Hey, it's Roy Wood Jr. Earlier this week, we heard from w NBA stars Sabrina I and Nescu on how the n C double as name and image likeness deals are changing college sports. In this bonus episode of Beyond the Scenes, I wanted to sit down with my friend, fellow correspondent and co host of the sports segment we do on the show. I apologize for talking while you're talking, Michael Costa. Costa, how you doing, man, Welcome to Beyond the Scenes. Thanks Roy, It's great to be here. Man. We wanted you here today, Costa because we wanted you to bring a professional tennis plane expertise to this program. You know you are a professional, former professional, and are you still professional? I don't know a bottom line. You gotta check from the World Tennis. Was it major League Tennis? What's the Major League Tennis Association of Tennis Professionals. Yeah. I also got some fines, Roy, So one time in Montreal, I threw a ball at my opponent, hit him in the neck, and then they wrote up the fine as Mr Costa, which I loved. They had to say, like, all fancy deliberately throw a ball at his opponent And I got fined two fifty dollars and my check that week was one hundred dollars, so I was negative one fifty that week. Tennis to me is different because it's an individual sport. Also, I can see your face, so I feel like from a marketing standpoint, if you're a popular tennis player, or you're playing for a school where tennis is popular, you have an advantage over the backup left offensive finement guard guy who no one knows. Like with these names and likeness deals, do you think there's gonna be a difference in playing an individual versus the team sport or is it just all the same time? Well, excellent question, and think about some of the highest paid professional athletes. Uh, tennis is always in there, especially on the women's side. You can see the face. You see a lot of the face. And as an affluent sport, the brands in a tracks it's Lexis, it's Heineken, it's Mercedes. I mean these are expensive brands. So yes. Historically, this is also why tennis was protected from a lot of the cuts that athletic departments make because their alumni have money. The wrestling teams would get cut more often because there's not as many wealthy alum who used to wrestle. I'm generalizing, but um, I do think the sport will matter. I think basketball players can market themselves better than football players. Most of the face is covered on football. Some teams don't even say the last name on the jersey in football, so you gotta like google who is that? Who's the quarterback? In order dame? You know, yeah, it's like like they're on top of that. Like with the with football, personality is what you have to use to transcend having the helmet on. But in the n C double A, God forbid, you're more than happy that you made a good it's a fifteen yard penalty. You can't even its taunting. They'll bring back a touchdown if you're too happy on the way to the end zone. So how do you overcome the rules and regulations of the sport and the masking of your face that means you just gotta be showboating on the sidelines. You got a Johnny Manziella, and you see how well you know he was. He was flagged every time he showed the personality. He was going like this. He was going like this before there was So you know, I don't love name image likeness promotion. I think it does promote individuality. I think it does promote focusing on your brand. I would just love it. I've said it before. If the team, you know, they pulled the money and they split the money up and freshman got this and sophomores got this, and it was based on the TV deal. But again the n C double A. They fought name image likeness pretty hard. They are not going to want to approve any revenue sharing from tickets or TV. But I think that is the most fair solution because it would be like roy if we got rewarded for being more selfish at the Daily Show, if we were given more money. And now I'm fighting you and Ronnie and Desie and it's just that's not a team environment. So it's a good question. You asked. You played tennis in University of Illinois in your time when you were in college. Just just talk because you know this is I'm bringing us up because we love to talk about whatever. I affly don't need to get paid. They're getting another money. Talk to me about how much work goes into like how much commitment it takes to be a steam athlete. Give me this, give me a schedule your training schedule. Well, you know, I played tennis at the University of Illinois and then I coached two years at University of Michigan. And I'll start as I'll start with my perspective as a coach, because as the assistant coach of men's tennis University of Michigan, half of my job how was an Excel sheet where I kept track of the hours of my athletes to make sure they weren't spending in the on season more