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Welcome to the Bloomberg Daybreak Asia Podcast. I'm Doug Chrisner. Well start in China, where over the weekend the People's Bank of China vowed to step up financial support. Much of the focus is on two areas tech, innovation and consumption, and to that end, the PBOC reiterated a pledge to lower interest rates as well as the reserve requirement ratio for a closer look. Now we're joined by Villain Sells. He is the CEO, I'm sorry, cio right, he is the global CIO at HSBC Global Private Bank and Wealth. Joining us from our studios in Hong Kong. Thank you so much for being with us. I think the message here of stronger stimulus is going to remain a key focus for anyone who wants to put money to work in China, be it a retail investor domestically or let's say an institutional investor offshore. Have you heard enough from the government? Has there been enough stimulus applied so far to make you a buyer of risk assets in China?

Welcome to the Bloomberg Daybreak Asia Podcast. I'm Doug Chrisner. Well start in China, where over the weekend the People's Bank of China vowed to step up financial support. Much of the focus is on two areas tech, innovation and consumption, and to that end, the PBOC reiterated a pledge to lower interest rates as well as the reserve requirement ratio for a closer look. Now we're joined by Villain Sells. He is the CEO, I'm sorry, cio right, he is the global CIO at HSBC Global Private Bank and Wealth. Joining us from our studios in Hong Kong. Thank you so much for being with us. I think the message here of stronger stimulus is going to remain a key focus for anyone who wants to put money to work in China, be it a retail investor domestically or let's say an institutional investor offshore. Have you heard enough from the government? Has there been enough stimulus applied so far to make you a buyer of risk assets in China?

So we have a neutral allocation to Chinese equities. You know that is because we indeed are waiting for that STIMILUS to come, and I believe that the markets and our clients want to want to see quite a significant package in a one stop, you know, one goal rather than incremental measures. But the government has announced a lot of things already. We do expect them as well, to lower the interest rates, to lower the reserve requirements. You know, clearly on the fiscal side, there will be stimulus as well. You mentioned that you know, the stimulus would be on the on the technology site and on the consumer side. I do indeed think that you know, for markets, it would be very encouraging if there is a lot of support for domestic demand because clearly, you know, the uncertainty is a and exports, you know, especially with the new US administration, you know, so therefore support for domestic demand for the consumer in particular through trade in schemes and so on would be a positive. But we are waiting for those measures potentially, you know, until March. Obviously, when you get the big parliamentary NPC meeting, that could be the time that we get you know, that package, and if that is convincing, then we would indeed increase because obviously Chinese equities are very cheap.

So we have a neutral allocation to Chinese equities. You know that is because we indeed are waiting for that STIMILUS to come, and I believe that the markets and our clients want to want to see quite a significant package in a one stop, you know, one goal rather than incremental measures. But the government has announced a lot of things already. We do expect them as well, to lower the interest rates, to lower the reserve requirements. You know, clearly on the fiscal side, there will be stimulus as well. You mentioned that you know, the stimulus would be on the on the technology site and on the consumer side. I do indeed think that you know, for markets, it would be very encouraging if there is a lot of support for domestic demand because clearly, you know, the uncertainty is a and exports, you know, especially with the new US administration, you know, so therefore support for domestic demand for the consumer in particular through trade in schemes and so on would be a positive. But we are waiting for those measures potentially, you know, until March. Obviously, when you get the big parliamentary NPC meeting, that could be the time that we get you know, that package, and if that is convincing, then we would indeed increase because obviously Chinese equities are very cheap.

So villam, I'm curious about what the catalyst may be to inspire some buying in Chinese markets. I mean, if it's not an issue of valuation, what is the trigger? What are we waiting for?

So villam, I'm curious about what the catalyst may be to inspire some buying in Chinese markets. I mean, if it's not an issue of valuation, what is the trigger? What are we waiting for?

