers that you have direct relationships. I'd just like to first invite you to give your overall thoughts of what is happening at open ai HQ about three miles from where I'm sitting right.

Bezos Sinkhar who's been writing in The Tech Daily. You should subscribe to the Tech Daily. It's a fantastic summary and smart take on the news of the day in the news of the hour. Let's send to another actual player in the field of artsficial intelligence. Hugging Face dive more into the implications for the AI industry at large with Delcense, to be joined by Hugging Faces chief ethics scientists Margaret Mitchell and Margaret I know that you have relationships with many that work at open AI. They are your industry peers that you have direct relationships. I'd just like to first invite you to give your overall thoughts of what is happening at open ai HQ about three miles from where I'm sitting right.

Yeah, So I think I have a sort of different perspective than a lot of people, although your recent interviews are sort of hitting on them where I don't know that it's the case that the board has failed broadly. I do think they've failed the employees because of this creation of shock and trauma, and what we're seeing is a response based on that. Right when you have the rug pulled out from you, you just want to get the rug back. So that is happening, and that can be arguably be a failure of the board. But I think broadly the board is sticking to some of its original goals, which is to balance the profit and the non profit, make sure that safety concerns are being taken seriously, and even making the decision to lose profit in cases where some of the safety concerns are starting to become overwhelming.

Yeah, So I think I have a sort of different perspective than a lot of people, although your recent interviews are sort of hitting on them where I don't know that it's the case that the board has failed broadly. I do think they've failed the employees because of this creation of shock and trauma, and what we're seeing is a response based on that. Right when you have the rug pulled out from you, you just want to get the rug back. So that is happening, and that can be arguably be a failure of the board. But I think broadly the board is sticking to some of its original goals, which is to balance the profit and the non profit, make sure that safety concerns are being taken seriously, and even making the decision to lose profit in cases where some of the safety concerns are starting to become overwhelming.

I think if one goes openly to open AI's website and looks at its governance and the statements it makes, it makes it abundantly clear that they put safety ahead of profits and are not for profit governance board. In hindsight, perhaps for vcs wasn't totally aligned. Has the discussion point changed longer term here, Margaret, Do you think that people start to say, Okay, well, we have to put the safety to one side because we need to keep on building and founders need to keep on doing deals and the compute power is so expensive.

I think if one goes openly to open AI's website and looks at its governance and the statements it makes, it makes it abundantly clear that they put safety ahead of profits and are not for profit governance board. In hindsight, perhaps for vcs wasn't totally aligned. Has the discussion point changed longer term here, Margaret, Do you think that people start to say, Okay, well, we have to put the safety to one side because we need to keep on building and founders need to keep on doing deals and the compute power is so expensive.

Yeah, I mean, I think that there will definitely be some changes and updates to this kind of structure. The profit model that OpenAI was spearheading was more of an experiment, and with experiments, in general with AI and in science, you just update based on the results you're getting, and so I think we're seeing that here. We'll probably see changes in light of the fact that there clearly is a need to have a reliance on commercial interests companies like Microsoft to provide compute and so you don't want to surprise Satchya, right if you have this kind of dependency. So there probably will be some updates here. But I do think that the board as originally constructed is basically doing what it's supposed to be doing.

Yeah, I mean, I think that there will definitely be some changes and updates to this kind of structure. The profit model that OpenAI was spearheading was more of an experiment, and with experiments, in general with AI and in science, you just update based on the results you're getting, and so I think we're seeing that here. We'll probably see changes in light of the fact that there clearly is a need to have a reliance on commercial interests companies like Microsoft to provide compute and so you don't want to surprise Satchya, right if you have this kind of dependency. So there probably will be some updates here. But I do think that the board as originally constructed is basically doing what it's supposed to be doing.

Margaret, how do we find a middle ground? If this existential threat issue is the issue, and frankly, we don't know why the board fired, Sam Outman, how do you appease both sides?

Margaret, how do we find a middle ground? If this existential threat issue is the issue, and frankly, we don't know why the board fired, Sam Outman, how do you appease both sides?

Actually, if you work towards the solutions, if you sort of take what the issue is and then work backwards towards the solutions, you'll find that the solutions for safety, for existential risk, for bias issues, non discrimination, a lot of these sort of ethical values that a lot of tech companies are holding right now, the solutions end up being roughly the same, as far as I can tell. And so really the middle ground is, let's go back to what the solutions are for all these issues that we're thinking and seeing, and can we agree on these solutions even if our goals are somewhat different, and I think that will really be a place where across the industry we'll see alignment.

