Flight attendants function as first responders in the sky and have to deal with unruly passengers, staff shortages, and flight cancellations. Season 2 of Beyond the Scenes takes flight with host Roy Wood Jr., who chats with Daily Show writer and frequent flier, Kat Radley, and the International President of the Association of Flight Attendants, Sara Nelson. They discuss the drive to unionize Delta flight attendants, how the #MeToo movement impacted the airline industry, and their worst flying experiences.
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And we're back. Welcome to Beyond the Scene season too. Baby. Look we got a whole new batch of topics for you this season. I'm Roy Wood Jr. If you don't know, this is the podcast that goes deeper into segments and topics that originally aired on the Daily Show with Trevor Noah that this is what you gotta think about this as this podcast is a companion piece to the Daily Show. It's the jelly to the peanut butter sandwich. Without us, you're just eating an old piece of bread with peanut butter that sticks to the roof through your mouth. And now your mouth's all drying. Now you're struggling to pull yourself a glass and milk before you choke and die. So you need the jelly and we bring that sweet goodness to the sandwich. And frankly, I don't think you're ready for this jelly. No, I'm not gonna I'm gonna let you enjoy that joke just a second longer. I hope you all enjoyed your summer travel, because today we're talking about the roll of flight attendant and how they faced turbulent times during the pandemics, what they did their flight turbult, give me the clip. For years, flight attendants in America have complained about well two things. One idiots who pressed the coal button when they meant to turn on the lights, and too the way they get paid. Well. Now, finally, Delta Airlines is taking care of one of those issues. Flight attendants with Delta will soon be getting paid a little bit more money. The airline says it will now start paying cabin crews during morning. Up until now, flight attendants did not start getting paid until the passengers were seated in the planes doors closed. That was the moment that their pay started. Delta says the change will start June second, as the company faces the possibility if it's more than twenty thousand flight attendants forming their own union. The change could increase some attendance wages by several thousand dollars every year. Yeah, leave it or not. Flight attendances in America do not get paid during the boarding process, which is crazy. Just think about your at work doing work, but your boss is like, no, this is your free time. What I only pay you when the doors are closed? That's wild. It also sucks for flight attendance on Spirit headlines because they don't even have doors. What do they do? Do they work for free? How does that should work? Today? I'm joined by Emmy nominated Daily show writer Cat Ratley. Cat is a traveling comedian who has been on like, I don't know, fourteen flights in the last few weeks. So you are an expert on air travel, Cat, how you doing? Yeah, I would say expert slash survivor. I got PTSD from fourteen flights and I think five weeks. Um, so yeah, it was. It was terrible. I don't know how you guys do it. That's just an average week, Cat. I know. I was like, should I just collect a paycheck and help out? Like? I'm here so much. Also joining us the international President of the Association of Flight Attendants, Sarah Nelson. Sarah, Welcome to the show. Thanks so much. Sarah. Let's jump right in. What are the issues facing flight attendants and the airline industry right now and how many of those challenges of because of the pandemic. Well, look, the pandemic created problems, for sure, and we're seeing the COVID effect right now, but a lot of the problems that you're seeing in the airline industry were created pre pandemic and it's really about uh greed, It's about corporate greed. After the bankruptcies following on to nine eleven, contracts were slashed, people were working harder for less, pensions were terminated. Uh, there were a lot of bad things that happened. But when the airline started making money again seventeen and they were really cooking after the mergers and making a lot of money, all that the financiers wanted to do was to get more of those profits in their hands. So even while they were making billions of dollars, the people on Wall Street were demanding that they give them even more in stock buy backs, and so you may have seen a lot of those headlines about all the stock buy backs the airlines gave going into the pandemic, which meant that they didn't have cash on hand to be able to handle this massive drop in demand, and the entire industry almost collapsed. So what we're seeing now is the effects of what they were doing based on corporate greed prior to the pandemic, and that was cutting staffing level levels to a bare minimum, counting on people with overtime hours to make the operation run. Now you have people who are getting sick because of COVID and so they can't work those overtime hours or uh, they're so tired out because it's become such a conflict on board and everyone is essentially a first time flyer today. So that makes the job of a flight attendant much much harder, which is part of why we love that segment from the Daily Show so much about that boarding process. And I'm going to give these flight attendants a lot of credit because let me tell you something, man, people fly all the time. You see these people working hard. But I didn't know that they weren't getting paid all the plane you do. I don't know that they're really patient people. If I was working for free during the whole boarding process, I would have been way less friendly than yo. I would have been in that airport like some one. Zone one. Get the hell up on the plane right now, hungry up, I'm trying to get paid. Move move, move, move, move your tomb mass put the thing on the thing that man, and I saw you, I swear I saw. If any of you broke as Zone four even trying to get online right now, I will have the chance a water board your