than twenty hours a week on tennis. In the off season it was less, but every single hour is accounted for when you are, as the n C double A likes to say, a student athlete. But when I played, I don't even know where I could have found the time to promote my likeness, my brand. It's gonna be very interesting to me to see how these athletes going forward do this, because, Broy, you're also trying to get a degree. You're also trying to do what your coaches are asking you. If you have aspirations to be a professional, you have to also do above what your coach is asking you. You've got to continue to improve your actual skills in the sport. So I I might beat more old school on this, but I just I don't know how many athletes are are really going to be able to successfully pull this off. When you all were playing, did you all ever just sit and think, Man, I need some money. Somebody need to be paying me for this ship. Dude. The Illinois tennis team was popular, We were successful, Our tickets were free and and yo we had people show up. That was amazing. But no, there was you know, for me, this isn't this isn't Getting my education paid for was what was enough. But I wasn't walking around campus seeing people wearing Costa jerseys, even though that would have been awesome. Do you see any drawbacks to name and likeness deals, you know, so you know, to to to come to to dovetail off of what Sabrino is just talking about about how it could breathe some level of jealousy in the locker room amongst the place. So you agree with that cost I do? I mean, especially it's it's individual name, image and likeness is very individual. And on the ultimate team sport football, you know, uh, that guy has to block so three things work in order so this guy can score a touchdown. I mean it's the ultimate team sport. It's your only as strong as your weakest link. It's gonna be tough. It's gonna be another thing the coaches have to manage too. I mean I was a coach. These are competitive, somewhat irrational, extraordinarily hard work working young men, spoiled sometimes spoiled in tennis especially. And you're gonna throw in this guy's making money for a tweet. This guy isn't Hey, can you introduce me to your agent? Oh? Sorry, you didn't win your match yesterday. It's it's complicated. It's very very complicated. Son, do you think as buying large as a whole? Is this name enlightening stuff? Is this a good thing by the n C double A or is it a smoke screen? I think it's a very small step, and I think they're trying to give a little bit to the athlete to say, see, we are adapting. But I believe, uh, it's not something to easily execute because there's no time for the athlete to really focus on this. I if I, if I want to be pessimistic, I think it's smoke screen. So they try to avoid sharing TV revenue with these athletes. I think the n C Double A is terrified of splitting TV revenue with athletes, which is why they almost kind of gave them this name image likeness thing because Sabrina is just saying sometimes she wouldn't even eat, she was practicing so hard. I want to see the athletes get money from the TV deals. Then they don't have to promote or brand or retweet. Just give them some of the money from the money with the put with the pot for a lot of young athletes right then, we know money could be a deciding factor on whether or not they can continue playing. But you know they have the pay to play leagues, the travel leads. Do you think that model would help kids keep playing sports? And if not, what that model be helpful? I only know from this perspective of tennis and tennis is primarily an affluent sport. But there are families that don't have as much money that that graduate kids that become great tennis players. Uh. Great, you know the King Richard movies out now about Richard Williams with what he did to help Serena and Venus. But families, it is expensive raising a kid. It's even more expensive preparing a kid to become world class at a sport. In my opinion, anything you could do to help the families, whether it be money or resources to keep these kids on track athletically, would be of benefit. Okay, if there were leagues in place, and if the NBA G League starts paying a little bit more, they probably won't because the NBA, I think, is in bed with n C double. But if you have these a AU and these paid travel ball programs that are promising players a hundred thousand dollars whether they get drafted or not to go to college, then if I'm a good athlete coming out of high school and I'm Duke or I'm whatever blue U n C or whatever blue blood basketball program Kentucky. If I'm Kentucky, I'm not on competing against other colleges. I'm now competing against elite that's gonna put money in this kid's pocket right now. And he may not get enough money from his Snapchat deal or his stupid Hey everybody, like like in