So it is the size of that package, you know, and indeed that would in my mind, first bring in the local investors and the regional investors, and then ultimately the foreign buyers. I think the foreign buyers potentially have less fomo and we'll want to see the proven the pudding will want to see there those earnings accelerate, will want to see the you know, more positive economic data. But obviously, you know, even though the foreign buyers are you know a little bit more reluctant, they also have the very very low positions, many of them have zero. So you know, I do think that if the stimulus is convincing that you have a market that could rally a lot for now for US, you know, we do, we we are awaiting it, and therefore that's why we have that neutral allocation.

So it is the size of that package, you know, and indeed that would in my mind, first bring in the local investors and the regional investors, and then ultimately the foreign buyers. I think the foreign buyers potentially have less fomo and we'll want to see the proven the pudding will want to see there those earnings accelerate, will want to see the you know, more positive economic data. But obviously, you know, even though the foreign buyers are you know a little bit more reluctant, they also have the very very low positions, many of them have zero. So you know, I do think that if the stimulus is convincing that you have a market that could rally a lot for now for US, you know, we do, we we are awaiting it, and therefore that's why we have that neutral allocation.

Fifteen days until the Trump administration. Talk to me a little bit about the risk that you see in US China relations as a it overhangs the macro in China.

Fifteen days until the Trump administration. Talk to me a little bit about the risk that you see in US China relations as a it overhangs the macro in China.

So so I do think that you know, what you know people are most looking at is obviously the tariffs, but from a from a global perspective, you know that you know, mainly impacts the markets through the inflation and through the interest rate channel. Right, So if you have tariffs that are widespread and you know, so that's still question mark because you know, it could be that they are just a negotiating tactic. But if they are widespread, then what is the impact on interest rates? The FED members have already tried. Some FED members have already tried to incorporate that, others have not. So it's clear that there is big uncertainty around this, and therefore I think the aid market will you know, be volatile as you know, further announcements are made and potentially those negotiations mean that industrates go up and down. So I think the bond market is going to be volatile. That creates opportunities as well for active managers obviously, right, who can lengthen shortened duration or go up down the credit curve. But it is also that bond market that is the most significant threat to the equity market. I think equities are still the place to be because of a decent economy, but the bond market will create volatility in equities.

So so I do think that you know, what you know people are most looking at is obviously the tariffs, but from a from a global perspective, you know that you know, mainly impacts the markets through the inflation and through the interest rate channel. Right, So if you have tariffs that are widespread and you know, so that's still question mark because you know, it could be that they are just a negotiating tactic. But if they are widespread, then what is the impact on interest rates? The FED members have already tried. Some FED members have already tried to incorporate that, others have not. So it's clear that there is big uncertainty around this, and therefore I think the aid market will you know, be volatile as you know, further announcements are made and potentially those negotiations mean that industrates go up and down. So I think the bond market is going to be volatile. That creates opportunities as well for active managers obviously, right, who can lengthen shortened duration or go up down the credit curve. But it is also that bond market that is the most significant threat to the equity market. I think equities are still the place to be because of a decent economy, but the bond market will create volatility in equities.

So I'm curious, if you move away from China, where are you finding opportunities across the Asia Pacific?

So I'm curious, if you move away from China, where are you finding opportunities across the Asia Pacific?

So, you know, Asia, indeed, as you are implying, I think is a very diverse opportunity set. You know, if you look at China versus India versus Japan, they are very different countries, very different markets, and so we have overweights on both India and Japan, and by the way, also on Singapore. You know, Japan there we are going to have, you know, further wage growth. We're also going to have potentially some fiscal spending ahead of the upper house elections. And you know that wage growth gives obviously consumers more to spend, leads to growth, but also a little bit of inflation is not bad for companies because it gives them pricing power. I don't think inflation is so rum that the Bank of Japan needs to needs to hunk very quickly. You know, I think you get too interest straight hunks. So Japan is still a market that we stick with. And then India, I would say for people not to get too worried about the recent weakness in the in the cyclical data that was mainly urban and high tech. I think there is more stimulus now for the rural side, for the mid tech side, and then you get a formal employment which is being pushed as well. It's a market that we I think people need to stick with because from a structural perspective, this is, you know, a very attractive allocation.