ass. Get back four. Sit down, you know who you wish. Every time we go to board of flight, it's questions from everybody. Nobody knows the plan, they don't have of the population that used to fly, showing them how things are done and creating kind of a follow the leader, uh situation. And so it is really really tough. It's really tough because we don't have enough people and that was really created pre pandemic, but now we've got the COVID effect making it worse. In the airline's defense, those CEOs, they have a family of yachts to feed, so you know they they do need the money. Yeah, yeah, no, I gotta tell you. Um so, I am really proud of something that our union did though, and and the rest of the aviation unions, And this happened only in the airline industry because we're eight percent union and so we have the power to do it. But we kept their pay, so their pay is capped until March, and we banned stock by backs until September of this year. But it's about to get a lot worse. I'm we're starting to talk about this, we're talking about this with lawmakers that if you're if you're complaining about the operation now it's about to get a lot worse when you have that stress from Wall Street saying that they want to take even more profits out just at a time when they really need to be reinvesting in the front line worker and in the infrastructure of the airlines. Um. So I'm about to get real serious here. But I'm also you know, the this is this is a problem with Wall Street Green and it's certainly the c e O s and and you know their family of yachts. Um. But but it's also much bigger pressure from hed hedge fund managers who were making billions of dollars. And the CEOs are kind of a little fish in a big pond today. So during the pandemic, we saw almost half a million airline workers either furloughed or let go or fired or forced into early retirement. And now we need those people because the demand is going up. Why can't we just go back and get do we really need? Because I saw where the Delta pilots were protesting in Atlanta in front of Hartsfield Jackson earlier this year, and they're like, yo, you're working us to the bone. We cannot cover all of these shifts. Can't we just go That's what I'm saying, Sarah. I see the movies where they go find people in the mountains and they go the country Nietzsche, Come, why is the solution not as easy and just going back and getting the people who you let go? Well, look, first of all, not all those people were let go. One of the things that we talked about was you got to keep people in place because in the airline industry, these are highly skilled jobs. They're certified safety positions, and it takes a long time to have the training in place to be able to get people into these positions. So the Delts pilots are right. I mean, the airline industry was counting on incredible overtime hours from everyone, and people are worn out. They're worn out from this pandemic. There weren't out from getting sick. There weren't out from all the effects on their families and their communities from the pandemic. Um we kept people in place, except that Congress had a lapse in funding from October to December, and guess what that created a major backlog in the training departments to be able to get everybody back on the schedule and back in place. And in addition to that, like I said, they created this problem pre pandemic by staffing levels, by cutting those staffing levels so low. So what the Delta pilots was saying is essential what seven hundred thousand workers across the airline industry are saying. We put contract negotiations on hold in because it wasn't a good time to be talking about contract improvements. But today, guess what we had inflation go through the roof. We gotta attract people to these jobs. We gotta get them into the pipeline, get them into the training center so that we can start that process of staffing up. And if we don't have you know, good pay and benefits to attract people to these jobs, there's no way we're going to make that work either. So we have a short term problem with not enough staff right now and not enough support for the people in the operation able to do their jobs. And then a long term problem is just going to keep compounding the longer they wait to negotiate these contracts and make things better. So what we have is a labor crisis, which war often and not is not funny because at it at its core, it is people not being given the opportunity to provide, So cat, how do you make that funny? You all did segment? It was called I think what was it, the throwdown for any Yeah, throw it down there The Airline for Assholes just explained that segment and what inspired that. It definitely came at that time. I want to say it was you know, like one year ago, like mid when people were starting to fly again, and every time you went on Twitter, there was a new video of passengers going crazy, fighting with each other, fighting over fighting with the flight attendants. Like every day there was like a new TikTok video of a passenger losing their ship and being a total asshole on a plane. So I don't know who pitched the idea or if it kind of came as a group mentality, but to do an ad for like an airline where hey, let's let all these air assholes fly, but like put them on one plane, um and just let them beat the ship out of each other. Do you want to travel and take out your pent up pandemic aggression on customer service employees? Hell yeah you do, but society won't let you punch up flight attendant until now thrown down as the wheels are up, the ship goes down. It was super fun. It was a kind of thing like one of our head writers kind of wrote the script up, but it was one of those things where all the writers got to then go into the script and just like punch up and add jokes wherever they wanted to kind of, you know, add the color to it. One thing I was I did come up with the tagline when the wheels go up, the ship goes down. So that was my contribution to the piece. I gotta tell you, we really appreciate that because we got a major relief at a time when things were really stressful. I mean, I