Birmingham right now, a bunch of the Alabama players that they're all on TV telling you where to go eat barbecue and ship. It's like, I know where to get barbecue. Do you think the n C Double A because of the pressure is created by outside paid amateur organizations, will eventually have to consider sharing that pot. They absolutely will, because you can't tell an eighteen year old kid whose family doesn't have enough money or has spent a lot of their money, um helping this kid become a great basketball player or whatever, baseball play, whatever the sport is. You can't keep this narrative of their getting paid with the education. I'm not saying education isn't important. It is, but money pays the rent. It's gonna be a problem, and I think the n C Double A knows it. They're fighting, but I do think, uh, and this might be pessimistic to say, I do think the players are going to follow the money, especially if you're talking like it's like it's big enough money. A hundred thousand dollars is a lot. Now. As a tennis player, I just didn't have that opportunity. I don't think we ever will because college tennis is not raking in the money. So for me, it was an added benefit to get the education. But in Sabrina's case, I mean, people are making real dollars off of her and she can't get a burrito at Chipotle. What here here, here's my doomsday scenario. So you have a league like Overtime Elite, right, Like, if the question is where are we going? Where, Where's where's all of this going? You know where are we going with this issue and name and Latin? I'll tell you where I think we're going costed. I think we're going to a spot where college athletics, if they are not careful, comes the new minor leagues of athletics. So if you have and I think at all, if we just let me take that back just basketball. Let's just talk basketball. This all boils down to which horse the NBA bets on. So if I'm a high school kid, I just had this high school kid on my podcast, Roy's Job Fair, part of the I Heart Media podcast. At This at this kid's mom on the podcast, he quit his high school team to make money for a pro am team. He plays pro am while still enrolled in high school with the bet with with the with the guarantee that he gets a hunt at the out for college, whether he goes overseas, whether he goes to the G League, or whether he gets drafted, hunt it out guarantee. Now, if that kid, if those kids start, enough of those kids make that leap from pro am straight to the NBA or into the G League, why would the NBA still bother draft in college. You draft a college kid or two, But if you're a college kid worth of your weight, why would you still go to college? If this is now the proven route. So if that starts working out for more and more people, I think that's the way all of the five star athletes are gonna go. I sound like a crazy sports round, I'm sorry, but like I think, if the NBA up the pay in the G League to compete with the program leagues, then the G League becomes the new college. That becomes a new place to go and try it. Look, if they're gonna pay the athlete a per d M stipend hundred a year, then it's not going to happen. But a hundred thousand dollars is a lot of money. And yeah, Kentucky has cool shorts, and yeah they Douke has great student fans. But nobody's gonna give a ship for a hundred thousand dollars. They're gonna follow the money. Um, and we'll see. We are at a pivotal time in collegiate sport. I think the fans don't want to admit it, the real die hard fans, But everybody else is now doing the economics of ticket sales. Dude, CBS just renewed March Madness for eight years for nine billion dollars. Be billion. Anybody who's reluctant to hearing about revenue sharing, you don't realize how much money is being made off of these athletes. So they got to adjust. Because you're right, if the G League or whomever, the ProAm League is offering a hundred grand, two undergrand by Kentucky, by Duke, Yeah, and so then who are you left with playing for Kentucky. It's gonna be like me. Also, you know what else is crazy? Roight, the coach of Duke makes fourteen million, fifteen million, sixteen million. It's like everybody around is making all this money. So, uh, I bet you. I bet you're a pretty good ball handler. Though no baseball was my thing, Okay, okay. My issue with basketball is just I just don't like people in my face. And that's to get away from me. That's a job of the defender. I would have loved tennis. That's a nice, spacious sport. Excellent sport. Hell away from me, You're like seventy ft from each other, dude. It's great, Costa. Thank you for coming on Beyond the Scenes with me. If you missed the conversation with Sabrina Tad, back through the Beyond the Scenes feed wherever you get your podcasts, or watch the video version of us on YouTube at Daily Show dot com slash Beyond. See you next week.