So, you know, Asia, indeed, as you are implying, I think is a very diverse opportunity set. You know, if you look at China versus India versus Japan, they are very different countries, very different markets, and so we have overweights on both India and Japan, and by the way, also on Singapore. You know, Japan there we are going to have, you know, further wage growth. We're also going to have potentially some fiscal spending ahead of the upper house elections. And you know that wage growth gives obviously consumers more to spend, leads to growth, but also a little bit of inflation is not bad for companies because it gives them pricing power. I don't think inflation is so rum that the Bank of Japan needs to needs to hunk very quickly. You know, I think you get too interest straight hunks. So Japan is still a market that we stick with. And then India, I would say for people not to get too worried about the recent weakness in the in the cyclical data that was mainly urban and high tech. I think there is more stimulus now for the rural side, for the mid tech side, and then you get a formal employment which is being pushed as well. It's a market that we I think people need to stick with because from a structural perspective, this is, you know, a very attractive allocation.

So if you look at the themes here, I'm wondering if there is commonality in Japan and India and whether the play is on the consumption side, on the consumer is that logical?

So if you look at the themes here, I'm wondering if there is commonality in Japan and India and whether the play is on the consumption side, on the consumer is that logical?

It's yeah, it's basically around Asia we focus on the domestic side and on the consumer side. Indeed, as you were saying, so I would even lump in trya on that as well. You know where we do think that ultimately you are going to get that that that that boost to consumer power. Clearly, that also then means that that that a trade like that makes you less sensitive to you know, whatever happens on the on the trade side.

It's yeah, it's basically around Asia we focus on the domestic side and on the consumer side. Indeed, as you were saying, so I would even lump in trya on that as well. You know where we do think that ultimately you are going to get that that that that boost to consumer power. Clearly, that also then means that that that a trade like that makes you less sensitive to you know, whatever happens on the on the trade side.

I have to ask about South Korea right now, I'm seeing a rally and the equity market in Seoul. How do you view political risk as a factor in putting money to work in the South Korean market.

I have to ask about South Korea right now, I'm seeing a rally and the equity market in Seoul. How do you view political risk as a factor in putting money to work in the South Korean market.

Yeah, I mean, it's that is obviously difficult to assess as to what is going to happen there, you know. Immediately, I do think that, you know, our clients tend to want to try to allocate on an you fundamental basis, you know, and there what you're seeing sequentially year over years, you saw quite significant growth in in earnings as a steck rebounded last year in terms of earnings growth, and then this year that is slowing down a little bit. It is quite concentrated market and that's why we have a neutral allocation on South Korea for the moment.

Yeah, I mean, it's that is obviously difficult to assess as to what is going to happen there, you know. Immediately, I do think that, you know, our clients tend to want to try to allocate on an you fundamental basis, you know, and there what you're seeing sequentially year over years, you saw quite significant growth in in earnings as a steck rebounded last year in terms of earnings growth, and then this year that is slowing down a little bit. It is quite concentrated market and that's why we have a neutral allocation on South Korea for the moment.

You mentioned Singapore a short while ago. What's the thesis.

You mentioned Singapore a short while ago. What's the thesis.

The thesis is a it's a relatively defensive market, but nevertheless it's been, you know, the top performing market in Asian It obviously also has an income element which is quite you know significant, and then exposure to the banking sector, you know, which is doing quite well. So that's why we have an an overweight in Singapore. Around the world, we really try to diversify, you know. So the fact that we're overweight to the UK, for example, is not that we're super excited about it, but that you know, clients cannot just have that overweight in the US, and obviously markets that have you know, low valuations plus a defensive element, plus a different sector composition than the US, you know, they can benefit from having an overweight. So that's how we come up with diversify in the UK, Japan, India, and Singapore.