mean, it's scary for you guys those videos are you your job is to keep everyone else safe and now having to keep yourselves safe too, and these people are fucking assholes, Like yeah, as what has been in the airport and like seeing like these assholes out in the wild like I used to Like Roy and I have both been traveling for a while, but it's like the people have gotten worse. People have become worse human beings out in public over the past two years. I do think that part of it is, like I have a I have a theory is that anybody in a form of service industry. The job of flight attendant is not exclusively service. It is part of it. So it falls to me in that same realm as as a waiter or a fast food worker, in a sense that in my mind, you're here to do a service for me and whatever whatever stressors are happening to me outside of this moment, I could be having a bad boss. I like in those moments, I feel like that is the one opportunity that the customer gets to be the boss because someone else is bossing them or something that's stressing them. So I'm gonna take it all out on you, And I wouldn't. I would argue that a lot of those moments are not solely exclusive to Oh, the waiter gave me bad service, you got my order wrong. It's that you had a bad day. You have a chip on your shoulder, you have bigger things un therapied, you have all types of stuff going on in your life, and you're taking it out on what amounts to essentially is an innocent bystander. Sarah, what do you think are some of the factors that contribute to all of this unruly behavior? I know, I'm sure in flight cocaine you all probably need to take. Some people might like that. Um, what do you think contributes to all of this? Well, I mean, I think listen, the stressors of the pandemic were huge, and having people the first time flyers, um where nobody knows what the program is was a major problem. You're you know, you're comparing this also to the what people on the front lines were facing, whether they were in a grocery store, working a restaurant job, or whatever else. And the only difference here is that for us, we're there primarily for your safety. Let me be very clear, and so if you act out on a plane, it's a federal offense. And one of the things that we said over the last two years is start prosecuting, make the a priority, prosecute, sit some butts in jail, And that finally started happen. Biden gave direction to Merrick Garland to make the a priority. They made it a priority. They had an m o U with that fa A about getting the reports over so they could speed up the process of investigating and prosecuting. And we finally just got some people sent to jail. And I gotta tell you, it has a chilling effect and so other people get the point and Cat I gotta say, you know, putting all the assholes on one plane is um is great, Like it's funny and we love it, and um we got a huge release from that. But there's also some truth in it. There's thousands of flights that take off every single day, and frankly, this was a handful of people making a problem for everyone on board and and making and making the evening news every night and making it look like this is like everybody who's flying is out of control, and it's actually not true. Um. The truth is that most people come, they want to follow the rules, They want to have a safe, fun eventful flight, and they want and they look to flight attendants for that leadership. And what happened for us during this time was that a few people were making it really difficult for us to express that leadership keep things in order, especially when everybody was essentially a first time flyer and everybody needed instruction and there were fewer of us, more passengers than ever before. How do we how do we expedite that process? Because I know alcohol plays a role in it. On some some airline bars, like in shout out to New Orleans chose to call at that airpro home. My goodness, great, No, Louis Armstrong in New Orleans. Like I know alcohol plays a role in purtailing access to alcohol before you board a flight. But why we just get a no fly list? Why is it so hard to just establish it? If you don't, if you act stupid on a plane, you can't fly anybody, You can't fly any you know this is or just because yeah, where flying attendants, they would not be happy about that, um, even though they were Come on, guys, Um, but is and it's roughly in spirit because they promote that right, come fly spirit for the first time every time. That's where the peak assholes go to fly. Yeah yeah, yeah, So shout out to those fly attends. They haven't they haven't actually anything harder than anybody else. Um, but you know, um, we worked really hard to get attention on this and and to get a no fly list. And the thing that is was incredible to us. You guys probably make it yourselves. You're like, I got Jerry on here, Jerry done, he's done, he's done. Um, no more coming on the plane drink. Can't do that, Jerry. And by the way, that is a federal regulation. Like some of this stuff was like airports, do your job, put the signs up, don't push alcohol on people. We had a huge problem because airports were trying to make money and they figured out during the pandemic with to go alcohol that oh wow, this is the way we can make money. So we're gonna actually we're gonna actually push this and tell people you can order alcohol at the gate. I mean it was in fane. JFK has a robot. I mean, yeah, this is not helpful, This is not and it's not exactly sending the right message. So um so anyway, we here, we tried to get this no fly list. I mean, if you act out on a plane, if you punch somebody on a plane, uh, you don't get to go on another plane. Is that simple? Right? And we had all these people who were so for the terrorists no fly list, right, Um, like Ted Cruz who's like, oh no, we don't want to do this because he was really afraid that this was the people that he was representing who were a problem. He wouldn't be allowed. That was so fear. Yeah, so all this all of a sudden, Yeah, all of a sudden, these people who were like, yeah, every occasion, let's have a no fly list and let's be really