Hey, it's Roy Wood Jr. Earlier this week, we heard from w NBA stars Sabrina I and Nescu on how the n C double as name and image likeness deals are changing college sports. In this bonus episode of Beyond the Scenes, I wanted to sit down with my friend, fellow correspondent and co host of the sports segment we do on the show. I apologize for talking while you're talking, Michael Costa. Costa, how you doing, man, Welcome to Beyond the Scenes. Thanks Roy, It's great to be here. Man. We wanted you here today, Costa because we wanted you to bring a professional tennis plane expertise to this program. You know you are a professional, former professional, and are you still professional? I don't know a bottom line. You gotta check from the World Tennis. Was it major League Tennis? What's the Major League Tennis Association of Tennis Professionals. Yeah. I also got some fines, Roy, So one time in Montreal, I threw a ball at my opponent, hit him in the neck, and then they wrote up the fine as Mr Costa, which I loved. They had to say, like, all fancy deliberately throw a ball at his opponent And I got fined two fifty dollars and my check that week was one hundred dollars, so I was negative one fifty that week. Tennis to me is different because it's an individual sport. Also, I can see your face, so I feel like from a marketing standpoint, if you're a popular tennis player, or you're playing for a school where tennis is popular, you have an advantage over the backup left offensive finement guard guy who no one knows. Like with these names and likeness deals, do you think there's gonna be a difference in playing an individual versus the team sport or is it just all the same time? Well, excellent question, and think about some of the highest paid professional athletes. Uh, tennis is always in there, especially on the women's side. You can see the face. You see a lot of the face. And as an affluent sport, the brands in a tracks it's Lexis, it's Heineken, it's Mercedes. I mean these are expensive brands. So yes. Historically, this is also why tennis was protected from a lot of the cuts that athletic departments make because their alumni have money. The wrestling teams would get cut more often because there's not as many wealthy alum who used to wrestle. I'm generalizing, but um, I do think the sport will matter. I think basketball players can market themselves better than football players. Most of the face is covered on football. Some teams don't even say the last name on the jersey in football, so you gotta like google who is that? Who's the quarterback? In order dame? You know, yeah, it's like like they're on top of that. Like with the with football, personality is what you have to use to transcend having the helmet on. But in the n C double A, God forbid, you're more than happy that you made a good it's a fifteen yard penalty. You can't even its taunting. They'll bring back a touchdown if you're too happy on the way to the end zone. So how do you overcome the rules and regulations of the sport and the masking of your face that means you just gotta be showboating on the sidelines. You got a Johnny Manziella, and you see how well you know he was. He was flagged every time he showed the personality. He was going like this. He was going like this before there was So you know, I don't love name image likeness promotion. I think it does promote individuality. I think it does promote focusing on your brand. I would just love it. I've said it before. If the team, you know, they pulled the money and they split the money up and freshman got this and sophomores got this, and it was based on the TV deal. But again the n C double A. They fought name image likeness pretty hard. They are not going to want to approve any revenue sharing from tickets or TV. But I think that is the most fair solution because it would be like roy if we got rewarded for being more selfish at the Daily Show, if we were given more money. And now I'm fighting you and Ronnie and Desie and it's just that's not a team environment. So it's a good question. You asked. You played tennis in University of Illinois in your time when you were in college. Just just talk because you know this is I'm bringing us up because we love to talk about whatever. I affly don't need to get paid. They're getting another money. Talk to me about how much work goes into like how much commitment it takes to be a steam athlete. Give me this, give me a schedule your training schedule. Well, you know, I played tennis at the University of Illinois and then I coached two years at University of Michigan. And I'll start as I'll start with my perspective as a coach, because as the assistant coach of men's tennis University of Michigan, half of my job how was an Excel sheet where I kept track of the hours of my athletes to make sure they weren't spending in the on season more