The thesis is a it's a relatively defensive market, but nevertheless it's been, you know, the top performing market in Asian It obviously also has an income element which is quite you know significant, and then exposure to the banking sector, you know, which is doing quite well. So that's why we have an an overweight in Singapore. Around the world, we really try to diversify, you know. So the fact that we're overweight to the UK, for example, is not that we're super excited about it, but that you know, clients cannot just have that overweight in the US, and obviously markets that have you know, low valuations plus a defensive element, plus a different sector composition than the US, you know, they can benefit from having an overweight. So that's how we come up with diversify in the UK, Japan, India, and Singapore.

One of the things that I want to address before I let you go is the dollar. The FED increasingly has been sounding a little bit more hawkish, number of officials here in the States over the weekend, indicating that the fight against inflation is not over. There's a little bit more to do in terms of reaching that two percent target. If we can agree that there are fewer ray cuts that we're going to get from the FED in the year ahead, and that the dollar will remain resilient, does that create a bit of a pall for risk assets in your neck of the woods.

One of the things that I want to address before I let you go is the dollar. The FED increasingly has been sounding a little bit more hawkish, number of officials here in the States over the weekend, indicating that the fight against inflation is not over. There's a little bit more to do in terms of reaching that two percent target. If we can agree that there are fewer ray cuts that we're going to get from the FED in the year ahead, and that the dollar will remain resilient, does that create a bit of a pall for risk assets in your neck of the woods.

So we can completely agree that you have an you know, fewer rate cuts than previously thought, and in particular, obviously you need to compare that to what other central banks are doing, so for example, the Eurozone, where you're going to get more cuts than in the US. So that leads to a strong dollar that is not the positive for emoting markets. Obviously higher for longer rates and stronger for longer US dollar, and so therefore you've seen quite significant downflows out of emerging markets. But I do think that this has to do as well with a number of video syncretic events like for example, Brazil. You know where you've had the outflows as well. You know, I think what people are doing to address the strong dollar, you know, is being in areas where you know that doesn't matter all that much. Number one, the US itself. You could also look at hard assets, so people looking at gold for example. Although there is that negative correalition with the US dollar, there is also the concern around higher deficits, and that's where gold can help. And then within the emerging markets, oil exporters for example, obviously I tend to be less sensitive to strong dollar.

So we can completely agree that you have an you know, fewer rate cuts than previously thought, and in particular, obviously you need to compare that to what other central banks are doing, so for example, the Eurozone, where you're going to get more cuts than in the US. So that leads to a strong dollar that is not the positive for emoting markets. Obviously higher for longer rates and stronger for longer US dollar, and so therefore you've seen quite significant downflows out of emerging markets. But I do think that this has to do as well with a number of video syncretic events like for example, Brazil. You know where you've had the outflows as well. You know, I think what people are doing to address the strong dollar, you know, is being in areas where you know that doesn't matter all that much. Number one, the US itself. You could also look at hard assets, so people looking at gold for example. Although there is that negative correalition with the US dollar, there is also the concern around higher deficits, and that's where gold can help. And then within the emerging markets, oil exporters for example, obviously I tend to be less sensitive to strong dollar.

Will leave it there. Thank you so much for being with us this morning. I wish you the best for twenty twenty five. Villam Cells is the Global CIO at HSBC Global Private Banking and Wealth. Joining us from our studios in Hong Kong here on the Daybreak Asia podcast. Welcome back to the Daybreak Asia podcast. I'm Doug Prisner, stateside this week the Fed is going to be one of the dominant themes. On Wednesday, we'll get minutes from the last policy meeting, and no fewer than six FED speakers are on the calendar. It was just over the weekend that we heard from two FED officials, both saying the central Bank must finish the fight on inflation and get to that two percent target. Joining me now from our studios here in New York is Hillary Kramer. She is the chief investment officer at Kramer Capital Research. Happy new year, thanks for stopping in. So the December meeting from the FED, we got this idea that there are going to be fewer rate cuts in the new year.