like strict on these people, and let's, you know, treat this like everybody's in the military. All of a sudden, they were like, oh no, we can't do this. We're gonna violate people's civil rights to be assholes on planes. So anyway, that's why we don't have no flylist right now for these people, um is because those people stood in the way of getting it done. As an experienced drinker, I apologize on behalf of all of my fellow alcoholics because I can have my three beers before flight, get on and be perfectly pleasant. So listen, if people out there, if you know you can't handle your booze, save it for when you land. Hey and listen. Listen, Cat, I get that you are an experienced drinker and you've been trying this out in the last fourteen flights that you took, right, I'm pro exactly, Okay, all right, so we're just gonna we're just gonna give you that bad um. But but other people, listen, eight thousand feet in the air, reduced oxygen, they think they're pro drinkers. They get up in the air, it's a different story. In the year, there were more than seven thousand incidents of this nature of varying degrees of severity in the air, according to the f A. Now to in catch defense, Sarah cat is a former high school teacher, So I don't know if there's some sort of drink exemption clause her. Yes, teachers teachers, yeah, And you know that's an industry that's also primarily made up of women who are doing jobs outside of their job description, Like teachers have to do so much more than just teach. So on the flight attendant side of that, Sarah, what are some things about that occupation that you wish more people just knew that you don't think we know? Well, I gotta say. I mean, you're you're bringing up to professions that have been traditionally defined as UM women's work UM, and because of that, the professions have been devalued. We make less than you might think, and there's a lot of flight tense that because of that. Here's something that people should know. UM, most flight attendants commute by air to work because they cannot afford to live in the expensive hub cities where they're based. So when when these flights are full. That means that probably a crew member is not getting on the flight that they need to get on so that they can get to work and crew your next flight. Um, so yeah, it's did they get charged for that or did they get to fly for free to get to work? Well, um, you know, we get to fly for free if there's a seat available, and you know, with all the automation and at the last minute selling seats, it's unbelievable. I mean, you can plan like we have for decades on getting to work on time and be watching these flights and they'll be half empty and you show up the next day at the gate. It's like completely fault not to mention the fact that the airlines have had to pull back some flights at the last minute because they overpromised. They were trying to, you know, um schedule all these flights so they can compete with each other and get that market share at each airport, and they overpromised and couldn't deliver, had to pull back. So there's a cascading effect not just for the passengers, but then if crews can't get to work, that makes things even worse, right, So you have to do conflict de escalation. You gotta be a first responder in case the conflict doesn't deescalate. You've got to know how to get people off the plane. Then I would imagine at this point, are y'all taking combat training because like the Air marshall might not be able to get to you. The Air marsha lane on every flight. They're not on every flight. We're not supposed to tell you which flights they're on, but they always try to guess. I'm always like, it's always the baby. You never think, but it's always the baby. Those bay bes man, you gotta watch out. They are tough. Um So, uh no, we actually take training from the Air Marshals. We we got this training just after nine eleven. We were the first ones killed a nine eleven flight. Tends were um and uh so we got this training and then um it was mandatory the airlines had to provide it, and continental airlines at the time complained to George Bush and uh he found a way to make it voluntary, and so then of course none of the airlines provided it because it was voluntary. So we got through T. S A the Air Marshals to put together a program where we have crewmember self defense training and it's voluntary for us to go get it, but at least the training exists. And I gotta tell you, over the last two years, the sign up on those classes went through the roof because flight tense. We're like, yeah, I need a little self defense training here to be able to do my job every days. Now can use a seatbelt like a nunchuck. Just listen. The stuff that we learn in these classes is awesome. And um. They also the air marshals will say, you know, uh, rules of engagement and combat are fair like flight attendants, look around your surroundings. What can you use to destroy someone? But you don't. You don't have any time and you don't have any space and it's you were them. Yeah, and the duct taping thing is legit, right, you guys can duct tape people two seats like. It's amazing about this. So it's not actually duct type. Um. The airlines would argue it is restraint tape. So let's be really clear. Okay, it's restraint tape. Um. But some of the airlines have have tough cuffs on board. But I have to tell you, everything goes down to a cost item um. So they have to have some sort of restraint device for the crew members. And uh, the restraint tape is the cheapest. So the air lines that only have the restraint tape, basically we're making a decision to have the lowest cost item for restraining when they get out of control. And so that's why you saw in Frontier that the passenger was taped to a seat, because that's what the flight tend has had. I could use duct tape in my classroom once or twice, duck tape a kid to a chair, but they frown on that. You said you were an ex teacher, right, and that's why she's out of education. After the break, I want to talk a little bit about union busting because I know that heaving a union is going to be one