than twenty hours a week on tennis. In the off season it was less, but every single hour is accounted for when you are, as the n C double A likes to say, a student athlete. But when I played, I don't even know where I could have found the time to promote my likeness, my brand. It's gonna be very interesting to me to see how these athletes going forward do this, because, Broy, you're also trying to get a degree. You're also trying to do what your coaches are asking you. If you have aspirations to be a professional, you have to also do above what your coach is asking you. You've got to continue to improve your actual skills in the sport. So I I might beat more old school on this, but I just I don't know how many athletes are are really going to be able to successfully pull this off. When you all were playing, did you all ever just sit and think, Man, I need some money. Somebody need to be paying me for this ship. Dude. The Illinois tennis team was popular, We were successful, Our tickets were free and and yo we had people show up. That was amazing. But no, there was you know, for me, this isn't this isn't Getting my education paid for was what was enough. But I wasn't walking around campus seeing people wearing Costa jerseys, even though that would have been awesome. Do you see any drawbacks to name and likeness deals, you know, so you know, to to to come to to dovetail off of what Sabrino is just talking about about how it could breathe some level of jealousy in the locker room amongst the place. So you agree with that cost I do? I mean, especially it's it's individual name, image and likeness is very individual. And on the ultimate team sport football, you know, uh, that guy has to block so three things work in order so this guy can score a touchdown. I mean it's the ultimate team sport. It's your only as strong as your weakest link. It's gonna be tough. It's gonna be another thing the coaches have to manage too. I mean I was a coach. These are competitive, somewhat irrational, extraordinarily hard work working young men, spoiled sometimes spoiled in tennis especially. And you're gonna throw in this guy's making money for a tweet. This guy isn't Hey, can you introduce me to your agent? Oh? Sorry, you didn't win your match yesterday. It's it's complicated. It's very very complicated. Son, do you think as buying large as a whole? Is this name enlightening stuff? Is this a good thing by the n C double A or is it a smoke screen? I think it's a very small step, and I think they're trying to give a little bit to the athlete to say, see, we are adapting. But I believe, uh, it's not something to easily execute because there's no time for the athlete to really focus on this. I if I, if I want to be pessimistic, I think it's smoke screen. So they try to avoid sharing TV revenue with these athletes. I think the n C Double A is terrified of splitting TV revenue with athletes, which is why they almost kind of gave them this name image likeness thing because Sabrina is just saying sometimes she wouldn't even eat, she was practicing so hard. I want to see the athletes get money from the TV deals. Then they don't have to promote or brand or retweet. Just give them some of the money from the money with the put with the pot for a lot of young athletes right then, we know money could be a deciding factor on whether or not they can continue playing. But you know they have the pay to play leagues, the travel leads. Do you think that model would help kids keep playing sports? And if not, what that model be helpful? I only know from this perspective of tennis and tennis is primarily an affluent sport. But there are families that don't have as much money that that graduate kids that become great tennis players. Uh. Great, you know the King Richard movies out now about Richard Williams with what he did to help Serena and Venus. But families, it is expensive raising a kid. It's even more expensive preparing a kid to become world class at a sport. In my opinion, anything you could do to help the families, whether it be money or resources to keep these kids on track athletically, would be of benefit. Okay, if there were leagues in place, and if the NBA G League starts paying a little bit more, they probably won't because the NBA, I think, is in bed with n C double. But if you have these a AU and these paid travel ball programs that are promising players a hundred thousand dollars whether they get drafted or not to go to college, then if I'm a good athlete coming out of high school and I'm Duke or I'm whatever blue U n C or whatever blue blood basketball program Kentucky. If I'm Kentucky, I'm not on competing against other colleges. I'm now competing against elite that's gonna put money in this kid's pocket right now. And he may not get enough money from his Snapchat deal or his stupid Hey everybody, like like in