Will leave it there. Thank you so much for being with us this morning. I wish you the best for twenty twenty five. Villam Cells is the Global CIO at HSBC Global Private Banking and Wealth. Joining us from our studios in Hong Kong here on the Daybreak Asia podcast. Welcome back to the Daybreak Asia podcast. I'm Doug Prisner, stateside this week the Fed is going to be one of the dominant themes. On Wednesday, we'll get minutes from the last policy meeting, and no fewer than six FED speakers are on the calendar. It was just over the weekend that we heard from two FED officials, both saying the central Bank must finish the fight on inflation and get to that two percent target. Joining me now from our studios here in New York is Hillary Kramer. She is the chief investment officer at Kramer Capital Research. Happy new year, thanks for stopping in. So the December meeting from the FED, we got this idea that there are going to be fewer rate cuts in the new year.

Right, Yes, that was the message.

Right, Yes, that was the message.

From four down to two. And I'm wondering whether you think maybe there's still too much optimism that we're going to get those two rate cuts.

From four down to two. And I'm wondering whether you think maybe there's still too much optimism that we're going to get those two rate cuts.

Well, the factors determining that much of it. If we want to talk inflation right now, yes, the Fed is not as stuck on this exact two percent level. But let's talk tariffs and the fact that no matter how you slice it, a tariff is even if it's beneficial. I'm not making a comment on tariffs itself. On the policy side, it creates a tax on the consumer. It creates a tax, meaning inflation occurs when you have tariffs.

Well, the factors determining that much of it. If we want to talk inflation right now, yes, the Fed is not as stuck on this exact two percent level. But let's talk tariffs and the fact that no matter how you slice it, a tariff is even if it's beneficial. I'm not making a comment on tariffs itself. On the policy side, it creates a tax on the consumer. It creates a tax, meaning inflation occurs when you have tariffs.

But didn't the FED seem to sugges just that that a number of members on the committee were a little concerned about the inflationary impact of some of these economic policies from the incoming their administration.

But didn't the FED seem to sugges just that that a number of members on the committee were a little concerned about the inflationary impact of some of these economic policies from the incoming their administration.

Right, the FED members are concerned. And this brings up the second point, And this is not real.

Right, the FED members are concerned. And this brings up the second point, And this is not real.

This is not.

This is not.

About numbers policy, but this is about politics, and I'm talking about the politics of the FED. The problem is how much pressure is the White House? Is the President Trump administration, from the White House, from the Oval Office going to put on the Federal Reserve. Okay, now we know that our chairman has said, hey, I am finishing my term. I am finishing it, and he said that emphatically. But at the same time, there's going to be pressure to cut rates because President Trump wants the market to keep going up. But we just had a twenty four percent s and P five hundred in the twenty four a twenty five percent s and P five one hundred and twenty twenty three, meaning upwards, and that's three times what it ordinarily would be, meaning even just to go back to equilibrium, we would have to have a down at year in twenty twenty five for the S and P five hundred.

About numbers policy, but this is about politics, and I'm talking about the politics of the FED. The problem is how much pressure is the White House? Is the President Trump administration, from the White House, from the Oval Office going to put on the Federal Reserve. Okay, now we know that our chairman has said, hey, I am finishing my term. I am finishing it, and he said that emphatically. But at the same time, there's going to be pressure to cut rates because President Trump wants the market to keep going up. But we just had a twenty four percent s and P five hundred in the twenty four a twenty five percent s and P five one hundred and twenty twenty three, meaning upwards, and that's three times what it ordinarily would be, meaning even just to go back to equilibrium, we would have to have a down at year in twenty twenty five for the S and P five hundred.