Actually, if you work towards the solutions, if you sort of take what the issue is and then work backwards towards the solutions, you'll find that the solutions for safety, for existential risk, for bias issues, non discrimination, a lot of these sort of ethical values that a lot of tech companies are holding right now, the solutions end up being roughly the same, as far as I can tell. And so really the middle ground is, let's go back to what the solutions are for all these issues that we're thinking and seeing, and can we agree on these solutions even if our goals are somewhat different, and I think that will really be a place where across the industry we'll see alignment.

Margaret Chief Ethic Scientists, Margaret Mitchell, thank you for being with us. We have some breaking us just crossing the Bloomberg. Open AI and its board are in open talks with Sam Outman about a return for Sam Outman to Open AI. I'm reporting this with actually Evans. What we're hearing the latest is that Adam D'Angelo is talking with Sam Altman. One source tells me that a possible scenario is that a transition board comes into place and Sam Altman takes a director role on that transition board. That is one caroline possible way forward that we're hearing about. Investors are involved, Investors are speaking with both the open AI side and the open aiye board. And what we're hearing myself, Ashley Emily Chang reporting this as well, is that EMMITTT. Sheer, whose interim open AI CEO is having a pretty tough time, is basically in the dark and at breaking point. At this point, and.

Margaret Chief Ethic Scientists, Margaret Mitchell, thank you for being with us. We have some breaking us just crossing the Bloomberg. Open AI and its board are in open talks with Sam Outman about a return for Sam Outman to Open AI. I'm reporting this with actually Evans. What we're hearing the latest is that Adam D'Angelo is talking with Sam Altman. One source tells me that a possible scenario is that a transition board comes into place and Sam Altman takes a director role on that transition board. That is one caroline possible way forward that we're hearing about. Investors are involved, Investors are speaking with both the open AI side and the open aiye board. And what we're hearing myself, Ashley Emily Chang reporting this as well, is that EMMITTT. Sheer, whose interim open AI CEO is having a pretty tough time, is basically in the dark and at breaking point. At this point, and.

It's notable, of course that Veno Kosler, for example, very early investor in open Ai, had been saying how much the Quora ceo had DeAngelo had been digging in and ultimately whether or not that was going to be a difficult scenario to be able to have a board change of direction. Ultimately, though, what are you hearing in terms of being pushed for of the makeup of that board, because many would say it doesn't just need Sam Altman to be reinstated.

It's notable, of course that Veno Kosler, for example, very early investor in open Ai, had been saying how much the Quora ceo had DeAngelo had been digging in and ultimately whether or not that was going to be a difficult scenario to be able to have a board change of direction. Ultimately, though, what are you hearing in terms of being pushed for of the makeup of that board, because many would say it doesn't just need Sam Altman to be reinstated.

Yes, I mean the name Brett Taylor, who is the co CEO of Salesforce, keeps coming up time and time again as someone that would be an appeasement to both sides of the discussion that we make the point in the story we've just reported, just as the sources make the point to us that the fact that Sam is even speaking to Adam Dangelo is news. It is complete change from the weekend. We sat there all day Sunday saying, Okay, well Sam's definitely coming back and the board's going to go. That wasn't the case at all. The board was digging in and there was very little communication at AOLS. So yeah, we keep going, we do.

Yes, I mean the name Brett Taylor, who is the co CEO of Salesforce, keeps coming up time and time again as someone that would be an appeasement to both sides of the discussion that we make the point in the story we've just reported, just as the sources make the point to us that the fact that Sam is even speaking to Adam Dangelo is news. It is complete change from the weekend. We sat there all day Sunday saying, Okay, well Sam's definitely coming back and the board's going to go. That wasn't the case at all. The board was digging in and there was very little communication at AOLS. So yeah, we keep going, we do.

And as Emily chattered to Satya yesterday, he of course supports no matter where Sam ends up being, whether at OpenAI or in house with Microsoft. So much more to come, and of course we're going to be talking a little bit more about Ed's scoops one about a chip venture that Sam Ammon was apparently trying to be bringing to the world. Will have Cleo Capital Serracance joining us. Next, this is blue Meg Technology. Now, of course we just had that breaking news coming from our own Ed Ludlow and team that Sam Alman and the Open Ai board are open to talks for his possible return. And while the saga continues, we want to go to our VC spotlight now Cleo Capital founder and managing director Serracus, for your own take on all of this, the repercussions for AI startup ecosystem more broadly, Sarah, is it that it becomes more competitive? Is it that becomes more concerning of profits visa V safety?