important piece of the postle. I also want to talk about how the role of the flight attendant has evolved. This is beyond the scenes. We'll be right back the role of flight attendant. It's evolved over the years. But there's been a history of sexism within your industry. And you know, Cat, you're an entertainment it's perfectly fine. There's no sexism over there now. It's very healthy. You can't relate to this. I'm only talking put this one out. Is the sexism and gender discrimination is that still prevalent today in that industry? Sarah? Yeah, absolutely, we're still breaking through. I mean when the Me Too movement broke, I said to our comms people, I said, get ready, the phone's going to ring. And they're like, what do you mean? And I said, because uh, media is going to look around and say, who can we talk to, who maybe has experienced sexual harassment on the job. And I gotta the first thing I'm gonna say, let's call the flight attendants because everybody knows because we were not just objectified in our workplace like in a normal way. I mean much like the entertainment industry. Um, we were sold. We were sold as sex objects. We were totally objectified. So people think that they can own us, they think that they can treat us a certain way. I've been a flight attendant for twenty six years, and I know what it's like to just do my job all day long and have people get my attention by tapping me on the river end or um come up to me and the galleon start asking me about my hottest layover or start or come up and start trying to massage me or touch me, and that's terrible. Yeah, they think they can do it. They think they think And when we have fewer staff on board to be able to deal with this, it's frankly really hard because our job is to de escalate all these issues in the air. I mean, you can't pull the plane aside and tell someone to get off. Um, you got to keep the temperatures down. So a lot of times, uh, we did a big survey in our union and the response that we got from flight attendants was well, yeah, I don't, I don't, I don't report it, um, And I kind of just have to put up with it because um, there's I don't have time even to be able to deal with this. So there's a lot of problems there. And and we've made some huge strides in the last several years. And I want to really thank the women who broke the mewtube movement because I gave us some space to push forward. Um. Prior to that, frankly, the women who were my mentors and who built this union, uh knew that no one was ever going to make space for us at the table. That management held us in contempt In fact, my very first week on the job, I was told listen, management thinks of us, and from a raspy voice of a flight attendent who had been around smoking her entire career, because we had just gotten rid of smoking, right, and so she listen, Management thinks of us as their wives or their mistresses, and in either case they hold us in contempt. Your only place of worth is with your FAILI flying partners, and if we stick together, there's nothing we can accomplish. And I gotta say, you know, my my union was filled with a bunch of badass women who cut a path for us, but we never expected to get that respect from the public, from management, from anyone else. We were just going to take it for ourselves for what we could. And so when the me too movement broke, that opened up space for us to be able to push farther and say to management, this is unacceptable. In fact, I wrote a letter to CEO U and said, you need to take this moment and denounce the sexiest past of this industry, say that there is a zero tolerance policy and hold up flight attendance as safety professionals. And three of them did it. So we made some progress there. Uh, and we got some legislation through too, um, but we got a long ways to go. It's interesting that, like your job is to like deescalate on the plane and so like if you get sexually harassed, you just want to like kind of calm the temperature and move on, Which is interesting because that's kind of like what women are just trained to do in every scenario. Like it's usually it's you know, a man harassing a woman, So usually it's you know, they have the physical size or strength advantage in most cases, So like we're just kind of women are in general are just trained to usually just kind of de escalate, not make a big deal about it because you don't want it to become worse than maybe just an ask tap or something like that. So it makes sense that you guys are de escalating for your safety and for everyone on the plane, where I feel like that's just such an a neat thing for a woman to do anyway, Like you guys are probably like, oh, yeah, we're used having to do that anyway, because I feel like women are always having to do that absolutely, But I have to tell you, I mean we're trying to change that. When we talk about the sexism within the industry, within your industry, and you know, cat jump in if it was similar to school teacher. I'm a child of an educator. My mother has been in education for thirty years. But it's it always seemed to me like flight attendants also had some level of regulation from the bosses on appearance. Has that changed from the past until the present? You know, like Hooters, Like there was a Hooters airline that was that was weird. But how is the regulation on women's outfits? How is that evolved over time? Oh? My god. I mean it used to be that every single flight attendant was handed the same pair of three and cheels that they had to wear. For example, UM, and there were paper uniforms and UM marketing ads with uniforms where you take off different pieces of clothing throughout the flight. It was called the air strip, and so there were all these uniforms own. Girdle checks like there used to be used to have to come and get girdle checks before you could go fly. And it was another way that you could sort of legally get harassed by management UM and put aside. And and then weight checks, I mean we had to step on a weight scale until um. So, so if they wanted to humiliate someone, that would be like, step on over here to the scale in front of