So one of the negatives potentially on the economic policies from the new administration would be that they are inflationary. But if you look at some of the other things that are being suggested a lot less in the way of regulation. Isn't that a market positive?

So one of the negatives potentially on the economic policies from the new administration would be that they are inflationary. But if you look at some of the other things that are being suggested a lot less in the way of regulation. Isn't that a market positive?

Regulation is a positive to some extent. But if at the same time, you know, we don't want you know, we don't we don't want to eat our young, so to speak.

Regulation is a positive to some extent. But if at the same time, you know, we don't want you know, we don't we don't want to eat our young, so to speak.

You don't want the wild West.

You don't want the wild West.

Okay, And that that's that's part of the that's part of the problem here, and this whole sort of like you know, go down tomorrow lago and pay your you know, your your your fee for entrance, so to speak, you know, for for the inaugural balls in the form of millions of dollars has you know, everyone's trying to curry favor, and when you have too much of that going on, it will be it will be a problem.

Okay, And that that's that's part of the that's part of the problem here, and this whole sort of like you know, go down tomorrow lago and pay your you know, your your your fee for entrance, so to speak, you know, for for the inaugural balls in the form of millions of dollars has you know, everyone's trying to curry favor, and when you have too much of that going on, it will be it will be a problem.

But I'm thinking of the banks, aren't they beneficial banks.

But I'm thinking of the banks, aren't they beneficial banks.

Oh, okay, financial institutions, which is one of the topics that I am most bullish on. I see the financial institutions. I mean it's going to be their year. November December, there were investment bankers, just like because I sit on boards and I can tell you investment bankers. You call investment banker. They were like, they called back in one second, and we're willing to take transactions or you know, fairness opinions for so much less money than they ordinarily would because there's been no business. There is so much in the pipeline, and the venture capital funds firms, they have a lot of IPOs in the in the market. But then you also have all these bankruptcies. And that's why, like if someone said, let's say you said, Hillary, where is the real opportunity in financial institutions, I would say in these boutique investment banks that are not dependent on consumer credit the way that you have at a city bank. So I'm talking Evercredlizard. I especially love Moelis.

Oh, okay, financial institutions, which is one of the topics that I am most bullish on. I see the financial institutions. I mean it's going to be their year. November December, there were investment bankers, just like because I sit on boards and I can tell you investment bankers. You call investment banker. They were like, they called back in one second, and we're willing to take transactions or you know, fairness opinions for so much less money than they ordinarily would because there's been no business. There is so much in the pipeline, and the venture capital funds firms, they have a lot of IPOs in the in the market. But then you also have all these bankruptcies. And that's why, like if someone said, let's say you said, Hillary, where is the real opportunity in financial institutions, I would say in these boutique investment banks that are not dependent on consumer credit the way that you have at a city bank. So I'm talking Evercredlizard. I especially love Moelis.

So when you look at deal flow, is there a theme here that we want to do.

So when you look at deal flow, is there a theme here that we want to do.

At The theme is going to be you're gonna have the Goldman Sachs is doing these massive transactions where we're going to have cross border mergers with big fees, and one might say that it might be built into some extent into the stock price, but so few people realize the extent at which money can be made, not just on the advisory fee, but on the financing, on investing the money of the principles who just cashed in and got twenty billion dollars. I mean, they make money every which way. So the big financial institutions will make money, and then the boutiques are going to make money as well because there's a lot of deal flow that needs to be handled, especially let's say in retail big box. Look, this has not been a great year. Just take a look at companies like big Lots.

At The theme is going to be you're gonna have the Goldman Sachs is doing these massive transactions where we're going to have cross border mergers with big fees, and one might say that it might be built into some extent into the stock price, but so few people realize the extent at which money can be made, not just on the advisory fee, but on the financing, on investing the money of the principles who just cashed in and got twenty billion dollars. I mean, they make money every which way. So the big financial institutions will make money, and then the boutiques are going to make money as well because there's a lot of deal flow that needs to be handled, especially let's say in retail big box. Look, this has not been a great year. Just take a look at companies like big Lots.