And as Emily chattered to Satya yesterday, he of course supports no matter where Sam ends up being, whether at OpenAI or in house with Microsoft. So much more to come, and of course we're going to be talking a little bit more about Ed's scoops one about a chip venture that Sam Ammon was apparently trying to be bringing to the world. Will have Cleo Capital Serracance joining us. Next, this is blue Meg Technology. Now, of course we just had that breaking news coming from our own Ed Ludlow and team that Sam Alman and the Open Ai board are open to talks for his possible return. And while the saga continues, we want to go to our VC spotlight now Cleo Capital founder and managing director Serracus, for your own take on all of this, the repercussions for AI startup ecosystem more broadly, Sarah, is it that it becomes more competitive? Is it that becomes more concerning of profits visa V safety?

You know, I honestly think the biggest takeaway about this isn't going to be about AI.

You know, I honestly think the biggest takeaway about this isn't going to be about AI.

I think it's going to be about corporate governance.

I think it's going to be about corporate governance.

You know, this on the heels of everything that happened with FTX, and obviously could not be more different situations. But in both cases you have companies that have been super super hot, you know, is billions of dollars, and there's no board, there's no traditional corporate governance, and so when things go sideways, they tend to go sideways in a really big way and catch a lot of people unawares. You know, ventures a business where we usually like to sort of handle the messy stuff a little bit quietly, and that's really impossible to do when there's no board, you know, no traditional board just sort of say, let's sit.

You know, this on the heels of everything that happened with FTX, and obviously could not be more different situations. But in both cases you have companies that have been super super hot, you know, is billions of dollars, and there's no board, there's no traditional corporate governance, and so when things go sideways, they tend to go sideways in a really big way and catch a lot of people unawares. You know, ventures a business where we usually like to sort of handle the messy stuff a little bit quietly, and that's really impossible to do when there's no board, you know, no traditional board just sort of say, let's sit.

Down and hash this out quietly. We're reporting that one possible outcome is that there's a transitional board, right Sam Outman joins this transitional board as a director, as a bench capsus. If somebody put in front of you the opportunity to participate in the tender, which we believe is still pending based on that information I just gave you, would you take an allocation?

Down and hash this out quietly. We're reporting that one possible outcome is that there's a transitional board, right Sam Outman joins this transitional board as a director, as a bench capsus. If somebody put in front of you the opportunity to participate in the tender, which we believe is still pending based on that information I just gave you, would you take an allocation?

I do early stage ventures, so they are out of range, and that's all I'll say.

I do early stage ventures, so they are out of range, and that's all I'll say.

But you know the reality is that I.

But you know the reality is that I.

Think that this is going to be a moment where the investors around the table say, look, you know, we played by your rules. You started as a nonprofit, you had this capped profit model, you know, you had this board that didn't directly oversee you know, and wasn't wasn't necessarily a fiduciary to the for profit arm.

Think that this is going to be a moment where the investors around the table say, look, you know, we played by your rules. You started as a nonprofit, you had this capped profit model, you know, you had this board that didn't directly oversee you know, and wasn't wasn't necessarily a fiduciary to the for profit arm.

I have a feeling that if Sam.

I have a feeling that if Sam.

Comes back, that is all going to change, possibly in a good way for him, but I think probably in a way that's a.

Comes back, that is all going to change, possibly in a good way for him, but I think probably in a way that's a.

Bit more investor in for profit friendly as well.

Bit more investor in for profit friendly as well.

A rule early stage investment outlook right now, there is this thesis at one point when indeed we thought that Sam was going to be sticking with Microsoft, is that open AI talent might not just go there, and they might go off and start creating their own businesses. One found at telling us that yesterday, are you seeing as much exuberant about building AI companies at the smaller check range at the moment?

A rule early stage investment outlook right now, there is this thesis at one point when indeed we thought that Sam was going to be sticking with Microsoft, is that open AI talent might not just go there, and they might go off and start creating their own businesses. One found at telling us that yesterday, are you seeing as much exuberant about building AI companies at the smaller check range at the moment?

So, you know, there's it's structurally hard to build a true AI company right foundational models. You know, it takes billions and billions of.

So, you know, there's it's structurally hard to build a true AI company right foundational models. You know, it takes billions and billions of.

Dollars worth of compute power.

Dollars worth of compute power.

You know, we've heard reports this year of VC who are actually going out and you know, getting compute space, getting cloud space, you know, buying chips AI chips so that they can use that as sort of an enticement to founders, And the other reality is it's not just enough to be sort of smart and hungry when you're talking about building in these kind of foundational AI spaces. You really need serious engineering chops, and not a ton of people have them. So, you know, certainly the bloom is a bit off the rose right now at open AI. And I think that, you know, when things change, they tend to stay somewhat changed, and so we might see people, you know, who are planning to stick around a couple more years.