Birmingham right now, a bunch of the Alabama players that they're all on TV telling you where to go eat barbecue and ship. It's like, I know where to get barbecue. Do you think the n C Double A because of the pressure is created by outside paid amateur organizations, will eventually have to consider sharing that pot. They absolutely will, because you can't tell an eighteen year old kid whose family doesn't have enough money or has spent a lot of their money, um helping this kid become a great basketball player or whatever, baseball play, whatever the sport is. You can't keep this narrative of their getting paid with the education. I'm not saying education isn't important. It is, but money pays the rent. It's gonna be a problem, and I think the n C Double A knows it. They're fighting, but I do think, uh, and this might be pessimistic to say, I do think the players are going to follow the money, especially if you're talking like it's like it's big enough money. A hundred thousand dollars is a lot. Now. As a tennis player, I just didn't have that opportunity. I don't think we ever will because college tennis is not raking in the money. So for me, it was an added benefit to get the education. But in Sabrina's case, I mean, people are making real dollars off of her and she can't get a burrito at Chipotle. What here here, here's my doomsday scenario. So you have a league like Overtime Elite, right, Like, if the question is where are we going? Where, Where's where's all of this going? You know where are we going with this issue and name and Latin? I'll tell you where I think we're going costed. I think we're going to a spot where college athletics, if they are not careful, comes the new minor leagues of athletics. So if you have and I think at all, if we just let me take that back just basketball. Let's just talk basketball. This all boils down to which horse the NBA bets on. So if I'm a high school kid, I just had this high school kid on my podcast, Roy's Job Fair, part of the I Heart Media podcast. At This at this kid's mom on the podcast, he quit his high school team to make money for a pro am team. He plays pro am while still enrolled in high school with the bet with with the with the guarantee that he gets a hunt at the out for college, whether he goes overseas, whether he goes to the G League, or whether he gets drafted, hunt it out guarantee. Now, if that kid, if those kids start, enough of those kids make that leap from pro am straight to the NBA or into the G League, why would the NBA still bother draft in college. You draft a college kid or two, But if you're a college kid worth of your weight, why would you still go to college? If this is now the proven route. So if that starts working out for more and more people, I think that's the way all of the five star athletes are gonna go. I sound like a crazy sports round, I'm sorry, but like I think, if the NBA up the pay in the G League to compete with the program leagues, then the G League becomes the new college. That becomes a new place to go and try it. Look, if they're gonna pay the athlete a per d M stipend hundred a year, then it's not going to happen. But a hundred thousand dollars is a lot of money. And yeah, Kentucky has cool shorts, and yeah they Douke has great student fans. But nobody's gonna give a ship for a hundred thousand dollars. They're gonna follow the money. Um, and we'll see. We are at a pivotal time in collegiate sport. I think the fans don't want to admit it, the real die hard fans, But everybody else is now doing the economics of ticket sales. Dude, CBS just renewed March Madness for eight years for nine billion dollars. Be billion. Anybody who's reluctant to hearing about revenue sharing, you don't realize how much money is being made off of these athletes. So they got to adjust. Because you're right, if the G League or whomever, the ProAm League is offering a hundred grand, two undergrand by Kentucky, by Duke, Yeah, and so then who are you left with playing for Kentucky. It's gonna be like me. Also, you know what else is crazy? Roight, the coach of Duke makes fourteen million, fifteen million, sixteen million. It's like everybody around is making all this money. So, uh, I bet you. I bet you're a pretty good ball handler. Though no baseball was my thing, Okay, okay. My issue with basketball is just I just don't like people in my face. And that's to get away from me. That's a job of the defender. I would have loved tennis. That's a nice, spacious sport. Excellent sport. Hell away from me, You're like seventy ft from each other, dude. It's great, Costa. Thank you for coming on Beyond the Scenes with me. If you missed the conversation with Sabrina Tad, back through the Beyond the Scenes feed wherever you get your podcasts, or watch the video version of us on YouTube at Daily Show dot com slash Beyond. See you next week.