everyone. Way, you in front of everyone. Um, and they just have to get on the baggage scale. They're like, jump on, we'll do you next. Yeah, yeah, sorry, you're over the limit. You're gonna have to pay fifty bucks. So UM no, I mean it was it was really no. You're gonna lose your job, is what it was. Um. Or we're gonna put you on the weight program. Um. And so you're gonna have to weigh in before every trip and you're gonna have to do that in front of everyone. UM. Flight attendants were pressured and even sometimes coerced by managers to take speed to try to lose weight. Um. These these are all the things that we had to fight through. And even by the time I was hired, luckily we had gotten the worst parts of that behind us. But when I was hired in nine you had to wear two on cheelds in the concourse he had to go. I had to go through a day of makeup class where the men got the day off and the women had to not only go to learn how to put makeup on, but then you got judged every day about whether or not you had the makeup on. And if you didn't have makeup, like I was this sort of granola girl from Oregon. Um, just like totally clueless. Um, they made you buy it, so you had to also spend your own money to buy the makeup that they were trying to six. It's just a nightclub or flying to trying to get somewhere. Why do I have to flirt with the men and then turn around and you wonder why to in a well exactly? And then they tell you, oh, you're lucky. You were one of two thousand people who applied for this position and lines around the block, so you're totally replaceable too, So don't think about getting out a line. You know, so fat about these things. The dress code for teachers, I will say, was opposite. We were not allowed to show any cleavage and had to have long dresses. And I actually remember one day I had like a new dress that like my mom sent me, and I like put it on without trying it on first, and when I got to school, I realized that it was like super low cut and like my boobs are hanging out and I was like, oh, ship, what do I do? So because I taught at high school and us I'm super hot, so I had to I went and got toilet paper and tried to create like a fake tank top to like cover my cleavage. But it was just like toilet paper. And I was like, I think this might be worse. So opposite problems for rid of the uh. But much like stand up comedy cat, the flight attendant industry has no standardized guidance on how to report sexual abuse from customers. So when we talk about unionization, which also is something that's been impossible to happen in the world of stand up, what are the strategies, Sarah, Because like you see what's happening with Amazon, you know, in Starbucks where their employees are gaining a little bit of ground, and you know, right now, as it stands, right now, Delta is the only major US airline without a flight attendance union. And you know, and and they announced the was it earlier this year? Hey we'll pay you while the door is open on the plane halftime. That nice. That was insane to me. I had no idea that was a thing. That you're not getting paid during boarding. That's crazy, that's in half of the ship. That's the worst part. I mean, this is why we organize, right, So to that, to that point, Sarah, is what Delta is what they're doing because Starbucks and then you see what Starbucks is doing. Starbucks is like, oh, we're just going to close. You're trying to unionize. Oh that's jobing out of business, fund and performing, whereas Delta is what Delta is doing. Is that part of a strategy to distract from unionization efforts or is it a step in the right direction. Oh, it's both. I mean, so we we were thrilled. This is going to set a new standard. I mean if we keep organizing and we're all at the table right now, I've talked to other CEOs and I'm like, you realize they're all going to have pay boarding pain now and they're like, yeah, yeah, we know. And as I and you realize at the negotiating table, we're going to demand more than Delta's pain. Yeah we know, we know. So, um, this is what's going to happen. And um, this is not a demand that really came to the table prior to nine eleven because we didn't Boarding just wasn't as hectic, you had more flight attendants. This wasn't something that was a huge requirement. Instead, what we did was we bargained for pay protections, so that would have formulas to make sure that we're getting a minimum number of flight hours because our our pay is normally based on flight hours, and we were exempted from UM the Fair Labor Standards Act. That's the problem. The Congress set the standard here that pushed us out of any of the duty, um, hour and rest regulations that a normal worker might get. So during this time staffing was cut, our planes got a lot fuller. The mergers happened prior to the pandemic and they cut a lot of capacity out of the industry, so got harder and harder and harder for flight attenpts. Not to mention the fact that our union was really successful in doing things like making sure that we have defibrillators on board. So our responsibilities around healthcare of the passengers just increased. Our security duties increased. After or nine eleven, everything got harder, UM, but we weren't getting paid and so yeah, we're gonna get paid now. So is this is this good or is this a bad thing? It's a great thing, and we're saying, great, this is why we organized. Delta did it to try to stave off the union drive, and we're so used to that. So they did it thinking they were going to kill the union drive. Actually what happened, um, it totally backfired on Delta because what you were saying is exactly what happened. Delta thought they were gonna get heralded as the heroes and flight attends were gonna say, oh, we don't need a union because our management treats us so well. And instead the public was like, you weren't paying flight importing? What paying out? And they said, well, we're the only ones. And then the answer was still you weren't paying flighting and um So, frankly, I actually think that it just made our organizing drive pick up more esteem because the flight attendants started