I'm also thinking crypto is going to be a big factor here, am I right? Oh?

I'm also thinking crypto is going to be a big factor here, am I right? Oh?

Cryptos. So this is why I am bullish on Coinbase and I'm bullish on robin Hood, but especially on Coinbase because Coinbase is your one stop shopping for digital currency that they handle everything including this tokenizations, meaning you have companies, nonprofit people that are tokenizing. They're creating these tokens, and many of them will go down but it's who's doing the transaction, who gets the transaction fee as well. With let's say robin Hood, for example, it is so easy to open an account at Robinhood as an individual and do fractional ownership of digital currency, of the bitcoins ethereums the coin, all of them as well as but it's the leverage, the margin that people can take. Now the individual has to be very careful and tread with incredible care when it comes to investing in the big coins. Right, bitcoin is not gold, and it is going to have a place in our economy, and it will because the White House is going to dictate that bitcoin has be bought and so therefore the price is going to rise. And you have countries that are buying in bitcoin. And when you have tariffs, what's the way around tariffs? You deal with bitcoin and purchases and you get you bring things in through the port. So bitcoin is going to have a new value. So we should expect to see that going from the mid ninety thousands to one hundred and fifty thousand, I mean easily one hundred fifty thousand to two hundred thousand dollars. But then one day it's it's musical chairs and it comes down.

Cryptos. So this is why I am bullish on Coinbase and I'm bullish on robin Hood, but especially on Coinbase because Coinbase is your one stop shopping for digital currency that they handle everything including this tokenizations, meaning you have companies, nonprofit people that are tokenizing. They're creating these tokens, and many of them will go down but it's who's doing the transaction, who gets the transaction fee as well. With let's say robin Hood, for example, it is so easy to open an account at Robinhood as an individual and do fractional ownership of digital currency, of the bitcoins ethereums the coin, all of them as well as but it's the leverage, the margin that people can take. Now the individual has to be very careful and tread with incredible care when it comes to investing in the big coins. Right, bitcoin is not gold, and it is going to have a place in our economy, and it will because the White House is going to dictate that bitcoin has be bought and so therefore the price is going to rise. And you have countries that are buying in bitcoin. And when you have tariffs, what's the way around tariffs? You deal with bitcoin and purchases and you get you bring things in through the port. So bitcoin is going to have a new value. So we should expect to see that going from the mid ninety thousands to one hundred and fifty thousand, I mean easily one hundred fifty thousand to two hundred thousand dollars. But then one day it's it's musical chairs and it comes down.

Well, let me talk about a little bit about what may be vulnerability. Was a great year for the equity market. It was also a great year for the crypto space. Our markets right now vulnerable in your.

Well, let me talk about a little bit about what may be vulnerability. Was a great year for the equity market. It was also a great year for the crypto space. Our markets right now vulnerable in your.

View, very vulnerable, very vulnerable.

View, very vulnerable, very vulnerable.

And what are you doing being believing.

And what are you doing being believing.

That I am recommending that everyone have keep their powder dry? Is the twenty twenty percent to thirty percent in cash and wait especially because you can still get You might not be able to get five percent, but you can still get four percent and lock it in or three point seventy five percent on your cash. That's a pretty decent return, whether you're an institution or an individual. And you can wait because no one's there. It's too risky to be jumping in. At these levels, we are at levels of nineteen ninety nine, two thousand, when the Internet was at its height. You know, this reminds me of Yahoo being two hundred and fifty dollars a share dropping to one hundred and seventy dollars a share, people going in and buying millions and millions of dollars of it, and then the next stop was twenty dollars a share and margin calls.