You know, we've heard reports this year of VC who are actually going out and you know, getting compute space, getting cloud space, you know, buying chips AI chips so that they can use that as sort of an enticement to founders, And the other reality is it's not just enough to be sort of smart and hungry when you're talking about building in these kind of foundational AI spaces. You really need serious engineering chops, and not a ton of people have them. So, you know, certainly the bloom is a bit off the rose right now at open AI. And I think that, you know, when things change, they tend to stay somewhat changed, and so we might see people, you know, who are planning to stick around a couple more years.

You know, the macro environment's not great.

You know, the macro environment's not great.

They you know, liked what they were doing at open AI, who are now you know, sitting there saying, you know, have whiplash and feel like, wow, maybe I do want.

They you know, liked what they were doing at open AI, who are now you know, sitting there saying, you know, have whiplash and feel like, wow, maybe I do want.

To go out on my own. And that's not necessarily a bad thing.

To go out on my own. And that's not necessarily a bad thing.

Clear Capital Founder Managing Directors, Hurricanes Goods catch up here on bloom By Technology.

Clear Capital Founder Managing Directors, Hurricanes Goods catch up here on bloom By Technology.

Zoom was out with earnings, reporting better than expected revenue on some strong enterprise sales and raising is fully of forecast. In fact, Zoom CFO Kelly Stackowa joins us now and Kelly there was some significant international slowdown and I'm interested as to how resilient the sort of growthing you saw in the prior quarter is for the next.

Zoom was out with earnings, reporting better than expected revenue on some strong enterprise sales and raising is fully of forecast. In fact, Zoom CFO Kelly Stackowa joins us now and Kelly there was some significant international slowdown and I'm interested as to how resilient the sort of growthing you saw in the prior quarter is for the next.

Yeah, So we were really pleased with our Q three results.

Yeah, So we were really pleased with our Q three results.

As you said, we.

As you said, we.

Exceeded both our top line as well as our profitability expectations, and we were able to raise for.

Exceeded both our top line as well as our profitability expectations, and we were able to raise for.

The full year.

The full year.

We saw growth in the Americas. We did see some headwinds both in AMYA and Asia Pac, some of that due to FX and currency. Were an Asia Pac for example, we would have been flat year every year, but we are starting to see some momentum in both of those regions and are looking forward to further progress as we moved through the rest of this year and in the next year.

We saw growth in the Americas. We did see some headwinds both in AMYA and Asia Pac, some of that due to FX and currency. Were an Asia Pac for example, we would have been flat year every year, but we are starting to see some momentum in both of those regions and are looking forward to further progress as we moved through the rest of this year and in the next year.

Like Kelly, the sales side analysts are basically saying that the raising guidance is just not bullish, and they're still worried about the long term growth of Zoom based on how society behaves today, how we communicate one another. How do you tell them definitively I can grow this company forever.

Like Kelly, the sales side analysts are basically saying that the raising guidance is just not bullish, and they're still worried about the long term growth of Zoom based on how society behaves today, how we communicate one another. How do you tell them definitively I can grow this company forever.

You know, we.

You know, we.

Achieved some amazing milestones during Q three. For example, Zoom Phone hit seven million seats, our Zoom contact center grew to over seven hundred customers, and Zoom AI Companion It's only been out for approximately two months and it's already activated in over two hundred thousand accounts.

Achieved some amazing milestones during Q three. For example, Zoom Phone hit seven million seats, our Zoom contact center grew to over seven hundred customers, and Zoom AI Companion It's only been out for approximately two months and it's already activated in over two hundred thousand accounts.

So that shows you that.

So that shows you that.

We are expanding to be a full collaboration and communication platform, and that's really what's going to drive our growth in the future. And that's exactly what investors are looking for. They're looking for reacceleration in our direct segment and they're looking for stabilization.

We are expanding to be a full collaboration and communication platform, and that's really what's going to drive our growth in the future. And that's exactly what investors are looking for. They're looking for reacceleration in our direct segment and they're looking for stabilization.

And our online segment.

And our online segment.

And as I said, the expansion of the platform is exactly what's going to drive that over time.

And as I said, the expansion of the platform is exactly what's going to drive that over time.

How then, have you been reacting to the going changes within AI?

How then, have you been reacting to the going changes within AI?

Right now?

Right now?