to feel their power about what they could achieve when they came together and and started trying to form the union, and enough, Delta did something that they said just three months earlier they would never do. Um. So when people start to feel their power and start to actually experience that they can make change, that only gets people more committed to getting that done. So the organizing campaign is just picking up steam, but Delta intended the opposite effect got them. What is the four d s of union busting? Is it divide, delay, distract and demoralize? Yes? Destruct, Oh no, not destruct, demolish. I can probably add two more D. So who's driving that before we get to the break and start talking solutions. Who are the people that have been at the core of this change when it comes to unionizing, this grassroot effort that's going on. You know, what would you say is the general makeup of this group of of employees. It's called people who know the No one laid out the red carpet for them. I mean, minors are on strike in Alabama for the same things that they fought for a hundred years ago, the eight hour day, vacations, sick time, a secure retirement, healthcare that's afordable. I mean, all of the things that they were fighting for a hundred years ago have been extracted from the workplace. And so people are understanding that more and more corporate power is a bad thing, and it's more and more inequality, and it's less and less opportunity for people. And so the same reasons that people formed unions a hundred years ago are the same reasons that unions are popular today that average people, working people, the vast majority of people in this country, the working class, um know that nothing's nothing else is working, you know, if they can keep going to the polls and voting for people. But as long as the political process keeps getting tied up by the people with all the money, nothing's going to change. Doesn't matter how popular an idea it is. Nine of the public loves it. But you know, one person to the public says it's not going to happen because it's not good for us, then it's not going to change. And the only way to tackle capitalism is to tackle capital where it exists in the workplace. So you know who can take on a billionaire, Well, Chris Smalls, You know somebody who organizes their union can take on a billionaire, and that billionaire doesn't have to answer to anybody else. After the break, I want to talk solutions, and cat I want to talk to you about the things that you all weren't able to leave in the piece because of everything we've covered just now, how do you boil that down into just a couple of minutes. But Trevor, we are talking flight attendants and the importance of adding in flight shrooms to the food beyond the scenes would be right back. You're dealing with an industry, Sarah, where you know greedy ceo s always undercutting the bottom line and making issues harder for you. Which makes it harder for passengers is who make it harder for you, the flight attendant who are there in their face, and then when you try to unionize, they undercut you by offering you crumbs. What can be done to improve the working conditions and cat? Did you all explore that at all when you all were writing this segment in the show, because it's so hard sometimes at the Daily Show where you can either talk about the causation or you can talk about the solution, but we rarely have time for both within a single piece. Did you find that to be the issue here? Yeah? I mean for this especially, it was like the and a lot of times it's about responding or responding emotionally, and this like the emotions of the videos, like looking at the anger of the passengers and seeing the real threats that we're facing flight attendance. I feel like we wanted to kind of capture the emotion that probably most viewers feel when they see that, especially as most people have had the experience of flying so they can relate. It's it's something everybody can were eight to. So I think for this piece, we wanted to kind of get at that emotion of the pent up rage everybody's been feeling, but also like how to express that. I feel like it kind of came at a time where we were doing a lot of pieces of kind of like how to get back to real life and what does that look like? So I feel like we kind of came at it from that angle of like airlines and this industry is one more industry hit by the pandemic and also one more part of life that people are having to learn how to do again. So I think we kind of took it from that approach, because yeah, getting to what causes this, what are the solutions? I mean, we could do a whole week of shows on that kind of stuff. So you talked about what your union is doing from the legislative side, but what can we do just regularly me Roy Gold Medallion, Flyer Bred Much Wow was Platinum and then they closed all the common clubs. What can we do to support? Flight Attendant Sarah Okay, So I'm gonna give some real practical things and then we'll talk a little bit more about you know, what the long term impact is here other than yeah, um so, I mean, Frankly, recognize us as human beings. So one of one of the problems is that we don't even connect anymore as human beings. So when you're getting on a plane, just put the phone down. Second, let us know that you see us, we see you, and let us know that you have our backs. So if something goes down on the plane, we know you know who are helpers are. That's that's a huge help right there, immediately on the plane. And then um, let us know when something is going wrong when you see something, bruin, let us know as soon as possible, because there's fewer of us to see these things anymore. And the sooner we can get to issues and try to de escalate, the better off we're going to be. Um. But long term, you know, Frankly, uh, there's a contract of carriage you sign off on when you buy your ticket, and any CEO would not go to work for an airline without their own contract and very clear about what they're going to make. And so talking to flight attendants about having their contract and getting engaged in their union, and