That I am recommending that everyone have keep their powder dry? Is the twenty twenty percent to thirty percent in cash and wait especially because you can still get You might not be able to get five percent, but you can still get four percent and lock it in or three point seventy five percent on your cash. That's a pretty decent return, whether you're an institution or an individual. And you can wait because no one's there. It's too risky to be jumping in. At these levels, we are at levels of nineteen ninety nine, two thousand, when the Internet was at its height. You know, this reminds me of Yahoo being two hundred and fifty dollars a share dropping to one hundred and seventy dollars a share, people going in and buying millions and millions of dollars of it, and then the next stop was twenty dollars a share and margin calls.

So we've been talking a lot about deals here that may be attractive in the United States on the equity side, maybe in the crypto space. We've talked a little bit about some of the themes that may be driving the price action. Are you seeing an thing away from the US that is curious to you right now that may be piquing your interests offshore anything.

So we've been talking a lot about deals here that may be attractive in the United States on the equity side, maybe in the crypto space. We've talked a little bit about some of the themes that may be driving the price action. Are you seeing an thing away from the US that is curious to you right now that may be piquing your interests offshore anything.

Yes, the big pharma companies, especially Snofi SNY, they really have such an incredible pipeline. They missed the COVID nineteen vaccines and the therapeutics, but they have put so much money this French biotech. Now you also have Novo Nordisk, which did have a hiccup, very a very rare hiccup in November because they had an obesity drug that didn't have the most positive returns that they thought it would have in one of their fased studies. But Novo Nordisk, look, we're going to be if there are so many people on ozembic and manjiorno right now to lose weight, but we haven't even started to see how many are going to be on that. Now. We might see some bounce back with the car companies in Europe that have done so poorly. You know, they've really struggled. You know, we could see that just simply because you know, there's there's they're oversold. And then and then even that, look at Toyota, you know, look at a Honda Nissan merger. What that might you know, end up creating. So there's opportunities to jump in.

Yes, the big pharma companies, especially Snofi SNY, they really have such an incredible pipeline. They missed the COVID nineteen vaccines and the therapeutics, but they have put so much money this French biotech. Now you also have Novo Nordisk, which did have a hiccup, very a very rare hiccup in November because they had an obesity drug that didn't have the most positive returns that they thought it would have in one of their fased studies. But Novo Nordisk, look, we're going to be if there are so many people on ozembic and manjiorno right now to lose weight, but we haven't even started to see how many are going to be on that. Now. We might see some bounce back with the car companies in Europe that have done so poorly. You know, they've really struggled. You know, we could see that just simply because you know, there's there's they're oversold. And then and then even that, look at Toyota, you know, look at a Honda Nissan merger. What that might you know, end up creating. So there's opportunities to jump in.

Now we'll leave it there. We've covered a lot of ground. Thank you for coming in sharing your thoughts with us. I wish you the best for twenty twenty five. She is Hillary Kramer, chief investment officer at Kramer Capital Research, joining us here on the Daybreak Asia Podcast. Thanks for listening to today's episode of the Bloomberg Daybreak Asia Edition podcast. Each weekday, we look at the story shaping markets, finance, and geopolitics in the Asia Pacific. You can find us on Apple, Spotify, the Bloomberg Podcast YouTube channel, or anywhere else you listen. Join us again tomorrow for insight on the market moves from Hong Kong to Singapore and Australia. I'm Doug Prisoner and this is Bloomberg.

Now we'll leave it there. We've covered a lot of ground. Thank you for coming in sharing your thoughts with us. I wish you the best for twenty twenty five. She is Hillary Kramer, chief investment officer at Kramer Capital Research, joining us here on the Daybreak Asia Podcast. Thanks for listening to today's episode of the Bloomberg Daybreak Asia Edition podcast. Each weekday, we look at the story shaping markets, finance, and geopolitics in the Asia Pacific. You can find us on Apple, Spotify, the Bloomberg Podcast YouTube channel, or anywhere else you listen. Join us again tomorrow for insight on the market moves from Hong Kong to Singapore and Australia. I'm Doug Prisoner and this is Bloomberg.

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