um, you know, giving us the power to fight for our workspace because that's your travel space. To UM, that's really helpful, and so cheering people on who are unionizing and cheering people on who are in contract negotiations. Um, that's helpful for the flight attendance. And frankly it's going to be helpful for you as a passenger too. So we shouldn't just border planes like yeah, hey, I'll tell you one of my solutions to help flight attendant. They gotta stop putting ya all in them this. Nobody respects of this. We we gotta we gotta overhaul a uniform. You gotta go club bouncers, single secret service earpiece, bomber jackets, that bomber jackets, the collar to go all the way up. If you if it's like nightclub bouncer type energy, I guarantee you people respecting right. You are combining two of my favorite things right now, because um, you know the four DS. We talked about that before the union busting. So even if the unions there, management's still trying to bust the union all the time with uh, you know, divide delay, distract and demoralized, so distracting. Whenever there's contract negotiations, that's when they bust out plans for a new uniform because they're hoping it's totally going to distract people. So you are bringing my two things and putting them together. So you're saying that some of the time when airlines change uniforms, that's basically a couple going through some issues. Yeah, pretty much bought me a new ascot, he said, he loves me. Yeah, yeah, yeah, So we got these uniforms. You know what, I'm I hope that the uniform committees at every airline, the uniform the union uniform committees are watching this and they're going to get some ideas because you know, the uniforms always end up being um a huge problem in terms. Yeah yeah, yeah, I mean magicians, Valet Parkers. These are not people you are intimidated by. Uh, we'll get you out of here on this, Sarah. And it's a cliche question, but you're here and you've done this for many, many years, so why not ask you what's the weirdest experience you've had as a flight attendant. And you've got to vivy at the we didn't even get into emotional support peacocks today. Yeah, what's the weird what's the weirdest thing? Like, give us one that stands out all time? Great, I know. So so I'm gonna I'm gonna pull from my personal repertoire because of course I get all the reports and I can tell you all the weird things. But you know, the weirdest one was when I was working a flight out of I Guess, and it was an overnight flight and had say no more light attendants who were with me. Yeah. Yeah, so this guy comes on. He's like six six, three fifty pounds and we're just trying to make space for everything. And like I said, I have these two they were the first week on the job, these two other flights since I was working with And then, um, he starts acting up right after we take off. He goes in the bathroom, starts smoking, um, and it just keeps escalating. Then he peas all over one of the bathrooms, one of the labs. We had to lock that off. And then he decided he was gonna like pee on the back door. Um, then he was going to try to open the back door. Then he decided he was going to do a strip tease in the middle of the aisle because you know, all the all the families with little kids that were on the plane thought that was really cool. Um. And I'm looking for this is like real strongest man. Yeah. And I'm looking around. Remember I said, you know, put your phone down so I know you might be a helper. I'm looking around. Who are my helpers on this flight. I'm like, oh my god, there is nobody who can help with his six but at six guy clearly on drugs. Um. So Anyway, I was a trained teacher. Yep, that's right, high school teacher. Um. And so I finally I was like, you know what, I gotta do something. So I went to the back of the plane and I said to him in my best teacher voice, I was like, you sit down, stop talking to other people, stop stripping, stop doing anything. I want you to keep your hands in your lap. And if you do that, we're gonna go to Chicago and you're gonna go off the plane in handcuffs in Chicago. If you don't do that, one more word out of you, one more little peep, and we're landing in De Moine. Your ass is going to jail. In Des Moines and he sat quietly the rest of the flight, and then when we landed, the police came on, put him in handcuffs, took him off. It was like choose your own prison, and he just picked Chicago over De Moines. He did, he did. I'm sorry De Moin, but um, yeah, that was what this dude, that that was what got to him. And then um, the other two flights turns quit. Oh no, no, no, I love that. It's like it was like that Lady Hooks and the old Police Academy movies, a little soft spoken black woman. She was finally hit up when she was finally fed up, Kat, what about you? You've flown a lot. It's supposed the weirdest thing you've seen, I would say, like the biggest asshole I've seen in the airport. It seems it's somewhat harmless, but it was this woman pushing her like Louis Vuitton luggage all stacked up, like pushing it around the airport, but not on a luggage cart, on a wheelchair, like one of the airport wheelchairs. And so a man from the airport came over to her and he was like, oh, miss, you know you can't use the wheelchair for your luggage. And she dis goes, oh no, it's fine, No one was using it, And I thought, I hope not like she thought people were worried because like someone was using it. Were like, what we think you like dumped a body out of this wheelchair to put her bags on top. That's such a great like just answer. It's like the old day. I'm sorry, officer, I didn't know. I couldn't do that. Can't do that. This has been a wonderful, wonderful discussion. Sarah, I cannot thank you for being a part of this. That's all the time we have for today. Thank you to our I guess Cat and Sarah, and thank you all for going beyond the scenes with us. Thanks Roy, thanks Sarah, Thanks y Cat. Listen to the Daily Show Beyond the Scenes on Apple podcast, the I Heart Radio app. But wherever you get your podcasts. We don't care where you get your podcast, just listen to it.